Non traditional app

[brain_implosion]

Ok - Quick recap

Went to school in Michigan,USA, GPA 3.3/4.0. Took courses at a public university and a community college simultaneously. The 3.3 is only the university GPA. The Community college GPA is 3.7/4.0. Completed the 4 year degree in 2 years and 4 months, worked full time through the degree to be able to pay for it - no aid as an international student.

Have been working for the past 4 years fulltime as a Senior Software Engineer. Considering medical school in Canada/US, going to school part-time to complete CHEM/BIO/ORGO prereqs, while working full-time. Once they are done, hope to do well on the MCAT. Been getting straight A's so far.

1) Does anyone have the slightest clue as to how my GPA will be eventually calculated. My transcripts dont show full time loads, since I was taking courses at 2 different institutions simultaneously.
2) Do I have a chance at any of the Canadian schools.

Who would I contact to get more information?

Regards!

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[megaman1x]

1) Does anyone have the slightest clue as to how my GPA will be eventually calculated. My transcripts dont show full time loads, since I was taking courses at 2 different institutions simultaneously.

There are 17 med schools in Canada and they calculate your GPA there own way. Some schools drop your lowest 15 credit hours, some schools only look at your best 2 years, etc, etc. You will have to check out each websites requirements and how they calculate GPA.

2) Do I have a chance at any of the Canadian schools.

There are 17 med schools in Canada and the only one I know of that accepts international students and that is U of T. I believe there might be another one in Ontario, I just don't know which school it was. You have a MUCH better chance in the US rather than in Canada.

Where can I find more info?

http://www.afmc.ca/docs/2006_admissions_book.pdf

That has all the info you need hopefully.

 

[brain_implosion]

Thanks a lot,for the link - very informative.
I actually am a Canadian permanent resident. I know US is a lot easier, but I am not a US citizen. I just went to school there. Any thoughts you would like to share?

 

[megaman1x]

Thanks a lot,for the link - very informative.
I actually am a Canadian permanent resident. I know US is a lot easier, but I am not a US citizen. I just went to school there. Any thoughts you would like to share?

What province were you born in? You still maintain in-province status there. So you can apply as an in-province student for your birth province. You won't be considered an international student then and you will have much better chances.

I just read that you are a permanent resident in Canada. So which province are you a permanent resident of. Applying that medical school will provide you with the best chances

 

[brain_implosion]

I was actually born in the middle east, I lived in the US for 4 years in michigan, and then moved to Ontario and have been living here for the past 1 year. I know my best chances are in Ontario, but given my background, do I have a chance at any of the schools in Ontario? I mean the average applicants have a 3.6 at most schools. I stand at 3.3 (I think - I still dont know how they're calculating the GPA) -
I am taking additional courses now - basically BIO/CHEM/ORGO pre-reqs. Does it matter if these courses are taken via distance education/online on a part-time basis?

 

[brain_implosion]

Actually - I should ask this - am i even considered in-province for ontario ??

 

[megaman1x]

Actually - I should ask this - am i even considered in-province for ontario ??

I don't think you are considered in-province for Ontario. Don't quote me on that though. There is a certain time limit that you have to be living in a province to be considered in-province. Also, the fact that you are not a Candian citizen is working against you. A 3.3 is quite low for Ontario. Actually it's quite low anywhere in Canada. I'm not gonna lie and give you false hope, things aren't looking too bright for you. I would get in touch with the specific universities that are in that PDF file. They will answer all your questions. I don't know the answers to your other questions, sorry.

 

[brain_implosion]

I don't think you are considered in-province for Ontario. Don't quote me on that though. There is a certain time limit that you have to be living in a province to be considered in-province. Also, the fact that you are not a Candian citizen is working against you. A 3.3 is quite low for Ontario. Actually it's quite low anywhere in Canada. I'm not gonna lie and give you false hope, things aren't looking too bright for you. I would get in touch with the specific universities that are in that PDF file. They will answer all your questions. I don't know the answers to your other questions, sorry.

Lol - I know 3.3 is quite low. I am painfully aware of that fact. I could have had a stellar GPA, but too late now.
I am doing Med School pre-reqs - BIO/CHEM/ORGO's and getting good grades on them. Do these grades count for anything in Canada? Would a knockout MCAT be any help?
BTW - I am hoping to do this over the course of the next couple years, by the end of which I will be a canadian citizen

 

[SMRT]

Also, the fact that you are not a Candian citizen is working against you.

I don't think that there is a distinction made between permanent residents and citizens. As long as you are a landed immigrant/permanent resident and not here on a visa then I think you are good.

Check with each school in Ontario about how they determine provincial residency (although Queen's and UofT have no preference for in-prov applicants).

 

[megaman1x]

Lol - I know 3.3 is quite low. I am painfully aware of that fact. I could have had a stellar GPA, but too late now.
I am doing Med School pre-reqs - BIO/CHEM/ORGO's and getting good grades on them. Do these grades count for anything in Canada? Would a knockout MCAT be any help?
BTW - I am hoping to do this over the course of the next couple years, by the end of which I will be a canadian citizen

Yes doing those pre-reqs will raise your GPA if you get good grades. For example, U of Manitoba requires you to have a Biochemistry course. So if you've taken it and got a good grade, then that little bit helps.

A good MCAT will help, but things are a bit diff in Canada. A HIGH mcat can sometimes compensate for a lower GPA. In Canada it does somewhat too, but not as much as in the US.

 

[dr_amer98]

Hello there
Just to clarify things for you.. You are considered a permanent resident of a province (anywhere in Canada) if you have lived there for at least 12 months prior to applying to medical school, these 12 months in a raw (one year), this doesn't include any time spent in postgraduate school , also you are a permanent resident of a province if do your high school there.
For the fact that you are a permanent resident or Canadian citizen, this makes no difference at all; both of them are looked at the same way.
Best of luck

 

[MeowMix]

A few issues:

1. each school has its own set of rules for how they determine in/out of province (e.g. I grew up in Ottawa, went to high school there, but I was considered to be out of province by U of O; I was in-province for Mac). You will need to look them up individually.

2. Canadian schools do indeed have high GPA cutoffs; for example, even though Mac posts a 3.0 minimum on their website, in reality 90% of their accepted students have a 3.8 or better. Stellar MCAT always helps, but the GPA policies are often very restrictive.

3. Doing your courses on a non-traditional schedule is the kiss of death for some schools. I don't know why Canadian schools are so stupid about this, because it really discriminates against anyone from a non-conventional background. Again, take a look and see what they say about prereqs.

Almost all Canadian students actually have better chances of getting into a US med school than a Canadian school. It's just really expensive!

 

[trustwomen]

Have been working for the past 4 years fulltime as a Senior Software Engineer. Considering medical school in Canada/US, going to school part-time to complete CHEM/BIO/ORGO prereqs, while working full-time. Once they are done, hope to do well on the MCAT. Been getting straight A's so far.

1) Does anyone have the slightest clue as to how my GPA will be eventually calculated. My transcripts dont show full time loads, since I was taking courses at 2 different institutions simultaneously.
2) Do I have a chance at any of the Canadian schools.

Sigh. Taking your prereqs part time is a terrible idea. I did it too, for the first few years, and it got me cut at several schools (they did not count any of those classes toward my GPA, despite proof that I was also working full-time). Quit work, or work part-time, and take five classes a semester. Get a year or two of full-time undergrad studies in Canada, with excellent marks, and some schools will just look at your more recent grades. Ottawa weights the recent years heavily, but you must be taking 4 classes/term; other schools also weight but only with five classes/term. I know you're phobic about debt (I was too) but don't let it ruin your chances at med school. It almost did for me.

You won't have a chance at Canadian schools if you go part-time. If you go full-time and get great grades (3.7+), you will get in somewhere, though you may have to finish a whole other degree first.

 

[brain_implosion]

Sigh. Taking your prereqs part time is a terrible idea. I did it too, for the first few years, and it got me cut at several schools (they did not count any of those classes toward my GPA, despite proof that I was also working full-time). Quit work, or work part-time, and take five classes a semester. Get a year or two of full-time undergrad studies in Canada, with excellent marks, and some schools will just look at your more recent grades. Ottawa weights the recent years heavily, but you must be taking 4 classes/term; other schools also weight but only with five classes/term. I know you're phobic about debt (I was too) but don't let it ruin your chances at med school. It almost did for me.

You won't have a chance at Canadian schools if you go part-time. If you go full-time and get great grades (3.7+), you will get in somewhere, though you may have to finish a whole other degree first.

Having spoken to Mac, UWO and Queens, chances that I'll be able to get into Canadian med schools look like almost nil now. Mac gave me some hope in that they will count part-time prereqs just like any others, but they dont care about MCAT's. I simply cannot quit work - not an option. US Medical schools seem to be more forgiving of the GPA, easier to get into, more inclusive of your overall qualifications, and less anal in general. So bottom line- McMaster/US is my only hope.

 

[trustwomen]

Having spoken to Mac, UWO and Queens, chances that I'll be able to get into Canadian med schools look like almost nil now. Mac gave me some hope in that they will count part-time prereqs just like any others, but they dont care about MCAT's. I simply cannot quit work - not an option. US Medical schools seem to be more forgiving of the GPA, easier to get into, more inclusive of your overall qualifications, and less anal in general. So bottom line- McMaster/US is my only hope.

Mac will also count every university course you've ever done equally... meaning you can never really recover from a bad year or two. UBC, at least, is willing to ignore grades over 10 years old (upon request).

Are you really just looking at Ontario? I'd recommend checking out all 17 medical schools in Canada (14, if you don't speak French).

You say that you're unable to quit your job (financial reasons, I presume) but willing to go to the U.S. for med school? That seems contradictory. Taking, say, two years off to study full-time would cost you maybe 50K in loans (assuming a moderate lifestyle), but med school in the U.S. will cost you an extra 100K - easy - compared to med school in Canada. More if your U.S. school winds up being in a large urban area - cost of living is much higher down there.

You are right in saying that U.S. schools are more accepting of non-trads. However, you would be an international non-trad over there, no? Restricted # of spots in many cases (and/or fees that absolutely soak you). Why not investigate all the Canadian options first? There are schools other than Mac that accept part-time prereqs.

Best of luck.

 

[Goalie]

Hey fellas,

If you started or if you know someone in your student body who started his/her medical school at 30 or older, please post here, for the older/non-traditional applicants.

Comme ci ---> Age: ?
Male/Female: ?
Married/SO (With Kids?): ? Yes/No
Expects Loans > $50K after MD ? Yes/No
GPA/MCAT when applied and accepted: ?
further details welcome.

Thanks for your help. If you want to write a short tale to inspire, that's very much appreciated too. Thanks fellas.

 

[Goalie]

I'll begin ..

- Female 33yo,
- Married, no kids.
- Expects to have debts $45K after MD (if accepted -- i'm working on it), I expect tuition and other educat'l costs around $17k x 4 = $68k ... OSAP maximum loan $11K x 4 = $44K ... with loan forgiveness level (2terms x 4= 8 terms), will repay only $28K .... Presently I'm working (paid) right now saving up to cover for the cost difference ($68K - $44K = $21K ) and for living expenses over 4 years ($12K x 4 yrs = $48). I have two years to save. Will be applying at 35yo, to start at 36yo. (Add 4 years MD, 2 years FM = 6 years. Will be 42yo, General Practitioner).
- GPA first undergrad 3.0 ... I'm doing my second undergrad for 2 years, as UWO, Queen's take the best 2 full years, (weighted ave. with UOttawa), I'm not sure if I can cut the 3.0 overall gpa with McMaster though as they count everything.
- MCAT ... I've been getting 30 on all three, using Kaplan, Princeton, Arco Review sets. I probably can move that 30 to 34.
- ECs ... in addition to work and school, 5 hours volunteer weeknights + 6 hours weekends.
My dream is to become a family doctor. I'm a late comer to MD, due to family/personal circumstances. But I'm not quitting. If I don't get in to Canadian schools, I'll try the schools in the States -- but it's too expensive in the US -- so Canada first, I'll apply coast-to-coast.

Your turn, please share. Were you over 30 yo when you got in, or are you over 30 working towards getting in ?

Hey fellas,

If you started or if you know someone in your student body who started his/her medical school at 30 or older, please post here, for the older/non-traditional applicants.

Comme ci ---> Age: ?
Male/Female: ?
Married/SO (With Kids?): ? Yes/No
Expects Loans > $50K after MD ? Yes/No
GPA/MCAT when applied and accepted: ?
further details welcome.

Thanks for your help. If you want to write a short tale to inspire, that's very much appreciated too. Thanks fellas.

 

[Goalie]

I'll begin ..

- Female 33yo,
- Married, no kids.
- Expects to have debts $45K after MD (if accepted -- i'm working on it), I expect tuition and other educat'l costs around $17k x 4 = $68k ... OSAP maximum loan $11K x 4 = $44K ... with loan forgiveness level (2terms x 4= 8 terms), will repay only $28K .... Presently I'm working (paid) right now saving up to cover for the cost difference ($68K - $44K = $21K ) and for living expenses over 4 years ($12K x 4 yrs = $48). I have two years to save. Will be applying at 35yo, to start at 36yo. (Add 4 years MD, 2 years FM = 6 years. Will be 42yo, General Practitioner).
- GPA first undergrad 3.0 ... I'm doing my second undergrad for 2 years, as UWO, Queen's take the best 2 full years, (weighted ave. with UOttawa), I'm not sure if I can cut the 3.0 overall gpa with McMaster though as they count everything.
- MCAT ... I've been getting 30 on all three, using Kaplan, Princeton, Arco Review sets. I probably can move that 30 to 34.
- ECs ... in addition to work and school, 5 hours volunteer weeknights + 6 hours weekends.
My dream is to become a family doctor. I'm a late comer to MD, due to family/personal circumstances. But I'm not quitting. If I don't get in to Canadian schools, I'll try the schools in the States -- but it's too expensive in the US -- so Canada first, I'll apply coast-to-coast.

Your turn, please share. Were you over 30 yo when you got in, or are you over 30 working towards getting in ?

Hey fellas,

If you started or if you know someone in your student body who started his/her medical school at 30 or older, please post here, for the older/non-traditional applicants.

Comme ci ---> Age: ?
Male/Female: ?
Married/SO (With Kids?): ? Yes/No
Expects Loans > $50K after MD ? Yes/No
GPA/MCAT when applied and accepted: ?
further details welcome.

Thanks for your help. If you want to write a short tale to inspire, that's very much appreciated too. Thanks fellas.