Bernie Sanders says he will cancel all student loan debt if he’s president, can he do it?

[Bimmaboy88]

I may have to vote for Bernie in November just cause of this. I still have around 175k loans I’m paying off. If he can rly cancel all student loans for everyone then that sounds very enticing

Not sure if you trolling , or you're serious. The guy wants to increase taxes on anyone who basically isn't getting welfare checks....what did you think money was going to fall from the sky ? I can't believe someone who is a pharmacist would even consider it a good offer and vote for a socialist ******.

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[Heroic Combo]

No... Probably not.. inevitability we all become slaves to the machine regardless of our debt status.

Come on - your a pot smoker, you should know this.

Dude last time we talked you shared Floyd's Welcome to the Machine on my unintentional queue, cheers~!

 

[Heroic Combo]

There's no such thing as a free lunch.

Yeah there is, you take the money of the ultra-rich who don't deserve to be billionaires. Then it's free

 

[Heroic Combo]

$1.5T has to come from somewhere.

The majority of student loan debt is own by a household with a graduate degree. Why should the other 70% who do not even have a bachelor degree pay for your debt? Wouldn’t that cause more wealth inequality?

I graduated with 6 figures. I paid it off in a few years. It wasn’t difficult at all.

NO, you tax the top 0.1% who don't deserve to have that much money, easy. Nobody deserves to be so unequivocally wealthy compared to the rest of us. Yes wealth can exist and people can be successful.. but the exponential way that people are successful money-wise is wrong.

 

[Heroic Combo]

Not sure if you trolling , or you're serious. The guy wants to increase taxes on anyone who basically isn't getting welfare checks....what did you think money was going to fall from the sky ? I can't believe someone who is a pharmacist would even consider it a good offer and vote for a socialist ******.

Id rather pay 2% of my income to give everyone else healthcare. Even so, I don't believe Bernies policies do that. You tax the ultra-rich.

 

[VA77]

FDR and LBJ were described as socialists for Medicare and Medicaid. They aren't perfect programs by far but there were certainly more elderly living in poverty back then. I don't think you should have 100% capitalism or socialism. Too much of one economic class destroys the other. Gotta find the balance and not make each form out to be evil.

 

[owlegrad]

WARNING: Virtue signaling alert!!

ouch, just me?

 

[BMBiology]

NO, you tax the top 0.1% who don't deserve to have that much money, easy. Nobody deserves to be so unequivocally wealthy compared to the rest of us. Yes wealth can exist and people can be successful.. but the exponential way that people are successful money-wise is wrong.

How do you tax the top 0.1%? Most of their money is in their business. If they don’t sell their stocks, they don’t pay any tax.

A wealth tax has been tried in a dozen European countries and they all have failed.

Let’s also be frank here...you are going to need Congress approval to change tax law. Bernie knows this but it doesn’t stop him from selling his unworkable plan to the masses.

 

[wagrxm2000]

The funny thing about all this is most jobs people end up with shouldn't even need a college degree.

Why is a teacher for example going to college for 4 years? This is not to look down on their profession, but there is not a single thing they need to learn for that many years of schooling. You want to teach algebra? Take a class on algebra, master it and you are good to go. This goes for many careers. You want to be a manager? Take a class on finance.

Employers all over the world require at least a bachelor's degree.

How many times have you heard a person say they don't even use their degree?

 

[owlegrad]

The funny thing about all this is most jobs people end up with shouldn't even need a college degree.

Why is a teacher for example going to college for 4 years? This is not to look down on their profession, but there is not a single thing they need to learn for that many years of schooling. You want to teach algebra? Take a class on algebra, master it and you are good to go. This goes for many careers. You want to be a manager? Take a class on finance.

Employers all over the world require at least a bachelor's degree.

How many times have you heard a person say they don't even use their degree?

I agree with your logic, but where do you draw the line? Once someone has mastered reading, writing (typing?), and extremely basic math aren’t they capable of being a productive member of society? With that logic we could eliminate practically all but the most rudimentary education.

At some level it seems like we value education for its own sake. As though just learning a bunch of stuff about stuff makes us better people or something.

 

[wagrxm2000]

I agree with your logic, but where do you draw the line? Once someone has mastered reading, writing (typing?), and extremely basic math aren’t they capable of being a productive member of society? With that logic we could eliminate practically all but the most rudimentary education.

At some level it seems like we value education for its own sake. As though just learning a bunch of stuff about stuff makes us better people or something.

I still can't use a semicolon correctly.

 

[deleted898085]

I get why college students are drawn to socialism. Many of them came of age during the housing crash so they experienced the worse of capitalism.

As I get older, I started to see the waste and inefficiency of our government. You have to realize that most politicians are just lawyers. They are good at giving speeches. But, what do lawyers know about healthcare? education? transportation? But yet, we elect them to make all of these big decisions for us.

Yes, I’ve heard that back in the 1950s, the rich paid tax that was somewhere 80% of their income. But then they tried to buy lawmakers and made the laws that benefit them. Nowadays, they pay nothing.
Capitalism, I see, is bad for human beings. Greed is NOT good.

“There was a time in which the economics profession worked in the public interest, but in the neoliberal era, today, they work only for big corporations and billionaires, and that is creating a little bit of a problem. We could choose to enact economic policies that raise taxes on the rich, regulate powerful corporations or raise wages for workers. We have done it before. But neoliberal economists would warn that all of these policies would be a terrible mistake, because raising taxes always kills economic growth, and any form of government regulation is inefficient, and raising wages always kills jobs. Well, as a consequence of that thinking, over the last 30 years, in the USA alone, the top one percent has grown 21 trillion dollars richer while the bottom 50 percent have grown 900 billion dollars poorer,“

 

[wagrxm2000]

Yes, I’ve heard that back in the 1950s, the rich paid tax that was somewhere of 80% of their income. But then they tried to buy lawmakers and made the laws that benefit them. Nowadays, they pay nothing.
Capitalism, I see, is bad for human beings.

“There was a time in which the economics profession worked in the public interest, but in the neoliberal era, today, they work only for big corporations and billionaires, and that is creating a little bit of a problem. We could choose to enact economic policies that raise taxes on the rich, regulate powerful corporations or raise wages for workers. We have done it before. But neoliberal economists would warn that all of these policies would be a terrible mistake, because raising taxes always kills economic growth, and any form of government regulation is inefficient, and raising wages always kills jobs. Well, as a consequence of that thinking, over the last 30 years, in the USA alone, the top one percent has grown 21 trillion dollars richer while the bottom 50 percent have grown 900 billion dollars poorer,“

I made well into 6 figures from the market last year, didn't get taxed on any of it.

It's not just the rich that benefit from it.

 

[deleted898085]

How do you tax the top 0.1%? Most of their money is in their business. If they don’t sell their stocks, they don’t pay any tax.

A wealth tax has been tried in a dozen European countries and they all have failed.

Let’s also be frank here...you are going to need Congress approval to change tax law. Bernie knows this but it doesn’t stop him from selling his unworkable plan to the masses.

Edit:
For example, they need to remove step-up in basis law. That’s one of the ways the rich evade tax.

My friend in France says if you have houses that worth more than 1 million, you have to pay an extra tax of 3% on the amount that is above 1 million.
In Holland, mortgage rate for 1st house is less than 2% but for 2nd, rental house, that is a lot more and it’s nearly impossible to borrow to buy the 3rd house.
They’re shocked to hear how much I have to pay for college and health care here.

 

[deleted898085]

I made well into 6 figures from the market last year, didn't get taxed on any of it.

It's not just the rich that benefit from it.

The rich own stocks, the middle class own house. When you own stocks, you have the same benefit the rich has.

 

[wagrxm2000]

The rich own stocks, the middle class own house. When you own stocks, you have the same benefit the rich has.

Uh so you are calling me rich?

Anyways it's not just the rich that own stocks. A family of 4 with both parents making 50k should easily be putting money towards their retirement accounts.

My friend in France says if you have houses that worth more than 1 million, you have to pay an extra tax of 3% on the amount that is above 1 million.
In Holland, mortgage rate for 1st house is less than 2% but for 2nd, rental house, that is a lot more and it’s nearly impossible to borrow to buy the 3rd house.
They’re shocked to hear how much I have to pay for college and health care here.

Let me understand this right. So if a person accumulates 50 million in real estate they have to pay 3% or 1.5 million a year? Or are you saying it goes by each individual house?

Where is that money suppose to come from? They don't have any liquid assets.

 

[deleted898085]

For example, they need to remove step-up in basis law. That’s one of the ways the rich evade tax.

 

[deleted898085]

Anyways it's not just the rich that own stocks. A family of 4 with both parents making 50k should easily be putting money towards their retirement accounts.

Yeah right.
They put money in CDs and guess what? Fed Reserve keeps lowering interest rate and they get crushed.
The rich borrow money with almost zero interest rate.

 

[deleted898085]

Let me understand this right. So if a person accumulates 50 million in real estate they have to pay 3% or 1.5 million a year? Or are you saying it goes by each individual house?

Where is that money suppose to come from? They don't have any liquid assets.

My cousin bought a house in SF for $15 million.
Guess how much she has to pay for property tax.
And guess where that money is supposed to come from, lol

 

[deleted898085]

He does not have the power to cancel all student loan debt. Only Congress can do that.

He can do executive order. But only with federal loans, not with private loans.
It may go to court...
But it has a chance, lol

 

[wagrxm2000]

My cousin bought a house in SF for $15 million.
Guess how much she has to pay for property tax.
And guess where that money is supposed to come from, lol

You clearly don't understand what I'm asking.

 

[deleted898085]

You clearly don't understand what I'm asking.

If you can answer my question, you can answer your own.

Uh so you are calling me rich?

I mean if you're just tagged along with the rich (not sure if I use the word right, I'm not a native speaker), I mean if you do what the rich do, you'll have the same benefit as they do.
For ex, when I looked into the structure of IBR, I saw that it doesn't benefit people with lower debt levels.
"The programs were structured in a way that encouraged their abuse by people with incredibly high debt levels, especially from graduate studies rather than two- or four-year degrees."
I see that if I borrow 200K or less, there's no benefit to apply for IBR. So I borrow maximum that I'm allowed and will apply for REPAYE when I graduate.
Here's the scenario:
Supposed the loans are 330K, interest rate is 7%. If my income is 60k/yr (single mom with 2 kids) then my repayment amount is about 3k/yr.
I'll owe an interest of 20k/yr . With REPAYE, I'll get 10k subsidy. After subsidy, I owe 10k/yr of interest or 250k for 25 yrs.
After 25 years, total debt
250K+ 330k = 580k is forgiven.
Tax bomb is 200k.
So total amount I have to pay back is 200k + 3k/yr x 25 = 275k.

Basically, I borrow money with zero interest if I make $60k/yr for 25 years.

I see at least one person whose parents are very rich, went to law school then dropped out, then became a teacher, then went to medical school, and now has 2 kids and works one day a MONTH. She told me her loans are higher than mine, I guess above 400K? I don't think she'll pay the tax bomb...

 

[BMBiology]

If you can answer my question, you can answer your own.
I mean if you're just tagged along with the rich (not sure if I use the word right, I'm not a native speaker), I mean if you do what the rich do, you'll have the same benefit as they do.
For ex, when I looked into the structure of IBR, I saw that it doesn't benefit people with lower debt levels.
"The programs were structured in a way that encouraged their abuse by people with incredibly high debt levels, especially from graduate studies rather than two- or four-year degrees."
I see that if I borrow 200K or less, there's no benefit to apply for IBR. So I borrow maximum that I'm allowed and will apply for REPAYE when I graduate.
Here's the scenario:
Supposed the loans are 330K, interest rate is 7%. If my income is 60k/yr (single mom with 2 kids) then my repayment amount is about 3k/yr.
I'll owe an interest of 20k/yr . With REPAYE, I'll get 10k subsidy. After subsidy, I owe 10k/yr of interest or 250k for 25 yrs.
After 25 years, total debt
250K+ 330k = 580k is forgiven.
Tax bomb is 200k.
So total amount I have to pay back is 200k + 3k/yr x 25 = 275k.

Basically, I borrow money with zero interest if I make $60k/yr for 25 years.

I see at least one person whose parents are very rich, went to law school then dropped out, then became a teacher, then went to medical school, and now has 2 kids and works one day a MONTH. She told me her loans are higher than mine, I guess above 400K? I don't think she'll pay the tax bomb...

47% of adults do not pay a cent in federal income tax. I came from a poor family. Now I am in the top 1% so I pay a lot of taxes. Look at our healthcare and education system. We are spending more money in those things than any other country but with poor results. So, it is not a problem with revenue. It is a problem with efficiency.

The truth is...how well you do in life depends on YOU. It is about making good financial decision.

People who are graduating from pharmacy school this year...didn’t you do your research? Why do you think it is so easy to get accepted nowadays? Didn’t you do a cost vs benefit analysis? Now taxpayers are stuck with your $300 k student loan debt.

 

[JustFillIt]

47% of adults do not pay a cent in federal income tax. I came from a poor family. Now I am in the top 1% so I pay a lot of taxes. Look at our healthcare and education system. We are spending more money in those things than any other country but with poor results. So, it is not a problem with revenue. It is a problem with efficiency.

The truth is...how well you do in life depends on YOU. It is about making good financial decision.

People who are graduating from pharmacy school this year...didn’t you do your research? Why do you think it is so easy to get accepted nowadays? Didn’t you do a cost vs benefit analysis? Now taxpayers are stuck with your $300 k student loan debt.

Your not In the top 1%.... You ain’t gotta lie to kick it.

 

[deleted898085]

People who are graduating from pharmacy school this year...didn’t you do your research? Why do you think it is so easy to get accepted nowadays? Didn’t you do a cost vs benefit analysis? Now taxpayers are stuck with your $300 k student loan debt.

I did do research. I came here 16 years ago and I've started to do research since. I didn't get accepted in 2011. Then I gave up. Then in 2016 I just felt bored and tried again. Then I got accepted just within 1 week. Then I know there is something wrong. Then I decided to forget pharmacy. Then I looked into IBR. Then I said why not?
(I worked as a tech and made $12/h in CA. I finished pre-pharm courses in 2007).
Don't hate the player. Hate the game.
I believe the top 1% pay a lot of tax if you say so. But percentage wise, I'm not sure. I know one person that is very close to me makes 300k+/year and pays $120k in tax this year. I don't believe the rich and ultra-rich pay that much - percentage wise.

 

[PikminOC]

NO, you tax the top 0.1% who don't deserve to have that much money, easy. Nobody deserves to be so unequivocally wealthy compared to the rest of us. Yes wealth can exist and people can be successful.. but the exponential way that people are successful money-wise is wrong.

Citation please where that will be enough money to start and sustain Medicare for all, tuition, and free puppies

 

[wagrxm2000]

Your not In the top 1%.... You ain’t gotta lie to kick it.

According to Forbes, the top 1% have a net worth over 10 million or earn half a million per year.

 

[PikminOC]

Yes, I’ve heard that back in the 1950s, the rich paid tax that was somewhere 80% of their income. But then they tried to buy lawmakers and made the laws that benefit them. Nowadays, they pay nothing.
Capitalism, I see, is bad for human beings. Greed is NOT good.

“There was a time in which the economics profession worked in the public interest, but in the neoliberal era, today, they work only for big corporations and billionaires, and that is creating a little bit of a problem. We could choose to enact economic policies that raise taxes on the rich, regulate powerful corporations or raise wages for workers. We have done it before. But neoliberal economists would warn that all of these policies would be a terrible mistake, because raising taxes always kills economic growth, and any form of government regulation is inefficient, and raising wages always kills jobs. Well, as a consequence of that thinking, over the last 30 years, in the USA alone, the top one percent has grown 21 trillion dollars richer while the bottom 50 percent have grown 900 billion dollars poorer,“

There were many more loopholes in the fifties to avoid tax

 

[confettiflyer]

Your not In the top 1%.... You ain’t gotta lie to kick it.

A two pharmacist household in California, with a moderate amount of overtime (or second job), can meet the $515k/yr threshold to be considered 1% in the state.


Sent from my iPhone using SDN

 

[wagrxm2000]

Citation please where that will be enough money to start and sustain Medicare for all, tuition, and free puppies

Sanders plans would double the current federal spending. There is no way it would ever get covered.

If we assume the top 1% pay one trillion in taxes. They would have for pay five times that to cover these programs.

 

[FiremedicMike]

Yang's proposal of taxing companies like Amazon made sense. I didn't know until he talked about it that amazon and netflix paid zero in taxes... we could've apparently gotten close to a trillion dollars if we would just tax the big tech companies.

Just flat cancelling student loans would be a... crime?! fraud?? no? what about those who's already paid a chunk or whole off? like that dad who confronted Warren, are they gonna refund the money to those who paid already? the problem with these scumbag politicians is that they would lie to get in power... but we all know this and still vote... haha they know you're a slave and can't think for yourself.

1. Had Yang won, those companies would have packed up and left America before inauguration day.

2. Businesses use the tax loopholes available to them just as we use the ones available to us as individuals.. I get tax breaks for having kids, for owning a house, for being married, etc.. It's the same thing but on a different scale.

3. To insist that those mega companies don't inject hundreds of millions of dollars into the American economy just because they don't pay corporate taxes is disingenuous at best..

 

[deleted898085]

1. Had Yang won, those companies would have packed up and left America before inauguration day.

Where do you think they're gonna go? Africa?
Lmao

 

[FiremedicMike]

Where do you think they're gonna go? Africa?
Lmao

Because the choice is either America or Africa?

The notion that those companies would stand to lose that much of their revenue sitting down is absurd. They would have absolutely looked for a new base of operations in an area that would have promised the same tax breaks that were previously afforded to them in America.

 

[deleted898085]

a new base of operations in an area that would have promised the same tax breaks that were previously afforded to them in America.

Where?
Also where do we have the most consumers?

 

[FiremedicMike]

Where?
Also where do we have the most consumers?

If you're asking me to give you an address or even a country, I can't.. That's not my area of expertise..

Are you trying to imply that America is the only country on the planet that offers corporate tax loopholes?

Are you willing to stipulate that companies the size of netflix, amazon, and google have an entire staff of people dedicated to economic development and expansion?

I have an exercise for you, won't take long.. Go research why most cruise ships aren't registered and "flagged" by first world nations..

 

[deleted898085]

If you're asking me to give you an address or even a country, I can't.. That's not my area of expertise..

Are you trying to imply that America is the only country on the planet that offers corporate tax loopholes?

Are you willing to stipulate that companies the size of netflix, amazon, and google have an entire staff of people dedicated to economic development and expansion?

I have an exercise for you, won't take long.. Go research why most cruise ships aren't registered and "flagged" by first world nations..

I'm sure Yang did research before he wants to chase American companies away.
I know US is the only country doesn't have VAT.
I know Europe is not a greater place for business.
And I know China knows how to deal with American companies and won't let American companies take advantage of it.
That's all I know.

 

[EggplantPharm]

He can do executive order. But only with federal loans, not with private loans.
It may go to court...
But it has a chance, lol

Trump issued an executive order to forgive $25 million in student loans for disabled veterans.

 

[PikminOC]

Not sure if you trolling , or you're serious. The guy wants to increase taxes on anyone who basically isn't getting welfare checks....what did you think money was going to fall from the sky ? I can't believe someone who is a pharmacist would even consider it a good offer and vote for a socialist ******.

Lots of gullible people out there. Doesn't matter your profession...

 

[PikminOC]

1. Had Yang won, those companies would have packed up and left America before inauguration day.

2. Businesses use the tax loopholes available to them just as we use the ones available to us as individuals.. I get tax breaks for having kids, for owning a house, for being married, etc.. It's the same thing but on a different scale.

3. To insist that those mega companies don't inject hundreds of millions of dollars into the American economy just because they don't pay corporate taxes is disingenuous at best..

There's a marriage penalty

 

[FiremedicMike]

There's a marriage penalty

<shrug> My return is higher (or my taxes owed are less) when I file jointly..

 

[FiremedicMike]

I'm sure Yang did research before he wants to chase American companies away.
I know US is the only country doesn't have VAT.
I know Europe is not a greater place for business.
And I know China knows how to deal with American companies and won't let American companies take advantage of it.
That's all I know.

Well, we're probably not going to see eye to eye on this..

But, it's moot.. Yang is out, no point in arguing about his platform anymore..

 

[deleted898085]

Well, we're probably not going to see eye to eye on this..

But, it's moot.. Yang is out, no point in arguing about his platform anymore..

I believe UBI will eventually come. It's just that it can't come from an Asian man.

 

[FiremedicMike]

I believe UBI will eventually come. It's just that it can't come from an Asian man.

You believe UBI was rejected because it came from an Asian man? Seriously?

Look, I’d love an extra $12,000 per year that I didn’t earn. It’d be great for a few months, and then inflation would catch up, and we’d be no better off than we are now.

Then the companies that are being fleeced to fund this program will either fold or leave America.. then we’ll be worse off..

 

[VictorOfHungerGames]

If you're asking me to give you an address or even a country, I can't.. That's not my area of expertise..

Are you trying to imply that America is the only country on the planet that offers corporate tax loopholes?

Are you willing to stipulate that companies the size of netflix, amazon, and google have an entire staff of people dedicated to economic development and expansion?

I have an exercise for you, won't take long.. Go research why most cruise ships aren't registered and "flagged" by first world nations..

One, it would not be possible for a trillion dollar company to just pick up and leave to a whole new country before January of 2021.

I also saw the Patriotic Act on this issue lol I don't think you can apply the same concept here...

 

[deleted898085]

You believe UBI was rejected because it came from an Asian man? Seriously?

Look, I’d love an extra $12,000 per year that I didn’t earn. It’d be great for a few months, and then inflation would catch up, and we’d be no better off than we are now.

They don't even consider listening when an Asian man talks and wants to be their President.

 

[BMBiology]

1. Had Yang won, those companies would have packed up and left America before inauguration day.

2. Businesses use the tax loopholes available to them just as we use the ones available to us as individuals.. I get tax breaks for having kids, for owning a house, for being married, etc.. It's the same thing but on a different scale.

3. To insist that those mega companies don't inject hundreds of millions of dollars into the American economy just because they don't pay corporate taxes is disingenuous at best..

Yang’s VAT is like a sale tax so even if Amazon move out of the country, a VAT still applies. Europe has a VAT so companies like Amazon still have to pay taxes.

 

[FiremedicMike]

They don't even consider listening when an Asian man talks and wants to be their President.

So then anyone who rejects UBI is racist?

 

[BMBiology]

You believe UBI was rejected because it came from an Asian man? Seriously?

Look, I’d love an extra $12,000 per year that I didn’t earn. It’d be great for a few months, and then inflation would catch up, and we’d be no better off than we are now.

Then the companies that are being fleeced to fund this program will either fold or leave America.. then we’ll be worse off..

Trump reduced Corp and personal tax, inflation is still less than 2%.

 

[FiremedicMike]

Trump reduced Corp and personal tax, inflation is still less than 2%.

There is a substantial monetary difference between Trump's tax cuts and Yang's proposed UBI plan.

 

[FiremedicMike]

One, it would not be possible for a trillion dollar company to just pick up and leave to a whole new country before January of 2021.

I also saw the Patriotic Act on this issue lol I don't think you can apply the same concept here...

Ok, perhaps uprooting between November and January was tongue and cheek, but I'm sure it can be accomplished faster than you might want to believe..