2017 - 2018 Anesthesiology Residency Application Thread

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I've got a little room to spare on my rank list, so I applied to the new Ocala program (Thank you SDN for the tip!), and sent them an email saying I could interview on short notice. I'll let you guys know if anything comes of it.
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Chip N Sawbones said:
In some cases I'm sorry to say that the schools are correct and med students don't know how the match works. I remember explaining to some of my classmates how it was best to rank our top programs first even if we thought we'd get rejected, and there was no way to game the system. I don't recall any great effort from my med school to teach us how to properly set up a rank order list.
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I have to say med students who can't figure out how the match works in the internet age sounds crazy. Can we really say they can think for themselves? At the very least they will be asy targets for drug companies.
 
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moisne said:
Schools call to try and convince you to rank them higher because they assume us med students don't know that the match favors the students.
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There's something to be said about feeling wanted, too. I have them ranked #2 (and did prior to learning of their interest), and I have no shame in saying that their letter made me reevaluate them to be sure they should stay where they are. It's human nature. I felt like an underdog all year and when you get love from an objectively great program that's well known it can mess with your head a little bit.

Also, feeling like you're in control. I've felt like all of this is out of my hands the entire time. This has let me feel like I'm in the drivers seat a bit more, even if it is an illusion.
 
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Mehd School said:
There's something to be said about feeling wanted, too. I have them ranked #2 (and did prior to learning of their interest), and I have no shame in saying that their letter made me reevaluate them to be sure they should stay where they are. It's human nature. I felt like an underdog all year and when you get love from an objectively great program that's well known it can mess with your head a little bit.

Also, feeling like you're in control. I've felt like all of this is out of my hands the entire time. This has let me feel like I'm in the drivers seat a bit more, even if it is an illusion.
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Truth. I got a phone call from the chair of anesthesiology at my #1 program. It obviously doesn't make me rank them more highly, but it makes me feel like I've made the right choice and that I'm wanted as a candidate.
 
moisne said:
This is the email I got... sent on Feb 1:
"i just want to take a moment to inform you that an anesthesioa resdiency program in ocala florida received ACGME accreditation to start for the 2018-2019 academic year... sponsored by UCF/GME based out of our HCA hospital. Will be accepting candidate for CA1 July 1 2018 and 2019. 9 per year."

Aka... they were late to the party and didn't even start interviewing in February and will likely be doing skype interviews in hoping of filling their spots. I'd avoid it though.
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Yeah, that was the exact same email I received. I just wanted to hear what everyone thought about that and how they would approach it.
 
Chip N Sawbones said:
I've got a little room to spare on my rank list, so I applied to the new Ocala program (Thank you SDN for the tip!), and sent them an email saying I could interview on short notice. I'll let you guys know if anything comes of it.
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Would you rather go there or scramble?
 
The problem with SOAP is that anesthesiology programs have no shortage of applicants who didn't match into EM or surgical subspecialties to choose from, all of whom have better board scores than I do. If I did get something in SOAP it would most likely be a malignant program in a big city that I don't want to live in. There are worse places than Florida to spend 3-4 years.
 
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Chip N Sawbones said:
The problem with SOAP is that anesthesiology programs have no shortage of applicants who didn't match into EM or surgical subspecialties to choose from, all of whom have better board scores than I do. If I did get something in SOAP it would most likely be a malignant program in a big city that I don't want to live in. There are worse places than Florida to spend 3-4 years.
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Dude have you even been to Ocala?
 
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Definitely in freak out mode after certifying the list, and realizing I have a real possibility of not matching (throw in awkward laugh). If anyone needs a freak out partner or is in a similar situation feel free to reach out.
 
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Reach 4 the Sky said:
Definitely in freak out mode after certifying the list, and realizing I have a real possibility of not matching (throw in awkward laugh). If anyone needs a freak out partner or is in a similar situation feel free to reach out.
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Why do you feel you have a real possibility of not matching?
 
Dr.Frostmeier said:
PLEASE HELP ME, ANY INPUT IS APPRECIATED!!!!!!!!!!

Hey Everyone. Hope things are moving along great for you guys throughout this cycle and you all get the positions that you really want. I am a third year OSTEOPATHIC medical student in the east coast. I have been interested in anesthesia since they day I applied to med school but unfortunately my board scores are less than stellar. my performance was entirely my fault because I had severe timing issues during the test (english is not my first language). I was scoring in the high 230's and low 240's on the practice exams but obviously the length of the stems were not representative of the actual exams. either way I screwed up and now have to deal with the consequences of it.

USMLE Step1: 210
COMLEX:525

My questions is, if i apply to every program in the country (I really do not care where i end up) do you think I have a decent shot of matching? I have looked at the NRMP match data and people with my score have an over 90% chance of matching. But that data is for MD students and im not sure how being a DO affects it. Thanks in advance
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This is going to be an uphill climb. DO students need an average of 10-15 points higher than a comparable MD student from what I’ve seen for a given program - an MD student with 195-200 would have difficulty matching. Your COMLEX score doesn’t move the needle much.

It’s still early, so if you are really interested you need to take Step 2 early and get a much improved score, preferably 230s but 240s would be much more helpful.

Plan on doing one or two away rotations at programs with a track record of taking DOs, especially those from your school. You will need to try to impress in person.

Without a substantial improvement in Step 2, to be honest it would be a good idea to apply with a backup specialty just to be safe.

I am sure you were being facetious, but don’t bother applying to “every program” - apply to those with a some number of DOs on their roster. Most of not all University-based programs will filter you out based on Step 1, honestly.
 
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AdmiralChz said:
This is going to be an uphill climb. DO students need an average of 10-15 points higher than a comparable MD student from what I’ve seen for a given program - an MD student with 195-200 would have difficulty matching. Your COMLEX score doesn’t move the needle much.

It’s still early, so if you are really interested you need to take Step 2 early and get a much improved score, preferably 230s but 240s would be much more helpful.

Plan on doing one or two away rotations at programs with a track record of taking DOs, especially those from your school. You will need to try to impress in person.

Without a substantial improvement in Step 2, to be honest it would be a good idea to apply with a backup specialty just to be safe.

I am sure you were being facetious, but don’t bother applying to “every program” - apply to those with a some number of DOs on their roster. Most of not all University-based programs will filter you out based on Step 1, honestly.
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If you have amazing letters, a heartfelt personal statement that is truly personal (meaning someone could pick yours out of a stack if it didn’t have your name on it), great clinical comments and a step 2 of 240+, you have a very good shot if you focus on the low tiers. DO friendly schools that are mid tier may or may not be an option. My PD at a top 25 med school said she cares more about step 2 than step 1. You’re definitely going to get filtered from 70% of programs but the ones who look past it may give you an interview if you contact the coordinator expressing interest. Yes, without knowing you, the situation looks bleak, but if you really want it, then dual apply and then give it your all.
 
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Maybe a silly question. Does the NRMP data approximate the actual percentages for DOs pretty well despite being grouped into the independent cohort?
 
Can people comment as to how much money they ended up spending on the interview process and how many interviews they attended. Trying to budget a bit for the future. thx.
 
MIpremed321 said:
Can people comment as to how much money they ended up spending on the interview process and how many interviews they attended. Trying to budget a bit for the future. thx.
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I spent $1870 on ERAS (I shouldn't have applied to quite so many programs) and interviews averaged about $300 each for airfare, hotels or Airbnb, airport parking and ground transportation. They would have cost more but I was able to use miles for most of my flights. If you are good at managing finances I recommend signing up for airline credit cards and spending enough to get the initial bonus before closing the accounts and switching to a new card. I think I'm on my tenth Alaska Airlines card, plus three or four each from American Airlines and Delta. Only do this if you are disciplined enough to pay off each bill IN FULL at the end of the month. If you aren't, the 20% interest rates will rapidly cost you much more than the miles are worth.
 
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MIpremed321 said:
Can people comment as to how much money they ended up spending on the interview process and how many interviews they attended. Trying to budget a bit for the future. thx.
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I spent around $10k and attended 14 interviews. Mine was an unusual situation though, as I got my CK score back late (last week of October) and interviews started pouring in. A lot of places put me on the waitlist or invited me basically asking if I could be there in like 6 days. So I had about 5 flights that were $600+ back-to-back-to-back. I was only able to drive to one. And I applied to a lot of middle tier programs that don't pay for hotels. Probably no coincidence that my top 5 is filled with higher tier programs that all gave me a free $150+ hotel room...
 
nope. and i spent 1k on eras and 2k on interview season only had 1 flight at 250$ drove to 11 interviews
 
AdmiralChz said:
Um, how much flying are you doing exactly?
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Quite a bit. Living in Alaska means taking a flight or a very long roadtrip if you need to get anywhere else, and the flights aren't going to be short either. I did interviews for medical school and residency while living in Alaska, plus various trips during medical school for weddings, emergency rental house repairs, visiting grandparents, and visiting my wife while she was on locums jobs. It adds up faster than you'd think.
 
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anbuitachi said:
Surprised to see NYU Columbia St lukes dominate among the NYC programs. Always interesting to see how everyones list differ by so much
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That's why I wish our thread was like the EM thread, so we can see people's rationale for their choices.
 
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Chip N Sawbones said:
Quite a bit. Living in Alaska means taking a flight or a very long roadtrip if you need to get anywhere else, and the flights aren't going to be short either. I did interviews for medical school and residency while living in Alaska, plus various trips during medical school for weddings, emergency rental house repairs, visiting grandparents, and visiting my wife while she was on locums jobs. It adds up faster than you'd think.
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Ha, I interviewed with you this year.
 
hey guys, good luck with the match on Monday.

I am a below average applicant looking to match gas next year, was wondering if there are any programs that you absolutely would not consider going to, even as a last resort. I remember seeing Buffalo has a lot of issues, any other names to drop?
 
Hey guys, trying to prepare for the upcoming Match week/SOAP.
Steps are 230s
Failed PE x2 and haven't gotten the 3rd score back yet
Some positives include multiple letters of recommendation from away rotations, decent-ish Step 1.

I had 7 anesthesia interviews and am at a high risk for not matching. We get 45 applications to send out to programs in the SOAP. Provided there are more than 45 spots unfilled like there were last year, how should I "budget" the applications I send out?

I obviously would love to SOAP into an anesthesia spot, but I'll be competing with the people who didn't get ortho, etc. The next plan would be to apply as a physician next year... Would IM or surgery "look" better? How many of the 45 would one suggest I put in anesthesiology vs IM/surg?

With the PE situation, maybe I'm being too ambitious and should purely focus on matching categorical Internal Medicine and dispense with the idea that I'll ever get to be an anesthesiologist? I know this is a very individual issue, but my advising I'm getting is pretty vague, my DO faculty are nice and helpful, but they don't have too much experience with students applying to anesthesiology. PS, If anyone thinks it's a terrible idea to be airing this stuff for programs to see I'll delete it.
 
sunealoneal said:
Hey guys, trying to prepare for the upcoming Match week/SOAP.
Steps are 230s
Failed PE x2 and haven't gotten the 3rd score back yet
Some positives include multiple letters of recommendation from away rotations, decent-ish Step 1.

I had 7 anesthesia interviews and am at a high risk for not matching. We get 45 applications to send out to programs in the SOAP. Provided there are more than 45 spots unfilled like there were last year, how should I "budget" the applications I send out?

I obviously would love to SOAP into an anesthesia spot, but I'll be competing with the people who didn't get ortho, etc. The next plan would be to apply as a physician next year... Would IM or surgery "look" better? How many of the 45 would one suggest I put in anesthesiology vs IM/surg?

With the PE situation, maybe I'm being too ambitious and should purely focus on matching categorical Internal Medicine and dispense with the idea that I'll ever get to be an anesthesiologist? I know this is a very individual issue, but my advising I'm getting is pretty vague, my DO faculty are nice and helpful, but they don't have too much experience with students applying to anesthesiology. PS, If anyone thinks it's a terrible idea to be airing this stuff for programs to see I'll delete it.
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I think it's ok sharing this. Anyways, I ask myself the question in bold everyday. Apparently people think IM prelim is preferable.... but it's also more competitive (maybe so much of an issue for AMGs?). More chances the surgery program will be malignant too. I still ranked surg prelims higher because I think doing procedures is fun and engaging + the programs I interviewed at did not seem malignant, and left a very good impression. I definitely feel like I might miss exposure to some important clinical stuff and knowledge by spending so much time with surgery work, hard to tell. That said, I have this creeping feeling I bombed all the interviews and if I match it will be in my bottom 2 choices, all categorical, so maybe I am worried about nothing.
 
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Good to know... I prefer IM as a field and if I ended up doing that as a career presuming I failed to match anesthesia again next year (which, let's be honest, is pretty realistic), I would not be predominantly bitter. So I should be applying to categorical IM programs in addition to anesthesia... The only question now is how many IM, how many anesthesiology.
 
sunealoneal said:
Hey guys, trying to prepare for the upcoming Match week/SOAP.
Steps are 230s
Failed PE x2 and haven't gotten the 3rd score back yet
Some positives include multiple letters of recommendation from away rotations, decent-ish Step 1.

I had 7 anesthesia interviews and am at a high risk for not matching. We get 45 applications to send out to programs in the SOAP. Provided there are more than 45 spots unfilled like there were last year, how should I "budget" the applications I send out?

I obviously would love to SOAP into an anesthesia spot, but I'll be competing with the people who didn't get ortho, etc. The next plan would be to apply as a physician next year... Would IM or surgery "look" better? How many of the 45 would one suggest I put in anesthesiology vs IM/surg?

With the PE situation, maybe I'm being too ambitious and should purely focus on matching categorical Internal Medicine and dispense with the idea that I'll ever get to be an anesthesiologist? I know this is a very individual issue, but my advising I'm getting is pretty vague, my DO faculty are nice and helpful, but they don't have too much experience with students applying to anesthesiology. PS, If anyone thinks it's a terrible idea to be airing this stuff for programs to see I'll delete it.
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I would do this:
- Find out which programs have advance positions (PGY2 = CA1) to be filled in the following match (usually the same as the places that one now).
- SOAP for a surgery prelim in the institutions where those PGY2 positions exists. Easier to get and more exposure to ICU (SICU, CICU, etc) and ORs.
- Schedule a meeting within a month of starting inter year with your GenSurg PD and Anes PD of said institution and talk clearly and honestly about your goal of going into Anes.
- If you have an elective do it in Anes at the same institution.
- Pass Step 3 with a more than reasonable score.
- Work hard and make some allies. Your chiefs, your mentors and the attendings that you work closely with can vouch for you to the Anes PD. Do not complain.
- Outside rotations are an option but is always weird and not very productive when when we get an outside PGY1 prelim at our institution. The idea is to maximize face-time while doing something productive so that you can shine. Outside rotators do a lot of watching.

There are several institutions with PGY-2 spots not too many but enough that to have some options.
 
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mai chan said:
Hi everyone, here OMS III.
Can anyone plz list some of the programs that are DO friendly, especially in the southern states.
Thank you.
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1) look at websites of current residents and see how many DOs there are. If none, probably not a reasonable choice.

2) Where did upper classmen go when they marched? Reach out to them.
 
AdmiralChz said:
1) look at websites of current residents and see how many DOs there are. If none, probably not a reasonable choice.
Thank you for ur response.
I already did look at the residents in each hospital. Even though they do have some DO, I still dont know if they are accepted bcs of their levels or bcs of their steps. I was wondering if I could call them and ask abt details.
Any other ideas plz...tnx.



2) Where did upper classmen go when they marched? Reach out to them.
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You are weird. Just search these forums, read some of the threads. take a chill pill. and apply broadly. take usmle.
 
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Let's all be nice ...


@mai chan ... just a friendly suggestion, don't go back and delete your messages after you post them. You've got 6 posts to your name, and you've self-deleted half of them. That's not how forums are supposed to work.

You've been given good advice in a couple places. These guys want to help you.

DOs still have something of a disadvantage competing with MDs for residency positions. I can tell English is not your first language, and if you speak like you write, it will hurt you at interviews. You're older than the traditional applicant too, which in theory shouldn't hurt you, but in reality might be another reason for programs to pass on you. Age discrimination exists. These are things you can't change.

So it's concerning that the single most important objective piece of your application (USMLE scores) is missing. This is something you can fix.
 
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mai chan said:
Idiot
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People have been more than helpful on this and the other thread. If you want to make yourself the most competitive applicant possible, you need to take the USMLEs. You are only hurting yourself by not taking the exams.

I am at a DO friendly program in the South(target area you stated) and we will not look at an application without a Step 1 score.
 
UrbanAchievers said:
I am at a DO friendly program in the South(target area you stated) and we will not look at an application without a Step 1 score.
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Exactly. Like it or not, USMLEs are often the only metric we have to quantitatively compare applicants - and when you get hundreds of applications for only 20 positions you have to start somewhere.

To be totally honest with you, I have no idea what to do with COMLEX scores. Does an 80th or 90th percentile mean the same as that performance on the USMLEs? It might not. My DO colleagues were very open in discussing this and their school gave them proper advising - want an allopathic residency, you need the USMLEs. This might not be what you want to hear, but better to find out now than in the middle of application season.
 
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pgg said:
Let's all be nice ...


@mai chan ... just a friendly suggestion, don't go back and delete your messages after you post them. You've got 6 posts to your name, and you've self-deleted half of them. That's not how forums are supposed to work.

You've been given good advice in a couple places. These guys want to help you.

DOs still have something of a disadvantage competing with MDs for residency positions. I can tell English is not your first language, and if you speak like you write, it will hurt you at interviews. You're older than the traditional applicant too, which in theory shouldn't hurt you, but in reality might be another reason for programs to pass on you. Age discrimination exists. These are things you can't change.

So it's concerning that the single most important objective piece of your application (USMLE scores) is missing. This is something you can fix.
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Factors Affecting Admission to Anesthesiology Residency in the United States:Choosing the Future of Our Specialty | Anesthesiology | ASA Publications
 
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