med school and debt

[gostudy]

I am currently applying for med school for the 2006 entering class. I thought it would be better to ask a more experienced lot than the pre-allos about debt and med school. Is $100,000 in debt a really huge burden like many pre-meds make it out to be? It seems to me like it's one extra bill you will have to pay in the future but not something that's gonna do you in. If anyone has any advice or a link to a previous thread discussing this topic that would be great. Thanks.

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[Lonestar]

I am currently applying for med school for the 2006 entering class. I thought it would be better to ask a more experienced lot than the pre-allos about debt and med school. Is $100,000 in debt a really huge burden like many pre-meds make it out to be? It seems to me like it's one extra bill you will have to pay in the future but not something that's gonna do you in. If anyone has any advice or a link to a previous thread discussing this topic that would be great. Thanks.

let me put it to you this way. you will have done more schooling than just about any other profession in the world, you will be in debt for years, minimal pay for years, your debt continues to accrue interest during your education, you find out that financially many physicians are not making as much as they used to, cost of living has skyrocketed, you will be seeing more patients in the future than the current group of physicians, you will be doing more paperwork...blah, blah...

Lets say: you make $150k after residency. Take 40% out for taxes and such. now you are left with 90K. your 100K in loans had matured to 140K by the time you finish paying the loans. so you pay 25K per year for the next six years. 90k-25K. now you are left with 65k. Ask yourself this question, do i feel lucky? Oh wait, by the time you realize that you need to get out, its too late!!!! you are sucked right in and can't get out. But it gets better. That 150K gross is up for grabs. Medicare cuts payments and guess what a 4% cut will mean another few thousand dollars down the drain. Then, next year medicare will cut payments again!!!!!

 

[gostudy]

let me put it to you this way. you will have done more schooling than just about any other profession in the world, you will be in debt for years, minimal pay for years, your debt continues to accrue interest during your education, you find out that financially many physicians are not making as much as they used to, cost of living has skyrocketed, you will be seeing more patients in the future than the current group of physicians, you will be doing more paperwork...blah, blah...

Lets say: you make $150k after residency. Take 40% out for taxes and such. now you are left with 90K. your 100K in loans had matured to 140K by the time you finish paying the loans. so you pay 25K per year for the next six years. 90k-25K. now you are left with 65k. Ask yourself this question, do i feel lucky? Oh wait, by the time you realize that you need to get out, its too late!!!! you are sucked right in and can't get out. But it gets better. That 150K gross is up for grabs. Medicare cuts payments and guess what a 4% cut will mean another few thousand dollars down the drain. Then, next year medicare will cut payments again!!!!!

I guess it depends on your point of view...clearly anyone getting into medicine for the cash is out of their mind. Still, I think a lot of people in this forum have a skewed since of reality. Hell, compared to most people in this country I feel lucky to make 65K doing something I love (medicine) regardless of the training I have to do to get there. There are so many out there doing jobs they hate and making nothing for it. Nonetheless, my question is dealing more with the idea that going to a school where you would be $100,00 in debt versus one where you would be $25,000 in debt would screw you for life (assuming comparable caliber of schools). In my mind I don't see any difference in the two in the long run. Correct me if I'm wrong

 

[EctopicFetus]

If you have 2 equal schools why wouldnt you go into a school thats cheaper.

the 75K difference amounts to about $450 per month at 6% interest if you pay over 30 yrs.

The other poster mentioned a salary of 140K, this is pretty low for docs. I dont know what they are telling premeds but the average docs salary is more in the neighborhood of 200K (across all specialities). Now Peds makes the least, they do earn around 140K if they arent specializing. Otherwise you are looking at 150-170K for family, 170 of so for Medicine, 250+K for Surgery, etc..

 

[GoPistons]

this post is more appropriate here:

not only have you lost 10 years of potential investment returns, you are entering a field that is subject to huge cuts from congress year in and year out...

every year congress votes to increase their own salaries... surprising??... when at the same time they vote to freeze all medicare payments to physicians... it has been happening every year...

when these baby boomers all qualify for medicare expect even more drastic cuts... nobody is going to pay for their care... the simple solution is to just cut reimbursements... it is faulty to presume greater demand = greater pay... in medicine it is the exact opposite... orthopedics, rads, anesthesia, any of them, all specialties are on the chopping block... no specialty is immune... peds and internal medicine were just hit first...

financially speaking, medicine is probably one of the poorest choices one could make right after undergrad... the only poorer ones are probably PhD in something that has no economic viability (such as PhD in French)...

not only will you guys ironically be in the highest tax bracket when you are finished with residency, you will have more debt than any other profession by far...

of course you can say this is great! I'm an MD... yeah... all the respect and whatever that comes with... just don't expect to be the richest person on your block, you will probably be one of the poorest until maybe your 55th birthday... and then you will realize that everyone else around you has a pension (minimal need for a sizeable nest egg) and you have been funding your retirement yourself for all these years...

I would definitely not recommend medicine to anyone in this day and age unless they truly would do medicine even if it paid minimum wage...

in short, go to the cheaper school...

 

[EctopicFetus]

Did you just copy and paste your other post.. cause I swear this looks familiar

 

[GoPistons]

yes,

that's why I wrote the caveat: "this post is more appropriate here"

 

[Doctor Bagel]

speaking of going to the cheaper school, is it worth shelling out extra money to get an md instead of a do behind your name? if so, why? this is my current dilemma. i'm not currently planning on doing anything like optho, ortho, rad, etc. i also should mention that i like the whole osteopathic thing but am wondering if it would be easier to only have to take the usmle, not worry about a stupid traditional rotating internship and silly residency programs that always prefer md's to do's regardless of individual qualifications.

 

[GoPistons]

my advice would be to go with the MD... a DO is just not going to give you all of the opportunities you want... such as what if you decide to become a health care executive, work for pharma, be director of a large private practice group, work in the WHO... etc.

Of course there are some DOs that do all these things but the MD will just make your life much much much easier... they are not equivalent degrees and don't let anybody convince you otherwise...

a nurse practitioner with 30 years of experience is better than a 3rd year medical resident but guess who gets more credibility?? This is the same way...

Anyway, financially speaking, you will make more as an MD so your extra investment in the degree would be prudent...

 

[EctopicFetus]

Anyway, financially speaking, you will make more as an MD so your extra investment in the degree would be prudent...

Could you please explain this? Are you saying that because you will have more options to go into higher paying fields? or are you saying a DO doing Peds (for example) makes more than an MD doing Peds..

The latter is not true..

 

[EctopicFetus]

BTW go MD, more options.. and you wont have to explain to people that you ARE a doctor.

Truth is you might have an idea of what you want to do now but that might change and even if you want to do FP, Peds or IM (the least competitive) there are still some top notch programs there that might not take DOs.. Thats just my opinion!

 

[GoPistons]

no what I'm saying is... if an MD and a DO were to go into Peds... they would start with the same starting salary but the promotions/financial rewards/opportunities to make partner would on average go to the MD >>>> DO... thus the MD should expect a greater overall average yearly income than a DO...

 

[EctopicFetus]

no what I'm saying is... if an MD and a DO were to go into Peds... they would start with the same starting salary but the promotions/financial rewards/opportunities to make partner would on average go to the MD >>>> DO... thus the MD should expect a greater overall average yearly income than a DO...

Agreed thanks for the clarification!

 

[Doctor Bagel]

no what I'm saying is... if an MD and a DO were to go into Peds... they would start with the same starting salary but the promotions/financial rewards/opportunities to make partner would on average go to the MD >>>> DO... thus the MD should expect a greater overall average yearly income than a DO...

I honestly don't buy that. My understanding is that once you're in a practice or field, the DO/MD distinction goes away. The salary info for DOs is the same as the salary info for MDs. Also, I don't want to do anything like pharm, research or business stuff. My only concern is getting a residency, and it's hard to get good information about that here at SDN.

 

[EctopicFetus]

I honestly don't buy that. My understanding is that once you're in a practice or field, the DO/MD distinction goes away. The salary info for DOs is the same as the salary info for MDs. Also, I don't want to do anything like pharm, research or business stuff. My only concern is getting a residency, and it's hard to get good information about that here at SDN.

Well the salary info is true, but the opportunities are just much greater for MDs.

Any way you cut it the MD doesnt close doors, the DO does close some even into residency. Take a look at what people are saying on here. Every DO I have met and I have met many from CCOM, and they will tell you to a man that they cant get into every program. Most MDs if they are qualified can.. DOs even if they are qualified can not.

 

[robotsonic]

speaking of going to the cheaper school, is it worth shelling out extra money to get an md instead of a do behind your name? if so, why? this is my current dilemma. i'm not currently planning on doing anything like optho, ortho, rad, etc.

Go with MD! You may think that you aren't interested in any competitive fields right now, but you have no idea what you will like once you start clinical rotations. (I was 90% sure I was going to be a neurologist until I started third year and fell in love with surgery!) If you find out later that you really want to do ophtho, or rads, or whatever is competitive that year, it will be much harder to get into residency. Also, even if you go into a less competitive field, the top residency programs will probably not be available to you, as they often do not interview DOs.

 

[GoPistons]

I honestly don't buy that. My understanding is that once you're in a practice or field, the DO/MD distinction goes away. The salary info for DOs is the same as the salary info for MDs. Also, I don't want to do anything like pharm, research or business stuff. My only concern is getting a residency, and it's hard to get good information about that here at SDN.

You have certainly been talking to too many DO admission reps... the difference of the two degrees is large... and you will only close doors for yourself...

Obviously, I don't know you but you went to law school and are now going into medicine so your past behavior certainly reflects that your plans for the future may change... you may want to be a neurosurgeon after medical school is done... you never know... don't close doors that you could have kept open...

doors almost fully closed with DO = ophtho, rads, derm, rad/onc, neurosurgery, ENT, the list goes on and on... i'm not even talking business, pharma, consulting, that list is just residencies

 

[EctopicFetus]

And the ones that arent fully closed are certainly much harder to get into..I got reamed for saying this before, but it is painfully true.

 

[Finally M3]

no what I'm saying is... if an MD and a DO were to go into Peds... they would start with the same starting salary but the promotions/financial rewards/opportunities to make partner would on average go to the MD >>>> DO... thus the MD should expect a greater overall average yearly income than a DO...

Actually, the opportunity to make partner would depend on how much revenue the said physician would be able to bring in. I don't think MD v. DO matters all that much (except maybe explaining to patients the diff) once you're an attending in a private group...it's all about the $$$

MD v. DO DOES effect residencies, however. Even if there are DO residencies for Derm or Rads...there are many allo residencies who don't look at DO applicants

BTW, how did this thread get hijacked?

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Actually, the opportunity to make partner would depend on how much revenue the said physician would be able to bring in. I don't think MD v. DO matters all that much (except maybe explaining to patients the diff) once you're an attending in a private group...it's all about the $$$

MD v. DO DOES effect residencies, however. Even if there are DO residencies for Derm or Rads...there are many allo residencies who don't look at DO applicants

BTW, how did this thread get hijacked?

I guess I hijacked it, even though my question is very similar to the op's initial (well, second, and apparently primary) inquiry. It is a good question -- how much of a factor should money have in our decision-making? DO v. MD, Harvard v. State U, etc. are just variations on the theme.

Okay, so better questions. Did you consider financial matters when picking your school? Did you regret/not regret your decision? What amount of money is trivial enough to not factor into a decision?

 

[EctopicFetus]

So in a weird way this is an MD vs DO thread. Bottom line, DO = fewer opportunities, dont think people can argue that..

$$ did not play a factor since my girlfriend at the time (wife now) was in chicago so I had to do what I had to do.. No regrets obviously!

Look at it like this. Interest rates are going up. at 6% (my guess this would be the avg rate of your loans fed and private for md school) for each $100K in loans you are looking at almost $600 per month to be paid over THIRTY years. If you want to pay it off over 15 years it would be almost $850 per month. I dont know if anyone but the individual can say what amount of $$ is trivial IMO 50K or less would be trivial assuming I liked that school more. In the end.. I dont know if it matters, go where you will be happy.

 

[Sinnman]

they are not equivalent degrees and don't let anybody convince you otherwise...

they would start with the same starting salary but the promotions/financial rewards/opportunities to make partner would on average go to the MD >>>> DO... thus the MD should expect a greater overall average yearly income than a DO...

How should I respond to this.....? Let's see... WRONG

I can't believe some of the BS that is perpetuated on this forum. For the 10,000th time, DO is legally, professionally, academically, and financially equal to an MD. There are good DOs, there are bad DOs. There are good MDs, there are bad MDs.

I will grant you that it is overall harder for a DO to get an MD residency. Since I want to be as fair and unbiased as I can, this statement is true. However, DOs frequently obtain residencies in all fields at allopathic institutions but it will be harder. Hey GoPistons, did you know that there are even some poorly trained, less-intelligent, sub-MD, DOs at Hopkins? Isn't that your ala mater? Why don't you go tell them to their face that they are inferior to you instead of stroking your ego by bashing people on an anonymous internet forum?

Since this topic has been discussed ad nauseam and I'm tired, I will let you search SDN as well as the match statistics on your own. Just do a search.

Can we PLEASE get back to the original point of this thread now?

 

[EctopicFetus]

No need to personally attack the guy.. ohh...

 

[OSUdoc08]

So in a weird way this is an MD vs DO thread. Bottom line, DO = fewer opportunities, dont think people can argue that..

$$ did not play a factor since my girlfriend at the time (wife now) was in chicago so I had to do what I had to do.. No regrets obviously!

Look at it like this. Interest rates are going up. at 6% (my guess this would be the avg rate of your loans fed and private for md school) for each $100K in loans you are looking at almost $600 per month to be paid over THIRTY years. If you want to pay it off over 15 years it would be almost $850 per month. I dont know if anyone but the individual can say what amount of $$ is trivial IMO 50K or less would be trivial assuming I liked that school more. In the end.. I dont know if it matters, go where you will be happy.

For what, exactly?

 

[OSUdoc08]

Actually, the opportunity to make partner would depend on how much revenue the said physician would be able to bring in. I don't think MD v. DO matters all that much (except maybe explaining to patients the diff) once you're an attending in a private group...it's all about the $$$

MD v. DO DOES effect residencies, however. Even if there are DO residencies for Derm or Rads...there are many allo residencies who don't look at DO applicants

BTW, how did this thread get hijacked?

Most will, so why does it matter?

 

[OSUdoc08]

You have certainly been talking to too many DO admission reps... the difference of the two degrees is large... and you will only close doors for yourself...

Obviously, I don't know you but you went to law school and are now going into medicine so your past behavior certainly reflects that your plans for the future may change... you may want to be a neurosurgeon after medical school is done... you never know... don't close doors that you could have kept open...

doors almost fully closed with DO = ophtho, rads, derm, rad/onc, neurosurgery, ENT, the list goes on and on... i'm not even talking business, pharma, consulting, that list is just residencies

Hey troll, there are plenty of DO's in these areas in both ACGME and AOA residencies.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

No need to personally attack the guy.. ohh...

true, but his information does seem to be false. believe me, i don't just truth what the admissions department tells me about matching and salaries and whatnot. however, i do trust match lists, and you'll see that do's go match into the things that gopistons said were impossible to match into.

also, so so few people regardless of md or do match into the super competitive things that i'm wondering if i should even use that as a consideration. for example, i haven't seen anyone at des moines university (one of the do schools i'm considering) match in derm. however, about 3 people matched in derm at the allopathic school i've been accepted to. so i'm looking at 3 out of 160 for 0 out of 200. sure the former is better, but neither are encouraging. chances are i'm not going to be able to do derm no matter where i go to school.

 

[NonTradMed]

no what I'm saying is... if an MD and a DO were to go into Peds... they would start with the same starting salary but the promotions/financial rewards/opportunities to make partner would on average go to the MD >>>> DO... thus the MD should expect a greater overall average yearly income than a DO...

Ok, I'm confused now. I thought promotions were based on how much money you can bring in as a doc or how good of a doctor you are? And I thought contracts you sign as docs would indicate how long before you can make partner in clinics? So are you saying that DOs would not make partners/own their own clinics as much as their MD counterparts? Any stats I can see? Was this from personal experience?

I mean, does this mean that if you go to Harvard you'll always get promoted faster despite providing the same quality of care as the state med graduate?

I have heard medicine is extremely hiearchal...does this attitude extend to what 'rank' your school is as well??

Also, I've seen no stats that indicate that MDs make more than DOs while doing the same job. I honestly would like to see the stats, as I have been trying to decide on schools and want to know what I'm going to expect if I go DO. However, everywhere I look, they base doctor's salaries on types of physicians rather than on MDs vs. DOs.

I'm not trying to say anyone is right or wrong, but everyone is talking, and there's no links or stats or even the old 'my uncle's cousin's yoga master told me this' stories to back up anything.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

Ok, I'm confused now. I thought promotions were based on how much money you can bring in as a doc or how good of a doctor you are? And I thought contracts you sign as docs would indicate how long before you can make partner in clinics? So are you saying that DOs would not make partners/own their own clinics as much as their MD counterparts? Any stats I can see? Was this from personal experience?

Yeah, I'm wondering about that one, too. I seriously doubt any clinic would block a DO from making partner assuming she was bringing in her fair share of revenue. Greed trumps snobbery most days! There was that one job listing which has been posted somewhere on sdn before where some radiology group specifically stated that they wouldn't hire DOs or IMGs, so, yeah, there might be some places that straight up won't hire you, but even that's really rare.

 

[OSUdoc08]

Yeah, I'm wondering about that one, too. I seriously doubt any clinic would block a DO from making partner assuming she was bringing in her fair share of revenue. Greed trumps snobbery most days! There was that one job listing which has been posted somewhere on sdn before where some radiology group specifically stated that they wouldn't hire DOs or IMGs, so, yeah, there might be some places that straight up won't hire you, but even that's really rare.

I do know of clinics that don't want DO's around, but who cares? Just go somewhere else.

In case everyone didn't notice, there is a shortage of physicians and an abundance of jobs in the US.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

maybe it's a bias that exists in the south b/c we have very few DO schools but people just look at DO's differently in my experience. if it doesn't bother you for people to assume what they will, then have at it.

It's always nice to have an MS-2 fighting a battle about matching. Carry on.

 

[OSUdoc08]

maybe it's a bias that exists in the south b/c we have very few DO schools but people just look at DO's differently in my experience. if it doesn't bother you for people to assume what they will, then have at it.

It's always nice to have an MS-2 fighting a battle about matching. Carry on.

Where in the south are you talking about?

This certainly isn't true in Texas or Florida.

 

[EctopicFetus]

I agree that looking at Derm is one thing.. but Add up the residencies GoPistons named and that should give you a better idea.

I know this has been rehashed.. The thing is this.. it isnt totally shut but it does make it harder. ANY DO will admit this. It is darn near impossible for some fields. Rad Onc anyone?

Another way to judge this is to look at everyone who went into Derm or the other competitive fields (using Derm as an example) and see how many of them are DOs. I think these stats are available.

Im not trying to flame at all but people should realize that there is a bias, I am not gonna get into if this is right or not.. but there def is a bias.

 

[hyperbaric]

... they are not equivalent degrees and don't let anybody convince you otherwise...

uh ok.

 

[community]

I wasn’t going to get involved in this useless banter, but I can tell that a lot of you are uninformed.

I am a fourth year DO student who applied to only allopathic residency programs with the COMLEX (the DO board exam for licensure equivalent to the USMLE). I was invited to 19 interviews of which I plan to attend 17. Two of my invitations were at Ivy league institutions, one of which was Harvard.

I also have a classmate who is also a fourth year DO student who will be interviewing at Dartmouth, Brown, Harvard, and Yale. I keep telling her “You go girl!!!!”

I believe that the most important factor in the success of any individual, whether an MD or DO is the individual themselves. If you put your mind to it you will do it, you don’t have a choice! I am not a person who lets someone tell me I can’t accomplish something; in the rare case where that has happened it has made me strive towards my goals with even more perseverance. I know for a fact that I have even more interviews than some of my MD counterparts who applied to the same number of programs b/c I am seeing the same students on the interview trail.

For those of you that don’t know, DO programs have their own residency programs in Ortho, Derm, Optho, etc. I did a Google search and found this DO in radiation oncology ( http://www.lij.edu/lijh/radiation_oncology/rad_oncol_staff.html ). There were many more, but you all need to do the search yourself b/c I have no interest in RadOnc. It is not true that you cannot enter these areas as a DO.

In addition, as DOs we can apply to MD residency programs but they can’t apply to ours which creates more opportunities for the DO students. Keep in mind though, whether MD or DO some programs won’t offer you an interview.

I encourage all of you, whether DO or MD to do your research when it comes to matters rather than talking out of your ass!!!

For any of you interested in osteopathic medicine feel free to PM me if you have any questions.


community

 

[EctopicFetus]

What field are you looking into?

That link has one old fart.. Can you find me a match list with a few Rad Onc'ers? I know DOs have their own programs but there are few. The facts are the majority of DOs and MDs do primary care, but a higher % of DOs do primary for one reason or another. Bottom line is things are harder anyone who doesnt admit that is not paying attention.

A DO has to jump through more hoops and has to prove themselves even more. Now I am not saying that a MD with a 215 step 1 will match derm while a DO with 250 wont.. but all things being equal for the applicants the MD has a decided advantage in many fields.

In addition, as DOs we can apply to MD residency programs but they can’t apply to ours which creates more opportunities for the DO students. Keep in mind though, whether MD or DO some programs won’t offer you an interview.

This is true.. but even though you can apply there are programs who wont interview you. On the EM forum there are some DOs with 250s who didnt get interviews at pretty average programs.

 

[EctopicFetus]

What field are you looking into?

That link has one old fart.. Can you find me a match list with a few Rad Onc'ers? I know DOs have their own programs but there are few. The facts are the majority of DOs and MDs do primary care, but a higher % of DOs do primary for one reason or another. Bottom line is things are harder anyone who doesnt admit that is not paying attention.

A DO has to jump through more hoops and has to prove themselves even more. Now I am not saying that a MD with a 215 step 1 will match derm while a DO with 250 wont.. but all things being equal for the applicants the MD has a decided advantage in many fields.

In addition, as DOs we can apply to MD residency programs but they can’t apply to ours which creates more opportunities for the DO students. Keep in mind though, whether MD or DO some programs won’t offer you an interview.

This is true.. but even though you can apply there are programs who wont interview you. On the EM forum there are some DOs with 250s who didnt get interviews at pretty average programs.

 

[robotsonic]

community,

You are missing the point of many of the posts here. Of course it is POSSIBLE to go into radonc if you have a DO instead of MD. It's possible, but much much more difficult. Also, you didn't mention the field that you are going into. If you are applying in an area that isn't competitive, then of course you got interviews, especially if you did very well at your DO school. As for the "Harvard" residency interview, are you referring to MGH, BWH... or BIDMC?

The fact that you have to include a link to some radonc DO to prove your point actually bolsters my argument. You wouldn't have to do that if it were actually common for DOs to go into competitive fields.

 

[Taus]

There was a great post by "Bones" earlier today on this issue and I couldn't have said it better, so here is a cut and paste:


"The only real restriction is you as an individual. Most of the people who say otherwise have not been through the process themselves (premeds or MS1/2). If you score very highly on COMLEX and interview well you can pretty much choose whatever residency you want (though not always where). There are DO's in many of the top programs in the country. If you plan on doing pain clinic anesthesia, orthopedics or PM/R at a top program DO degree may help you get noticed above the other 150 applicants, since your osteopathic skill really can set you apart.


If, however, you only went DO because you werent competetive enough to get into an MD school, it is much harder to get into some of the top allopathic residencies than it is to get into their medical schools. What makes you think you will fare better? Some of these programs require statistics at the undergrad equivalent of a 3.9gpa and a 40 MCAT score. Additionally, you should know someone who knows the program director personally- almost all the applicants who get accepted have connections like this. Do some out rotations. Also, it helps to have your name on several publications during your first 3 years of medical school. Many of the MD applicants have this. Get on it. These factors are FAR more important than whether you took the USMLE vs the COMLEX. You cant blame your degree for your own personal failures.



There is genuine anti- DO bias at a few backward podunk hospitals in states without DO schools. You may need to take the USMLE to get into one of these places, or they may even exclude you if you take the USMLE. Get over it. For every one like this there are 5 that wont treat your application any differently than the MD applicants and 1 that will prefer you over an MD because of your degree alone. Harvard, U of Wash, Cleveland Clinic and Mayo all openly welcome DO's to their most competetive programs, just to name a couple.

Also, there are several DO-only residencies in some of the most competitive specialties if you're numbers arent good enough for the best allopathic residencies in the country. There are something like 5 DO derm residents here in kirksville. There are several DO anesthesiology residents, several DO surgery residents. This is a very small town. You can get into DO derm or DO surgery residencies with even average numbers if you know the doc and have some charisma... a backdoor way into very high competition fields. I have heard many MD's complain about how unfair this is, and how its so much harder for them to get into competetive specialties than it is for DO's because of this.


The only real restriction with the DO degree is working internationally. This is only true for certain countries, and people are working on it, but it continues to be a challenge. There are many countries that welcome DO's however. If you arent too picky about where you go this isnt that big a deal.



when all is said and done though, ask yourself why you want to be a DO. If you dont have a answer you're happy with- go MD. If you do have a good answer- no restrictions will hinder you."
__________________

 

[EctopicFetus]

Should get interesting.. I will be checking out now..

 

[EctopicFetus]

So I think the OPs original Q has been answered.. I am sick and tired of the MD vs DO thing..

 

[GoPistons]

didn't mean to rip on DOs as some people perceive... DOs are great and I have no bias towards them... the original question was would you go to DO school vs. MD school if you had the choice... and my answer is clearly MD... you can disagree with me and that is fine...

the same question could be asked for being an FMG MD vs. USA MD vs. USA DO... I would pick USA MD every time b/c it has more opportunities... and I would probably be willing to incur approximately $75k more in debt to do it...

I agree that DOs should have all of the same opportunities as MDs... but in the real world it doesn't work like that...

 

[BobaGreenTea]

didn't mean to rip on DOs as some people perceive... DOs are great and I have no bias towards them... the original question was would you go to DO school vs. MD school if you had the choice... and my answer is clearly MD... you can disagree with me and that is fine...

the same question could be asked for being an FMG MD vs. USA MD vs. USA DO... I would pick USA MD every time b/c it has more opportunities... and I would probably be willing to incur approximately $75k more in debt to do it...

I agree that DOs should have all of the same opportunities as MDs... but in the real world it doesn't work like that...

 

[eadysx]

So I think the OPs original Q has been answered.. I am sick and tired of the MD vs DO thing..

IMHO- You seem to dump alot of gas on fire that is the MD vs DO thing to be "sick and tired" of it.

E-

 

[Taus]

my future response to these type of threads is to refer the quote in my signature....

 

[LovelyRita]

I am currently applying for med school for the 2006 entering class. I thought it would be better to ask a more experienced lot than the pre-allos about debt and med school. Is $100,000 in debt a really huge burden like many pre-meds make it out to be? It seems to me like it's one extra bill you will have to pay in the future but not something that's gonna do you in. If anyone has any advice or a link to a previous thread discussing this topic that would be great. Thanks.

A lecture from a financial advisor last year said the most important thing: why hurry to pay back your loans? why transfer your hard earned income back to a bank when they are giving the opportunity to take 30 years to do it? He basically said pay them off over 30 years. Low payments. Enjoy the rest of your $$. or $$$$. or in my case $$$$$$ j/k.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

A lecture from a financial advisor last year said the most important thing: why hurry to pay back your loans? why transfer your hard earned income back to a bank when they are giving the opportunity to take 30 years to do it? He basically said pay them off over 30 years. Low payments. Enjoy the rest of your $$. or $$$$. or in my case $$$$$$ j/k.

with interest rates still being low, i think that makes a lot of sense. i've stretched my law school loans out over the longest payment option available to me. my interest rate is around 3% -- i can easily get 2 to 3 times that rate in my 401k. also, inflation's the friend of all debtors. i think loans should not be at the bottom of the list, but i don't think it makes sense in all situations to put them at the top, either.

 

[Pir8DeacDoc]

also, much like a home mortgage loan, I believe the interest on an educational loan is tax deductible. So it really makes sense to slowly and steadily pay off the school loan and take advantage of that tax break as long as you can.

 

[Doctor Bagel]

also, much like a home mortgage loan, I believe the interest on an educational loan is tax deductible. So it really makes sense to slowly and steadily pay off the school loan and take advantage of that tax break as long as you can.

yes, it is! in fact, i should be getting my statement any day stating how much i paid back in loans this year. i think there might be a cap, though, but i'm not sure.

 

[sddoc]

I love MD's, and I've worked with many of them throughout my education in a major city. However, if anyone ever decides they aren't going to interview me for a position or that they are going to try to pay me less because I am a DO, I can guarantee that my loans are going to go away very quickly when I apply my lawsuit settlement to the remaining balance.