WWedding at the End of the WWorld: Game Thread

[cubsrule4e]

Anyone wanting to claim they were blocked?

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[Barkley13]

This is through page 8

Spoiler: Quotes

With such good taste she must be village, but in all seriousness genny isn’t doing anything that would make me inclined to think she’s a wolf. She sounds like village genny

Sloth village read genny pretty quickly and for one reason other than “sounds like village”. Shorty did point out a very similar post from when sloth was village though, so sloth village reading genny seems to be NAI at least

I’m not really seeing the PleezIt sketch even in the iso much but will be interesting to see how she defends since she is very often a village read.

Cubs not wolf reading please

mostly the progression on her read on you. When she didn't include you in the people who she thought needed more pressure, she seemed neutral on you, but then most recently said you felt normal and I didn't really see how she got to that point.

Also her village read on cubs felt surprising to me

It just doesn't remind me of how village pleasey reads people

Please was village reading Cubs back
(I already forgot who the first part was about)

I feel like usually being village read early in a game most all the time she doesn’t ever have to defend much. Wondering how she’ll respond being in the lead on D1

Cubs made a weird comment about please

Bold statement. Can anyone tell me how obvious it is when genny is a wolf? Can please explain to me how she's seen genny wolf and caught her when she wasn't trying to be caught?

Cray was also lightly questioning please but from what I’ve seen so far didn’t push it any further

@PhiloslothicalStudent so is genny neutral or village?

After sloth called genny both neutral and village

Im rereading these interactions since the cray post and they do seem out of place, especially the "sounds like village genny." I dont know how much hes played with her, but never when I was around. First time I think Ive played with Philo

Cubs questioning sloth, need to keep reading to see if he said anything further about this

Well ive got village reads on PleezIt, AM, and shorty so I guess Ill vote for one of the other 2 on the wagon cause I dont have much else right now.

vote bread

At this point I still feel inclined to at least put Cubs lowest in the POE with how many times he called please village when the consensus was that she was wolfy.

I guess its kinda like innocent until proven guilty. I dont see anything incriminating, 4 people feel strongly enough to vote for her, I dont see what theyre seeing, so by default I guess I lean her village or at worst neutral.

Cubs reasoning for not wolf reading please

So overall
- Cubs called please village multiple times which actually makes me feel a little better because why would a wolf repeatedly say that unless they’re going for the TWTBW strategy
- sloth called genny both neutral and village and it was never clear why
- cray lightly questioned please

 

[genny]

yeet mel

 

[cubsrule4e]

Well the way it looks, barring any mechanical info, me, genny, and mel are the last 3 yeets. Its not me, I dont think its genny, which leaves mel for me. Mel will say the same exact thing but in reverse. If we're all village, thats the game. So what do we do here? Ride it out for the next week? Anyone got anything else of worth to contribute?

 

[supershorty]

I'm planning to go through multiple people's posts again today, just feeling mentally a little burned out. I'll try and get to it tonight.

I'm okay with discussing people outside the POE. Too much tunnel vision can get us in trouble.

 

[Barkley13]

And then through the end of D1

[

What's pinging you about please?

Honestly not entirely sure right now. I am rereading a fair amount right now but just feeling better about AM at the moment

Bread was being hedgey on please and didn’t have an explanation for voting her

I'm really not sure where to go rn
I can see shorty's points on me and I don't think it's coming from a wolf standpoint
But I doubt my wagon is 100% village
Between AM, shorty, bread, Dina and sloth I feel currently the best about AM and shorty, then dina then bread and sloth are kinda tied.

vote bread

And then please also voted for bread but had him tied with sloth. What are the odds that her two wolfiest reads are both of the other reads? Seems unlikely

What is making you feel bad about bread?

the read on me being out of nowhere.
bread and sloth are kinda tied at the bottom of my reads right now
so it was kinda a dartboard between the two

But she also didn’t really explain her bread read too much

Not fully caught up and heading out to dinner.

So far though, not feeling great about Sloth or Please and willing to see what happens there.

#### yeet Sloth #####

Not sure I want to be not fully informed just pile onto Please.

Cray mentioned feeling bad about both sloth and please and her vote put sloth at 3 votes

maybe you already said this but if you think mel is wolfier than me why aren't you on mel?

Egging alley(?) on to vote for mel….. doesn’t rule mel out as wolfy since it wasn’t going to be a viable wagon anyway (which was a whole argument)

Nope. I had that thought about pleasy's reads being odd and then shorty's post had the same thoughts as me. I agree with shorty but came to the conclusion on my own

this would be easier to believe if you had shown any signs of evaluating VMLPBRO before everyone started calling her sketchy.

I mean. I get the point you’re trying to make with Alley here but I think it’s not quite the got ya moment you’re making it out to be.

Day 1 is a crap shoot, and your argument is essentially “her list is a list of sketchy people”.

Like…what are you expecting her to have on D1? A POE of non-sketchy people?

Just an interesting interaction. It’s not a super good look for mel

(This is part of the mel quote but everything is broken):
Sloth - I liked an earlier line of questioning pushing someone to elaborate on specifics of a read. Enough for me to put in my "more village than not" pile

Alley - Begrudgingly giving her some village points rn, still not convinced that she's fully village because of the waffling to me off of VSLMIP and I STILL don't like how she went from "But pleasey is an easy D1 vote!" to "Oh pleasey is wolfy enough to vote" with 0 evaluation in between. That looks like a wolf trying to dig out a partner and then trying to jump on the vote.
Cray, Cyndia, everyone else I haven't paid attention to - neutrals
Cubs
Dina, Bread - 3rd and 4th people on a wolf wagon always get sketch points. Don't make me link the MafiaScum page

The sloth read is interesting, especially since I remember he later walks it back very quickly

Bread and please were voting for each other, and with both wagons semi-viable in the event of waffles, that seems less likely to be w/w, I agree.

Sloth's abrupt turnaround on please and whether she agreed with my analysis or not made me very uncomfortable.

Shorty then started to question sloth right after yeet close and kept it up the next day

 

[Barkley13]

I tried to spoiler that too but everything was broken 😬

 

[Barkley13]

Well the way it looks, barring any mechanical info, me, genny, and mel are the last 3 yeets. Its not me, I dont think its genny, which leaves mel for me. Mel will say the same exact thing but in reverse. If we're all village, thats the game. So what do we do here? Ride it out for the next week? Anyone got anything else of worth to contribute?

Why is cray out of the POE?

 

[Barkley13]

Day One Please Take Your Seats Vote Tally

please (5) - AM, shorty, Bread, Dina, sloth
AM (1) - genny
cheezit (1) - alley
bread (3) - cyndia, cubs, please
alley (1) - cheezit
sloth (3) - barks, Zenge, cray

 

[Barkley13]

Why is cray out of the POE?

@ anyone

 

[Animal Midwife]

Why is cray out of the POE?

For me, tone + plus both flipped villagers that were prior partners with her said she doesn't bus like that.

 

[cubsrule4e]

Why is cray out of the POE?

Im not the one who officially removed her.

 

[cubsrule4e]

Day One Please Take Your Seats Vote Tally

please (5) - AM, shorty, Bread, Dina, sloth
AM (1) - genny
cheezit (1) - alley
bread (3) - cyndia, cubs, please
alley (1) - cheezit
sloth (3) - barks, Zenge, cray

If youre calling the D1 wagon now pure, I still think the Cray vote could be opportunistic, easy spot for a wolf to have slipped in their last minute vote, and then look good on the sloth flip later.

 

[supershorty]

Unyeet genny

thinking

 

[cubsrule4e]

unvote mel

I just dont know. I kind of feel what @supershorty does right now, just doesnt feel like a wolfy Mel, especially how hard he's trying to push me right now.

 

[supershorty]

I'm still living in my paranoid world where D1 was a grand bus tour like in Basics and I'm clearing people for the wrong reasons, and I don't like it here. Someone take me home, please.

 

[supershorty]

unvote mel

I just dont know. I kind of feel what @supershorty does right now, just doesnt feel like a wolfy Mel, especially how hard he's trying to push me right now.

Is this the main reason you're starting to feel differently, or is it this in addition to other things?

 

[cubsrule4e]

Is this the main reason you're starting to feel differently, or is it this in addition to other things?

That plus I dont really have anything besides the VCA, which doesnt look good, but ive had plenty of bad villager games myself. Just starting to feel like the wrong way to go.

 

[Animal Midwife]

I'm still living in my paranoid world where D1 was a grand bus tour like in Basics and I'm clearing people for the wrong reasons, and I don't like it here. Someone take me home, please.

Well, so far the kills have been outside the POE. Which I expect to be the opposite of what a deepwolf wants to do.

I still think the blocker or whoever targeted Cyndia should reveal.

 

[supershorty]

There were 2 semi-viable wagons besides please when she voted for Bread - him and AM. At the time, Sloth only had 1 vote on her, and was already bussing please. please chose to put her vote on Bread, pushing him to 3 votes (which was only 2 behind her at the time) and putting him within range of a yeet.

In a world where it's a please/sloth/Bread pack and all 3 were on the board, with please already being essentially outed, I just don't see the pack - even a pack of noob wolves - making that choice.

It would also mean that Bread bussed 2 out of 3 days so far. I'll go look at WWizards to see if he bussed in that game*, I don't know if it's part of his wolf meta or not.

Tbh Bread's lack of engagement with the thread is NAI.

Edit: he did not bus at all in WWizards. There was even a day where the ONLY people who didn't vote for a particular wolf were the remaining wolves. That's the only time I've played with wolf!Bread, I think, so I don't have other spreadsheets I can go look at.

Thinking about this more and looking at my vote tracker, I think a wolf!Bread is more unlikely than when I made this post this morning.

When Bread voted, this was the tally:

Spoiler

please (2) - AM, shorty
Dina ()
shorty ()
Barky ()
AM (2) - genny, Mel
genny ()
Spooky ghost ()
Mel ()
Bread (1) - Cyndia
Cray (1) - alley
cubs ()

He then voted please to push her to 3. With multiple viable wagons, and only 2 votes on the leading ones at the time, he very easily could have gone elsewhere with his vote, started a new wagon, or added momentum to a village wagon already on the board. But he didn't - he voted for please. That was just under 5 hours before yeet close.

please didn't vote until quite a bit later - just about an hour and a half before yeet close, and the tally was this at that time:

Spoiler

please (5) - AM, shorty, Bread, Dina, Sloth;
Dina ();
shorty ();
Barky ();
AM (2) - genny, Mel;
genny ();
Spooky ghost ();
Mel ();
Bread (2) - Cyndia, cubs;
Cray ();
cubs ();
alley ();
Sloth (1) - Barky

So at that point, sloth has already panic-bussed and the wagon is taking off. I talked about this in the post I quoted so I'm not going to repeat myself, but I hadn't looked at the timing for Bread's vote.

Idk. Just doesn't feel that likely to me coming from someone without a history of bussing.

 

[genny]

unvote mel

I just dont know. I kind of feel what @supershorty does right now, just doesnt feel like a wolfy Mel, especially how hard he's trying to push me right now.

why wouldn't mel push you as a wolf?

 

[cubsrule4e]

why wouldn't mel push you as a wolf?

Pocketing attempts, I guess. Its not a perfect science, but usually when he's pushing me really hard like this we often end up both village. I definitely know his last wolf outing he wasnt sussing me at all, often agreeing with my reads.

 

[supershorty]

Going to try something based on feels, and AM's going to have a stroke over it, but I'm gonna do it anyway.

Yeet Barky

iso to follow

 

[Animal Midwife]

Going to try something based on feels, and AM's going to have a stroke over it, but I'm gonna do it anyway.

Yeet Barky

iso to follow

I doubt anything will convince me to vote for anyone on the D1 sloth wagon, but if this iso helps you come to a village read on her so be it.

 

[supershorty]

I doubt anything will convince me to vote for anyone on the D1 sloth wagon, but if this iso helps you come to a village read on her so be it.

AM, I don't think she's village. I really don't.

I'm rereading Emojis right now.

 

[Melchizedek]

Pocketing attempts, I guess. Its not a perfect science, but usually when he's pushing me really hard like this we often end up both village. I definitely know his last wolf outing he wasnt sussing me at all, often agreeing with my reads.

Dubz used this same defense last game what makes you think I’m gonna let it slide this time eh?

Also why does everyone use this excuse? You make it sound like all I do is argue with villagers lol

 

[supershorty]

I was thinking about it more because my POE at this point was genny, cubs, and Mel, like everyone else, but it just didn't feel right.

The argument that I had with genny last night felt more like the v/v fights we used to have than anything else. And I still have issues with how D1/D2 played out, I just can't see genny bussing sloth THAT hard.

Same deal with cubs. And his recent posts have felt like village gamesolving, not tunneling (... like me) and getting fixated on the POE and just brushing off anything else. He's thinking about other options.

I really just don't think Mel is wolfing based on his posts, and if he is, kudos because you bamboozled me.

That left me with Barks, Bread, Cray, and AM. I already explained earlier why I don't think it's likely for Bread to be a wolf. I have the same read as AM on Cray for similar reasons. If AM is a wolf, I can only see that happening through conversion, which I haven't seen any hints of and have no reason to believe is in the game.

So then I had to go back to Barks. Barks, who we gave a village pass to pretty early on, and who wolfed recently in LaWWpy, and we've been trusting Dina's read on her plus her D1 vote on sloth. But this feels eerily similar to Basics, where we dismissed people because of their D1 votes, and so I wasn't comfortable just sitting on that. So I went back and reread Emojis, which is the last time that I played with wolf!Barks. And there are similarities there that I can't ignore. I'm putting together an ISO right now comparing both games, it's just taking a bit because the forum is being laggy.

I really think we need to discuss Barks more. We've been giving her a pass based on what she supposedly would or wouldn't do bus-wise, but that behavior burned us badly in Basics, and I think the reason I've felt like my POE isn't making enough sense is because it DOESN'T.

 

[Animal Midwife]

what if Barks is just village tho

 

[Animal Midwife]

gal's face just looks very villagey

 

[supershorty]

what if Barks is just village tho

Can you please at least consider what I'm going to show you in the ISO before we do a repeat of Basics and have an incredibly strong village start and blow it at the end? Like, I know you were dead by the time that happened, but I can't tell you how similar this feels.

 

[Animal Midwife]

Can you please at least consider what I'm going to show you in the ISO before we do a repeat of Basics and have an incredibly strong village start and blow it at the end? Like, I know you were dead by the time that happened, but I can't tell you how similar this feels.

i guess

 

[cubsrule4e]

Dubz used this same defense last game what makes you think I’m gonna let it slide this time eh?

Also why does everyone use this excuse? You make it sound like all I do is argue with villagers lol

Defense of what? lol. Im explaining why im reading YOU village.

 

[supershorty]

So I'm like halfway through Barky's posts in her ISO and the forum software is already getting really fussy about the number of quotes I pulled. I'll have to post her ISO in sections.

I already know Midwife is unlikely to listen to me because she has a hard time yeeting her tees (other than MsP), but Cray, cubs, Bread, Mel, and genny, I'm literally begging you to at least consider what I'm saying. I think we're on the wrong track with our current POE and I really, really think it's Barks.

 

[cubsrule4e]

So I'm like halfway through Barky's posts in her ISO and the forum software is already getting really fussy about the number of quotes I pulled. I'll have to post her ISO in sections.

I already know Midwife is unlikely to listen to me because she has a hard time yeeting her tees (other than MsP), but Cray, cubs, Bread, Mel, and genny, I'm literally begging you to at least consider what I'm saying. I think we're on the wrong track with our current POE and I really, really think it's Barks.

Im willing to consider it for sure. We still have a big cushion, I just wanted to get some kind of discussion going before it became yeet mel genny cubs and lose. We can still go back there at any point if more evidence surfaces.

 

[supershorty]

Ok I'm going to post these out of order because the first half isn't as useful anyway.

tl;dr:
Barky has done a lot of things in this game that are very similar to her play in Emojis, which is the last game I played with wolf!Barks. Of note, she'll ask packmates lots of questions (and other people lots of questions) that make it look like she's trying to game solve, but when you go through her posts, she's actually doing minimal or no analysis.

-I can't explain her D1 sloth vote beyond she probably thought that wagon wasn't going to take off and then wasn't in a position to get off it once it did. I'm asking you to look past that, and to look past the "Barks wouldn't bus there" unless you have irrefutable proof of it, and consider the rest of what's in here.
-Most of what she posts is thread consensus or summaries. This morning, she pulled a bunch of quotes, trying to look helpful I assume, and wrote little snippets under it. They were posts that had me feeling a little better about her at first glance, and then I started thinking about the content within those posts and decided that they were more like a wolf trying to LOOK like they were contributing to game solving, but not actually game solving. She never provided any analysis in them, just summarized what happened in those quotes. Anyone can do busywork. A wolf is more likely to do it and try to get credit for it.
-She was on the earlier side to vote for sloth D2 as well, but when you look at the wagons at that point, she didn't really have another choice. The leading village wagon, if I'm right, was cubs, and she'd been village reading him. Sloth was starting to look sketchier, so that wagon was picking up speed. That leaves a wolf!Barks with 3 options: start a new wagon, which would look pretty sus; walk back her read of cubs somehow and get on his wagon, which would look pretty sus; or get on the sloth wagon knowing that she's going down.
-If you only read 2 quotes in this entire ISO, please read the last 2 in this one and think about what I'm saying about them.

Spoiler

I’ve been pondering the please situation. On the surface it looks sketchy that he was defending please so much and that she randomly put him in her village reads based on weak reasons. But the other part is wondering if that’s too sketchy to be an actual wolf and was just misguided villager. I haven’t had a chance to go back to look at yesterday yet so I’m hoping that may help clear things up

This is nice, looks villagery, we'll see how her cubs read progresses.

Neutral currently. There's the right amount of fluff vs. content that I'm not reading wolfy but also haven't seen anything that screams village to me

Thread consensus. NAI.

I want to say no to this. From what I can remember, it doesn't seem like something that a wolfy cubs would do that quickly

Shorty just asked about genny but why dina?

What do you think about what I said about his defense being too loud/obvious for him to be a wolf?

Again, pressing a packmate for more explanations of her reads. Same thing she did in Emojis.

Reading these quotes from cubs where he makes a joke, a bunch of people start questioning him, and then he walks back the joke just gave me flashbacks. I feel like this happens early in almost every game when people misunderstand him and then it becomes a whole thing

Light defense of cubs, who is another easy misyeet. But this fits with her earlier post on him.

I understand where the sloth vote is coming from and am considering going there again. I’m leaning village on Cubs at this point due to what I’ve said before. I’m just not seeing how he could be wolf this game. I don’t hate the mel vote because I have him as neutral and earlier today he made some interesting posts on sloth that looked like backtracking. I have cray as neutral leaning wolfy because I liked shorty’s ISO and saw the points there. Still neutral on genny

This is overall kind of weak when you actually read it. The most that she's willing to say is neutral, leaning wolfy, but she doesn't actually want to give any wolf reads - and she leaves the door open to go onto sloth again. What's interesting to me reading through this is that she voted sloth D1 with the reason of not liking her genny read - and sloth certainly didn't do anything to make herself seem less wolfy when it came to please's flip - but Barky was hesitant to go there the next day, even when she didn't have a solid wolf read on anyone else and hadn't expressed any reason to be feeling any better about sloth.

AM and shorty are village. Bread is neutral because someone made a good point against him being wolfy but I also can’t remember any content that stands out so don’t want to move village yet. Dina is neutral leaning village because seems not sketchy on the surface but I struggle to convince myself lol. Want to look at cyndias posts more.

Pretty much thread consensus, but still leaving the door open for herself on Bread. The Dina read feels off to me too - I know that village!Barks always is suspicious of Dina, but it felt just a tiny bit like trying too hard to mimic that. Dina was pretty clearly village after please flipped. Although ironically, I was going to say that Dina wouldn't bus like that, but that's the main reason that AM won't listen to me on Barks. Welp.

Oh I guess

Yeet sloth

Gets on the sloth wagon when there are 3 votes on it, so in theory, could still go somewhere else, but think about it - if she tried to get another wagon going at this point, wouldn't it look pretty suspicious? She could have voted cubs, who was the other real wagon at this point, but that wouldn't be congruent with her read on him, so she'd either have to get on the wagon she did, start a new one, or find a non-sus way to walk back her cubs read and justify putting her vote there. A wolf!Barky really didn't have another choice at this point.

Oh I thought about it but didn’t write it down lol. I still see some sketchy things and have trouble seeing you as village. Wondering how sure shorty was in her read on you

I will wager all the hats I own and go buy out the selection at Macy's in both the men's and women's sections to add those to the hats I have to eat if I'm wrong on alley. I've never been more sure in my life.

I have a feeling that this exchange, combined with my not believing sloth's protector claim, is why alley died.

Why are you reading Mel village? You can tell me to go look if you've already said lol

Mama said burn your biographies, rewrite your history, light up your wildest dreams

Mel is one who I think this game in general would love to yeet. His VCA doesn't look great (although with 2 people yet to flip), he hasn't been around much, and other people seem to be finding his posts a lot more sus than I am? I've already articulated the differences I'm seeing in his posts and why I just don't think he's a wolf, but I know other people disagree and would be willing to vote there. Then she continues with trying to get me to change my read there - but not in a way that would come across as too pushy, because that might be too obvious. Just trying to put enough doubt in my mind that maybe I'd reconsider.

Didn't have a dime but I always had a vision that village Mel will also be committed to pushes since Im pretty sure he was village in the game he got Dubz to shoot me so may be NAI

Didn’t know how but I always had a feeling that his current play is heavily affected by being busy. But I see what you’re saying about starting elsewhere

Yes agreed, I’m not convinced it’s a block but I’m not really sure what “woke up groggy” would mean. Baby we built this house on memories and in my memory I can’t think of anything similar. But since I haven’t voted yet

Yeet cyndia

Agrees with me that it doesn't sound like a block, butttttttt then gets on the Cyndia wagon anyway and doesn't get off.

This is through page 8

Spoiler: Quotes

Sloth village read genny pretty quickly and for one reason other than “sounds like village”. Shorty did point out a very similar post from when sloth was village though, so sloth village reading genny seems to be NAI at least

Cubs not wolf reading please

Please was village reading Cubs back
(I already forgot who the first part was about)

Cubs made a weird comment about please

Cray was also lightly questioning please but from what I’ve seen so far didn’t push it any further

After sloth called genny both neutral and village

Cubs questioning sloth, need to keep reading to see if he said anything further about this

At this point I still feel inclined to at least put Cubs lowest in the POE with how many times he called please village when the consensus was that she was wolfy.

Cubs reasoning for not wolf reading please

So overall
- Cubs called please village multiple times which actually makes me feel a little better because why would a wolf repeatedly say that unless they’re going for the TWTBW strategy
- sloth called genny both neutral and village and it was never clear why
- cray lightly questioned please

And then we get to her posts today, which honestly had me feeling better about Barks until I went back and reread her posts in Emojis. Because on the surface, this SEEMS really helpful - she pulled a bunch of quotes, she puts some words afterward, wow look at the hard work, she's probably village. But if you actually read what commentary she's putting, it's an attempt at LOOKING like she's doing an ISO without actually doing any analysis. She's just summarizing what happened. It's a great example of doing busywork to look like you're a villager trying to solve the game, but not actually doing anything to solve it.

And then through the end of D1

[



Bread was being hedgey on please and didn’t have an explanation for voting her

And then please also voted for bread but had him tied with sloth. What are the odds that her two wolfiest reads are both of the other reads? Seems unlikely



But she also didn’t really explain her bread read too much

Cray mentioned feeling bad about both sloth and please and her vote put sloth at 3 votes

Egging alley(?) on to vote for mel….. doesn’t rule mel out as wolfy since it wasn’t going to be a viable wagon anyway (which was a whole argument)





Just an interesting interaction. It’s not a super good look for mel

(This is part of the mel quote but everything is broken):
Sloth - I liked an earlier line of questioning pushing someone to elaborate on specifics of a read. Enough for me to put in my "more village than not" pile

The sloth read is interesting, especially since I remember he later walks it back very quickly

Shorty then started to question sloth right after yeet close and kept it up the next day

Same thing here. LOOKS really helpful, but it's not actually doing anything to game solve.

 

[supershorty]

Here's the first half, god willing.

Spoiler

Yeet Dina

As I always say she’s a sneaky one! I had no idea she was a wolf last time

Barks pinged me right off the bat with this because I thought it was a strange vote given that her most recent game with Dina was LaWWpy, and as I mentioned earlier, there was no real reason for salt. I don't think much of D1 first votes, but it was the first ping I got of the game.

The last game I played we were joking about me always calling her sneaky. So it made me laugh to myself to yeet her in the hopes of being able to use that reason

But her earlier posts were just her saying she wouldn’t be here

Has he been a wolf recently? I can’t think of any games

Questions like this by themselves are NAI. But what got my attention when I was rereading Emojis was that wolf!Barks will ask a LOT of questions to look like she's contributing to game solving - without actually game solving. I'll pull quotes from Emojis and give them their own post because the forum software probably won't let me post this as it is.

But would cyndia know that he's an easy push?

Another example of the kinds of questions a wolf!Barks will ask to look villagey.

I just found it interesting that he only had reads on you and shorty and how it was shortly after you had softly defended him being low hanging fruit and not a good place to go today. Your role in it is definitely NAI and I was pondering where bread might be coming from and decided it could be wolf or village

Bread is an easy misyeet and saying something like this lightly sets the stage for it, but gives her enough room to avoid taking the plunge if it seems like the thread isn't going to go there. When Bread is wolfing, he tends to village read his packmates, so I'll give Barks that Bread having Zenge as his top village read was pingy - I don't know if anyone has Zenge as their top village read on D1.

So do you think her lacking content this game is different than the previous games when she was village? Because it sounds like you don’t think that but you’re voting for her

Can you explain this more? I’m not sure what normal sloth really sounds like

More asking questions to look helpful. She did this a TON in Emojis too.

Yeet sloth

Because the thing with the genny read feels off to me. I'm hesitant to vote please or alley because they're two that I find sketchy every single game but I do see things that make me side eye

And then we get to the part where Midwife is going to stop reading, because she doesn't think that Barks would bus in this situation. I haven't played with wolf!Barks enough to know what she would or wouldn't do, but I'll point out that if this was in fact the wolf strategy and 2 of the 3 of them bussed on D1, it worked pretty well because we've given Barks a pass since then. This was a legitimate reason to wolf read sloth, and when you look at it, it actually sets her up for a genny misyeet in the event that sloth was actually the one to flip. Why she'd bus here instead of vote someone else, I can't give you a particularly good explanation - but unless Barks is as adamantly anti-bussing as Midwife is, I'm not dismissing it. We've been down that road and played that game before, and village started strong and then lost. And I got my ass dragged to endgame in that game too, and it was horrible. I'm not letting it happen again.

What is making you feel bad about bread?

Noting this interaction with please. She did this a lot in Emojis too - asked her packmates to explain their reads on other people, looked like she was pressing them.

I need to look back but I think he was also still defending her towards the end

This is definitely concerning for alley who was also pinging me earlier in the cycle. I really need to look back at the end of the day yesterday

Setting the stage for some sus on cubs (who admittedly had somewhat defended please, we've discussed that) and for a potential alley misyeet based on something that cubs had said with his concern about alley's voting on D1.

Why the village leans on mel, cyndia, and genny?

And how dare you put spoopy ghost as wolfiest 😡


How was crays vote on sloth opportunistic?

Again, note that while Barky is asking a lot of questions of other people (cubs in this case), she herself isn't posting any reads or really making any pushes. It's entirely possible that she threw the vote on Sloth D1 not expecting that wagon to start picking up speed and then really wasn't in a position to get off it.

 

[supershorty]

This isn't an ISO that has a big "gotcha!" moment in it. But I don't think we're looking for a wolf who is going to have a gotcha moment - frankly, we got 2 of those in this game already. But there are a lot of little things that when you look at it, don't make sense for village!Barks and don't fit village!Barks' typical play.

genny, I'm sorry I tunneled on you. Ripperoni, genny reading card.

 

[supershorty]

I'm going to go look at please and sloth's mentions of Barky. It won't surprise me if they're minimal.

 

[supershorty]

Also, for the tiniest and least important point, Barks doesn't play that often these days and probably wouldn't know about Zenge's unfortunate habit of dying very early on, especially since he went to endgame in the last game she played. AND, keeping him alive that long in that game contributed heavily to the wolves losing.

 

[cubsrule4e]

Ok I'm going to post these out of order because the first half isn't as useful anyway.

tl;dr:
Barky has done a lot of things in this game that are very similar to her play in Emojis, which is the last game I played with wolf!Barks. Of note, she'll ask packmates lots of questions (and other people lots of questions) that make it look like she's trying to game solve, but when you go through her posts, she's actually doing minimal or no analysis.

-I can't explain her D1 sloth vote beyond she probably thought that wagon wasn't going to take off and then wasn't in a position to get off it once it did. I'm asking you to look past that, and to look past the "Barks wouldn't bus there" unless you have irrefutable proof of it, and consider the rest of what's in here.
-Most of what she posts is thread consensus or summaries. This morning, she pulled a bunch of quotes, trying to look helpful I assume, and wrote little snippets under it. They were posts that had me feeling a little better about her at first glance, and then I started thinking about the content within those posts and decided that they were more like a wolf trying to LOOK like they were contributing to game solving, but not actually game solving. She never provided any analysis in them, just summarized what happened in those quotes. Anyone can do busywork. A wolf is more likely to do it and try to get credit for it.
-She was on the earlier side to vote for sloth D2 as well, but when you look at the wagons at that point, she didn't really have another choice. The leading village wagon, if I'm right, was cubs, and she'd been village reading him. Sloth was starting to look sketchier, so that wagon was picking up speed. That leaves a wolf!Barks with 3 options: start a new wagon, which would look pretty sus; walk back her read of cubs somehow and get on his wagon, which would look pretty sus; or get on the sloth wagon knowing that she's going down.
-If you only read 2 quotes in this entire ISO, please read the last 2 in this one and think about what I'm saying about them.

Spoiler

This is nice, looks villagery, we'll see how her cubs read progresses.


Thread consensus. NAI.


Again, pressing a packmate for more explanations of her reads. Same thing she did in Emojis.


Light defense of cubs, who is another easy misyeet. But this fits with her earlier post on him.


This is overall kind of weak when you actually read it. The most that she's willing to say is neutral, leaning wolfy, but she doesn't actually want to give any wolf reads - and she leaves the door open to go onto sloth again. What's interesting to me reading through this is that she voted sloth D1 with the reason of not liking her genny read - and sloth certainly didn't do anything to make herself seem less wolfy when it came to please's flip - but Barky was hesitant to go there the next day, even when she didn't have a solid wolf read on anyone else and hadn't expressed any reason to be feeling any better about sloth.


Pretty much thread consensus, but still leaving the door open for herself on Bread. The Dina read feels off to me too - I know that village!Barks always is suspicious of Dina, but it felt just a tiny bit like trying too hard to mimic that. Dina was pretty clearly village after please flipped. Although ironically, I was going to say that Dina wouldn't bus like that, but that's the main reason that AM won't listen to me on Barks. Welp.


Gets on the sloth wagon when there are 3 votes on it, so in theory, could still go somewhere else, but think about it - if she tried to get another wagon going at this point, wouldn't it look pretty suspicious? She could have voted cubs, who was the other real wagon at this point, but that wouldn't be congruent with her read on him, so she'd either have to get on the wagon she did, start a new one, or find a non-sus way to walk back her cubs read and justify putting her vote there. A wolf!Barky really didn't have another choice at this point.



I have a feeling that this exchange, combined with my not believing sloth's protector claim, is why alley died.


Mel is one who I think this game in general would love to yeet. His VCA doesn't look great (although with 2 people yet to flip), he hasn't been around much, and other people seem to be finding his posts a lot more sus than I am? I've already articulated the differences I'm seeing in his posts and why I just don't think he's a wolf, but I know other people disagree and would be willing to vote there. Then she continues with trying to get me to change my read there - but not in a way that would come across as too pushy, because that might be too obvious. Just trying to put enough doubt in my mind that maybe I'd reconsider.



Agrees with me that it doesn't sound like a block, butttttttt then gets on the Cyndia wagon anyway and doesn't get off.


And then we get to her posts today, which honestly had me feeling better about Barks until I went back and reread her posts in Emojis. Because on the surface, this SEEMS really helpful - she pulled a bunch of quotes, she puts some words afterward, wow look at the hard work, she's probably village. But if you actually read what commentary she's putting, it's an attempt at LOOKING like she's doing an ISO without actually doing any analysis. She's just summarizing what happened. It's a great example of doing busywork to look like you're a villager trying to solve the game, but not actually doing anything to solve it.


Same thing here. LOOKS really helpful, but it's not actually doing anything to game solve.

Agree that I initially had a village vibe on her wall of quotes this morning. Then she provided the D1 Vote tally, but not D2 or 3, which subconsciously could have been a way to also get people to remember that she was the very first one to vote sloth, making her look pretty good. Pleasy was already going down, and she had no way of knowing zenge and cray would have jumped on sloth so fast after her, so to say it was a situation where it was "too risky to bus" doesnt really work in the context of the timeline. Then, as you said, it took 3 or 4 people to vote sloth the next cycle before she said "oh right, guess I gotta vote here."

 

[supershorty]

please has ZERO posts that contain "bark", "barky", or "barks."

Same for sloth.
What better way to distance than to not mention her at all and instead make some kind of sus reads on other people that would push village in one direction or another on them? Look how well it almost worked.

 

[cubsrule4e]

Here's the first half, god willing.

Spoiler

Barks pinged me right off the bat with this because I thought it was a strange vote given that her most recent game with Dina was LaWWpy, and as I mentioned earlier, there was no real reason for salt. I don't think much of D1 first votes, but it was the first ping I got of the game.




Questions like this by themselves are NAI. But what got my attention when I was rereading Emojis was that wolf!Barks will ask a LOT of questions to look like she's contributing to game solving - without actually game solving. I'll pull quotes from Emojis and give them their own post because the forum software probably won't let me post this as it is.


Another example of the kinds of questions a wolf!Barks will ask to look villagey.


Bread is an easy misyeet and saying something like this lightly sets the stage for it, but gives her enough room to avoid taking the plunge if it seems like the thread isn't going to go there. When Bread is wolfing, he tends to village read his packmates, so I'll give Barks that Bread having Zenge as his top village read was pingy - I don't know if anyone has Zenge as their top village read on D1.



More asking questions to look helpful. She did this a TON in Emojis too.


And then we get to the part where Midwife is going to stop reading, because she doesn't think that Barks would bus in this situation. I haven't played with wolf!Barks enough to know what she would or wouldn't do, but I'll point out that if this was in fact the wolf strategy and 2 of the 3 of them bussed on D1, it worked pretty well because we've given Barks a pass since then. This was a legitimate reason to wolf read sloth, and when you look at it, it actually sets her up for a genny misyeet in the event that sloth was actually the one to flip. Why she'd bus here instead of vote someone else, I can't give you a particularly good explanation - but unless Barks is as adamantly anti-bussing as Midwife is, I'm not dismissing it. We've been down that road and played that game before, and village started strong and then lost. And I got my ass dragged to endgame in that game too, and it was horrible. I'm not letting it happen again.


Noting this interaction with please. She did this a lot in Emojis too - asked her packmates to explain their reads on other people, looked like she was pressing them.


Setting the stage for some sus on cubs (who admittedly had somewhat defended please, we've discussed that) and for a potential alley misyeet based on something that cubs had said with his concern about alley's voting on D1.


Again, note that while Barky is asking a lot of questions of other people (cubs in this case), she herself isn't posting any reads or really making any pushes. It's entirely possible that she threw the vote on Sloth D1 not expecting that wagon to start picking up speed and then really wasn't in a position to get off it.

So here you explained what I just said above, which to me, is the crux of the situation: how likely/possible is it for her to have bussed here? Again, she was the first one on sloth fairly late in the cycle and had no reason to think the wagon would pick up like it did. Why not park a vote right there and use the cred later if need be?

 

[cubsrule4e]

vote barks

Im willing to go here for now.

 

[supershorty]

Ok I'm going to post these out of order because the first half isn't as useful anyway.

tl;dr:
Barky has done a lot of things in this game that are very similar to her play in Emojis, which is the last game I played with wolf!Barks. Of note, she'll ask packmates lots of questions (and other people lots of questions) that make it look like she's trying to game solve, but when you go through her posts, she's actually doing minimal or no analysis.

-I can't explain her D1 sloth vote beyond she probably thought that wagon wasn't going to take off and then wasn't in a position to get off it once it did. I'm asking you to look past that, and to look past the "Barks wouldn't bus there" unless you have irrefutable proof of it, and consider the rest of what's in here.
-Most of what she posts is thread consensus or summaries. This morning, she pulled a bunch of quotes, trying to look helpful I assume, and wrote little snippets under it. They were posts that had me feeling a little better about her at first glance, and then I started thinking about the content within those posts and decided that they were more like a wolf trying to LOOK like they were contributing to game solving, but not actually game solving. She never provided any analysis in them, just summarized what happened in those quotes. Anyone can do busywork. A wolf is more likely to do it and try to get credit for it.
-She was on the earlier side to vote for sloth D2 as well, but when you look at the wagons at that point, she didn't really have another choice. The leading village wagon, if I'm right, was cubs, and she'd been village reading him. Sloth was starting to look sketchier, so that wagon was picking up speed. That leaves a wolf!Barks with 3 options: start a new wagon, which would look pretty sus; walk back her read of cubs somehow and get on his wagon, which would look pretty sus; or get on the sloth wagon knowing that she's going down.
-If you only read 2 quotes in this entire ISO, please read the last 2 in this one and think about what I'm saying about them.

Spoiler

This is nice, looks villagery, we'll see how her cubs read progresses.


Thread consensus. NAI.


Again, pressing a packmate for more explanations of her reads. Same thing she did in Emojis.


Light defense of cubs, who is another easy misyeet. But this fits with her earlier post on him.


This is overall kind of weak when you actually read it. The most that she's willing to say is neutral, leaning wolfy, but she doesn't actually want to give any wolf reads - and she leaves the door open to go onto sloth again. What's interesting to me reading through this is that she voted sloth D1 with the reason of not liking her genny read - and sloth certainly didn't do anything to make herself seem less wolfy when it came to please's flip - but Barky was hesitant to go there the next day, even when she didn't have a solid wolf read on anyone else and hadn't expressed any reason to be feeling any better about sloth.


Pretty much thread consensus, but still leaving the door open for herself on Bread. The Dina read feels off to me too - I know that village!Barks always is suspicious of Dina, but it felt just a tiny bit like trying too hard to mimic that. Dina was pretty clearly village after please flipped. Although ironically, I was going to say that Dina wouldn't bus like that, but that's the main reason that AM won't listen to me on Barks. Welp.


Gets on the sloth wagon when there are 3 votes on it, so in theory, could still go somewhere else, but think about it - if she tried to get another wagon going at this point, wouldn't it look pretty suspicious? She could have voted cubs, who was the other real wagon at this point, but that wouldn't be congruent with her read on him, so she'd either have to get on the wagon she did, start a new one, or find a non-sus way to walk back her cubs read and justify putting her vote there. A wolf!Barky really didn't have another choice at this point.



I have a feeling that this exchange, combined with my not believing sloth's protector claim, is why alley died.


Mel is one who I think this game in general would love to yeet. His VCA doesn't look great (although with 2 people yet to flip), he hasn't been around much, and other people seem to be finding his posts a lot more sus than I am? I've already articulated the differences I'm seeing in his posts and why I just don't think he's a wolf, but I know other people disagree and would be willing to vote there. Then she continues with trying to get me to change my read there - but not in a way that would come across as too pushy, because that might be too obvious. Just trying to put enough doubt in my mind that maybe I'd reconsider.



Agrees with me that it doesn't sound like a block, butttttttt then gets on the Cyndia wagon anyway and doesn't get off.


And then we get to her posts today, which honestly had me feeling better about Barks until I went back and reread her posts in Emojis. Because on the surface, this SEEMS really helpful - she pulled a bunch of quotes, she puts some words afterward, wow look at the hard work, she's probably village. But if you actually read what commentary she's putting, it's an attempt at LOOKING like she's doing an ISO without actually doing any analysis. She's just summarizing what happened. It's a great example of doing busywork to look like you're a villager trying to solve the game, but not actually doing anything to solve it.


Same thing here. LOOKS really helpful, but it's not actually doing anything to game solve.

@Melchizedek @Crayola227 @genny @The_Breadmann

I know it's a lot of reading. I'm sorry. The tl;dr summarizes it pretty well.
We haven't considered Barks really at all.

I'm really convinced I'm right. I'm also certain that AM won't listen to me on this. But I'd appreciate your thoughts, and I really, really think we should vote here today.

 

[Crayola227]

Thank you for tagging me. Also sorry to say, today is moving day (my parent is staying with us to prepare and help with baby) so I can't really play intol tomorrow probably.

 

[Crayola227]

I will say questions about my wolfiness are not realistic.

Even with noob wolves under heavy sus (like the game with Alley and Sunny) and any game since, I'm not wanting to lose any wolves and try to win a game by assuming I'll be able to lone wolf to the end and win in an F3. I seem to be an almost policy auto yeet before an end game unless there's no question to my villageriness which is pretty rare, and something that may come my way when I am actually village but not something I rely on as a wolf.

I feel like I was pretty serious about heaping the majority of my sus on Please and Sloth, maybe vaguely earlier in D1 but it was there, and I was consistent in that throughout and voted a wolf every time we've had a vote ffs lol. Except this last one I guess.

Even if you want to make the case that I am trying to deep wolf and bussed these folks, well sadly past packmates are dead (Cyndia and Alley) and can't vouch, but I always say the best defense is an offense, meaning that there's no reason in the world I can see that I am wolfing, and even if bussing HARD, that I don't have a few other folks that are misyeets that I'm pushing just as hard if not harder hoping that even if I don't defend packmates directly, that I can get the heat off them and onto someone else. Fake wolf hunting and pushing yeets are some of the least detrimental ways to wolf.

That's not to say I haven't had cubs, Mel, maybe genny in my POE as well through all this, but I haven't pushed hard there. I wanted Please and Sloth yeeted and even if you want to argue I haven't played super hard to make it happen, that is where the bulk of my effort has gone. I wanted those flips and I don't think I've done much to suggest otherwise.

I mentioned I've been out of town this week and not coming home until tonight. So besides reading thread and trying to follow and place a decent vote (sussing Please and pushing Sloth not being bad moves so far) I haven't been able to dig for this last wolf and reeval people. Sorry. And it's easiest for me right now to post this defense of mine than to do more than that, as I don't really have to strain my brain to analyze others to offer up my limited viewpoint on the corner of the game I've been in doing ma thing.

Anyhoo guys I gotta go and try to get packed and out of here and onto the road.

 

[genny]

@Melchizedek @Crayola227 @genny @The_Breadmann

I know it's a lot of reading. I'm sorry. The tl;dr summarizes it pretty well.
We haven't considered Barks really at all.

I'm really convinced I'm right. I'm also certain that AM won't listen to me on this. But I'd appreciate your thoughts, and I really, really think we should vote here today.

i think i'm stuck in a mel tunnel. I wasn't really considering Barks, but i guess your iso makes sense. i'll have to think about it.

 

[WildZoo]

Y'all are witnessing what happens when neither mod likes tallying

 

[supershorty]

genny ()
cubs (1) - Mel
Mel (1) - genny
Barky (2) - shorty, cubs

point plz

 

[WildZoo]

genny ()
cubs (1) - Mel
Mel (1) - genny
Barky (2) - shorty, cubs

point plz

Point awarded