*** 2021-2022 MD/PhD cycle - Questions, Comments, and other things ***

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2021-2022-NonTrad said:
Also, I just wanted to provide an answer to this specifically about Wayne State. I was able to contact a current student and they gave me a good summary:

About ~36 interviewees were sent the email inviting them to a second look sometime in February or March. Of those 36, some were sent an invitation and some (the higher priority) were sent the modified sentence "we will be prepared to offer you an acceptance." This sentence and this second look are not an offer of acceptance, and attending is not required to receive an acceptance (as illness, covid, etc. can always happen). All 36 invitees (or those who accept to come and/or express continued interest) will have an interview with the Dean to gauge interest, sell the program, etc. The first interview was an evaluative screen. of the ~36 invitees, only around 10 will ever be offered an acceptance, and the school will not offer any more than 6 acceptances as they do not want to enroll. Having that extra "we will be prepared to offer...." line does not mean you have been accepted, but it was intentionally added. Not having that line in there does not mean you will not be accepted as you still can be (the current student I spoke with did not have this extra line).

Overall, it seems pretty standard to their process and now explained makes sense. I tried to avoid absolutes and certainties here and I don't have any more information, but just some clarification for anyone that got those emails and was confused.

Edit: just to clarify, I have not interviewed here. I have just become invested in making sure several of my friends who may be too nervous to ask have clarification, and just wanted to share the information with anyone else who may have gotten the emails.
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Thanks for this, so it seems like if we weren't given an email at all, but interviewed, then this is basically a rejection?
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housestark22 said:
From a PD's perspective, are letters of intent taken seriously? I was waitlisted by my top choice (for professional and personal reasons--especially for family proximity), and want them to know that I would absolutely commit to enrolling if I was pulled off the alternate list.
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Programs are different about this. Generally what I've seen is that if it's someone the program is seriously considering, yes it will help them stand apart from their peers. If it's someone way down the list, it may not help. Unfortunately for the applicant there is often no way for them to know.
 
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I found a 2008 document from the GREAT MD-PhD Training Section Leadership & Committees
entitled "MD-PhD Training and Careers: A Guide for Potential Applicants, Current Trainees, and Advisors". Containing useful summary info per programs, such as summer rotation requirements and GPP participation.

Would anyone know if an updated version of this exists? A similarly titled PDF lacks GPP participation status, and it does not have a date that I can see: MD-PhD Dual Degree Training

(2008 document; N.B. this will download a PDF): https://biology.nd.edu/assets/18211..._applicants_current_trainees_and_advisors.pdf
 
holdmybow said:
I found a 2008 document from the GREAT MD-PhD Training Section Leadership & Committees
entitled "MD-PhD Training and Careers: A Guide for Potential Applicants, Current Trainees, and Advisors". Containing useful summary info per programs, such as summer rotation requirements and GPP participation.

Would anyone know if an updated version of this exists? A similarly titled PDF lacks GPP participation status, and it does not have a date that I can see: MD-PhD Dual Degree Training

(2008 document; N.B. this will download a PDF): https://biology.nd.edu/assets/18211..._applicants_current_trainees_and_advisors.pdf
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Is this the PDF you are talking about?
 
While I recognize they are still several months away, what is the usual dress code for second visits (in person or virtual)?
 
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I have a school I interviewed at beginning of November that I still haven't heard anything from and the portal hasn't been updated. I sent them updates beginning of December. Is it fair to ask them for an application status? Is this long of a wait normal? I want to come across as interested in the school but don't want to seem pushy and impatient. Am I overthinking this? 🙃
 
Many schools release all their acceptances at once at end of their interview cycle. Provide them with a brief update/interest email and ask about their timeline. That is not pushy... I tell my interviewees when we make decisions at the end of the interview, and for most of them is the week after Feb. 14th.
 
Fencer said:
Many schools release all their acceptances at once at end of their interview cycle. Provide them with a brief update/interest email and ask about their timeline. That is not pushy... I tell my interviewees when we make decisions at the end of the interview, and for most of them is the week after Feb. 14th.
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Thank you for the advice! It's easy to overthink all of this
 
How much weight are ya'll giving to location in terms of making a final decision? I am fortunate to have a couple of options now. The first option has more research opportunities that align with my interests, but location is not ideal for personal reasons. Second option is much better location, but fewer labs I can see myself joining (albeit there are still several good options). Looks like these will probably be my only 2 As, so at this point I am ready to start making a final decision. I feel torn, help
 
applesauce14 said:
How much weight are ya'll giving to location in terms of making a final decision? I am fortunate to have a couple of options now. The first option has more research opportunities that align with my interests, but location is not ideal for personal reasons. Second option is much better location, but fewer labs I can see myself joining (albeit there are still several good options). Looks like these will probably be my only 2 As, so at this point I am ready to start making a final decision. I feel torn, help
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Personally, I am giving the location a lot of weight! MSTPs are a package deal, and that includes location. I'll be spending the next 8 years of my life there, and who knows how I will feel 4-5 years down the line. It's absolutely okay to prioritize your personal reasons, even if it sometimes feels like it comes at the expense of your program fit. If you'll be happier in your personal life, you'll likely perform better as well!
 
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applesauce14 said:
How much weight are ya'll giving to location in terms of making a final decision? I am fortunate to have a couple of options now. The first option has more research opportunities that align with my interests, but location is not ideal for personal reasons. Second option is much better location, but fewer labs I can see myself joining (albeit there are still several good options). Looks like these will probably be my only 2 As, so at this point I am ready to start making a final decision. I feel torn, help
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I think location matters a lot more for MD PhD than for MD only due to the length of training, particularly if you have a partner/dependents coming with you. Unless a school is on either end of the bell curve in terms of research (has immense resources in your field or has <2 PIs) then you can more or less find good research anywhere as it is much more about the mentor ship and quality of science you do than cutting-edge field specific.

For me personally, Location >>> > P/F curriculum and clinical integration during grad years >= research quality/translational prospects >> rank/name.
 
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Hi @Fencer,
Do you have any updates to the cycle data? February has typically been the month with many acceptances so I'm curious where we're at now.
 
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Hi everyone,

I've gotten so many DMs within the last 24 hours questioning my sanity about my decision with Hopkins and Harvard. I'm going to paste what I messaged someone last night!

I don't think I could last a year in Baltimore. I had a conversation with my parents but the more I thought about it, I could absolutely not see myself living there for 8 years. That was really the biggest reason for no Hopkins for me, even if I sacrifice the "name".

And for Harvard, honestly, they don't have a lot of the research (like two PIs) I want to continue working in + it's really far from my family/friends + it's freezing there all the time I hate snow sm.

So as you can tell, I'm basing my decision on location/quality of life than anything else!
 
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mdphd63627 said:
So as you can tell, I'm basing my decision on location/quality of life than anything else
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It's 8 years man. These are the ONLY factors that matter. Don't let the haters hate, you go where *you* will be happy. An MSTP is an MSTP
 
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Hell, I decided the schools I applied to almost solely based on location/quality of life. I wouldn't sweat it at all.
 
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mdphd63627 said:
Hi everyone,

I've gotten so many DMs within the last 24 hours questioning my sanity about my decision with Hopkins and Harvard. I'm going to paste what I messaged someone last night!

I don't think I could last a year in Baltimore. I had a conversation with my parents but the more I thought about it, I could absolutely not see myself living there for 8 years. That was really the biggest reason for no Hopkins for me, even if I sacrifice the "name".

And for Harvard, honestly, they don't have a lot of the research (like two PIs) I want to continue working in + it's really far from my family/friends + it's freezing there all the time I hate snow sm.

So as you can tell, I'm basing my decision on location/quality of life than anything else!
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You are not making a bad decision. You have the privilege of choosing among terrific programs. If you eventually want to go to those Ivy locations, do that for your "finishing" fellowship for a year or two. Congratulations on joining the Guild of Physician-Scientists!
 
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Fencer said:
Guild of Physician-Scientists!
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1644520406193.png


The members of this forum in a few months
 
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mdphd63627 said:
WashU or Vandy are the top two runners as of now. Need to attend second looks in March/April to fully commit.
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Seems reasonable to me. WashU is a big enough name that it's not going to hold you back compared to Harvard or Hopkins. I've known others who have turned down both of those programs for various reasons. Harvard/Hopkins might be better if you wanted to stay in the northeast after the MD/PhD program, but it doesn't seem like that's on your priority list.
 
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Is there any particular courtesy to be extended to programs if you're withdrawing from a program you interviewed at vs accepted to? I am very lucky to have 4 acceptances, but am only actively considering between 3 of them. I have withdrawn from other programs post interview, but not post-acceptance. Is a similar email suggested for both situations? Thanks!
 
humoralhuman said:
Is there any particular courtesy to be extended to programs if you're withdrawing from a program you interviewed at vs accepted to? I am very lucky to have 4 acceptances, but am only actively considering between 3 of them. I have withdrawn from other programs post interview, but not post-acceptance. Is a similar email suggested for both situations? Thanks!
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The biggest thing to do is just do it. Be professional. Here is a template i used/made yesterday if you want one:

Good evening, all

I am unfortunately reaching out to formally withdraw from my acceptance to (university). I am thankful enough to have received a number of acceptances in the last several weeks that I feel better align with my research and geographical interests.

I greatly appreciate all of your time and efforts, and I don't think an admissions team can surpass the experience y'all have provided. I am grateful for the consideration and am certain that the incoming class will be filled with equally qualified individuals!
 
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Hi all! Really appreciate everyone's advice and support on this thread, it makes me excited to join the MSTP community. I currently have one acceptance (!) but am still waiting to hear back from a program I really like. I interviewed in late Oct/early Nov and they said I would hear a decision in late Dec/sometime in Jan but I have heard nothing (I assume I'm waitlisted but still strange). I sent an update letter in late Dec and got confirmation from admissions that they received it.

I am thinking of sending another letter to demonstrate continued interest but don't really have any updates. I was also hoping for advice on how to nicely ask about the admissions timeline, and if I should mention my acceptance to another program in the letter. Thanks for any advice!
 
medmicro64 said:
Hi all! Really appreciate everyone's advice and support on this thread, it makes me excited to join the MSTP community. I currently have one acceptance (!) but am still waiting to hear back from a program I really like. I interviewed in late Oct/early Nov and they said I would hear a decision in late Dec/sometime in Jan but I have heard nothing (I assume I'm waitlisted but still strange). I sent an update letter in late Dec and got confirmation from admissions that they received it.

I am thinking of sending another letter to demonstrate continued interest but don't really have any updates. I was also hoping for advice on how to nicely ask about the admissions timeline, and if I should mention my acceptance to another program in the letter. Thanks for any advice!
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Congrats on the A!

I think it's totally fair to ask what's up since it's a month past when you thought you would hear. I've sent a couple emails with something simple like "I remain very interested in the ___ MSTP and was hoping to have heard an update on my application status by now. Is the Admissions Committee still evaluating me for an offer of admission?" with a letter of interest attached.

For the letter, I don't think it's necessary to have an update in a letter of continued interest. You can just highlight all of the reasons you love the program and think you are a good fit. Good luck!
 
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^^^ I have a similar question. I am considering sending a letter of intent to a program I am waitlisted at. Is it advantageous to explicitly mention the names of other programs I have been accepted to? They are all of similar ranking.
 
@Fencer Do MSTPs communicate between each other about letters of intent they have received from applicants?

There is a school I'd commit to if I was accepted, but I fear that a letter of intent could negatively affect my candidacy elsewhere if other schools were to learn about it. Thoughts?
 
As of last night sync (02/15/2022):
- Total MD/PhD applicants - 1766
- Total applicants w at least 1 MD/PhD AC - 516
- Expected # applicants to receive at least 1 MD/PhD AC - 850, thus only 61% of eventual accepted applicants have received a MD/PhD acceptance. If you interviewed at multiple programs, you still have a great chance in the 2022 cycle.
 
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After getting waitlisted so many times and gradually losing hope in this cycle recently, I’ve been wondering if it’s OK to ask those schools to consider me for MD-only admissions? Has anyone ever done this before?
 
dualdegreepossibly said:
Funny you say that, since I made this account with the intent of changing my name to "dualdegreedefinitely" once accepted! I thought it would have a nice ring with the alliteration :lol: Great minds think alike!
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Alliteration is the way to go. My mind is not quite as great as yours. Keep it up.
 
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First off I am incredibly blessed to be able to choose between multiple schools this cycle, however, if I am looking to get advice between two different schools, should I post here or create a new thread?
 
dangoi1 said:
First off I am incredibly blessed to be able to choose between multiple schools this cycle, however, if I am looking to get advice between two different schools, should I post here or create a new thread?
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On the main Premed forum you can post in the X vs Y school thread. Or create an MD PhD “X vs Y school thread”

Actually this is a good idea.
 
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dangoi1 said:
First off I am incredibly blessed to be able to choose between multiple schools this cycle, however, if I am looking to get advice between two different schools, should I post here or create a new thread?
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forums.studentdoctor.net

***2021-2022 MD/PhD: Feedback on school options***

For individuals with multiple acceptances to list pros and cons of different schools and gather opinions on options available.
forums.studentdoctor.net forums.studentdoctor.net

I went ahead and made one
 
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AMCAS CYMS will be opening in the morning of Tuesday, 02/22/2022. Please use the CYMS choice even if you have even one acceptance. It is helpful for Programs as the CYMS tool provides "aggregate" data of your choices. You can change it as often as you want, but it will be reported daily (at overnight sync) to schools.

Below are two AAMC Video about the CYMS, the first one is the most recent and shows how the revised 2022 applicant portal as it will be looking like beginning on Tuesday. The important stuff for applicants starts at 11:27 and ends at 27:06. The newly improved portal provides more information to applicants. It tells you about your status at all applications for each of your schools. You know the AC (accepted), WA (withdrew after AC), WB (withdrew before AC), RJ (rejection), etc. with a time stamp of when the decision was submitted to the AMCAS system by the school. That is pretty cool and useful.
  • (*good stuff starts at 11:27) - This was posted 6 days ago and is about the 2022 cycle
  • - This is from about 10 months ago (~April 2021) and is about the 2021 cycle with some stats.
 
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I do not know if seeing that about 40% of the class has yet to be given one acceptance gives me more or less hope. I am currently on the waitlist at 3 programs and do not have an acceptance. I have acceptances to MD programs but MD Ph.D. is my ideal career path. At this point, I am uncertain how to feel about my chances but I welcome any words or advice to help put my brain at ease.
 
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Harterlux7480 said:
I do not know if seeing that about 40% of the class has yet to be given one acceptance gives me more or less hope. I am currently on the waitlist at 3 programs and do not have an acceptance. I have acceptances to MD programs but MD Ph.D. is my ideal career path. At this point, I am uncertain how to feel about my chances but I welcome any words or advice to help put my brain at ease.
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I am on the waitlist at 4/4 programs I interviewed at and feel pretty good I’ll leave the cycle with at least one A - hopefully that makes you feel better (and less alone in it)
 
So I interviewed at 7 programs, but so far I have only heard back from one program (which I was waitlisted). I am getting a little anxious about the silence, and I am worried the silence would likely mean rejections. I know the decision of one program won't come out until March, but haven't heard anything from the rest starts to make me feel frustrated.
 
tarocake said:
So I interviewed at 7 programs, but so far I have only heard back from one program (which I was waitlisted). I am getting a little anxious about the silence, and I am worried the silence would likely mean rejections. I know the decision of one program won't come out until March, but haven't heard anything from the rest starts to make me feel frustrated.
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I think that happens pretty often to those that don't share admission data on SDN. I could be totally wrong though. The other option is that you will hear soon and lower the statistic that shows that 40% of the spots haven't been awarded.

Jokes aside, seven interviews is great and you have a very significant chance of getting in. I wish we could just opt-in to fast-forward to May.
 
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tarocake said:
So I interviewed at 7 programs, but so far I have only heard back from one program (which I was waitlisted). I am getting a little anxious about the silence, and I am worried the silence would likely mean rejections. I know the decision of one program won't come out until March, but haven't heard anything from the rest starts to make me feel frustrated.
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I'm in a really similar spot to you. I interviewed at 6 programs, have one rejection, one waitlist, and four radio silence (and one MD acceptance). It's definitely not a fun experience.
 
Fencer said:
AMCAS CYMS will be opening in the morning of Tuesday, 02/22/2022. Please use the CYMS choice even if you have even one acceptance. It is helpful for Programs as the CYMS tool provides "aggregate" data of your choices. You can change it as often as you want, but it will be reported daily (at overnight sync) to schools.

Below are two AAMC Video about the CYMS, the first one is the most recent and shows how the revised 2022 applicant portal as it will be looking like beginning on Tuesday. The important stuff for applicants starts at 11:27 and ends at 27:06. The newly improved portal provides more information to applicants. It tells you about your status at all applications for each of your schools. You know the AC (accepted), WA (withdrew after AC), WB (withdrew before AC), RJ (rejection), etc. with a time stamp of when the decision was submitted to the AMCAS system by the school. That is pretty cool and useful.
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Make sure that you check AMCAS CYMS tomorrow morning after 9 am (EST)... you might be surprised or disappointed about some of those "radio silence" decisions.

We also are just at 548 applicants with at least 1 MD/PhD acceptance, and we expect to get to 850 by end of cycle (that is 64.5%). That means that over 35% of accepting slots have not been filled as of yet. Overall, in recent cycles, we extended about 2200 MD/PhD acceptances to those 850 applicants and about 55% of those acceptances are given by now, with about 5% this week, and another ~20% in March.
 
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@Fencer - Thanks for the updates. Does that mean finalized school decisions will show up on CYMS, even if the applicant hasn't received an official decision from the school? Am supposed to hear back from a couple schools very soon, so I'm guessing the decisions have already been finalized, and was wondering if they were likely to show up on CYMS tomorrow (if accepted) or after they inform applicants of the decision.
Thanks!
 
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