Pulmonary and Critical Care Fellowship 2021/2022 Cycle

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it's still early in a game.
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I am an US MD currently completing PGY3 at a large tertiary care center (community program with some academic affiliations). I have a smattering of publications from med school and residency (3-5) with several case reports also, average board scores. Applied to 38 spots. How many did everyone apply to? Just curious!
 
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I received an email from Washu St Louis for PCCM saying they can only interviews to a small number of people but they would keep my file active and if that changes they would contact me. Seems like a polite rejection but did anyone else get an email like this?
 
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I know it's only been a week since we went live, but seeing a few programs I applied to already sending out interviews while I sit in silence hasn't exactly been reassuring for my current stress levels.

Applied to 30 programs and suffering from needless neuroticism after reading last year's thread...
 
Big N Tasty said:
I know it's only been a week since we went live, but seeing a few programs I applied to already sending out interviews while I sit in silence hasn't exactly been reassuring for my current stress levels.

Applied to 30 programs and suffering from needless neuroticism after reading last year's thread...
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What programs have you seen people getting invites from other than people posting about ECU here?
 
JustLungs said:
What programs have you seen people getting invites from other than people posting about ECU here?
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Quite a few in here now. Intellectually I know they're clearly reviewing apps and sending out invites as they go or are waiting to deliver them in bunches. But I hate application season lol
 
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The CCM interview process is going to be a little bit slower this year because for the first time IM-CCM is going into the fellowship match. That means (unless they buck the trend and stay out of the match), programs don't need to rush and interview quickly and start sending offers. Everyone is on the same slow timeline.

By this time last year we had already sent out interview offers and had our first virtual interviews. This year I can take the process a little bit slower.

The APCCMPD (Association of Pulmonary and Critical Care Medicine Program Directors) recommended that programs continue to do virtual interviews. It's not a requirement so each program gets to choose. We opted for a hybrid this year; some days are in-person and will be open to residents of the area (with shifting covid issues I don't want out-of-state people making travel plans and then having to cancel them at the last minute), and the rest will be virtual.

And for what it's worth, in regards to all of the rejections that WashU is sending out, when a program rejects the field this early in the process, it usually means they filled from within. Or set an extremely high bar for limited spots and reject anything below it because they know they'll fill without a problem (which WashU can do)
 
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non-ACGME fellowship options related to PCCM/CCM?
I haven't received any interviews (0/125) (IMG-Needs Visa), already almost two weeks, game over for me guys. Need to start looking into plan-b options. Any ideas are welcome.
 
tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
non-ACGME fellowship options related to PCCM/CCM?
I haven't received any interviews (0/125) (IMG-Needs Visa), already almost two weeks, game over for me guys. Need to start looking into plan-b options. Any ideas are welcome.
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It's way, way too early to call it game over. Almost nobody has any interview invites at all. Less than 10% of programs have sent interviews to even their first choice candidates.
 
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Whack Get Out said:
It's way, way too early to call it game over. Almost nobody has any interview invites at all. Less than 10% of programs have sent interviews to even their first choice candidates.
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agree, some program just have started reviewing application.
 
I see. thanks.
But just in case for future reference, do you guys have any non-ACGME programs in mind, besides applying to sleep medicine?
 
Doctor Bob said:
The CCM interview process is going to be a little bit slower this year because for the first time IM-CCM is going into the fellowship match. That means (unless they buck the trend and stay out of the match), programs don't need to rush and interview quickly and start sending offers. Everyone is on the same slow timeline.

By this time last year we had already sent out interview offers and had our first virtual interviews. This year I can take the process a little bit slower.

The APCCMPD (Association of Pulmonary and Critical Care Medicine Program Directors) recommended that programs continue to do virtual interviews. It's not a requirement so each program gets to choose. We opted for a hybrid this year; some days are in-person and will be open to residents of the area (with shifting covid issues I don't want out-of-state people making travel plans and then having to cancel them at the last minute), and the rest will be virtual.

And for what it's worth, in regards to all of the rejections that WashU is sending out, when a program rejects the field this early in the process, it usually means they filled from within. Or set an extremely high bar for limited spots and reject anything below it because they know they'll fill without a problem (which WashU can do)
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Thanks for the explanation and reassurance!

Now that Step 2 CS is permanently cancelled, do you know if programs will still use this as a screening tool? Is your program screening applicants with a failed CS score as well? I ask because I was one of the few unfortunate people to fail on my first attempt, but passed it the second time. I'm afraid that I will be screened out by most programs because of this, despite graduating from a university program and doing chief year (IM).

Thanks again for being a part of this forum!
 
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I agree this is nerve racking but I think we probably just need to be patient. I'm a DO with strong scores, lots of leadership stuff, 5 pubs, 12 posters and haven’t heard anything either. Not even from my home program.
 
I haven’t received anything either as well
 
Thanks to all those keeping the spreadsheet up to date!

Definitely nerve-wracking this season with the uncertainty around how many IV needed for matching. Best of luck to everyone this cycle!
 
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tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
non-ACGME fellowship options related to PCCM/CCM?
I haven't received any interviews (0/125) (IMG-Needs Visa), already almost two weeks, game over for me guys. Need to start looking into plan-b options. Any ideas are welcome.
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I think it's too early to freak out, you'll be fine tony the tiger.
 
Also got the Yale rejection.
 
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HeisenbergIMG said:
Thanks for the explanation and reassurance!

Now that Step 2 CS is permanently cancelled, do you know if programs will still use this as a screening tool? Is your program screening applicants with a failed CS score as well? I ask because I was one of the few unfortunate people to fail on my first attempt, but passed it the second time. I'm afraid that I will be screened out by most programs because of this, despite graduating from a university program and doing chief year (IM).

Thanks again for being a part of this forum!
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A failure on the transcript is still a failure and when we have hundreds of applications for a very small number of spots, we look for the low hanging fruit for ways to parry down the numbers.

Now, if the rest of your application brings you up to or near the cutoff point, then I'd look more closely at the LORs to see if they speak to how you interact with patients (since that's really what CS tested) and if they're glowing in that area then it might be enough to push you up into the interview bracket.

But I'll be frank. We have over 300 applicants for 6 spots this year... and from a CCM standpoint we're a big program. Most places have fewer spots but are probably seeing the same(ish) number of applicants. The general wisdom is you interview ~10 people for every spot you have open. If a place wants to narrow the field down, failures are easy triggers. Everyone has glowing LORs, everyone has a wistful poignant yet hopeful and uplifting personal statement, and there are a lot of applicants with great board scores and lots of research.

Every program makes their assessments differently. I go through the ERAS applications and assign point values to all of the objective data, sort by that number, then review the people from the top down. And I keep reviewing until I fill all my spots. There isn't anything immediately exclusionary other than missing data (like board scores... amazingly lots of people don't submit any of them).
 
tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
non-ACGME fellowship options related to PCCM/CCM?
I haven't received any interviews (0/125) (IMG-Needs Visa), already almost two weeks, game over for me guys. Need to start looking into plan-b options. Any ideas are welcome.
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Don't do non-accredited programs. You won't be board eligible and that will make finding a job extremely difficult which will only add to the difficulty of finding a job that sponsors visas. Plus if a program isn't accredited you have to ask why...

Pirate2009 said:
I agree this is nerve racking but I think we probably just need to be patient. I'm a DO with strong scores, lots of leadership stuff, 5 pubs, 12 posters and haven’t heard anything either. Not even from my home program.
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Agreed.
If you didn't have interview offers by this time last year it was a concern. But with everyone going to the match this year programs are slowing the process down. Nobody has to rush to get pre-match offers out.
 
Doctor Bob said:
Don't do non-accredited programs. You won't be board eligible and that will make finding a job extremely difficult which will only add to the difficulty of finding a job that sponsors visas. Plus if a program isn't accredited you have to ask why...



Agreed.
If you didn't have interview offers by this time last year it was a concern. But with everyone going to the match this year programs are slowing the process down. Nobody has to rush to get pre-match offers out.
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Thanks so much! Your insight is very appreciated.
 
Y’all it’s definitely way too early to worry. My home institution told me they aren’t planning on sending IV invites for another almost 2 weeks :)
 
Vermont just sent invites via Thalamus.
 
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Was there supposed to be a letter attached to that second Yale message? Or was that just saying ignore the date from the previous letter?
 
I understand it’s early, but I am realizing I may not be passing the filters.
IMG-need J1. 238/237/cs second attempt/ step 3 pending result.
No chief year
Good research background.
Small community program.

so just thinking maybe its better to start early in the game with nephro/ID/Sleep rather than applying last minute in desperate mode
 
tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
I understand it’s early, but I am realizing I may not be passing the filters.
IMG-need J1. 238/237/cs second attempt/ step 3 pending result.
No chief year
Good research background.
Small community program.

so just thinking maybe its better to start early in the game with nephro/ID/Sleep rather than applying last minute in desperate mode
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It’s been harsh on most of us. I’m not visa requiring, but am a US-IMG from a community program and good scores and research without fails and I still have nothing :/
 
tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
I understand it’s early, but I am realizing I may not be passing the filters.
IMG-need J1. 238/237/cs second attempt/ step 3 pending result.
No chief year
Good research background.
Small community program.

so just thinking maybe its better to start early in the game with nephro/ID/Sleep rather than applying last minute in desperate mode
Click to expand...
I am IMG with 25x/27x/26x first attempt cs, univ affiliate and still haven’t heard anything, am i panicking? not there yet, but my heart does quiver every now and then, but i am still waiting and hopeful,
But what i realized that would i be happy to do ID/nephro for the rest of my life, the answer to that is a resounding No,
So think really hard do you want to just specialize or do you want pccm?
If it is the later could do sleep and try to make connections?
If it is CCM i guess id and or nephro followed by CCM?
But ask yourself what do you really want ?
 
Forgottenhopes said:
I am IMG with 25x/27x/26x first attempt cs, univ affiliate and still haven’t heard anything, am i panicking? not there yet, but my heart does quiver every now and then, but i am still waiting and hopeful,
But what i realized that would i be happy to do ID/nephro for the rest of my life, the answer to that is a resounding No,
So think really hard do you want to just specialize or do you want pccm?
If it is the later could do sleep and try to make connections?
If it is CCM i guess id and or nephro followed by CCM?
But ask yourself what do you really want ?
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I understand your point. I want PCCM. But its a matter of being realistic. My credentials are not good enough, then maybe better start early for other options rather than applying to an another fellow in September. No, I don’t like ID or neph as much as pulm but they are good ways to get to crit.
 
tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
I understand your point. I want PCCM. But its a matter of being realistic. My credentials are not good enough, then maybe better start early for other options rather than applying to an another fellow in September. No, I don’t like ID or neph as much as pulm but they are good ways to get to crit.
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I understand that hence i was saying if you like PCCM i would probably do sleep
If you are just a fan of CCM ID/Nephro.
As for me it is the P in PCCM that drives my interest
 
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tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
I don’t like ID or neph as much as pulm but they are good ways to get to crit.
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They are ways to get to critical care. They aren't necessarily good ways.
After nephro/ID, generally you're competing for a one year track. There are way fewer spots for those and the applicants get a lot closer scrutiny because the program has to train you up in one year and is relying a lot on your previous fellowship to have adequately laid the foundation (spoiler... most don't).

You can offer to do a two year track regardless, but how that is received is very program dependent.

Don't go into an ID/nephro program unless you'd be happy doing ID/nephro because that's what you'll be doing if you don't match into CCM afterwards.
 
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tonythetiger_2021_pccm said:
I understand it’s early, but I am realizing I may not be passing the filters.
IMG-need J1. 238/237/cs second attempt/ step 3 pending result.
Click to expand...

That right there...
That's going to be exclusionary. Until you have that result your application isn't complete and won't be reviewed. And even though the process is slowed down this year, there will come a point at which programs will fill their interview spots and not review applications any further.

When the result comes in you need to email all of the programs you have applied to and let them know that your application is complete because most won't go back to review the incomplete applications unless they have more interview spots they need to fill.
 
Hello, Jumping on the freaking out train. US MD, mid academic program. Step 1: 210+, step 2: 240+, cs: pass, step 3: 240+. All first attempt. Research: 2 pubs, 4 posters. No interviews. Do you guys think my poor step 1 score is filtering me (what a bummer that a test 4+ yrs ago is still haunting me…)?
 
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