Corona

[wazoodog]

Possible links between COVID-19 and ACE2

ACE inhibitors and angiotensin receptor blockers may increase the risk of severe COVID-19, paper suggestsl

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[VictorOfHungerGames]

‘Is the Coronavirus as Deadly as They Say?’: Professors claim more data needed to know mortality rate - Washington Examiner

Two professors of medicine at Stanford University published an opinion article Tuesday in the Wall Street Journal, suggesting there is little evidence that the coronavirus would kill millions of people without shelter-in-place orders and quarantines.“Fear of Covid-19 is based on its high...

www.washingtonexaminer.com

 

[DagS132]

I am not buying the “unreported cases” argument. Is there anyone anywhere who would not get checked out if they are feeling ill right now? Maybe during a regular flu season but not right now would be my guess. I just don’t buy that it would be a statistically significant number on the population level.

I have a few friends that said they wouldn't. The reason being is that they are poor and don't have health insurance. Also due to this weird times, their pay is cut so they definitely don't want to go into the hospital. The only way they would go in is if they actually felt like they were going to die which might be too late but thats their mentality.

 

[wagrxm2000]

I have a few friends that said they wouldn't. The reason being is that they are poor and don't have health insurance. Also due to this weird times, their pay is cut so they definitely don't want to go into the hospital. The only way they would go in is if they actually felt like they were going to die which might be too late but thats their mentality.

Doesn't cost anything

 

[DagS132]

Doesn't cost anything

Haven't been up to date with the testing bill but good to see its now free. But what about treatment? That was the biggest issue, paying for the test was one thing.

 

[wagrxm2000]

Haven't been up to date with the testing bill but good to see its now free. But what about treatment? That was the biggest issue, paying for the test was one thing.

Treatment will still cost you.

Most healthy people shouldn't need treatment though, I'd rather your friends go in and find out so they don't pass it on if they have extremely mild cases.

 

[SClENCE]

I have had at least 4 people this week ask what is the best OTC for cough and when I asked if they have chest congestion they said they don't have the cough yet but are stocking up. Then idiots with a fever coming in the store to ask for OTC recommendations coughing everywhere and ignoring the tape on the floor. People asking for alcohol, masks, thermometers every 10 minutes and they always go to the consultation window and ask specifically for the pharmacist every ****ing time because they must think I have a secret supply. People handing us their grocery list and in the drive-thru. One lady cussed me out yesterday and called corporate because I wouldn't fill her narcs a week early due to Corona virus then her husband came in shouting at me, it was too much and I lost my temper.

 

[sfachine]

I have had at least 4 people this week ask what is the best OTC for cough and when I asked if they have chest congestion they said they don't have the cough yet but are stocking up. Then idiots with a fever coming in the store to ask for OTC recommendations coughing everywhere and ignoring the tape on the floor. People asking for alcohol, masks, thermometers every 10 minutes and they always go to the consultation window and ask specifically for the pharmacist every ****ing time because they must think I have a secret supply. People handing us their grocery list and in the drive-thru. One lady cussed me out yesterday and called corporate because I wouldn't fill her narcs a week early due to Corona virus then her husband came in shouting at me, it was too much and I lost my temper.

I fill all narcs now unless third party rejects.I would have been pissed too.Get your nose out of the regulation book.These are not ordinary times

 

[Cleaveland]

What if they want to fill cash? Or they have specific notes saying they try to fill early on their controls? But now they use the corona as an excuse? Yeah I had to deal with that nonsense. I respectfully declined those fills. Don't let anyone bully/harass you for controls.

 

[sfachine]

Well I think the corona "excuse" is 100 percent legit.Lets say you did fill it and it wasn't legit.Do you think the world would end? Do you actually think you would loose your permit in the middle of a pandemic?Send them to me..I would be happy to fill them.

 

[Twentytwelve2]

What if they want to fill cash? Or they have specific notes saying they try to fill early on their controls? But now they use the corona as an excuse? Yeah I had to deal with that nonsense. I respectfully declined those fills. Don't let anyone bully/harass you for controls.

If there is a consistent pattern of early refills, sure- deny it. A one time early fill 1 week early is fine in this situation.

 

[owlegrad]

It’s irresponsible to allow for early refills for no good reason imo. What does COVID have to do with needing your percs early?

/soapbox

 

[Twentytwelve2]

It’s irresponsible to allow for early refills for no good reason imo. What does COVID have to do with needing your percs early?

/soapbox

For example, the Walgreens in my town has closed down..... yeah...

 

[PharFromNormal]

25-Year-Old Pharmacy Technician Dies From Coronavirus In Riverside County, No Underlying Health Conditions Reported

Riverside County health officials reported the death of a 25-year-old pharmacy technician from COVID-19 Friday and warned the community that the illness is not just deadly for elderly people.

losangeles.cbslocal.com

 

[lane one]

25-Year-Old Pharmacy Technician Dies From Coronavirus In Riverside County, No Underlying Health Conditions Reported

Riverside County health officials reported the death of a 25-year-old pharmacy technician from COVID-19 Friday and warned the community that the illness is not just deadly for elderly people.

losangeles.cbslocal.com

“The virus does not discriminate and age doesn’t matter."

False. Age very much matters. It's possible that young people can experience severe ARDS from CoVID, it's just that the data show the overwhelming majority do not.

 

[PharFromNormal]

“The virus does not discriminate and age doesn’t matter."

False. Age very much matters. It's possible that young people can experience severe ARDS from CoVID, it's just that the data show the overwhelming majority do not.

I think it’s true actually. The virus does not discriminate. All ages can carry the virus and it seems to spread regardless of age.

Now the severity of the disease... well that’s a different story.

 

[wucool33]

I don't want to downplay CoVID, but I agree with a lot of what you're saying. I've been asking these questions myself and it's not a popular position. If the death toll for CoVID ends up coming in south of our recent flu season, there are going to be some serious questions about if we handled this correctly. It sounds cold to set an "acceptable level" of death for a pandemic, but we do it every year by not shutting down the country for flu season.

I'm not calling it a hoax or conspiracy or any of that, but I do think it's smart to ask the question is it all worth it. The economic impact of what we've done will be astronomical.

What more evidence do people with your mindset still need? Did we ever run out of respirators during a regular flu season? And this is with all the shut downs and social distancing. Imagine how bad this would be right now if China didn’t force everyone to stay home for 2 months. This is already way past the time to still compare it to a regular flu.

 

[WVUPharm2007]

I'm sure you've all heard about the idiot couple that ate fish tank cleaner with chloroquine phosphate in it and died. I guess Trump was saying chloroquine was the potential solution to the pandemic. So they took a teaspoonful (4-5x the usual dose) and one of them died.

So there was a big dustup about how Trump influenced these people to consume the tank cleaner from liberal media. Ok, yeah, whatever. To be expected.

What is REALLY amusing is that there is apparently an epidemic of idiots that seem to think that chloroquine "isn't the same" as chloroquine phosphate. You know how people are. Trying to find an excuse for their political "side."

I'm just sitting back being amused by the idiot laymen. That phosphate ion is all the difference between lethality and what Doctor Trump prescribed...lol.

 

[Sine Cura]

Well I think the corona "excuse" is 100 percent legit.Lets say you did fill it and it wasn't legit.Do you think the world would end? Do you actually think you would loose your permit in the middle of a pandemic?Send them to me..I would be happy to fill them.

It's about enabling bad behavior, like pharmacists letting fake scripts for hydroxychloroquine be dispensed. It's also an unnecessary distraction when you be could doing other scripts rather than relent due to the whining of a bunch of mindless hoarders

 

[Sine Cura]

I'm sure you've all heard about the idiot couple that ate fish tank cleaner with chloroquine phosphate in it and died. I guess Trump was saying chloroquine was the potential solution to the pandemic. So they took a teaspoonful (4-5x the usual dose) and one of them died.

Labeling of aquarium-use chloroquine phosphate shows 1/8 teaspoonful = 400 mg so 1 full teaspoonful = 3,200 mg

Source: Google cache "Mr frags" chloroquine phosphate

All retail pharmacists have encountered top minds who complain about the sulfate and HCl counterions of APIs so this one should be easy to explain too

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

I fill all narcs now unless third party rejects.I would have been pissed too.Get your nose out of the regulation book.These are not ordinary times

Filling narcs early because of a regular virus infection? Lol then same argument can be made for the flu. Are you gonna fill early for all flu patients? This is how you lose your license.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

What more evidence do people with your mindset still need? Did we ever run out of respirators during a regular flu season? And this is with all the shut downs and social distancing. Imagine how bad this would be right now if China didn’t force everyone to stay home for 2 months. This is already way past the time to still compare it to a regular flu.

I got two doctors friends who are at the forefront of this. One is internal medicine and the other is ER. Both say theyre overwhelmed with work overload but they both agree that this is stupid. The reason for their overwhelming work is due to people freaking out and admitting themselves into the hospital. The reason for lack of ventilators isnt because of coronavirus but because of every human in the city with some kind of respiratory issue wanting to be checked and treated for even though 99% of the time they are negative for covid19.

Again, back to my original point. This chaos is just too stupid and funny. The economic downfall will probably will cause more damage.

 

[APN-59 rph]

I got two doctors friends who are at the forefront of this. One is internal medicine and the other is ER. Both say theyre overwhelmed with work overload but they both agree that this is stupid. The reason for their overwhelming work is due to people freaking out and admitting themselves into the hospital. The reason for lack of ventilators isnt because of coronavirus but because of every human in the city with some kind of respiratory issue wanting to be checked and treated for even though 99% of the time they are negative for covid19.

Again, back to my original point. This chaos is just too stupid and funny. The economic downfall will probably will cause more damage.

Anecdotal at best. Big city? small town? No doubt that this is a huge training experience for everyone...is there no triage? After this settles down...and with luck an adult replaces the present individual this will be used to re rig the system. Peeps seem to be screaming for equipment, so what is happening in your case is a puzzle.. Bill Gates was on CNN with some extremely interesting comments. My take is that the US population is in general fearful and easily led...The average middle or upper class person has never met with a deadly challenge other than traffic and they panic easily...

 

[APN-59 rph]

I'm sure you've all heard about the idiot couple that ate fish tank cleaner with chloroquine phosphate in it and died. I guess Trump was saying chloroquine was the potential solution to the pandemic. So they took a teaspoonful (4-5x the usual dose) and one of them died.

So there was a big dustup about how Trump influenced these people to consume the tank cleaner from liberal media. Ok, yeah, whatever. To be expected.

What is REALLY amusing is that there is apparently an epidemic of idiots that seem to think that chloroquine "isn't the same" as chloroquine phosphate. You know how people are. Trying to find an excuse for their political "side."

I'm just sitting back being amused by the idiot laymen. That phosphate ion is all the difference between lethality and what Doctor Trump prescribed...lol.

Yipper..it's just a scream a minute....

 

[Sine Cura]

If people are so dependent on medication they are developing anxiety about hoarding for a rainy day they should've reconsidered their base life choices (assuming they were ever capable of introspection and delayed gratification, unlikely) unless cancer, autoimmune, congenital or genetic basis, or devastating work injury or MVA.

 

[TheBlaah]

I got two doctors friends who are at the forefront of this. One is internal medicine and the other is ER. Both say theyre overwhelmed with work overload but they both agree that this is stupid. The reason for their overwhelming work is due to people freaking out and admitting themselves into the hospital. The reason for lack of ventilators isnt because of coronavirus but because of every human in the city with some kind of respiratory issue wanting to be checked and treated for even though 99% of the time they are negative for covid19.

...what? What would the ER and IMS docs know about ventilator usage? An ER MD would only need to place a vent on a patient during an emergency situation, otherwise the admitting critical care MD would be responsible. Patients are only placed on vents, outside of emergencies, when they've failed nasal cannula, then venti-masks. Right now, hospitals are trying to discharge and reserve ventilator usage as much as they can, so they're not using them on indiscriminately.

Do you even work in a hospital? I don't know why you're trying to speak about something you don't seem to know much about.

 

[JustFillIt]

Meanwhile, a new social order is forming:

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

...what? What would the ER and IMS docs know about ventilator usage? An ER MD would only need to place a vent on a patient during an emergency situation, otherwise the admitting critical care MD would be responsible. Patients are only placed on vents, outside of emergencies, when they've failed nasal cannula, then venti-masks. Right now, hospitals are trying to discharge and reserve ventilator usage as much as they can, so they're not using them on indiscriminately.

Do you even work in a hospital? I don't know why you're trying to speak about something you don't seem to know much about.

Clearly, i do not work at a hospital. And no i am not speaking about something i dont know, i am speaking about a conversation i had with my close friends who informed me of what they do and where they work. No reason for you to belittle me just because you think i dont know something you do. My lack of hospital knowledge does not make you any more intelligent so please spare me the condescending lecture on how things work. So are you saying ALL patients on ventilators are coronavirus patients? And why wouldnt ER or any other doctor not have knowledge of this? Just because they dont have to put the vents on themselves, wouldnt they still be aware of which patients and how many of them are on it? And why there is a shortage of vents in their own hospital?

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

@TheBlaah

This is copy and paste from my ER doc friend’s text. Im gonna assume she knows a thing or two about ventilator usage.

She was taking a quick break from her work which is why shes typing all weird haha

“Right. so we have the “usual” number of patients requiring ventilators, sick from
Other things, but it’s usually from Different things like heart attack, major Surgery, Other lung problems, etc, which don’t all happen at the same
Time For everybody.

But now with the covid, it’s a pandemic, and people getting sick ALL AT THE SAME TIME, so that means there are LOTS
Of people requiring ventilators AT THE SAME TIMe, leading to the lack of hospital beds and ventilators that are
Needed to treat all these patients.

The goal is not
To just get rid of
Covid completely, that’s not going to happen.

The goal is to decrease the strain on healthcare resources. If there’s a more steady flow of patients needing ventilators, instead
Of This surge, there will be enough time for some patients to get better, come off of
The ventilator, and then the next patient who is sick can use that ventilator, and we can save all of them.”

 

[DagS132]

@TheBlaah

This is copy and paste from my ER doc friend’s text. Im gonna assume she knows a thing or two about ventilator usage.

She was taking a quick break from her work which is why shes typing all weird haha

“Right. so we have the “usual” number of patients requiring ventilators, sick from
Other things, but it’s usually from Different things like heart attack, major Surgery, Other lung problems, etc, which don’t all happen at the same
Time For everybody.

But now with the covid, it’s a pandemic, and people getting sick ALL AT THE SAME TIME, so that means there are LOTS
Of people requiring ventilators AT THE SAME TIMe, leading to the lack of hospital beds and ventilators that are
Needed to treat all these patients.

The goal is not
To just get rid of
Covid completely, that’s not going to happen.

The goal is to decrease the strain on healthcare resources. If there’s a more steady flow of patients needing ventilators, instead
Of This surge, there will be enough time for some patients to get better, come off of
The ventilator, and then the next patient who is sick can use that ventilator, and we can save all of them.”

This might be a dumb question but where should I assume that 99% of the patients are negative for covid and that all patients get ventilators regardless of whether they actually have covid or not.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

This might be a dumb question but where should I assume that 99% of the patients are negative for covid and that all patients get ventilators regardless of whether they actually have covid or not.

Lol 99% was an exaggeration. Apologies if anyone actually thought that was true. But she did sound like majority of patients who were on ventilators werent officially diagnosed with covid19.

 

[wucool33]

@TheBlaah

This is copy and paste from my ER doc friend’s text. Im gonna assume she knows a thing or two about ventilator usage.

She was taking a quick break from her work which is why shes typing all weird haha

“Right. so we have the “usual” number of patients requiring ventilators, sick from
Other things, but it’s usually from Different things like heart attack, major Surgery, Other lung problems, etc, which don’t all happen at the same
Time For everybody.

But now with the covid, it’s a pandemic, and people getting sick ALL AT THE SAME TIME, so that means there are LOTS
Of people requiring ventilators AT THE SAME TIMe, leading to the lack of hospital beds and ventilators that are
Needed to treat all these patients.

The goal is not
To just get rid of
Covid completely, that’s not going to happen.

The goal is to decrease the strain on healthcare resources. If there’s a more steady flow of patients needing ventilators, instead
Of This surge, there will be enough time for some patients to get better, come off of
The ventilator, and then the next patient who is sick can use that ventilator, and we can save all of them.”

Huh? I’m confused by this post. Because of covid, people are all getting sick at the same time due to different things that are not covid related? What?

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Huh? I’m confused by this post. Because of covid, people are all getting sick at the same time due to different things that are not covid related? What?

I think what she meant is people are being hospitalized all at the same time for different symptoms due to covid19. Not that they all have covid19 but the pandemic and panic of covid 19 is making people visit the hospital more urgently. Again, she was texting me during her break so im sure she wasnt proofreading haha

The reason i posted it was to prove a point that, despite what @TheBlaah believes, ER doctors knows a thing or two about ventilator usage.

 

[Sine Cura]

Regardless of how they got there, they have anxiety now, and I don't consider it helpful to tell them they should reconsider their base life choices, particularly as their pharmacist. Rather, my role is to figure out how to help alleviate their anxiety about access to medications while still meeting my responsibilities to follow the law and protect patients from harm. It's not my job to judge their life choices.

On a different note, if giving an early refill means less frequent in-person encounters and less of a need for the patient/care giver to have to leave the house to go to the pharmacy, that's something to consider as well (I'm specifically thinking of parents getting ADHD medications for their children and wanting to "stock up" to have to avoid multiple visits to the pharmacy during this time, which is a particular scenario I came across recently. Granted, in the military health system we have a lot more leeway with early refills regardless of global pandemics).

Yes I agree wasting time cajoling these customers is a complete waste of time for a pharmacist. The point is I don't see any compelling reason to give people special treatment when this isn't going away even after wave 1 peak death.

But why do parents need ADHD meds if their spawn aren't even in school?

 

[TheBlaah]

I think what she meant is people are being hospitalized all at the same time for different symptoms due to covid19. Not that they all have covid19 but the pandemic and panic of covid 19 is making people visit the hospital more urgently. Again, she was texting me during her break so im sure she wasnt proofreading haha

The reason i posted it was to prove a point that, despite what @TheBlaah believes, ER doctors knows a thing or two about ventilator usage.

After reading your friend's text, it seems like very general stuff she's texting that anybody in the hospital would know about. For example, I'm aware our ventilator usage is increasing because we're converting an additional floor to an ICU to accommodate an increase in ventilated patients (while we obtained enough vents, we didn't have enough rooms for both vents and regular ICU patients).
Also, it seems like you're taking her text and inferring things to fit the narrative in your own head. I see no mention of "this pandemic is stupid"; "99% of the time they're negative for covid"; "I think what she meant...is making people visit the hospital more urgently". You're assuming a lot on her behalf.

I will agree that the majority of tests are returning negative, not because there's a lack of affected patients, but because all patients with a suspected respiratory infection are being tested. At this point, most of the doctors are using the test as a rule-out rather than something they suspect.

Lastly, it seems I didn't get the point across from my previous post. If a patient is put on a ventilator, it means they *NEED* a ventilator to breathe. I cannot stress that enough. Patients are generally put into medically induced coma for ventilation. A influx of regular walk-in patients would not have a 1:1 proportional relation with ventilator usage. Additionally, with flu season shortly coming to an end with the coming of April, the number of patients who come in with respiratory symptoms usually decrease around this time.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

After reading your friend's text, it seems like very general stuff she's texting that anybody in the hospital would know about. For example, I'm aware our ventilator usage is increasing because we're converting an additional floor to an ICU to accommodate an increase in ventilated patients (while we obtained enough vents, we didn't have enough rooms for both vents and regular ICU patients).
Also, it seems like you're taking her text and inferring things to fit the narrative in your own head. I see no mention of "this pandemic is stupid"; "99% of the time they're negative for covid"; "I think what she meant...is making people visit the hospital more urgently". You're assuming a lot on her behalf.

I will agree that the majority of tests are returning negative, not because there's a lack of affected patients, but because all patients with a suspected respiratory infection are being tested. At this point, most of the doctors are using the test as a rule-out rather than something they suspect.

Lastly, it seems I didn't get the point across from my previous post. If a patient is put on a ventilator, it means they *NEED* a ventilator to breathe. I cannot stress that enough. Patients are generally put into medically induced coma for ventilation. A influx of regular walk-in patients would not have a 1:1 proportional relation with ventilator usage. Additionally, with flu season shortly coming to an end with the coming of April, the number of patients who come in with respiratory symptoms usually decrease around this time.

Just so I can understand better, what do you do? As in are you a doctor treating covid19 patients?

 

[TheBlaah]

Just so I can understand better, what do you do? As in are you a doctor treating covid19 patients?

In regards to covid-19, I was asked by the ID docs and pharmacists to create and upkeep report of our system of hospitals detailing the numbers of covid tests, our lab callbacks, the percentage that come back positive, the types of treatments positive patients receive, percentage of deaths, percentage that were admitted, percent that were ventilated, ect. I also keep track of covid drug inventory and their daily usage report.

While I'm not responsible for keeping track of vent inventory/usage, I've heard in-depth explanations about it in our meetings.

 

[johnpharm01]

I'm not sure a blanket early refills on controls policy is justified, but I would definitely be more willing to consider it during these times on a case-by-case basis. A lot of times people who are showing "drug seeking behavior" are actually just legitimately anxious about being able to access a medication they depend on, and I can't blame folks for having worse anxiety during these times.

So providing controlled substances early is an appropriate solution? After everything that's happened with the opiate epidemic? What happens next patients self medicating with those controls to feel good and possibly overdosing. If I worked with you I would report you to the state bop.

The only justification I can see possible is if there legit med supply would be ending ie pharmacy closing and there would not be enough time to replace it.

 

[owlegrad]

So providing controlled substances early is an appropriate solution? After everything that's happened with the opiate epidemic? What happens next patients self medicating with those controls to feel good and possibly overdosing. If I worked with you I would report you to the state bop.

The only justification I can see possible is if there legit med supply would be ending ie pharmacy closing and there would not be enough time to replace it.

I would consider an early refill for someone who tested positive for COVID and wanted to get an early refill to reassure themselves that they won’t be cut off due to not being able to leave the house or something like that.

But a blank “fill them early because of an unrelated pandemic”, absolutely not, I agree with you. The early refill of a narcotic “just because” isn’t something I would condone. You would just be feeding the opioid crisis.

Just for fun, how many people die every year to opioid overdose vs COVID?

 

[grumpyRph]

yeah i think a good case is someone with multiple meds. psych med cocktail with benzo for prn anxiety. well if 3 things are ready but the benzo (adhd med, ambien, etc) is a little too early, well...if it runs through insurance might as well let them have it to make one trip to pharmacy. at this point, it's really just good for society. if you're gonna sell clean needles, might as well prevent multiple trips to the pharmacy/public with certain situations with your patients.

edit, i suppose this is best when the patient is standing there. but i guess if they call on the phone you can encourage them to come when the controlled substance is due to pick up everything. haha. i mean this isn't rocket science.

 

[johnpharm01]

I would consider an early refill for someone who tested positive for COVID and wanted to get an early refill to reassure themselves that they won’t be cut off due to not being able to leave the house or something like that.

But a blank “fill them early because of an unrelated pandemic”, absolutely not, I agree with you. The early refill of a narcotic “just because” isn’t something I would condone. You would just be feeding the opioid crisis.

Just for fun, how many people die every year to opioid overdose vs COVID?

I remember that over 400,000 died from opiates in the last 20 years legal and illegal. You can rationalize it any you want but when other pharmacists suggest convenience as the reason, yoo have stopped being a health care provider.

 

[DagS132]

I remember that over 400,000 died from opiates in the last 20 years legal and illegal. You can rationalize it any you want but when other pharmacists suggest convenience as the reason, yoo have stopped being a health care provider.

Yeah yeah and the world's third leading cause of unintentional injury death was caused by dihydrogen monoxide. Its founds in nearly everything you eat and drink, we are surrounded by it, its even found in our plumbing systems. But its not banned. Do your part as a healthcare provider and stop this chemical from harming more people, get better control and make sure people don't refill on it too early.

 

[Sine Cura]

Great analogy.

Except you don't actually need opioids to live despite a good % of American degenerates popping anything and everything to bury their miserable lives in a drug-fueled stupor

 

[BidingMyTime]

Not exactly early refills, but our friends across the pond are considering easing up on prescription requirements for controlled substances: ACMD advice on COVID-19 emergency legislation to enable supply of controlled drugs

This makes sense. Doctors have been told to cancel all routine appointments in my state. Yet many people have a monthly routine appt to get their controlled RX refilled. Still too many doctors set up for controlled e-prescribing, so even if a patient doesn't require an appt, they may still have to go to the office to their prescription. It would make sense for the DEA to encourage doctors not to require a routine appt for a monthly RX, and then encourage these doctor to give out give out 3 RX's with apppropriate fill dates, when the pt picks up an RX.I don't know how the e-rx system works, but if it were possible to temporarily make it so any doctor set up for e-prescribing could e-prescribe CII's, I think that would be an excellent idea.

 

[DagS132]

Great analogy.

Except you don't actually need opioids to live despite a good % of American degenerates popping anything and everything to bury their miserable lives in a drug-fueled stupor

Ah good point. Might I also add that cigarettes are sold daily and those kill half a million each year.
Lmao, I'm just trying to say don't treat everything as black and white.

 

[Sine Cura]

This makes sense. Doctors have been told to cancel all routine appointments in my state. Yet many people have a monthly routine appt to get their controlled RX refilled. Still too many doctors set up for controlled e-prescribing, so even if a patient doesn't require an appt, they may still have to go to the office to their prescription. It would make sense for the DEA to encourage doctors not to require a routine appt for a monthly RX, and then encourage these doctor to give out give out 3 RX's with apppropriate fill dates, when the pt picks up an RX.I don't know how the e-rx system works, but if it were possible to temporarily make it so any doctor set up for e-prescribing could e-prescribe CII's, I think that would be an excellent idea.

That guidance is for the U.K. though. US opioid prescribing is an absolute clown show where you literally have idiot prescribers doing cut-and-paste of discharge opioid regimens ad infinitum if you never intervene. If you don't push back, this is where you get pts on Fentanyl + Norco + MS Contin MME <= 900 a day from Joe Schmoe FP. Didn't President Trump declare a public health emergency over the U.S. opioid "crisis"?

These idiots apparently didn't get the memo nor have a clue. Intellectual honesty would require putting 15-25% of these "patients" in heroin maintenance clinics (eat, snort, shoot up, I don't care) rather than going through this charade of writing opioids for "pain"

I doubt UK is as bad.

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

Feds classifying all coronavirus patient deaths as ‘COVID-19’ deaths, regardless of cause

The federal government is classifying the deaths of patients infected with the coronavirus as COVID-19 deaths, regardless of any underlying health issues that could have contributed to the loss of …

nypost.com

Pa. Department of Health revises down COVID-19 death counts

Pennsylvania’s Department of Health has released daily death figures from COVID-19, broken down by county, for the last five weeks. For the first time Thursday, the numbers included a mathematical

www.delcotimes.com

 

[LazyPharmacist2.0]

Feds classifying all coronavirus patient deaths as ‘COVID-19’ deaths, regardless of cause

The federal government is classifying the deaths of patients infected with the coronavirus as COVID-19 deaths, regardless of any underlying health issues that could have contributed to the loss of …

nypost.com

Pa. Department of Health revises down COVID-19 death counts

Pennsylvania’s Department of Health has released daily death figures from COVID-19, broken down by county, for the last five weeks. For the first time Thursday, the numbers included a mathematical

www.delcotimes.com

You are the few on here who is beginning to grasp the intricacies behind this alleged pandemic. Most people on here will only accept "facts" that are spewed by what is termed mainstream media. Sadly the truth is labeled as a conspiracy and brushed aside. By the time people realize what has truly transpired it is too late. History will always repeat itself. Is it a coincidence that facts are revisioned after the passing of time?

Once the effects of this pandemic are actualized people will begin to question its cause:

1) Many small businesses will be shattered completely. Most private universities will close their doors and massive layoffs will ensue. Education will be reserved for the elite as it originally was.
2) Stimulus checks will be continued as a way to acclimate society into guaranteed universal income.
3) Food shortages will become a reality in a few months for various reasons (decreased imports and food plants closing).
4) International travel will be severely limited. Only those who have "immunity certificates" will have the luxury
5) The systematic removal of civil liberties under the guise of protecting society from the pandemic. This will be done through several ways.


This may sound crazy to most people but as time passes all this will come to fruition. People are too divided and blind to see what is going on. Things will never return to what they once were

 

[owlegrad]

While the "tinfoil hat" is strong with this post there are a few elements that I agree with. I could definitely see this being used to justify UBI at some point. I hear an awful lot of "why are people being paid more money to stay at home" blah blah blah. Excellent point - let's use UBI to eliminate that 'injustice'!

Food shortages seem all but guarantied at this point.

The rest I am +/- on. I doubt travel restrictions will become the norm, I guess we will see. #1 is the most unlikely IMO. #5 is so vague you can make anything fit that so it is basically guaranteed to be right.

You are the few on here who is beginning to grasp the intricacies behind this alleged pandemic. Most people on here will only accept "facts" that are spewed by what is termed mainstream media. Sadly the truth is labeled as a conspiracy and brushed aside. By the time people realize what has truly transpired it is too late. History will always repeat itself. Is it a coincidence that facts are revisioned after the passing of time?

Once the effects of this pandemic are actualized people will begin to question its cause:

1) Many small businesses will be shattered completely. Most private universities will close their doors and massive layoffs will ensue. Education will be reserved for the elite as it originally was.
2) Stimulus checks will be continued as a way to acclimate society into guaranteed universal income.
3) Food shortages will become a reality in a few months for various reasons (decreased imports and food plants closing).
4) International travel will be severely limited. Only those who have "immunity certificates" will have the luxury
5) The systematic removal of civil liberties under the guise of protecting society from the pandemic. This will be done through several ways.


This may sound crazy to most people but as time passes all this will come to fruition. People are too divided and blind to see what is going on. Things will never return to what they once were

 

[M0df]

His understanding of intricacies was to laugh it off with Lol and Haha. Pointing a finger at panic buying of toilet paper. At some point, he started to support quarantine of selective population but didn't pursue that argument much. That argument actually had some merit. It might be hard to execute but I haven't seen anyone put a comprehensive plan either, unless you count Sweden with their selective quarantine. Oh and btw, if we didn't execute our current plan, what makes anyone think that a more complex plan was feasible.

You bring up valid points. All those things 1 through 5 are a reality. They are here. There is no denying it. However, they probably would have been here if nothing was done as well. The argument that seems to come up time after time is we are not NYC, we are not NO.

You cry outrage! Where are my liberties! Knock yourself out. Btw, I don't see an actual solution that would have avoided 1-5 in your post. All those things would have happened just in a different sequence if they let the virus sweep through our population. As I said, we did a half baked job and wasted months. We damaged our economy and still have to bury the dead.

P.S. I am a pharmacist in a low risk category with no underlying conditions.