Gen Surg Applicant Looking for Advice

[OK Computer]

Hey everyone. I'm an MS3 98% sure I am applying into Gen Surg. So I just want some opinions on my application and what I can expect during the application cycle. Not a chance thread per se (because we all hate those), but just looking for some advice on what I should focus on. I've reached out to administrators and they are sometimes helpful, but often not very much, and they have been removed from the process so long, that I don't know how much stock to put into what they say. The second problem is that our school (which is a top 20 well-regarded school) usually doesn't have many people applying into Gen Surg, so good advice is hard to come by.

With that being said, a quick overview of my applications:
Step 1: 237
Clerkship grades: 3 honors, 3 HPs (Honors in Surgery, HP in Medicine); I have 1 rotation left
Research: I think I have pretty decent research. a first author case report/lit review published in psych/neurosurgery realm, an oral presentation at a national conference on GI stuff, 1 first author original research about to be submitted (should be published by app time) on GI stuff, a 4th or 5th author paper about to be submitted (should be published by app time) on Orthopedics. One poster/presentation at school research symposiums.
ECs are fine. Student government VP, co-founded a pretty successful cultural club, other small stuff like clubs, nothing else really great
Awards/Honors: Summer after 1st year, I got a pretty good surgery fellowship at a top hospital. Eh, other than that. didn't really get any awards in med schools.
LORs: who knows, but I imagine they'll be pretty good.

I THINK I have a decent application (not by SDN standards, but real life standards). Anyways, I have a few questions:

1) Just so I can adjust my expectations, do I have a realistic shot at top 25 programs? or should I be aiming lower?
2) I'm not sure what sub-specialty I am interested in. I really like Colorectal and Cardiothoracic. I know there are some direct programs for Cardiothoracic and Vascular (maybe others?). Is it worth it to apply into these programs with my resume? I don't really have any specific Cardiothoracic or Vascular research, although I am starting research with a thoracic surgeon soon.
3) I should take my step 2 before applying, right?
4) I care somewhat where I go, but I also care about saving time, so I am considering 5 year community programs as well. Thoughts?
5) What's the general consensus about Away rotations. One surgeon told me that the chances that you'll just be meh is much greater than the chance that you will wow them, so he suggested against aways. Another surgeon said aways are a good idea. Not sure what to make of the conflicting advice.
6) General advice?

Thanks in advance.

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[kharateez]

Hey everyone. I'm an MS3 98% sure I am applying into Gen Surg. So I just want some opinions on my application and what I can expect during the application cycle. Not a chance thread per se (because we all hate those), but just looking for some advice on what I should focus on. I've reached out to administrators and they are sometimes helpful, but often not very much, and they have been removed from the process so long, that I don't know how much stock to put into what they say. The second problem is that our school (which is a top 20 well-regarded school) usually doesn't have many people applying into Gen Surg, so good advice is hard to come by.

With that being said, a quick overview of my applications:
Step 1: 237
Clerkship grades: 3 honors, 3 HPs (Honors in Surgery, HP in Medicine); I have 1 rotation left
Research: I think I have pretty decent research. a first author case report/lit review published in psych/neurosurgery realm, an oral presentation at a national conference on GI stuff, 1 first author original research about to be submitted (should be published by app time) on GI stuff, a 4th or 5th author paper about to be submitted (should be published by app time) on Orthopedics. One poster/presentation at school research symposiums.
ECs are fine. Student government VP, co-founded a pretty successful cultural club, other small stuff like clubs, nothing else really great
Awards/Honors: Summer after 1st year, I got a pretty good surgery fellowship at a top hospital. Eh, other than that. didn't really get any awards in med schools.
LORs: who knows, but I imagine they'll be pretty good.

I THINK I have a decent application (not by SDN standards, but real life standards). Anyways, I have a few questions:

1) Just so I can adjust my expectations, do I have a realistic shot at top 25 programs? or should I be aiming lower?
2) I'm not sure what sub-specialty I am interested in. I really like Colorectal and Cardiothoracic. I know there are some direct programs for Cardiothoracic and Vascular (maybe others?). Is it worth it to apply into these programs with my resume? I don't really have any specific Cardiothoracic or Vascular research, although I am starting research with a thoracic surgeon soon.
3) I should take my step 2 before applying, right?
4) I care somewhat where I go, but I also care about saving time, so I am considering 5 year community programs as well. Thoughts?
5) What's the general consensus about Away rotations. One surgeon told me that the chances that you'll just be meh is much greater than the chance that you will wow them, so he suggested against aways. Another surgeon said aways are a good idea. Not sure what to make of the conflicting advice.
6) General advice?

Thanks in advance.

1. You do have a realistic shot a top 25 programs, but don't just apply to top 25 programs. Apply broadly
2. If you are not sure what sub-specialty you're interested in, then apply to general surgery to give yourself a few years to decide if you want to sub-specialized and what that sub-specialty might be.
3. Step 2 will boost your application only if you score higher than on your step 1
4. There are plenty of 5 year academic programs, i.e. not all academic programs are 7 years long. You well get adequate training with either community or academic programs. There are several threads discussing this topic.
5. Away rotations only help if you're dead set on a particular program that you want to go to. Even then, you have to wow them while you're there. Otherwise, away rotations don't matter that much for your application but are very helpful for preparing you for intern year in general surgery.

 

[sinombre]

I'm a current applicant this year and have a couple of things to chime in on.

1) I did basically the same as you on step 1. I never had any interest in top programs but knew that I had to do well on step 2 regardless, so I took a month off at the beginning of 4th year for dedicated study time. I was able to increase my score by 30 points, and that absolutely helped me this year. I imagine this is especially important at big name academic programs, because you have to be able to prove that you can do well on standardized tests. Step score performance is correlated with absite scores which programs care a lot about. So if I were you I would definitely take time off at the beginning of 4th year to get the highest step 2 score possible and have your score back before you submit your application.

2) I had always heard what @SouthernSurgeon said about the high risk/high reward nature of away rotations, and can definitely confirm that after doing a couple of away rotations this past year. It only takes one slip up (possibly something out of your control) to look bad. It's pretty hard to shine in front of a bunch of people who know infinitely more than you do. And on top of that you'll be in a foreign environment and probably rotating with students from that program who are familiar with how things work. I was fortunate that I had one away rotation that went extremely well and resulted in a letter from someone with a big name that was commented on at just about every interview. And I was less fortunate at my other away rotation where things just didn't go as well (I can PM you specifics if you're interested). That said, when you're starting from the proverbial bottom and trying to climb your way up, you usually have to take risks. And I think doing away rotations at programs you're interested in is probably a risk worth taking if you know that you're a hard worker and are generally social/personable.

(Also, I appreciate the Radiohead reference in your handle)