Official: Harvard 2006

[Sundarban1]

I just want to make a few comments regarding some of the virtual diarrhea being spewed in this thread in the past week or so...

#1.) Most of the people giving the advice here are very well educated and have taken the classes at HES. We are a receptive group and don't mind giving future students advice based on our own presonal class experience, and if you do not want to take our advice that is your business. However, the rigor of the classes is not appearant by simply looking at the syllabus. This is why so many people overload, and then eventually drop a course or two once the classes begin. While I agree that good advice on SDN is pretty hard to come by, to tell potential students to take our advice with "a grain of salt" is pretty ignorant on your behalf and downright laughable to say the least.

#2.) We all work very hard in these classes, and I don't think its appropriate to gloat how easy the classes will be before you even step foot in the classroom. If you are finding the books a nice read that is great, however incase you missed Jays quote before, you will do no problems out of the chem textbook; its as good as a very large paperweight as far as the course is concerned. Try doing logan notes or assigned homeworks (these are NOT from the book and significantly more difficult). The same for physics, the book is very colorful and looks pretty harmless, however when it comes exam time you will not see the same questions that appear in the book. All of the prior exams are listed on the course website if you're curious.

/rant.

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[Maxprime]

#2.) We all work very hard in these classes, and I don't think its appropriate to gloat how easy the classes will be before you even step foot in the classroom. If you are finding the books a nice read that is great, however incase you missed Jays quote before, you will do no problems out of the chem textbook; its as good as a very large paperweight as far as the course is concerned. Try doing logan notes or assigned homeworks (these are NOT from the book and significantly more difficult). The same for physics, the book is very colorful and looks pretty harmless, however when it comes exam time you will not see the same questions that appear in the book. All of the prior exams are listed on the course website if you're curious.

/rant.

Going to go out on a limb here and assume this is directed at me - my mistake if I came off that way. My comment of requiring 20 hours per week of work was meant to underscore the difficulty that has been explained to me.

 

[Moki]

I just want to make a few comments regarding some of the virtual diarrhea being spewed in this thread in the past week or so...

#1.) Most of the people giving the advice here are very well educated and have taken the classes at HES. We are a receptive group and don't mind giving future students advice based on our own presonal class experience, and if you do not want to take our advice that is your business. However, the rigor of the classes is not appearant by simply looking at the syllabus. This is why so many people overload, and then eventually drop a course or two once the classes begin. While I agree that good advice on SDN is pretty hard to come by, to tell potential students to take our advice with "a grain of salt" is pretty ignorant on your behalf and downright laughable to say the least.

/rant.

I used the term "a grain of salt" in the following context:

"Others, including myself, will only be able to offer you advice based on our biased perspectives. Make sure that you take all advice with a grain of salt, since this forum is anonymous and you have no way of knowing the background and life experiences from which others speak."

I believe that the advice on these forums is of value, otherwise I would not continue to be a part of this community. My intention was in no way to denigrate any individual who takes the time to share their experience with others. I firmly believe that any advice, particularly that received from anonymous sources, should be taken with a grain of salt. You will note that I included myself in that caveat.

The primary thrust of my message was that an individual seeking advice should trust themself and their instinct, whatever that may be. I hardly find that to be an ignorant or controversial statement.

Please allow others to express their opinions without receiving such a hostile response. It stifles communication.

 

[jays2cool4u]

Please allow others to express their opinions without receiving such a hostile response. It stifles communication.

Moki

I understand what you are saying. Also, please be aware that Sundarban1 and I have disagreed marjorly in the past. However, I agree with him totally on this. People get here and they THINK they can handle 3 science classes only to earn mediocre grades. I urge everyone to go over their class schedule, volunteer, and/or work schedule with Dr. Fixsen before Sept. 18. We want everyone to succeed at HES.

Jay

 

[Sundarban1]

Please allow others to express their opinions without receiving such a hostile response. It stifles communication.

You may post anything you want, don't let me stop you! I simply found it humorous that your first post in this thread was to instruct students to take our advice with a grain of salt, especially since we've already taken the classes in question.

 

[Moki]

It was not personal. I also suggested that she take my advice with a grain of salt.

 

[Sundarban1]

Hey you people taking physics are in luck. I was at the bookstore yesterday and it looks like Rueckner purchased giancoli book in the paperback edition. The benefit is that the two volume set also comes with an MCAT physics prep packet in addition to the two course books. I like the paperback versions because volume one only covers what is covered in first semester and the same with volume two, so you dont have to lug around the whole book. Good luck!

 

[BobLJ99]

Hey you people taking physics are in luck. I was at the bookstore yesterday and it looks like Rueckner purchased giancoli book in the paperback edition. The benefit is that the two volume set also comes with an MCAT physics prep packet in addition to the two course books. I like the paperback versions because volume one only covers what is covered in first semester and the same with volume two, so you dont have to lug around the whole book. Good luck!

Having two separate volumes can be an inconvenience when you are studying second semester material at the library and you want to look back to a chapter from first semester, but cannot because volume one is at home. Some concepts from first semester intertwine with second semester. Sundarban of all people should realize that Newton’s Laws were not repealed after second semester!

 

[Sundarban1]

Having two separate volumes can be an inconvenience when you are studying second semester material at the library and you want to look back to a chapter from first semester, but cannot because volume one is at home. Some concepts from first semester intertwine with second semester. Sundarban of all people should realize that Newton's Laws were not repealed after second semester!

Listen, who are you to comment when you don't even have the paperback versions? You're just bitter because you had to haul that huge book around all year and now suffer from chronic back pain. Or perhaps you're just mad because TO got fined before the f*ckin NFL season even started. Either case, don't take it out on the HES thread, it's already tainted with bad advice, we don't need yours too.

 

[BobLJ99]

Listen, who are you to comment when you don't even have the paperback versions? You're just bitter because you had to haul that huge book around all year and now suffer from chronic back pain. Or perhaps you're just mad because TO got fined before the f*ckin NFL season even started. Either case, don't take it out on the HES thread, it's already tainted with bad advice, we don't need yours too.

Somebody could use a nap

 

[Maxprime]

Different text? <expletive>

As for TO, my 'Boys have made yet another personnel mistake . . .

 

[solipsis]

thanks for a great thread.

which is a less lethal combination?

chem+phys first year or chem+bio first year?

of course, cynics would argue that both would result in a trip to the mortuary, let alone orgo in the second year.

 

[Maxprime]

thanks for a great thread.

which is a less lethal combination?

chem+phys first year or chem+bio first year?

of course, cynics would argue that both would result in a trip to the mortuary, let alone orgo in the second year.

I'll weigh in, but I haven't taken any of the above so I am no authority (my new standard disclosure).

Bio is taught on the molecular level (i.e. involving a lot of chem), so if you haven't had chem before you will be lost pretty quickly. They strongly recommend you take chem before bio. I've read the textbooks and agree 100% with their strong recommendation - without chem you would be having to learn things that are assumed fully mastered.

Chem & Physics is the advisor-recommended combo for 1st semester, that's what pretty much everyone does.

 

[Maxprime]

Has anyone actually taken orgo in the summer and survived? I looked at the syllabus and have never actually been terrified of a class. If anyone has, I'd like to know how it was (i.e. did it all blow by too quickly to remember for the MCAT) and congrats to anyone who actually did it - sounds like an absolutely incredible amount of work.

 

[Sundarban1]

Somebody could use a nap

Looks like I'm not the only one needing a nap.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2564476

 

[BobLJ99]

Looks like I'm not the only one needing a nap.

http://sports.espn.go.com/nfl/news/story?id=2564476

HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA! That is too funny! I almost laughed as hard as I did when I saw the lopsided 41-0 score the Patriots managed over the Redskins NOT IN MY MEDICAL SCHOOL!!!!

To a previous post: Dr. Fixsen recommends taking physics with chemistry and then biology with organic. Max is correct in that some aspects of chemistry overlap with biology, so one would be better prepared having already had chemistry before taking biology.

 

[sharona1121]

(sorry reposting I think I posted this in the wrong area before)



Hi guys,

I'm relatively new to this... have been thinking of med school in the past few days and someone mentioned I could start HES now (i'm still at my job)... I looked at the website, and I see that I can indeed start now although the next 2 weeks would probably be the most hectic of my life.

I also noticed in the past threads that taking 3 classes is not advisable. I understand the vigor of the classes but aren't there one year post bac programs like bryn mawr? Is HES more rigorous than bryn mawr or is it just generally not advised simply because of the fact it is really rigorous?

If I were to do HES starting 2 weeks I would probably not do volunteer work but focus on getting the courses done and doing them well - I had 4 years of significant volunteer work in health related fields during college and would focus on that during my glide year. Would that be OK?

I'm so impressed by all of your guys' commitment to this forum! If I do end up at HES hope I get to meet some of you guys...

 

[Sundarban1]

RE: 3 classes. It's not advised, it's not common among students, however there are always a few who do it and succeed. Overall these tend to be extremely gifted students in a group of overall bright people.

I've outlined a rough sketch of what a week with 3 classes will look like back on page 5 of this thread.

 

[Sundarban1]

NOT IN MY MEDICAL SCHOOL!!!!

That's what Moss will be saying to Owens on Sept. 17.

 

[prav]

A change of subject from all this worrying/advice/blah ..

I just gotta say, I am soooo PUMPED up to kick major ASS this semester. Don't you love that pre-semester "LET'S GIT'R DONE!" feeling?

Anyway, let's hope that lasts through the semester.

To everyone who's starting HES -- Do what you gotta do to succeed! You'll meet many supportive people. Don't let people complaining distract you or discourage you. These classes are completely do-able! Remember, have faith in yourself! You'll kick major butttttt.

I'm gonna try to buy my books tonight.

Peace, love, puppies and grilled cheese,
Prav

 

[sharona1121]

RE: 3 classes. It's not advised, it's not common among students, however there are always a few who do it and succeed. Overall these tend to be extremely gifted students in a group of overall bright people.

I've outlined a rough sketch of what a week with 3 classes will look like back on page 5 of this thread.

Thanks for the response! I read the outline on page 5 - looks rigorous. I will definitely not be working a job and will focus purely on classes. I dedicated my undergraduate years to health related volunteer work and I am confident that I can still document that and get strong letters of recommendations... I'm hoping that will still help make my application strong without having to do volunteer work during the year I do post bac. What do you think?

 

[Sundarban1]

A change of subject from all this worrying/advice/blah ..

I just gotta say, I am soooo PUMPED up to kick major ASS this semester. Don't you love that pre-semester "LET'S GIT'R DONE!" feeling?

Anyway, let's hope that lasts through the semester.

To everyone who's starting HES -- Do what you gotta do to succeed! You'll meet many supportive people. Don't let people complaining distract you or discourage you. These classes are completely do-able! Remember, have faith in yourself! You'll kick major butttttt.

I'm gonna try to buy my books tonight.

Peace, love, puppies and grilled cheese,
Prav

Dude, you totally made me screw up my final grade in physics with your whole "bits per pit" scheme. I would not take advice from you either

We're thinking of getting together in the coming weeks before school starts, what weekend are you free?

 

[Sundarban1]

Thanks for the response! I read the outline on page 5 - looks rigorous. I will definitely not be working a job and will focus purely on classes. I dedicated my undergraduate years to health related volunteer work and I am confident that I can still document that and get strong letters of recommendations... I'm hoping that will still help make my application strong without having to do volunteer work during the year I do post bac. What do you think?

I think you should PM one of us if you want to talk about scheduling/workload, etc.

 

[prav]

Dude, you totally made me screw up my final grade in physics with your whole "bits per pit" scheme. I would not take advice from you either

We're thinking of getting together in the coming weeks before school starts, what weekend are you free?

Pshh, Bits-per-pits is correct, and you know it. I have letters from Sony Compact Disc engineers to prove it.

BobLJ99 is on my side with Bits-per-pits, ain't he?

I'm free any weekend except that of Sep 8-11! Would love to get together and drink a few Provisionals with y'alls.

 

[BobLJ99]

Pshh, Bits-per-pits is correct, and you know it. I have letters from Sony Compact Disc engineers to prove it.

BobLJ99 is on my side with Bits-per-pits, ain't he?

I'm free any weekend except that of Sep 8-11! Would love to get together and drink a few Provisionals with y'alls.

Sundarban did not understand the complex derivation involved with bits-per-pits. That is ok though, perhaps Ron can explain it to him

 

[lexrageorge]

(sorry reposting I think I posted this in the wrong area before)



Hi guys,

I'm relatively new to this... have been thinking of med school in the past few days and someone mentioned I could start HES now (i'm still at my job)... I looked at the website, and I see that I can indeed start now although the next 2 weeks would probably be the most hectic of my life.

I also noticed in the past threads that taking 3 classes is not advisable. I understand the vigor of the classes but aren't there one year post bac programs like bryn mawr? Is HES more rigorous than bryn mawr or is it just generally not advised simply because of the fact it is really rigorous?

If I were to do HES starting 2 weeks I would probably not do volunteer work but focus on getting the courses done and doing them well - I had 4 years of significant volunteer work in health related fields during college and would focus on that during my glide year. Would that be OK?

I'm so impressed by all of your guys' commitment to this forum! If I do end up at HES hope I get to meet some of you guys...

So, my first question to you, or anyone else thinking of doing 3 courses: why the rush? It sounds like you're currently working. You should note that most of those 1-year post-bacc programs are full-time programs; you're essentially expected to focus solely on your classes during that time.

If you do the courses as recommended by the HES advisors (and by the majority of the posters on this thread), you will finish your pre-reqs in time to apply in the summer of 2008. Even if you could handle the course overload in addition to your current job, not sure you really buy that much by taking 3 classes now.

Also, seriously consider the downside. You take 3 classes, and find yourself struggling to keep up with the classes, homework assignments, labs, and your job commitments. You have your first round of exams in late October, and you do not do so well. Now you have to decide if you should drop 1 or 2 classes to refocus your efforts on the remaining class(es); you will still have a substantial amount of catching up to do to salvage your semester.

Finally, you will not be given a whole lot of leeway by medical school admissions offices if your post-bacc GPA is not up to par. It's one thing to explain away a mediocre but distant undergrad GPA as being due to maturity issues, employment/financial constraints, etc. provided you have a solid post-undergrad GPA. However, what excuse will you use if your post-bacc GPA is a 2.5?

It is far better to have a solid post-bacc GPA in 2008 than a 2.5 GPA in 2007.

 

[Sundarban1]

Sundarban did not understand the complex derivation involved with bits-per-pits. That is ok though, perhaps Ron can explain it to him

You got points taken off as well smarty. Bits per pit seemed like at perfectly good idea at midnight. If anyone needs an explanation it would be the TF who corrected it.

 

[sharona1121]

So, my first question to you, or anyone else thinking of doing 3 courses: why the rush? It sounds like you're currently working. You should note that most of those 1-year post-bacc programs are full-time programs; you're essentially expected to focus solely on your classes during that time.

If you do the courses as recommended by the HES advisors (and by the majority of the posters on this thread), you will finish your pre-reqs in time to apply in the summer of 2008. Even if you could handle the course overload in addition to your current job, not sure you really buy that much by taking 3 classes now.

Also, seriously consider the downside. You take 3 classes, and find yourself struggling to keep up with the classes, homework assignments, labs, and your job commitments. You have your first round of exams in late October, and you do not do so well. Now you have to decide if you should drop 1 or 2 classes to refocus your efforts on the remaining class(es); you will still have a substantial amount of catching up to do to salvage your semester.

Finally, you will not be given a whole lot of leeway by medical school admissions offices if your post-bacc GPA is not up to par. It's one thing to explain away a mediocre but distant undergrad GPA as being due to maturity issues, employment/financial constraints, etc. provided you have a solid post-undergrad GPA. However, what excuse will you use if your post-bacc GPA is a 2.5?

It is far better to have a solid post-bacc GPA in 2008 than a 2.5 GPA in 2007.

I agree with everything you've said.

The rush is probably the rush everyone feels when they're "late in the game" for a lack of better words. If I were to start post bac, I would not do any job, i.e., quit my current job and focus solely on these classes. One could argue that I need to do some volunteer work as well, but I have very strong volunteer work experience in health related fields during my under grad years as well as strong work experience and I think I'll be able to document this fairly well. My next goal would be to just study my post bac courses, do well in them adn do well on the MCAT and apply.

I used to take 5-6 classes during undergrad while working 20+ hours a week and at the same time do lots of volunteer work and I did well in my classes (3.8 gpa, 3.9 major gpa at ivy league school).

I've never taken these science courses - which is why I'm asking you guys whether these 3 science courses are really rigorous that even if I focus only on them and not do anything else, it's still too much? I'm by no means super smart.. just willing to work hard and have lots of determination

thanks for all your help!!

 

[Sundarban1]

I've never taken these science courses - which is why I'm asking you guys whether these 3 science courses are really rigorous that even if I focus only on them and not do anything else, it's still too much? I'm by no means super smart.. just willing to work hard and have lots of determination

thanks for all your help!!

Unless you're planning on taking a summer class next year (which would be orgo in your case since you cannot take gen chem and ochem the same semester) you will finish in 2 years anyway. Taking orgo over the summer is usually avoided as well, another reason they say to not take 3 classes at once. Also remember tuition is 3x as expensive during the summer as you are taking them through Harvard Summer School, not the Extension School.

 

[jms622]

A change of subject from all this worrying/advice/blah ..

Peace, love, puppies and grilled cheese,
Prav

Mmmmm.....I could go for a grilled cheese right about now

Anyone game for Friday? I'll be around until this weekend until Saturday night....Sundarban, you ready to give me all of your $$ in a poker game??

 

[Sundarban1]

Mmmmm.....I could go for a grilled cheese right about now

Anyone game for Friday? I'll be around until this weekend until Saturday night....Sundarban, you ready to give me all of your $$ in a poker game??

Sorry, I have family coming in this weekend so I won't be around. Our poker game is scheduled for Fri. Sept. 15th. I'll check to see if women are allowed

 

[jms622]

Sorry, I have family coming in this weekend so I won't be around. Our poker game is scheduled for Fri. Sept. 15th. I'll check to see if women are allowed

Bahahaha....oh how the tables turn when you even THINK that I have a clue how to play (let alone clean out your pockets)!! I believe the invitation at lunch last week still stands. Don't worry, I'll bring a box of tissues for you to soak up the tears

Have fun with the fam; I'm out to spend some time with my hippie friends in Burlington. I see lots of tie-dye in my future....

 

[NY Musicologist]

HES folks, I apologize for crashing your thread...just a quick question. I'm very interested in starting the program in Fall 07, and I would like to know if it would be appropriate/possible to try to arrange a private meeting with Dr. Fixsen to discuss whether or not I'd fit well. (I know there's an information session scheduled on September 14, but I'll be out of town that day and would really just like the chance to meet-n-greet him personally if possible.) I read somewhere else on the forum that he's a bit of a tough nut to crack, and I certainly don't want to start out on the wrong foot by breaking protocol before I've even put in an application!

Yea/nay? Thanks in advance!

 

[Maxprime]

Who's in town? I'm scrambling to find a place and studying, but other than that am just trying to get a lay of the land. PM me if you want to meet up for drinks, studying, whatever.

 

[Sundarban1]

HES folks, I apologize for crashing your thread...just a quick question. I'm very interested in starting the program in Fall 07, and I would like to know if it would be appropriate/possible to try to arrange a private meeting with Dr. Fixsen to discuss whether or not I'd fit well. (I know there's an information session scheduled on September 14, but I'll be out of town that day and would really just like the chance to meet-n-greet him personally if possible.) I read somewhere else on the forum that he's a bit of a tough nut to crack, and I certainly don't want to start out on the wrong foot by breaking protocol before I've even put in an application!

Yea/nay? Thanks in advance!

He's a very approachable guy and I'm sure either himself or Owen Peterson would be very happy to discuss your concerns face to face. I don't see him as a tough nut to crack but he tends to be a bit stoic in person until he hears your story, etc. and then he opens up a bit more.

 

[Andes87]

Hey all, just moved here and settling in, anyone interested in getting some drinks, roaming the city, etc, pm me.

 

[Maxprime]

It seems like most people are moved in - let's do some sort of social event. I would assume that a second year would know the best place to meet and when, etc.

Otherwise, PM me if you want to go get a beer or meet up, etc.

 

[sharona1121]

hey guys,

sorry just one last question...been doing a lot of talking to pre med advisors, med school students etc about courseload and about post bac programs.

one pre med advisor stressed how harvard extension program because classes aren't with undergraduates won't be viewed as favorably as a nyu or columbia or johns hopkins....also becuse the extension school courses aren't really taught by harvard university professors, it doesn't carry as much weight

what do you guys think?

i personally think doing well at the extension school courses should be fine for pre med requirements, even for the top med schools in the nation.. but wanted to hear your guys' opinions.

how long have you guys been doing the classes at HES for? seems like you guys are hard core.. studying chapters way in advance and stuff!

 

[Maxprime]

hey guys,

sorry just one last question...been doing a lot of talking to pre med advisors, med school students etc about courseload and about post bac programs.

one pre med advisor stressed how harvard extension program because classes aren't with undergraduates won't be viewed as favorably as a nyu or columbia or johns hopkins....also becuse the extension school courses aren't really taught by harvard university professors, it doesn't carry as much weight

what do you guys think?

i personally think doing well at the extension school courses should be fine for pre med requirements, even for the top med schools in the nation.. but wanted to hear your guys' opinions.

how long have you guys been doing the classes at HES for? seems like you guys are hard core.. studying chapters way in advance and stuff!

As for being taken with undergrads, I have never heard that being an issue. Along those lines, extension courses aren't curved which tends to give them some points above normal undergrad courses.

Comparing with other programs - every program has pluses and minuses. I know one person going to Cornell and another that is expecting to go to Harvard MS after doing the extension program. Personally, I am just looking to get into my state school.

They are taught by harvard profs, one of the reasons they are such a great value.

From what I've heard speaking with admissions people, the Harvard program is thought to be challenging and good preperation program. I would suggest speaking with medical school admissions committee members instead of pre-med advisors, your fate rests in their hands.

 

[Maxprime]

PM me your AIM addresses (or email if you haven't seen the light yet) and we'll try to get a decent contact group going.

 

[maximus07]

Anyone know anything about "intro to biostats?" Just signed up for it, a little hesitant since its a online course and I have no stats background.

 

[Sundarban1]

Anyone know anything about "intro to biostats?" Just signed up for it, a little hesitant since its a online course and I have no stats background.

You should have checked with schools to see if they count online courses. I hope your not trying to fulfull a math requirement as many schools do not accept online credits. I personally would not take math classes online.

 

[maximus07]

No i just signed up thinking it counted as a science elective. I already have a year of calc during undergrad. Is bio-stats for people who need a math requirement?

 

[Sundarban1]

No i just signed up thinking it counted as a science elective. I already have a year of calc during undergrad. Is bio-stats for people who need a math requirement?

No, it's not required. As I said many medical schools will not count online courses towards your GPA, so I was saying that if you were hoping to complete a math requirement you should check with the schools you are applying to first to see if online courses are accepted. I'll save you the trouble and tell you that most do not. I just found online courses (especially ones involving math) to be more of a hasstle to take online.

 

[jays2cool4u]

I took biostats last spring and did well. I went to class about 25% of the time and did the rest online. It counts as a science elective and not as a math requirement. I highly recommend the course.

Jays2cool4u.

 

[jms622]

For all the newbies out there....Anyone headed to the Info Session tonight?

 

[Sundarban1]

For all the newbies out there....Anyone headed to the Info Session tonight?

Are we not informative enough for you?

 

[Maxprime]

For all the newbies out there....Anyone headed to the Info Session tonight?

I will probably go b/c I have little else to do before classes start . . . unless someone who's already been will tell me not to go (please!).

 

[jms622]

Are we not informative enough for you?

Oh, you're fabulously informative...just faaaabulous!! But sometimes a gal needs to (or prefers to) hear it straight "from the horse's mouth" ...

 

[hill81]

hey guys...i'm new in town and i was wondering if anyone was up for grabbing a drink or something friday night...just let me know if anything's going on!