NPs vs. MD's.

[frenchyn]

I've never seen a doctor yell at a nurse for not knowing details like this, but the thread here was started by a nurse who believed that the extra education/experience a doctor has isn't really important, hence the discussion.

Oh trust me...it does happen...

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[frenchyn]

@frenchyn The problem is she is going to go NP school, and she probably will never have a chance to take chemistry again because most NP schools require just a BSN... I wonder how she is going to understand biochem, pharmacokinetics/pharmacodynamics etc...

Most of nursing experience is from working as a nurse so I hope she will learn it working as a nurse...or during NP program. I am not going to NP program so I do not know what it covers and what not...so I can not go into detail. I just talked about my nursing program experience since I have been there and done that But I agree with you...it is scary when she does not know how to do simple math calculation.

 

[dwgrubbs1s]

I've commented on several posts that are like this. The only reason I do is because I am a BSN (Bachelor of Science in Nursing) graduate and am currently finishing up my final few classes to start applying MD/DO. The propaganda of NPs are equal to MDs is real and being pushed (at least it was in my school). After taking the undergraduate course work for nursing, it is a joke compared to undergraduate work for medical school (again at my school at least). Nursing focuses very heavily on social issues, which is fine. However, to adequately treat patients I would assume one needs a deep background in science. I do NOT beleive NPs should be working autonomously. This is dangerous and could lead to issues. Someone made mention that the science isn't all that necessary to treat certain illnesses. Unfortunately in life not everything presents in textbook form. A deep background in science is needed in these times to help understand what is going on possibly at the molecular level and what could be the possible course of treatment. Nursing is the only field I know of that advocates that less education is just as good or better than more education.

 

[medic86]

so if US guy says its something different but decision has already been made and procedure occurs that isn't needed, who is responsible?

Well, they're not going to say it's a brain bleed unless they're damn sure it's a brain bleed.

Otherwise: "please correlate clinically."

 

[group_theory]

My bad hehehe...I meant I heard a residency said PEA as NSR during a code. I guess his resident asked him what rhythm is this. He said NSR.

Just to be technical, you can be in PEA and be in NSR .... you just don't have a pulse. PEA used to be known as electromechanical dissociation

 

[frenchyn]

Just to be technical, you can be in PEA and be in NSR .... you just don't have a pulse. PEA used to be known as electromechanical dissociation

Are you saying if a patient is in NSR he/she can be in either PEA or not? Maybe SR with PEA but not NSR. To me PEA is not considered normal. I usually say SR with first degree block. ...not normal NSR with first degree block...but I am not a cardiologist. Now you get me curious

 

[ridethecliche]

That was actually meant to rile OP up, not you While there is room in medicine for those lacking interpersonal skills (path, rads, etc), hospitalist medicine certainly isn't the place for it. Two of the best surgeons I've ever had the pleasure of working with had painfully bad interpersonal skills (and I mean like, autism spectrum levels of bad), but they were damn good at cutting people apart and putting them back together, so people didn't much make a fuss. I didn't mean to collaterally rustle your jimmies

The best surgeon I worked for essentially had a team built around him to do damage control for everytime he opened his mouth and said something ridiculous. Nothing un-PC or anything, but the dude was downright weird at times. I still thought he was awesome, but the reason people came to see him from all over the world was because the list of the people that could do what he did as well as he did was very very short That and his team was incredible.

 

[group_theory]

Are you saying if a patient is in NSR he/she can be in either PEA or not? Maybe SR with PEA but not NSR. To me PEA is not considered normal. I usually say SR with first degree block. ...not normal NSR with first degree block...but I am not a cardiologist. Now you get me curious

Yes, you can be in PEA and in NSR. Normal Sinus Rhythm is the electrical activity seen on monitor. PEA is PULSELESS Electrical activity, so it can be any electrical activity, but without pulse. Hence the old name, electro-mechanical dissociation. For example, you can have a massive PE, be in PEA/coding, and have NSR as the underlying rhythm. "sinus rhythm with first degree block" isn't really normal anymore but that's because there is an underlying EKG abnormality. If you're hooked on the semantics of the word "normal" in NSR, then you're really missing the BIG picture and just focused on semantics for the sake of semantics.

*I'm not a cardiologist but I am board-certified in critical care medicine

 

[Psai]

Are you saying if a patient is in NSR he/she can be in either PEA or not? Maybe SR with PEA but not NSR. To me PEA is not considered normal. I usually say SR with first degree block. ...not normal NSR with first degree block...but I am not a cardiologist. Now you get me curious

Guys take a good look. This is exhibit A for "you don't know what you don't know"

Btw why would a doctor yell at a nurse for not knowing how something works? They don't care if a nurse knows how it works. They care if the medication was ordered but not given

 

[seminoma]

Are you saying if a patient is in NSR he/she can be in either PEA or not? Maybe SR with PEA but not NSR. To me PEA is not considered normal. I usually say SR with first degree block. ...not normal NSR with first degree block...but I am not a cardiologist. Now you get me curious

Rate of 60-100 with normal rhythm is NSR.

 

[frenchyn]

Guys take a good look. This is exhibit A for "you don't know what you don't know"

Btw why would a doctor yell at a nurse for not knowing how something works? They don't care if a nurse knows how it works. They care if the medication was ordered but not given[/QUOTE

Woah you are so ignorant. Trust me...even though not every nurses know, you hope your nurses know how a medication works because guess what...if you put the order in incorrectly, she/he is the one who will catch it and save your patient. And yes I had doctors yell at me for all stupid stuffs such as calling for consult or asking for a UA on a patient that had UTI...basically for doing my job. Or calling nurses incompetent over a phone number...it happened. I am just speaking from my perspective. Your last statement makes me curious...have you worked at bedside as a doctor or any health care professional?

I admit I don't know everything but I am open to learn. No need to to say "you don't know what you don't". No one knows everything and when you think you do, that is when you will kill a patient. I saw that happened and it was unfortunate for the patient.

 

[gmbz]

RN to MD checking in here (sitting on a MD acceptance). In my 5 years working as a nurse, both inpatient and outpatient, it is pretty clear that midlevels do not have anything close to the depth of knowledge that the MD (or some DO's) possess. Surprisingly I believe that the patients are going to be the main deciders here. Almost every patient I have come in contact with understands that the "doc" or Physician is the person to see. If people are not going to see a physician during their hospitalization they will complain. As satisfaction becomes the metric for reimbursement we will see the NP's fall into the PA's slot, part of the team. Nothing more, nothing less. Physicians will still be orchestrating the ship.

 

[W19]

RN to MD checking in here (sitting on a MD acceptance). In my 5 years working as a nurse, both inpatient and outpatient, it is pretty clear that midlevels do not have anything close to the depth of knowledge that the MD (or some DO's) possess. Surprisingly I believe that the patients are going to be the main deciders here. Almost every patient I have come in contact with understands that the "doc" or Physician is the person to see. If people are not going to see a physician during their hospitalization they will complain. As satisfaction becomes the metric for reimbursement we will see the NP's fall into the PA's slot, part of the team. Nothing more, nothing less. Physicians will still be orchestrating the ship.

Lol... You cannot be serious!

 

[gmbz]

Sorry for the anecdotal opinion?

Lol... You can not be serious!

 

[Bearcat74]

My point all along has been to say that physicians have much better/deeper training, but NPs can become very proficient in what they do. For example, my dad had a friend (MD surgeon) who was a missionary in Africa (when it was peaceful) for 25 years. He would do the surgery, and his medical assistants (locals, most which had absolutely no education or medical training), would close up each patient. My dad's friend said that after one year of experience, most could close a patient as good as he could. Some even were able to do basic surgery!

NPs have a role that continues to increase. Money is the driving force in today's medicine. That is why we see so many prior auths now. My agency is not hiring MDs (other than supervisory), but instead is hiring as many NPs as it can (at half the salary). Just remember, follow the $$ before you get in debt $250K. Especially avoid radiology and pathology. Only chose FP or IM if tons of paperwor & dealing w/ insurance companies, will not bother you.

As yes, I wish I had gone the MD route instead of the NP route. I'd be retired now, as tuition back then was nothing like it is now.

 

[ModyzMalak]

Not a "troll" here, just have plenty of years experience as an NP, from a "real university", not some on-line thing, and have some thoughts/comments, for you to consider:

1. There is no doubt that MD students have much deeper & broader basic science training than any NP I have every known. Obviously.

2. Big question.... do you really need all that biochem, histology, anatomy to treat sinusitis or DMII? No, but you need it to understand a lot of other things, and to know how to interpret research and determine the best course for your patients when you are at the edge of evidence based practice.

3. Most NPs, after several years "on the job" training, are quite compentent to handle otitis media, HTN, and the other "common cold" problems most pt's have. The problem is that they don't know what is common and what is uncommon. 95% of those things will be the typical presentation of the typical disease, but nurses DO NOT KNOW the atypical presentations of many typical diseases, nor do they know the zebras that present as horses.

4. If there is something we can't handle, most certainly refer these patients onto the MD/DO. A lot of the time you won't know what you can't handle. How can you know you have to refer something if you have no idea what it is and mistake it for something else? There's been more than a few cases of nurses treating "minor" illnesses that turned out to be major and didn't get caught until late, that were OBVIOUS to any physician looking at them, particularly amongst the oncology patients that would get antibiotic after antibiotic only to end up with cancer.

5. I really resent NPs who get their training from on-line programs. My school required first year chemistry and real organic chemistry as prereqs. Most programs don't. This is exactly why I am against independent NP practice. There are far more bad programs than good ones. I knew a lot of NPs that became midlevels and felt like they knew basically NOTHING more than they knew when they were a nurse after completion of their programs, and described their clinical rotations as glorified shadowing.

6. There should be NO automous practice for any NP until the NP has 3 years experience, working collaboratively with an MD/DO. There should be no autonomous practice for NPs period.

7. Medicine is changing so rapidly. I see patients, do the same thing as the one MD in our office, and make 1/2 as much. Much of the move to NPs is driven by the insurance companies, and the very powerful nurses lobbies and associations. Nurses lobbies are as powerful as the NRA. The nice thing about being a physician is that if things get bad enough, there's a good chance we'll be able to simply opt out of the system and take cash for whatever the market will bear. Nurses are generally employees, and not very entrepreneurial, so they'll probably stick to the system till it burns to the ground.

8. The paperwork, especially prior authorizations, is just plain crazy. If there is a generic alternative, the insurance company will "fight you" until you feel like just saying, "I give up".... even if the newer drug is better for the patient. Pre-auth sucks, I'll agree with you there. **** insurance companies.

9. Burnout is a factor for both MD and NPs. Most I know are happy, but many are not. When you take a 1 week vacation, it takes 2 weeks to catch up when you return. There's miserable people in every field of work.

10. Pt's are more demanding now than ever. Be sure you name/phone/email is not publicly listed, although w/ EMRs, many patients can reach you through your practice portal. Obviously.

11. NPs have no interest in doing surgery (although some do basic stuff in derm clinics), and we are pretty much limited to FP, Psych, Peds, and Women's Health. And allergy, IM, hospitalist work, critical care, EM, derm, etc etc...

12. I see many CT scans and MRIs going to Australia and Israel for interpretation..... cheaper! Avoid radiology like the plague.... as this is
getting more common. Cheaper =/= better. When these patients start having errors and can't track down the radiologist to sue, they'll come after the hospital. And when the hospitals start paying up, they'll switch back to US radiologists. Final reads CANNOT be done by a radiologist that is NOT licensed in the state in which they are read- it's straight up illegal. Initial reads can be, but a US-trained radiologist must look them over and approve the read to absorb the liability.

13. Most hospitalists are foreign trained, here on work visas, and most (in my experience at least) are lacking in interpersonal skills, and most seem unhappy. We care about medical skills, not interpersonal skills. In the future, most hospitalists will be US trained anyway, as the number of US students is rapidly approaching the number of residencies. And those hospitalists are NOT foreign trained- they have a foreign medical education and US graduate medical education.

14. And yes, I was admitted to 2 public MD schools, and one public DO school. 15 years ago I couldn't prescribe an aspirin, now I can (idependently) prescribe Percocet..... Medicine is sure changing, and just like everything, these changes are "cost driven". I'm sorry you made the wrong choice. Med school isn't nearly as bad as you would imagine, and residency can actually be pretty chill if you choose wisely. As to the "cost driven" nature of things, the ship sinks from the bottom up. The first people to take pay cuts at the hospitals near me were the people in basic functions- transport, food prep, janitorial, CNAs. The next to take a hit were the people a step up- nurses, respiratory therapists, radiation techs, etc. Then the cuts would hit the PAs, NPs, physical therapists, audiologists, etc. Never saw a pay cut hit the docs. Never saw pay cuts hit management. Get as high up the chain as you can, because medicine is going to sink, and the farther down you are, the worse things'll be. I've got a buffer- I'll go in making 250k-300k, if I sink to 200k, no big. You're starting at 100k, if you sink to 60k, that'll really hurt.

This was so eloquent , well said!

 

[Bearcat74]

This was so eloquent , well said!

I was a pre-med too at one time. Scored a 9.1 average on the old MCAT. You have no idea what you do not know, and what medicine today is like.

 

[ModyzMalak]

I was a pre-med too at one time. Scored a 9.1 average on the old MCAT. You have no idea what you do not know, and what medicine today is like.

Huh? Um alrighty thanks

 

[Mad Jack]

I was a pre-med too at one time. Scored a 9.1 average on the old MCAT. You have no idea what you do not know, and what medicine today is like.

9.1? How's that even possible without multiple retakes...

 

[Bearcat74]

Back then, there were six sections (Biology, Chemisty, Physics, Reading comprehension, and two more I can't remember). You could score 1-15 on each. You would take your total number, divide by six, and get an average. You needed an average (as a white male) of at least a 9, and a science GPA of 3.5 to get into a public medical school.

 

[NontradCA]

I just wanted to say lol ochem.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

How come virtually every doc I speak to says much of the basic science "stuff" they learned as a M1 and M2 was soon forgotten after Step 1? I don't see many primary care docs looking through a microscope at blood samples, or tissue samples.

I have seen many "stupid" mistakes by MDs too.... like an ER doc at my hospital telling a patient he had nothing but GERD, and then the pt died three hours later at home from a massive MI.

Not knocking MDs. Thank God for them. But the "pie is going to be split up even more", and the day of the omnipotent physician is over. 21 states now have autonomous practice for NPs, and more will be happening, as a way to control costs. As usual, "just follow the money".

I do enjoy reading your forum. Most topics are very good.

Of course I don't do my own pathology slides, but without having taken pathology then the path reports I do receive wouldn't make much sense. I, and most family doctors I know, still do their own urine microscopy and wet preps.

You're still missing the point though. Its not every single minute detail that matters, its how all of those details fit together. Truthfully, most MDs use all that stuff without even realizing it. Allow me to give you a perfect example for just this morning.

We had a 2 week check up for my daughters this morning. My wife was concerned about the younger twin getting hiccups 5-6x/day. The pediatrician, without even pausing, explained that this was due to the myelination of the phrenic nerve. This is a combination of anatomy (knowing the phrenic nerve controls breathing), embryology (knowing that newborns' peripheral motor nerves are mostly unmyelinated at birth and become myelinated as they age), and physiology (knowing that irritation of the phrenic nerve can causes hiccups) all being put together to reassure a worried new mother. Its one thing to know that newborn hiccups are benign - I would expect an NP to know that much. Knowing and being able to explain why things like that happen in the body is why medical school is so long and covers so much material, even things that seem pointless or irrelevant.

Don't even get me started on stupid doctor mistakes. Those irritate me more than midlevel screw ups because I expect my colleagues to be better than that. What I have found, and this should be a surprise to no one, is that the quality of care delivered is directly related to how many patients a doctor sees. My current FP, while a very good doctor, does some of the things I mentioned. He's seeing 30 patients per day, you don't have time to discuss viral v. bacterial sinus infection or try to explain why you want to change blood pressure medications that they have been on for 15 years in an 8 minute office visit. My former boss in Urgent Care was the same way seeing 60 patients in a 12-hour shift. Contrast that with my first partner out of residency. 20 minute appointments, guy was a great doctor who did right by his patients - including some of mine when I left.

I think they key point is that, like everything else in life, we both exist on a bell curve. A few really bad practitioners in both groups, a few really good ones, and the rest of us somewhere in the middle. However, I think the MD bell curve has a greater baseline competency compared to the NP curve.

I won't argue at all about why midlevels are getting more popular - money talks after all.

 

[VA Hopeful Dr]

My point all along has been to say that physicians have much better/deeper training, but NPs can become very proficient in what they do. For example, my dad had a friend (MD surgeon) who was a missionary in Africa (when it was peaceful) for 25 years. He would do the surgery, and his medical assistants (locals, most which had absolutely no education or medical training), would close up each patient. My dad's friend said that after one year of experience, most could close a patient as good as he could. Some even were able to do basic surgery!

NPs have a role that continues to increase. Money is the driving force in today's medicine. That is why we see so many prior auths now. My agency is not hiring MDs (other than supervisory), but instead is hiring as many NPs as it can (at half the salary). Just remember, follow the $$ before you get in debt $250K. Especially avoid radiology and pathology. Only chose FP or IM if tons of paperwor & dealing w/ insurance companies, will not bother you.

As yes, I wish I had gone the MD route instead of the NP route. I'd be retired now, as tuition back then was nothing like it is now.

As the old saying goes, I can teach a monkey to do the procedures I do. It takes a doctor to know when and why to do them.

 

[SouthernSurgeon]

My point all along has been to say that physicians have much better/deeper training, but NPs can become very proficient in what they do. For example, my dad had a friend (MD surgeon) who was a missionary in Africa (when it was peaceful) for 25 years. He would do the surgery, and his medical assistants (locals, most which had absolutely no education or medical training), would close up each patient. My dad's friend said that after one year of experience, most could close a patient as good as he could. Some even were able to do basic surgery!

There is a reason that once upon a time surgeons were considered a lower class than Physicians. Surgeons were more akin to barbers (and in fact did both).

The physical act of surgery, particularly for basic procedures or parts of procedures, is the easy part. I have no doubt I could train even a child to safely and efficiently close a patient. That's not really the point though.

 

[IslandStyle808]

Back then, there were six sections (Biology, Chemisty, Physics, Reading comprehension, and two more I can't remember). You could score 1-15 on each. You would take your total number, divide by six, and get an average. You needed an average (as a white male) of at least a 9, and a science GPA of 3.5 to get into a public medical school.

This must have been before 1991. I remember looking at some old questions from that MCAT. A good chunk of them seemed first degree in nature, but it was all about memorizing minutia. Might be easier for some, but difficult for others.

 

[Instatewaiter]

How come virtually every doc I speak to says much of the basic science "stuff" they learned as a M1 and M2 was soon forgotten after Step 1? I don't see many primary care docs looking through a microscope at blood samples, or tissue samples.

I have seen many "stupid" mistakes by MDs too.... like an ER doc at my hospital telling a patient he had nothing but GERD, and then the pt died three hours later at home from a massive MI.

Not knocking MDs. Thank God for them. But the "pie is going to be split up even more", and the day of the omnipotent physician is over. 21 states now have autonomous practice for NPs, and more will be happening, as a way to control costs. As usual, "just follow the money".

I do enjoy reading your forum. Most topics are very good.

Yeah I call absolute bull**** on this. Having been in 5 hospitals in many different states and seen ER practice patterns over the course of a decade, it would uncharacteristic for an ER doc to send anyone with chest pain or upper abdominal pain home before multiple negative troponins and EKGs- this coming from someone who has been consulted for literally thousands of bogus chest pains by the ER. ER docs are hypersensitive about chest pain and tend to be a little consult heavy.

Second, how would you know it was a massive MI? It appears by your post that this wasnt your patient. So you wouldn't have access to an autopsy...

Love,
Your neighborhood cards fellow

 

[deleted407021]

Lol... You can not be serious!

DO = NP + Ochem, duh.

 

[Instatewaiter]

My bad hehehe...I meant I heard a residency said PEA as NSR during a code. I guess his resident asked him what rhythm is this. He said NSR.

Just as complete heart block is often undelying sinus rhythm, PEA can be sinus rhythm. There is just electromechanical dissociation. While I agree this was not exactly the best worded during a code, it was technically not wrong. The electrical rhythm was sinus.

 

[frenchyn]

Just as complete heart block is often undelying sinus rhythm, PEA can be sinus rhythm. There is just electromechanical dissociation. While I agree this was not exactly the best worded during a code, it was technically not wrong. The electrical rhythm was sinus.

Ya I understand. Thanks for your explanation. I think the resident just said NSR without mentioning PEA or no pulse when his attending asked him what rhythm the patient is in during a code. If a patient is in NSR with PEA, you can just say NSR and be correct right? I am just trying to learn.

 

[jw3600]

Sorry for the anecdotal opinion?

No one cares what your anecdotal opinions of what you think DOs are or are not, you clown. You are not remotely qualified to even make a judgement. I am one of the least DO uppity people on this site (check my post history if you don't believe me), but that little jab is ridiculous. Just because entrance requirements are less competitive and there are some disadvantages in matching doesn't mean attending DOs are less qualified. You sound like a complete douche.

 

[Instatewaiter]

Ya I understand. Thanks for your explanation. I think the resident just said NSR without mentioning PEA or no pulse when his attending asked him what rhythm the patient is in during a code. If a patient is in NSR with PEA, you can just say NSR and be correct right? I am just trying to learn.

Well if it is a code, you assume no pulse.

I agree, no one says "the patient is in sinus rhythm without a pulse" when they are PEA because the algorithm has simplified things and called everything that is not VT or VF or bradycardia, PEA. And during a code, simple is sometimes better. Technically PEA is not a rhythm- pulseless VT is PEA- there is electrical activity and it is pulseless. VF is pulseless electrical activity. So for simplicity, call it PEA, but there is an electrical rhythm underlying this which is not causing the myocardium to contract (electromechanical dissociation)

 

[frenchyn]

Well if it is a code, you assume no pulse.

I agree, no one says "the patient is in sinus rhythm without a pulse" when they are PEA because the algorithm has simplified things and called everything that is not VT or VF or bradycardia, PEA. And during a code, simple is sometimes better. Technically PEA is not a rhythm- pulseless VT is PEA- there is electrical activity and it is pulseless. VF is pulseless electrical activity. So for simplicity, call it PEA, but there is an electrical rhythm underlying this which is not causing the myocardium to contract (electromechanical dissociation)

Thanks for taking your time to explain this

 

[W19]

No one cares what your anecdotal opinions of what you think DOs are or are not, you clown. You are not remotely qualified to even make a judgement. I am one of the least DO uppity people on this site (check my post history if you don't believe me), but that little jab is ridiculous. Just because entrance requirements are less competitive and there are some disadvantages in matching doesn't mean attending DOs are less qualified. You sound like a complete douche.

I already said that, but nicely!

 

[Bearcat74]

Yeah I call absolute bull**** on this. Having been in 5 hospitals in many different states and seen ER practice patterns over the course of a decade, it would uncharacteristic for an ER doc to send anyone with chest pain or upper abdominal pain home before multiple negative troponins and EKGs- this coming from someone who has been consulted for literally thousands of bogus chest pains by the ER. ER docs are hypersensitive about chest pain and tend to be a little consult heavy.

Second, how would you know it was a massive MI? It appears by your post that this wasnt your patient. So you wouldn't have access to an autopsy...

Love,
Your neighborhood cards fellow

I saw no reports. The story was related to me by the pt's wife, who was a retired CRNA. The pt's EKG was basically normal in the ER. That's all I know.

 

[jw3600]

I saw no reports. The story was related to me by the pt's wife, who was a retired CRNA. The pt's EKG was basically normal in the ER. That's all I know.

I think we have had enough from the CRNA/NP inferiority complex crew for one night.

 

[Roxas]

I saw no reports. The story was related to me by the pt's wife, who was a retired CRNA. The pt's EKG was basically normal in the ER. That's all I know.

But....was there a troponin?

nomsayin @Instatewaiter ?

 

[67552931811]

I saw no reports. The story was related to me by the pt's wife, who was a retired CRNA. The pt's EKG was basically normal in the ER. That's all I know.

shocking

 

[Psai]

I saw no reports. The story was related to me by the pt's wife, who was a retired CRNA. The pt's EKG was basically normal in the ER. That's all I know.

Rofl so basically you posted a bs story that was obviously full of crap about a doctor to doctors and now that you were called out, this is all you have?

"I have seen stupid mistakes by mds" "9.1 average on the mcat" you are such a dirty liar
9.1x6=54.6
So you're saying that when it was scored from 1-15 you got a .6 on a section? Don't come here and try to **** on us with this weak garbage

 

[Bearcat74]

Rofl so basically you posted a bs story that was obviously full of crap about a doctor to doctors and now that you were called out, this is all you have?

"I have seen stupid mistakes by mds" "9.1 average on the mcat" you are such a dirty liar

Listen genius.... I am about ready to retire. I can tell you this; hospitals and agencies, such as the one I work at, are moving away from MDs to cheaper NPs. The days where you guys ruled the roost are quickly coming to an end. I'm glad I graduated in 1984, and I will compare the knowledge I have in psych, with any psychiatrist. In fact, my agency did a patient survey, and NPs scored higher than our MDs.

9.1 was a good MCAT, but not great. If I wanted to jazz up this story, I would have said I had an 11.1 MCAT average. I still got accepted to two well-established Ohio public MD schools, and one Ohio public DO school. Perhaps it was my charming personality during the interview that got me in, and not my great MCAT score?

Cheers.

 

[Psai]

Listen genius.... I am about ready to retire. I can tell you this; hospitals and agencies, such as the one I work, at are moving away from MDs to cheaper NPs. The days were you guys ruled the roost are quickly coming to an end. I'm glad I graduated in 1984, and I will compare the knowledge I have in Psych, with any psychiatrist. In fact, my agency did a patient survey, and NPs scored higher than our MDs.

9.1 was a good MCAT, but not great. If I wanted to jazz up this story, I would have said I had an 11.1 MCAT average. I still got accepted to two well-established Ohio public MD schools, and one Ohio public DO school. Perhaps it was my charming personality during the interview that got me in, and not my great MCAT score?

Cheers.

I'm not saying anything about your score, I'm saying that the score of 9.1 is impossible as they don't grade with decimal points so your story, like the other one, is utter nonsense. You must be one of those psych nps that mismanage your patients so badly that they get admitted to us all manic and psychotic. Half of my patients on the floor were like that which scares me for the future

I haven't met any mid level that knows as much as me. They know how to do their job better than me of course but the knowledge base is just not there. Makes me laugh that you are making a claim about your knowledge because of patient surveys

 

[el_duderino]

I'm not saying anything about your score, I'm saying that the score of 9.1 is impossible as they don't grade with decimal points so your story, like the other one, is utter nonsense. You must be one of those psych nps that mismanage your patients so badly that they come to us all manic and psychotic

I haven't met any mid level that knows as much as me. They know how to do their job better than me of course but the knowledge base is just not there. Makes me laugh that you are making a claim about your knowledge because of patient surveys lol

From 1977 to 1991, the MCAT was six sections, each graded 1-15.

A total score of 55 would be an average of 9.17 per section, which could be truncated or slightly mis-remembered as 9.1

 

[TaroBubbleTea]

Listen genius.... I am about ready to retire. I can tell you this; hospitals and agencies, such as the one I work, at are moving away from MDs to cheaper NPs. The days were you guys ruled the roost are quickly coming to an end. I'm glad I graduated in 1984, and I will compare the knowledge I have in Psych, with any psychiatrist. In fact, my agency did a patient survey, and NPs scored higher than our MDs.

9.1 was a good MCAT, but not great. If I wanted to jazz up this story, I would have said I had an 11.1 MCAT average. I still got accepted to two well-established Ohio public MD schools, and one Ohio public DO school. Perhaps it was my charming personality during the interview that got me in, and not my great MCAT score?

Cheers.

I guess since patients know so much about quality patient care, we might as well give them prescribing privileges.

 

[Bearcat74]

I'm not saying anything about your score, I'm saying that the score of 9.1 is impossible as they don't grade with decimal points so your story, like the other one, is utter nonsense. You must be one of those psycho nps that mismanage your patients so badly that they come to us all manic and psychotic

OK, let's do this again... Back then, you went by your average. Check it out.... 6 categories. Add them all up, and divide by 6. My high was an 11 in Physics, and my low was a 7 in biology (strangely enough, my major, and I thought my strongest area). My average was 9.1..... I have no idea how the MCA T is scored now.

 

[cbrons]

Can't be serious! Even a second year med student won't do something stupid like that. What do they freaking teach at these NP schools?

I had to explain to a nursing student the other what a proton pump inhibitor is... She is a nursing student, but... Geez!

Its not their job to know stuff like that... so i dont know why this would be a surprise

 

[67552931811]

Listen genius.... I am about ready to retire. I can tell you this; hospitals and agencies, such as the one I work at, are moving away from MDs to cheaper NPs. The days where you guys ruled the roost are quickly coming to an end. I'm glad I graduated in 1984, and I will compare the knowledge I have in psych, with any psychiatrist. In fact, my agency did a patient survey, and NPs scored higher than our MDs.

9.1 was a good MCAT, but not great. If I wanted to jazz up this story, I would have said I had an 11.1 MCAT average. I still got accepted to two well-established Ohio public MD schools, and one Ohio public DO school. Perhaps it was my charming personality during the interview that got me in, and not my great MCAT score?

Cheers.

lol, sure bud

 

[Roxas]

Listen genius.... I am about ready to retire. I can tell you this; hospitals and agencies, such as the one I work at, are moving away from MDs to cheaper NPs. The days where you guys ruled the roost are quickly coming to an end. I'm glad I graduated in 1984, and I will compare the knowledge I have in psych, with any psychiatrist. In fact, my agency did a patient survey, and NPs scored higher than our MDs.

9.1 was a good MCAT, but not great. If I wanted to jazz up this story, I would have said I had an 11.1 MCAT average. I still got accepted to two well-established Ohio public MD schools, and one Ohio public DO school. Perhaps it was my charming personality during the interview that got me in, and not my great MCAT score?

Cheers.

And I will compare my knowledge to yours. Wow this arrogance game is easy!



I still think we are at the hands of a troll. 3/10

 

[Psai]

From 1977 to 1991, the MCAT was six sections, each graded 1-15.

A total score of 55 would be an average of 9.17 per section, which could be truncated or slightly mis-remembered as 9.1

So with a birth year of 1974 they took the mcat at age 17. Yeah okay.

 

[el_duderino]

So with a birth year of 1974 they took the mcat at age 17. Yeah okay.

Where did he say he was born in 74? He said he graduated in 84.

 

[Psai]

Where did he say he was born in 74? He said he graduated in 84.

Because he's shown himself to be a trustworthy guy amirite

 

[Whoops12]

Whats an NP?