Dating in Med School for a Girl? Disturbing Trend?

[freemontie]

Of course men have standards that they are held to - they just aren't held to them by women. We don't have that kind of power, and I'm not sure why you think that we do. The ideas of society have been dictated by men for a long long time.
Yes I think it literally has nothing to do with what's being talked about here

Men want and need women just as much if not more than vice versa. Of course they have power- but it's a different kind. And neither men nor women are going around holding each other to B.S. standards just because. They're just the result of the average of what the other gender wants in a mate.

That is unless a significant number of women suddenly want a short, virgin, assistant kindergarten schoolteacher with a high pitched voice, and no good career prospects. (if she's beautiful and strokes his ego- most men could be very interested in the female version though lol)

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[touchpause13]

You don't hear virgin men complaining about how they're looked down upon. It has nothing to do with the "he's a nerd" thing either, even someone like Tim Tebow was mocked and ridiculed for choosing not to have sex with women and his sexuality was constantly under attack.

Elliot Rodger sure complained

 

[famoussquamous]

Or her value has nothing to do with her sexual behavior. I don't understand this need to connect the value of a human being with their genitalia. It's one facet of our lives, not an end all be all of our worth an humans, that's just gross.

It's not so much her "value" as a human being that gets called into question, it's more about her viability as a long term mate. There's been several studies that have shown that women with fewer sexual partners before marriage are more likely to stay married, report higher marital satisfaction, and were less likely to cheat on their spouse.

 

[touchpause13]

It's not so much her "value" as a human being that gets called into question, it's more about her viability as a long term mate. There's been several studies that have shown that women with fewer sexual partners before marriage are more likely to stay married, report higher marital satisfaction, and were less likely to cheat on their spouse.

There are a lot of factors at play besides just number of sexual partners. Feel free to post the studies, but I'm not buying it and I promise I wouldn't buy it.

 

[famoussquamous]

Elliot Rodger sure complained

Really, you're gonna bring up a psychopath that killed innocent people to prove your point? That's almost like using the Hitler/nazi "trump" card in a debate

 

[PL198]

It's not so much her "value" as a human being that gets called into question, it's more about her viability as a long term mate. There's been several studies that have shown that women with fewer sexual partners before marriage are more likely to stay married, report higher marital satisfaction, and were less likely to cheat on their spouse.

you're going to pop some blood vessels with this one

 

[charmiedermie]

Virgin shaming, other end of the spectrum.

A virgin female is considered a prize by many men and a virgin male is considered defective and undesirable. But again, you don't hear men complaining about it.

Wut? Who says this?

 

[famoussquamous]

Feel free to post the studies, but I'm not buying it and I promise I wouldn't buy it.

Then why bother posting them if they wouldn't convince you?

Come on, you're better than that.

 

[famoussquamous]

let's compare to peacocks. so a male peacock shows off his stuff and if thats good enough for the female peacock, she's like "alright lets do this "

now imagine a male peacock with a really cool pattern, who tons of female peacocks approved of. obviously that validates him since his pattern is sweet.

now imagine a female peacock who gets with every dude. clearly her standards aren't that high, because not every peacock has a sick pattern. thus her value is lowered.

But to them, it shouldn't matter because that female peacock should be able to "select" whatever type of male peacock she wants.

 

[touchpause13]

Then why bother posting them if they wouldn't convince you?

Come on, you're better than that.

I just figured I'd let you know as a personal courtesy, but if you like I can be less polite.

 

[touchpause13]

But to them, it shouldn't matter because that female peacock should be able to "select" whatever type of male peacock she wants.

Are you suggesting that we shouldn't be able to select our sexual partners? What's your point? Seriously what is your point with your whole thing here, because it doesn't make a lick of sense to me.

 

[famoussquamous]

I just figured I'd let you know as a personal courtesy, but if you like I can be less polite.

Saying "go ahead and use evidence to support your claim, but your claim still sucks no matter how much you back it up" isn't an effective argument strategy, just fyi.

 

[sunealoneal]

It's not so much her "value" as a human being that gets called into question, it's more about her viability as a long term mate. There's been several studies that have shown that women with fewer sexual partners before marriage are more likely to stay married, report higher marital satisfaction, and were less likely to cheat on their spouse.

 

[Psai]

Virgin shaming, other end of the spectrum.

A virgin female is considered a prize by many men and a virgin male is considered defective and undesirable. But again, you don't hear men complaining about it.

Funny enough, every male was a virgin at some time

 

[touchpause13]

Saying "go ahead and use evidence to support your claim, but your claim still sucks no matter how much you back it up" isn't an effective argument strategy, just fyi.

It's just that I've read plenty of studies before and they always are lacking - small samples, really old, there are factors they don't consider. And it's pretty much impossible to prove causation with this type of thing so I don't think studies are going to actually help your case.

 

[famoussquamous]

Wut? Who says this?

Lots of people.

 

[fancymylotus]

Really, you're gonna bring up a psychopath that killed innocent people to prove your point? That's almost like using the Hitler/nazi "trump" card in a debate

Did we get to 10 pages before Godwin's happened?

 

[cinnamonlady]

If it's what you want to do then go. There's lots of women in the medical field nowadays and plenty of female medical students.

I'm not 100% sure if it's the right thing to do to be honest. I would much rather lie around all day, do yoga, read books about Roman history, play guitar, do laundry and make dinners I'm just going to be honest. But when it comes to forcing my husband to do evil with his career in order to make the most money possible to sustain the lifestyle I am most interested in or being dependent on him in the event that things don't work out, I am just not down. I would rather become a pediatrician and do what I love most in my down time.

 

[charmiedermie]

Lots of people.

Wow, great answer.

 

[fancymylotus]

I'm not 100% sure if it's the right thing to do to be honest. I would much rather lie around all day, do yoga, read books about Roman history, play guitar, do laundry and make dinners I'm just going to be honest. But when it comes to forcing my husband to do evil with his career in order to make the most money possible to sustain the lifestyle I am most interested in or being dependent on him in the event that things don't work out, I am just not down. I would rather become a pediatrician and do what I love most in my down time.

Most days I go to Pilates, buy some stuff I don't need online, play my sitar, watch history channel documentaries about ancient Egypt because I really wanted to be an archeologist but my mother wouldn't let me, and cook random stuff from recipes I find on the internets.

See were like twinsies!

 

[famoussquamous]

It's just that I've read plenty of studies before and they always are lacking - small samples, really old, there are factors they don't consider. And it's pretty much impossible to prove causation with this type of thing so I don't think studies are going to actually help your case.

Even if they did release a study that took everything you're saying into consideration, you'd still find issue with it because fundamentally, you don't think that stuff matters, so you'll just find SOMETHING to discredit it.

 

[touchpause13]

Even if they did release a study that took everything you're saying into consideration, you'd still find issue with it because fundamentally, you don't think that stuff matters, so you'll just find SOMETHING to discredit it.

Lol, okay sure.

 

[cinnamonlady]

Omfg that is amazing

Most days I go to Pilates, buy some stuff I don't need online, play my sitar, watch history channel documentaries about ancient Egypt because I really wanted to be an archeologist but my mother wouldn't let me, and cook random stuff from recipes I find on the internets.

See were like twinsies!

 

[famoussquamous]

Wow, great answer.

What did you want me to say? It's a real life phenomenon. Male virginity is mocked in our culture all the time (think about movies like Superbad, the 40 year old Virgin, the American Pie series, etc) You can shoot back that they're just movies, but they reflect the ideals of contemporary culture.

 

[sunealoneal]

Even if they did release a study that took everything you're saying into consideration, you'd still find issue with it because fundamentally, you don't think that stuff matters, so you'll just find SOMETHING to discredit it.

I mean, if "SOMETHING" is available for someone to discredit a study, then it should and will be discredited. That's how science works.

 

[freemontie]

He can go to the year 3000 and men will still have a strong preference for life partners who were less promiscuous.

 

[famoussquamous]

Lol, okay sure.

Hey, your words not mine.


ANYWAY, I can see that this brutal honesty has ruffled some feathers (kind of like how when women admit they dislike short men) so I'll ease up.

 

[touchpause13]

so many non sequiturs

breaking news: I still cannot even

 

[sunealoneal]

What did you want me to say? It's a real life phenomenon. Male virginity is mocked in our culture all the time (think about movies like Superbad, the 40 year old Virgin, the American Pie series, etc) You can shoot back that they're just movies, but they reflect the ideals of contemporary culture.

This is true. This being true does not exclude other things "at the other end of the spectrum" from being bad as well.

 

[touchpause13]

He can go to the year 3000 and men will still have a strong preference for life partners who were less promiscuous.

cool...
not all guys have the same preferences. I know it's really easy to make broad generalizations, but it makes you look like you don't know what you are talking about because they are so easily refuted.

 

[famoussquamous]

He can go to the year 3000 and men will still have a strong preference for life partners who were less promiscuous.

Most women know this, which is why it's such a touchy matter, and it's why the "multiply by 3" rule exists.

 

[fancymylotus]

so many non sequiturs

breaking news: I still cannot even

I am not even able to even

 

[touchpause13]

Most women know this, which is why it's such a touchy matter, and it's why the "multiply by 3" rule exists.

Are you actually using the 2nd American Pie movie to prove your point? Because that's really weak

 

[sunealoneal]

He can go to the year 3000 and men will still have a strong preference for life partners who were less promiscuous.

Most women know this, which is why it's such a touchy matter, and it's why the "multiply by 3" rule exists.

I'm not sure if the mere existence of this kind of thinking is equivalent to a justification.

 

[famoussquamous]

Are you actually using the 2nd American Pie movie to prove your point? Because that's really weak

Not really. Women (not all women but you know that already) under report the amount of sexual partners they have because they know males hold women with fewer sexual partners in higher regard. I could post studies that prove this point, but you'd either not read them or say it isn't true . Likewise, men lie about the number of their sexual conquests to improve their status

 

[touchpause13]

Not really. Women (not all women but you know that already) under report the amount of sexual partners they have because they know males hold women with fewer sexual partners in higher regard. I could post studies that prove this point, but you'd either not read them or say it isn't true . Likewise, men lie about the number of their sexual conquests to improve their status

I haven't heard of any girl IRL doing that, but whatever. What is your point?

 

[famoussquamous]

This is true. This being true does not exclude other things "at the other end of the spectrum" from being bad as well.

At least you're willing to admit that virgin shaming goes on in our society instead of ignoring it like that other poster. Also im not so much making a value judgement on either side so much as simply saying it exists.

 

[PL198]

Did we get to 10 pages before Godwin's happened?

no they did something similar with slavery on like page 3

 

[BurghStudent]

I'm showing up late, whatever, but just to throw it our there, guys who prefer girls with a minimal/no sexual past should hold themselves to the same standards. Fair is fair.

 

[fancymylotus]

I'm showing up late, whatever, but just to throw it our there, guys who prefer girls with a minimal/no sexual past should hold themselves to the same standards. Fair is fair.

I like you.

 

[Mad Jack]

a master key that opens all locks vs a lock that is opened by all keys.

women are the barriers to sex, thus when a man has sex with multiple women, his value is increased. additionally, when a woman has sex with multiple men, her value is lowered, for the same reason.

not rocket science at all.

Those barriers are artificial and determined entirely by societal norms and expectations. Women want sex as much as men, but at some point in the past, we decided men should be free to act on their sexual desires while women should not, because men were running things and why would they willingly choose to set up a value system in which they can't act upon their own desires.

 

[famoussquamous]

I'm showing up late, whatever, but just to throw it our there, guys who prefer girls with a minimal/no sexual past should hold themselves to the same standards. Fair is fair.

100% agree. Same with wanting a girl that's in shape you should be in shape yourself.

You have to realize @touchpause13 that when you don't address both sides of an issue (both the fact that slut shaming exists for females and slut appraisal for males, and virgin appraisal for females but virgin shaming for males) you sound bias and hypocritical and you're less likely to be taken seriously in an argument. The "hold yourself to whatever standards you want in your partners" argument presented here is a good example of the right way to go about it.

 

[touchpause13]

100% agree. Same with wanting a girl that's in shape you should be in shape yourself.

You have to realize @touchpause13 that when you don't address both sides of an issue (both the fact that slut shaming exists for females and slut appraisal for males, and virgin appraisal for females but virgin shaming for males) you sound bias and hypocritical and you're less likely to be taken seriously in an argument.

when did I say that men don't have negative social consequences for not being sexual?

 

[Mad Jack]

Virgin shaming, other end of the spectrum.

A virgin female is considered a prize by many men and a virgin male is considered defective and undesirable. But again, you don't hear men complaining about it.

I hear plenty of men complaining about it on the internet.

 

[touchpause13]

Also I have no obligation to say "both sides" of any issue.

 

[famoussquamous]

Also I have no obligation to say "both sides" of any issue.

No, it just makes you sound more informed and balanced, and being able to adresss "both sides" of an issue indicates that you actually have a thorough understanding about whatever you're talking about

 

[freemontie]

I'm showing up late, whatever, but just to throw it our there, guys who prefer girls with a minimal/no sexual past should hold themselves to the same standards. Fair is fair.

Men and women don't just hold up each other to random B.S. standards "just because".
It's a reflection of what we naturally tend to value as a hetero man or woman.
Don't worry about fairness too much- women's standards can be just as brutal. Like I said before, a short, virgin, high-pitched assistant kindergarten schoolteacher of a man isn't going to get much out of women in most cases.

 

[cinnamonlady]

 

[wiggitywack12]

Please don't take this personally @famoussquamous but very few of your posts have been anything outside of illogical and hypocritical.

Men try to save women of questionable moral character everyday. Plenty of women do what you may consider to be "less than ideal" things and make bad decisions in their youth, but they still usually end up with someone at the end.

^^^ in reference to high earning men esteeming strippers and escorts as proper mothers and wives

Most men accept that women want/like sex, we're just a territorial sex and want a woman that's sexual with US, not with everyone else. Yes it's irrational but that's how a lot of us think.

Also there's a difference between someone that only sleeps with someone in whom they're in a serious relationship with and someone that has ONS every weekend. Most men are fine with the former but not the latter. That said a female like Lolo Jones that hasn't slept with anybody is more respected by men than a female that's slept with everybody.

^^^^ asserting that men don't respect promiscuous women

What did you want me to say? It's a real life phenomenon. Male virginity is mocked in our culture all the time (think about movies like Superbad, the 40 year old Virgin, the American Pie series, etc) You can shoot back that they're just movies, but they reflect the ideals of contemporary culture.

Asserting that trash comedy is reflective of contemporary culture when its just reflective of the writers, directors and the people who have the free time to constantly consume comedy that revolves around human genitalia (i.e., low iq low effort comedy)

Most women know this, which is why it's such a touchy matter, and it's why the "multiply by 3" rule exists.

^^^ reinforcing that "studies have shown" that virgin or close to virgin females have better marriages after stating that gold diggers, strippers and escorts were still desirable as wives because they were good looking

 

[touchpause13]

No, it just makes you sound more informed and balanced, and being able to adresss "both sides" of an issue indicates that you actually have a thorough understanding about whatever you're talking about

The problem is that this always comes up when discussing women's issues, or racial or LGBT issues for that manner. Suddenly it's all about equal attention when I try and discuss the PoV of an oppressed group. Maybe instead of trying to counter with the problems that men face, you could sit back and listen to what we are trying to tell you. But of course god forbid we have a discussion about women's issues without someone chiming in what about teh menz.