Duke-NUS GMS II

[gte770m]

Hey all, I've been following this thread on and off. Thinking of applying for the 2011, took the MCAT once before and did horribly - used Examkrackers. Saw goldendaffodil and whiteprincess mentioning they still had their MCAT stuff, was wondering what material did the 2 (and anyone else) of you use.

Btw, I PM-ed both of you, so do check your inbox! Tks!

And heartiest congrats to all that got into the class of 2010!

I can't really compare review books since I've only used one, Kaplan comprehensive review. However, I will say that you can't just study off of review books because they are pretty shallow in terms of how far they will go to explain the concepts you need to know. I used school textbooks along with the review book. I think I actually looked at the textbooks more than the review book... But that may be because I took MCAT having taken only one semester of bio and no orgo lab in high school and college. I fulfilled pre-reqs after taking MCAT... So it might require a different strategy for you...

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[goldendaffodil]

Hey all, I've been following this thread on and off. Thinking of applying for the 2011, took the MCAT once before and did horribly - used Examkrackers. Saw goldendaffodil and whiteprincess mentioning they still had their MCAT stuff, was wondering what material did the 2 (and anyone else) of you use.

Btw, I PM-ed both of you, so do check your inbox! Tks!

And heartiest congrats to all that got into the class of 2010!

Hi there, got your PM, thought I'd reply here for others who may want to know too.

My background: I did chem, physics and bio for 'O' and 'A' levels, the latter way back in 1993. That's the last I ever touched chem and physics. As a nurse (did you all know that??) I was a lot more comfortable with bio, since it's more directly related to what I do.

So, the MCAT...

I took about 4.5 weeks leave to study for the MCAT full-time, for about 7-8hrs 6-7 days a week till test day. Consulted the AAMC MCAT test topics, then put together a revision schedule for each of the science sections. Interpersed were half-days when I'd do the VR samples.

Left the final week or so to focus purely on doing full-length tests, did total of 11. I was doing at least one everyday, at the exact same timing I would do the actual test, under similar test conditions e.g. taking 10min break in between, eating the type of food/snacks as I would on the actual day etc. I found that really helpful, so that on actual day I knew what to expect and had my stamina built. Also, there clearly was way more than I could study within the short period, so doing the tests were a way to know what I needed to revise. The afternoons were spent going through my mistakes and revising the stuff I'd missed.

For WS, I did mock practice daily during the final 2 weeks under test timings, using actual sample questions from AAMC.

Review books I had: McGraw-Hill, Barrons, Princeton Review, Kaplan. I thought McGraw-Hill and Barrons were crap. Way too skimpy.

Found Princeton Review good for reviving my distant memories of the concepts, the explanations were simple yet effective (at least for me!). For Kaplan, I found that the revision chapters assumed some degree of familiarity with concepts, so what I did was to start with Princeton, then to Kaplan, googling in between if I needed more.

I guess my study plan, and the review books I had, worked for me because I already had a foundation in the sciences. So the concepts were not entirely alien (except for some in org chem, which I gave up on). I just needed to jolt my memory in most instances, and retrieve stuff from my cerebral archives.. Thank god they're still there

If you haven't got some foundation, I would strongly suggest going back to textbooks, like gte770m said, instead of just relying on the review books. The review books sift and point out the important concepts and tips for the MCAT, but to understand the concepts from ground zero, you really do need more than that. Find time to look at some of the MCAT tips on SDN etc, I found these useful too.

Finally, I also made sure I took care of my physiological needs to optimize my frame of mind for the big day: making sure I get sufficient sleep for the week prior to the day, keeping up with my runs, and (this one is for the ladies out there!) making sure that my monthly hormonal cycle is at the right phase with progesterone out of the way

Anyhow, hope this helps somewhat, all the best to all who are taking the MCAT and applying to Duke!

 

[Hostilia]

When is the last day accepted applicants have to decide to attend the school?

 

[whiteprincess]

It's usually two weeks from the point of offer. My letter stated April 21st as the last day to accept the offer, and my letter came in on the 6th.

When is the last day accepted applicants have to decide to attend the school?

 

[mindsg]

Thanks

 

[knguyen5]

2 weeks seem awfully short to make such a life changing decision. Best of luck yo!

When is the last day accepted applicants have to decide to attend the school?

 

[Arty Farty]

Heya everyone:

Congrats to those who got in at Duke-NUS and for those who didn't get what they wanted, perhaps better things to come down the road!

Am a Singaporean medical student currently at the University of Queensland. Did interviews at Duke-NUS before, but ultimately decided to come over to UQ.

Am just curious, but does Duke-NUS have dissections, and have enough cadavers for anatomy lessons? I recalled that as a Life Science student at NUS, remembered taking the Human Anatomy module, but it seems my batch was the last batch that we ever got to dissect something. I dissected a human brain, but when I spoke to juniors, they never did any dissection. The last I heard from NUS is that they do not have enough cadavers for dissection.

Don't know about others but our surgical tutors at the anatomy labs here did point out that the failure of IT-based virtual reality anatomy based education is that they do not really give students a sense of space in three D with regards to orientation. Sadly, medical schools worldwide are resorting to virtual reality.

And for the year 3 research, is it a year off or do they still do clinicals? We have a similar research component like an Honours thesis which everyone has to do here in UQ, but it is not the bench top kind..more of analysis of clinical data and all that. And we have to do it concurrently with our clinicals. So it is school as per normal on top of our research.

Anyway best of luck!!!!!

Best Regards from Brisbane!

 

[Hostilia]

Heya everyone:

Congrats to those who got in at Duke-NUS and for those who didn't get what they wanted, perhaps better things to come down the road!

Am a Singaporean medical student currently at the University of Queensland. Did interviews at Duke-NUS before, but ultimately decided to come over to UQ.

Am just curious, but does Duke-NUS have dissections, and have enough cadavers for anatomy lessons? I recalled that as a Life Science student at NUS, remembered taking the Human Anatomy module, but it seems my batch was the last batch that we ever got to dissect something. I dissected a human brain, but when I spoke to juniors, they never did any dissection. The last I heard from NUS is that they do not have enough cadavers for dissection.

Don't know about others but our surgical tutors at the anatomy labs here did point out that the failure of IT-based virtual reality anatomy based education is that they do not really give students a sense of space in three D with regards to orientation. Sadly, medical schools worldwide are resorting to virtual reality.

And for the year 3 research, is it a year off or do they still do clinicals? We have a similar research component like an Honours thesis which everyone has to do here in UQ, but it is not the bench top kind..more of analysis of clinical data and all that. And we have to do it concurrently with our clinicals. So it is school as per normal on top of our research.

Anyway best of luck!!!!!

Best Regards from Brisbane!

Shortage of cadavers seems to be a problem for some schools, but I am not sure if Duke-NUS would be having this problem..
Back in the States, cadavers' a plenty for many schools.

Year 3 is dedicated to research, wet lab stuff as far as I can tell, all the while attending clerkships in the hospitals.

 

[Arty Farty]

Shortage of cadavers seems to be a problem for some schools, but I am not sure if Duke-NUS would be having this problem..
Back in the States, cadavers' a plenty for many schools.

Year 3 is dedicated to research, wet lab stuff as far as I can tell, all the while attending clerkships in the hospitals.

Oh I see. It doesn't seem to be a problem here in UQ though. It seems UQ has some sorta programme that solicits the living to donate their body to medicine, and they treat their potential donors well too, all the while ahhering to the organ transplant act. We don't seem to run short of cadavers here, and in addition, have a collection of pathological specimens from each organ system besides the normal ones.

 

[BlackTalon]

Heya everyone:

Congrats to those who got in at Duke-NUS and for those who didn't get what they wanted, perhaps better things to come down the road!

Am a Singaporean medical student currently at the University of Queensland. Did interviews at Duke-NUS before, but ultimately decided to come over to UQ.

Am just curious, but does Duke-NUS have dissections, and have enough cadavers for anatomy lessons? I recalled that as a Life Science student at NUS, remembered taking the Human Anatomy module, but it seems my batch was the last batch that we ever got to dissect something. I dissected a human brain, but when I spoke to juniors, they never did any dissection. The last I heard from NUS is that they do not have enough cadavers for dissection.

Don't know about others but our surgical tutors at the anatomy labs here did point out that the failure of IT-based virtual reality anatomy based education is that they do not really give students a sense of space in three D with regards to orientation. Sadly, medical schools worldwide are resorting to virtual reality.

And for the year 3 research, is it a year off or do they still do clinicals? We have a similar research component like an Honours thesis which everyone has to do here in UQ, but it is not the bench top kind..more of analysis of clinical data and all that. And we have to do it concurrently with our clinicals. So it is school as per normal on top of our research.

Anyway best of luck!!!!!

Best Regards from Brisbane!

To briefly answer your question, YLLSOM (NUS med school) have stopped doing dissections, in favor of prosections (pre-dissected cadavars).

Duke-NUS apparently believes that actual dissections will help students achieve a 3D understanding of anatomy as well as retain the huge amount of information. Duke-NUS gets their cadavars from the US.

 

[Arty Farty]

To briefly answer your question, YLLSOM (NUS med school) have stopped doing dissections, in favor of prosections (pre-dissected cadavars).

Duke-NUS apparently believes that actual dissections will help students achieve a 3D understanding of anatomy as well as retain the huge amount of information. Duke-NUS gets their cadavars from the US.

Wow! They fly in cadavers from the US?! Hmmmmmmmmmm interesting man.

 

[BlackTalon]

Wow! They fly in cadavers from the US?! Hmmmmmmmmmm interesting man.

Yea, I was pretty surprised to learn about this too. I guess there is a shortage of cadavars here in Singapore, so they had an arrangement with US (perhaps with Duke-Durham? Not sure though).

 

[Arty Farty]

OMG, legendary?!?! How did I get that status?

Anyway, I hope my posts were of some use. Ugh... this week's insane... like 20 lectures.... I'll drop in when I can though... especially during boring pharma classes

BTW, how does Duke-NUS throw in 20 lectures in one week? 4 lectures per day? How long is one lecture btw?

When I last interviewed at Duke, distrinctly remembered they stream their lectures over from the Duke in US, at least tht was what I was told. Is it like distance learning or you get Profs actually teaching?

And the team GMS thing..where they get a team to answer MCQs..do they still do that?

BtW, which pharmacology textbook you guys use? We use Rang and Dale, and Bertrand Katzung as accessory....

 

[BlackTalon]

BTW, how does Duke-NUS throw in 20 lectures in one week? 4 lectures per day? How long is one lecture btw?

When I last interviewed at Duke, distrinctly remembered they stream their lectures over from the Duke in US, at least tht was what I was told. Is it like distance learning or you get Profs actually teaching?

And the team GMS thing..where they get a team to answer MCQs..do they still do that?

BtW, which pharmacology textbook you guys use? We use Rang and Dale, and Bertrand Katzung as accessory....

Well, the lectures were pre-recorded at Duke-Durham, and we are each given a portable harddisk with the lectures within. There is also a software installed that allows us to wirelessly sync the harddisk with Duke-NUS servers. IMO, that's one of the big benefits of Duke-NUS. Recorded lectures allows us to benefit from some of the top specialists in their fields. There were several times where the lecturer was the same one who discovered what he was lecturing about. Of course, some lecturers are not as good, and recorded lectures allows us to listen at 2X speed or just skip it and read the textbook.

We do have Profs lecturing in class, usually during labs or after we completed our assessments and they have an idea of what we are unclear about. In any case, a "content expert" will be present during most of the assessments to explain the thinking process required to arrive at the answer, and to clarify the medicine. Assessments are a great teaching tool.

Yes, we still do the GMS thingy. It's great.

We use Basic and Clinical Pharmacology by Katzung and Trevor.

 

[blithey]

Thanks for sharing your experience Goldendaffodil. I personally found it useful.

I did Chemistry in Uni, but still feel lacking in aptitude with regard to O Chem (so wow, you totally gave up on the O Chem component of the MCAT?). Physics is one area I never studied in JC, but did a bit of it in Yr 1 uni - took Bio as well. However the areas covered were more focused, less broad-based than what JC covers.

Think the part about mimicking actual test conditions was great, haven't thought of that before!

Hi there, got your PM, thought I'd reply here for others who may want to know too.

My background: I did chem, physics and bio for 'O' and 'A' levels, the latter way back in 1993. That's the last I ever touched chem and physics. As a nurse (did you all know that??) I was a lot more comfortable with bio, since it's more directly related to what I do.

So, the MCAT...

I took about 4.5 weeks leave to study for the MCAT full-time, for about 7-8hrs 6-7 days a week till test day. Consulted the AAMC MCAT test topics, then put together a revision schedule for each of the science sections. Interpersed were half-days when I'd do the VR samples.

Left the final week or so to focus purely on doing full-length tests, did total of 11. I was doing at least one everyday, at the exact same timing I would do the actual test, under similar test conditions e.g. taking 10min break in between, eating the type of food/snacks as I would on the actual day etc. I found that really helpful, so that on actual day I knew what to expect and had my stamina built. Also, there clearly was way more than I could study within the short period, so doing the tests were a way to know what I needed to revise. The afternoons were spent going through my mistakes and revising the stuff I'd missed.

For WS, I did mock practice daily during the final 2 weeks under test timings, using actual sample questions from AAMC.

Review books I had: McGraw-Hill, Barrons, Princeton Review, Kaplan. I thought McGraw-Hill and Barrons were crap. Way too skimpy.

Found Princeton Review good for reviving my distant memories of the concepts, the explanations were simple yet effective (at least for me!). For Kaplan, I found that the revision chapters assumed some degree of familiarity with concepts, so what I did was to start with Princeton, then to Kaplan, googling in between if I needed more.

I guess my study plan, and the review books I had, worked for me because I already had a foundation in the sciences. So the concepts were not entirely alien (except for some in org chem, which I gave up on). I just needed to jolt my memory in most instances, and retrieve stuff from my cerebral archives.. Thank god they're still there

If you haven't got some foundation, I would strongly suggest going back to textbooks, like gte770m said, instead of just relying on the review books. The review books sift and point out the important concepts and tips for the MCAT, but to understand the concepts from ground zero, you really do need more than that. Find time to look at some of the MCAT tips on SDN etc, I found these useful too.

Finally, I also made sure I took care of my physiological needs to optimize my frame of mind for the big day: making sure I get sufficient sleep for the week prior to the day, keeping up with my runs, and (this one is for the ladies out there!) making sure that my monthly hormonal cycle is at the right phase with progesterone out of the way

Anyhow, hope this helps somewhat, all the best to all who are taking the MCAT and applying to Duke!

 

[Arty Farty]

Well, the lectures were pre-recorded at Duke-Durham, and we are each given a portable harddisk with the lectures within. There is also a software installed that allows us to wirelessly sync the harddisk with Duke-NUS servers. IMO, that's one of the big benefits of Duke-NUS. Recorded lectures allows us to benefit from some of the top specialists in their fields. There were several times where the lecturer was the same one who discovered what he was lecturing about. Of course, some lecturers are not as good, and recorded lectures allows us to listen at 2X speed or just skip it and read the textbook.

We do have Profs lecturing in class, usually during labs or after we completed our assessments and they have an idea of what we are unclear about. In any case, a "content expert" will be present during most of the assessments to explain the thinking process required to arrive at the answer, and to clarify the medicine. Assessments are a great teaching tool.

Yes, we still do the GMS thingy. It's great.

We use Basic and Clinical Pharmacology by Katzung and Trevor.

Recorded lectures..kinda remind me of those streaming lectures in IVLE....oooooh so the format is that you have to go through the lectures and do the assessments?

We do it differently here. Every organ system is presented with a pathological case. Down here, it is clinical aspect first and then the sciences. But we don't do assessments...we have quizzes but they are not counted.

BTW, do they use the NUS system of grading in Duke-NUS?

 

[Hostilia]

It's usually two weeks from the point of offer. My letter stated April 21st as the last day to accept the offer, and my letter came in on the 6th.

So when is the last day applicants can withdraw their acceptance?

 

[medsga]

Hello and congratulations to those who received an offer for this year's entry.

I need some advice as I am at a crossroads. I have been accepted for a doctoral program in the US (Clinical Psychology) but I wonder if 4 years of grad school + 1 year of internship + 1 year of fellowship/fulfiling licensing requirements will be worth it in the end. Looking at recent publications, the field of Clinical Psychology is losing popularity in the US as the professional boundaries between psychiatrists/psychologists/social workers are blurred. Obviously, psychiatrists are still on top of the food chain. I wonder if I should spend my years towards a medical degree instead (Duke-NUS??) and go into psychiatry.

Background: I did Chem, Physics, Bio, E-Maths, A-Maths 'O' Levels (straight A's) and Chem, Bio, and Maths in an Australian institution (90% average). Subsequently I did a BA in Psychology and Asian Studies, Hons in Psychology - GPA 3.3 (did the WES conversion). I gained research experience in Melbourne Uni's Dept of Psychiatry and was offered a PhD in post-natal depression. I also gained clinical experience as a Psychologist in a few Australian colleges before I moved back to Singapore for full-time research in NUS Yong Loo Lin School of Medicine. I have not taken the MCAT.

Questions:
1. What are my chances, taking into account my miserable GPA? Should I even bother doing the MCAT and applying? They told me they have never taken in a Psychologist before .

2. Obviously doing the doctoral is a more straitghtforward option. But I am afraid the profession would become obsolete. Will the admissions committee see me as a fickle-minded person?

 

[knguyen5]

First of all, you really need to know what you are passionate about. Because trust me, when the going gets hard, it's only your passion that gets you through. More importantly, for your purpose, it is your passion that will get you in Duke-NUS or any other medical school for that matter. Admissions people are quite smart and they can see right through you. So to answer your 2nd question, if you are truly passionate about helping people and contributing to the improvements of the human conditions then it's fine. After all, if you know that you can do more as a psychiatrist then your switch is perfectly reasonable. Be sure though to have a fairly reasonable argument for why the clinical psychologist profession is obsolete and how you can contribute more as a psychiatrist. Hint: being top of the food chain is not a very good reason IMHO.

MD is actually a longer haul for you (not to mention the 5-year bond commitment service at Duke-NUS). I know it will be worth it for me and wouldn't trade it for anything else because it is what I've ever wanted. So your concern my friend, is to find out what is it that you want. Are you familiar with life in medicine? Try shadowing doctors and see if that lifestyle suits you. You seem to have a fairly good amount of researches and the people at Duke-NUS love that. As far as your GPA goes, you can easily 'repair' that with a stellar MCAT score! But you need to start studying and registering for it soon if you are planning to apply for 2011.

Besides the MCAT, you also need to work on your extra-curricular activities such as shadowing, community services, etc. Those are all important parts of your application. Good luck though! Hope to see you at Duke-NUS one day (if it is indeed what you are truly passionate about).

Hello and congratulations to those who received an offer for this year's entry.

I need some advice as I am at a crossroads. I have been accepted for a doctoral program in the US (Clinical Psychology) but I wonder if 4 years of grad school + 1 year of internship + 1 year of fellowship/fulfiling licensing requirements will be worth it in the end. Looking at recent publications, the field of Clinical Psychology is losing popularity in the US as the professional boundaries between psychiatrists/psychologists/social workers are blurred. Obviously, psychiatrists are still on top of the food chain. I wonder if I should spend my years towards a medical degree instead (Duke-NUS??) and go into psychiatry.

Background: I did Chem, Physics, Bio, E-Maths, A-Maths 'O' Levels (straight A's) and Chem, Bio, and Maths in an Australian institution (90% average). Subsequently I did a BA in Psychology and Asian Studies, Hons in Psychology - GPA 3.3 (did the WES conversion). I gained research experience in Melbourne Uni's Dept of Psychiatry and was offered a PhD in post-natal depression. I also gained clinical experience as a Psychologist in a few Australian colleges before I moved back to Singapore for full-time research in NUS Yong Loo Lin School of Medicine. I have not taken the MCAT.

Questions:
1. What are my chances, taking into account my miserable GPA? Should I even bother doing the MCAT and applying? They told me they have never taken in a Psychologist before .

2. Obviously doing the doctoral is a more straitghtforward option. But I am afraid the profession would become obsolete. Will the admissions committee see me as a fickle-minded person?

 

[medsga]

Thank you for your insight. I really appreciate your honest feedback.

I am passionate about people and it is my dream to work in the area of psych trauma. It pains me to see few disaster-relief efforts focusing on long-term psych impact on survivors. My previous PhD in psychiatry offer was in the genetics of post-natal depression. Previous findings concluded that certain genetic mutations might be the result of traumatic life events - causing depression and anxiety. I know for sure that I don't want to do 100% research. I want to have the human interactions aspect of clinical practice. Thus I did not go ahead with the PhD option. But to answer your question, yes, I am passionate about helping people, and that is why I applied for doctoral studies in Clin Psych in the first place (it's not 100% research).

Yes, I understand that MD is a longer haul, but after the 5-year bond (which is the whole duration of the new residency program, no more housemanship year), one is technically an associate consultant of a certain specialty. I am looking at 6 years of training to be a doctoral-level clinical psychologist. It is 3 - 4 years of difference, but would it be more worthwhile? I am sure I can do more as a psychiatrist (better pharmacology training), but if that's all the difference, is it worthwhile?


I am familiar with life in medicine. My parents both have medical degrees (dad not practising), and my sisters are both medical students. I grew up in the culture, and since young, I am used to scrubbing in for neurosurgery ops. However, they are not formal "shadowing". Do you have any advice on how I can record hours of shadowing and community services?

So far my extra-curricular activities involve teaching in health seminars, leading and advising in student organizations, as well as fundraising activities. I have done fundraising events every year from 2002 - 2008. But I stopped since I moved to Singapore. Would church involvement count?

I was taken aback by the MCAT questions, though. It seems so complex. I have forgotten most of high-school science. How long does it take to recover the concepts? If I sign up for the July exam, is it reasonable?

First of all, you really need to know what you are passionate about. Because trust me, when the going gets hard, it's only your passion that gets you through. More importantly, for your purpose, it is your passion that will get you in Duke-NUS or any other medical school for that matter. Admissions people are quite smart and they can see right through you. So to answer your 2nd question, if you are truly passionate about helping people and contributing to the improvements of the human conditions then it's fine. After all, if you know that you can do more as a psychiatrist then your switch is perfectly reasonable. Be sure though to have a fairly reasonable argument for why the clinical psychologist profession is obsolete and how you can contribute more as a psychiatrist. Hint: being top of the food chain is not a very good reason IMHO.

MD is actually a longer haul for you (not to mention the 5-year bond commitment service at Duke-NUS). I know it will be worth it for me and wouldn't trade it for anything else because it is what I've ever wanted. So your concern my friend, is to find out what is it that you want. Are you familiar with life in medicine? Try shadowing doctors and see if that lifestyle suits you. You seem to have a fairly good amount of researches and the people at Duke-NUS love that. As far as your GPA goes, you can easily 'repair' that with a stellar MCAT score! But you need to start studying and registering for it soon if you are planning to apply for 2011.

Besides the MCAT, you also need to work on your extra-curricular activities such as shadowing, community services, etc. Those are all important parts of your application. Good luck though! Hope to see you at Duke-NUS one day (if it is indeed what you are truly passionate about).

 

[knguyen5]

The whole point about shadowing is to make sure you understand the nuances, the difficulties and challenges of life in medicine. Nobody asked me any 'evidences' about my shadowing experience but through the stories I told them or through my thought process in answering their questions, the interviewers understood that I'm not naive about medicine and can survive the rigorous environment.

As far as the MCAT goes, don't freak out. I was trained by Princeton Review to tutor MCAT and have done it for awhile. MCAT is ultimately designed to test HOW you think and not about WHAT you know. Even if you can memorize all the materials, your score will be around the median. It is how you use your basic science and integrate it with the new materials presented in the passage that is more important. It's intimidating at first but after awhile, it's actually very engaging intellectually because of the kind of lateral thinking involved. I love it. You just need to train yourself at first. As far as the time involved, I can't really counsel you on that because everyone studies differently. For about a month I studied from noon to 8 p.m (with about 2-hour break in between) then played World of Warcraft from 8:30 p.m to 2 a.m. My supervisor at PR forbid me from telling that story to my students >.< But the point is, study smart is more important than study hard.

 

[BlackTalon]

Recorded lectures..kinda remind me of those streaming lectures in IVLE....oooooh so the format is that you have to go through the lectures and do the assessments?

We do it differently here. Every organ system is presented with a pathological case. Down here, it is clinical aspect first and then the sciences. But we don't do assessments...we have quizzes but they are not counted.

BTW, do they use the NUS system of grading in Duke-NUS?

No, the grading system at Duke-NUS is honors/pass/fail. As we say here, P=MD (pass = medical degree).

Here, they build you up from the bottom... basic sciences, followed by normal anatomy/physiology, then pathology. Of course, we get snippets of clinical info during our application exercises and extracurricular shadowing.

 

[gte770m]

I still haven't made a decision on where I want to go... US is probably a more comfortable choice except I am kinda worried about what is going to happen after graduation regarding visa status when I start residency.
Duke-NUS at least offers PR after couple years in school, and that kind of assurance is pretty appealing...

 

[knguyen5]

BlackTalon!! Hey there, I'm that noob kid who sat in one of the TeamLEAD 2 weeks ago during the epilepsy session. Where were you sitting? I also want to ask you about book list. When do they release the book list? and do you buy all of the items on the list? How easy it is to get those textbooks from the library? Thanks for your help!

 

[CECFellow-2020]

I still haven't made a decision on where I want to go... US is probably a more comfortable choice except I am kinda worried about what is going to happen after graduation regarding visa status when I start residency.
Duke-NUS at least offers PR after couple years in school, and that kind of assurance is pretty appealing...

I am no expert with immigration, but I am sure residency qualifies you for US work visa, if not student visa. And just like Singapore, the US would want to keep home-trained MD in-states, you should qualify for a green card easily, and citizenship (if you have a permanent residency) for the amount of time you've spent in US medical school.

 

[Hostilia]

I am no expert with immigration, but I am sure residency qualifies you for US work visa, if not student visa. And just like Singapore, the US would want to keep home-trained MD in-states, you should qualify for a green card easily, and citizenship (if you have a permanent residency) for the amount of time you've spent in US medical school.

well, i'm not sure about visa or greencard, but it seems like an US MD will get you in most other countries with relative ease including Singapore, however not vice versa. ECFMG is a pain in the arse for foreign-trained students to practice in the US.

 

[Arty Farty]

Well, the lectures were pre-recorded at Duke-Durham, and we are each given a portable harddisk with the lectures within. There is also a software installed that allows us to wirelessly sync the harddisk with Duke-NUS servers. IMO, that's one of the big benefits of Duke-NUS. Recorded lectures allows us to benefit from some of the top specialists in their fields. There were several times where the lecturer was the same one who discovered what he was lecturing about. Of course, some lecturers are not as good, and recorded lectures allows us to listen at 2X speed or just skip it and read the textbook.

We do have Profs lecturing in class, usually during labs or after we completed our assessments and they have an idea of what we are unclear about. In any case, a "content expert" will be present during most of the assessments to explain the thinking process required to arrive at the answer, and to clarify the medicine. Assessments are a great teaching tool.

Yes, we still do the GMS thingy. It's great.

We use Basic and Clinical Pharmacology by Katzung and Trevor.

Recorded lectures..so it is like distance learning...
Actually, i don't see how a distance learning lecture will allow students to benefit maximally, so sorry if i may appear a little dense here..but my field of work prior to enrolling in medical school requires me to work with top specialists from each country..and the experience of a live interaction with these folks is definitely different from an online distance type.

I think it's logical because you don't to query the professor/lecturer, and in cases when doing assignments or project collaborations (in my case)..it is not possible to gain access, which is only possible in a face to face conversation. I would say I learnt alot more in my field of my work through a live interaction than online types.

In certain educational establishments, there is unfortunately a stigma attached to distance learning types..but saying that it may change.

Of course there is still benefit in accessing a lecture by a top guy...but nowadays, i do see med students recording their lectures live and then distributing the videos. Guess this is part of a duty roster, where students take turns recording, and his friends take turns to pontang lecture..hahahahaahahahaha

 

[BlackTalon]

well, i'm not sure about visa or greencard, but it seems like an US MD will get you in most other countries with relative ease including Singapore, however not vice versa. ECFMG is a pain in the arse for foreign-trained students to practice in the US.

Well, I'm not sure how much I should say in an open forum, but this issue is definitely a concern amongst the student body. You should find out as much as you can about the options available to you if you do matriculate at Duke-NUS. Don't forget the 4-year bond! Many details are still being worked out between Duke-NUS, MOH, and Duke-Durham (as well as ACGME, etc).

 

[BlackTalon]

BlackTalon!! Hey there, I'm that noob kid who sat in one of the TeamLEAD 2 weeks ago during the epilepsy session. Where were you sitting? I also want to ask you about book list. When do they release the book list? and do you buy all of the items on the list? How easy it is to get those textbooks from the library? Thanks for your help!

Hi! I was sitting not too far away from you actually. Did you enjoy your experience?

The book list is released just before a course starts, perhaps 2-3 weeks prior? The library stocks all the books in the list, and each team gets their own set of the books. I personally feel that many of the recommended books are too detailed, and a good review book may be better. If you need to reference the recommended text, there is always the team copy or the library.

Let me give you an example. Head and neck anatomy from Moore and Dalley runs about 250 pages, and you will read and memorize that much in 1 week. The "baby" version of Moore and Dalley summarizes all that into almost half that. If you can "own" the 180 pages of the baby version, you would certainly do much better than "owning" the first 180 pages of the papa version. Do ask your seniors about which review books they recommend!

 

[BlackTalon]

Recorded lectures..so it is like distance learning...
Actually, i don't see how a distance learning lecture will allow students to benefit maximally, so sorry if i may appear a little dense here..but my field of work prior to enrolling in medical school requires me to work with top specialists from each country..and the experience of a live interaction with these folks is definitely different from an online distance type.

I think it's logical because you don't to query the professor/lecturer, and in cases when doing assignments or project collaborations (in my case)..it is not possible to gain access, which is only possible in a face to face conversation. I would say I learnt alot more in my field of my work through a live interaction than online types.

In certain educational establishments, there is unfortunately a stigma attached to distance learning types..but saying that it may change.

Of course there is still benefit in accessing a lecture by a top guy...but nowadays, i do see med students recording their lectures live and then distributing the videos. Guess this is part of a duty roster, where students take turns recording, and his friends take turns to pontang lecture..hahahahaahahahaha

This IS distance learning. Of course, it would be great to interact with the top people. Go one step further, and say that it would be great to study 1-on-1 under that person at some isolated place (maybe he will teach you the 5-point-palm-exploding-heart-technique ) You are really lucky. In most Singaporean universities, we don't get lectures by such eminent people at all, so this is a rare treat. Don't forget that we also get to interact with top faculty in Singapore medicine. Especially during applications, where you will REALLY interact with them.

 

[Kyoichi]

"5-point-palm-exploding-heart-technique"... sibei LOL... pardon my Singlish... forgot where I heard this from but it sounds damn familiar... hahaha...

Thanks for all ur input BlackTalon... appreciate it... and humour of course...

This IS distance learning. Of course, it would be great to interact with the top people. Go one step further, and say that it would be great to study 1-on-1 under that person at some isolated place (maybe he will teach you the 5-point-palm-exploding-heart-technique ) You are really lucky. In most Singaporean universities, we don't get lectures by such eminent people at all, so this is a rare treat. Don't forget that we also get to interact with top faculty in Singapore medicine. Especially during applications, where you will REALLY interact with them.

 

[BlackTalon]

"5-point-palm-exploding-heart-technique"... sibei LOL... pardon my Singlish... forgot where I heard this from but it sounds damn familiar... hahaha...

Thanks for all ur input BlackTalon... appreciate it... and humour of course...

Thanks for the thanks for the poor humor

It's from Kill Bill Vol 2, BTW

 

[whiteprincess]

Been getting loads of PMs. KEEP THOSE QUESTIONS COMING!!!!!!

I'm no golden go-to person about Duke-NUS admissions - BlackTalon knows wayyy more than me. But just PM me anything and I'll make sure I reply within 24 hours!! (when I'm not doing my royal duties of course)

 

[WhiteTalon]

Hi everyone ... I would just like to introduce myself... WhiteTalon!
I aspire to follow the footsteps of the legendary BlackTALON and the newly annointed WHITEprincess... With a name like WhiteTalon I feel like I have already doubled my chances of being accepted into Duke-NUS...

 

[knguyen5]

LOL. Welcome WhiteTalon.

Just curious though, why not BlackPrincess?

 

[knguyen5]

I liked the TeamLEAD session very much and enjoyed it thoroughly. It seems Dr. Graham noticed my enjoyment as well.

Thank you so very much for your recommendations on books. It seems the general consensus (from all medical student friends that I know) is that 'papa' version of anything is overkilled. If the library and team copy have the full books then I think buying review books are indeed better. How much (very roughly) did you spend on book?

Hi! I was sitting not too far away from you actually. Did you enjoy your experience?

The book list is released just before a course starts, perhaps 2-3 weeks prior? The library stocks all the books in the list, and each team gets their own set of the books. I personally feel that many of the recommended books are too detailed, and a good review book may be better. If you need to reference the recommended text, there is always the team copy or the library.

Let me give you an example. Head and neck anatomy from Moore and Dalley runs about 250 pages, and you will read and memorize that much in 1 week. The "baby" version of Moore and Dalley summarizes all that into almost half that. If you can "own" the 180 pages of the baby version, you would certainly do much better than "owning" the first 180 pages of the papa version. Do ask your seniors about which review books they recommend!

 

[whiteprincess]

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHHAHA.

Blacktalon = male
Whiteprincess = female
WHITETALON = tranny ?

Anyway, hello! Welcome. Whitetalon's an unbeatable nick. You're so gonna pawn everyone here. Until Blackprincess comes along.......

Hi everyone ... I would just like to introduce myself... WhiteTalon!
I aspire to follow the footsteps of the legendary BlackTALON and the newly annointed WHITEprincess... With a name like WhiteTalon I feel like I have already doubled my chances of being accepted into Duke-NUS...

 

[WhiteTalon]

Tranny???!!!!!!! .... Hmmm.... But then again Duke-NUS did say they prize diversity in their class... I may just make a trip to Thailand ( For the.. ahem... op... ) and make this my competitive advantage... Thanks Whiteprincess!!! You are ingenious!!! The admission committee will be SO impressed with how FAR I am willing to go to be a doctor...

p.s. When I come back in my new "form"... I would then change my nick to BlackPrincess... Ha... with a foolproof strategy like this... Who needs to study for the MCAT...

 

[Kyoichi]

LOL.... things are getting quite laid back and humorous around here... guess it's becos the application period just closed and re-opened for the next batch...

definitely gonna start studying for my mcat before semester starts again... all the best everyone...

 

[BlackTalon]

Been getting loads of PMs. KEEP THOSE QUESTIONS COMING!!!!!!

I'm no golden go-to person about Duke-NUS admissions - BlackTalon knows wayyy more than me. But just PM me anything and I'll make sure I reply within 24 hours!! (when I'm not doing my royal duties of course)

Well, I'll help when I can, what I can, but it's been a year since my application experience. You are much closer to that horrible event...

 

[BlackTalon]

I liked the TeamLEAD session very much and enjoyed it thoroughly. It seems Dr. Graham noticed my enjoyment as well.

Thank you so very much for your recommendations on books. It seems the general consensus (from all medical student friends that I know) is that 'papa' version of anything is overkilled. If the library and team copy have the full books then I think buying review books are indeed better. How much (very roughly) did you spend on book?

It's great that you enjoyed the TeamLEAD. I find it both stressful and exciting.

To answer your question, I spent $0 on M&C, $200 for Practice Course (cos I bought O'Conner), $300 for NB (anatomy texts and atlases), $100 for B&B, and $300 for B&D.

 

[BlackTalon]

Tranny???!!!!!!! .... Hmmm.... But then again Duke-NUS did say they prize diversity in their class... I may just make a trip to Thailand ( For the.. ahem... op... ) and make this my competitive advantage... Thanks Whiteprincess!!! You are ingenious!!! The admission committee will be SO impressed with how FAR I am willing to go to be a doctor...

p.s. When I come back in my new "form"... I would then change my nick to BlackPrincess... Ha... with a foolproof strategy like this... Who needs to study for the MCAT...

UGH... my identity has been HIJACKED!

Good luck Whitetalon.....

 

[WhiteTalon]

UGH... my identity has been HIJACKED!

Good luck Whitetalon.....

Thanks BlackTalon... However, if by any stroke of luck that I am successful in my application... be prepared to see the appearance of BlueTalon, GreenTalon , RedTalon , GoldTalon , YellowTalon ... and the like!!! Not to mention the multicoloured "princesses"...
On a more serious note... How have the non Biological Sciences people been faring with their studies in Duke-NUS... Do they have to struggle more? As these people probably would not have any bench research experience... does that mean they are limited to doing clinical research for their 3rd years? These are concerns for me as I am from a Social Sciences background...

 

[deerwinter]

wow this forum is amazing! im thrilled to see so many seniors here... congrats to those got in this year!

 

[deerwinter]

Hi Seniors! Im preparing for MCAT but the prep materials r so expensive to me...! so i hope can buy some 2nd hand ones..... anyone have used books (kaplan, examkrackers, test practices etc )? please contact me at 97239816. many thanks!

 

[goldendaffodil]

Student Affairs at Duke-NUS has a number of preparatory materials for loan. Call to ask. Or if you've friends going to/coming back from the US, order from amazon and beg them to help you bring back... That's what I did

 

[BlackTalon]

Thanks BlackTalon... However, if by any stroke of luck that I am successful in my application... be prepared to see the appearance of BlueTalon, GreenTalon , RedTalon , GoldTalon , YellowTalon ... and the like!!! Not to mention the multicoloured "princesses"...
On a more serious note... How have the non Biological Sciences people been faring with their studies in Duke-NUS... Do they have to struggle more? As these people probably would not have any bench research experience... does that mean they are limited to doing clinical research for their 3rd years? These are concerns for me as I am from a Social Sciences background...

Let's start a Talon clan!!!

Hmm, there are quite a few engineers in my class with minimal bio background (some are bioengineers). There is a chemist and an chemical engineer too (no bio background). They are all doing fine, even the latter two. You may have to work harder during M&C, because the stuff they go thru are relatively basic molecular biology things like DNA replication, central dogma, etc, which most people with bio degrees will have encountered, and they go thru the material quickly. Your teammates are your best friends... there will be at least a few in your team with bio degrees, so ask them to explain things you don't understand.

From NB onwards, it's a level playing field, because most people wouldn't have done anatomy and physiology at that great detail.

I wouldn't worry too much if you don't have bio background. You may have to do some catching up, but you will be on par with everyone else in no time. Don't forget that half of your grade will be contributed to team work, ie. group readiness assessments and TeamLEAD, so that helps too.

 

[WhiteTalon]

Let's start a Talon clan!!!

Hmm, there are quite a few engineers in my class with minimal bio background (some are bioengineers). There is a chemist and an chemical engineer too (no bio background). They are all doing fine, even the latter two. You may have to work harder during M&C, because the stuff they go thru are relatively basic molecular biology things like DNA replication, central dogma, etc, which most people with bio degrees will have encountered, and they go thru the material quickly. Your teammates are your best friends... there will be at least a few in your team with bio degrees, so ask them to explain things you don't understand.

From NB onwards, it's a level playing field, because most people wouldn't have done anatomy and physiology at that great detail.

I wouldn't worry too much if you don't have bio background. You may have to do some catching up, but you will be on par with everyone else in no time. Don't forget that half of your grade will be contributed to team work, ie. group readiness assessments and TeamLEAD, so that helps too.

With all this BlackTalon, WhiteTalon , RedTalon etc ... I suddenly feel like a Power Ranger! Haha! Good thing this is virtual and not reality... I can't imagine having to wear spandex... ewww...

Anyway, good to know the non-Bios are managing well... However, is it possible to do bench research in the 3rd year for those without the background?

p.s. Btw... thanks for attending to questions on this forum... the insider info u provide is highly useful and enlightening.

 

[BlackTalon]

With all this BlackTalon, WhiteTalon , RedTalon etc ... I suddenly feel like a Power Ranger! Haha! Good thing this is virtual and not reality... I can't imagine having to wear spandex... ewww...

Anyway, good to know the non-Bios are managing well... However, is it possible to do bench research in the 3rd year for those without the background?

p.s. Btw... thanks for attending to questions on this forum... the insider info u provide is highly useful and enlightening.

Well, I'm glad to help in some small miniscule way...

Yes, it's possible to do molecular research in MS3. Speaking from a bio graduate, we had a general idea on the research tools we have available to us, and the basic theory behind them. However, learning how to USE the techniques require alot of hands-on experience, and it's unlikely, even with a year worth of experience, that you will know a significant number of techniques. You might have a disadvantage with planning the experiment, but your PI should help with that.

In terms of medical knowledge, everyone will be on par by MS3, so no worries there.

 

[gte770m]

I withdrew my acceptance today. Good luck to those still on waitlist.