Dumb High School Doc Wannabe Chick Bragging on Facebook

[medicinesux]

Wanted to vomit after reading about this dumb high school chick I graduated with bragging about how she is going to be "just like a doctor" before starting her NP program in a couple of weeks on facebook. As if this wasn't enough to swallow, Lisa Big Boobs (one of the most popular girls in my class) chimes in and comments on how she can't wait to take her babies to see her for a "check up" .
I am sure this girl wasn't in the top half of my white trash public high school graduating class. This girl never took one advanced class nor studied, instead she spent her time shaking her pom poms while on the cheerleading squad and flirting with the HS quarterback...After busting my ass throughout high school, college, med school and residency it SCARES me to know that she is going to have access to a prescription pad just like myself!
But then again, the more I think about it..... perhaps she is the smart one for gaming the system and I am the dumb one for sacrificing my precious time away and saddling myself with six figure debt. All the while she was making her $40 an hour from the age of 18 as an LPN with no debt and driving SUV's, buying a mcmansion, jaunting her way through the Caymans and Jamaica, I was slaving away my 20's over medical books. Get me another martini...STAT!

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[surgicalskills]

Stay tuned. More and more of these knuckleheads will be infiltrating the medical field in the near future backed by a clueless, pandering president who will make them feel like they are at the same level of a physician. Of course, when you factor in the less stress, hours and liability that they have to endure, I'm sure they will have more opportunity to form unions and lobby for more rights in the medical field.

 

[TopSecret]

Patients still prefer MD's over NP's. Unless she practices in an underserved area, MD's will have the advantage.

 

[mercaptovizadeh]

Patients still prefer MD's over NP's. Unless she practices in an underserved area, MD's will have the advantage.

Still, Obamacare envisions primary care as including general IM, peds, FM, and - get this - Ob/Gyn, and it seems to me that NPs/DNPs are envisioned as equals of MDs in these fields, according to his plan.

 

[Law2Doc]

Patients still prefer MD's over NP's. Unless she practices in an underserved area, MD's will have the advantage.

Most patients have no clue what the letters mean after a healthcare professionals name. They see somebody in a white coat at what seems to be a doctor's office, and they are fine with it. Most probably call their NP "doctor", and most would underestimate the need for more medical training anyhow.

 

[Doctor G]

Fundamentals are essential to practice medicine, and having this strong fundamental to be built requires strong college education and the rigorous medical school curriculum. I have the impression that those people who couldn't make it into med school who are wannabe doctors think they can pull it off with just experience alone, meaning that they think they can just "pick things up" from working in the medical field long enough, and think they are almost at the level of a doctor if not equivalent. It doesn't work that way. There are still gaps in their knowledge. I would not trust anyone who just base their practice on just experiences and hearsays. Only strong medicine knowledge foundation pairing up with evidence-based practice is legit. Make them take the USMLE x 3 or the COMLEX x 3 and we'll see how they do.

 

[Ashers]

Still, Obamacare envisions primary care as including general IM, peds, FM, and - get this - Ob/Gyn, and it seems to me that NPs/DNPs are envisioned as equals of MDs in these fields, according to his plan.

I was told at my University of Hawaii med school interview that OB/gyn was a primary care field by the OB/gyn faculty member who interviewed me.

Side note: At my med school and now residency, the insurance people at the school basically told students we had to go see the NPs at this one clinic. The only good thing about this is that I can basically just say what I want and the NP does it. I go in for physical visits when I really don't feel well. I'd rather see a doctor, but the people at the school said that student/residents have to go there. They're kinda mean about it.

 

[medicinesux]

I was told at my University of Hawaii med school interview that OB/gyn was a primary care field by the OB/gyn faculty member who interviewed me.

Side note: At my med school and now residency, the insurance people at the school basically told students we had to go see the NPs at this one clinic. The only good thing about this is that I can basically just say what I want and the NP does it. I go in for physical visits when I really don't feel well. I'd rather see a doctor, but the people at the school said that student/residents have to go there. They're kinda mean about it.

Recently saw an online ad looking for an NP to staff my med school's student health clinic. Hypocritical to say the least.

 

[Boba Q Fett]

I've heard of OB being considered primary care at a lot of places and I asked one of my friends who did OB. She said it's because a lot of younger girls only see a doctor once a year when it's time for their PAP smears so the OBs have had to start doing more primary care type stuff on top of the OB/Gyn stuff.

 

[mig26x]

Recently saw an online ad looking for an NP to staff my med school's student health clinic. Hypocritical to say the least.

the same thing with minute clinics where you can see a young RN prescribing medications w/o precepting with a physician but in my case with 4 years of med school and now in my 3rd year of IM I have to precept everyone I see in clinic with my attending no matter how silly the case.

 

[Law2Doc]

I've heard of OB being considered primary care at a lot of places and I asked one of my friends who did OB. She said it's because a lot of younger girls only see a doctor once a year when it's time for their PAP smears so the OBs have had to start doing more primary care type stuff on top of the OB/Gyn stuff.

Yeah, there's an ongoing and longstanding movement by OBs to embrace the notion that they are a primary care field. See eg http://www.faqs.org/abstracts/Healt...st-specialist-and-primary-care-physician.html . You can find more recent stuff on Pubmed. It's old news.

 

[McGillGrad]

I used to get upset about this type of hilarity, but this is a river of change flowing powerfully into the future. Not much we can do to stop it until NPs start killing/maiming patients. Then again, if the results are the same, then we might be over-trained and overcharged for our educations.

As an aside, we are still king of the professional "hill" so either lobby for protecting our turf or watch it disappear in a whirlwind of short-sighted politicking without much thinking.

 

[maceo]

Patients still prefer MD's over NP's. Unless she practices in an underserved area, MD's will have the advantage.

and what exactly does that mean? patients have a say? you get what you get.. period..

 

[McGillGrad]

and what exactly does that mean? patients have a say? you get what you get.. period..

Yeah, if you need to see someone about your health and your HMO choices are:

1. MD in 2 weeks
2. PA/NP in 3 days

Most people won't wait.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Most patients have no clue what the letters mean after a healthcare professionals name. They see somebody in a white coat at what seems to be a doctor's office, and they are fine with it. Most probably call their NP "doctor", and most would underestimate the need for more medical training anyhow.

Yep. Everyday I see patients who refer to their PA or NP or even RN as "Doctor". They are confused when I correct them as they seemingly do not know the difference in the training, nor do they seem to care.

Patients care about who can see them the quickest, who's the nicest and the cheapest. There are very few who care about things like MD/DO, BC, etc.

 

[Ashers]

Yeah, if you need to see someone about your health and your HMO choices are:

1. MD in 2 weeks
2. PA/NP in 3 days

Most people won't wait.

I come from a medical family (dad's an MD, mom's an RN). After moving to a new state and trying to establish care, I think my mom surprised some schedulers when they said she could get in to see the dermatologist's NP in a week for some recurring actinic keratoses after she had a treatment to reduce the number. She said she wanted to see a real doctor and told me that the scheduler acted all haughty and said, "Well, you'll have to wait 2 months!" My mom agreed to wait. Also, when she couldn't get in to see an actual orthopaedist and had to go the orthopod's PA, she took my dad (orthopod) to the appointment to make sure everything the PA said was ok by him. Unfortunately, not everyone's like my mom.

 

[McGillGrad]

Wow, that sounds pretty harsh. I will definitely make sure my family gets to see the proper people, but the difference in waiting times is almost criminal.

I come from a medical family (dad's an MD, mom's an RN). After moving to a new state and trying to establish care, I think my mom surprised some schedulers when they said she could get in to see the dermatologist's NP in a week for some recurring actinic keratoses after she had a treatment to reduce the number. She said she wanted to see a real doctor and told me that the scheduler acted all haughty and said, "Well, you'll have to wait 2 months!" My mom agreed to wait. Also, when she couldn't get in to see an actual orthopaedist and had to go the orthopod's PA, she took my dad (orthopod) to the appointment to make sure everything the PA said was ok by him. Unfortunately, not everyone's like my mom.

 

[Ashers]

Wow, that sounds pretty harsh. I will definitely make sure my family gets to see the proper people, but the difference in waiting times is almost criminal.

Totally. I was amazed it took that long to see an MD. I guess there wasn't even a waitlist.

 

[TedyBearSuicide]

Yep. Everyday I see patients who refer to their PA or NP or even RN as "Doctor".

I have visited family practices where in fact the RNs refer to PA's as doctors!

 

[lapelirroja]

I have always thought it was way too easy to get into NP programs.

PA program admissions more closely mirrors med school in terms of GPA and coursework.

 

[AmoryBlaine]

I totally understand the desire of NPs and PAs to move into more independent clinical work esp given the looming shortage of physicians.

What I don't understand is this fairly constant need among some percentage of them to be viewed as physicians. They are health professionals but clearly not physicians. It's like the APNs that have 16 other sets of letters after their name on their long white coats. I always want to be like, "hey you got a BSN and now you're an AP, it's a nice accomplishment so just be proud of it."

I don't go around hoping that people will mistake me for an attorney, a chemical engineer, and astronaut, or a professional baseball player...

 

[dynx]

Then again, if the results are the same, then we might be over-trained and overcharged for our educations.

well, here's the thing. What results do you measure?
Hard to say if antibiotic resistance is increasing because every sore throat upset stomach and earache gets antibiotics. Nobody is going to get sued for that.
Hard to measure quality of life indicators like a middle aged guy with erectile dysfunction because a NP decided to put him on a beta-blocker instead of HCTZ or and ACE as first line for his BP...not gonna get sued for that.

There are a lot of little ways to mess up that don't involve lawsuits. In addition, these are the low lying fruit that a primary doc can really nock out in 5 minutes, get his slice of the pie and then spend more time on a serious problem.

The NPs are going to take all the T-ball patients maybe manage them right, maybe not...and send all the tough ones to the primary care guys. Now they have tougher patients, are maybe or maybe-not getting paid more (I'll believe it when I see it) and need to pack them into the same day.

 

[Acherona]

I'm not sure where the idea that NP's dont' have any debt came up. At many schools the tuition is as high as medical school. For example, the nurse practitioning program at MGH is about 40K/yr. I have some NP friends who have as much debt as me but don't have the earning potential that I will eventually have. They do make good money though fairly soon after graduation.

 

[McGillGrad]

I'm not sure where the idea that NP's dont' have any debt came up. At many schools the tuition is as high as medical school. For example, the nurse practitioning program at MGH is about 40K/yr. I have some NP friends who have as much debt as me but don't have the earning potential that I will eventually have. They do make good money though fairly soon after graduation.

because NPs have less years of education. basic math, dude.

 

[Acherona]

because NPs have less years of education. basic math, dude.

Not necessarily. If you do a regular undergrad, then 1-2 years to get your RN or BSN and then another 2 yrs for NP degree the difference is not that big. You could end up with a lot of debt.

 

[McGillGrad]

Not necessarily. If you do a regular undergrad, then 1-2 years to get your RN or BSN and then another 2 yrs for NP degree the difference is not that big. You could end up with a lot of debt.

Don't you need a certain number of years of RN work to qualify? That would cut down on debt because of the 2-3 years of salary in between.

 

[Acherona]

Don't you need a certain number of years of RN work to qualify? That would cut down on debt because of the 2-3 years of salary in between.

I think many do but it's not required. A starting RN makes around the same as a resident anyway so not going to make major headway on the debt.

 

[McGillGrad]

I think many do but it's not required. A starting RN makes around the same as a resident anyway so not going to make major headway on the debt.

I checked on it and I was right.

NP = 4 years of undergrad plus 2 years of master's level = 6 years

MD = 4 years of undergrad plus 4 years of med school plus 3-5 years of residency = 11-13+ years

No matter what, they come in with much less debt.

 

[Winged Scapula]

Plus most NP courses can be done part-time, allowing them to work during schooling. Medical school cannot be done part time.

 

[ProRealDoc]

Plus most NP courses can be done part-time, allowing them to work during schooling. Medical school cannot be done part time.

Forget part time, they can be done online while you lay in bed. All you need is a laptop and a bag of chips.

 

[gluon999]

Forget part time, they can be done online while you lay in bed. All you need is a laptop and a bag of chips.

You mean a box of donuts? j/k.

A lot of people I see in the hospital wear a long white coat, even the x-ray techs! Everyone wants to act like a doctor but none of them want to put in the hard work.

 

[ProRealDoc]

You mean a box of donuts? j/k.

A lot of people I see in the hospital wear a long white coat, even the x-ray techs! Everyone wants to act like a doctor but none of them want to put in the hard work.

Everyone wants to be the chief and no one wants to be the indian.

 

[275079]

Everyone wants to be the chief and no one wants to be the indian.

That would be cool if docs just start wearing feathered headdresses.

 

[Acherona]

I checked on it and I was right.

NP = 4 years of undergrad plus 2 years of master's level = 6 years

MD = 4 years of undergrad plus 4 years of med school plus 3-5 years of residency = 11-13+ years

No matter what, they come in with much less debt.

yea but if you don't do a nursing undergrad degree you have to add another 1-2 yrs for that. Look, I'm all Im saying is I have two NP friends and they both have debt >100K which they say is not uncommon, one of them was struggling for a while with very low pay because there weren't many jobs in her specialty. Everyone likes to think the other guy has it easier, but that's easy to assume until you actually talk to them.

 

[McGillGrad]

Yes, two people in the world have a different situation. The other 99% do not fall into your N=2 category.

yea but if you don't do a nursing undergrad degree you have to add another 1-2 yrs for that. Look, I'm all Im saying is I have two NP friends and they both have debt >100K which they say is not uncommon, one of them was struggling for a while with very low pay because there weren't many jobs in her specialty. Everyone likes to think the other guy has it easier, but that's easy to assume until you actually talk to them.

 

[Acherona]

Yes, two people in the world have a different situation. The other 99% do not fall into your N=2 category.

it's better than your n=0

 

[McGillGrad]

it's better than your n=0

I know you are, but what am I?

 

[schrizto]

ugh I hate those kinds of people. Reminds me of the dumb chicks in high school who were taking Fundamentals of Pre-Algebra and thought they could go to Princeton, acting like it was a brand name they could buy just like Abercrombie and Fitch. Wonder where they went... *gasp* what if they became NPs?

 

[Handinhand]

A girl that was in the top 10 students in my class of ~500 from highschool was in my Organic chem class this summer. I thought, damn, she's going to set the curve, this girl was nucking futs in highschool with studying. I knew she was pre-med so I figured she was still neurotic as hell, but then I found out how she was doing in the class. Highest test score: 60%. Me on the other hand, I graduated high school with around a 3.0 GPA and a 30 ACT. Pretty lopsided I know but I was a huge slacker in highschool and NOBODY would expect me to be on the path I am on. Now... posted >3.9 GPA the last 2 semesters and just scored into the 99th percentile on the ACS Organic Chemistry Final.

Moral of the story, highschool performance is a downright terrible way of judging someone's intellect. Sure, she may be a pretentious bitch now and was back then; and I would say a large majority of people don't change their stripes much, but it can happen and the transition from highschool to college and after can really be a turn-around for some people.

 

[medicinesux]

I assure you this is not the case with this girl. I actually had the "great pleasure" of doing my internship at the same hospital she worked. She drove my co-residents nuts with her ridiculous 4 AM pages and among many other silly things. It was clearly apparent that her knowledge base had actually deteriorated from tenth grade biology.

So to the comment above, you are absolutely right when you say a large majority of people don't change their stripes much. She is proof of this. You can now vividly imagine why my jaw was on the floor when I found out that she is now on her way to become a NP.

 

[Handinhand]

I assure you this is not the case with this girl. I actually had the "great pleasure" of doing my internship at the same hospital she worked. She drove my co-residents nuts with her ridiculous 4 AM pages and among many other silly things. It was clearly apparent that her knowledge base had actually deteriorated from tenth grade biology.

So to the comment above, you are absolutely right when you say a large majority of people don't change their stripes much. She is proof of this. You can now vividly imagine why my jaw was on the floor when I found out that she is now on her way to become a NP.

It sounds like she will fit RIGHT in with all the people at the Wal-Mart free clinic.

 

[velouria]

ha! this reminds me of my high school friend who posted that she was so excited to finish chiropractor school because now she's a REAL DOCTOR!!!

 

[Gyric]

As a pathologist it is hard enough making sure my non-specialist colleagues understand my diagnoses (or the esoteric/molecular tests they are ordering), but a generalist is on an entirely different level than a nurse practitioner from my perspective; I can explain something to another physician, trying to relate the subtleties of my specialty to an NP has been entirely impossible in my experience. I just tell them to refer their patients to a treating physician now.

 

[periopdoc]

Wanted to vomit after reading about this dumb high school chick I graduated with bragging about how she is going to be "just like a doctor" before starting her NP program in a couple of weeks on facebook. As if this wasn't enough to swallow, Lisa Big Boobs (one of the most popular girls in my class) ...

Facebook Link???


-pod

 

[JaggerPlate]

Facebook Link???


-pod

LOL ... I was going to bash on whoever bumped this thread, but totally justified.

 

[fab4fan]

Everyone wants to be the chief and no one wants to be the indian.

I have absolutely no desire to be a chief.

 

[Doctor246853]

Wanted to vomit after reading about this dumb high school chick I graduated with bragging about how she is going to be "just like a doctor" before starting her NP program in a couple of weeks on facebook. As if this wasn't enough to swallow, Lisa Big Boobs (one of the most popular girls in my class) chimes in and comments on how she can't wait to take her babies to see her for a "check up" .
I am sure this girl wasn't in the top half of my white trash public high school graduating class. This girl never took one advanced class nor studied, instead she spent her time shaking her pom poms while on the cheerleading squad and flirting with the HS quarterback...After busting my ass throughout high school, college, med school and residency it SCARES me to know that she is going to have access to a prescription pad just like myself!
But then again, the more I think about it..... perhaps she is the smart one for gaming the system and I am the dumb one for sacrificing my precious time away and saddling myself with six figure debt. All the while she was making her $40 an hour from the age of 18 as an LPN with no debt and driving SUV's, buying a mcmansion, jaunting her way through the Caymans and Jamaica, I was slaving away my 20's over medical books. Get me another martini...STAT!

Dude get the f outta here there is noooo lpn that makes NEAR that much try half that maybe...Rn okk yeah but lpn no f'ing way they make 40 how you a doc and you believe that..

 

[turquoiseblue]

hmm.. i guess on the bright side having an NP degree would be good for the MD's that didn't make it out there. but it is unfair what is going on, don't get me wrong. our own kind created this mess in the first place and they don't seem to change, although they had a chance to add 15,000 residency spots, which was supposedly declined. now the NPs get to fill what MD's didn't.

 

[caspian]

She drove my co-residents nuts with her ridiculous 4 AM pages and among many other silly things. It was clearly apparent that her knowledge base had actually deteriorated from tenth grade biology.

Inefficient middle men whose lack of fundamentals will drive them to refer out more and engage in shotgun testing all the while charging AT THE SAME RATE as physicians.
This kind of behavior will only worsen as the lawsuits start coming around against these independent noctors.

And this reduces health care spending how???

 

[psychforme]

On one of my rotations all nursing students wore white coats. The overseeing nurse threatened any medical student she would make sure they would be failed if she saw them wearing white coats "because you shouldnt confuse patients". We knew several upper classmen who have been failed at this place for wearing white coats and theyre now in FM.