2017-2018 heme/onc cycle

[visari]

Hi guys. Please help me rank the following programs. I am interested in malignant Hem/BMT and academics. No geographic or weather preference. This is my tentative rank list.

1- Mayo Rochester
2- Columbia
3- NIH
4- Duke
5- Yale
6- University of Chicago
7- University of Maryland
8- UPMC
9- OSU
10- University of Minnesota
11- Baylor
12- Georgetown
13- Montefiore
14- Tufts
15- Methodist hospital

I would greatly appreciate any input. Thank you!

Good list as it is. Fair warning though, when it comes to malignant hem Mayo Rochester is really strong in myeloma and lymphoma. Leukemia/MDS/BMT definitely fall behind. Arguably, UMinn is stronger in those areas

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[visari]

what is more important - A renowned mentor in a low tier program or a reputable program? I have identified a mentor who is really good, well published, well connected,active in bench and translational research but is from a relatively low tier program on my list . I know a lot of people change their preferences when they start fellowship so I don't want to limit my options.

if you're leaning towards private practice (even by a little bit), go to the place that has a more well rounded clinical experience with more autonomy and a good continuity clinic.
And yes, people change preferences during fellowship. I'm looking back at my fellowship class and pretty much everybody changed their plans.

 

[visari]

Leaning towards solid tumor and academics. No regional preference and am flexible with city size. I have finished interviewing and these are my rankings thus far. Let me know what you all think !

1. Northwestern
2. University of Chicago
3. University of Minnesota
4. University of Iowa
5. UTSW
6. Indiana University
7. University of Florida
8. University of Arizona
9. MUSC
10. UIC

Great list but I would agree with @gutonc that I would personally push UMinn down a little if my focus was solid tumors. Definitely below UTSW and or even below Indy if you have any interest in GU or Lung.

 

[BMT/Heme]

Good list as it is. Fair warning though, when it comes to malignant hem Mayo Rochester is really strong in myeloma and lymphoma. Leukemia/MDS/BMT definitely fall behind. Arguably, UMinn is stronger in those areas

Thank you. I kind of had this feeling when I went there. Do you think Columbia would be a stronger place in those?

 

[BMT/Heme]

I am not sure if this was brought up earlier but I am really not sure about communication with programs after we are done interviewing and kind of submitted our rank list. I heard a lot of people saying that they will contact their top 3 or so programs but I am not sure this is a good idea. If I contact my second choice saying I will rank them highly they will know that it is not nb 1 and if it is a competitive place that is looking to have all people who ranked them 1, it will actually hurt. What do people here with expertise think? Do you think we should only contact nb 1 and nobody else or even not contact anyone? Also, in terms of having people contact on our behalf, would you ask for support in top 1 or even more than that? I would really appreciate your input.

 

[HOIV]

I am not sure if this was brought up earlier but I am really not sure about communication with programs after we are done interviewing and kind of submitted our rank list. I heard a lot of people saying that they will contact their top 3 or so programs but I am not sure this is a good idea. If I contact my second choice saying I will rank them highly they will know that it is not nb 1 and if it is a competitive place that is looking to have all people who ranked them 1, it will actually hurt. What do people here with expertise think? Do you think we should only contact nb 1 and nobody else or even not contact anyone? Also, in terms of having people contact on our behalf, would you ask for support in top 1 or even more than that? I would really appreciate your input.

Programs should be ranking based on who they want. I wouldn't rank my 20th person first over my favorite person because the 20th person said they were ranking me one and the best candidate did not. I told one institution I was ranking them number one and matched there. I am confident that the tie breaker is telling someone they are your number one if they cannot decide where to rank you vs someone very close to you in terms of candidacy. Then I'd rank the person who expressed considerable interest higher.

 

[visari]

I am not sure if this was brought up earlier but I am really not sure about communication with programs after we are done interviewing and kind of submitted our rank list. I heard a lot of people saying that they will contact their top 3 or so programs but I am not sure this is a good idea. If I contact my second choice saying I will rank them highly they will know that it is not nb 1 and if it is a competitive place that is looking to have all people who ranked them 1, it will actually hurt. What do people here with expertise think? Do you think we should only contact nb 1 and nobody else or even not contact anyone? Also, in terms of having people contact on our behalf, would you ask for support in top 1 or even more than that? I would really appreciate your input.

No need for post-ranking communication as it almost never changes the outcomes. If you're itching to do something, send a short email to your #1 telling them you're ranking them 1st. Don't send these vague "you are high on my list" emails to other places.

 

[BMT/Heme]

Thank you @visari and @HOIV. This is really helpful. Do you think phone calls change the outcome? and if so shall we ask for help with our nb 1 or even top 3?

 

[Img heme]

anybody has some thoughts on lsu Shreveport? Have interview there but little scared about weather? How is the program? Website is not much informative though. Any thoughts will be appreciated.

 

[gutonc]

Thank you @visari and @HOIV. This is really helpful. Do you think phone calls change the outcome? and if so shall we ask for help with our nb 1 or even top 3?

A phone call is unlikely to change anything. But having your PD, or Hem/Onc clinical/research mentor who knows you well, reach out to 1 (and only 1) program isn't unreasonable.

That said, most people don't do that and wind up just fine.

 

[BMT/Heme]

A phone call is unlikely to change anything. But having your PD, or Hem/Onc clinical/research mentor who knows you well, reach out to 1 (and only 1) program isn't unreasonable.

That said, most people don't do that and wind up just fine.

Sounds good! Thank you very much!

 

[BMT/Heme]

UMinn should probably be higher if you're looking for Leukemia/BMT, but it's fine as it is.

Thank you very much! That is helpful!

 

[gutonc]

Posted for another use who wishes to remain anonymous:
"Hoping to get some feedback regarding my tentative rank list. Geography is not a concern, as these are all desirable cities to live in. Interested in academics, Lung and GI.

1. Moffitt
2. Vandy
3. Colorado
4. University of Florida
5. UNC
6. University of Miami

Thanks again"

 

[HOIV]

Posted for another use who wishes to remain anonymous:
"Hoping to get some feedback regarding my tentative rank list. Geography is not a concern, as these are all desirable cities to live in. Interested in academics, Lung and GI.

1. Moffitt
2. Vandy
3. Colorado
4. University of Florida
5. UNC
6. University of Miami

Thanks again"

My order would be different albeit with a geographical bias:

1. Colorado (lung)
2. Vandy
3. UNC (Geo preference)
4. Moffitt (didn't like when I interviewed, fellows made call seem too easy and didn't like the vibe)
5. UF
6. Miami

That's a good list anyway. Vandy was my #2 when I matched at my #1. Nashville is a great city but I chose a better geographic fit for me.

 

[oncothromorphic]

Help w ranking please. I'm interested in solid tumors and specifically clinical trials as well as translational research in biomarkers and cancer genomics

1. Northwestern
2. Uchicago - strong clinical and research but only saw three fellows the entire interview day
3. Michigan - great well rounded program but location is an issue
4. Mayo - obviously great but location
5. Hopkins - only 1 year clinical exposure and double boarding is discouraged which is off
6/7: Cornell vs Columbia - please help with this, which program is stronger in trials?
8. Mt Sinai - great program clinically but I'm not so sure about research
9. NIH - poor clinical training from my impressions but most impressive in terms of sheer research opportunities for fellows
10. NYU - fellows clinic here appears like a disaster with mostly uninsured/Medicaid patients and poor resources for support
11. Yale - great program but location not so much
12. Wash U - would be in top 5 but moving to St Louis is something ide rather avoid

 

[visari]

Help w ranking please. I'm interested in solid tumors and specifically clinical trials as well as translational research in biomarkers and cancer genomics

1. Northwestern
2. Uchicago - strong clinical and research but only saw three fellows the entire interview day
3. Michigan - great well rounded program but location is an issue
4. Mayo - obviously great but location
5. Hopkins - only 1 year clinical exposure and double boarding is discouraged which is off
6/7: Cornell vs Columbia - please help with this, which program is stronger in trials?
8. Mt Sinai - great program clinically but I'm not so sure about research
9. NIH - poor clinical training from my impressions but most impressive in terms of sheer research opportunities for fellows
10. NYU - fellows clinic here appears like a disaster with mostly uninsured/Medicaid patients and poor resources for support
11. Yale - great program but location not so much
12. Wash U - would be in top 5 but moving to St Louis is something ide rather avoid

A lot of good programs there. It's really hard to justify NYU above Yale and Wash U for anything and especially for solid tumors but you're very unlikely to drop down that much on your list. Otherwise, I can talk myself into ranking that list in 10 different ways but it really doesn't matter. your top 8 at least are all great programs and you clearly have geographic preferences.

 

[oncothromorphic]

A lot of good programs there. It's really hard to justify NYU above Yale and Wash U for anything and especially for solid tumors but you're very unlikely to drop down that much on your list. Otherwise, I can talk myself into ranking that list in 10 different ways but it really doesn't matter. your top 8 at least are all great programs and you clearly have geographic preferences.

Thanks! What are your thoughts on Mt Sinai vs Cornell vs Columbia for solid rumors and especially clinical trials and translation research?

 

[gutonc]

My order would be different albeit with a geographical bias:

1. Colorado (lung)
2. Vandy
3. UNC (Geo preference)
4. Moffitt (didn't like when I interviewed, fellows made call seem too easy and didn't like the vibe)
5. UF
6. Miami

That's a good list anyway. Vandy was my #2 when I matched at my #1. Nashville is a great city but I chose a better geographic fit for me.

FWIW, this is how I'd rank them too...except I'd swap Vandy and UNC...for geographical preference)

 

[HoldTheCoffee]

Help w ranking please. I'm interested in solid tumors and specifically clinical trials as well as translational research in biomarkers and cancer genomics

1. Northwestern
2. Uchicago - strong clinical and research but only saw three fellows the entire interview day
3. Michigan - great well rounded program but location is an issue
4. Mayo - obviously great but location
5. Hopkins - only 1 year clinical exposure and double boarding is discouraged which is off
6/7: Cornell vs Columbia - please help with this, which program is stronger in trials?
8. Mt Sinai - great program clinically but I'm not so sure about research
9. NIH - poor clinical training from my impressions but most impressive in terms of sheer research opportunities for fellows
10. NYU - fellows clinic here appears like a disaster with mostly uninsured/Medicaid patients and poor resources for support
11. Yale - great program but location not so much
12. Wash U - would be in top 5 but moving to St Louis is something ide rather avoid

Great list - disclaimer, I didn't apply to or attend to interviews for all these places, but my top choices would probably be Michigan, Yale, Hopkins, or Wash U in some order but if the geographic concerns are important to you, I think you'll be just fine at any of your top choices.

 

[gutonc]

Thanks! What are your thoughts on Mt Sinai vs Cornell vs Columbia for solid rumors and especially clinical trials and translation research?

Personally?
Columbia
MSSM
Cornell

 

[Pembrolizumab]

Interview invite today !

 

[WhoAmIM]

Interview invite today !

Awesome! Good to know programs are still sending out invites. Which program was this?

 

[WhoAmIM]

Is there any disadvantage in doing just Oncology (solid onc) programs that are only 2 years in duration? I'm not planning on practicing nor interested in being board certified in Heme. My main interest is solid tumors.

 

[HOIV]

Is there any disadvantage in doing just Oncology (solid onc) programs that are only 2 years in duration? I'm not planning on practicing nor interested in being board certified in Heme. My main interest is solid tumors.

It depends on where you want to work. It could be job limiting in the future. That being said, you'd probably be ok if you have an idea of where you want to go and you can see the trend in that area. Most of my soon to be partners are only currently boarded in onc. I plan on doing both boards and keeping them up. I have also found the third year of fellowship to be invaluable from a work life balance standpoint. I have the chance to grow tremendously in my VA continuity clinic without much inpatient service while still being around for conferences and hearing all the new data.

 

[gutonc]

Is there any disadvantage in doing just Oncology (solid onc) programs that are only 2 years in duration? I'm not planning on practicing nor interested in being board certified in Heme. My main interest is solid tumors.

Yes...but...no.

It may look bad to a group you're trying to join, but the reality is that 100% of malignant heme is covered by your Onc training, and 90+% of benign heme could be handled by a gunner M3 with an UpToDate subscription...the rest of it will go to the nearest ivory tower anyway.

I'm single boarded in Onc and 10-15% of my practice is benign heme (and to be fair, half of those are "eval for microcytic anemia" that wind up being colorectal patients of mine). In retrospect, I wish I'd added the extra heme time to my training (instead of the extra 2 years of research).

 

[Kymriah]

Please help with my tentative rank list. I am interested in Hem Malignancies but looking to learn more about all aspects of heme & onc (our favorite interview line), clinical trials and translational research. Future plan is Pharma.

1. Moffitt
2. University of Chicago
3. Georgetown
4. UVA
5. WVU
6. Augusta University

Thanks again

 

[Square[]]

UChicago has a nice clinical pharmacology program. You can also get an MBA from Chicago Booth for free. Amazing choice if pharma is what you are interested in.

 

[mouk]

Is it ACGME policy violation to tell the PD that you are ranking their program #1? Just asking.

 

[gutonc]

Please help with my tentative rank list. I am interested in Hem Malignancies but looking to learn more about all aspects of heme & onc (our favorite interview line), clinical trials and translational research. Future plan is Pharma.

1. Moffitt
2. University of Chicago
3. Georgetown
4. UVA
5. WVU
6. Augusta University

Thanks again

Swap 1 and 2 and call it a night.

 

[gutonc]

Is it ACGME policy violation to tell the PD that you are ranking their program #1? Just asking.

The answer to this is the same as it was when you applied to residency.

No.

 

[Hemeoncres725]

If you're set on solid tumors, I'd move UMinn to 5 and slide Iowa and UTSW up. But otherwise I like it. And if you ignore my advice, you'll be fine.

Thanks for the advice ! I like to think of rankings more as tiers than a specific order with location/feeling you got during interview day/miscellaneous things helping to differentiate the rank within each tier. Would it be fair to say that NW and U of C on my list are in their own tier with iowa/utsw/IU/minn filling out a second tier of relatively equal future job opportunities and training ? or do you think it would be very strange to not bump one of those up to the top tier or down to a lower tier on my list ?

 

[chelseafc26]

Hey guys I was hoping to get some help with my ranking too.
I am an IMG and on a J1 visa so my J1 waiver will likely be in a community setting (barring few exceptions such as Uni of Alabama and Wisconsin that I know of).
Therefore I was thinking of ranking programs with that in mind.
Few questions:
1. Do you guys agree with the ranking. I want to do benign and malignant hem mostly but a 100% sold on that yet.
2. Would it be impossible to get back to an academic centre if I did my fellowship at a community program like allegeny or westchester and then a waiver in the community too.

1 Case Western/Univ Hosps Cleveland
2 Montefiore Med Ctr/Einstein-NY
3 Western Pennsylvania Hosp / Allegeny
4 NYMC-Westchester Med Ctr-NY
5 U Rochester/Strong Memorial-NY
6 CMSRU/Cooper University Hospital-NJ
7 U Arkansas COM-Little Rock
8 U Louisville SOM-KY
9 SUNY HSC Brooklyn-NY
10 Baystate Med Ctr-MA
11 St Elizabeths Med Ctr-MA
12 Univ of Vermont Medical Center
13 Gundersen Lutheran Med Fdn-WI
14 Albert Einstein Med Ctr-PA

I do understand that its not a stellar list like the others posted but any comments and help would be really appreciated.

 

[Img heme]

Hey guys I was hoping to get some help with my ranking too.
I am an IMG and on a J1 visa so my J1 waiver will likely be in a community setting (barring few exceptions such as Uni of Alabama and Wisconsin that I know of).
Therefore I was thinking of ranking programs with that in mind.
Few questions:
1. Do you guys agree with the ranking. I want to do benign and malignant hem mostly but a 100% sold on that yet.
2. Would it be impossible to get back to an academic centre if I did my fellowship at a community program like allegeny or westchester and then a waiver in the community too.

1 Case Western/Univ Hosps Cleveland
2 Montefiore Med Ctr/Einstein-NY
3 Western Pennsylvania Hosp / Allegeny
4 NYMC-Westchester Med Ctr-NY
5 U Rochester/Strong Memorial-NY
6 CMSRU/Cooper University Hospital-NJ
7 U Arkansas COM-Little Rock
8 U Louisville SOM-KY
9 SUNY HSC Brooklyn-NY
10 Baystate Med Ctr-MA
11 St Elizabeths Med Ctr-MA
12 Univ of Vermont Medical Center
13 Gundersen Lutheran Med Fdn-WI
14 Albert Einstein Med Ctr-PA

I do understand that its not a stellar list like the others posted but any comments and help would be really appreciated.

 

[Img heme]

Please need suggestions
Interested in solids

1. University of Kentucky
2.university of Cincinnati
3. University of Oklahoma
4. West Virginia University
5. University of Louisville
6. LSU Shreveport
7. Lankenau
8. St John
9. St elizabeth Boston
10. Marshall University

 

[chelseafc26]

I cant see your response for some reason

 

[Smallmelon]

hello guys, I need some insights ranking these 4 programs. I am interested in solid tumor, especially GI. So far, more leaning towards private practice, but do have phd in cancer biology, and open-minded about academia. Also, if private practice, does it even matter whether trained in big shot place or in a solid community program?

Case
CCF
U of Maryland
U of Cincinnati

Thank you all for any input

 

[gutonc]

Thanks for the advice ! I like to think of rankings more as tiers than a specific order with location/feeling you got during interview day/miscellaneous things helping to differentiate the rank within each tier. Would it be fair to say that NW and U of C on my list are in their own tier with iowa/utsw/IU/minn filling out a second tier of relatively equal future job opportunities and training ? or do you think it would be very strange to not bump one of those up to the top tier or down to a lower tier on my list ?

Yes...but...the tiers aren't so far apart that it really matters.

 

[gutonc]

Please need suggestions
Interested in solids

1. University of Kentucky
2.university of Cincinnati
3. University of Oklahoma
4. West Virginia University
5. University of Louisville
6. LSU Shreveport
7. Lankenau
8. St John
9. St elizabeth Boston
10. Marshall University

Looks fine to me. I'd have Cincy #1 personally, but your order is fine.

 

[gutonc]

hello guys, I need some insights ranking these 4 programs. I am interested in solid tumor, especially GI. So far, more leaning towards private practice, but do have phd in cancer biology, and open-minded about academia. Also, if private practice, does it even matter whether trained in big shot place or in a solid community program?

Case
CCF
U of Maryland
U of Cincinnati

Thank you all for any input

I'd personally flip that list completely upside down and call it a day.

 

[gutonc]

Hey guys I was hoping to get some help with my ranking too.
I am an IMG and on a J1 visa so my J1 waiver will likely be in a community setting (barring few exceptions such as Uni of Alabama and Wisconsin that I know of).
Therefore I was thinking of ranking programs with that in mind.
Few questions:
1. Do you guys agree with the ranking. I want to do benign and malignant hem mostly but a 100% sold on that yet.
2. Would it be impossible to get back to an academic centre if I did my fellowship at a community program like allegeny or westchester and then a waiver in the community too.

1 Case Western/Univ Hosps Cleveland
2 Montefiore Med Ctr/Einstein-NY
3 Western Pennsylvania Hosp / Allegeny
4 NYMC-Westchester Med Ctr-NY
5 U Rochester/Strong Memorial-NY
6 CMSRU/Cooper University Hospital-NJ
7 U Arkansas COM-Little Rock
8 U Louisville SOM-KY
9 SUNY HSC Brooklyn-NY
10 Baystate Med Ctr-MA
11 St Elizabeths Med Ctr-MA
12 Univ of Vermont Medical Center
13 Gundersen Lutheran Med Fdn-WI
14 Albert Einstein Med Ctr-PA

I do understand that its not a stellar list like the others posted but any comments and help would be really appreciated.

Arkansas and UVM need to be higher than Downstate. Rochester should probably be top 3 as well.

 

[ipilimumab2017]

Hi, currently, I am a research fellow Non ACGME accredited (for example, leukemia, lymphoma, melanoma) and involving in clinical trials. I went to 3 interview places and program directors asked me that " Will my name be in publications from clinical trials"?
What is the reason behind this question? What do PDs want to know? and How should I answer?
I answer that only Principal investigators' names will be in publication. Is it a good answer?
Thanks.

 

[mouk]

Hello all. I need help ranking my list as well. I am interested in solid tumors in general, GI in particular. I prefer to work at a teaching instituation with research/clinical trials background:

1. Baylor at Houston
2. University of Oklahoma
3. Uni of Minnesota
4. Case
5. Methodist Houston
6. LSU Shreveport
7. Karmanos
8. Henry Ford
9. SUNY upstate
10. Cooper

 

[gutonc]

Hello all. I need help ranking my list as well. I am interested in solid tumors in general, GI in particular. I prefer to work at a teaching instituation with research/clinical trials background:

1. Baylor at Houston
2. University of Oklahoma
3. Uni of Minnesota
4. Case
5. Methodist Houston
6. LSU Shreveport
7. Karmanos
8. Henry Ford
9. SUNY upstate
10. Cooper

Why Karmanos and HFH so low?

Ignoring geography (and longtime members will know my abhorence for TX), I'd say:
Baylor/UMinn
Karmanos
Case/HFH
OK
Whatever

 

[WhoAmIM]

Yes...but...no.

It may look bad to a group you're trying to join, but the reality is that 100% of malignant heme is covered by your Onc training, and 90+% of benign heme could be handled by a gunner M3 with an UpToDate subscription...the rest of it will go to the nearest ivory tower anyway.

I'm single boarded in Onc and 10-15% of my practice is benign heme (and to be fair, half of those are "eval for microcytic anemia" that wind up being colorectal patients of mine). In retrospect, I wish I'd added the extra heme time to my training (instead of the extra 2 years of research).

Thank you. The only reason I thought single board would be just fine is because of the sheer volume. Practicing all of Hematology & Oncology is literally impossible I feel. Everyone gravitates towards one or two sub specialties and they try to become experts at it. My thought process is if I'm going to become an expert at solid tumors, why should I even keep up with Heme? Not like I'll be inducing acute leukemias anyways.

 

[gutonc]

Thank you. The only reason I thought single board would be just fine is because of the sheer volume. Practicing all of Hematology & Oncology is literally impossible I feel. Everyone gravitates towards one or two sub specialties and they try to become experts at it. My thought process is if I'm going to become an expert at solid tumors, why should I even keep up with Heme? Not like I'll be inducing acute leukemias anyways.

You say that now....

 

[premedUVA]

Posted for another use who wishes to remain anonymous:
"Hoping to get some feedback regarding my tentative rank list. Geography is not a concern, as these are all desirable cities to live in. Interested in academics, Lung and GI.

1. Moffitt
2. Vandy
3. Colorado
4. University of Florida
5. UNC
6. University of Miami

Thanks again"

Unless things have changed in the last year, the call schedule for Colorado is absolutely brutal. It's essentially q4 call split between the first year fellows. Moffitt on the other hand had so many fellows it felt like they were never on call. Great for lifestyle, but personally was looking for something between the two.

Lung in Colorado IMO is second to none, however. Basic science is strong, great crosstalk with pulm/cc faculty, and fantastic mentorship (specifically Doebele)

 

[mouk]

Why Karmanos and HFH so low?

Ignoring geography (and longtime members will know my abhorence for TX), I'd say:
Baylor/UMinn
Karmanos
Case/HFH
OK
Whatever

Really? Karmanos ahead of case?

 

[Square[]]

Anderson, Sloan, Farber, and Hopkins fellows have historically been able to secure ~90% of ASCO YIAs.

What’s your opinion on the programs like Penn, UW, UCSF, NCI? Any specific reason the fellows seem to be slightly behind academically?

 

[HoldTheCoffee]

Anderson, Sloan, Farber, and Hopkins fellows have historically been able to secure ~90% of ASCO YIAs.

What’s your opinion on the programs like Penn, UW, UCSF, NCI? Any specific reason the fellows seem to be slightly behind academically?

As someone who's at one of the places on the YIA-heavy list you mentioned, I'm not sure it's fair to use the ASCO YIA success rate as the sole metric for comparing programs. Don't get me wrong, I'm happy to be where I am but I definitely wouldn't consider a colleague at the Hutch or Penn to be "academically behind" me.

 

[chelseafc26]

Arkansas and UVM need to be higher than Downstate. Rochester should probably be top 3 as well.

Awesome. Thanks a lot!!