California Northstate Accreditation Discussion

[prettycat]

im very concern with the last part...he is saying" if we dont get accreditated u will get a degree"
if he was hoping they will get accreditated next year he wouldnt say that....

isnt that a way of saying" we wont get accreditated at all but u will get a degree"???

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

im very concern with the last part...he is saying" if we dont get accreditated u will get a degree"
if he was hoping they will get accreditated next year he wouldnt say that....

isnt that a way of saying" we wont get accreditated at all but u will get a degree"???

Yea I think its a strange thing to say, he knows the results...so if they were accredited then it would be useless to throw that hypothetical in the email.

Who needs a degree from an unaccredited school? lol...

I wonder what the graduates of 2012 will do?

 

[prettycat]

ya byebyebeautiful,

his trying to prepare people for the news...tution is due on july 23...maybe thats what they are waiting for

i think 2012 graduates are jobless...unless they pass the neplex and have connection so a few might find a job that way...but this economy...a degree from unaccreditated school worth nothing....

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

ya byebyebeautiful,

his trying to prepare people for the news...

i think 2012 graduates are jobless...unless they pass the neplex and have connection so a few might find a job that way...but this economy...a degree from unaccreditated school worth nothing....

I was under the impression that you can only take the NAPLEX if your school is accredited?

 

[prettycat]

i think u can take it even if its not...according to his email u can take the neplex regardless

 

[prettycat]

he is tying to play games ....i rather for them to come out and say it ...than playing stupid games.....im a 32 years old woman ...i dont need this kindda games ...how old he thinks we are 12???

im so disappointed

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

Gee, that sounds like another indicator of being denied accreditation! He is giving a lot of info on what to do with your unaccredited degree.

 

[prettycat]

loooooooooooooooooooooool,

exactlly....his not only trying to say we didnt get accreditated but his trying to say dont get ur hopes up ...we might not get accreditated at all and u will end up with an unaccreditated degree..but no worries u can take the neplex..i already have one nonaccreditated degree not need another one

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

loooooooooooooooooooooool,

exactlly....his not only trying to say we didnt get accreditated but his trying to say dont get ur hopes up ...we might not get accreditated at all and u will end up with an unaccreditated degree..but no worries u can take the neplex..

Well CNCP is a for profit school. Maybe they just want to squeeze some more students out of money and then quit the business of pharmacy school with the loan money of poor poor students :'(

 

[RobertHorry]

Prettycat, twentytwelve2,

can you please copy and paste the email into the forum? i have much at stake here

thank u

 

[RobertHorry]

Prettycat, twentytwelve2,

can you please copy and paste the email into the forum? i have much at stake here

thank u

please show us the email from the dean today

 

[prettycat]

i agree byebyebeautiful....

the email freaks me out...we are dealing with dishonest people...not acceptable

 

[pig rx]

please show us the email from the dean today

Calm down. Check your junk inbox. Are you on the wait list? The email was sent to the wait listers too.

 

[RobertHorry]

Calm down. Check your junk inbox. Are you on the wait list? The email was sent to the wait listers too.

sorry for being excited, i am on the waitlist, they must not have put me on their mail list...if someone kind enough PM me, please show me the meail.

thank u!

 

[robw02]

What can be reasonably gathered from the email is a confirmation that the school was not granted full accreditation this year. He says its confidential, but one has to think if it was good news, he would probably share it with everyone immediately. Additionally, it seems sketchy with everything else thats been going on that the "official" public release date of the decision is 7/24, and the tuition deadline for fall semester just happens to be due 7/23...

I agree that there is a lot of shadiness on the part of the school with all of this. Big thanks to whoever contacted APCE and got them to update the site early. Given the information we have, I think the class of 2016 especially has to take the next couple of weeks to seriously explore other options. With the school not being accredited, it has only one more chance in June 2013. But obviously there is no guarantee, and having failed once already (twice if you count the delay from pre-candidate to candidate), what confidence should we have right now that it will succeed next year.

One thing I am unsure of is regarding graduates who pass the Naplex with the school under candidate status. If what he says is true, then the class of 2016 would be able to sit for the Naplex upon graduation. But as some have stated already, would our licences be any good if the school is unaccredited? And even if they are, would anyone want to hire a pharmacist from an unaccredited school?

Currently I'm leaning towards not going anymore because given what we now know, the risk seems too great. This is extremely disappointing, but at the very least for the class of 2016, we have the opportunity to cut our losses without a significant financial burden but nothing to show for it.

 

[RobertHorry]

What can be reasonably gathered from the email is a confirmation that the school was not granted full accreditation this year. He says its confidential, but one has to think if it was good news, he would probably share it with everyone immediately. Additionally, it seems sketchy with everything else thats been going on that the "official" public release date of the decision is 7/24, and the tuition deadline for fall semester just happens to be due 7/23...

I agree that there is a lot of shadiness on the part of the school with all of this. Big thanks to whoever contacted APCE and got them to update the site early. Given the information we have, I think the class of 2016 especially has to take the next couple of weeks to seriously explore other options. With the school not being accredited, it has only one more chance in June 2013. But obviously there is no guarantee, and having failed once already (twice if you count the delay from pre-candidate to candidate), what confidence should we have right now that it will succeed next year.

One thing I am unsure of is regarding graduates who pass the Naplex with the school under candidate status. If what he says is true, then the class of 2016 would be able to sit for the Naplex upon graduation. But as some have stated already, would our licences be any good if the school is unaccredited? And even if they are, would anyone want to hire a pharmacist from an unaccredited school?

Currently I'm leaning towards not going anymore because given what we now know, the risk seems too great. This is extremely disappointing, but at the very least for the class of 2016, we have the opportunity to cut our losses without a significant financial burden but nothing to show for it.

Sorry to keep on bugging, but could you fwd me the email? I am dying to read the specific language, thanks!

 

[prettycat]

what bothers me so much... playing politics...trying to outsmart people.
them opening a medical school...what a joke

ACPE result are out there...for them to say...itll be out there late july is like saying ur stupid hahhah omgggg

for him to say class of 2016 can sit for nexples regardless is= saying we are NOT accreditated and WE WONT be but dont worry u get to take the exam
i think we should all think about this till july23..and make a decision...something is super weird about this school...
how is that they announed wasc decision but for acpe they have to wait till after july 23 lloll

 

[44mumucoco]

Hello everyone, I didn't apply to this school buti accidentally read the thread. I applied to touro college of pharmacy and we did receive the result in the beginning of July. I just want to let you all know that results already out for the candidate school . I hope this helps

 

[CNCPstudent]

..

 

[robw02]

Hi guys, I am a CNCP student and just wanted to clarify some of the questions that you guys have. I will be lying if I say "i'm not trying to defend the school" but there are couple of things that I just wanted to clarify

2) why hasn't the school post the status of accreditation? This is only my guess: Main reason is because the school is NOT allowed to give official announcement of the status because of their agreement with the board of trustee (investors). Even though ACPE has sent the result to the school, it doesn't mean that school can immediately give the result out whether it is a good news or bad news. If this is true, then why were all the students notified of the WASC accreditation already? Dean said that both were confidential until late July. This tells me that it only matters if its confidential if its bad news.

4) Dean's email to the accepted students. I do not have a copy of this email so I don't know exactly what is going on, but I can address some of the concerns/questions posted at the forum. (I am assuming this so don't quote me) He was just trying to address the concerns that incoming students may have about the school's accreditation's status and may have caused misunderstandings. If you sit for the boards and passed the NAPLEX, from MY understanding you will be a licensed pharmacist and will be able to practice (i'm not 100% sure so don't quote me, only my assumption) This is something I want to know for certain. I hope the school or APCE will pick up and give me a direct answer when I call. My other concern is even if this is true, will employers want to hire graduates from an unaccredited institution even though they have the license to practice?

5)Will Northstate be accredited in the future? This is MY belief. There is a very very small possibility that school will not get accredited. Based on the things going on with the school and its progress, I am convinced that school is doing well. I wish I could have this confidence. But it just begs the question, if they were doing so well, why didn't they get it this year? And because they didn't get it this year, why should we think they will next year?


no I did not proof-read it.

I'm not trying to be negative, just voicing reasonable concerns as a potential incoming student. I hope everything works out, I'm just not sure I want to gamble away borrowed money on it given the recent news. And lastly, most of the professors there may not be shady, but there definitely has been some shadiness in the schools handling of the recent APCE decision.

 

[CNCPstudent]

..

 

[30Percent]

Its very shady to set the ACPE announcement on July 24 when the tuition due date is July 23. They could've at least been more discrete about it and set the ACPE announcement on August 1st.

Your future students should have all the necessary information before they commit the $40k into your institution.

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

Hello everyone, I didn't apply to this school buti accidentally read the thread. I applied to touro college of pharmacy and we did receive the result in the beginning of July. I just want to let you all know that results already out for the candidate school . I hope this helps

I happened to notice this as well..Touro NY did not wait til any "official' time to release the news that they were accredited...

Also I strongly believe that ACPE gives the school the decision before they make it public themselves is so that the school can inform current students of their situation.

Who knows really whats going on but because they aren't telling us the news and are telling us we CAN take the NAPLEX without accreditation is very shady indeed.

 

[prettycat]

I called ACPE on monday morning and asked for the status...they told me they wont make it official till july 24 and theyve asked me to contact the school...they were suprised that the school wouldnt make the information public...they posted the result on monday evening....
this school is all about money and very shady..professors are either young or non us graduates ...and who cares about the quiz bowl are we in the elementry school?????
what was naplex passsing rate???that whats important not the quiz bowl

nobody will hire people from unaccreditated schools..if u search indeed.com ull see one of the requirments employees are looking for is graduation from an accreditated school....
if this school was so good it would get accreditated like touro ny....western and all other schools were accreditated after graduation ...please dont compare this school to sd or westernu...u can compare it to hawaii the one that went out of biz....hahhah
if they were hopeful they will get accreditated ..they wouldnt say u can take naplex without accreditation

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

I called ACPE on monday morning and asked for the status...they told me they wont make it official till july 24 and theyve asked me to contact the school...they were suprised that the school wouldnt make the information public...they posted the result on monday evening....
this school is all about money and very shady..professors are either young or non us graduates ...and who cares about the quiz bowl are we in the elementry school?????
what was naplex passsing rate???that whats important not the quiz bowl

Haha, I completely agree prettycat, what does one quiz bowl have to do with anything? When would CNCP disclose NAPLEX pass rates anyways?

Yes it wouldnt make sense for ACPE to give the school accreditation information early if they wanted it to be a secret so much

 

[Tebowed]

I wonder if CNU is still going ahead with their plans for a med school...

 

[prettycat]

......

 

[lakeboy]

I guess you can take the NABPLEX if the school is not accredited but I just went and checked the Cali BOP website and under qualifications to get a Cali lic it says ACPE accredited school. No disrespect but I really don't want to be stuck working in Hicksville

 

[30Percent]

I wonder if CNU is still going ahead with their plans for a med school...

I think they will since they've already invested into remodeling their new facilities in Elk Grove. Assuming its true they didn't get accredited, it doesn't affect them financially much. They will still collect on the tuition from new students who are desperate enough to attend and current students since they are locked in.

They should be really concerned with their reputation. There are a lot of people who feel the school doesn't belong and this will only reinforce their beliefs. If its true they didn't get accredited, it will spread like wildfire in the pharmacy community and there will be a stigma associated with their students and graduates.

 

[prettycat]

2012 i sent u a private message read it its important

 

[robw02]

prettycat, are you going to email the dean about the information you heard from APCE?


I really want to find out as much as I can before the 23rd. Does anyone know if the tuition is refundable if we withdraw before school starts? According to another post, our deposit is refundable less $100 or something.

 

[pig rx]

I checked the ACPE statuses of several schools. I think all the ACPE statuses for 2011-2012 are up now.

 

[Twentytwelve2]

2012 i sent u a private message read it its important

I knew it... Thank you, Prettycat. <3

 

[cycloketocaine]

I checked the ACPE statuses of several schools. I think all the ACPE statuses for 2011-2012 are up now.

Yes, look at Chicago State, who was granted full accreditation.

 

[confettiflyer]

I checked the ACPE statuses of several schools. I think all the ACPE statuses for 2011-2012 are up now.

This is correct. Of the 4 schools I looked at that opened in 2008 (CNCP, Sullivan, Jefferson, Belmont), CNCP is the only one that did NOT receive accreditation this year. Per ACPE, "candidate" accreditation was continued.

At this point, I wouldn't believe anything that is sent from CNCP since their fiduciary duty is to protect the financial interests of the school.

The next meeting of ACPE is November 11-13. The ACPE website lists the next opportunity for advancement to full accreditation is 2012-2013. I have no idea what the dean has to announce on July 24 except possibly "Hey, dirt-ay, baby I gotcher money!"

Note: the class of 2012 is safe, they've graduated under a candidate program and retain the same rights/privileges as accredited programs. 2013 is possibly also safe because they may graduate before any final ACPE decision is made. Any class beyond that will is up in the air, and in the event of an adverse decision, may be subject to the "escape clause" which was filed with their ACPE initial application...more on that if we get to that point, but it's not a happy topic.

 

[30Percent]

As already mentioned, it could have something to do with the pass rate of the recent graduates. And if thats true, then you really have to think that something is seriously wrong with the school and its program.

I really want to find out as much as I can before the 23rd. Does anyone know if the tuition is refundable if we withdraw before school starts? According to another post, our deposit is refundable less $100 or something.
.

Read their school catalog. It should have information their about their tuition refund policy after school starts. Most schools will refund your tuition to a certain date after school begins.

If the school doesn't release their NAPLAX pass rates, the NAPLAX website will eventually list them on their website. I'm not sure when, but I think it might be towards the end of year when all the graduates throughout the US has taken it. Also a mod stated that NAPLAX pass rates has nothing to do with the school being accredited by ACPE.

 

[prettycat]

ur welcome 2012,

i guess we should just wait and see...and maybe call acpe again...

 

[prettycat]

tebow maybe u should email them and ask them to post the result before the 23 or change the tutuion due date...
confittiflyer has a good point...all 2008 schools got accreditation..

 

[pbv6]

According to the PharmCAS website:
_________________________________________________

ACCREDITATION STATUS OF AACP MEMBER INSTITUTIONS

...at-a-glance

Pharmacy institutions are accredited by the Accreditation Council for Pharmacy Education (ACPE). Students must graduate from an ACPE accredited program to be eligible to practice pharmacy in the U.S. For more information about accreditation, go to our Accreditation Information page.
_________________________________________________

Source: http://www.pharmcas.org/collegesschools/AAGAccreditation.htm

 

[RobertHorry]

According to the PharmCAS website:
_________________________________________________

ACCREDITATION STATUS OF AACP MEMBER INSTITUTIONS

...at-a-glance

Pharmacy institutions are accredited by the Accreditation Council for Pharmacy Education (ACPE). Students must graduate from an ACPE accredited program to be eligible to practice pharmacy in the U.S. For more information about accreditation, go to our Accreditation Information page.
_________________________________________________

Source: http://www.pharmcas.org/collegesschools/AAGAccreditation.htm

- Candidate Following achievement of Precandidate status, and once students have enrolled in a new program, but the program has not had a graduating class, the program may be granted Candidate status. The granting of Candidate status denotes a developmental program that is expected to mature in accord with stated plans and within a defined time period. Reasonable assurances are expected to be provided that the program may become accredited as programmatic experiences are gained, generally, by the time the first class has graduated. Graduates of a class designated as having Candidate status have the same rights and privileges as graduates of an accredited program.

 

[pbv6]

1. Thanks for posting the information.

2. Do not post replies like this.

Have you heard of the controversy behind Hawaii College of Pharmacy?

Forgive me the link is from wikipedia, but feel free to investigate directly by checking the Notes and External links.
Wiki Link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii_College_of_Pharmacy

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

1. Thanks for posting the information.

2. Do not post replies like this.

Have you heard of the controversy behind Hawaii College of Pharmacy?

Forgive me the link is from wikipedia, but feel free to investigate directly by checking the Notes and External links.
Wiki Link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii_College_of_Pharmacy

Yes I have studied that before but their situation was a lot worse, I dont think they even had candidate status and the Dean had lied about their ACPE status most of the time

 

[confettiflyer]

While similar, it's not a fair comparison to the HICP debacle. The whole reason we have precandidate status is because of HICP, which opened without any type of accreditation and started, de novo, their application while students were sitting in their seats in the cramped classroom.

CNCP has been going through the established process legitimately, just at a slower pace.

I can't say I'm surprised, they also lagged when advancing from precandidate status to candidate status while the other fall 2008 schools achieved candidate status a full year before CNCP did.

 

[Byebyebeautyful]

For Touro it says 2011-2012 full accreditation granted while for CNCP it says 2011-2012 candidate status continued on ACPE..

Im pretty sure this means ACPE has come out with all their decisions... anyone who calls CNCP to get them to disclose the results should bring this up...its already on the ACPE website!

It would seem that they are hoping that there are people who wont do the research on their own.. anyways I dropped my seat. I definitely dont feel comfortable with all this shady business.

 

[pbv6]

- Candidate Following achievement of Precandidate status, and once students have enrolled in a new program, but the program has not had a graduating class, the program may be granted Candidate status. The granting of Candidate status denotes a developmental program that is expected to mature in accord with stated plans and within a defined time period. Reasonable assurances are expected to be provided that the program may become accredited as programmatic experiences are gained, generally, by the time the first class has graduated. Graduates of a class designated as having Candidate status have the same rights and privileges as graduates of an accredited program.

I am a bit confused as to what exactly those same rights and privileges are. I'd be startled if PharmCAS lied, stating "Students must graduate from an ACPE accredited program to be eligible to practice pharmacy in the U.S."

I'm assuming from your post that recent graduates from a school under candidate status are given the privilege to practice as a pharmacist in the United States.

However, how many terms can a school continue to maintain candidate status if it does not advance to full accreditation stage?

According to ACPE's Policies and Procedures (Updated May 2012) 9.1.3
" 9.1.3 Terms for Preaccreditation Preaccreditation status is awarded in accord with specified terms and conditions, involving monitoring provisions that include on-site evaluations. The Preaccreditation status (the combination of Precandidate and Candidate status) of a program shall be limited to an aggregate of no more than five years. "
Source: https://www.acpe-accredit.org/pdf/CSPoliciesProceduresMay2012.pdf

What if the school does not reach accreditation by its fifth year? Will the school still be considered Candidate or will it be officially unaccredited? And for those graduated students from the candidate school - will they be still be granted the same rights and privileges given to those graduated from accredited schools after hearing the school did not reach accreditation by its fifth year?

 

[Weibo]

Dude awesome.

 

[Weibo]

1. Thanks for posting the information.

2. Do not post replies like this.

Have you heard of the controversy behind Hawaii College of Pharmacy?

Forgive me the link is from wikipedia, but feel free to investigate directly by checking the Notes and External links.
Wiki Link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hawaii_College_of_Pharmacy

With all do respect.... Please don't use bold, underlined letters on non important information inside this sub forum. It draws the readers' attention away from the main points inside the posts and frankly I find it pretty distracting. I'm sure I'm speaking for others too. Anyway, thank you for your understanding. Have a nice day.

 

[confettiflyer]

For Touro it says 2011-2012 full accreditation granted while for CNCP it says 2011-2012 candidate status continued on ACPE..

Do note that this is Touro NY (which was another 2008 school I believe). Touro CA has been fully accredited since 2009.

 

[confettiflyer]

I am a bit confused as to what exactly those same rights and privileges are. I'd be startled if PharmCAS lied, stating "Students must graduate from an ACPE accredited program to be eligible to practice pharmacy in the U.S."

The legal wording of that is ambiguous enough to include "fully accredited," and "candidate accredited." It's an accredited program...just what level of accreditation. Therefore, graduating from a candidate accredited program (CNCP c/o 2012) affords them the same rights/privileges and therefore the PharmCAS quote is correct.

I'm assuming from your post that recent graduates from a school under candidate status are given the privilege to practice as a pharmacist in the United States.

Didn't see this before I wrote the above, but yup.

However, how many terms can a school continue to maintain candidate status if it does not advance to full accreditation stage?

According to ACPE's Policies and Procedures (Updated May 2012) 9.1.3
" 9.1.3 Terms for Preaccreditation Preaccreditation status is awarded in accord with specified terms and conditions, involving monitoring provisions that include on-site evaluations. The Preaccreditation status (the combination of Precandidate and Candidate status) of a program shall be limited to an aggregate of no more than five years. "
Source: https://www.acpe-accredit.org/pdf/CSPoliciesProceduresMay2012.pdf

What if the school does not reach accreditation by its fifth year? Will the school still be considered Candidate or will it be officially unaccredited? And for those graduated students from the candidate school - will they be still be granted the same rights and privileges given to those graduated from accredited schools after hearing the school did not reach accreditation by its fifth year?

[/quote]

We don't know, it's never happened before...the closest we're getting is CNCP and it's unfolding before our very eyes. It would be very interesting to see what happens going forward because we're in uncharted territory.

I DO know from personal interviews with faculty members intimately involved with accrediting matters that ACPE requires new schools to file "escape plans" which comprise of "what we're going to do if we don't get accredited and close." My best guess is that the school awards you some token bachelor's degree for your classes taken since those don't have any legal weight the way PharmD, MD, DDS/DMD, etc... have. Or, they let you "transfer" the credits somewhere...but goodluck getting a school to accept your classes--If I'm UC Davis, for example, am I going to accept units from an unaccredited x2 school?

Refunds are probably not involved because if it ever gets to this point, the school would just have to close since its primary revenue stream would be cut off (no more students).

 

[prettycat]

strudal ,

im sorry but i posted that assuming the school will get accreditated ...if the school doesnt get accreditated i will take all of it back..cuz no matter how good u are...noone will hire a nonaccreditated gradu