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[sherrydadouzi]

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[iamapharmacist]

You'll burn the bridge for sure but if you can get a better position, hey, it may be worth it.

 

[M0df]

Is there anything that will stop you from accepting your new opportunity? The answer is no. So buy some cupcakes, send out some emails, and roll with it.

You took the fellowship to get this chance. So count your blessings that you got it a year ahead of schedule and move on.

 

[wazoodog]

Coming from someone who didn't do fellowship, it depends on the industry fellowship. If its the Rutgers one, that's always seemed like a pretty tightknit network whose former fellows have a presence throughout the industry all the way up to executive management. The chances are good some cross-referencing will occur throughout your career. Maybe it'll mean less as the years go by though. For most other fellowships, I dont think the burned bridges will have much impact.

 

[lord999]

Coming from someone who didn't do fellowship, it depends on the industry fellowship. If its the Rutgers one, that's always seemed like a pretty tightknit network whose former fellows have a presence throughout the industry all the way up to executive management. The chances are good some cross-referencing will occur throughout your career. Maybe it'll mean less as the years go by though. For most other fellowships, I dont think the burned bridges will have much impact.

It's regional, Kaiser Downey in CA and Group Health Cooperative in the PNW blacklist you. Agree on the Rutgers. If yours is a government one, doubtful as there's retention clauses, you get the SF-50 25 DNR note and that's that.

 

[sherrydadouzi]

Coming from someone who didn't do fellowship, it depends on the industry fellowship. If its the Rutgers one, that's always seemed like a pretty tightknit network whose former fellows have a presence throughout the industry all the way up to executive management. The chances are good some cross-referencing will occur throughout your career. Maybe it'll mean less as the years go by though. For most other fellowships, I dont think the burned bridges will have much impact.

Thank you for your reply! It is not rutger. it is a standalone fellowship. There is also no academia program associate with the fellowship.

 

[sherrydadouzi]

It's regional, Kaiser Downey in CA and Group Health Cooperative in the PNW blacklist you. Agree on the Rutgers. If yours is a government one, doubtful as there's retention clauses, you get the SF-50 25 DNR note and that's that.

Thank you! Yea mine is not rutger or regional. It is a standalone program. Just a quick question, what is SF-50.

 

[sherrydadouzi]

Is there anything that will stop you from accepting your new opportunity? The answer is no. So buy some cupcakes, send out some emails, and roll with it.

You took the fellowship to get this chance. So count your blessings that you got it a year ahead of schedule and move on.

Agree! Your answer is well said. So far i dont think anything legally can stop me. Contract is at will. But yea just worry about maybe the some un-foreseen risk might occur during the course.

 

[lord999]

Thank you! Yea mine is not rutger or regional. It is a standalone program. Just a quick question, what is SF-50.

Not government, not relevant. In government, it is your positional record.

 

[wazoodog]

I've interviewed quite a few industry job candidates, and my general observation is that the things that catch someone's attention can be pretty arbitrary (and oftentimes unreasonable or unfair to the candidate). Having an incomplete fellowship on your CV would probably catch my eye and there's a possibility I would wonder if it means lack of commitment to see things through to completion. This has to be taken into context of a lot of other factors though - such as how many years have passed since and does your subsequent experience sufficiently balance out any doubt. There's other interviewers that would barely notice, especially if it's from more than 10 years past.

In general, I would say completing a fellowship is good thing - obviously, companies sponsor fellowships with the intention they be completed. If every fellow in the program left early, I think they would reconsider continuing the program at all. At the same time, I can understand an individual's concern about future job security and it's hard to foresee what the job market will look like in a year. However, a fellowship isn't quite like a job - sponsor companies sort of go out on a limb to start and keep a fellowship going. Even if it doesn't seem to be run well, there's usually some measure of altruism on the company's part that played a role in getting the program established. So what do you owe the company as a fellow? That's where you'll run into some different opinions, but I think more people might tie the completion of a fellowship to accountability and commitment, then a completed contract period for a temp job.

 

[sherrydadouzi]

I've interviewed quite a few industry job candidates, and my general observation is that the things that catch someone's attention can be pretty arbitrary (and oftentimes unreasonable or unfair to the candidate). Having an incomplete fellowship on your CV would probably catch my eye and there's a possibility I would wonder if it means lack of commitment to see things through to completion. This has to be taken into context of a lot of other factors though - such as how many years have passed since and does your subsequent experience sufficiently balance out any doubt. There's other interviewers that would barely notice, especially if it's from more than 10 years past.

In general, I would say completing a fellowship is good thing - obviously, companies sponsor fellowships with the intention they be completed. If every fellow in the program left early, I think they would reconsider continuing the program at all. At the same time, I can understand an individual's concern about future job security and it's hard to foresee what the job market will look like in a year. However, a fellowship isn't quite like a job - sponsor companies sort of go out on a limb to start and keep a fellowship going. Even if it doesn't seem to be run well, there's usually some measure of altruism on the company's part that played a role in getting the program established. So what do you owe the company as a fellow? That's where you'll run into some different opinions, but I think more people might tie the completion of a fellowship to accountability and commitment, then a completed contract period for a temp job.

I think its well said. But slight disagree on the company go out on a limb for a fellow, i think its program/company dependent. Not all the program will care about the fellow the same. After all, it is dog eat dog environment in Pharma. You will have to look out for yourself and do the best for your career.

 

[lord999]

I think its well said. But slight disagree on the company go out on a limb for a fellow, i think its program/company dependent. Not all the program will care about the fellow the same. After all, it is dog eat dog environment in Pharma. You will have to look out for yourself and do the best for your career.

But remember it goes both ways. Someone that is known to be too mercenary gets doors shut in their face and never opened. I've seen it happen to several people in my generation and middle age becomes a real problem if a journeyman.

You've written about looking and leaving for the last couple of months. You need to make a decision or you could offend all parties.

 

[wazoodog]

I think its well said. But slight disagree on the company go out on a limb for a fellow, i think its program/company dependent. Not all the program will care about the fellow the same. After all, it is dog eat dog environment in Pharma. You will have to look out for yourself and do the best for your career.

To clarify, I meant that a company goes out on a limb to sponsor a fellowship program overall.

If its a dog eat dog world as you describe, setting up a fellowship program is a tough sell to company decision-makers when they could be spending the same amount of money to hire an experienced person without setting aside resources to support any extra expectations of a fellowship program. If the fellow leaves earlier than the program contract, it gives decision-makers more of a reason to say "hey this program is a useless drain in resources, let's discontinue it." Many interviewers won't notice it, but some might wonder if it's too risky to take a chance on someone who shows a track record of leaving a sponsored fellowship program early. I guess the way a company sees it is....a fellowship is a training program intended for new graduates who commit to a set time period with the goal of being groomed for more advanced roles.

Ultimately its your career and you have to decide what is best. There are plenty of fellows who come across opportunities to leave early but decide to finish their commitment. I have yet to see an industry fellow truly struggle to find a pharma job after they finish...not all at the same company but the majority of them seem to land at least a manager position immediately after or within an year of completing their fellowship.

 

[sherrydadouzi]

But remember it goes both ways. Someone that is known to be too mercenary gets doors shut in their face and never opened. I've seen it happen to several people in my generation and middle age becomes a real problem if a journeyman.

You've written about looking and leaving for the last couple of months. You need to make a decision or you could offend all parties.

Leaving a position almost a year is normal now day. I would not describe as "too mercenary",and trust me employers wont struggle with these moral issues when they decide to get rid of you. Have you heard of whats called the "laid off". The day of company loyalty is long gone maybe we are indeed in two very different generations. If a company valued and invested in me, I would be crazy to leave. If they just used me as a cheap labor, is it too much a crime that i seized the better opportunity.
Thank you for asking regard to my decision. Sorry to disappoint, yea I already decided to catch my dream and the new opportunity. Maybe i will regret in the future maybe not. I know for sure if this opportunity fly, i will regret for the rest of my life.

 

[sherrydadouzi]

To clarify, I meant that a company goes out on a limb to sponsor a fellowship program overall.

If its a dog eat dog world as you describe, setting up a fellowship program is a tough sell to company decision-makers when they could be spending the same amount of money to hire an experienced person without setting aside resources to support any extra expectations of a fellowship program. If the fellow leaves earlier than the program contract, it gives decision-makers more of a reason to say "hey this program is a useless drain in resources, let's discontinue it." Many interviewers won't notice it, but some might wonder if it's too risky to take a chance on someone who shows a track record of leaving a sponsored fellowship program early. I guess the way a company sees it is....a fellowship is a training program intended for new graduates who commit to a set time period with the goal of being groomed for more advanced roles.

Ultimately its your career and you have to decide what is best. There are plenty of fellows who come across opportunities to leave early but decide to finish their commitment. I have yet to see an industry fellow truly struggle to find a pharma job after they finish...not all at the same company but the majority of them seem to land at least a manager position immediately after or within an year of completing their fellowship.

Thank you for your advice. I appreciate your detail answer but this is rare opportunity and i had to take a chance.

 

[wazoodog]

Thank you for your advice. I appreciate your detail answer but this is rare opportunity and i had to take a chance.

Right and I can understand. I've been there and hopped from my first industry job to my second in less than a year. That was also a different era and I'm just giving you my perspective as someone who interviews a lot of candidates in 2021, and has had 15+ years to look back and reflect on career decisions i made.

These kind of situations....you will only really know whether they were good decisions later after the fact (sometimes years later). If its an opportunity you feel you can't pass up then so be it. As long as I was willing to learn as much as I could in any job, I dont think there was any industry job I regretted. The difference is there are some where I only looked to learn and experience what I could until I was looking forward to something better, and there are the few where I just loved almost everything about the work environment enough to consider staying there until retirement.
At the end of the day, you're still very early in your career so look to learn as much as you can. As for the advice from people to stay longer, it is true that hiring managers generally feel it takes at least 2-3 years for someone to master the role. Meaning that if you show a pattern of leaving earlier, the impression theyre likely to get is that you're not into committing the time to master a role. Also, it looks good if you show promotion within the same company since its a strong indicator that you can succeed in your role. Leaving after only a year may be common in the industry, but its also common for hiring managers to see that as a big red flag. Its okay for the first contract job or maybe 2, or a contract stint in between longer employment periods...but the candidates whose CVs fail to demonstrate the ability to succeed in any industry job for a longer period (at least 3-5 years) usually don't get the job or even an interview.

 

[wazoodog]

Have you heard of whats called the "laid off". The day of company loyalty is long gone maybe we are indeed in two very different generations.

I have been laid off and what you say is true with a caveat. There are 2 sides to this mentality. When you're leaving a job you dont feel valued in, it makes sense at the time. When you interview for future jobs, you are still expected (even in 2021) to demonstrate a commitment to stay long enough for the company to see a return on investing in you. When we hire someone, we've usually spent considerable time interviewing several candidates in multiple rounds to find the best fit - it often takes months to find a hire. And we usually don't expect a new hire to fully contribute for the first 3 months while they onboard and train. Many take longer. All that time we are investing time to get them up to speed and figure out together what their strengths are and how to best leverage to complement the team. One year is really when they're just starting to run and can be trusted to take on more responsibility. Basically, that means when we look at a CV we are looking for signs we can get at least 2-3 years out of a hire at minimum. Interviewers will ask why you left so soon and, obviously, saying its normal and justifying with companies don't value loyalty anymore won't be acceptable. Its not hard coming up with reason for your first job, but it will be hard to explain a pattern.

So there's no need to worry about it at the beginning of your career, but just be wary of making a trend of it. And I urge you to reconsider your opinion that leaving early is justified by today's companies lack of loyalty. All too often, that's what I heard from coworkers who weren't always the best examples of success...but with good intentions to make someone feel better. As you advance and interact with more seasoned veterans, you hear that less.