Who can pinpoint the reason(s) they didn't get in the first time around?

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jayski2030

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I haven't applied yet, but when I do I want to try to make sure it's my only time going through it. So, if the 2nd timers could put their fingers on what went wrong during the frist application processes and share them with everyone, maybe we can hope to avoid those things.
THanks
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I was told:

1) Improve your MCAT, at least get 8s across each section
2) Get more hospital/clinical experience (I had some, but very little)
3) Get more LORs if reapplying next year (Since they use the previous years and don't want to see three of the same letter again)
4) Show academic involvement (I was graduating-like everyone else). They wanted me to take a couple of science classes (my choice) to not get "rusty" when it comes to studying.
 
I know my crummy transcript kept me out the first two times.

I was told to take more high level sciences, and get good grades in them, and get more patient contact.

Didn't do any of it. Went and got a job, moved on with life.

Now, I'm trying again. Interview notices should be arriving in the next 3-4 weeks. Can't wait!

Jess
 
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I 've been told it was my undergrad GPA and that the rest of my application was great.
 
My application was great also, but it was my interview-I was so nervous! Boy did I screw that up. On top of that it was at the end of March.

So, 1. apply early and 2. interview well!
 
I am an applicant next year... bad GPA. Can you please PM me your stats if you don't mind Megalofyia?
 
My MCAT and GPA were too low... the MCAT was kinda easy to fix but it could take years to fix a bad GPA, so I'm not worrying about it (this time). :)
 
Just like Xcanadian, my big f'up was my MCAT score. My GPA, EC's and LORs were great, but my mcat (especially verbal) really held me back big time.
 
My MCAT was great, but they wanted more clinical exp. and my app. was late.
 
Definitely MCAT scores.
I applied last year got one interview after pulling strings (having people call on my behalf). Was waitlisted.
I retook the MCAT in Aug and now have 4 interviews.
I should hear from the first school next week!


I think the rule of thumb for the MCAT (definitely not for every school but for most) minimums of 10, 10, 10. Shoot for that and it can get you over the number requirements. Of course depending on your GPA, recs and ECs.
 
about a week after you think you should have everything into the admissions office give them a call to make sure. An applicaiton I thought was complete two month ago is still incomplete due to a letter getting lost somewhere.
 
Timing, and school choice, for me. I have a low GPA (but in biomed eng!) with a 36-38 MCAT, plus loads of research, community service, etc. GPA definitely held me back the first time, but timing and schools choice were huge factors. Last year I applied late and applied to schools blindly. This year, I started my application process in July and have already been accepted. I also bought the MSAR and read through all the schools carefully and picked schools that I thought would give me a chance, e.g. less numbers of applicants, no automatic screen.
 
Hi guys,

On the advice of my Principal Investigator I contacted several schools that rejected me in 2002. I received a hodge podge of information. It ranged from "your MCAT's great just bring up your gpa by doing a post bacc, to inch up your MCAT 1 or 2 points and you'll be fine" The more schools I talked to the more diverse the responses. I devised my own plan. I knew my undergrad gpa was a major factor so I took more advanced level science courses (advanced cell bio, histology, microbial pathogenesis etc) and did well although my AMCAS gpa still sucks. Signed up for Princeton Review and raised my MCAT score. The only thing that may be my achilles heel now is my volunteering. Before, I volunteered twice a week at a hospital. But working full time and taking a full load of classes and MCAT left little time for the hospital. Hopefully my current research will compensate some. I plan to resume hospital volunteering and shadow a physician in the upcoming month. If this recipe doesn't work I plan on exploring D.O. for class of 2005. Last but not least I've been told by U of M admissions that I have great LOR's. I'm using those same three and I've added four new ones. Hopefully my complete package will compensate for the earlier difficulties I experienced in undergrad.

Cheers!
rmp

P.S. Does anyone who blew it in undergrad (freshman, sophmore year) feel like a convicted criminal? Although we served our sentence and corrected our ways and are now contributing members to society we still suffer the stigma and record of our previous past crimes.

Before I get flamed I applaud students who start college and never had any difficulties and made straight A's through all four years. Their maturity, discipline, and focus are to be acknowledged. At the same time I wish people with experiences similar to mine could get a break somehow. Unfortunately (as we all know) admission to medical school is so competitive that it can sometimes boil down to a numbers game and the applicants with the higher stats get in.

Oh well, good luck to us all!
 
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Yep, definitely felt like a convicted criminal, even though I finished college 6 years ago and had a 3.8 in grad school. A good MCAT score seemed to help only somewhat to get past *some* screenings.

I met the dean of admissions at a top 5 school, and he admitted to me that schools do NOT read applications, that first screenings miss great people, but this is just the way it is. He said the key is to apply to schools that will read and appreciate your strengths, like Rochester and Pitt.

Just to clarify, I'm not whining. :D I made the choices I made, and I can't change them. I chose the difficult path, but along the way I've lived an interesting life.

I wish you all the best of luck!
 
Originally posted by Ol'Girl


Just to clarify, I'm not whining. :D I made the choices I made, and I can't change them. I chose the difficult path, but along the way I've lived an interesting life.
Click to expand...

I echo your sentiments.
 
I was told that the fact I graduated in 3 yrs was not favorable in the scheme of things... I applied back in '97-'99 with GPA 3.65/3.70 MCAT 30.

S
 
yes, i feel like a convicted criminal....a very bad freshman year with a psycho roommate, and it'll show up in my gpa forever....and i know that's one of the things that makes my application weak.....sucks VERY much....and a 35+ MCAT score doesn't seem to make up for it either......what do they want from me, my first-born?
 
For me, I think it was...

1. applying too late (I didn't send my secondaries in until January the first time around)
2. a crappy MCAT verbal score (6)
3. a so-so GPA (I think in my senior year I got my GPA from a 3.3 to a 3.5 in time for the second application cycle)

This is my first post on this new forum, and I think it's great! I wish SDN would have had this section when I was a re-applicant and felt like the only person who hadn't gotten into med school on their first attempt.
 
I think that my problem the first go was definately the MCAT. I applied before, 1 interview and I was rejected. Since then, I improved my MCAT by 6 points and raised my GPA with a Master's degree. Top it all off with a publication and I got 6 interviews and I have been accepted to med school already! I think that the major improvement was my MCAT, I believe that was preventing me from getting interviews the first time around. So, my advice is, nail the MCAT first time around!
 
Don't lose hope. Be willing to explore all your options... if you want it bad enough, then you will get in.

I started college in 1991 as a single mom. Eventually I was placed on probation, then kicked out. I took a two year hiatus, held odd jobs, married, expanded my family, and then reentered school. I pretty much started over after many years off. I ultimately graduated Magna Cum Laude from a state school.

I knew that I was not a competitive applicant, so after graduation I joined the Air Force as a medic. Two years on active duty with tons of healthcare experience really helped boost my confidence and my application (once I felt ready to apply). The first year I only applied to USUHS and was rejected post-interview. Year two, I applied to five schools, was offered interviews at four, was waitlisted at one, accepted to one, and I declined interviews to the others.

I am now a MSI at AZCOM. I am doing well... As an aside, I chose an osteopathic school because I felt more comfortable there. There seemed to be more students with similar life experiences and families. I am 31, and many of classmates are about my age. Also, I lived in Arizona during undergrad and familiarity with the location was a benefit as well.

So- I suppose my message is to keep the faith. If I can do it, then anyone can!!

Hope this helps some.

Cyndi
 
My MCAT scores absolutely killed me the first two times that I applied. After I was rejected the first time to medical school, I went into an MS program. I applied during my first semester in graduate school, and once again did not get accepted, however, I was placed on the alternate list at WVSOM. I decided to take the next year off, and just focused on finishing my masters degree. After I graduated, I was hired to work in a hospital as a clinical exercise physiologist in the Cardiopulmonary Rehab department. After working for a year, and retaking the MCAT, I decided to apply again for a seat in the 2008 medical school class.

I decided 4 years ago that if I did not make it in on my first attempt, I would keep applying until I got in. It was a tough, tough road, but I recently was accepted, and still did not have the greatest MCAT scores.

Grad school brought my overall GPA significantly, which was a plus. My MCAT scores, despite taking multiple prep courses, still did not raise much more than a point or two. Verbal absolutely killed me twice. I really think it was my experience in the hospital along with my personality that finally helped me get in.

The best advice that I can give anyone who reads this post, is to NEVER GIVE UP. If you want to be a physician that bad, eventually someone will give you a chance to fulfill your dream. Talk with the admission staffs if you are denied a spot in their class to see what you can do to improve your chances of getting in.

I wish everyone all the luck in the world. Happy Holidays!
 
It doesnt matter,condifer applying to the best medical school abroad or consider becoming a PA.

The best school abroad in my opinion which is cimpetitive too is sacker-if you go there you will get back in the USA and get a good residency-I think they have a 99.9return rate and its a great sunny location

http://med.tau.ac.il/ny/the_school.htm

who cares why you didnt get in dont get upset have a plan ho to get into a good school and fufill your careet dreams

good luck
 
i had a not so great freshman year gradewise, and after four years my gpa was a 3.56.....now, i really want to get into a cali school (though i will go to any at this point), and i KNOW this is why i haven't been accepted yet.....you'd think they'd take a psycho roommate into account, and forgive those first year grades....does anyone else feel like the UC's in particular can be very cold and numbers driven?
 
if u really really want to go 2 cali, may i suggest DO medical school?? Dunno of that is your cup of tea or not.

the cali ones are very easy to get into <<doges evil stares from TUCOM and COMP students>>

with your GPA you will most likely get in assuming you have a MCAT higher than a 24.


i interviewed at both and got accepted at both but they didnt suit me. but hej, it is in cali.....so u might want to give it a shot


GOOD LUCK
 
DEFINITELY, the undergrad GPA kept me out the first time I applied.
 
[does anyone else feel like the UC's in particular can be very cold and numbers driven? [/B]
Click to expand...

of course, and they have to be, probably being the best state school system overall. even the worst of the UCs are hard to get into, as undergrads, and certainly as grads.

countless stories of high school grads with 4.0 GPAs, stellar SAT scores, getting rejected by mediocre UCs like UC Santa barbara. so tough luck trying to apply for med school or as a grad student, i think this may even be bloodier than the battle of normandy. and it only gets worse year after year.
 
Originally posted by rmp
Hi guys,

P.S. Does anyone who blew it in undergrad (freshman, sophmore year) feel like a convicted criminal? Although we served our sentence and corrected our ways and are now contributing members to society we still suffer the stigma and record of our previous past crimes.

Click to expand...

so how many years of redemption do we need to cover up fresh/soph screw ups? how many did you do? i'm 24 and i feel so behind already!
 
Originally posted by camstah
.....you'd think they'd take a psycho roommate into account
Click to expand...

psycho roommates should be banned from the dorms.
 
Sometimes there just isn't any good reason.

On my first attempt, I got rejected from all the schools to which I applied. I had a GPA of 3.85, and my MCAT was a 30. I had volunteer experience, research experience, and lots of interesting extra-curriculars.

Second time, I got accepted to 3 schools, without any major overhauls to my application.

Hang in there. I'm going through the same thing again with my application to Ophthalmology residency. Sometimes I think it's just a bit of bad luck. TOtally revamp your personal statement. Get new recommendations. Do something in your year off that shows you are an industrious, hard working individual (ie don't use this as a year to careen around Europe and party like a rock star).

Get a job! I worked at the airport fueling airplanes. My interviewers thought it was a great experience because it put me in a setting with "real people", like you'll be treating!

Geddy
 
A question for those who may know...Let's assume the reason my application did not go well last year becaus I turned it in at the very end of the application cycle, will I still have that reapplicant stigma? Will my application need to have improved that substantially? It has only been 6 months or so...I'm still the same person I was 6 months ago so I don't feel writing a completely different personal statement is appropriate.
 
dantt said:
A question for those who may know...Let's assume the reason my application did not go well last year becaus I turned it in at the very end of the application cycle, will I still have that reapplicant stigma? Will my application need to have improved that substantially? It has only been 6 months or so...I'm still the same person I was 6 months ago so I don't feel writing a completely different personal statement is appropriate.
Click to expand...

From what I've heard from the people I've talked to, you do need to rewrite your PS and secondary essays. I didn't have too much to change, I was told flat out hte fact that my application was late and my MCAT score although overall wasn't bad, it wasn't balanced (7,11,11). But you can still use the same ideas, but write it over better. My reasons for medicine are the same, but I jsut wrote them better. Some schools told me they will even pull out the previous application and compare, so you don't want the same thing down twice.
 
jayski2030 said:
I haven't applied yet, but when I do I want to try to make sure it's my only time going through it. So, if the 2nd timers could put their fingers on what went wrong during the frist application processes and share them with everyone, maybe we can hope to avoid those things.
THanks
Click to expand...
Problem one: GPA, GPA, GPA.

Problem two: 'Poor' interview skills. To clarify, a rational discussion of how you decided to become a doc is not what ADCOMs want to hear. They want you to jump around like a crazy person, because that makes you a better doc. Yeah.
 
MCAT scores.
That's it.
"Everything else is great!" they all told me.
Those that tell you anything, that is.
 
Orthodoc40 said:
Wow, congratulations on the new baby! :)
Click to expand...

thank you :)


but to answer the op's question without going into all the gory details it boils down to two things:
1. low cum undergrad gpa (i will not go into my rant about the discrepancy b/w my cum and my science and how no one looked at why my cum was low or what was making it low)
2. lower mcat score
 
Orthodoc40 said:
MCAT scores.
That's it.
"Everything else is great!" they all told me.
Those that tell you anything, that is.
Click to expand...

I ended up retaking my MCAT's too. It's kind of silly how much that one number matters...does that mean if you keep everything else the same but had a higher MCAT score they'd accept you the 2nd time around? :laugh:
 
Orthodoc40 said:
Those that tell you anything, that is.
Click to expand...

i agree with you 120% here...getting them to tell you ANYTHING is like pulling teeth.
 
I first applied to med school in 1984. I applied to about a dozen schools, got interviews at 5 of them, and got accepted to one. That school charged $20+K per year tuition and I didn't want to go into such debt, so I applied to school in Italy and got accepted. Tuition and living expenses were less than US$2000 per year. My BCPM GPA was 3.79, Total CPA 3.94, and MCAT 37.

While I was in Italy, was asked by the Registrar to ewview my transcript file from the US (they needed some clarification of ny course descriptions) and I was handed a manila folder with all of the stuff for review. Low and behold there was my school's Pre-Medical Advisory Committee LOR..., which was a composite letter containing comments from more than a half dozen professors, all of whom I'd asked to contribute to this LOR. I specifically asked them if they could write supportive comments, and if they couldn't, I'd rather that they didn't... All said they could, so I said go ahead. The PMAC has a policy of writing a "confidential" letter, and applicants were required to sign a waiver of their right to demand to see the letter... Given the assurances I'd gotten from the Profs that they would write "good" comments (or I wouldn't let them write any), I signed the waiver.

Imagine my surprise when I read the letter. All of my Profs, save one, gave glowing recommendations. Standing out, like a sore thumb, were three paragraphs from my Organic Chem Professor... Although I got an A+ in O Chem (the grade was based on exam grades, and I got the highest class grades in all of the exams) the Prof opined that he thought I was "brilliant" but "the most arrogant student I have ever taught" etc.

Well, it was nice to see what he wrote, A couple of years later I decided to reapply as a transfer student to US Med Schools. I went to my University and spoke with the PMAC to have their letter sent out for the reapplication process. They wouldn't let me see the letter, but allowed me to "delete" the comments of any Professor. I told them to send the letter minus any comments by Professor X. They did so, and I had no problem from that point on.

I did run into Professor X once while I was visiting the old campus, and I mentioned that I was finishing Neuro residency. I thanked him for writing a recommendation, which I was sure helped me in my career. I also made a sympathetic comment about how unfair I thought it was that in my first year out of residency I would be earning $50K more than he did as a Professor...

Priceless...:laugh:

Nick
 
neurodoc said:
I first applied to med school in 1984. I applied to about a dozen schools, got interviews at 5 of them, and got accepted to one. That school charged $20+K per year tuition and I didn't want to go into such debt, so I applied to school in Italy and got accepted. Tuition and living expenses were less than US$2000 per year. My BCPM GPA was 3.79, Total CPA 3.94, and MCAT 37.

While I was in Italy, was asked by the Registrar to ewview my transcript file from the US (they needed some clarification of ny course descriptions) and I was handed a manila folder with all of the stuff for review. Low and behold there was my school's Pre-Medical Advisory Committee LOR..., which was a composite letter containing comments from more than a half dozen professors, all of whom I'd asked to contribute to this LOR. I specifically asked them if they could write supportive comments, and if they couldn't, I'd rather that they didn't... All said they could, so I said go ahead. The PMAC has a policy of writing a "confidential" letter, and applicants were required to sign a waiver of their right to demand to see the letter... Given the assurances I'd gotten from the Profs that they would write "good" comments (or I wouldn't let them write any), I signed the waiver.

Imagine my surprise when I read the letter. All of my Profs, save one, gave glowing recommendations. Standing out, like a sore thumb, were three paragraphs from my Organic Chem Professor... Although I got an A+ in O Chem (the grade was based on exam grades, and I got the highest class grades in all of the exams) the Prof opined that he thought I was "brilliant" but "the most arrogant student I have ever taught" etc.

Well, it was nice to see what he wrote, A couple of years later I decided to reapply as a transfer student to US Med Schools. I went to my University and spoke with the PMAC to have their letter sent out for the reapplication process. They wouldn't let me see the letter, but allowed me to "delete" the comments of any Professor. I told them to send the letter minus any comments by Professor X. They did so, and I had no problem from that point on.

I did run into Professor X once while I was visiting the old campus, and I mentioned that I was finishing Neuro residency. I thanked him for writing a recommendation, which I was sure helped me in my career. I also made a sympathetic comment about how unfair I thought it was that in my first year out of residency I would be earning $50K more than he did as a Professor...

Priceless...:laugh:

Nick
Click to expand...

:)
 
RxnMan said:
Problem one: GPA, GPA, GPA.

Problem two: 'Poor' interview skills. To clarify, a rational discussion of how you decided to become a doc is not what ADCOMs want to hear. They want you to jump around like a crazy person, because that makes you a better doc. Yeah.
Click to expand...

i love your problem two. its perfect. i felt the same way after i interviewed. it seems that to have anything other than some sort of epiphany-like moment is not good enough. i slowly came to the idea of being a doctor despite it being in the back of my mind since i was in high school. and to be honest, i don't get "excited" about things i haven't been through before. i think i would love being a doctor and it would be an absolutely rewarding career, but until i'm there i won't know for sure. i'm completely commited to the path i have chosen, but i don't think admissions committee's can understand this. but i don't want to BS people about how "i'm so totally EXCITED"- i'm too honest... and it probably costs me. i didn't get in last year and am reapplying, but i'm not going to jump through hoops this time either. at least i have my dignity.


Sinatra sums it up: "My Way"

And now, the end is near;
And so I face the final curtain.
My friend, Ill say it clear,
Ill state my case, of which Im certain.

Ive lived a life thats full.
Ive traveled each and evry highway;
And more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Regrets, Ive had a few;
But then again, too few to mention.
I did what I had to do
And saw it through without exemption.

I planned each charted course;
Each careful step along the byway,
But more, much more than this,
I did it my way.

Yes, there were times, Im sure you knew
When I bit off more than I could chew.
But through it all, when there was doubt,
I ate it up and spit it out.
I faced it all and I stood tall;
And did it my way.

Ive loved, Ive laughed and cried.
Ive had my fill; my share of losing.
And now, as tears subside,
I find it all so amusing.

To think I did all that;
And may I say - not in a shy way,
No, oh no not me,
I did it my way.

For what is a man, what has he got?
If not himself, then he has naught.
To say the things he truly feels;
And not the words of one who kneels.
The record shows I took the blows -
And did it my way!
 
Same here. No hoop jumping. I've never been good at "selling" myself, I really don't like it. It's not that I'm a recluse, but I just don't like being, oh well I've done A, B, and C, blah blah blah. I got three interviews the first time around with okay stats, but the interviews were my downfall. I'm pleasant and love to chat, but dont ask me to sell myself (hahaha...). I managed waitlists too, but I think if I had that ability, I might have been able to land those. Oh well, hoping I have fixed that problem this time around...
 
I am pretty sure I bombed the interview. If you get to the point where you have an interview, it's really in your hands I believe. they would not have invited you for an interview if you didn't deserve to be their statistically. That's my belief. Whatever your reasons for being a doctor, you should stay true to that. Stay true to the philosophy of the school. I wish I could say more, but it's been so long ago, kinda forgot, lol. But i'm sure it was the interview.
 
I am pretty sure I bombed the interview. If you get to the point where you have an interview, it's really in your hands I believe. they would not have invited you for an interview if you didn't deserve to be their statistically. That's my belief. Whatever your reasons for being a doctor, you should stay true to that. Stay true to the philosophy of the school. I wish I could say more, but it's been so long ago, kinda forgot, lol. But i'm sure it was the interview.
 
I'm fairly certain it was because one of my letter writers put something in my letter that didn't sound very appealing. Why do I think this?
Because at one interview, the person interviewing me asked "So I see that some people think that you are brilliant, but only put as much effort into something as you think it needs." Since I didn't write that in my personal statement (well, ok, I did, but my proofreaders took it out for me), it had to be a letter writer. After matriculating, I went back and looked at my interviews from the school I got into, and they said that I was a great candidate, so I know it wasn't the interviews. Had the highest MCAT of my school, so it wasn't that. My GPA was 3.41, which wasn't spectacular, but my BCPM was 3.5.
All in all, the only reason to try and figure this stuff out is so that you can change it. Not to dwell on it. I have seen plenty of people get eaten up inside churning over this stuff. I know because I was one. If you feel like you get shafted, you start becoming that person. Just try and do better in the future. Make your app shine.
 
First Time - applied late, too few schools, verbal on MCAT was problem.

2nd Time - applied early, retook MCAT but score went down!!!

3rd Time - applied early, took MCAT (acceptable score), lack of clinical experience

4th time - let you know in July 2007.
 
RayhanS1282 said:
First Time - applied late, too few schools, verbal on MCAT was problem.

2nd Time - applied early, retook MCAT but score went down!!!

3rd Time - applied early, took MCAT (acceptable score), lack of clinical experience

4th time - let you know in July 2007.
Click to expand...
Dammit, Rayhan, I was rooting for you. I was thinking about quitting when season number four was looking like a real possibility for me.

Very funny avatar, as always. Better luck this time.
 
I think it's kinda funny that the OP was three years ago, but this thread is definately still relevant.

My problem was a relatively low BCPM and a (possibly) weak LOR.

The biggest thing is not to give up if you don't get in the first time. Seek the advice of someone on the adcom/the dean at the schools you don't get into. Each school may have different reasons they chose not to accept you, depending on the applicant pool and the individual school's goals.

Oh yeah, and follow that advice! The poster further up who said they didn't do anything they were advised to do...I'd like to know if that person actually got into Medical School. I'm guessing probably not.

The first year I applied, I did EDP at one school, then applied to two others later. I got one interview, no acceptance.

I talked to the dean at the EDP school, and he advised that I take more upper level sciences.

The second year I applied to nine schools, got secondaries from almost all of them (waste of money), and interviewed at two. Rejection from one, waitlisted at the other.

This year is my third year applying. I talked to the deans at both schools I interviewed at. The one of them who was actually helpful (ie not a complete jerk) told me to take more science courses, and do more shadowing.

I started shadowing intensively, took/am taking more classes, and applied EDP this year.

This time around, it was surprisingly easy. I was interviewed and accepted in a matter of weeks.
 
MCAT, lack of clinical, one LOR was weak
 
For myself, I had weak clinical experience, a lower than acceptable GPA (3.345 overall) and a weak MCAT.

But let's face it: fixing a GPA is damn near impossible and pretty much written into stone. But I was able to overcome the other two deficits.

I've applied four times, and I have been in the interview process three times. All I can say is persistance is one of my virtues. :)
 
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