Let's make a Pact

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NewVintage said:
Can you substantiate this ? (the too many specialist part)
From what I have heard there is a planned shortage of all specialists
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What I am saying is that too many people may be entering more highly specialized areas; there are not going to be enough primary care physicians, basic OB/GYN, Gen. Surgery and so on. These specialties pay less compared to cardio, Pulmonology, neuro and so on, and one incurs terrible malpractice fees which leaves one with close to a teacher's salary (in FP, OB/GYN and so on).

Now how does one expect to pay off $175,000 in loans in primary care??? The point is that people want to be rich in this country and a lot of them are pursuing specialization. I will have to find some articles to prove my point....AMA, Middle American and so on.
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Just wanted to inject my 2 cents into this discussion. While it is true that family pratctitioners do not make anywhere near the salary of certain specialists, they certainly do make more than teachers.

The average salary for a family practitioner in the US is more than $125 000 AFTER expences. Although high paid specialist can make ten times that (over a million US dollars net income for ORS spinal surgery) that is still way more than teacher make. The highest paid teachers in the country live in California and they make less than $56, 000.

I agree that the difference in pay is driving medical students to pursue higher paid specialties, especially those like RADS that provide nicer working hours. I just wanted to post this information for anyone interested in family practice who might be scared away by the idea that they would never pay off their student loan.

References:
http://www.allied-physicians.com/salary_surveys/physician-salaries.htm
http://www.educationworld.net/salaries_us.html
 
mdcanuck said:
Just wanted to inject my 2 cents into this discussion. While it is true that family pratctitioners do not make anywhere near the salary of certain specialists, they certainly do make more than teachers.

The average salary for a family practitioner in the US is more than $125 000 AFTER expences. Although high paid specialist can make ten times that (over a million US dollars net income for ORS spinal surgery) that is still way more than teacher make. The highest paid teachers in the country live in California and they make less than $56, 000.

I agree that the difference in pay is driving medical students to pursue higher paid specialties, especially those like RADS that provide nicer working hours. I just wanted to post this information for anyone interested in family practice who might be scared away by the idea that they would never pay off their student loan.

References:
http://www.allied-physicians.com/salary_surveys/physician-salaries.htm

http://www.educationworld.net/salaries_us.html
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Thank you for your input. I was justifying my claim by an article in JAMA that I read....which was quite a bit bleaker. Like I said, I will try to find the copy online since I have it in hard-copy at home.
 
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Teacher- actually if you factor in holidays and summer vacation, 56,000 is about $35/hr
If they worked through the summer, that would add another say 9 weeks of salary- rounding down that is about 12,000. NOw you are up to 68,000. That's not too bad!

Teachers can actually make a decent buck if they do extra things like coaching, detention, or act as chaperones (yes that would increase their work hour). Time like anything plays a role- my mom makes 82,000 at a public high school- no summer school, no coaching, etc. She has been teaching for 20+ years mind you, but she should actually be making a bit more... If you go to administration ie principal, superintendent you hit a healthy six digits (but no more teaching).



You have to remember to that 50,000 is a nice bit of money, but it is not what it was ten years ago.

Just some info to add...
 
I'm from central ontario and I paid for the courier.
 
Only a bit more to go... arghh, would be so dissapointed to get a rejection now.
 
I am with you on that one zeyad. I really would like to go to Trinity. I wish you much :luck: Not too much longer before we hear something.
 
Yeah, its Trinity for me too. And hopefully i'll see you there! Good :luck: to both of us!
 
I'm with you guys! Best of luck to both of you and to anyone else who is still anxiously waiting. :luck:
 
Hey, it's McDuck. For some reason, my email address isn't getting emails from SDN, and I changed it so I had to change it on here. So, I had to get a new name.

Anyway, I just wanted to reiterate that even though I was rejected from RCSI, and I currently don't think I'll be going to Ireland (probably going to be rejected from UCD :p ), I don't think ABP is a bad thing. There was a misunderstanding, most probably on my part, and I said a few less than polite things. Anyway, as I said on another thread, I think ABP is great. They provide a wonderful service to applicants, and I'm grateful they gave me the chance to apply to Ireland. :)

So, I apologize to the ABP and to anyone on here if I gave a negative impression.
 
your a class act Mr McDuck!, im sure no one on here took any really offense anyway. Good luck on the ucd application too by the way no matter if you decide to attend or not!
 
Haha. I'm happy so many people are getting accepted. It seemed like there was a run of rejections, but finally people are getting acceptances. That's great. I'm sure the people that are going will have great experiences, and they will become good docs where ever they decide to end up. And, I'm sure those of us that don't go to Ireland--due to rejection or a decision not to attend--will land right where we are supposed to be. :)
 
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TheDuck said:
Haha. I'm happy so many people are getting accepted. It seemed like there was a run of rejections, but finally people are getting acceptances. That's great. I'm sure the people that are going will have great experiences, and they will become good docs where ever they decide to end up. And, I'm sure those of us that don't go to Ireland--due to rejection or a decision not to attend--will land right where we are supposed to be. :)
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Been wondering where you have been--THE DUCK! Anyway, I still hope you hear something positive from UCD. I also agree with you that whatever someone's situation, I am sure that they will become good doctors wherever they attend or whatever path they are currently meant to follow. I was going to call Trinity as zeyad did, but the fact that the office tells you whether or not you are on their rejection list ( previous list) is a lot of information to digest over the phone....ie, maybe they did not send some letters out yet. I don't care what anyone says, IMG, FMG or Carb. or USMG....it's all relative and we all have to take it one step at a time.
:laugh: Getting into medical school is not clear-cut or guaranteed and therefore, if I get an acceptance to an Irish MD program I will take it and run with it!!!!!
 
Haha, well great :luck: to you! I keep checkin the mail just out of habit and curiosity--nothing today. :( No news is good news I guess.
 
everyone here seems to be hoping to get into rcsi or trinity, am i the only one who wants to get into cork? i feel like i'm missing something here
 
Haha. Well to be quite honest, i've been through all the stress with UK medical schools.. so being told I'm rejected over the phone is no big deal. Although i'm sure having UK backups eases my stress-levels a bit. I've made up my mind though, If i do get into Trinity (hopefully:love: ), its my first choice. Again, good :luck: to us all!
 
hags said:
everyone here seems to be hoping to get into rcsi or trinity, am i the only one who wants to get into cork? i feel like i'm missing something here
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UCC sounds like a great school too. I guess it is because I have visited Trinity...always wanted to go to school there. I also applied to UCC and UCD---trust me, I wish for those to work out as well (any of the Irish schools), although I have heard that they (UCC/UCD) emphasize numbers a bit more. Hence, I am counting on someone, a very dear soul, to look at my entire application rather than base the decision on a simple cut-off.
 
Oh and one more thing. We here on SDN represent a very small number of the applicant pool--duh :laugh:, so I am sure that many more are routing for UCD and UCC than we might know via SDN. :luck: to you all. We are eachother's competition, but I sure hope that we all receive good news.
 
docolive said:
UCC sounds like a great school too. I guess it is because I have visited Trinity...always wanted to go to school there. I also applied to UCC and UCD---trust me, I wish for those to work out as well (any of the Irish schools), although I have heard that they (UCC/UCD) emphasize numbers a bit more. Hence, I am counting on someone, a very dear soul, to look at my entire application rather than base the decision on a simple cut-off.
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I'm not sure that UCC does stress numbers that much. Mine are pretty awful (my BA GPA is so low that even with my BSc GPA of 3.6 the overall GPA for all my courses is about 2.1) and my MCAT score was a 28S (VR 11, PS 8, BS 9), but I got in on the first try. Now that was 4 years ago and they may be looking at different things now, but at the time they were looking at hobbies and outside interests a lot at UCC, which would be the reason I got in (a BA in Medieval Studies and hobbies ranging from archery to fused glass work through painting and gardening, volunteering with Girl Guides and at the children's hospital in Halifax and jobs ranging from running an information service for families with children with special needs to walking the tortoise at the Museum of Natural History). Like getting into medicine anywhere these days, it is a total crap shoot. The best strategy is to apply everywhere you can realistically see yourself going to study and then hope you get in somewhere. It's all supposed to be an objective process, but as a veteran of 3 interviews at Dal (3 years running and not one acceptance), I can tell you that it isn't close! Good luck. Cheers,
M
 
UCD doesn't stress numbers at all...I got in without the mcat and not great marks...Don't fret, its still sooooooo early and many people will be accepted into June! I know that's not great news for you but a june acceptance is better than a rejection!
 
How come some people will have to wait till June?
 
I check my online banking religiously. It's funny, though--I didn't think I really wanted to go anymore, but I keep dreading a rejection everytime I go to the mailbox. Maybe I do want to go, and I'm just trying to convince myself I don't in case I get rejected. :rolleyes:
 
TheDuck said:
I check my online banking religiously. It's funny, though--I didn't think I really wanted to go anymore, but I keep dreading a rejection everytime I go to the mailbox. Maybe I do want to go, and I'm just trying to convince myself I don't in case I get rejected. :rolleyes:
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That's probably the case. It's better not to care too too much about the outcome because anything other than an acceptance can be disheartening. Not to mention, it is a major opportunity for some of us.
 
zeyad said:
How come some people will have to wait till June?
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I guess it's just how they review the applications periodically...they may decide to make a few offers now and wait until more applications (late) come in. Then make some more offers and so on...all depending on the response of the offers made.
 
Hey guys just got my acceptance inot the 6 year program at rcsi, magic trevor or anyone else of this who got in wanna send me a PM and chat about it a bit?

Good :luck: too everyone else who's still biting their nails ( i know mine are down to the bone after this week), its still early and im im sure some people who've already been selected will elect not to go, so more spots could open up later too.
 
Yeah, but I think about what I'm planning on doing and going to Ireland, and I actually prefer the former. I guess I just hate to lose/get rejected. :laugh:
 
Well, I got my RCSI rejection for the 4 year program today. but i also got a Georgetown Med interview and and and Albany med interview at the same time! so i guess i'm more happy than sad. maybe i shouldn't have talked about how much I love Cork at my interview and how i've never actually been to Dublin.
 
Hags:

I was hoping for Cork but got the big 'no thanks' letter a while back.


Firemed
 
TheDuck said:
Yeah, but I think about what I'm planning on doing and going to Ireland, and I actually prefer the former. I guess I just hate to lose/get rejected. :laugh:
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Yeah, I understand the part about getting rejected. I never want to lose either, and that is why we, rather than lazy bums, are pursuing these careers. :laugh: I think that your opinion may shift toward the latter option upon receiving an acceptance. Looking at apartments gets me excited....more than I should be right now. :hardy:
 
I'm not doing anything about looking stuff for Ireland, because I know if I do, I'll get rejected. :laugh:

But, actually, I'm pretty set on staying here. I'm thinking of going into biomedical engineering. In the OR the other day, I had to teach a doctor how to use a certain catheter and guide him through the operation. Knowing the mechanics of how it worked, etc. was really cool. It actually excited me more than doing the operation. :laugh:
 
Do you mind if i ask how old you are Mr. mcduck/ The duck lol, you seem to have so much work/research experience but you said you were applying for the 6 year program, correct?
 
got my acceptance today in ontario for the 4 year program (regular air mail). its a little bit of a dilemma...6,500 euro deposit? or wait unitl mid may to hear from the canadian schools. i'm torn.
 
bananaboat said:
got my acceptance today in ontario for the 4 year program (regular air mail). its a little bit of a dilemma...6,500 euro deposit? or wait unitl mid may to hear from the canadian schools. i'm torn.
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Awesome (for RCSI?)! Ok, what I would do is first call the school and see if they can work out a refund policy (doubtful of this)....perhaps describe your situation or ask them if they can extend the offer for just a few more weeks into May.
option 2) defer the acceptance to next fall
option 3) Just take it!!!! :laugh:
congratulations.
 
Well, my friend was accepted to RCSI's 4-year program, and he said the deposit is due Apr 27, so your plan of waiting until May would mean not attending RCSI. Also, the deposit is non-refundable, which means if you give it and decide not to go, they keep it. If you think about it, that's fair, because by sending in your deposit, you're holding a seat for yourself; if you decide not to go, that's a lot of money they lose. The deposit is kind of an insurance in case you decide not to go--at least they get something.

And, I'm 23.
 
Another week and not a single word from anywhere! Sigh.

Well, it's off to work for me! See y'all Monday!!
 
hags said:
everyone here seems to be hoping to get into rcsi or trinity, am i the only one who wants to get into cork? i feel like i'm missing something here
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Lots of people don't want to go to UCC because they've only heard of the biggest city in Ireland. So I think a lot of people don't consider UCC from the get go. Either Cork or Trinity have had the highest admission marks for Irish students each year in recent history. I think UCC's been second to Trinity for the last 2 years.

Maybe a lot of people like living in bigger cities as well. Personally, I prefer Cork because it's smaller. Dublin is hard to get around and when I lived there I shared a room in a crappy old apartment with another guy for the same rent I'm paying now for my room in a nice, new apartment. The cost of living in Dublin was killing me. And while Cork is only 180k people, it's so much more compact then cities are in Canada. My home city is 300k people and Cork feels about 5 times as big cause it isn't so spread out.

So yeah, hope to see you around Cork! Good luck.
 
bananaboat said:
got my acceptance today in ontario for the 4 year program (regular air mail). its a little bit of a dilemma...6,500 euro deposit? or wait unitl mid may to hear from the canadian schools. i'm torn.
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I think a bird in the hand is worth two in the bush. I'd pay the deposit. Either you don't get into Canada and then at least you're in somewhere or you do get into Canada and you lose 6.5k. If you don't pay, you could easily end up getting in no where and then kicking yourself for being so thrifty next year.

I know it's a lot of money though! Tough decision.
 
Definitely agree. If you can afford it, pay the deposit so you at least have somewhere to go in the Fall.

Today there's mail, but it hasn't come yet. I know I won't be getting an acceptance today, so I'm just hoping there's no rejection. :laugh:
 
okay, but i think i'd actually prefer to go to trinity over rcsi. should i call up trinity and see where my app stands? or if they coudl tell me? so i could give them my deposit instead of RCSI?
 
Called trinity up earlier in the week, they said they'll start making decisions within a week or 2. (Although as some of you know, they've been saying that for around 1 and a half months now).
 
i was just reading over the letter that rcsi sent me, i applied for the 6 year program... when my accpetance came i was pretty stoked so i read through the rest of the aceptance package quickly. Today i was reading it again and it turns out i got into the 5 year program?!
Im finsihing up my second year of university this month so im wondering if this could factor into their decision somehow? I remebered in the interview they said specifically how would you feel about re-dooing some courses, because "MOST LIKELY" you would have to recomplete the foundation courses.
Has this happened to anyone else or have they ever heard of this, because i was half wondering if it was a typo, but ABP doesn't seem like the organization to send out a letter with a major typo in it...?!
Good :luck: to eveyone still waiting to hear back, i still got my finger crossed about my UCD application because going there would save a pile of money lol..
 
Hello all,

A big congrats to all of those who have recieved acceptance letters and best of luck to all that are still playing the waiting game. I have a general question to all of those who have been accepted. What did you include on your application, other that your marks and MCAT scores? In other words, what do you think set you apart from the rest of us? also, what advice could you give the regected folks or people planning on applying next year that might increase there chances? Any info would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers,

Fish Man
 
Fat Head,
first the mcat scores and gpa are the foundation to your application, in general if they are up to par you have a shot, then its everything else on your application that takes you the the next step.
One thing that helps alot is believe it or not sport involvement, alot of medical schools like to know that applicants can say cooperate with people (like you would on a sports team) and your used to relating with peopl (all the social things that go along with it). Medical schools arn't just looking for people who can memorize a text, they want people who posses the character traits of a good doctor on top of the intelligence. Also Volunteering is huge, It shows that your compationant empathetic etc...... Great traits for a doctor to posses. Not to mention if you do both of the things i mention above it shows you can multitask which is key to becoming a good physician. On the admisiins essays dont ramble on about how being a doctor is all youve wanted to do since you were a kid, be specific if you have a personal experience (private or not) that drove you to this career say it. My father and mother had cancer, i talked about it in my essay, then during my interview the comitte specifically brought that up, personal stories like that make lasting impressions. Finally during the interview itself dont search for the yearbook answer on everyquestion they ask. The point of the interview is for the committe to get to know you, not listen to all the bull**** you memorized before hand. Sure do your homework and have alot of info in your head, but be honest and confident in the interview, say whats really on your mind, if you make it to this point they're trying to talk you into going to their school just as much as your trying to get it.... Anyways thats a few things that i found helped me...
good luck to people still waiting, and good luck next year to anyone re applying!
 
supernova,
I just received admission to the 6 year program but I am just completing my 2nd year as well, at McGill. I was wondering what courses you have taken, or whether you specifically indicated that you wanted to surpass the foundation year.
I'd really like to be able to do the same as it would save a TON of money.
thanks!!
 
I was under the impression that you had to have a degree and MCAT scores in order to be considered for the 5-year programs at any of the schools, but that's pretty awesome that they're pushing you into that program! :thumbup: I'd definitely go for it. If you have to repeat courses, that might mean taking a heavier load the first year, or--hopefully not--doing the regular 6 years, but having a lighter load the first year. I doubt they'd make you do that though. What would be the point? Anyway, congrats.

As far as deciding between RCSI and Trinity, if Trinity had made offers already, you could call and tell them that you have an acceptance elsewhere, but would prefer to go to Trinity--that would basically give them an incentive to expedite your decision. But, they haven't made offers yet, so that likely won't do any good. If decisions really will be out next week, I'd just wait and see; you have until April 27th to send your deposit into RCSI, I believe.
 
Im not sure what happend to be honest, im going to call before i send my deposit to see if its a mistake or not. But im really hoping its not, and if it isnt a mistake i dont think there would be anyway to change the offer they give you, they seem pretty strict on taking what your given and commiting the 6,500 asap. I've got a friend who graduated from RCSI a few years back, im gouing to call him tomorrow and see if its common practise or whats the deal, im kinda leaning towards its a typo tho, but ill let you know what he says KDP... But no i didn't ask about the 5 year at all, if it is correct they decided to admit me on their own. and im a Biochemistry student, so ive completed all the foundation sciences and englishs in my first year, and this year i completed all the organic chemistrys, a gentics courses, intro biochemistry, food sciences.. things along those lines
and KDP29 drop me a pm with your email address, ill look you up on msn, i wouldnt mind haveing a chat about all this ireland business lol.

Mr. McDuck do you have you undergraduate already? because you said you had a 4.0 gpa (i asumed that was from uni) i ask because wouldnt you be better off getting the m cat out the way and applying to the 4 or 5, over the 6?
 
One of my roommates started at RCSI this year as a first year med in the five year program after only doing two years of undergrad.
 
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