Are W-2 physicians being suckered?

[BobLoblaw78]

yes, but why are these suddenly free speech advocates not criticizing their "leaders" for fraud and fraudulent statements on social media? iinstead, fake news is retweeted


that statement is subjective. subjective statements should not censored. a vastly different statement than stating that there is snake venom in vaccines, or that vaccines are more likely to cause myocarditis than the infection.

thankfully you do not associate the phrase "chinese" in a negative connotation. but that is your singular perspective. the 300 percent increase in asian hate crimes - which may be the tip of the iceberg in terms of such feelings - belies that this perspective is not static. clearly, something has changed - in a lot more than 1 person.


each social platform should have a way of monitoring and discussing with those who spread misinformation. those authors should have the opportunity to back up their statements with facts, and they should be given the opportunity to modify their positiion, or the option of clearly posting that they are expressing an opinion with no factual basis. there should be no retweeting or forwarding or reposting until such a process is complete.

this is a common tactic to deflect racism. its not the fact that the hatred exists - you are saying that it only exists in that 1 person!
however... without what these individuals feel is implicit approval by some KOL for racist actions, that individual would not have acted.

it is a diversionary tactic to deflect blame for statements that prompt others to their inappropriate actions.

I am defending other's rights even though I disagree with them (insert MJ pic again). You are wanting to take away other's rights bc you disagree with them. I understand what you are saying but I am fundamentally opposed to your viewpoint. I see my view as truly compassionate and yours as unrealistic to the point of causing more harm than good. I assume you see your viewpoint in the same light as I do mine.

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[BobLoblaw78]

View attachment 353987

MJ agrees w/ Mitch. Advantage Mitch

 

[Baron Samedi]

I have no legal problem(morality aside) with Alex Jones, the person, saying nonsense. I do think that our news sources, however, should be held to a higher standard and that the Bill of Rights does not apply to corporations. Is preventing broadcasting companies from broadcasting inappropriate material such as pornography or vividly violent images a violation of an individuals Freedom of Speech and expression? Most would agree not.

Would love to see return of the Fairness Doctrine and overturning Citizens United, in that regard.

 

[Ducttape]

this is not an issue of "free speech or no free speech", which you seem to be attempting to portray.

i do not advocate for taking away peoples rights to free speech. you are making a false assumption.

people are allowed to express their opinion, but opinions need to be expressed so that they are not misconstrued as proven fact. unless they are proven facts.


i am fundamentally opposed to lying and deceit and presenting false facts when the purpose is to further political and financial ambitions. there is no accountability right now for lying.

 

[nvrsumr]

Cops are allowed to lie to suspects to get a confession.

 

[MitchLevi]

You can say what you want. You may be sued; you may get your teeth knocked out.

It is both immature and naive to make statements referencing "lying" as being an act punishable by the loss of fundamental rights bc "truth" is malleable depending on who presents it.

Both sides of the political aisle lie and withhold facts. Corporate media lies and withholds facts.

Social media companies like Twitter appear to punish those on one side of the aisle and not the other, an interesting set of circumstances considering the single biggest threat to liberalism is the loss of free speech.

Lots of wild things were posted on social media during the GFloyd riots that never resulted in a ban.

How many outright lies were posted by BLM? How much mischief and mayhem occurred freely and without threat from Twitter or Facebook or Instagram?

The moment the Parler (sp) app showed up it was set on fire and burned to the ground without hesitation.

This is largely slanted against one political ideology, and those behind it donate to the opposite ideology at rates of 99% (Twitter donations).

Yall will not argue in your current manner if this were going the other direction.

 

[hyperalgesia]

Faith in some authority figure or committee to police speech and expression is the cornerstone of totalitarian regimes everywhere.

 

[Ducttape]

Faith in some authority figure or committee to police speech and expression is the cornerstone of totalitarian regimes everywhere.

thats why it has to come from the community and from the person itself.

Social media companies like Twitter appear to punish those on one side of the aisle and not the other, an interesting set of circumstances considering the single biggest threat to liberalism is the loss of free speech.

Lots of wild things were posted on social media during the GFloyd riots that never resulted in a ban.

How many outright lies were posted by BLM? How much mischief and mayhem occurred freely and without threat from Twitter or Facebook or Instagram?

The moment the Parler (sp) app showed up it was set on fire and burned to the ground without hesitation.

This is largely slanted against one political ideology, and those behind it donate to the opposite ideology at rates of 99% (Twitter donations).

Yall will not argue in your current manner if this were going the other direction.

there definitely is misinformation and lies from both sides of the political spectrum. no doubt about that.

yes, my gut feeling is that there are more politically conservative false news spreaders, but there are definitely cases such as Justin Smollet case and Nick Sandman situation on the left. ( the first was sentenced and the second received an apology from the liberal network. im not seeing admission of mistake with Sandy Hook or Mike Lindell or vit D/HCQ/ivermectin or Cyber Ninjas... )


looking deeper, here is an interesting article that specifically pinpoints 1 group:

APA PsycNet

psycnet.apa.org

We offer a more nuanced account by proposing that the sharing of fake news is largely driven by low conscientiousness conservatives. At high levels of conscientiousness there is no difference between liberals and conservatives.

and

https://www.science.org/doi/10.1126/sciadv.abf1234

Results confirm that conservatives have lower sensitivity than liberals, performing worse at distinguishing truths and falsehoods. This is partially explained by the fact that the most widely shared falsehoods tend to promote conservative positions, while corresponding truths typically favor liberals. The problem is exacerbated by liberals’ tendency to experience bigger improvements in sensitivity than conservatives as the proportion of partisan news increases.

 

[Ducttape]

Faith in some authority figure or committee to police speech and expression is the cornerstone of totalitarian regimes everywhere.

this requires a separate response.

it is laughable considering trumps relationship with mainstream media and his desire to shut down what he calls "fake news".

 

[BobLoblaw78]

this requires a separate response.

it is laughable considering trumps relationship with mainstream media and his desire to shut down what he calls "fake news".

I'm truly confused. Are you saying it would be dangerous to allow someone like Trump to shut down "fake news"? That they would use it for malfeasance? That this would be wrong?

I think you may have made the case for allowing free speech. You have made the case why people in power shouldn't police which speech is allowed and which speech isn't allowed.

 

[MitchLevi]

this requires a separate response.

it is laughable considering trumps relationship with mainstream media and his desire to shut down what he calls "fake news".

What he calls "fake news" could be justified as such on many occasions, with evidence to back it up. It isn't simple, and deny that is dishonesty.

Of course, here comes the DHS Disinformation Governance Board! Rolling out before the midterms apparently.

I hope you're happy about this.

Huge deal. Huge...

 

[hyperalgesia]

What he calls "fake news" could be justified as such on many occasions, with evidence to back it up. It isn't simple, and deny that is dishonesty.

Of course, here comes the DHS Disinformation Governance Board! Rolling out before the midterms apparently.

I hope you're happy about this.

Huge deal. Huge...

Wow, we now have an official propaganda department. Wonderful.

 

[Pain Applicant1]

because there are many outright lying and deceiving people, and people seaching on social media are too, well, ignorant to find out the truth. they find comfort in someone who is spewing these lies because it fits in to their world view, even if that view is wrong.



Free speech does not include blatant lies and misinformation or hate speech.

no, thats racist. the virus is not chinese. where it was first found has no foundational relationship to the people in that region.

and using these terms causes harm to those people who are thought to be from that region.

thats not true.

these sick individuals normally suppress violent tendencies and do not act, until they are given what they feel is carte blanche to act - based on what they see on social media, their perception that there is approval by society to perform violent acts.

if what you stated were true, then the rates of hate crimes of asians would have remained the same even after misinformation spreaders started railing about COVID and blaming it on asians. but we saw a 339% increase in hate crimes against asians in 2021, after a 75% increase in 2020.

Help me understand. Are attacks on Asians racist? Is calling covid the Chinese virus racist?

Many of the violent attacks on Asians and the name callings have been done by perpetrators who are black. I thought you and @SSdoc33 said multiple times that black people can't be racist.

I'm trying to follow but this is all very confusing to me.

 

[MitchLevi]

Did any Middle Eastern individuals get attacked after MERS? What about Ebola? I don't remember a bunch of ethnically African ppl being attacked during the Ebola scare...

 

[MitchLevi]

Wow, we now have an official propaganda department. Wonderful.

Yes, and you should look up the woman who's heading it up.

Here are her two books. It's Dolores Umbridge IMO.

 

[deleted131481]

Despite the disagreeing viewpoints above, I still don't see why either side is opposed to corporations having their own policies. Twitter and Facebook have their own terms of service. SDN has it's own terms of service. These aren't government entities. For those who aren't a fan of these policies, why not they migrate to Parler and Truth Social?

If someone wants to spew their own conspiracy trash on the street corner then go for it. Why should companies be forced to enable it?

 

[Ducttape]

I'm truly confused. Are you saying it would be dangerous to allow someone like Trump to shut down "fake news"? That they would use it for malfeasance? That this would be wrong?

I think you may have made the case for allowing free speech. You have made the case why people in power shouldn't police which speech is allowed and which speech isn't allowed.

im saying that making proclamations that have no factual basis is ethically wrong. for example, what Russian disinformation farms did in the 2016 and 2020 elections, much of anti-vax and anti-mask proclamations pertaining risks of those. Tenpenny, Bollinger, Mercola, Islam post anti-vax information as the truth with no factual basis. they should be given the opportunity to modify their statements (so that it is clear they are making a fictitious claim) or to post actual scientific data to back up their claims. likewise, Lindell and the like trumpet widespread election fraud when there is none.


i have not stated that people in government should not be policing free speech. no one in power - including government - should be given the right to prevent free speech - which is what one politician has railed for ever since 2016. but the social media company does have the right to moderate speech.

political expression should also be broadcast as opinion, and not news.

Help me understand. Are attacks on Asians racist? Is calling covid the Chinese virus racist?

Many of the violent attacks on Asians and the name callings have been done by perpetrators who are black. I thought you and @SSdoc33 said multiple times that black people can't be racist.

I'm trying to follow but this is all very confusing to me.

i have not said that blacks cannot be racist. technically, anyone can be racist, hold damaging thoughts against someone else of a different race or ethnicity. i have stated that the impact is different because of power gradients. a minority member expressing racist thoughts against a majority is less impactful than a minority disparaging a weaker minority, but both are racist.



attacks on asians based on their race is racist. calling it the China virus and Kung flu is racist - it is associating a negative connotation to someone based on racial characteristics. the WHO specifically recognized this when they changed virus naming policy.

unfortunately, the ones who feel if a statement is racist is the minority affected by the statement. thats why trump thinks he is not racist. he has no idea of the impact of his thoughts and actions. a white male doesnt think calling it the China virus is racist because it doesnt affect him negatively - and actually may make him feel "better" because it is an external factor outside of his world view.

 

[Doctodd]

This new department of diinformation is one more step closer to communism. Democrats have completely lost it. We told you so.

 

[Pain Applicant1]

i have not said that blacks cannot be racist. technically, anyone can be racist, hold damaging thoughts against someone else of a different race or ethnicity. i have stated that the impact is different because of power gradients. a minority member expressing racist thoughts against a majority is less impactful than a minority disparaging a weaker minority, but both are racist.

Well, maybe only Batman (@SSdoc33 ) said it and not Robin (you), lol but still comes from the same team, lol.

 

[lobelsteve]

Yes, and you should look up the woman who's heading it up.

Here are her two books. It's Dolores Umbridge IMO.

View attachment 354027

I was waiting for the first Dolores reference. This is all I could think about when I heard the news.

 

[SSdoc33]

Well, maybe only Batman (@SSdoc33 ) said it and not Robin (you), lol but still comes from the same team, lol.

nope. wasnt me, either. if i said it multiple times, pull my my quotes.

i essentially said what ducttape said here:

"unfortunately, the ones who feel if a statement is racist is the minority affected by the statement. thats why trump thinks he is not racist. he has no idea of the impact of his thoughts and actions. a white male doesnt think calling it the China virus is racist because it doesnt affect him negatively - and actually may make him feel "better" because it is an external factor outside of his world view"

 

[Pain Applicant1]

nope. wasnt me, either. if i said it multiple times, pull my my quotes.

i essentially said what ducttape said here:

"unfortunately, the ones who feel if a statement is racist is the minority affected by the statement. thats why trump thinks he is not racist. he has no idea of the impact of his thoughts and actions. a white male doesnt think calling it the China virus is racist because it doesnt affect him negatively - and actually may make him feel "better" because it is an external factor outside of his world view"

No need to look it up to quote you. I'll take you for your word. If I was wrong then apologies to you guys. Still a funny batman and robin reference though.

 

[SSdoc33]

No need to look it up to quote you. I'll take you for your word. If I was wrong then apologies to you guys. Still a funny batman and robin reference though.

im definitely his Robin. unfortunately.

 

[hyperalgesia]

Yes, and you should look up the woman who's heading it up.

Here are her two books. It's Dolores Umbridge IMO.

View attachment 354027

Biden's handlers are assembling generals for the fight to come...

 

[Ducttape]

im definitely his Robin. unfortunately.

oh no...

im thinking more Marvel.

Cap and Bucky.

Spidey and Daredevil.

Luke Cage and Iron Fist.

 

[cowboydoc]

At least he didn’t go with Ace and Gary.

 

[Agast]

Spider-Man and Daredevil are not partners >:|

How about Spider-Man and Deadpool? That’s a classic combo

 

[SSdoc33]

At least he didn’t go with Ace and Gary.

Nice.

Maybe harry and lloyd?

 

[DODOCSS]

so cute these two...

 

[Dr. Ice]

Spider-Man and Daredevil are not partners >:|

How about Spider-Man and Deadpool? That’s a classic combo

Who are you? Lol..love it

 

[Dr. Ice]

Nice.

Maybe harry and lloyd?

I think Harry got paid 7x what Lloyd did..

 

[clubdeac]

That is basically what it boils down to. Whenever somebody is being a complete d@ck, they can always hide behind "Its a free country. Its my first amendment rights".

Lovely.

Exactly buddy, unfortunately we can’t silence people for being complete d@cks. If we could I would have silenced you a long time ago

 

[DODOCSS]

robin and robin's sister

 

[bedrock]

Bedrock of Western liberal democracy is free speech.

Exactly. That’s why it’s my screen name.

Free speech is the absolute foundation of any democratic society worth living in.

I don’t understand how liberals like ssdoc/ductape/ don’t see the hypocrisy in limiting conservative free speech, while liberals/socialists can say whatever they want about anyone and anything.

That mentality seems closer to communist (aka socialist) Soviet Russia than the largest democracy on the planet.

 

[Baron Samedi]

Exactly. That’s why it’s my screen name.

Free speech is the absolute foundation of any democratic society worth living in.

I don’t understand how liberals like ssdoc/ductape don’t see the hypocrisy in limiting conservative free speech, while liberals/socialists can say whatever they want about anyone.

That mentality seems closer to communist (aka socialist) Soviet Russia than the largest democracy on the planet.

Just curious -- do you believe that communism and socialism are the same thing?

On a similar note -- do you believe that Social Security, Medicare, minimum wage, and the national highway system are communist?

 

[hyperalgesia]

Just curious -- do you believe that communism and socialism are the same thing?

I don't really understand the difference tbh, despite having looked it up. Can you explain?

 

[lobelsteve]

Just curious -- do you believe that communism and socialism are the same thing?

On a similar note -- do you believe that Social Security, Medicare, minimum wage, and the national highway system are communist?

Do away with SS. Replace medicare with basic preventative health needs, basic hospitalization care. I mean bare bones. Let people pay for the insurance they can afford. Minimum wage should be to prevent labor abuse, not a living wage.

Highway is physical infrastructure. Government should provide an electrical grid, water/sewer, ability to have gas, natural gas, and defense. Including a wall on our southern border. You don’t like our broken immigration laws? Change the law, don’t ignore it.

 

[Agast]

Exactly buddy, unfortunately we can’t silence people for being complete d@cks. If we could I would have silenced you a long time ago

There is an Ignore function. If you choose not to use it then at some level you must still want to know what he has to say.

 

[Baron Samedi]

I don't really understand the difference tbh, despite having looked it up. Can you explain?

Both are definitely left-wing ideologies with the main idea of fair distribution of wealth. Communism seeks to eliminate financial class by eliminating private ownership of property and industry and redistributes wealth based to citizens. This is done so through a totalitarian government. Socialism, in it's original form, still allows for private ownership of personal property but not of industry -- this is controlled by a central government ran by elected officials and profits are distributed to either society(government owns the means of production) as a whole or to the workers(co-operative ownership).

Within modern socialist movements(i.e. Democratic Socialism), Capitalist ideology may or may not co-exist. Some modern socialists advocate for centralized industry while others still advocate for private ownership with more control given to workers rather than being concentrated at the top, primarily through unionization. Most Democratic Socialists advocate for a broadened social safety net through universal healthcare and accessible high quality education(de-industrialization of essential services as determined through a Democratic process).

If you are interested in learning more, there's a documentary called "The Big Scary 'S' Word" on Hulu. It is obviously biased, however; it does discuss some of the historical differences and how many of the institutions we have in America, such as the Republican Party, are based around Socialist movements.

 

[Baron Samedi]

Do away with SS. Replace medicare with basic preventative health needs, basic hospitalization care. I mean bare bones. Let people pay for the insurance they can afford. Minimum wage should be to prevent labor abuse, not a living wage.

Highway is physical infrastructure. Government should provide an electrical grid, water/sewer, ability to have gas, natural gas, and defense. Including a wall on our southern border. You don’t like our broken immigration laws? Change the law, don’t ignore it.

I do wonder how the Republican party would fare if they adopted a Libertarian platform -- I can't imagine their voting base would support SS/Medicare abolishment. Even Rand Paul won't suggest that out loud.

 

[Doctodd]

From what I recall, 2 counties were able to become exempt from Medicare, and they are doing fine.

 

[NITRAS]

I do wonder how the Republican party would fare if they adopted a Libertarian platform -- I can't imagine their voting base would support SS/Medicare abolishment. Even Rand Paul won't suggest that out loud.

Because the recipients of SS/Medicare are the biggest voting block. At our core, humans entitled, selfish pricks.

I would argue that is our basic sin nature. . . . But that is a different discussion.

 

[Baron Samedi]

Because the recipients of SS/Medicare are the biggest voting block. At our core, humans entitled, selfish pricks.

I would argue that is our basic sin nature. . . . But that is a different discussion.

Ayn Rand was a SS/Medicare beneficiary later in her life -- I wonder if she would have referred to herself as a "taker" back then or if she felt like she "earned it."

 

[Status Sciaticus]

this thread definitely took some turns, and it does not disappoint.

 

[bedrock]

Just curious -- do you believe that communism and socialism are the same thing?

As I posted a few months ago, I have a degree in Russian history and literature, speak Russian fluently, and lived in Moscow for six months in the 90s. I understand communism far better than you ever will.
This is why I am adamently opposed to socialism, which not exactly the same as communism which you described fairly well in post #240. However, socialism is closer to communism than any other major political theory theory which is why I compared how progressives aka socialists aka communists, more fervently suppress free speech than moderate democrats.

The further someone drifts along the political spectrum to the extremes, the less tolerance they have for truly fair and equal political discourse, i.e. free speech. Such extremists can't win political debates on facts or merit so they turn to suppression of free speech.

This also happens with people on the extreme right.

If you, Ductape, and SSdoc, etc, can't support free speech, then you are much further to the left than you might think or care to admit, and likely are in truth...... a socialist/communist, and not a reasonable left of center liberal.

 

[Baron Samedi]

As I posted a few months ago, I have a degree in Russian history and literature, speak Russian fluently, and lived in Moscow for six months in the mid 90s. I understand communism far better than you ever will.
This is why I am adamently opposed to socialism, which not exactly the same as communism which you described fairly well in post #240. However, socialism is closer to communism than any other major political theory theory which is why I compared how progressives aka socialists aka communists, more fervently suppress free speech than moderate (center left)democrats.

The further someone drifts along the political spectrum to the extremes, the less tolerance they have have true equal and fair political discourse, i.e. free speech. This also happens with people on the extreme right.

If you. Ductape, and SSdoc, etc, can't support free speech, then you are much further to the left than you might think or care to admit, and likely are in truth...... a socialist/communist, and not a reasonable left of center liberal.

Genuinely confused if you are arguing with me or agreeing.

Please link me a post where I do not "support free speech." If we are going to peacock our credentials(I'd rather not), I have plenty that show that I do, in fact, "support free speech."

 

[bedrock]

Genuinely confused if you are arguing with me or agreeing.

Please link me a post where I do not "support free speech." If we are going to peacock our credentials(I'd rather not), I have plenty that show that I do, in fact, "support free speech."

I beg pardon if linked you in with some of the other liberals on this forum regarding free speech.

I know for a fact that SSdoc, Ductape, and even Agast have made posts arguing against free speech (unsurprisingly, speech that goes against their beliefs automatically becomes hate speech).

 

[bedrock]

As a side note, I am extremely pleased that Twitter will finally represent free speech, once Musk is in charge. Two recent Musk quotes.

“Free speech is the bedrock of a functioning democracy, and Twitter is the digital town square"

"I hope that even my worst critics remain on Twitter, because that is what free speech means"


More free speech will be seen on twitter than in the digital pages of another major media company owned by a billionaire....aka washington post/Jeff Bezos.

My subscriptions to the Boston Globe and New York times have long been cancelled due to their flagrantly biased propaganda the last 5 years..........

 

[Baron Samedi]

Do you think Musk would be cool with his employees posting their salaries or discussing unionization over Twitter?

 

[Dr. Ice]

If you need to “emote” constantly, you will be against free speech or anyone using the term “snowflake” which (although not a trumpian) I think is awesome to describe the fragility of many nowadays.