USC cost of attendance is 130K for the 1st year

[sumin5924]

What year did she graduate and what was her four year cost of education? Someone from a generation ago is a terrible reference. Four year cost of education, across all schools on average has DOUBLED since 2001. Debt to income ratios are skyrocketing and the market in California is concerning.

I remember asking you this before but I'm not quite sure if you responded. It's relevant information if you're going to be telling people that paying off that sum is going to be easy.

Don't count on a response. He always beats around the bush.

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[fogorvostan]

What year did she graduate and what was her four year cost of education? Someone from a generation ago is a terrible reference. Four year cost of education, across all schools on average has DOUBLED since 2001. Debt to income ratios are skyrocketing and the market in California is concerning.

I remember asking you this before but I'm not quite sure if you responded. It's relevant information if you're going to be telling people that paying off that sum is going to be easy.

So true. My brother finished dental school at Stony Brook in 1999. When he was helping me pick schools, he could not even believe how high the tuition had become in less than 20 years.

 

[bb2014]

What year did she graduate and what was her four year cost of education? Someone from a generation ago is a terrible reference. Four year cost of education, across all schools on average has DOUBLED since 2001. Debt to income ratios are skyrocketing and the market in California is concerning.

I remember asking you this before but I'm not quite sure if you responded. It's relevant information if you're going to be telling people that paying off that sum is going to be easy.

I didn't see this but she graduated 2002. The 4 years was about 275k plus interest. I asked her what her first 5 years salary looked like and it ranged from 108k to 135k per year. Today she's making almost double that at 220k per year while on the process of opening another practice. Cost of tuition has almost doubled, but so did her salary....here in saturated California. She does complain about insurance companies though. A lot. I'm not saying that paying off the sum is easy. I'm saying it's do-able.


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[Scumbag_Steve]

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[Incis0r]

I didn't see this but she graduated 2002. The 4 years was about 275k plus interest. I asked her what her first 5 years salary looked like and it ranged from 108k to 135k per year. Today she's making almost double that at 220k per year while on the process of opening another practice. Cost of tuition has almost doubled, but so did her salary....here in saturated California. She does complain about insurance companies though. A lot. I'm not saying that paying off the sum is easy. I'm saying it's do-able.


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I don't think it's fair to assume that a new dentist, right out of school, will be able to command a 220K salary which took your mom 14 years to achieve (not to mention the fact that she wouldn't be able to get financing to open another practice with significant student loans).

I know dentists 4+ years out who are at a corp making ~140-150K. Everyone assumes that they're going to go and set the world on fire right out of school and command $200K incomes, and then reality hits.

You need to do an apples-to-apples comparison.

Debt-to-Income Ratio for your Mom: $275K debt before interest/$121.5K pre-tax starting income (I averaged your 108 and 135K) = 2.26

Debt-to-Income Ratio for a current USC grad: $452.5K before interest/$120K average pre-tax starting income (assuming you work at a corp with the standard $500/day offer) = 3.77

In other words, a USC grad is going to be having nearly 170% of the difficulty that your mom had. Not equivalent by any means.

But wait- that number is actually somewhat inaccurate because your mom had low interest rates, and today's USC grads will have higher interest loans (~7%). Furthermore, your mom only had to pay interest on $275K of loans...today's USC grads will pay interest on $452.5K loans....so not only is the interest rate higher, but the amount of capital they pay interest on is much larger.

 

[Silent Cool]

I don't think it's fair to assume that a new dentist, right out of school, will be able to command a 220K salary which took your mom 14 years to achieve (not to mention the fact that she wouldn't be able to get financing to open another practice with significant student loans).

I know dentists 4+ years out who are at a corp making ~140-150K. Everyone assumes that they're going to go and set the world on fire right out of school and command $200K incomes, and then reality hits.

You need to do an apples-to-apples comparison.

Debt-to-Income Ratio for your Mom: $275K debt before interest/$121.5K pre-tax starting income (I averaged your 108 and 135K) = 2.26

Debt-to-Income Ratio for a current USC grad: $452.5K before interest/$120K average pre-tax starting income (assuming you work at a corp with the standard $500/day offer) = 3.77

In other words, a USC grad is going to be having nearly 170% of the difficulty that your mom had. Not equivalent by any means.

But wait- that number is actually somewhat inaccurate because your mom had low interest rates, and today's USC grads will have higher interest loans (~7%). Furthermore, your mom only had to pay interest on $275K of loans...today's USC grads will pay interest on $452.5K loans....so not only is the interest rate higher, but the amount of capital they pay interest on is much larger.

The USC debt is more than 452.5K because the interest compounds from day one. If we assume 7% interest, then at graduation the debt is about 541K. If that person does a GPR for a year, then it compounds to 579K. The other issue is that back in the good ol' days the principal and interest I believe were tax deductible and the rates were very low, like below 2%. So the modern debt to income ratio is more like: 4.5-4.8.

 

[Incis0r]

The USC debt is more than 452.5K because the interest compounds from day one.

I agree, but he gave his mom's loan amount at "$275K before interest," so I wanted to do an apples-to-apples comparison which is why I gave $452.5K (total USC cost of attendance without interest).

Good calculations.

 

[Silent Cool]

I agree, but he gave his mom's loan amount at "$275K before interest," so I wanted to do an apples-to-apples comparison which is why I gave $452.5K (total USC cost of attendance without interest).

Good calculations.

Gotcha. Yeah, these loans are out of control.

 

[Silent Cool]

I agree, but he gave his mom's loan amount at "$275K before interest," so I wanted to do an apples-to-apples comparison which is why I gave $452.5K (total USC cost of attendance without interest).

Good calculations.

The other issue is that the schools keep raising the costs every year. So, if a person has some undergrad debt, say 30K, then we are already at about 600K at USC with current costs. Someone starting now will end up paying higher than the listed costs currently, so that person with some undergrad debt will be sitting probably at about 650K of debt. Holy **** balls. And there are more dental schools opening and dental therapists want to compete against dentists. Wow. Not to mention the cost of specialist training, which at USC would take one comfortably over 1 million.

 

[Advance]

The other issue is that the schools keep raising the costs every year. So, if a person has some undergrad debt, say 30K, then we are already at about 600K at USC with current costs. Someone starting now will end up paying higher than the listed costs currently, so that person with some undergrad debt will be sitting probably at about 650K of debt. Holy **** balls. And there are more dental schools opening and dental therapists want to compete against dentists. Wow. Not to mention the cost of specialist training, which at USC would take one comfortably over 1 million.

It's a scary thought isn't it?

 

[hellofuturedentists]

The other issue is that the schools keep raising the costs every year. So, if a person has some undergrad debt, say 30K, then we are already at about 600K at USC with current costs. Someone starting now will end up paying higher than the listed costs currently, so that person with some undergrad debt will be sitting probably at about 650K of debt. Holy **** balls. And there are more dental schools opening and dental therapists want to compete against dentists. Wow. Not to mention the cost of specialist training, which at USC would take one comfortably over 1 million.

I can't even fathom that

 

[frozenicecreamDMD]

what is up with darknightzzz that @bb2014 and cal dental keep referring me to.

Great, two con-USC users have been banned, this thread will die down and future pre-dents will miss out on this.

to answer your question, I think most dental schools I attend to don't really have much to offer either. some have minor problems while one has major problems.

 

[Incis0r]

Great, two con-USC users have been banned, this thread will die down and future pre-dents will miss out on this.

I'm observing this pattern too, and it is concerning. In case I don't get to say it to you all later, it's been a true pleasure to be a fellow SDNer with you all

 

[hellofuturedentists]

what is up with darknightzzz that @bb2014 and cal dental keep referring me to.

Great, two con-USC users have been banned, this thread will die down and future pre-dents will miss out on this.

to answer your question, I think most dental schools I attend to don't really have much to offer either. some have minor problems while one has major problems.

I haven't been paying close attention, but if I had to guess, they probably didn't just get banned for discussing the cons of attending USC. Having calm and rational discussions is encouraged on SDN. Attacking others or getting belligerent isn't really (again, haven't really seen their posts, but if they're exceptionally rude or inflammatory, that might do it). If you and @Incis0r and others continue to inform potential applicants in a nice manner, I don't think you would get banned.

 

[allantois]

Watch USC buy this forum to silence critics

 

[frozenicecreamDMD]

Rest in Peace

my fellow critics

musicplease

Confused321

anyways, USC clearly has experienced a drop in application number, last time I had an interview there in Nov, they only received 1800 app, which is much less than the applications regular private schools receive (above 2000) and much less than public schools (mid 2000)

you should go to USC specific thread to read on how some users accepted to USC don't even know both types of loans for dental school are "unsubsidized" and are shocked when they realize they "have interest while still in school" "have loan fees". and they are surprised at 6.8% interest on the loans while the undergrad counter part is only 3.5%

if they dont know this, i dont think they even plan that far ahead for loan repayment yet.

 

[OrphanageCaretaker]

I don't understand why threads like these keep popping up, yes, USC is a very expensive school, too damn expensive if you ask me. If you don't want to pay the tuition, don't apply. If you get in and it's your only choice, either you're going to go or you'll decline the acceptance and apply to other schools. Simple as that.

 

[distressstudent]

I don't understand why threads like these keep popping up, yes, USC is a very expensive school, too damn expensive if you ask me. If you don't want to pay the tuition, don't apply. If you get in and it's your only choice, either you're going to go or you'll decline the acceptance and apply to other schools. Simple as that.

That's kind of the point. People don't want to pay that high of a tuition, but they still apply. The thinking is that when you're making 150k salary with 400k estimate cost of attendance, you can easily pay that off within a few years because 400k/150 is not even 3. I knew that crossed MY mind when I was just a college student with a rudimentary understanding of finance. It's April of this year cycle, and someone just found out that graduate loans aren't subsidized...

"If you get in and it's your only choice"
That's what we want to avoid. When applying to schools, students have options and we want to them to know they have options. Pre-dents are desperate; they take what they can get. We have all been there. But we also have a limited budget when applying to dental school. Some students might look at their list and think "well USC is my safety school and a few others. my list is fine" That's how all my friends were; when making a list, they prioritized applying to safety schools and that's what they spent their budget on. When you're desperate for an acceptance, you don't worry about what comes after. For many pre-dents, the reality of a dental career doesn't hit them until they have an acceptance in hand. Dental admission is an awfully stressful process; can you imagine stressing yourself out even more by calculating your debt/income ratio for a school you might not even get into? When the letter comes, it is already too late to apply to cheaper schools. Just look at how often interest in HPSP spikes after dec 1.

Students have options. Don't get comfortable with the idea of attending a 500k school and exercise those other options. You don't want to find yourself in a situation where USC is your only acceptance.

 

[molarbear8895]

Does anyone know about the financial aid packages the USC offers?

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