any updates on ab 1467?

[mommyr]

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[yasi]

hi mommyr
i think we almost are the same f/married
part 1 83,now in canada ,waiting for ab1467
but i haven't heard any thing yet about it...
still waiting.... ..... .... ....
have you apply for any advance standing in canada or US or not

 

[mommyr]

yes, i applied to U of T the last 2 years but nothing happened... i am beginning to think it's a waste of my time and money to even try further here in canada... maybe we should try in the U.S. schools instead... i am waiting for the bench and Nov. to apply for canadian citizenship...

 

[gsmm]

does anyone know where is scott or ivorinedust or anybody who is aware of whats happening in the california board legislations?

i wonder is any updates can be followed through the internet.

 

[ivorinedust]

There is no new-news Keep your hopes up. Something as good as the RT extension will definitely pass. Unless selfish xenophobes get their way...

Ivorinedust

===================================
Apolonia, relieve me of my toothache!

 

[mommyr]

it's been interesting how i find myself logging on to this forum every night browsing through everyone's experiences... there are days when it get's depressing esp. when it seems it might be awhile before anything happens in terms of getting recertified as a dentist...

i get treated very well as a dental assistant where i am working at and since i am assisting a new grad she treats me as a colleague and asks for my input in her treatment plans all the time but between cleaning the office and watching a new grad panic doing an exo. i find myself lost in deep thought wondering when to quit and looking for a more experienced dentist to work for and hopefully better hours and pay and what to do just in case i find a new job and get called for the bench...

i don't like it when i only see my 3 y/o 2 hours a dayonly bec. i work all week and all saturdays trying to catch up with my credit card bills incurred while enrolled in Dr. Duggan's course...knowing i am a competent dentist just as good and sometimes better than the dentist i am assisting... but yet here i am...

now and then wondering whether i should go for the Florida dental hygiene board exam but where do i get at least another $1000 to fund that exam while catching up with my credit card bills...

then there's the Eligibilty Exam again for June with March as the deadline for applying which means money out 500 to rewrite the exam and aim for a more competitve score, anothe 200 to rewrite my expired TOEFL and more money for notarizations, more money to apply in canadian universities....

all these plans while doing a joggling act being a mom, a wife, an employee and wondering when my break will be...

i was looking at old threads and sam's funny stories, megg's insights and there are so many others.... i don't have a very good GPA but i'm not dumb either... it just so happens the state university i came from was very tough getting by every year was a major accomplishment in itself...but anyway that's how i know my scores will not be good enough for most universities here or in the US and so I pin my hopes on the bench...

in the meantime here i am again logging on, pouring my heart out to those who can understand somehow as if this forum was their diary as well....

goodnight ...

 

[Meggs]

mommyr, you made me cry!!!

 

[mommyr]

don't worry i am down but not resigned, just feeling melancholic tonight....

i am just confused wondering what my gameplan ought to be bec. frankly after studying for the NDBE 1, 2, canadian EE, preparing for the bench last year and evrything else i just feel tired...

again tired but alive... i am trying to keep things in perspective, afterall God is sovereign and in the final analysis God is not impressed with our degrees but how obedient we are to His will...

tomorrow's Friday and with my little one so sick the whole week i am glad to be off at least one day before I go back to work again on sat.

then there's valentine's day on sat. so when i think about my husband and my little girl I know there's much to be thankful for, my degree is just icing on the cake!

 

[Chuchuca]

mommyr,

I have been feeling the same way too.

It sucks to be an assistant, especially when I know that I can do better.

My chances on getting accepted for any school, are zero. And yes, the bench is the only way for me. I could start all over, get back to the first year, but I am pretty old for that, so...

I know that we will be able to sit for the bench test, but I am tired of this waiting. Too emotional.

But as you, I have a family who motivates me and will love me no matter what. And all this love and luck, motivates me and give me fuel to keep my flame burning.

I have learned that " Life is complicated for those who do not have hope and passion for it" I see that people here in this forum have lots of these feelings and they have been a great motivation for me as well.

Patient is the key. I am sure that all will come to us, sooner or later.

 

[pinktooth]

Hi mommyr and chunchua,
There are times in your life when we feel that nothing is going as we wish it would.Or maybe fast forward the things we are so impatiently waiting for.
Trust me I am one of them too but reading your mails have really made me realise to have patience and leave everything to God.And look at the things that God has given us.'coz thats the way we can be happy.Happiness is an active process and I am trying very hard these days to be happy..
Thanks alot

 

[Dentisthusband]

Hi Mommyr,

I understand how you feel, even though I myself am just the spouse of a foreign trained dentist. Yet my wife and I keep a positive attitude about this whole process. And really, what other option do we have than to be hopeful? Despair yields only a bitter reward. We work on that which we can change and accept that which we cannot.

Adriana and I continue to believe that she will eventually succeed and so we continue to work toward that goal. I suppose that Adriana and I each have our own selfish reasons for this quest. Ultimately though, we work for the future of the most important member of our family; our daughter Isabella.

Regardless of our own daily struggles, she always greets us with the unbridled enthusiasm that only a 4 year old can possibly possess. And the fantastic revelation always remains that we already are successful with her, and through her, and because of her. And as any proud parent would, I am attaching a photo of her.

I want you to know that I talked to Andy Martinez yesterday evening. He said that the California Dental Association and the California Dental Board are still haggling over a few minor details in the wording of the legislation. He wouldn't hazard a guess as to when it would be finalized but he is hopeful that next week it move from the Senate to the Assembly. I'll let you know when the bill moves forward.

Scott

PS: Like you Mommy, Adriana knows that her scores of 80 on each of the National Boards is probably too low for admission to an IDP. So she, like you, is counting on the bench test renewal. You write very well and that is a skill that Adriana is very envious of. Each of you have your own strengths and abilities. Rejoice in those that you have and strive for those that you desire.

 

[Dentisthusband]

Oops!

Forgot that photo I said I would attach. Her she is with her favorite storybook.

Scott

 

[explorer2010]

She is beautiful, Scott.

guys- don't give up, it's tough time for everybody, but there is light at the end of tunnel.
Good luck, everybody.

 

[sck]

Hey Scott,
She is cute..
Hi friends,
I was sailing in the same boat as u guys... waiting endlessly for the bench. My husband tried hard to get a good job in CA and we moved here from the east coast in Oct 02, right before the Duggans classes hoping to take the bench in Feb 03!! and then it got postponed to May 03, i with some friends went to Sacramento to submit the application before a week! and so far i have never got a chance!! in the meantime though i applied to UCLA and got interviewed and accepted.. I was very reluctant about going to school as I want to go back tomy country some day and dont want to be in these huge debts... But then i have reconciled with the fact of going to an IDP program looking at all the brighter aspects of the programs.
Like everyone else i have gone thru the turmoil, but managed to remain cheerful and happy, thanks to the blessings of the Almighty and the love of my husband.. afterall like all of us here believe, happiness is within and is not determined by degrees, bench, dentistry etc etc!!

 

[sadanand]

hi everybody ,

here i am one among u .

I have completed my masters & practised for a while in my country & stand nowhere now .
Right now , i am working as an assistant , with out any pay , as my visa doesnt allow me to work . I should say that the dentist i work for is extreamly nice to me , & lets me do minor things . still its nowwhere near what i used to do at home .
I am an endodontist , & now am busy handing the instruments & sterlising them . it pinches somewhere .
Everything said , i have a score of 91 in part 1 , 87 in part 2 , & 2040 in GRE . still i cant do anything , because with my plans of eventually settling in my country , i cant thnik of all the debts i will have if i go to school .
So right now , i cant do anything but to wait , wait & wait .

But one good thing is , i dont have to pay the credit card bills , as my husband not only does that , but has let me buy everything i hope will be useful one day for the bench !!!!! its only his emotional & moral support thats keeping me going .......
But i do miss my work a lot !!!!!! hopefully GOD willing i will be back to one of the things i love the most ....dentsitry & specifically endo !!!!!!!

 

[gsmm]

while reading this thread i became very emotional i feel the micarle of part 3 will happen one day and all these lovely people who didnt give up despite the tough life and responsibilities shall find there way in this country and get their licenses. God bless all of you guys.
i am in the same situation..i dont want to lose hope ..school is very hard for me because of my baby kids..i wish people who are responsible for the extension read this thread and support us.
i had my dental office in my home country, now i am not accepted as a dental assistant in many places i applied too

 

[mommyr]

for some reason i have trouble opening your daughter's picture scott but i'll keep trying

i am attaching my little sabrina's picture too

 

[mommyr]

beautiful scott! i just opened it, here's another one of sabrina

georgia

 

[wcl]

You write beautifully. It brought tears to my eyes.... I know it is hard for you.... I have been thru the same and the feeling of dispare is very dishartening.... Like you I too tried for the bench in 2002 but was unsuccessful.... so I took the eligibility exam the last two times ..... thnkfully I got accepted in U of Manitoba this year. All I can do is advise you not to give up hope and put in all your effort towards applying in various universities.... Something good will definitly happen I am confident

If you need any help or advise i am always available 24/7

all the best
regards
wcl

 

[yasi]

hi wcl
would you please share with us about the experience in university of manitoba and your ee score and alsohow was the interview and practical exam and also how many student did they accept?
thank you so much

 

[wcl]

my EE score was 84,toefl 291,ielts 8.5
the U of Manitoba selects 20 candidates for an interview in dec of each year....of these they select up to seven candidates for the program depending on availability of seats.... this year they selected 5 the previous year 4
as far as I see EE score is not the main criteria for selection for an interview as I met a couple of ppl for the interview with 74 and 75. how ever a good ielts score 7.5 or above is very imp. further they look into your academic record and how experienced are you as a dentist.

The interview is a 5 day affair

the first two days are for practice and an interview session of half hour per candidate. the interviewers are usually 2 professors from the Dpt of EnglishI think they are mainly scaling the level of english profeciency and interpersonal skills

the next two days are reserved for hand skills crown preps and cavities are performed on maniquins in full clinical simulationsdon't worry ample of time is provided to perform the task

the last day comprise of a 2 hr OSCE ie they provide us with various radiographs, slides and cast and ask us multiple choice questions on them.....this is followed by a tour of the universtiy and a chance to meet current students and professors over lunch

regards
wcl

 

[ketu229]

mommyr, sadanand,dentisthusband ,sck

Its great that you are facing this bravely, but dont worry GOD is going to get something very good for you.
Since I have am not familiar with the hassels of bench test I cannot advice you on that, but yes I am sure you will paid for your hard efforts very soon.

ketu

 

[Meggs]

Wcl, thank you for posting your experience. In this forum we have gotten many questions about Canadian experience, but not many responses.

I think the people interested in the Canada pathway should post information like this in the "Links of interest...." thread. Just a thought....

 

[Dentisthusband]

Hi Mommy,

Nice photo of your daughter. I hope no one thinks that we are too sentimental posting the photos. Our own world wide web photo album. Good luck on the modeling gig.

I have news on AB 1467 and I will post it on the other thread.

Scott

 

[mommyr]

Dear wcl,

It was nice chatting with you on the phone this afternoon. You lifted my spirits up. With the way things are going I might hold off retaking the EE and concentrate on preparing for the Bench.

mommyr

 

[sadanand]

hi ,
mommyr , u r daughter & dentist husband u r daughter , r soo cute .


talking about the bench again , i was wondering how many of us have started practicing for the bench , if any one has whats the rate , i mean how many preparation per week ??
cause as we all know the typhodonts r soo soo expensive to keep practicing everyday , & also its hard to concentrate & think that we r not wasting on something we arent sure of !!!!!!

 

[ToTaLLy_TaSha]

Mommyr!

Its your 2nd year "anniversary" on SDN!!! (feb 2002-2004) --> c, im observant Congrats!!

Thank you for your insightful inputs and the emotional, 'real' touch u have given this forum.. our best wishes go out to u and everyone else hoping to take the cali bench.. we're rooting for u guys all the way!!!

Tasha

 

[Chuchuca]

Hi you all,

I am curious about how you guys are preparing for part3.
Please list materials, review classes, how many prep/ per week...Anything can help, I am kinda of lost and do not know where to start.

Thank you

 

[sadanand]

hi ,
same here , really dont know how to start where to start !!!!!
& since we dont have any idea when the bench's going to be , i wonder if we should really consider seriously practising ???

chuchuca , i guess we should decide on if we need to take the bench prep course , if sow hich one ??
as of now , with all the survey i ahve conducted , i have concluded that duggans is the best , so am just waiting for them to announce the short course !!!!
any feed back will be appreciated .

 

[Chuchuca]

sadanand, I really do not know where to go. I have heard good things about UOP, UCLA and Duggan' review classes, but nothing that made me decide yet. Only one friend took the UCLA classes and passed first attempt. I saw her reviews notes and they seem all right, but I would love to compare with Duggans and UOP notes. My friend told me that she received excelent tips on how to take the exam and time managment, plus, she practise a lot at home.
And yes, I believe we should start with the practising process.

Anyway, please people " HELP US" all ideas, any ideas are welcome .

 

[Chuchuca]

By the way sadanand, why did you choose duggan?

 

[Dentisthusband]

Based upon what I have heard from candidates who have failed and candidates who have passed the exam, the UCLA course is the best and yields the highest chance for success.

If you have obtained any copies of a course sylabus then you have enough info to start parcticing at home. If you are unsure of what you need to practice then reread my post in the forum etiquette and FAQs.

Scott

 

[sck]

Originally posted by Dentisthusband
Based upon what I have heard from candidates who have failed and candidates who have passed the exam, the UCLA course is the best and yields the highest chance for success.


Not necessarily.. according to me, Duggans is the best, UCLA is too fast, too expensive.. anyways, for all the people who want to start practising from now, i can say that it is kind of early!! this is from my experience and people like me who were sure they will sit in the exam in Feb 03, then they postponed the exam to May and we still kept practising vigorously, taking mockboards, spending a fortune of instruments and teeth.. and when we didnt get selected for May, we still didnt stop practising!!!! as we were almost certain we will get a chance in August and then it didnt happen for us in August either!!!!!!!!!!!!
the bench exam was atleast certain then, but now everything is in the air.. starting from "if there is going to be a bench", "if so, when", "if in a particular month, will ALL of us be selected",, "who will get a priority" (in may we learnt 15 days before the exam that we are not in!!!!!!!!!!!!!) And last but not the least, i just dont mean to be discouraging, all of us know the pass rate- 25-30% in the last few exams..
i am sure that everyone has their own opinion, but in my opinion, bench is the most uncertain thing in America!!!!!

 

[shreyas]

hi,
i really appreciate all of u guys who r waiting so patiently for bench. & sincerely believe something good will certainly happen.& since they have this rule now tht it will be limited to memebers who wud have taken their part 2 by dec 2003 . i think u will stand a fair chance.i know its frustrating when u put in so much of time & hard work, but certainly it will pay off.have faith .

 

[Chuchuca]

Hi sck,

could you please tell me the difference between both classes. What made you choose Duggans, besides cost?

Thanks

 

[sck]

hi,
There were a lot of my seniors who took the Duggans course and nobody even thought about UCLA because it was very clear that for bench, the Duggans course is much more beneficial than UCLA. also, a friend of mine took the UCLA and she regretted it a lot, we practised together and i used to show her all the Duggans techniques and she started using those techniques over what they taught in UCLA.. There are mock boards, exam simulations, they give u video tapes of the preparations, its on the whole a very comprehensive course for the bench..
eg.. if u take MOD onlay prep, Duggan's way is much easier to grasp and learn with practise than UCLA's.
hope this helps.

 

[sadanand]

hi chuchuca ,
i do agree with sck . i mean even i have heard that duggans offers better course than UCLA , which is way to expensive as well .
& i also heard some people took UCLA course who failed in the first attempt , took duggans second time .
well we should say it is individual's preference l & also ability to grasp r learn things in a particular way .
but s i have heard that for bench duggans is the best .

 

[Chuchuca]

Thank you all. I am still thinking , but soon I will have my answer

 

[wcl]

i just wanted to add that I took the duggans course and was very impressed. Dr. Duggan may be expensive but he did train us very well and in a very organized manner. The most impressive part were how simple he made it for us to take the bench

right from selecting which tray system to use, equiliberating the typhodont and how to manage time during the test.....were taught . I definitly recommed Duggans course to anyone

PS:- Just wanted to ask dentalhusband.....if the bench test is for sure going to happen this year and is it true that only candidates who have completed their part1 and 2 by 2003 will be permitted to take the test?????

regards
wcl

 

[kosha]

hi wcl,
yes ...everyone who has passed part1&2 before 2003 dec r eligible.......
which yr did u pass from dyp i from dyp too

 

[sadanand]

hi ,
duggans has announced a short term course r a condensed course for the bench exam . from next month r so .
i have few doubts , any reply will be appreciated .


firstly has it got anything to do with the passing of the bill ?? because once when i had called the duggans study institute to enquire about the short term courses , they had told me that they will announce it only after the bill is passed .....

secondly , the instructor for this course is "Orest frangopol " .. will it make a difference ?? i mean i have heard dr.duggan teaches really well ., but havnt heard anything about Orest frangopol .


any info will be highly appreciated .

 

[sck]

My friend took classes with Orest, and he is a pretty good teacher. i dont have any clue about passing the bill..

 

[kosha]

hi sadanad ;
dr orset is a good teacher .... my freinds all have lreaned uinder him and he is really nice .....dr duggan speaks of him often ... belive me veven if the bill dose not passs i think i have ehnaced my skills a lot my attending duggans ..ya i kow lot of momey just to enhance skills but i feel it is worth it

 

[sadanand]

hi ,
thanks a lot sck & kosha .

i ahve one more question kosha , do u have any idea about the accomodation options available near the duggans institute , for people who take course , & who dont belong in & around LA ?
thanks again .

 

[sck]

Originally posted by kosha
hi sadanad ;
dr orset is a good teacher .... my freinds all have lreaned uinder him and he is really nice .....dr duggan speaks of him often ... belive me veven if the bill dose not passs i think i have ehnaced my skills a lot my attending duggans ..ya i kow lot of momey just to enhance skills but i feel it is worth it

U r very right... even if we dont get to take the bench.. the skills have improved so much.. i look at my preps when i started and my preps when i was close to giving the exam.. and i cant say that the same person did it!!!!!!!!

 

[gryffindor]

Originally posted by sck
U r very right... even if we dont get to take the bench.. the skills have improved so much.. i look at my preps when i started and my preps when i was close to giving the exam.. and i cant say that the same person did it!!!!!!!!

I am in a regular 4-year DDS program but I have been following the California bench test and other threads in this forum to see what problems international dentists seem to have. If you are practicing dentists in your home countries, how are you seeing your preps and skills improve that much? Aren't you being taught the same principles of tooth preparation? Why is it that this course has you doing your work & preps so drastically different than what you were taught and are used to doing?

I'm just curious to know, I get the feeling sometimes from this forum that many students feel there are too many barriers to becoming licensed in the US when you are already a dentist in another country. Then I read posts like this and wonder if all these "barriers" are in place only to ensure that those with the better clinical skills believed to be on par with the "American standard" are licensed to practice.

 

[Meggs]

Originally posted by griffin04
... Then I read posts like this and wonder if all these "barriers" are in place only to ensure that those with the better clinical skills believed to be on par with the "American standard" are licensed to practice.

That's how it's supossed to be...... but if the rest of the world's dentists had such lousy skills, as these "barries" seem to prove, then how's the world dental health copping? 'cause the bench test has roughly 50% pass rate.

But anyway, what you mention is the "principal purpose" of the "barriers".

 

[Meggs]

Originally posted by griffin04
If you are practicing dentists in your home countries, how are you seeing your preps and skills improve that much? Aren't you being taught the same principles of tooth preparation? Why is it that this course has you doing your work & preps so drastically different than what you were taught and are used to doing?

Griffin, as soon as you head out of school, you'll realize that 3/4 crowns are not as popular in the "real world" as they are in US schools. The same with amalgams. As a matter of fact, I haven't done a single amalgam since I got out of school.

And, I didn't even knew what a 3/4 crown was until I saw the bench test prep course material and took UOP bench test. We don't taught those 'cause they are "obsolete". But in the rest of fixed prostho preps I had plenty of practice.

Yes, they are the same principles, but in bench test they'll fail you by a 2 angle degree difference in a tapered wall, by a 0.3 mm difference in a cut wall or floor. Does this makes any sense?

 

[elto]

Hey Meggs, No amalgams????? How do you do it.... I mean for many patients is a good ( and only) option......most insurance companies cover only amalgam for posteriors, the patient have to pay extra for bonding......and even here in America there are people that can not afford it.........Is it different in your country???
And about the 3/4 I agree with you....I haven't seen one single tiny one in the real world, I don't even remember the prep....
I think they choose that one only for tests....(nobody remembers, nobody will pass

 

[gryffindor]

Thanks meggs. I do understand about failing b/c of a 2 degree angle difference in taper. I am currently practicing for my upcoming NERB (North East Regional Board) exam in May and we have to adhere to and pay attention to similar criteria for our bridge preps and root canals and other clinical areas to pass.

The rest of the world is coping with the dental skills of its national dentists. However, we often have international patients in our clinics and some of my classmates have earned a lot of clinic credit re-doing foreign dental work (some even on their own family members). This isn't to say all non-US dentists are incompetent. But when you see dental work like this in these patients after seeing what we are expected to learn and do in school, it makes sense why the ADA has the International Dentist Programs in place to try and and keep some even standards of dentistry in our country - or at least to teach everyone the same standards before going into practice in the USA.