*** 2021-2022 MD/PhD cycle - Questions, Comments, and other things ***

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So this is probably a dumb question, but in general, how do you compare different schools based on your area of interest? For example, if I am interested in immunology, would one program be considered "better" than another if they have more NIH funding in that area?

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So this is probably a dumb question, but in general, how do you compare different schools based on your area of interest? For example, if I am interested in immunology, would one program be considered "better" than another if they have more NIH funding in that area?
Sometimes that funding might be going towards different things. One program may be very strong in single molecule immunotherapy, one in cell therapies, one one in RNA-mediated T Cell stuff, one in tumor perfusion, one in allergens, one in etc etc (if you can’t tell from how I basically ignored the basic side of immunology, I am a cancer immunotherapy boi). But overall, funding can be a scalar as a starting point, but you still need to go to websites to investigate.
 
So this is probably a dumb question, but in general, how do you compare different schools based on your area of interest? For example, if I am interested in immunology, would one program be considered "better" than another if they have more NIH funding in that area?
Not a dumb question at all. I look at fit for my research interests, which relies on faculty more than just the amount of funding. Most schools have a list of their departmental faculty with profiles that list their positions, whether they're taking students, research interests, publications, and funding if you're lucky. There are some schools that have less organized pages, making it more difficult to look at faculty.

The quick way to find faculty of interest is to go to the NIH Reporter and enter the school for the organization, and check for funding in the last few years from organizations of interest. Immunology funding can come from multiple areas, so you may want to tailor it to your specific research interests (eg NHLBI for the typical heart, lung, and blood studies, NCI if you want to specialize in cancer, NIAID if you like Allergies or Infectious Diseases, etc). You'll want to find researchers that have larger, multi-year awards like R01s or U6s at that school, because they are the most likely to be capable of taking an MD-PhD student. Also, understand that the NIH reporter only has funding from the NIH. If you find a faculty member on their website that you really like but doesn't currently have NIH funding, they may have an outside source of funding while applying for grants; they may also still be able to take you as a student when you start graduate school in two years.

EDIT: You may not want to mention that you read about their funding if you meet with your faculty of interest. It is more polite to say you read their latest publication or their website if they have one.
 
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Does anyone know if Texas MD/PhD programs still use the AMCAS traffic rules? One of my schools is having us fill out enrollment paperwork before mid-January. This is just to get the ball rolling and is non-binding, correct?
 
From a PD's perspective, are letters of intent taken seriously? I was waitlisted by my top choice (for professional and personal reasons--especially for family proximity), and want them to know that I would absolutely commit to enrolling if I was pulled off the alternate list.

The only problem is that this school doesn't accept application updates, and I'm not sure if letters of intent are considered updates? Below is their wording regarding replying to the waitlist email:

"Again, you do not need to confirm your place on the alternate list. Please only reply to this email if you wish to be removed from the alternate list."

Any help or guidance on this would be greatly appreciated!
 
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What are other people’s post Interview results looking like?

I have currently heard back from 5 school post II,
1 WL, 2R, 2A.

Although I am grateful for the acceptances, if things continue like this I will be very sad. My interviewing skills isn’t the problem.

I’m extremely pessimistic how the rest of the cycles gonna go based off these results, feel like I’m being invited to interview at places that won’t accept me. Like if I can’t even cut it at X state university, how am I supposed to defy all
Odds and get into the “top” schools I’ve been invited to interview at, which makes up a good chunk of places im waiting To here from post II

I have no red flags and my stats are good. Any thoughts?
 
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What are other people’s post Interview results looking like?

I have currently heard back from 5 school post II,
1 WL, 2R, 2A.

Although I am grateful for the acceptances, if things continue like this I will be very sad. My interviewing skills isn’t the problem.

I’m extremely pessimistic how the rest of the cycles gonna go based off these results, feel like I’m being invited to interview at places that won’t accept me. Like if I can’t even cut it at X state university, how am I supposed to defy all
Odds and get into the “top” schools I’ve been invited to interview at, which makes up a good chunk of places im waiting To here from post II

I have no red flags and my stats are good. Any thoughts?
You are currently sitting at a 40% post interview acceptance rate. If the average school accepts between 30 and 50 percent of their interviewees, well hey look at that you are right on target.

To answer your question, I have head back from 5 schools and it has been:

2 MD/PhD As, 1 MD only A, 1 MD only WL, 1 MD only R, silence from 1 MD and 1 MD/PhD who I could have heard back from but haven’t.
 
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From a PD's perspective, are letters of intent taken seriously? I was waitlisted by my top choice (for professional and personal reasons--especially for family proximity), and want them to know that I would absolutely commit to enrolling if I was pulled off the alternate list.

The only problem is that this school doesn't accept application updates, and I'm not sure if letters of intent are considered updates? Below is their wording regarding replying to the waitlist email:

"Again, you do not need to confirm your place on the alternate list. Please only reply to this email if you wish to be removed from the alternate list."

Any help or guidance on this would be greatly appreciated!
Wondering the same, as I am likewise contemplating writing one for my top choice
 
What are other people’s post Interview results looking like?

I have currently heard back from 5 school post II,
1 WL, 2R, 2A.

Although I am grateful for the acceptances, if things continue like this I will be very sad. My interviewing skills isn’t the problem.

I’m extremely pessimistic how the rest of the cycles gonna go based off these results, feel like I’m being invited to interview at places that won’t accept me. Like if I can’t even cut it at X state university, how am I supposed to defy all
Odds and get into the “top” schools I’ve been invited to interview at, which makes up a good chunk of places im waiting To here from post II

I have no red flags and my stats are good. Any thoughts?
Congrats on your acceptances!

I have attended 3 interviews. Here's my cycle so far:
0 A, 0 R, 0 WL.

Hope this helps!
 
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Congrats on your acceptances!

I have attended 3 interviews. Here's my cycle so far:
0 A, 0 R, 0 WL.

Hope this helps!
Ok…. I get some applicants have it worse than me I’m not denying that…. But that doesn’t mean my feelings aren’t valid…..everyone has the right to have dreams/schools they would rather attend if possible….Whether it be for a S/O or family issues, career goals, etc.

Everyones application strength and Goals are different, some should expect different results than others.

My original post was wondering about the possibility of getting >14 interviews yet only obtaining 2-3 acceptances. Like is the criteria individuals invite on different from what is considered for post II acceptance rates? Are underrepresented individuals more likely to be interviewed out of curtsey rather than actually standing a decent shot at acceptance? Etc.
 
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But that doesn’t mean my feelings aren’t valid
Your feelings are valid. In the position you stand right now, you feel like your are doing poorly. Valid feelings based on your present lives experiences and what is going on internally. But stepping back and looking objectively at the math of things, your feelings are unfounded and not grounded in reality. To reiterate: valid in your head, that is how you feel and no one can change that. Not objectively valid as a verifiable concern.
everyone has the right to have dreams/schools they would rather attend if possible
if there is a discordance between your dreams and reality, maybe adjust your dreams or wake up. Live happy with what you have, and given you have “>14 interviews” and have only heard back from five, you seem to have 9 more chances at your dreams.
My original post was wondering about the possibility of getting >14 interviews yet only obtaining 2-3 acceptances.
3/14 = 20% acceptance rate. Could be someone that is a poor interviewer. It happens, totally viable. This person should get 4-5 As, but they they could also get 14 or they could get zero.
Like is the criteria individuals invite on different from what is considered for post II acceptance rates?
Yes, criteria post interview is different pre-interview. Post interview, the interview is considered.
Are underrepresented individuals more likely to be interviewed out of curtsey rather than actually standing a decent shot at acceptance?
No. If you are interviewed then you can be accepted.
 
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I have currently heard back from 5 school post II,
1 WL, 2R, 2A.
Congratulations on your acceptances, you are a future double doc! Based on your current results, you should not be pessimistic. Your results are exactly in line with how many As data from previous cycles would predict you to have (data filtered for >0 IIs and As for quality reasons).
1641261465343.png
 
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My original post was wondering about the possibility of getting >14 interviews yet only obtaining 2-3 acceptances. Like is the criteria individuals invite on different from what is considered for post II acceptance rates? Are underrepresented individuals more likely to be interviewed out of curtsey rather than actually standing a decent shot at acceptance? Etc.
Look, clearly you are qualified for basically any MD/PhD program considering the success you've had so far. I believe there have been PDs in this thread (or maybe previous years' questions threads) who have said that there are no courtesy interviews. You got the interview, the school's interested in you, and you're being considered for admission.

It's hard for us to know what's really being considered and why one person will get an interview or acceptance somewhere but not elsewhere. Rejection/waitlist at what you call "X state university" doesn't mean you can't be admitted to a "top school." The cycle is long: people have gotten acceptances in April and May. Really, the only thing to do is wait and see.
 
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Everybody wants to be a “Top right green” but we just end up as “bottom left red”s
Congratulations on your acceptances, you are a future double doc! Based on your current results, you should not be pessimistic. Your results are exactly in line with how many As data from previous cycles would predict you to have.
View attachment 347761
 
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The largest group of MD/PhD acceptances is mid- to late February as the interview season wraps up. Some programs don't release their ACs until then. The journey of becoming a Physician-Scientist will take you to unexpected places, but any mid-level MD/PhD program graduate, if they excel at their graduate research work, can land at an Ivy-type residency program. I have trained MD/PhD graduates that landed at the Hvd vs Yale level for residency AND faculty.
 
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is it frowned upon to start reaching out to potential research rotation/clinical research PIs to meet them/discuss upcoming work? really fortunate to have received an acceptance to a program that has tons of opportunities in field I am interested in and while I want to start examining my opportunities there I don't want to come off as guner-ish especially since I haven't committed (though I am leaning heavily). thanks for any insight!
 
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is it frowned upon to start reaching out to potential research rotation/clinical research PIs to meet them/discuss upcoming work? really fortunate to have received an acceptance to a program that has tons of opportunities in field I am interested in and while I want to start examining my opportunities there I don't want to come off as guner-ish especially since I haven't committed (though I am leaning heavily). thanks for any insight!
Not at all. You aren’t a gunner for being proactive. I have had meetings with potential PIs really just to get the ball rolling.
 
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My interviews have gone amazing and my app is amazing and yet I’ve been rejected from schools where my stats are way above their median
What if - and I know this may be difficult to take in - they haven’t and it isn’t?

I don’t mean this sardonically or condescendingly, hear me out. I started out the app cycle with a school list of 30 that had a median USNWR ranking of 20. I did this based on what I thought, and have been told, is an objectively gold-star, superb, get in anywhere type of application. Fast forward to September and I had a single MD/PhD interview. It is a humbling hit, but recognizing this and adapting early, added another 15 schools that were “lower ranking”, in the process discovering that ranking and non-MSTP status is really not as significant as I thought. Of my 8 MD/PhD IIs, 5 are from that second list of 15 and both of my acceptances so far are from the second list. Of my 14 or 15 pre-II Rs, 13 are from that first list. Could I have faired better MD only? Sure. But this is the path to go down. The lesson being take your cycle results not as an attack on you but as feedback on your application. You may be a bad interviewer, you may have weaker LORs, you may have weaker in comparison research, you just don’t know and it is not a statement on you as an individual or as an applicant. It is feedback on your application that maybe, it isn’t as good as you think. Internalizing that is a struggle for one’s ego, but if you cannot then you will continue to resent the schools that *do* want you.

TL;dr - maybe, objective measures and preconceived notions of how one will do in the cycle aren’t as accurate as we hope or want, but introspection and learning from one’s lives experiences is an excellent skill to have.
 
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What if - and I know this may be difficult to take in - they haven’t and it isn’t?

I don’t mean this sardonically or condescendingly, hear me out. I started out the app cycle with a school list of 30 that had a median USNWR ranking of 20. I did this based on what I thought, and have been, is an objectively gold-star, superb, get in anywhere type of application. Fast forward to September and I had a single MD/PhD interview. It is a humbling hit, but recognizing this and adapting early, added another 15 schools that were “lower ranking”, in the proces discovering that ranking and non-MSTP status is really not as significant as I thought. Of my 8 MD/PhD IIs, 5 are from that second list of 15 and both of my acceptances so far are from the second list. Of my 14 or 15 pre-II Rs, 13 are from that first list. Could I have faired better MD only? Sure. But this is the path to go down. The lesson being take your cycle results not as an attack on you but as feedback on your application. You may be a bad interviewer, you may have weaker LORs, you may have weaker in comparison research, you just don’t know and it is not a statement on you as an individual or as an applicant. It is feedback on your application that maybe, it isn’t as good as you think. Internalizing that is a struggle for one’s ego, but if you cannot then you will continue to resent the schools that *do* want you.

TL;dr - maybe, objective measures and preconceived notions of how one will do in the cycle aren’t as accurate as we hope or want, but introspection and learning from one’s lives experiences is an excellent skill to have.

In terms of why i think interviews have gone well is because many PDs/Deans have actively recruited me during interviews, saying very nice things and essentially begging me to attend(no joke this happened at one school It was awkward). Many people have commented on my LOR saying they are stellar, same with app and essays etc. The quality/ number of my interview invites align with this(only 2 pre II Rs for reference, many T10 II) So on that front I think I was doing well.

However then january hit and I’ve been rejected from some programs I wouldn’t have expected, which led to my suprise and hence why I asked OG question. Based on app/interview invites I would categorize myself as a “top” applicant. Interviews have gone well, however results not as expected so far Atleast. Maybe this is just the anxiety talking, it’s hard not to think of the process as linear
 
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f why i think interviews have gone well is because many PDs/Deans have actively recruited me during interviews, saying very nice things and essentially begging me to attend.
This is going to be yet another hit to your view of your application: I have been told this quite literally by every single PD and about 2/3 of the PIs I have interviewed or met with. Hell, I had one PD recruit me to their school and tell me before the cycle even started “you are going to have multiple fantastic MSTP offers at the end of the cycle” and I am currently on a waitlist/alternate pile at their school.

What individual PIs and PDs tell you doesn’t matter. What matters is what the overall admissions committee thinks of you. There could be something in your application that gives the committee pause. Maybe they didn’t feel you would attend them based on your research, maybe they think you would prefer a different geography, maybe you had poorer md-only portions in spite of excellent MD/PhD interviews.

What is said during an interview is not the feedback you should be factoring in. What you should be doing is factoring in the feedback you get from concrete results. Those application results say more about what committees think of you, not just individuals.

Edit:
it is the anxiety. Look, I get your feelings. It is difficult to navigate this process alone. Find a peer group of like minded individuals and/or other applicant to vent to. To bounce ideas off of, do interview practice, destress. We are a self selected group of type As and Being virtual amplifies the uncertainty. It is terrible for ones mental health. I feel yuh, but this ain’t it.
 
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Let's not forget that we are all going to be colleagues one day!
 
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Moderator note:

Hi everyone, emotions have run high over the past couple pages. This process is highly competitive and stressful. It is important to be kind to ourselves and others throughout this process.

As many have stated, what is said during an interview may not necessarily reflect the relative strength of one's application. It's possible that the praise given to one applicant is generally given to all other applicants as well (because you're all awesome). It's also possible that an interviewer genuinely likes an applicant (and was genuine in their remarks) but was simply overruled by the committee. Many applicants fall into this latter group. It's hard to know where one's application truly stands without having a 'behind the scenes' look at the other applications. Stats are but just one measure considered during this selection process.

The offending posts have been edited/removed. Most replies to these posts have also been removed as they now lack context. Thank you for your understanding. Here's a comic to help lighten the mood:

1641336090416.png
 
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Moderator note:

Hi everyone, emotions have run high over the past couple pages. This process is highly competitive and stressful. It is important to be kind to ourselves and others throughout this process.

As many have stated, what is said during an interview may not necessarily reflect the strength of one's application. It's possible that the praise given to one applicant is generally given to all other applicants as well (because you're all awesome). It's also possible that an interviewer genuinely likes an applicant (and was genuine in their remarks) but was simply overruled by the committee. Many applicants fall into this latter group. It's hard to know where one's application truly stands without having a 'behind the scenes' look at the other applications. Stats are but just one measure considered during this selection process.

The offending posts have been edited/removed. Most replies to these posts have also been removed due to the now-lack of context. Thank you for your understanding. Here's a comic to help lighten the mood:

View attachment 347793
@Moko is best mod.
 
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@turn up raaaah4 you're a great applicant--PD and interviewers have repeatedly affirmed this for you, so take a deep breath and relax! Admission into your dream school is still a possibility (and a very real one as there's still plenty of time to hear back). As mentioned earlier, most decisions come out in mid to late February.

I know it can be discouraging to think about whether you have a shot at those top programs when possibly lesser ranked schools have turned you down, but I think that mindset is going to be your worst enemy. As with all types of admissions, it's a literal crapshoot. Among stellar applicants, there are a million and one reasons as to why you got rejected from some programs and acceptances to others (e.g., program fit, research interests, diversity of class, certain personal values that are alluring to the school, etc.). Heck there could be a single sentence in one person's app that compelled School A to choose them over you. Who even knows! There's no objective way to compare two stellar applicants; hence, why you probably won't see a clean correlation between acceptances and school rank (Harvard might be looking for the very qualities that State University Y isn't interested in).

Also another possibility: maybe at the time you interviewed you were exceptional, but later application reviews revealed even more stellar applicants. But that's a sad thought to think, so ignore that :)

The point I want to get across is that in admission processes like these are long, grueling, and full of discouragement the more you try to make sense of it. The number of interviews you've gotten so far and the feedback you've gotten within your interview should provide you with enough basis to be hopeful of an acceptance to your dream school. Don't try to make sense of rejections; keep your head up--being hopeful is healthy.
 
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Moderator note:

Hi everyone, emotions have run high over the past couple pages. This process is highly competitive and stressful. It is important to be kind to ourselves and others throughout this process.

As many have stated, what is said during an interview may not necessarily reflect the relative strength of one's application. It's possible that the praise given to one applicant is generally given to all other applicants as well (because you're all awesome). It's also possible that an interviewer genuinely likes an applicant (and was genuine in their remarks) but was simply overruled by the committee. Many applicants fall into this latter group. It's hard to know where one's application truly stands without having a 'behind the scenes' look at the other applications. Stats are but just one measure considered during this selection process.

The offending posts have been edited/removed. Most replies to these posts have also been removed as they now lack context. Thank you for your understanding. Here's a comic to help lighten the mood:

View attachment 347793
To clarify the moderation, why did 8 whole pages disappear
 
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To clarify the moderation, why did 8 whole pages disappear
Hrm, great question.. I believe I only deleted 8 posts, but the thread does seem a bit shorter (I think it was on page 15 or 16?). I'm not seeing any traces of the other posts. @gyngyn were there 8 pages of collateral :oops:
 
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Hrm, great question.. I believe I only deleted 8 posts, but the thread does seem a bit shorter (I think it was on page 15 or 16?). I'm not seeing any traces of the other posts. @gyngyn were there 8 pages of collateral :oops:
I didn't delete anything...
 
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I came hoping that Fencer might have the new stats on the cycle, but quickly realized that I missed a chaotic weekend on SDN.

Keep hanging in there y'all!

P.S. Thanks, mods, for being awesome!
 

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Wondering the same, as I am likewise contemplating writing one for my top choice
Reposting this, in case my original question may have gotten lost in the shuffle! Original post below:

From a PD's perspective, are letters of intent taken seriously? I was waitlisted by my top choice (for professional and personal reasons--especially for family proximity), and want them to know that I would absolutely commit to enrolling if I was pulled off the alternate list.

The only problem is that this school doesn't accept application updates, and I'm not sure if letters of intent are considered updates? Below is their wording regarding replying to the waitlist email:

"Again, you do not need to confirm your place on the alternate list. Please only reply to this email if you wish to be removed from the alternate list."

Any help or guidance on this would be greatly appreciated!
 
As of 1/5/22 (overnight sync):
nMCATcGPA
TOTAL APPLICANTS1765511.43.69
At least 1 MD/PhD AC338517.53.84
Currently MD/PhD AC337517.53.84
Withdrew AFTER AC1524.04.00

not much movement over the holidays.... Just remember the majority of MD/PhD acceptances arrive in February. At end of cycle, I expect about 850 applicants with at least 1 MD/PhD Acceptance, but about 100 will chose to go MD-only (withdraw after MD/PhD AC) or defer to another year.


Letters of intent are usually not that important but if I have 3 or 4 applicants very close by, I might use it to lobby in the admissions committee. In my program and others, rankings are the beginning of conversation. LORs and interviewer comments might sway the admissions committee to move someone above others.
 
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Is a letter of intent something that is sent pre-decision or post-decision/while occupying the waitlist?

I interviewed at a school that conveniently my entire lab moved to last year (I now work in a remote lab by myself at our old location. My PI was extremely, extremely kind and left me funding here). I interviewed there in the beginning of December, I think it went reasonably well, and am now waiting on a decision. I sent them an update letter a week after the interview since I had a few more papers published. I don't want to bombard them with more emails but want to make clear I would absolutely go there if accepted. Is this a time to send a letter of intent? Or is there something my PI (current faculty there, wrote me a LoR) could do to make clear I would attend, or is that considered inappropriate? He is not on the admissions committee.
 
Letters of intent are usually not that important but if I have 3 or 4 applicants very close by, I might use it to lobby in the admissions committee. In my program and others, rankings are the beginning of conversation. LORs and interviewer comments might sway the admissions committee to move someone above others.
Thank you! This particular school says they do not rank applicants on their alternate list…could a letter of intent potentially make a larger impact in this case?
 
"We would like to know what factors are involved in making applicants' decisions. If you have not indicated what influenced your withdrawal, please do so by sending an email.."

Is it expected to respond why I withdrew my acceptance or do I not have to? I feel awkward explaining why I did so
 
"We would like to know what factors are involved in making applicants' decisions. If you have not indicated what influenced your withdrawal, please do so by sending an email.."

Is it expected to respond why I withdrew my acceptance or do I not have to? I feel awkward explaining why I did so
Anything you tell them is for their own data. It may cycle back in to how they recruit, how they choose interviewees, some part of the interviewer selection etc. but it is just for them. It is not required.
 
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"We would like to know what factors are involved in making applicants' decisions. If you have not indicated what influenced your withdrawal, please do so by sending an email.."

Is it expected to respond why I withdrew my acceptance or do I not have to? I feel awkward explaining why I did so
Dear [institution],
My inner science god(dess) is too powerful for you university. I have also been promised preferential 24/7/365 access to a Flow Cytometer at my school of choice.
Thank you for your time,
-Awesome McGreatpants

No big deal.
 
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@Fencer I was curious if you have ever seen a school requiring attendance of second look to formally receive an acceptance? A few of my friends received a fairly cryptic email from Wayne State saying “We will be prepared to offer you an acceptance if you come to second look” and it just seems kinda sus. I don’t think they want to waste time and money if they don’t have to, but anecdotally it sounds like they may have operated this way in previous cycles (at least on the MD only side)
 
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@Fencer I was curious if you have ever seen a school requiring attendance of second look to formally receive an acceptance? A few of my friends received a fairly cryptic email from Wayne State saying “We will be prepared to offer you an acceptance if you come to second look” and it just seems kinda sus. I don’t think they want to waste time and money if they don’t have to, but anecdotally it sounds like they may have operated this way in previous cycles (at least on the MD only side)
Also curious about this. I received an email from the MD-PhD PD about attending what essentially sounds like a second look, but email definitely makes it clear that it's not an acceptance at this point. Sort of confused about whether acceptances are only offered to those who end up attending and what your chances of acceptance are if you can make it to the campus visit. Seems a bit odd since for most programs, if you are offered a second look visit it means you've been accepted.
 
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Not aware... but others in MSTP leadership might want to chime. @Maebea @MSTPadvocate
UTSW used to require a January revisit in order to get an acceptance back when Rod Ulane ran the program. But I am not aware of any MSTPs requiring a revisit now.
 
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UTSW used to require a January revisit in order to get an acceptance back when Rod Ulane ran the program. But I am not aware of any MSTPs requiring a revisit now.
I think Indiana did when I applied.

Based on their website looks like they still may, though it's not super clear if they send an acceptance with the second interview invitation. It looks like the acceptance is implied with the second invite.

 
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I think Indiana did when I applied.

Based on their website looks like they still may, though it's not super clear if they send an acceptance with the second interview invitation. It looks like the acceptance is implied with the second invite.

I was accepted to IU this cycle just a month after my interview without ever attending a second look (which none have happened yet).
 
On the topic of revisit/second look, what exactly happens during these and is there anything we should prepare? If in-person, what costs are covered vs out-of-pocket, and is there dress code?
 
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On the topic of revisit/second look, what exactly happens during these and is there anything we should prepare? If in-person, what costs are covered vs out-of-pocket, and is there dress code?
It's the exact inverse of interview day- the school is trying to sell itself to you. If you want to prepare, any questions that you may have and maybe reaching out to faculty you are interested in and seeing if they would be free to chat, whether there is a formal mechanism or informally. In-person, food, transport, and housing should be covered!
 
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Update as of 01/15/22...

Admission Action
n
cGPA
MCAT
MD/PhD Applicants
1766
3.69
511.4
Withdrew Before AC
40​
3.73​
512.5​
Rejected group (PR,PW,RJ,DR)
1051​
3.65​
510.0​
At least 1 MD/PhD AC
378
3.84
517.4
Withdrew After AC
2​
3.99​
521.0​
Currently MD/PhD AC
376​
3.84​
517.4​
Available - active (RS,AL,IN)
165​
3.67​
511.4​
Available - passive (NA,HO)
132​
3.58​
504.0​

In prior application cycles, we have reached about 850 applicants with at least 1 MD/PhD acceptance by end of cycle. The peak of MD/PhD acceptances is in February, so for many of you, they are coming... If you interviewed in this cycle, your chances are good with a 20-50% eventual acceptance rate per interview (eventual means by end of cycle & could be waitlisted then AC). Hopefully, you learn from prior interviews not repeating mistakes while interviewing. Good luck to all of you...
 
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Update as of 01/15/22...

Admission Action
n
cGPA
MCAT
MD/PhD Applicants
1766
3.69
511.4
Withdrew Before AC
40​
3.73​
512.5​
Rejected group (PR,PW,RJ,DR)
1051​
3.65​
510.0​
At least 1 MD/PhD AC
378
3.84
517.4
Withdrew After AC
2​
3.99​
521.0​
Currently MD/PhD AC
376​
3.84​
517.4​
Available - active (RS,AL,IN)
165​
3.67​
511.4​
Available - passive (NA,HO)
132​
3.58​
504.0​

In prior application cycles, we have reached about 850 applicants with at least 1 MD/PhD acceptance by end of cycle. The peak of MD/PhD acceptances is in February, so for many of you, they are coming... If you interviewed in this cycle, your chances are good with a 20-50% eventual acceptance rate per interview (eventual means by end of cycle & could be waitlisted then AC). Hopefully, you learn from prior interviews not repeating mistakes while interviewing. Good luck to all of you...
Based on assessments of previous cycles' data, only about 10% of that "rejected" pile will come out of the rejected pile. So we have 376 people with Acceptances, and 297 who have been interviewed (or at least just not rejected anywhere). So that makes for 673+(1051*0.1) = 778 total accepted applicants which will result in a class of ~700? Something isn't adding up there in regards to the post-interview acceptance rate.

I know that the "Interviewed" status is not mandatory to report as it is not a final decision. My assessment would be that there is a *very* large chunk of individuals coded as 'rejected' who have actually just not had interviews reported. Otherwise as it stands, it is almost as if everyone with an (indicated) interview as of right meow will get an acceptance. Which doesn't sound right.
 
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@Fencer I was curious if you have ever seen a school requiring attendance of second look to formally receive an acceptance? A few of my friends received a fairly cryptic email from Wayne State saying “We will be prepared to offer you an acceptance if you come to second look” and it just seems kinda sus. I don’t think they want to waste time and money if they don’t have to, but anecdotally it sounds like they may have operated this way in previous cycles (at least on the MD only side)
Also, I just wanted to provide an answer to this specifically about Wayne State. I was able to contact a current student and they gave me a good summary:

About ~36 interviewees were sent the email inviting them to a second look sometime in February or March. Of those 36, some were sent an invitation and some (the higher priority) were sent the modified sentence "we will be prepared to offer you an acceptance." This sentence and this second look are not an offer of acceptance, and attending is not required to receive an acceptance (as illness, covid, etc. can always happen). All 36 invitees (or those who accept to come and/or express continued interest) will have an interview with the Dean to gauge interest, sell the program, etc. The first interview was an evaluative screen. of the ~36 invitees, only around 10 will ever be offered an acceptance, and the school will not offer any more than 6 acceptances as they do not want to enroll. Having that extra "we will be prepared to offer...." line does not mean you have been accepted, but it was intentionally added. Not having that line in there does not mean you will not be accepted as you still can be (the current student I spoke with did not have this extra line).

Overall, it seems pretty standard to their process and now explained makes sense. I tried to avoid absolutes and certainties here and I don't have any more information, but just some clarification for anyone that got those emails and was confused.

Edit: just to clarify, I have not interviewed here. I have just become invested in making sure several of my friends who may be too nervous to ask have clarification, and just wanted to share the information with anyone else who may have gotten the emails.
 
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Based on assessments of previous cycles' data, only about 10% of that "rejected" pile will come out of the rejected pile. So we have 376 people with Acceptances, and 297 who have been interviewed (or at least just not rejected anywhere). So that makes for 673+(1051*0.1) = 778 total accepted applicants which will result in a class of ~700? Something isn't adding up there in regards to the post-interview acceptance rate.

I know that the "Interviewed" status is not mandatory to report as it is not a final decision. My assessment would be that there is a *very* large chunk of individuals coded as 'rejected' who have actually just not had interviews reported. Otherwise as it stands, it is almost as if everyone with an (indicated) interview as of right meow will get an acceptance. Which doesn't sound right.

I realize that precisely. A very critical and important aspect is that applicants can be moved into rejection codes without being notified, and that rejection can be deleted by the admission officer (AO) without notifying applicants. So, in a sense, these are pools of applicants that are placed based upon the current perception of the AO. The eventual class of MD/PhD trainees should be about 750. Precisely because schools are acting as the 2021 cycle but they will need to reach to fill the ~850 eventual accepted applicants by taking them off from rejection codes. In contrast, some schools interviewed a few more applicants to make sure they can fill with their top 30-40% of interviewees. Despite that, I still reject highly qualified applicants from an invitation to interview, and quite a few are admitted into other MSTPs. In 2021 cycle, 56% of my MD/PhD applicants matriculated into MD/PhD programs (43%) or MD-only programs (13%). I was only able to interview about 60% of the applicants who matriculated into MD/PhD programs
 
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I realize that precisely. A very critical and important aspect is that applicants can be moved into rejection codes without being notified, and that rejection can be deleted by the admission officer (AO) without notifying applicants. So, in a sense, these are pools of applicants that are placed based upon the current perception of the AO. The eventual class of MD/PhD trainees should be about 750. Precisely because schools are acting as the 2021 cycle but they will need to reach to fill the ~850 eventual accepted applicants by taking them off from rejection codes. In contrast, some schools interviewed a few more applicants to make sure they can fill with their top 30-40% of interviewees. Despite that, I still reject highly qualified applicants from an invitation to interview, and quite a few are admitted into other MSTPs. In 2021 cycle, 56% of my MD/PhD applicants matriculated into MD/PhD programs (43%) or MD-only programs (13%). I was only able to interview about 60% of the applicants who matriculated into MD/PhD programs
I have seen exactly this from the applicant side of things. For instance, Iowa had to interview and accept ~20% more last cycle (and stated as such for this cycle) in order to get to their final target class number.
 
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