Class of 2017.... how you doin?

[HorsesRLife]

Even if you are in podunk, you are already bringing quality aid to the animals!

Yeah, podunk is rough! No tech/receptionist, only injectible anesthesia, rusty dental tools (so I'm pretty much turning away dentals until I can afford to buy a scaler polisher at least, since owner doesn't think we have enough small animal clientele to support one so won't invest.) I spent probably thousands of their money just replacing expired small animal drugs (as in like expired 10 years ago). Just keep telling myself he's going to retire soon and I'll buy the practice and update everything starting with a veterinary computer program.

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[Trilt]

Yeah, podunk is rough! No tech/receptionist, only injectible anesthesia, rusty dental tools (so I'm pretty much turning away dentals until I can afford to buy a scaler polisher at least, since owner doesn't think we have enough small animal clientele to support one so won't invest.) I spent probably thousands of their money just replacing expired small animal drugs (as in like expired 10 years ago). Just keep telling myself he's going to retire soon and I'll buy the practice and update everything starting with a veterinary computer program.

Oh goodness. That's very, very podunk.

 

[twelvetigers]

The link in my siggy is for a comic based in Podunk, OK (no joke)

 

[hygebeorht]

Residency applications coming due super soon for out-of-match programs. Stress level: rapidly rising :/

 

[KCgophervet]

Residency applications coming due super soon for out-of-match programs. Stress level: rapidly rising :/

Will say I am super glad I don't have to do that again. Radiology? Good luck - you can do it!

 

[hygebeorht]

Will say I am super glad I don't have to do that again. Radiology? Good luck - you can do it!

Thanks. It's quite an experience. Getting LORs is so freaking painful

 

[Doktor Timo]

It seems ridiculous even attempting to apply for residencies. I've been a vet for, like, 4 months. What have I even done?

 

[LetItSnow]

It seems ridiculous even attempting to apply for residencies. I've been a vet for, like, 4 months. What have I even done?

Heh. Actually, I kinda agree with that, in a way....

I'm occasionally struck by the way our 'process' works when I get some recommendation from a consult specialist who obviously has never really practiced clinically. Mostly I note it with radiologists (because that's one of the primary specialist services I use): they'll read out the Rads/US/CT/MR, make some recommendation, and I'll promptly start rolling my eyes because the recommendation just doesn't make any sense, is clearly 'textbook' from a decade ago, their differentials are just crazy, or that sort of thing....

This isn't a slam on the awesome radiologists that support those of us in the trenches. I love the support we get and I think it's amazing that we can get images read out 24 hours a day within an hour. But I wish part of the DVM -> Internship -> Residency pathway involved significant exposure to real-world medicine.

I can almost always tell when the specialist giving me feedback (whether it's radiology, pathology, etc.) has practiced out in the 'real world'.

I think it's telling that it's a very regular occurrence in rounds to hear "... and radiology read it out as X and recommended Y [insert eye roll] but we did Z."

 

[Frozenshades]

Heh. Actually, I kinda agree with that, in a way....

I'm occasionally struck by the way our 'process' works when I get some recommendation from a consult specialist who obviously has never really practiced clinically. Mostly I note it with radiologists (because that's one of the primary specialist services I use): they'll read out the Rads/US/CT/MR, make some recommendation, and I'll promptly start rolling my eyes because the recommendation just doesn't make any sense, is clearly 'textbook' from a decade ago, their differentials are just crazy, or that sort of thing....

This isn't a slam on the awesome radiologists that support those of us in the trenches. I love the support we get and I think it's amazing that we can get images read out 24 hours a day within an hour. But I wish part of the DVM -> Internship -> Residency pathway involved significant exposure to real-world medicine.

I can almost always tell when the specialist giving me feedback (whether it's radiology, pathology, etc.) has practiced out in the 'real world'.

I think it's telling that it's a very regular occurrence in rounds to hear "... and radiology read it out as X and recommended Y [insert eye roll] but we did Z."

Disagreeing with radiology was a reasonably regular occurrence on medicine lol. I know a lot of people talk about internships like they're the holy grail of learning experiences for new grads, but sometimes I wonder. Not going that path, obviously I'm an outsiders perspective, but from what I saw in school on the small animal side of things you're massively overworked, and still almost never really in charge of anything under the residents in the hierarchy, except for when the entire ICU is thrust upon you overnight because why not. How competitive for match are those who go into practice for a few years after school instead? Especially for the more competitive fields, it seems kinda crazy to me that people are doing 2 or even 3 years of internships trying to get a residency. You'd probably be less stressed, and definitely making a lot more money, working a regular job during that time frame instead.

 

[LetItSnow]

Disagreeing with radiology was a reasonably regular occurrence on medicine lol.

It's not really "disagreeing" per se. I mean, radiologists and other boarded specialists (or third-yr residents and to a lesser degree second-yr residents) know their **** - that's how they got boarded. It's that their recommendations for how to USE their information are often .... just not all that great. And a lot of the time, it's due to many of them not having any real clinical experience to put their observations into context.

I dunno that there's an easy solution. I mean, the last thing any of us want us for vets (or MDs) to have to do even more low-paid training while debt accumulates.

It's just an observation, I guess. And it's not just radiologists; like I said, they just happen to be my most-utilized consulting specialty.

 

[that redhead]

I'm occasionally struck by the way our 'process' works when I get some recommendation from a consult specialist who obviously has never really practiced clinically.

The big company that we use for our labs offers free consults with their specialists. I used it once where I'd gone through all of the possible ddx's and was still scratching my head. The specialist just read me the same list of differentials I'd already gone through twenty times. Uh, thanks?

 

[Trilt]

The big company that we use for our labs offers free consults with their specialists. I used it once where I'd gone through all of the possible ddx's and was still scratching my head. The specialist just read me the same list of differentials I'd already gone through twenty times. Uh, thanks?

As bad as it is, I mostly use our consult line to give oomph to recommendations to owners. Take five minutes to be able to say "and the boarded internal medicine specialist agrees that we should do yada yada next" is often worth it to avoid hassle and back and forth with them.

Oh and the exotics people are amazing when you can get a hold of them. I've gotten whole book chapters faxed to me by them before lol.

 

[that redhead]

As bad as it is, I mostly use our consult line to give oomph to recommendations to owners. Take five minutes to be able to say "and the boarded internal medicine specialist agrees that we should do yada yada next" is often worth it to avoid hassle and back and forth with them.

Oh and the exotics people are amazing when you can get a hold of them. I've gotten whole book chapters faxed to me by them before lol.

This makes total sense, but I'm calling the consult line because I have no idea what to do

And nice about the exotics! I tried to stat g.pig rads and they were like LOLnope. But then said they'd let the regular ol' boarded radiologist look and "if they didn't feel like they knew what they were talking about then they'd send them to the exotic specialist"...UH, can you just send them to the exotics specialist then? The report (which came after the pig died, of course) was from a non-exotics person and they recommended I do BAL on the g.pig...which I'm sure someone out there in the universe can do but I ain't that person!

 

[allieh8607]

Have any of you had any experience with or heard anything about hospitals owned by Vetcor?

 

[that redhead]

Have any of you had any experience with or heard anything about hospitals owned by Vetcor?

We have them around here...I haven't heard anything to equate it to Banfield and their reputation but I purposefully avoided applying to corporate places.

 

[psilovethomas]

Oh and the exotics people are amazing when you can get a hold of them. I've gotten whole book chapters faxed to me by them before lol.

Curious- which lab?

 

[Trilt]

Curious- which lab?

Antech.

 

[hygebeorht]

Anyone else applying to residencies at the moment? Not every specialty has out-of-match options. Our first application was due 10/15.

Radiology last year had 19 in-match positions and a ~16% match rate. This year there are only 17 positions...

 

[LetItSnow]

We have them around here...I haven't heard anything to equate it to Banfield and their reputation but I purposefully avoided applying to corporate places.

I've talked to them a few times here 'n there, but don't have direct experience (and I don't think we have any in MN). They talk the talk about avoiding the pitfalls of Banfield; at least, the common complaints of corporate-directed medicine, limited DVM flexibility, too much workload, etc. Whether they succeed or not - no clue.

 

[allieh8607]

I've talked to them a few times here 'n there, but don't have direct experience (and I don't think we have any in MN). They talk the talk about avoiding the pitfalls of Banfield; at least, the common complaints of corporate-directed medicine, limited DVM flexibility, too much workload, etc. Whether they succeed or not - no clue.

That's definitely the speech they've been giving me. I'm heading down a path towards employment with them currently but really can't find much information on them. They only own ~230 hospitals right now but quite a few in my area. The lack of information makes me nervous given that it'll be my first job and I've also purposefully avoided Banfield but the vets at this place seem pretty happy and don't have anything bad to say about their experience with Vetcor so I guess it may just take me being willing to take a leap of faith.

 

[LetItSnow]

That's definitely the speech they've been giving me. I'm heading down a path towards employment with them currently but really can't find much information on them. They only own ~230 hospitals right now but quite a few in my area. The lack of information makes me nervous given that it'll be my first job and I've also purposefully avoided Banfield but the vets at this place seem pretty happy and don't have anything bad to say about their experience with Vetcor so I guess it may just take me being willing to take a leap of faith.

Yeah, tough decision. But if you have a practice with them you like, and the vets there are positive about it ... might be worth it. I mean, lots of DVMs love working for Banfield, too. And VCA.

Let's face it, though - Vetcor will probably have the Mars Inc. stamp on it within the next few years. We're all destined to be Mars employees. I just wanna know if we get discounts on candy.

 

[Frozenshades]

Yeah, tough decision. But if you have a practice with them you like, and the vets there are positive about it ... might be worth it. I mean, lots of DVMs love working for Banfield, too. And VCA.

Let's face it, though - Vetcor will probably have the Mars Inc. stamp on it within the next few years. We're all destined to be Mars employees. I just wanna know if we get discounts on candy.

Keeping that white van fully stocked must add up I'm sure.

 

[deleted498041]

Anyone else applying to residencies at the moment? Not every specialty has out-of-match options. Our first application was due 10/15.

Radiology last year had 19 in-match positions and a ~16% match rate. This year there are only 17 positions...

Yup, working on my letter of intent today. Will likely end up at a specialty internship, but that's okay.

 

[JaynaAli]

We're reviewing apps for my program this weekend and voting/offering interview invites early next week. It seems so early for out-of-match programs compared to the match.

 

[TheGirlWithTheFernTattoo]

Why does a program choose to do things out of the match vs during the match?

 

[KCgophervet]

Why does a program choose to do things out of the match vs during the match?

Having been to a recent conference lecture where this topic was discussed (in lab animal, idk about other specialties) part of it was due to funding woes, and not necessarily having guaranteed funding for the position by the Match deadlines.

 

[dyachei]

Yeah, tough decision. But if you have a practice with them you like, and the vets there are positive about it ... might be worth it. I mean, lots of DVMs love working for Banfield, too. And VCA.

Let's face it, though - Vetcor will probably have the Mars Inc. stamp on it within the next few years. We're all destined to be Mars employees. I just wanna know if we get discounts on candy.

You do, if you order them through the right channel. At least on personalized m&ms

 

[JaynaAli]

Why does a program choose to do things out of the match vs during the match?

Some specialties (like mine) are completely out of the match for residencies. It has been discussed on the listservs about whether people want to switch into the match or stay outside it, and the vast majority of votes are to stay outside. It gives programs more choice about who they pick, and a specialty like clin path where we literally sit in the same room as our faculty the entire day every day we are on clinics, having a good fit is really important. As an applicant, it was a little more challenging to navigate different application due dates, requirements, etc. And, although this is being changed to be more standardized, my first offer arrived more than three weeks before some places were even interviewing. This place was my #1 choice so it was okay, but it would have sucked to be put into a position where I had to accept or not before I had other offers from other choices I had preferred better. Now there is a universal acceptance date for clin path so even if you are offered a position early, you don't have to tell them until a specified date to avoid one place swooping in early and taking the best candidates.

I'm not sure how it works or the rationale behind it for programs that have some in and some out of the match like Ophtho or a lot of the large animal ones.

 

[hygebeorht]

We're reviewing apps for my program this weekend and voting/offering interview invites early next week. It seems so early for out-of-match programs compared to the match.

You're telling me. I'm like "please train me...I am a good doc I promise...for the approximately 3 months I have been practicing..."

 

[allieh8607]

I might delete this because I feel weird about it so please no quoting of the whole thing.

I had my first euthanasia over the weekend (of course the last appointment of my first solo Saturday) where it wasn't like a scheduled euthanasia that I was prepared for. I've only been practicing since November. The patient came in very sick and I guided the owner towards the decision to euthanize. But it has hit me so hard, and I'm wondering if it's just me be an over-dramatic baby or if it's normal. I just have this overwhelming feeling of guilt that I pushed too hard towards euthanasia and maybe the owner wasn't ready or we did it too soon. It doesn't help that the cat was purring and kneading up until the very end. Without going into too many medical details, I truly feel that it was the best decision for the cat and I still stand by my suggestions for the owner. But I'm talking like...I cried after the owner signed the paperwork and the techs were putting in the catheter, cried all the way home afterwards, cried when I got home for awhile, cried on the way to my evening plans Sat night, and I've been crying about it on and off all weekend. I feel ridiculous lol Like any time I'm by myself and I even start thinking about it, I tear up. I'm going to talk about the case with my colleagues today to see if that eases my mind at all but jeesh if this is how I'm going to react every time, it's exhausting lol

 

[PrincessButterCup]

Hugs @allieh8607! I don't think that's unusual at all. There have been some cases that really affected me for one reason or another, and I've never been the person making decisions or giving medical advice. If an assistant is allowed to be a mess over a patient, the doctor is certainly allowed to cry about it, too.

 

[Trilt]

I don't think it's weird at all. Some of them still hit me really hard, even if it's definitely the right decision for the animal. Sometimes it's not really the animal, it's just all the rest of the cases and the **** going on in life and yada yada yada.

Necropsies help sometimes. I was sad about a cat euth last week... opened her up and found tiny tumours all throughout the omentum and caudal abdomen. There wasn't fixing that no matter what money they threw at it.

 

[twelvetigers]

Allie, I had a lab that I did a quick US on an saw what I perceived as badness. Those owners ended up euthanizing this sweet dog, and I couldn’t help but feel like it could have had some more good days before going to that. But they wanted to let it go before the condition made it sick.

I still wonder about it. They weigh heavily sometimes. But there’s not much to do about it now.

We do the best we can to steer owners in the right direction. It’s hard sometimes.

 

[KCgophervet]

How's everyone doing? We've been out for about a year now, which is crazy to me!

 

[genny]

How's everyone doing? We've been out for about a year now, which is crazy to me!

I had to refer an emergency surgery to the vet school today - and talked to one of the clinicians on the phone who remembered me. It got me all flustered, and made me feel like I was back in school again presenting a case! Also made me realize how far I've come in just a year.

 

[Frozenshades]

Still here

Finished my PhD coursework, going to Boston for a week in July for some training. Planning on doing my preliminary exam to advance to candidacy late summer/early fall. Want to defend and be outta here end of next year.

 

[deleted498041]

Congratulations to everyone who's finishing up internships!

 

[Lupin21]

Hope all are doing fantastic moving into two years out! I'm enjoying the confusion I've created among some of the clinicians thinking I should be more advanced than a fourth year. I am quite horrible about wearing my 19er flare, so I'm not really helping the situation. hehe

 

[KCgophervet]

It's officially been two years since graduation day and it's amazing how fast the time has flown by. I'm over halfway through my residency program, got married, had a kid, and feel like every day I learn just how little I actually know. Anyone else from c/o 2017 around? How is everyone?

 

[Lupin21]

It's officially been two years since graduation day and it's amazing how fast the time has flown by. I'm over halfway through my residency program, got married, had a kid, and feel like every day I learn just how little I actually know. Anyone else from c/o 2017 around? How is everyone?

Original graduating on Friday for comparison. lol

 

[Frozenshades]

I see the vet students now and I'm like

Guess it's make or break over the next few months to finish up this PhD thing, cause I'm not sticking around next year...

 

[Lupin21]

I see the vet students now and I'm like

Guess it's make or break over the next few months to finish up this PhD thing, cause I'm not sticking around next year...

 

[deleted498041]

Almost done with first year of residency! Terrified for boards and feeling like I know less than I did when I started -- although logically knowing that's just not true. I love my job (almost) every day

 

[KCgophervet]

The other threads popping up made me want to chime in here - anyone still around? I'm up to 2 kids now and working in my specialty field back at the U of MN. Haven't taken boards yet (kid #2 delayed that for me) but hoping to take them next year. I'm teaching residents now which is crazy and vet students seem even younger than ever. Still love my field though even if the job is currently challenging.

How's everyone else doing?

 

[genny]

The other threads popping up made me want to chime in here - anyone still around? I'm up to 2 kids now and working in my specialty field back at the U of MN. Haven't taken boards yet (kid #2 delayed that for me) but hoping to take them next year. I'm teaching residents now which is crazy and vet students seem even younger than ever. Still love my field though even if the job is currently challenging.

How's everyone else doing?

I feel like this dog right now. I’m ready for the slow season to start but I’m not seeing any signs of that. Still love what I do! But I would be ok with doing slightly less of it.

 

[Lupin21]

I started here! Drowning like everyone else. Do I still like what I do? Sometimes. But I like my coworkers and most staff and I love where I live, so that's good enough.

 

[Rainheart]

I'm really thinking of all you ER people. Thank you for all you do!!!

I've just come up on 3 years at my current clinic. We just found out we are being bought by corporate (NVA) a few weeks ago. I've signed on, got a raise and a lot more vacation. I'm also planning on buying into the clinic currently.
My wife and I just refinanced our house, too. We are going to be saving almost $500/month on the mortgage. She's up for a promotion at work at the end of the year, too (and hopefully a raise)
So... things are going pretty well right now. I'm a bit worried about corporate, I've never worked for one so I'll have to see what things do actually change.

 

[Coopah]

I'm really thinking of all you ER people. Thank you for all you do!!!

I've just come up on 3 years at my current clinic. We just found out we are being bought by corporate (NVA) a few weeks ago. I've signed on, got a raise and a lot more vacation. I'm also planning on buying into the clinic currently.
My wife and I just refinanced our house, too. We are going to be saving almost $500/month on the mortgage. She's up for a promotion at work at the end of the year, too (and hopefully a raise)
So... things are going pretty well right now. I'm a bit worried about corporate, I've never worked for one so I'll have to see what things do actually change.

You'll have to let us know how it goes! We're having trouble keeping staff here currently because corperate is refusing to pay tech's what they're worth. Three left last week after several meetings with management and getting nothing out of it. They got $3 and hour raise elsewhere.

 

[Rainheart]

You'll have to let us know how it goes! We're having trouble keeping staff here currently because corperate is refusing to pay tech's what they're worth. Three left last week after several meetings with management and getting nothing out of it. They got $3 and hour raise elsewhere.

I will update once the sale has gone through. It's really awful that this field cannot keep techs and cannot pay them well. We only have one currently and have been desperately trying to find another.