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Are there any other Neuro sites out there? How about one in which we can compile a list of where everyone matched after next friday? Thanks and best of luck to all in the match.
Other Neuro Sites/Match Results
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While we're at it. Can someone post the numbers from this years match: number applicants to neuro, number of american students matching, percent matched etc.
I've been hearing all year long how neuro is becoming more competitve. I'm just curious to see if there are numbers to support this.
By the way, congrats everyone who matched. I'll see you guys at the annual neurology meeting in 2004.
I've been hearing all year long how neuro is becoming more competitve. I'm just curious to see if there are numbers to support this.
By the way, congrats everyone who matched. I'll see you guys at the annual neurology meeting in 2004.
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yay! matched in boston. okay, this would not be escaping the winter weather, but the opportunity is outstanding.
re: match results. sfmatch sent a copy with the match result.
current year / previous year
# registered 1010/1067
IMG registration 548/579
Matched 503/487
# US Seniors matched 317/313
# US Grads matched 8/32
# IMG's matched 138/140
Had list - no match 176/153
Avg USMLE Matched 218/216
Avg USMLE no match 200/198
# Matched w/ PhD 52/not available
Rank lists US appl 334/324
Rank lists others 305/314
Avg applications 19.3/18.4
Avg interviews 6.2/6.0
% Matching total 79%/76%
% US Seniors matched 95%/97%
% US grads matched 50%/80%
% IMG's matched 48%/51%
my two cents: on the interview trail, it didn't seem overly (and at a few places not even overtly) competitive.
note for those contemplating neurology: the most important number above is that 95% of US seniors that submitted a rank list matched. i.e. you will match as long as you interview at and rank 6-8 places. i'll also bet that most of us got one of our top three or four.
cheers
re: match results. sfmatch sent a copy with the match result.
current year / previous year
# registered 1010/1067
IMG registration 548/579
Matched 503/487
# US Seniors matched 317/313
# US Grads matched 8/32
# IMG's matched 138/140
Had list - no match 176/153
Avg USMLE Matched 218/216
Avg USMLE no match 200/198
# Matched w/ PhD 52/not available
Rank lists US appl 334/324
Rank lists others 305/314
Avg applications 19.3/18.4
Avg interviews 6.2/6.0
% Matching total 79%/76%
% US Seniors matched 95%/97%
% US grads matched 50%/80%
% IMG's matched 48%/51%
my two cents: on the interview trail, it didn't seem overly (and at a few places not even overtly) competitive.
note for those contemplating neurology: the most important number above is that 95% of US seniors that submitted a rank list matched. i.e. you will match as long as you interview at and rank 6-8 places. i'll also bet that most of us got one of our top three or four.
cheers
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Hi Panch,
congats!! it must feel good. I was wondering though, were there any stats on osteopathic med students matching on that list? or were they just bunched into the US grad match? If they were seperated, could you list the numbers for DO applicants. Also, what is the difference between US seniors, and US grads, they sound the same to me. thanks.
congats!! it must feel good. I was wondering though, were there any stats on osteopathic med students matching on that list? or were they just bunched into the US grad match? If they were seperated, could you list the numbers for DO applicants. Also, what is the difference between US seniors, and US grads, they sound the same to me. thanks.
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current year / previous year
# registered 1010/1067
#IMG registration 548/579
Rank lists US appl 334/324
Rank lists others 305/314
# US Seniors matched 317/313
# US Grads matched 8/32
# IMG's matched 138/140
Matched 503/487
I think I may have misunderstood this, but are you saying 1010 people paid good money to register for the match, but only 639 submitted ROLs, and 503 of them matched in the end? If so, how was the "matched" # derived? 317+8+138= 463 according to my trusty online calculator (US sen+US grad+IMG). Where did the rest of the 40 come from?
As well, from your numbers, 462 registrants were US applicants. Of these, only 334 submitted ROLs. That's a difference of nearly 30% - a HUGE number, one would think. Would this mean nearly 30% of US registrants did not get even one interview call to consider it worthwhile submitting an ROL? That would imply that the quality of their applications was so low that US program directors were unwilling to call these US applicants for any interviews. Or perhaps they changed their minds about neurology upon completion of Med III and didn't bother actually sending out apps (after forking out the cash to register)? Or a combination of these and other reasons, which cannot be determined from the above data only.
Either way, this bodes ill for the venerable profession. The indirect implication (which I cannot make with any degree of certainty owing to lack of data above) is that many of the US applicants are very poor students, and/or neurology loses its appeal among students by the time the time comes for them to apply and make decisions about their future practice of medicine.
# registered 1010/1067
#IMG registration 548/579
Rank lists US appl 334/324
Rank lists others 305/314
# US Seniors matched 317/313
# US Grads matched 8/32
# IMG's matched 138/140
Matched 503/487
I think I may have misunderstood this, but are you saying 1010 people paid good money to register for the match, but only 639 submitted ROLs, and 503 of them matched in the end? If so, how was the "matched" # derived? 317+8+138= 463 according to my trusty online calculator (US sen+US grad+IMG). Where did the rest of the 40 come from?
As well, from your numbers, 462 registrants were US applicants. Of these, only 334 submitted ROLs. That's a difference of nearly 30% - a HUGE number, one would think. Would this mean nearly 30% of US registrants did not get even one interview call to consider it worthwhile submitting an ROL? That would imply that the quality of their applications was so low that US program directors were unwilling to call these US applicants for any interviews. Or perhaps they changed their minds about neurology upon completion of Med III and didn't bother actually sending out apps (after forking out the cash to register)? Or a combination of these and other reasons, which cannot be determined from the above data only.
Either way, this bodes ill for the venerable profession. The indirect implication (which I cannot make with any degree of certainty owing to lack of data above) is that many of the US applicants are very poor students, and/or neurology loses its appeal among students by the time the time comes for them to apply and make decisions about their future practice of medicine.
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Why is there such a large discrepancy between US grads, and US seniors? Since they are all are from or going to be from a US medical school, shouldn't the numbers look a little more even? I guess my question is, why are US grads less competitive than US seniors?
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thanks for the congrats YellowRose. as far as i know, sfmatch does not release the numbers of DO vs MD applicants (at least to us applicants).
as to the discrepency b/w US Grads and US Seniors: they are not necessarily less competitive. one hurdle is that some of these people may already be in residency (family practice and internal medicine most likely) and did not get good recommendations from their current programs, and neurology program directors might be less likely to consider these people as they are afraid that they'll get burnt (what if they drop from neurology as well). another factor might be that these people might have less of an opportunity to take days off to interview... dunno, any US grads out there that applied or matched to neuro under that status?
re 317+8+138= 463 (not 503): true. i think the other 40 are people that participated in the short match (i.e. 463 matched for PGY2 in July 2004, and 40 ppl matched for PGY2 in July 2003)
re people registering but not submitting list: yeah, it happens. probably one major reason is that since neurology is early match (the "recommended" due date for applications was the third week of august 2002) people are registering for the match (~$100 US) but then decided that something else floats their boat. i find it less likely that so many US seniors didn't get interview calls (unless they just didn't submit their apps to enough places... IMHO one should send it to AT LEAST a few bottom-tier, ~15 mid-tier and 5 top-tier programs and see what interview calls come in)
one thing to keep in mind is that neurology has developed a bad rep over the past 50 years. while most other fields of medicine exploded with diagnostic and therapeutic options, we've just begun this revolution in neurology. the story goes that we're great at diagnosing a patient's problems and rounding endlessly on our patients, but there's not really much that we do for our patients (diagnose and adios).
in fact, in the past couple of decades we've seen a revolution in basic science and clinical research in the neurosciences. the current and next generation of neurologists and other neuroscientists are developing and discovering some incredible tools and therapies. (e.g. functional neuroimaging, deep brain stimulation, gamma-secretase inhibitors...)
time for me to stop babbling
as to the discrepency b/w US Grads and US Seniors: they are not necessarily less competitive. one hurdle is that some of these people may already be in residency (family practice and internal medicine most likely) and did not get good recommendations from their current programs, and neurology program directors might be less likely to consider these people as they are afraid that they'll get burnt (what if they drop from neurology as well). another factor might be that these people might have less of an opportunity to take days off to interview... dunno, any US grads out there that applied or matched to neuro under that status?
re 317+8+138= 463 (not 503): true. i think the other 40 are people that participated in the short match (i.e. 463 matched for PGY2 in July 2004, and 40 ppl matched for PGY2 in July 2003)
re people registering but not submitting list: yeah, it happens. probably one major reason is that since neurology is early match (the "recommended" due date for applications was the third week of august 2002) people are registering for the match (~$100 US) but then decided that something else floats their boat. i find it less likely that so many US seniors didn't get interview calls (unless they just didn't submit their apps to enough places... IMHO one should send it to AT LEAST a few bottom-tier, ~15 mid-tier and 5 top-tier programs and see what interview calls come in)
not a big surprise, but i don't agree. i've met many incredibly intelligent people on the interview trail that would've run circles around a number of the applicants in the most competitive specialties.
one thing to keep in mind is that neurology has developed a bad rep over the past 50 years. while most other fields of medicine exploded with diagnostic and therapeutic options, we've just begun this revolution in neurology. the story goes that we're great at diagnosing a patient's problems and rounding endlessly on our patients, but there's not really much that we do for our patients (diagnose and adios).
in fact, in the past couple of decades we've seen a revolution in basic science and clinical research in the neurosciences. the current and next generation of neurologists and other neuroscientists are developing and discovering some incredible tools and therapies. (e.g. functional neuroimaging, deep brain stimulation, gamma-secretase inhibitors...)
time for me to stop babbling
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Oh, I don't doubt that at all, panch. Indeed the brightest physicians I know are neurologists. It is a specialty that has survived all this time (in spite of poor pay, low 'status' and chronic untreatable conditions that weary both patients as well as their physicians) simply because it has consistently attracted some of the brightest minds in all of medicine. What I meant was that I don't see this latest match result as indicating that neurology is getting out of the deep unpopularity that it currently inspires among most students.
yes, makes sense.
S
Stinky T
Hey Panch,
Did you match at the Partners Program? If so, I got to know a lot of the PGY-2s (we spend two months there as Neuro Residents) who will be your seniors. They're a great bunch of people and all extremely bright.
Did you match at the Partners Program? If so, I got to know a lot of the PGY-2s (we spend two months there as Neuro Residents) who will be your seniors. They're a great bunch of people and all extremely bright.
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yes, it is at the partners program. and they are extremely bright. (what an experience)
who is "we" btw Stinky Tofu? are you a peds neuro resident at Boston Children's? (just curious).
i think that's one problem. sometimes we're attracted to neurology in spite of the personalities we've met, not because of them (many academic neurologists have a reputation for being a little eccentric as well as brilliant). we need to develop more enthusiastic and inspiring teachers in neurology, ones that will spark the interests of US med students.
who is "we" btw Stinky Tofu? are you a peds neuro resident at Boston Children's? (just curious).
i think that's one problem. sometimes we're attracted to neurology in spite of the personalities we've met, not because of them (many academic neurologists have a reputation for being a little eccentric as well as brilliant). we need to develop more enthusiastic and inspiring teachers in neurology, ones that will spark the interests of US med students.
S
Stinky T
I'm a Partners PM&R resident primarily at SRH (Spaulding Rehabilitation Hospital). Congratulations on your match!
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kewl, i was wondering what SRH meant. i'll be coming out and studying w/ y'all as well.
thanks for the congrats. i guess i'll see you in Boston (where i've condemned myself to wearing the short coat for another four years at least...)
thanks for the congrats. i guess i'll see you in Boston (where i've condemned myself to wearing the short coat for another four years at least...)
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Hi - I just stumbled across this forum. Panch, I'm interested in your opinion on something as someone who recently went through the match. I'm a 3rd year med student in a decent (top 20-25) med school. So far I have honored in Neuro and Psych and got a "High Pass" in Surgery. I did a research year before 3rd year and have 5 first author and 2 second author publications (4 original research, 2 review papers and one commentary) and 3 chapters (2 first- and 1 second-author) in areas mostly related to neuro (dementia, autism, neurobiology, palliative care, depression), as well as a bunch of oral presentations and posters. My area of concern is Step 1 - I scored 213. Would this pre-screen me out of a bunch of programs (I know it would pre-screen me out of the top 4 or 5)? There are 16 or so programs in the geographic area I'm interested in, and they run the gamut prestige-wise... I'd appreciate and opinion you have on this.
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pinky going to houston, i know you. hello.
haven't been to queens sq yet. hope to during residency.
beezer5: wow. you do have a strong app (except for the 213). i would study and take step 2 early (mid July) and see how you do. but i've learned that PDs *love* publications. they don't seem to want to read them, but they like the fact that you have.
you know your **** with all that under your belt. i would do one or two away electives at the best university programs in your area, work hard, do well, get letters. then you're positioning yourself for those programs as well as other national programs.
and apply WIDELY. i sent out my application to 31 places. eventually got 30 interview calls (hopkins wouldn't waste their time ), interviewed at 12, ranked eleven, and matched well. you can never have too many inteview calls, you can just turn down calls once the ones you want roll in.
overall, you're pretty well positioned. the BS would cut you out of an interview call at a few places (don't worry bout them). just do your best this summer and impress well known neurologists to write you letters. also, if you can make it to the AAN meeting this Spring, i would highly recommend going and meeting people there, guaranteed that you'll see some of those attendings as you go on the interview circuit (plus it's in Hawaii this year))
http://am.aan.com/
http://aan.com/professionals/awards/award/awa_med_stu_ann.cfm
haven't been to queens sq yet. hope to during residency.
beezer5: wow. you do have a strong app (except for the 213). i would study and take step 2 early (mid July) and see how you do. but i've learned that PDs *love* publications. they don't seem to want to read them, but they like the fact that you have.
you know your **** with all that under your belt. i would do one or two away electives at the best university programs in your area, work hard, do well, get letters. then you're positioning yourself for those programs as well as other national programs.
and apply WIDELY. i sent out my application to 31 places. eventually got 30 interview calls (hopkins wouldn't waste their time
), interviewed at 12, ranked eleven, and matched well. you can never have too many inteview calls, you can just turn down calls once the ones you want roll in.overall, you're pretty well positioned. the BS would cut you out of an interview call at a few places (don't worry bout them). just do your best this summer and impress well known neurologists to write you letters. also, if you can make it to the AAN meeting this Spring, i would highly recommend going and meeting people there, guaranteed that you'll see some of those attendings as you go on the interview circuit (plus it's in Hawaii this year))
http://am.aan.com/
http://aan.com/professionals/awards/award/awa_med_stu_ann.cfm
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I think I am in the same boat as beezer5. I even have my PhD in neuroscience and excellent clinical evals, but my Step I is just simply subpar (although I got good neuro grades from year I and II). I think I read somewhere that you are not going to improve by more than 15-20 points on your step II and sometimes it *may* be better to not take step II while you're applying/interviewing/ranking. On one hand, I can see why the top programs should just "screen out" applicants with low board scores. On the other hand, I would certainly like to have the rest of my apps reviewed. Any idea how much "screening" the top programs actually do?
