**Rate your SMP & Postbac**

[deleted248403]

Would a SMP or Postbacc help me or hurt me?

My numbers:

cGPA: 3.44
sGPA: 3.42

MCAT 31R (10PS 10V 11B)

6 years of research in including almost 2 years after graduating from college.
Volunteered at a pediatric unit for about 70 hours.
Volunteered at an international hospital for an entire summer (full-time~300 hours)
Shadowed Internist (~40 hours)


I submitted my AMCAS late (early September) but I applied to over 30 schools. Finished all of my secondaries by the end of November. So far I haven't gotten any interviews. Should I consider enrolling in a SMP or Postbacc to enhance my application? Or should I just apply earlier and broader? Or should I do both? How well do I need to do in a SMP or Postbacc to stand out to adcoms? I'll appreciate any constructive feedback. Thanks!

Wrong thread, man.

+1 do not cross post either

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Queenofspades]

I am looking for more information about Scripps. Anyone out there have a moment to weigh in? Seems like Bryn Mawr is the cream of the crop then Goucher and then everyone else in terms of attention, focus and support.

That post about Scripps worried me as well
http://forums.studentdoctor.net/arch.../t-222036.html

Thanks in advance anyone who can give input!

 

[NYdoctobe]

Is there anyone who did the Hopkin's MHS program willing to write a review?

Also, is the Columbia Nutrition program equivalent to an SMP?

 

[deleted248403]

Is there anyone who did the Hopkin's MHS program willing to write a review?

Also, is the Columbia Nutrition program equivalent to an SMP?

Neither of these are SMPs

 

[dj0607]

Could anyone comment on Rush U's MS in Biotechnology Program?

 

[JShen]

Hi All,
Just wanted to give some info on Hofstra's post-bacc program, as I will be completing the program in a month.

I really don't think this post-bacc was in any way catered to helping me in my path to an MD/DO school. By this I mean that while I retook all of the med-school pre-reqs and got mostly As, a few A-s, I feel as though I could have done this at any school in the world. There is no specific help or guidance for post-bacc students, it was really just a continuation of my undergrad studies. So, if you live nearby, by all means do a post-bac program here, but you certainly shouldn't go out of your way to attend Hofstra's post-bacc program. Hopefully, since I did well, I'll get in to a MD or DO program, but from what I've read, it seems as though going to a Post-bacc program that is more established, or even doing an MPH or some other grad program would be preferable to this one.

 

[TDHoang]

Can anyone give a more recent feedback on Barry U BMS program? Any feedback/advice is appreciated. Thanks in advance.

 

[icehockychick]

1) The Pros/Cons of the program

Pros:
- Small school, very personalized advising from a very enthusiastic advising staff
- Small "cohort" of fellow Post-Bacc students (20-25 students)
- Does not allow teachers to "bell curve" their scores in an effort to promote a non-competative atmosphere.
- Along the lines of my previous comment, the atmosphere is very supportive amongst the post-baccs, an environment that is actively fostered by the post-bacc advising staff
- Priority for all class registration (you will get the classes you want)
- Linkage program with Mercer School of Medicine (for GA Residents)
- Advising staff actively helps you seek out and find shadowing and volunteer opportunities
- Most (not all... I will address this below) of the professors love post-bacc students, they understand our journey, and they actively seek to support you
- This program is not just for medical school applicants... they will help you with Dental, Veterinary, PA, and Pharm school as well.
- Professors are professors (not TA's), and they are very very accessible to the students
- Although you are no longer a "student" after the year is over, they continue to reach out and support you during your glide year as you muddle through the AMCAS system, secondary apps, and interviews.

Cons:
- This is NOT a grade improvement program... it is strictly a career change program... meaning the course is one year, and you take Gen Chem, Orgo I &II, Bio I & II, and Physics I & II. Its the down and dirty of pre-med requirements, no frills.
- You have to be a full time student... you can, at most, have already completed four of the required eight classes, but you cannot spread this program out over multiple years (I personally find this a pro, but I know some would disagree).
- Relatively expensive tuition
- This is an all female, undergraduate institution outside of the post-bacc program (men can attend as post-baccs)... some of the instructors (read: some Bio Instructors) do not like teaching post-bacc students... we are "overeducated" and too "grade conscious" for their liking (their words, not mine).
- You may have some adjunct professors mixed in... this can be a huge plus, or a huge minus, depending on the prof and their experience.
- They offer MCAT prep, but its eh, IMHO
- This is a non-degree program (i.e. you don't get anything but a pat on the back after the year is over).


2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description

The course layout is very standardized, see below:
Summer - General Chemistry 1 & 2 with labs
Fall - Biology 1 w/ lab (Cell Bio and Animal Bio... some topics involve plants or animals other than humans... useless for pre-meds...)
Physics 1 w/ lab (exactly what it sounds like)
Organic Chem 1 w/ lab (again, exactly what it sounds like)
Spring - Bio 2 w/ lab (genetics and molecular biology focused)
Physics 2 w/ lab (yup)
Organic Chem 2 w/ lab (again, yup)

During your glide year, between post bacc and medical school (hopefully) they encourage you to take Bio Chem and the like, but it is not part of the formal post bacc program (and I think most people in their glide year choose to work and build their resume in other areas).

3) Something you wished you knew coming into the program

What an awesome and inspiring group of post-baccs I would be meeting! I am so excited to see where everyone's education paths take them. Oh, and going to school with 19 y/o undergrads was a little weird at first... and made me feel old! (I am 6 years removed from graduating from college).

4) Something you would like to tell incoming students about your program

Do not try to work during the program. There is too much at stake! This is your one shot for medical school, don't screw it up trying to work part time and spreading yourself out too thin! Be prepared to commit yourself full time to your studies... you'll have to do that anyway if (when) you get accepted to medical school! Get on a student budget now!

5) Tips for students applying to your program

Yes, you must take the GRE to get accepted to this program. Just add it to the list of standardized tests that you have to conquer to realize your dream, and drive on. Apply early to the program, attend the open house to get a good feel for the students in the program, and have a serious heart to heart with yourself (and your family!) about taking this step towards a career in medicine. You get one shot.

6) Did it help you get into medical school?

I am doing the linkage program with Mercer, so yes, MUSM class of 2017!

7) Anything else you'd like to add

Atlanta is a fantastic city, enjoy all it has to offer while you are here. Despite the linkage program with Mercer (who only accepts GA residents), the program has found much success getting students into schools outside of GA. Don't be turned off if you are not a GA resident. This program doesn't care where you are from, they just want you to be dedicated to a future in medicine and serious about your commitment to the program.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)

5

The Agnes Scott PBPM program doesn't get much attention on here. If you have any questions, feel free to PM me!

 

[Vinny]

Can someone please rate or write a review about Lincoln Memorial University- Debusk College of Ostepathic Medicine Post Bacc Program and William Carey College of Osteopathic Medicine Masters of Biomedical Science program.

I would really appreciate it! Thank you.

 

[amlove]

Has anyone been here? It's the George Mason / Georgetown program. I would appreciate a rating.

 

[Toofpaste]

Another poster - Klotek - rated the same SMP I'm in: NYMC 2-year track. Our experiences have been completely different, so take our reviews as you will. Overall my experience has been incredibly positive.

1) The Pros and Cons of their program (structure of the program, learning environment, cost, location, faculty, classes, difficulty, competitiveness, other students, buildings/classrooms/facilities, etc..)

1. Structure/Classes: We take Physio/Biochem/Patho/Histo/Cell Bio - all of these courses (with an exception for Patho) were taught very well overall.
2. Learning Environment: When I was on campus (library/mods), I always felt driven to study. There are almost always students studying, so seeing others hard at work gave me motivation to continue working hard.
3. Cost: I have nothing to say one way or another about tuition. The rent in Westchester (the county the school is in) is incredibly high, so that was a problem.
4. Location: It's in Valhalla, NY - there isn't really much to do in Valhalla itself. However, White Plans (15-20 min drive away) has plenty of bars and lots of things to do. NYC is ~35-40 min away by train, so traveling to the city isn't a problem either. Klotek (the other poster who rated this SMP) was upset about the juvenile detention center/etc that are in the area. Honestly, I don't see how that affects the quality of the SMP at all - I have NEVER run into any problems because of the juvenile detention center being nearby.
5. Faculty: There were a few professors in each of those classes (above) that could have lectured in a more engaging manner, but overall, they were all great. When I visited professors for advising - EVERYONE gave me great advice. The program director - Dr. Lerea - is always honest with you and is very encouraging. He looks at your overall application, and can often tell you exactly how to improve your application for medical school. Other professors were also very helpful in pointing me to research opportunities, volunteering opportunities, etc.
6. Competitiveness: There wasn't any competition between me or others in the program. While I wasn't friends with everyone in the program, my group and I often studied together and shared materials (old exams, notes, lecture recordings). Our studying sessions were very collaborative and I think we made each other better students.
7. Other students: There are plenty of opportunities (bar events, intramural sports, club events, etc) to meet other students in both the grad and med school. I haven't had a single unpleasant experience with another student. Obviously this depends on the group of students that is accepted into the program, but my experience has been very good. I know I will remain friends with many of the students I met here well into the future.
8. Buildings/Classrooms/Facilities: All the classes you take will be in one building - the Basic Sciences Building. The classrooms for the first years is mini-auditorium style. However, in the 2nd year, you tend to take classes that are much smaller in scale. These classes are taught in smaller classrooms in each department. For Pathology we actually ran out of space in the small classroom and had to move back to an auditorium to accommodate the class size.

2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description.
I discussed the traditional classes above. You are required to take Biochem 1&2, Physio 1&2, Cell Biology, and 2 Frontiers classes (read journal articles and present them/write synopsis). In addition to those, you need to take a few electives in your 2nd year. The material we are taught is very similar to what medical students are taught - of course we don't get the same amount of volume in the same time frame, and we don't learn how much about treatment/therapy. However, according to one of the course directors for Physio, we learn 90% of the Physio material that medical students learn. Additionally, when I looked at medical school old exams while taking these courses, I was able to answer the majority of their questions correctly.

3) Something they wished they knew coming into the program
Geese poop EVERYWHERE. Course Director for Biochem is not the head of the Biochem department.

4) Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program

1. If you're in this program to get into medical school, you should be prepared to work hard. A handful of students in my program decided to treat it as an extension of undergrad - they often partied instead of remaining focused on school. This was reflected in their grades. To put things in perspective, I work about 40-60 hoursweek (hospital volunteer/lab work/MCAT tutor), and then go to class for 8 hours/week, and then study for at least 16 hours/week. This puts a serious cramp on time spent with the gf/family/friends, but it resulted in me maintaining a 3.97 GPA (my AMCAS cGPA for undergrad is 3.1) While I couldn't hang out with friends to the same level that I did in undergrad, if I managed my time wisely I had plenty of social interaction.
2. There is no linkage - you are not guaranteed admittance to NYMC if you go to this program.

5) Tips for students applying to your program
Get to know Dr. Lerea well. He is an AMAZING resource and a great help for your medical school application. Study hard before you play hard! If you need to retake the MCAT, do so after your first year. Physio and Biochem will help you ACE the Bio section.

6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?
I am applying in the current cycle - so I can't say anything about this. From my group of friends (total of 8), 3/3 people who applied to MD schools got in. The rest of us are applying this cycle.

7) Anything else you'd like to add
I had a very positive experience in this program, but I worked incredibly hard while in it. The only BAD thing I could say about the program is that it doesn't have a linkage - you aren't guaranteed admittance into NYMC if you do well in the program. However, making contacts in the school while in the program will definitely help your chances.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)
4 - It's a great program, except for the fact that it doesn't have linkage.

 

[saxofoonie]

Can someone please rate or write a review about Lincoln Memorial University- Debusk College of Ostepathic Medicine Post Bacc Program and William Carey College of Osteopathic Medicine Masters of Biomedical Science program.

I would really appreciate it! Thank you.

 

[Fire Cupper]

Can anybody give me some personal experiences with Loyola's Master of science in Medical physiology and Midwestern (AZ) master of arts in biomedical science? I got accepted into both program and can't decide which to go to. any suggestions?

 

[cocoxaurus]

Can anyone give a review on the Drexel IHS program? I would really appreciate it.

I recently got accepted, but would like some insight from someone who has completed the program.

Thank you in advance.

 

[CriticalCond]

Had some extra time at work so I made this key. It's not perfect, so if you would like to edit/improve, just quote and change. Thanks to all the alumni who have come back and made comments. It's amazing how much good information is in this thread.

I listed the program name or acronym and the post numbers where it is reviewed or referenced. The formatting is weird because I pasted from excel, but I think it's still readable. Not everyone followed the format posted in the beginning, but I tried to catch any post that contained pertinent information.

Agness Scott Postbacc 314
Barry U MBS 147, 173
Boston U MAMS 23, 84, 138, 183, 215, 216, 229, 280
Bryn Mawr 72
Cleveland State U Postbacc 190
Columbia Postbacc 15, 83
Columbia SMP in Human Nutrition 9
CUNY Hunter College Postbacc 226, 266
Drexel DPMS 227
Drexel IMS 65, 124, 161, 195, 210, 228, 267
Drexel IMS Sacramento 224
Georgetown Postbacc 145
Georgetown SMP in Physiology 4, 12, 196, 199
Goucher Postbacc Program 5/11/0182
Hampton MMS 236
Harvard Extension 86
Hofstra 312
IUPUI Pre-Prof Masters 179, 205, 253, 255, 278
Keck MSGM 294
Loyola (Chicago) 7, 25, 81, 92, 102, 197
Manhattanville 225
Midwestern MBS 141
Mills Postbacc 87, 146
Mississippi College MMS 189, 279
Northwestern SCS 46
NYMC 100, 317
PCOM Postbacc 148
Penn Postbacc 28
Penn Special Sciences 139
Regis MBS 230
Rosalind Franklin MBS 293
Scripps COllege Postbacc 212, 218
Temple ACMS/BCMS 237,238, 239, 245
Temple Postbacc 178
TouroCOM NY SMP 192
Tulane ACP 36, 163
U Cinn MS in Physiology 123, 288, 291
U Rochester Postbacc 258
UCLA RAP 118
UMDNJ 90
VCU Premedical Health Sciences Certificate 2

 

[schwasted589]

Can someone please rate or write a review about Lincoln Memorial University- Debusk College of Ostepathic Medicine Post Bacc Program and William Carey College of Osteopathic Medicine Masters of Biomedical Science program.

I would really appreciate it! Thank you.

I remember when I was looking at programs, it sucked that no one had rated LMU so here it goes. Remember that there's been a lot of changes that have been put into place for next year. Instead of just one track that everyone followed, this next year there's going to be 3 proposed tracks and you can pick and choose the elective classes on your own. Regardless, I'm sure the criteria for admission will be the same (looking at performance in MGA, histo) so here's a breakdown of the program:

1) The Pros and Cons of their program (structure of the program, learning environment, cost, location, faculty, classes, difficulty, competitiveness, other students, buildings/classrooms/facilities, etc..)

Pros:
- Faculty/admissions really cares about watching you succeed
-You get to take medical school classes (MGA, Histology, Neuroscience--not sure if they're letting PMSP students take Physiology next year) WITH the med students
-If you do well in the med school classes (>80%), and you get into DCOM, you don't have to take those classes the following year
-Lots of study rooms with TV that you can plug your laptop into
-Awesome anatomy lab (PMSP students in the past have gotten to take a Prosection class 2nd semester so that really helps with Anatomy)
-The non med school classes aren't very rigorous (LMU isn't exactly a very competitive UG institution)
-VERY friendly environment; everyone for the most part tries to help each other
Location: I guess it was a plus for me because it was easy to study; no distractions. It's very safe and I felt comfortable walking around and driving to town to run errands. VERY different from city life.
-Extremely high linkage. They won't say it's a guarantee but you really have to screw up to not get in. The school wants to retain their post-bacc students and they'll do their best to help you out.

Cons:
-It was around 30,000 dollars for us, which was expensive
-Location: it's VERY rural. The town has 3,000 people...and really crappy fast-food joints.
-No starbucks (they have one of those "Brew Starbucks" coffee shops in the student center but it has odd hours and it's not super close to the med school building)
-Was slightly unorganized because of changes in admin for the PMSP program and other changes, but I think they ironed most of that out for next year.

2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description.
I can only speak for previous years so take this with a grain of salt because the curriculum is changing quite a bit.

MGA (medical gross anatomy): a 7.5 unit class you take with med students. There's the lecture portion and the lab portion. Lectures are usually in the morning and labs are 2 x a week in the afternoon. In lab you're assigned to a body with 4-5 other people and you dissect according to the syllabus. Every 3-4 weeks, there's a block exam with a lecture component and a lab/practical component in the afternoon. The practical is where they pin structures and you walk around and identify them/answer secondary questions about the. Dr. Cross is a GEM of a person. I went and spoke with him numerous times and he was really helpful and supportive about things. He flies through his lectures but a majority of his questions are fairly straightforward. Dr. Hermey is hilarious and she does a lot of the abdomen lectures in anatomy. Also very helpful and willing to come into lab before exams and help you out. Dr. Shirley is a bit intimidating but is a GENIUS and does a few lectures. She's usually in lab during lab times and will come around and help you/ answer questions while you're dissecting.

Histology: (this past year, it was split into 2 courses-- Histo I in the Fall and Histo II in the Spring).
This class was definitely NOT one of my favorites. Dr. Bassett is VERY straightforward and her slides are fairly organized which is PERFECT because she only tests on material from her powerpoints. There's lecture in the mornings and once a week, there's TBL (team based learning) exercises. You're basically with the same group of 4-5 people and you take a short individual quiz on the week's lecture. Then you go over the answers as a group. After that, you're giving an "application" exercise and you answer the questions with your group. The application questions tend to be ones that generate debate/discussion. So after all groups have submitted their answers, you go over each questions one by one together with the entire class. I really didn't like it and felt like it was a waste of my time (almost everyone else I spoke to felt the same way). This year, I heard that Histo is going to be all one class, spanning most of the 1st semester. This might be better since a lot of post-baccs didn't do well, as the entire grade in the class was based on only 2 tests

Neuroscience: This class was offered to PMSP students in the Spring, given that they got >80% in MGA/Histology. It was taught by Dr. Leo, who's also the Dean of Students, and a really great lecturer. The class was difficult but extremely interesting.

Prosection: Not sure if next year's post-bacc class will have a chance to take this but anyone that got >80 in MGA/histo first semester was able to sign up. We basically chose our groups (4-5 people) and dissected a cadaver from beginning to end. It was supposed to be fairly relaxed but there were some issues with communication/TAs/leadership/etc. In the end it ended up being okay. Took far too much time and unless you're REALLY into dissecting (I'm not), I wouldn't recommend taking it.

The undergrad classes will be changing immensely since it's not a Master's program but if they're anything like the ones we took, I wouldn't worry too much. Go to class, memorize the powerpoints, and you'll end up with at least a B+.

3) Something they wished they knew coming into the program

How to study for MGA right off the bat. It's really hard to do well if you do extremely poorly on the first exam and I know that happened to quite a bit of people. And just how invested the faculty/admissions associated with the program are in ensuring that post-bacc students get in to DCOM.

4) Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program

Do your work, stay on everyone's good side and you'll be fine. The med students at DCOM are incredibly encouraging, as are previous years' post-baccs. If you're having trouble/confused bout anything, school related or not, feel comfortable asking anyone.

5) Tips for students applying to your program

Make sure your MCAT is above a 22 (at the very least a 20) and your extra curriculars and everything are in order before the program. It's incredibly hard to do well in MGA and Histo AND study/do well on the MCAT. Don't do anything that'll compromise your shot of getting in. Also, take advantage of the friendliness of the faculty: if you're having trouble, go talk to them. They'll listen and give you advice.

6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?

I liked DCOM so much, I didn't want to apply anywhere else. I know a few people did get into other places though. With the exception of 4 people, everyone else is coming here.

7) Anything else you'd like to add

Focus on doing well in MGA, because it'll be the most important determinant of admission the following year AND because you don't want to retake it (there's a few people having to do that next year and they're not happy). After that, your MCAT will matter most. Just make sure you keep your GPA up with the undergrad classes but don't sweat too much about them.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)

4
The undergrad classes were a complete waste of time and prosection was unnecessarily stressful but other than that, I owe everything to this program. Last year I had no idea what I was going to do with my life and now i'm starting medical school in the Fall--with a lighter course load to make the transition even easier. I've met some really amazing students/faculty and I'm really glad I'm going to be here for the next few years.

If you have any other questions, feel free to PM me.

 

[bgbg22]

These reviews are great, I am just curious, does anyone have a link/ or list of the schools that are linkage schools?

 

[PostBaccHopeful]

Had some extra time at work so I made this key. It's not perfect, so if you would like to edit/improve, just quote and change. Thanks to all the alumni who have come back and made comments. It's amazing how much good information is in this thread.

I listed the program name or acronym and the post numbers where it is reviewed or referenced. The formatting is weird because I pasted from excel, but I think it's still readable. Not everyone followed the format posted in the beginning, but I tried to catch any post that contained pertinent information.

Agness Scott Postbacc 314
Barry U MBS 147, 173
Boston U MAMS 23, 84, 138, 183, 215, 216, 229, 280
Bryn Mawr 72
Cleveland State U Postbacc 190
Columbia Postbacc 15, 83
Columbia SMP in Human Nutrition 9
CUNY Hunter College Postbacc 226, 266
Drexel DPMS 227
Drexel IMS 65, 124, 161, 195, 210, 228, 267
Drexel IMS Sacramento 224
Georgetown Postbacc 145
Georgetown SMP in Physiology 4, 12, 196, 199
Goucher Postbacc Program 5/11/0182
Hampton MMS 236
Harvard Extension 86
Hofstra 312
IUPUI Pre-Prof Masters 179, 205, 253, 255, 278
Keck MSGM 294
Loyola (Chicago) 7, 25, 81, 92, 102, 197
Manhattanville 225
Midwestern MBS 141
Mills Postbacc 87, 146
Mississippi College MMS 189, 279
Northwestern SCS 46
NYMC 100, 317
PCOM Postbacc 148
Penn Postbacc 28
Penn Special Sciences 139
Regis MBS 230
Rosalind Franklin MBS 293
Scripps COllege Postbacc 212, 218
Temple ACMS/BCMS 237,238, 239, 245
Temple Postbacc 178
TouroCOM NY SMP 192
Tulane ACP 36, 163
U Cinn MS in Physiology 123, 288, 291
U Rochester Postbacc 258
UCLA RAP 118
UMDNJ 90
VCU Premedical Health Sciences Certificate 2

Kudos for making this list! It really makes it a lot easier for everyone to refer back to each specific program. You've immensely saved a lot of my time and others I'm sure! Thank youuuuu!!! You're truly amazing

 

[Chip90]

Program: MBS at The Commonwealth Medical College in Scranton, PA
Year: 2012-2013

Let me start by saying why I needed a program like this. Most of my courses in undergrad were non-Bio (Physics major) and my core courses had a lot of bad grades. I needed something to bring up my GPA.

1) The Pros and Cons of their program (structure of the program, learning environment, cost, location, faculty, classes, difficulty, competitiveness, other students, buildings/classrooms/facilities, etc..)

Pros: Classes (good), faculty (what made the classes great), building (new building, small, great space to study in), Difficulty (great step up from undergrad courses to get you ready for medical school), Students (once you see the same group for a year, you become close to them)

Neutral: Cost (about the same at other programs) & Competitiveness (not as competitive against other programs because it's newer)

Cons:Structure (they are working on this, but there have been a lot of changes in the program every year- ie they stopped curving courses our year), their MBS to MD student acceptance (see #7)

2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description.

We've taken some excellent courses. Coming from a non-bio background in undergrad, this program helped me immensely learn about: Biochem, Epidemiology, Genetics, Physiology, Histology, Pharmacology, Cell Bio, Immunology, and Neuroscience. All of these courses were taught by some of the best professors I have encountered. They were all very willing to help and knowledgeable in the material.

3) Something they wished they knew coming into the program

I wish I was a bit better prepared for the amount of material that comes at you in the beginning. Going from 100 slides a week in undergrad to 100 in a day was a difficult transition. Also see #7.

4) Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program

Carefully consider your options. If you go here, make sure you know that it's a RISK. See # 7.

5) Tips for students applying to your program

Interview is laid back, but be prepared for it. Be on your best behavior during the student panels and the tour. Ask questions, but be polite. Everything is reported back..

6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?

To a point. It did not help me get into TCMC, which was the point. But I had 8/9 interviews and i think TCMC MBS definitely helped me land those interviews. Did it help me get into where I am going next year UMDNJ-SOM? Not exactly. They wanted a full years worth of work before I applied to the med school. Since I applied while I did MBS, they didn't count my grades really from the first semester in MBS.

7) Anything else you'd like to add

Let me preface this section by saying that different classmates would have different opinions when I come to the topic. I will use this space to expand on a con.

TCMC MBS Class of 2012 was about 40 students large. About half applied and ~10 were accepted.

TCMC MBS Class of 2013 was about 65 students large. About half applied. ~9 students were accepted.

So acceptance went from ~50% to ~30% of the students that applied.

I will just speak a little about the Class of 2012 (before me)- there were 5 students with 4.0s and only 1 got in. What does that mean? I don't know. Maybe they had bad ugrad GPAs or bad MCAT. Maybe. An important change that I should mention is that they stopped curving (which was only done in some courses).

Speaking about my year (Class of 2013), I can say that students that were not accepted including me were students with 3.6 and 3.8 GPAs. Heck, some of us were accepted into the Honors society, but weren't accepted to the med program. So what does this mean? Once again, not 100% sure. But to go back the 2012-2013 MBS thread, a student mentioned reasons why students may have not been accepted (their year) with good grades. Well I had the following: 3.0+ uGPA, 30+ MCAT, volunteered in undergrad, was in student council in MBS, started a club with another classmate, tutored, and had excellent letter of recommendations.. I can go on and on, but I think this brings the point across. I was liked by peers and more importantly professors. I am a polite person and always spoke with respect to professors. Many professors were not just disappointed, but disgruntled to hear I, along with certain other classmates were not accepted. But they don't really have a hand in the admissions process.

Here are some theories that I came up with that helped students get in:

1. A lot of accepted students interviewed with Dr. Tracey, which I think helped since he definitely has a voice in the school. (But this is up to chance, or at least seems to be so)

2. There was a big, big change in leadership. The director of admissions left the school in December to another school and a new director was brought in August for that. It feels this may have played a role in this.

3. This may be a little out there, but it seems that "they" (I don't know who they is..) decided who they wanted in the school the first semester. I'm not sure what they liked specifically, but these students obviously caught the eye of admissions. Again, this is a bit out there.

So here is my issue with all of this. If you have decent undergrad stats, a good MCAT score, overall helpful person in school, do well in classes, it makes sense that it shouldn't be a RISK to get into the med program. I was fortunate to have other acceptances, but a lot of students that were in my boat (waitlisted) did not have that. And they will be applying for the upcoming cycle, which is just unfortunate.

Maybe some other programs are like this, but speaking to friends at other programs (2), they both said that those who got into their medical school did well. People that did not get in either did not do well in the program or had large problems with GPA or MCAT from undergrad. This is why I cannot really recommend this program.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)

2; Knowing what I know now, I would not do this program again. I would have loved to be a part of it when it was smaller however.

 

[common man]

People that did not get in either did not do well in the program or had large problems with GPA or MCAT from undergrad. This is why I cannot really recommend this program.

Thank you for this EXCELLENT, objective review. I thought the whole point of the SMP was to address that!

1) Do you take classes side by side with med students? Even if no, then I'd still imagine that a strong performance in recognizable biomedical classes at a medical school would hold enough weight to address the GPA (provided that MCAT and other things are solid).

This has always perplexed me - how can adcoms ignore As in med school classes? I've heard similar complaints for some other SMP programs.

2) To be fair, we should look at the success rate for people who apply AFTER doing the program. the 30-50% number you mentioned were for people whose grades did not come out until January. By that point, only a few interview slots remain.

3) It's possible that your sGPA held you back (which I assume was lower than 3.6) but I'm still perplexed because I thought SMP addresses sGPA and cGPA.

Thanks again for the review. It was very useful.

 

[plasmamorris]

I think Chip90 did a good job relating the pros and cons of the program. I think he emphasized risk, which I agree with. However, I think his rating of 2 is based on his experience and not that of everyone in the program. Knowing what I know, I would give the program a 4, with the amount of risk being the only thing that knocks any points off. I'll say this - I know Chip personally, and his situation and circumstances were very different from mine. He had acceptances at other SMPs which I think influence his rating of 2. If anyone takes the time to read my history of posts - my only option was TCMC MBS or the Caribbeans. TCMC gave me an opportunity, no one else would even touch me. My grades were that radioactive.

One thing I would add is that he didn't reference the number of individuals who got in the year after MBS. 7 additional kids from the class of 2012 got in. That brings their number up to 50% of their entire class, given that some kids were dental, some were pre-vet, some simply dropped out. I think the bigger issue was the change in class sizes which simply couldn't accommodate all of the kids from the previous class. The class of 2012 MBS class was ~40 kids, the class of 2016 MD class that they would have matriculated into was ~70 kids. While the class of 20I7 MD class will be ~100 kids. They had overflow of kids who were great from the previous MBS class to take. Hell, I think we even have a charter MBS student with us next year (that's 4 years after she was in MBS). I will say, I've learned more about the individuals who had 4.0s and didn't get in - one was found to have a DUI and his application was subsequently dropped and another had below a 25 MCAT (while TCMC's standards may be lower than others - they're not low enough for a 25).

I also have to stress the value of personal statements and interviews. While I know as pre-meds we don't value these items as strongly because they're not as concrete - I know TCMC places a lot of emphasis on them. Their secondary is huge compared to other MD or DO schools. This also may have contributed to why students weren't accepted. I know while Chip may be disappointed he didn't get in, I know many of us were similarly disappointed he didn't get in - his peers who didn't get in DID have bigger issues with their entire application and lower GPAs in the program. In that case - TCMC leaves you with zero room for error.

Simply put - I had a sub 3.0 uGPA but a stronger MCAT - I knew I had to do as well as I could in the program. A 3.5 doesn't cut it when you don't have the undergrad grades to back it up.

Beggars can't be choosers - this was the mentality I went in with. While getting into TCMC is great - getting into any medical school was my goal. If that's your goal - TCMC will provide you with a platform to improve your circumstances and get interviews. You absolutely have to seize the opportunity though.

At the end of the day - you'll see I do a lot of defense for TCMC and I think my ultimate opinion comes down to this - it's a competitive process and we're all great ppl at the end of the day, but they simply don't have room for every single GPA comeback story, otherwise it would be a school full of kids who spent 3 years in pre-clinical sciences. MBS would honestly be just a M0.5. You have to really look at your circumstances and try your absolute best. You can't knock a program for giving the opportunity to succeed even if they themselves don't give you an acceptance. Chip said it himself - he attributes a lot of his interviews to TCMC. If he didn't get into UMDNJ - he still would have gotten into other schools. Even I got other allopathic interviews and I know that that's only because of TCMC. Many of my classmates got interview - many who didn't even get interviews at TCMC!

Any SMP has risk. TCMC has a good amount of risk - but they do get kids into their MD program. You're going to learn a lot and be prepared for your first year of medical school be it at TCMC or anywhere else. It's structured and the administration is really there to help you succeed - which is rare in higher level education. I would recommend this program if you don't have other options. I would even recommend this program over established DO SMPs. The level of organization, the resources, and the ultimate benefits are great.

I hope that adds more depth and dimension to Chips review.

 

[MedWonk]

Hey guys, as part of trying to continually improving the postbac forums to help SDN students looking into postbacs/SMPs, Id like to ask students here who are going through their SMP/Postbac, or have graduated since to rate their program.

FIRST: List your program and your year and then

Specifically, Id like to see users here comment about

1) The Pros and Cons of their program (structure of the program, learning environment, cost, location, faculty, classes, difficulty, competitiveness, other students, buildings/classrooms/facilities, etc..)
2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description.
3) Something they wished they knew coming into the program
4) Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program
5) Tips for students applying to your program
6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?
7) Anything else you'd like to add
8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)


Note to students reading: A majority of these ratings will be subjective and will vary from student to student within the same program. This is just another resource to help our SDN students out

-Brandon

Harvard Extension Review

1) The program is fairly unstructured. There is only a bare bones framework in place that guides you through which prerequisites are required and what is required for a committee letter. Otherwise, you're basically on you own. The Health Careers Program office is, however, very helpful if you ever need some guidance, but they expect the student to go out and seek help when they need it. There's very little hand-holding.

The classrooms are nothing special. They're typical college lecture halls and classrooms. The air conditioning in the Science Center is either on full-blast or not at all.

The cost makes the program unbeatable in the Boston area. Each class costs about the same as taking a class at a public school's continuing ed program. The prerequisites seem tougher than what is normally encountered at most colleges. The location is Cambridge, which essentially puts you right next door to some of the best healthcare facilities in the world. The city itself is clean and safe with plenty of amenities. It's a great place to be if you want to live in an urban environment but want someplace more low-key.

Competitiveness is fairly low. There was always a cooperative atmosphere.

2) I took the prerequisites as well as intro psych, calculus, and a couple of upper level bio classes. Intro psych was easy. The science and math classes were fairly challenging, but not overly difficult. Getting an A is quite a challenge, while getting an A- typically not as much. The A- is attainable for anyone who works hard. Getting an A takes an extra bit of effort and requires spending a tremendous amount of time studying, moreso than most are probably accustomed to.

3) I wish I knew more about how financial aid worked in this program. You only get one year of financial aid. After that, you need to find a way to pay for it without federal loans.

4) Cost of living is fairly high. Don't bring your car, sell it. You have to be fairly aggressive in seeking out an apartment. If you're from CA or TX, we apparently don't have the mexican food you're looking for. If you're from NY or NJ, it's pizza.

5) Work you ass off. Don't be afraid to ask lots of questions. Be sure to get yourself a pint or two at the Queenshead.

6) TBD, but those applying ahead of me who have gotten a committee letter from the Extension School have been quite successful. Something like 80% get in the first time.

8) I give it a 5

 

[Chip90]

Thank you for this EXCELLENT, objective review. I thought the whole point of the SMP was to address that!

1) Do you take classes side by side with med students? Even if no, then I'd still imagine that a strong performance in recognizable biomedical classes at a medical school would hold enough weight to address the GPA (provided that MCAT and other things are solid).

This has always perplexed me - how can adcoms ignore As in med school classes? I've heard similar complaints for some other SMP programs.

2) To be fair, we should look at the success rate for people who apply AFTER doing the program. the 30-50% number you mentioned were for people whose grades did not come out until January. By that point, only a few interview slots remain.

3) It's possible that your sGPA held you back (which I assume was lower than 3.6) but I'm still perplexed because I thought SMP addresses sGPA and cGPA.

Thanks again for the review. It was very useful.

1. No, we have separate physical classes, but our lectures slides do often overlap. The best way to put it I guess is that although the course may be similar (for example Cell Biology), we only have to know some aspect about diseases and we go more in depth into the science whereas med students learn about- well medicine.

2. Yes that is true and plasmamorris has talked about this. People from MBS 20112 were accepted (~7) to the MD Class of 2017. Yes, there are fewer seats, but they still had enough seats to hand out if they would have liked to MBS students.

3. Yes, my sGPA was not very high, 3.2- but still thats the whole point of this program isn't it? If I had a 3.6 sGPA I would have no reason to do this program

And no problem, I'm glad this helped.

I think Chip90 did a good job relating the pros and cons of the program. I think he emphasized risk, which I agree with. However, I think his rating of 2 is based on his experience and not that of everyone in the program. Knowing what I know, I would give the program a 4, with the amount of risk being the only thing that knocks any points off. I'll say this - I know Chip personally, and his situation and circumstances were very different from mine. He had acceptances at other SMPs which I think influence his rating of 2. If anyone takes the time to read my history of posts - my only option was TCMC MBS or the Caribbeans. TCMC gave me an opportunity, no one else would even touch me. My grades were that radioactive.

One thing I would add is that he didn't reference the number of individuals who got in the year after MBS. 7 additional kids from the class of 2012 got in. That brings their number up to 50% of their entire class, given that some kids were dental, some were pre-vet, some simply dropped out. I think the bigger issue was the change in class sizes which simply couldn't accommodate all of the kids from the previous class. The class of 2012 MBS class was ~40 kids, the class of 2016 MD class that they would have matriculated into was ~70 kids. While the class of 20I7 MD class will be ~100 kids. They had overflow of kids who were great from the previous MBS class to take. Hell, I think we even have a charter MBS student with us next year (that's 4 years after she was in MBS). I will say, I've learned more about the individuals who had 4.0s and didn't get in - one was found to have a DUI and his application was subsequently dropped and another had below a 25 MCAT (while TCMC's standards may be lower than others - they're not low enough for a 25).

I also have to stress the value of personal statements and interviews. While I know as pre-meds we don't value these items as strongly because they're not as concrete - I know TCMC places a lot of emphasis on them. Their secondary is huge compared to other MD or DO schools. This also may have contributed to why students weren't accepted. I know while Chip may be disappointed he didn't get in, I know many of us were similarly disappointed he didn't get in - his peers who didn't get in DID have bigger issues with their entire application and lower GPAs in the program. In that case - TCMC leaves you with zero room for error.

Simply put - I had a sub 3.0 uGPA but a stronger MCAT - I knew I had to do as well as I could in the program. A 3.5 doesn't cut it when you don't have the undergrad grades to back it up.

Beggars can't be choosers - this was the mentality I went in with. While getting into TCMC is great - getting into any medical school was my goal. If that's your goal - TCMC will provide you with a platform to improve your circumstances and get interviews. You absolutely have to seize the opportunity though.

At the end of the day - you'll see I do a lot of defense for TCMC and I think my ultimate opinion comes down to this - it's a competitive process and we're all great ppl at the end of the day, but they simply don't have room for every single GPA comeback story, otherwise it would be a school full of kids who spent 3 years in pre-clinical sciences. MBS would honestly be just a M0.5. You have to really look at your circumstances and try your absolute best. You can't knock a program for giving the opportunity to succeed even if they themselves don't give you an acceptance. Chip said it himself - he attributes a lot of his interviews to TCMC. If he didn't get into UMDNJ - he still would have gotten into other schools. Even I got other allopathic interviews and I know that that's only because of TCMC. Many of my classmates got interview - many who didn't even get interviews at TCMC!

Any SMP has risk. TCMC has a good amount of risk - but they do get kids into their MD program. You're going to learn a lot and be prepared for your first year of medical school be it at TCMC or anywhere else. It's structured and the administration is really there to help you succeed - which is rare in higher level education. I would recommend this program if you don't have other options. I would even recommend this program over established DO SMPs. The level of organization, the resources, and the ultimate benefits are great.

I hope that adds more depth and dimension to Chips review.

Haha, hey there plasmamorris- I see that I've got a cyberstalker

plasmamorris has added a lot of great points here.

Look, I understand my score of a 2 may come off as biased because I was placed on the wait list. But what do you think will happen next year? Students applying from our class include a pretty large number, with a decent amount of people who won't get it I fear. I would say that for as many 4s are given, there are just as many 2s and 3s. And unless the increase the seats they allocate to MBS from a number to a percentage, this is going to be a perpetual thing.

And right, I forgot to mention the MD class size got bigger for this entering year. I guess that didn't help us like I thought it would.

About the GPA in the program, I can't believe I didn't mention that. You BETTER have a 3.8 or 4.0 if you want a good shot at this program. I know very, very few that got in with lower grades from our class. Here's the thing though, this wasn't the case until our class began. When I began the program, the Director of Admissions (who left mid year) told me having a 3.5+ is excellent and should get you into the MD program as long as everything else is good. That is a good GPA, but maybe not good enough to get into their MD program. People with 3.2s got in from MBS 2012. So make sure your grades are very good.

And to address his last 2 paragraphs, I agree, TCMC MBS is better than not doing any sort of MBS program. Or doing one that isn't very good (by that I mean not having many medical courses to take). Although I had a SMPs I got into, this was the best one and I came here. Yes, I learned a lot and I'll always have that knowledge.

But you know? When someone has the options between this program and other good ones, they need to ask themselves where they can get into the school's MD program the best from. There are definitely SMPs out there that are better at getting students into their medical program. And the funny thing is that those Masters programs' are bigger, 150 students some of them, and they still get a lot of students into their MD class.

 

[plasmamorris]

But you know? When someone has the options between this program and other good ones, they need to ask themselves where they can get into the school's MD program the best from. There are definitely SMPs out there that are better at getting students into their medical program. And the funny thing is that those Masters programs' are bigger, 150 students some of them, and they still get a lot of students into their MD class.

I agree, TCMC could do a better job of getting people in within the same year. I also agree that I would not rate TCMC over Georgetown, Cinci, or BU and Tufts. Programs like Temple and Tulane are a little different breed, but are also empirically better. Those are better programs in every sense of the word. The name recognition will take you far. Would I rank TCMC over PCOM, Midwestern, or UMDNJ (DO or Bio Masters)? Hell yes.

I'm simply speaking for the ppl who literally have TCMC or some other no name SMPs and are trying their absolute best to make something out of nothing. Those are the people I can speak to because that was my background.

Honestly - if you're sitting at a 3.3 - 3.5 uGPA...you have options outside of TCMC's SMP and way more to think about besides just grades. For those of us with GPAs around a 3.0 +/- .1 - TCMC is a good bet to get you somewhere, if not TCMC.

I'm not sure how much longer TCMC can claim this, but until someone tells me otherwise I'll reiterate what a lot of people have told me - TCMC is a new school. This SMP is 5 years old. Cinci and Georgetown have been around for more than 20 years. If their class sizes are larger and they get more ppl in - it's because they can trust the program and they know their admissions stats very well. TCMC is redefining their stats and their standards every year.

I think while Chip and I are going back and forth - fundamentally we agree that there is risk associated with TCMC. I don't doubt that I was an absolute best outcome from this program - but to be honest, the best advice I can give any SMP or med school hopeful is to visualize yourself being the absolute best outcome and have a plan to make that a reality. Don't leave anything to chance. Get a 4.0, participate in everything possible, get your name and face out there, talk to as many ppl (in administration!) as possible, get your personal and secondaries read and re-read by screeners/parents/friends. You're selling yourself - why in the world would you ever go in without doing everything possible to make the sale?

We're both saying the same information from two different perspectives and I think that's a real benefit to a good chunk of people. Do your best, do some real introspection about your app and your personality, and figure out the absolute best situation for you.

Best of luck to anyone going into an SMP this year and hopefully both Chip and I will see you on the other side. We're rooting for all of you.

 

[jondoe666]

hi guys so i've been accepted into drexel IMS and tcmc MBS and fater reading so many summaries of each program in this thread, i can say i'm more lost than ever. i have 3.0ugpa, 30mcat (9/10/11). does that mean i would have a better chance of getting into med school by going with tcmc like plamsamorris says?

 

[PerpetualNovice]

Anyone go through Eastern Mennonite University MA in Biomedicine (SMP)?

 

[Lytokayn]

Tulane Masters in Pharmacology? Thanks

 

[freshbagels]

Tulane Masters in Pharmacology? Thanks

Sure thing.

Tulane MS Pharmacologyhttps://tulane.edu/som/departments/pharmacology/masters/

1) The Pros and Cons of their program (structure of the program, learning environment, cost, location, faculty, classes, difficulty, competitiveness, other students, buildings/classrooms/facilities, etc..)

Tulane's program is a master's degree granting one through the School of Medicine. The core of the program is the Medical Pharmacology course, taken alongside second year Tulane medical students. It runs mid-July through the end of April, but the bulk of the work is complete by the end of March when you take the NBME Pharmacology shelf exam.

The other major course, Principles of Pharmacology, is essentially a supplementary class for the MS students. It covers (briefly) much of the background that the medical students get in their first or second years.

There's no two ways about it: it's a hard program. Med Pharm and Principles take up a lot of time to study for, you cover a ton of material, and you're expected to perform at or above the level of the medical students. I began the year with weak study habits and finished it with strong ones.

A small class size (between 25 and 30 - we had 28) engenders a close learning environment. There is little to no 'gunner' competition between students; in fact, I'd argue that a good study group is essential for having a successful year. Despite the fact that you take Med Pharm with the medical students, there wasn't a lot of overlap (social or otherwise) with the SoM kids. They are usually more concerned with their Pathology class than Pharm.

In terms of getting in: I did it with a <3 uGPA and no MCAT. They want to accept people that apply, you just need to give them a compelling reason to do so (in my case, a convincing story, upward trend, and high GRE).

The professors, like anywhere, are hit and miss. Most are great teachers, write fair tests, and are responsive to student questions. A few are pretty clearly there for their research first, but on the balance you will receive great instruction.

2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description.

In addition to the aforementioned Med Pharm and Principles classes, you also take Mol/Cell Pharm (essentially biochem & cell biology), Cell Control Mechanisms (more cell bio), Advances in Pharm (presentation based), a Seminar, and, in the spring, Endocrine Pharm (discussion & presentation based) and Cardiobiology (presentation based).

In the spring particularly, you give a lot of presentations. We had 3 presentation based classes, leadng to each student giving 7 or 8 talks over the course of the semester. On the bright side, you learn to read, analyze, and present scientific papers - but it can feel like you're constantly working on a powerpoint at times.

3) Something they wished they knew coming into the program

The value of good flashcard skills! I used Anki for all of my courses, but it was especially helpful for Med Pharm. I pulled out a 4.0 thanks to brute memorization of tons of drugs.

4) Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program

Work hard and do well. A poor performance will sink your medical school hopes. One of the benefits to the MS Pharm is that Dr. Beckman, the associate Dean for Admissions at Tulane Med, is a professor. She is a big help when it comes to applications: she's blunt and honest, and doesn't pull any punches. She will tell you if you're not competitive for Tulane. Something to keep in mind is that, unlike the ACP, there are no guarantees to get in to Tulane, even if you do well. With such a large pool of applicants, med schools have their pick of applicants who don't need to do a post-bac program to enhance their credentials. Various pre-med post-bac programs have sprung up like weeds over the last 10 years - thankfully, Tulane's program is pretty well established, and you take a med school course, so the LoR you get from the Program Coordinator spells out your performance relative to both other students in your class and the med school at large.

There isn't a ton of time to work during the program. You'll be too busy. Some kids did research - I don't think anyone published anything this year, but I could be wrong.

5) Tips for students applying to your program

Have a good narrative to explain your sub-par undergrad performance.

6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?

I'm applying right now, so I'll update this after the year and let you all know. Out of 28, I think 15 or so applied during the year. Around 10 got in (1 to dental school, 3 to Tulane, a couple to DO schools). The rest of us are applying now.
edit: Well, I was accepted to an MD school - Cooper!! During the interview, my MS GPA was looked upon favorably and seemed to outweigh my previous uGPA. However, having spoken to several other schools at which I was rejected, some did not realize that this was an SMP-type program with medical school courses; they saw the "Health" course classification on AMCAS and summarily dismissed the program. I was able to appeal this with at least one school (Wayne State) but others basically told me "tough luck" (VCU, BU).

7) Anything else you'd like to add

New Orleans is an awesome city. I chose Tulane over a couple of other programs specifically because I wanted to experience life in a brand new part of the country. The nightlife, when you have time to go out, is incredible. I liked Nola so much I decided to stay for another year and do my AmeriCorps here while applying!

Cost: Tuition and fees come out to around $27k. Total COA is like $47k or so. It's not ludicrously expensive compared to other programs, but it isn't cheap.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)

I'd give it a 4. If you can hack it, pull out a good GPA, and get some good letters of rec, it will certainly help your med school app.

 

[sharpieLIFE]

How intense were the presentations? Like thesis length? Group presentations?
Thanks so much for the review of the program though!
Does the Pharm program have a ton of students with borderline 3.0uGPA's?

 

[freshbagels]

How intense were the presentations? Like thesis length? Group presentations?
Thanks so much for the review of the program though!
Does the Pharm program have a ton of students with borderline 3.0uGPA's?

They're not intense, really. Group presentations, 30-60 minutes long, reviewing a particular paper that, depending on the class, is either assigned to you or not.

I know of at least 5 students with <3 GPAs, but we are all applying right now so I can't speak to how the Pharm program helped our chances until later in the cycle.

 

[Trillmatic]

Has anyone gone through the University of South Carolina Graduate Certificate in Biomedical Sciences Program? If so, could you provide info on this program?

Thank you.

 

[sharpieLIFE]

Can anyone please review the Tufts MBS program?

 

[structure]

Can someone review Wayne State BMS?

 

[prada2012]

Does anyone know about the NJMS GSBS program? I would like to know how many of the GSBS students actually make the Med school admission for IS or OOS. I am hearing that even 3.5+ GPAs (from GSBS) have very little chances IS (NJMS/RWJ/Cooper). OOS is even harder. Any comments?

 

[deleted248403]

Does anyone know about the NJMS GSBS program? I would like to know how many of the GSBS students actually make the Med school admission for IS or OOS. I am hearing that even 3.5+ GPAs (from GSBS) have very little chances IS (NJMS/RWJ/Cooper). OOS is even harder. Any comments?

As discussed at length in the Newark GSBS thread - they are mostly IIS. There are only like 4-5 OOS in any given med school class, and they dont all come from the GSBS program.

And welcome back to SDN

 

[neuro85]

Hi Trillmatic,

Have you tried the program's website. There is now a frequently ask questions section, which I did not see a few months back when I was looking . Also, what you can do is email the contact person on the website. This is what I did in April and he/she ( I cannot tell from the name) put me in contact with a former student. Below is the response I got from the student:

Thank you for your interest in our Biomedical Science Certificate Program at the University of South Carolina School of Medicine. Currently we have a 72% rate for students accepted into medical/vet/dental school after completion (or while completing) the program. This percentage also includes students accepted after finishing the program and either transferring into the MS program or completing the program and applying the following year.

Our program has been continuously growing, starting in 2009 with eight students and our current class (2012-2013) having 24 students. We are looking at growing our class to 28-34 students for this upcoming year.

As far as research goes, there are many opportunities for research at the school. Typically you can research a professor and go and speak with them. There are always teachers looking for students to do research in their labs.

I was in the BMSC Program from 2011-2012 and I decided to transfer into the Biomedical Science MS program. It takes an additional year (you end up participating in the program for 2 years total). However, if you transfer into the MS program you will not get your certificate, the hours can only count towards 1 degree.

I hope this answers all of your questions.

Please let me know if you have any additional questions, I am more than happy to answer them.

Good luck in your applications,

Answers in regards to out of state acceptance and MCAT prep

We accept about 50% out of state students. This year we have students from states as far as California, but preference is given to students from SC, NC, GA (states closest to SC).

Also, we do not currently have an MCAT prep program. We are working on this for the future but it'll be years down the road. Let me know if you have any other questions,

 

[tomz1385]

Sacramento - Drexel IMS

I posted in the low GPA thread as well, but I guess it might get lost, so I'll post here with some additional information - http://forums.studentdoctor.net/showpost.php?p=13868904&postcount=3051

1) The Pros and Cons of their program (structure of the program, learning environment, cost, location, faculty, classes, difficulty, competitiveness, other students, buildings/classrooms/facilities, etc..)

I love Sacramento because I've lived there my whole life. Some people may want to live in the city (Philadelphia) and have access to lots of places to eat, stores and other things by foot. I like bigger roads and the ability to drive around (and find parking!). Plus I was able to live at home with my parents. Rent is a bit cheaper compared to bigger cities.

Sacramento is a small class, usually between 15-25 students. You'll get to know all your classmates. You can rely on them, make good friends and almost everyone is close to one another... well at least we can stand each other - or know what we all look like! Dr. Tamse and Dr. G (Dr. Dasu too I guess? But he wasn't my adviser so I didn't see him often) and the rest of the Sacramento staff are super nice and they will do everything they can to help you if you need it.

The "campus" is basically just a floor of a large building. You don't need more than that to study. If you were looking for a college experience, this isn't it. It has all the things you need to be successful, and it is a nice place to study and do well.

2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description.

Biochemistry - Tough course. Questions may be tricky for some people. For biochem majors it won't be too bad. We start off with it early in the year, so you need to study this very well because you won't be used to the level of detail required and the types of questions you'll see. Work hard and you'll do well.

Microanatomy - Histology and Cell Bio combined. Lots of slides, lots of memorizing. The time put into this class will directly correlate with what your grade is. Nothing complicated or fancy... just memorize and look at pictures. Dr. Smith - the course director (but not sure for how much longer?) is super nice. I went to visit her at Drexel during my interview, she spent plenty of time to talk to me.

Immunology - Most organized class at Drexel. The material is great, taught very well. Dr. Larson is awesome. If you get into Drexel you'll have her for Genetics too. There is a ton of material though, you need to work very hard if you want to get 93% for an A. Every point matters... I barely made that cutoff on this course - you need to study very hard for each quiz because getting 100% on each of them will help you make it there.

Nutrition - I actually liked this course. It is very clinically relevant. Most people didn't like it... the saddest part is Dr. Swaney is retiring after this year (I Think?). I really liked him - I went to visit him once when I was interviewing at Drexel - super nice professor, spent 30+ minutes to talk to me.

Physiology - I liked Physio. I had it with Dr. Laudadio, but she is no longer the course director. This class was a bit harder for some people, because it requires a bit more physics based thinking rather than memorizing. Get lots of practice and tutoring if this isn't your strength.

Neuroscience - Sort of like Microanatomy, one of my favorite courses. It comes at the end of the year, so your schedule won't be so busy and you'll get a lot more time to study. It won't be hard to get honors in it if you work at a decent pace.

Med and Society - Ethics course basically.

3) Something they wished they knew coming into the program

Not much really. But for any incoming students - make sure to have some good experiences coming in (Volunteering, etc). You'll get a chance to shadow at Kaiser and if you stay for a second year, get some clinical research under your belt.

4) Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program

Work hard. Don't slack off. You don't want to start off with a 75 on your first exam and have to rely on getting 90's to get a B.

5) Tips for students applying to your program

Apply early and call admissions! There are plenty of spots available early. I actually don't think Sacramento IMS filled up this year either.

6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?

Yes, I am currently an MS1 at Drexel. I really like my school and all the professors are awesome. I am actually enjoying MS1 because I've taken all the courses so I can really focus on clinicals. I can work at free clinics all over the city and have a large variety of extracurriculars that I can do because my school is so large.

7) Anything else you'd like to add

Dr. Tamse and Dr. G were awesome. The rest of the Sacramento Staff like Lynn were super helpful all the time. Friendly atmosphere - everyone knows each other.

The Drexel curriculum is actually very good. Lots of the lecturers are decent, but even for those that may not be super articulate or lucid - the notes are amazing. You won't need anything else but these notes.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)

5, met my expectations. My GPA was horrid and I felt like I had almost no chance of getting into an MD school even with 3+ years of undergrad retakes. The program allowed me to network and get a ton of research and build my academic records up.

 

[cherryghost]

Rutgers - New Brunswick Postbaccalaureate Prehealth Program

1) The Pros and Cons of their program (structure of the program, learning environment, cost, location, faculty, classes, difficulty, competitiveness, other students, buildings/classrooms/facilities, etc..)

Advantages:

It's inexpensive, relatively speaking. There's a saying we throw around on the post-bac boards: "don't go into debt for your post-bac." If you think this statement holds any sort of truth at all and you have NJ residency, you should be strongly considering this program for this reason alone. State school prices, you only pay for the credits you take, and once you're done with your core 8 you can gtfo.

You're essentially doing a DIY post-bac but have the opportunity for a committee letter and (NJ only) linkage thrown in. This is huge, if a DIY post-bac is what you need/want and you can do without the typical pre-med handholding.

There's no set completion timeline. Want to do it in a year while working full time (like I did)? You're out of your mind, but go for it. Want to go full time? Cool. Want to go part-time over two years? That's fine, too. You do what you need to do as far as getting yourself done and out.

Disadvantages:

This school is a bureaucratic hellscape. I could go into details, but there's no real point. Everyone has problems and no two problems are the same, and you won't emerge unscathed. If you've heard bad things about Rutgers sometime in your past (the RU Screw, as it's known), know that there's probably some element of truth to everything that you hear.

If you're expecting Goucher or BM caliber of advisement or advocacy you will be super disappointed. This is only a "program" in that Rutgers allows a few people early registration periods for otherwise very popular classes. In terms of getting your pre-reqs done, that's their only responsibility to you… once you're ready to put your app together they get to work on the interview/letter, but it's very hands off until you take the initiative and get yourself ready to move on.

You're right in there with undergrads, and you realize soon enough that the playing field isn't exactly even. There's a ton of sharing of notes and homework, friends sell graded lab notebooks to younger friends, old exams get passed down, etc. It's more of an annoyance than a disadvantage, but when things get busy or difficult it's SUPER EASY to resent.

There's not a lot of student-professor contact unless you've turned yourself over to the gunner mentality.

2) The kinds of classes you've taken and a description.

The core 8 - Chem, Orgo, Bio, Physics. I also took Genetics and Biochemistry, but upper level science courses vary dramatically by professor and labs are not required.

Chemistry at Rutgers is pretty intense. Lecture courses are big lecture halls with once per week recitation/discussion sections. The Gen Chem experience varies widely by professor, some of which are awful and will essentially leave you to learn the material on your own. Orgo, on the other hand, is the same rite of passage it is at most big schools and mostly everyone takes the same Chem 307/308 sequence overseen by the same man who has overseen this class for something close to 50 years now. It's pretty difficult, but once I started my MCAT prep I realized I didn't need to look over anything. The big thing about your 4 Chemistry courses is that you only take ONE semester of lab for Gen Chem and ONE semester of lab for Orgo, either during the second semester sequence or afterward. That's it.

Bio at Rutgers is a beast of it's own. No recitation/discussion sections, but bio labs are integrated into the lecture course itself and will probably make up your best/worst classroom memories at the school. Each lab is full 3 hours/week and usually planned to the minute with busy work and/or useless memorization TAs are obliged to farm out. The labs themselves are really low-tech. You'll end up having to memorize a ton about plant biology and have to rush through human bio in the second semseter. Not exactly MCAT conducive or difficult, but incredibly time consuming.

Physics is super casual and great. Lecture courses with recitations once per week, two separate semesters of labs you can take alongside the courses or afterward. TAs have a lot of freedom to do what they want in recitations and labs (the opposite of bio), which I think works out better for everyone involved. I felt conceptually prepared for this on the MCAT, but I did have to spend some time putting equations to memory (which I never had to do for exams in these courses).

3) Something they wished they knew coming into the program

The linkage (this program calls it "fast track") option is a late-starting one and success is far from guaranteed… this applies not only to Rutgers, but to RWJMS and NJMS linkage agreements in general. There isn't a set number of spots set aside in each school for the post-bac linkage students… from what I gathered, spots at RWJMS and NJMS are opened up not to individual programs but to all the linkage applicants from all the relevant post-bac programs, and it could be as few as 1 space (as it was at RWJMS very recently). Even if you're a fantastic, can't miss student, you can't count on it - they'll see your app so late that their hands are tied. Plan accordingly.

4) Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program

This program provides THREE THINGS:
1) Priority registration (you register with first day seniors)
2) A committee letter
3) Potential linkage with in state medical schools.

If you are expecting this program to provide any more than that (shadowing opportunities, regular advisement, help with your application, mcat prep), you will be very disappointed.

5) Tips for students applying to your program

The application is super simple, costs little, and is basically just you telling them that you want to career change into medicine, you've thought about it a lot, and you're taking the relevant steps to make sure this is right for you. There's an interview with the program director that, for me, lasted about 45 minutes and was pretty painless.

6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?

I thought I'd be able to do this in one year while working full-time, which I almost pulled off. I did the classes, but couldn't simultaneously prep for the MCAT and put an app together that quickly, so I'm taking some upper levels now while prepping for my MCAT/putting next year's application together.

7) Anything else you'd like to add

NOPE.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)

If you know what you're doing, have a healthy fear of student debt, and live in-state it's a 4. I wouldn't consider it otherwise.

 

[Bea5T]

Would like some info on the following post bacc's

CSUEB
SFSU
Dominican University
CSULA

 

[Bea5T]

ignore

 

[lazyindy]

Can anyone please review the Tufts MBS program?

+1

 

[lazyindy]

Also does anyone have any insight and review on the Upenn pre-health specialized studies program?

 

[deleted248403]

Also does anyone have any insight and review on the Upenn pre-health specialized studies program?

Discussed at length in the UPenn thread here on the forum. You may have to go back a page or two to find it.

Spend some time reading it, and if you still have Qs then PM me - I went there

 

[Freezing]

Tufts MBS

I was going to wait until my application cycle was over, but since it has been requested...

1) Pros:
-- good advising
-- supportive faculty and classmates
-- location (very accessible by T, walking distance to the commons, tons of inexpensive food options, etc)
-- curriculum is challenging, but grading was overall very fair
-- opportunity to volunteer at Sharewood

Cons:
-- cost (tuition is expensive, as is cost of living in Boston)

2) Classes
Sept-Nov: biochem, medical genetics, cell bio, tissue & organ biology (histology), immunology, microbiology
Dec: pharmacology, nutrition, intro to clinical medicine
Jan-May: physiology, pathology, anatomy, elective

3-4) Something they wished they knew coming into the program./Something they would like to tell incoming students about your program.
Stay focused and stay on top of your work and you will be fine.

5) Tips for students applying to your program.
I am not involved in admissions to my program, so take my advice with a grain of salt. I'd suggest focusing your application essay on the strengths and weaknesses of your current med school admissions profile and how the program will help you address those weaknesses.

6) Did it help you get into medical school/dental school/etc.?
I would say yes. I never applied until after I completed the program, but my undergrad gpa was only 3.0 and currently have 1 acceptance and 3 pending interview decisions (I applied MD only). All of my interviewers seemed to react favorably to my SMP experience.

7) Anything else you'd like to add.
I think IF an SMP is the only way to address the weaknesses in your app, Tufts has a great, albeit expensive, one.

8) A rating from 1-5 (1 being the worst (no recommendation) to 5 (full recommendation)
5

 

[lazyindy]

Thanks @Freezing !!

I can't seem to find too much info on it but does anyone have review of the Masters in Biomedical Sciences program at Mount Sinai?

 

[jackbauer29]

Hi! Can someone post a review of the Toledo MSBS program?
Can't seem to find anything about it on sdn

 

[DrMidlife]

Hi! Can someone post a review of the Toledo MSBS program?
Can't seem to find anything about it on sdn

Wait for the search engine maintenance to be done then search for "Toledo". There are threads.

 

[MercifulDoc]

Tulane ACP 2007


Structure of the program: You take most of the first semester courses for Tulane Medical School with Tulane's medical students. If your grades are above the class average (for the Medical School, not the ACP program) you get to come back as an M1 the following year. As an M1 you will TA the classes you took in the program.

Admissions: You must be waitlisted at a US medical school to apply, and even then it's pretty competitive.

Facilities: Changing. Old building was OK, I hear the new one is going to be much better than OK.

Competitiveness: Since you're graded against the medical students (who generally aren't worried about class rank) rather than other students in the ACP program, you really don't need to worry about a cutthroat attitude from your fellow students. Everyone actually goes way out of their way to help one another.

Pros: Treated like part of the class by the medical students and faculty, extremely high linkage (90%+) to an incredible school, by far the cheapest (15K) and shortest (1 semester) of the SMPs, only program that lets you take the full Anatomy course, no lag year, and if you get in you get to TA the courses you took rather than taking them over

Cons: Can't think of much. Almost everyone from the program continues on to Tulane, so if you wanted a different school this probably isn't the program for you. The only other thing is that you're always a bit worried about offending someone. Tulane makes it very clear that offending their students is like offending their faculty is like offending the Dean of admissions. I mean, everyone at the school is amazing and nice, but it's just makes you worry, you know?


In the Fall you take Gross Anatomy and Histology. Both classes graded based on three tests, with the grade split evenly between a written portion an a practical. Gross Anatomy also has a lab participation grade, which basically amounts to a lab attendance grade. In the Spring students are given the option of taking Neuro Anatomy at no aditional cost, but performance in this class has no bearning on Tulane's decision about whether or not to admit you.


Go to either the TAs or SDN for advice on studying for Anatomy. I wasted the better part of two weeks reading the stupid text book before I got around to buying Netter flash cards and a Rohen. Also join a study group, it's a good way to get outside of the ACP 'clique' that tends to form. Also if at all possible find both an Anatomy and a Histology Study group, people have a tendancy to focus too much on Anatomy and ignore Histology until it's too late. Set some time aside for Histo.


The TAs are last year's ACP class. Use the TAs!! They (or I guess I can say we ) want to help you!


No clue, still amazed I got in


Yup, admitted last week


This is one of the only SMP programs I would consider recommending for someone who is a very borderline applicant (3.4/29). The cost is low enough, the school is good enough, and the success rate is high enough, that it probably makes sense. Of course, if you can get in with a truely bad GPA (the traditional SMP student) you should definitely attend.


5. No program's perfect, but I can't imagine any SMP being better.

Sorry I don't quite undesrtand the admissions process. Do you need to be waitlisted at an US medical school to get admitted or can you apply to this SMP without ever haviing applied to a medical school before?

 

[DrMidlife]

Sorry I don't quite undesrtand the admissions process. Do you need to be waitlisted at an US medical school to get admitted or can you apply to this SMP without ever haviing applied to a medical school before?

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=tulane+acp

 

[Perrotfish]

Sorry I don't quite undesrtand the admissions process. Do you need to be waitlisted at an US medical school to get admitted or can you apply to this SMP without ever haviing applied to a medical school before?

You need to be waitlisted an accredited US medical school (Caribbean doesn't count) to apply.