Yale Psych drama and current state of the program

[creoque]

Breaking News..Yale Psychiatry has removed Wasser from PD position and reinstated Belitzky as interim PD due to resident pushback

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[G Sheb]

I'm not agreeing or disagreeing with "many" here, I'm just pointing out what was literally said in the article to show why someone might think that race played a role.

A the risk of repeating myself, minority status clearly played a role in how the candidates were considered and ranked.
But it's not the reason the current aPD was ruled out or why he faced unanimous opposition to the appointment.
That distinction is important, and pretending that the article implied anything like that is a bit disingenous and requires lots of twisting and stretching of the quotes you mentioned (some of them imply the absolute opposite, while ofc conveniently omitting other information).

 

[G Sheb]

Why would you be surprised? During my time in training, we had a transition of PD, and only women of color were allowed to be seriously considered by my co-residents. The way the PD selection process was done was that those highest up faculty in the administration presented a list of candidates to the residents, and the residents would ultimately vote for and elect from this list who the new PD would be after interviewing each individual candidate on this administration-approved list. Because the prevailing obsession in my program was to hire a woman of color, I had to resign myself to make the most of my vote by giving it to which woman of color had the most merit, as my vote for anyone else would have been pointless. They dismissed any males as serious contenders but humored those of color at least. White males were grilled more intensely during the group interview sessions with the residents and candidates for new PD. The males never had a chance, and white males were gatekept with any excuse about their character or performance before they were even seriously evaluated.

Academia does not like white men and actively tries to recruit any other demographic if it has the choice. The less male, the less white, the less heterosexual, the better. Have you spoken to the average psychiatry resident lately? They speak incessantly about white supremacy, racism, transphobia and all other flavors of the most mainstream social justice rhetoric. They complain about how there aren’t enough minorities in the residency programs, despite the fact that demand far outweighs supply of minorities. This heavily influences program directors and selection committees to rank candidates highly based on these superficial diversity characteristics. My residency program was sponsored by one of the elite institutions, and this preoccupation with diversity, mostly skin color, sexual orientation, and transgenderism, was built into the foundation of the institution and reinforced from the top down.

As a straight white male myself, my voice was so small and held little value in the community, and I walked on eggshells the entire time I was in training, never once daring to bring up opposing points of views or to even question anything remotely woke (e.g., I could suffer social and even professional damage for daring to speak about the incredible importance of intact families or the potential value of a male father figure in the home for the children—because this would be seen as misogynist towards single mothers and transphobic respectively). Those who rarely dared to were often ridiculed, documented thoroughly on, watched under a microscope, were less likely to be given mercy for natural learning mistakes, shamed, gossiped about, and treated as an outsider. I was surrounded by self-righteous activists, not humble physicians. It was 4 years of pretending that I was a true believer as much as I could without entirely betraying my true self and hating who I was, hoping the others couldn’t smell on me that I was different, trying to blend in and not be noticed. I considered any attention on me to be negative attention, even if I had done something good. I did not want eyes on me or minds thinking about me. I just focused on my work 1 day at a time, taking great satisfaction in being able to care for my patients and become a better physician daily, until it was finally over. I am now a very good clinician, but I still resent the environment I was forced to endure as a resident. Psychiatry, as a professional community, has lost its collective mind.

Let's just get a list of chairs and program directors, and see how many are white males, and how many are minorities.
Maybe you'd understand why there's a push to recruit leadership from monirities in a specialty that is inherently sensitive to bias and discrimination.
What a load of victimized bs. (ironically).

 

[annoyedpsychiatrist]

A the risk of repeating myself, minority status clearly played a role in how the candidates were considered and ranked.
But it's not the reason the current aPD was ruled out or why the residents made a big fuss.
That distinction is important, and pretending that the article implied anything like that is a bit disingenous and requires lots of twisting and stretching of the quotes you mentioned (some of them imply the absolute opposite).

The article was poorly written and did imply that. I dunno what side was true, but the article made subtle hints that the residents wanted someone more diverse then they got.

The only people who know the actual story are the residents and the PD, everything on here, both sides is speculation and that article was poorly written, the way it was written it seems like it was almost trying to get a rise out of people.

 

[creoque]

Let's just get a list of chairs and program directors, and see how many are white males, and how many are minorities.
Maybe you'd understand why there's a push to recruit leadership from monirities in a specialty that is inherently sensitive to bias and discrimination.
What a load of victimized bs. (ironically).

I think considering Yale removed Wasser very recently due to resident push back, they will certainly hire a minority woman for leadership.

 

[annoyedpsychiatrist]

I mean come on lets be real here, of all the people they quote, they quote the intern who just started? And the fact that he spoke up and went public with stuff like that just demonstrates hes eager for the spotlight; no one with a logical brain would openly trash their program. What is there to even gain from that? lol. Give me the opinions of the PGY 3s and 4s and then ill take this article somewhat seriously.

 

[G Sheb]

I think considering Yale removed Wasser very recently due to resident push back, they will certainly hire a minority woman for leadership.

It's a sensible decision if this is true.
Having the bulk of the residents on the opposite side is not a good look.

 

[Chrish]

Reading the article makes me think said person was just not liked by the residents..

If he were good at his job and respected, I seriously doubt he would attract such strong reaction regardless of skin pigmentation and genital..

“..concerns over Wasser’s “interpersonal leadership skills” and a “lack of empathy, relatability and responsiveness.”

 

[hallowmann]

I mean come on lets be real here, of all the people they quote, they quote the intern who just started? And the fact that he spoke up and went public with stuff like that just demonstrates hes eager for the spotlight; no one with a logical brain would openly trash their program. What is there to even gain from that? lol. Give me the opinions of the PGY 3s and 4s and then ill take this article somewhat seriously.

Literally only 3 out of the 75 residents were willing to endorse this guy becoming PD. That's striking. I can't imagine feeling comfortable even taking the position knowing that's how the residents felt. It was clear when he saw he wasn't being chosen as PD initially he was going to resign (the email to residents he sent mentioned in the article), likely because he felt he couldn't advance there.

The perceived path of least resistance by the chair was to give him what he wants and have him stay, but the residents were understandably upset because of the 3 candidates he was literally the one they recommended against. It ended up not being the path of least resistance so much.

I think considering Yale removed Wasser very recently due to resident push back, they will certainly hire a minority woman for leadership.

My guess is with this news, he'll go (i.e. resign like he had planned prior) and be hired as PD somewhere else. He was not "removed", they simply changed their mind regarding promoting him given the pushback. Its not like he was there for years. Let's not act like he's being cancelled, the pushback wasn't even about firing him, it was about not wanting him to be promoted to that specific position.

 

[Stagg737]

Literally only 3 out of the 75 residents were willing to endorse this guy becoming PD. That's striking.

Kind of semantics, but 20% of the residents didn't participate in the survey they cited. I doubt that would have significantly changed the results, but I'd be curious about who those who chose not to participate were and why they didn't participate.

My guess is with this news, he'll go (i.e. resign like he had planned prior) and be hired as PD somewhere else. He was not "removed", they simply changed their mind regarding promoting him given the pushback. Its not like he was there for years. Let's not act like he's being cancelled, the pushback wasn't even about firing him, it was about not wanting him to be promoted to that specific position.

Actually I'd say he was removed as he was recently (I believe last week) listed as the PD on Yale's psychiatry website and no longer is. He's also no longer listed as an APD.

Also, is it normal for a program to have 3-4 APDs? I realize they're a large program, but that just seems like bureaucracy at its finest, lol.

 

[TexasPhysician]

Breaking News..Yale Psychiatry has removed Wasser from PD position and reinstated Belitzky as interim PD due to resident pushback

Unless Wasser did something truly terrible, there should be a huge lawsuit in the near future. Yale psych is looking like a train wreck.

 

[hallowmann]

Kind of semantics, but 20% of the residents didn't participate in the survey they cited. I doubt that would have significantly changed the results, but I'd be curious about who those who chose not to participate were and why they didn't participate.


Actually I'd say he was removed as he was recently (I believe last week) listed as the PD on Yale's psychiatry website and no longer is. He's also no longer listed as an APD.

Also, is it normal for a program to have 3-4 APDs? I realize they're a large program, but that just seems like bureaucracy at its finest, lol.

This is what I was basing the statement off of:

In the same survey of 75 current residents that revealed only 4 percent approved "the selection of Tobias Wasser as Program Director," 77 percent also responded "no" to the question of whether they felt "the decision making process for Program Director leadership was completed ethically and fairly."

How big is the program? 95+ people? That's huge.

EDIT: Looks like there are 75 residents and 8 "integrated" residents per the website. Where did it say 20% didn't respond? It looked like 20% didn't sign the letter of no confidence to the news article. Is that what you're talking about?

Time will tell if he told them he was leaving when he was told they'd demote him from the position, and that's why he's not on the website. Like I said, he was already planning to leave when he wasn't gonna get it before.

As for the APDs, I can say my smaller program had 2 APDs, so I think its probably typical.

 

[Stagg737]

This is what I was basing the statement off of:


How big is the program? 95+ people? That's huge.

EDIT: Looks like there are 75 residents and 8 "integrated" residents per the website. Where did it say 20% didn't respond? It looked like 20% didn't sign the letter of no confidence to the news article. Is that what you're talking about?

Time will tell if he told them he was leaving when he was told they'd demote him from the position, and that's why he's not on the website. Like I said, he was already planning to leave when he wasn't gonna get it before.

As for the APDs, I can say my smaller program had 2 APDs, so I think its probably typical.

You are correct. I was seeing that only 60 signed the letter. My bad.

He's still on the website as faculty, but he's no longer listed as an APD or PD on the website and recently, I believe last week, he was listed as the PD. So not only no longer listed as PD/deputy PD, he's not listed as any kind of director. Seems like something they'd only do if he accepted the position and the department planned on moving forward with it, so them pulling the offer does come across as being "removed" from the PD position.

 

[hallowmann]

You are correct. I was seeing that only 60 signed the letter. My bad.

He's still on the website as faculty, but he's no longer listed as an APD or PD on the website and recently, I believe last week, he was listed as the PD. So not only no longer listed as PD/deputy PD, he's not listed as any kind of director. Seems like something they'd only do if he accepted the position and the department planned on moving forward with it, so them pulling the offer does come across as being "removed" from the PD position.

Yeah, optics not great for everyone involved. If I was that guy, I would peace out (sounds like that's what he wanted before) or alternatively shift away from education and more towards clinical/research.

 

[creoque]

They definitely gave him the position and then pulled it away. He was removed. This is not an opinion, it is a fact.

 

[Medstart108]

So...let me get this straight. The residents are outraged because:

1) in a survey circulated in the program, Wasser only mustered a 4 percent approval rating from residents (but we aren't given any additional information about why)
2) In Wasser’s interview with residents, according to Godley, Wasser fielded questions about how he planned to support residents of color in the program, especially because, unlike the other two candidates — both Black women — Wasser was a white man with limited DEI experience. [but the author/article provides ZERO specifics about his answers to these questions and--I suppose--we are supposed to presume that they were offensive or unacceptable in some way?]
3) Based on the results of the search (and, I presume, the residents' expressed preferences via the survey) SOMEONE ELSE was initially offered the position but ultimately couldn't accept it
4) Ultimately, the faculty determined that Wasser was an acceptable candidate (at the last minute?) based on his actual record of performance over the years to serve in the position and offered him the position
5) Basically the residents (at least some vocal ones) are outraged that Wasser is a white man and not a black woman

I didn't see anywhere in the article where residents were even claiming (let alone providing specifics) that Wasser wasn't qualified for the position (based on merit, experience, scholarship, clinical experience--or lack thereof) or that he had said or done things (specific things) that were being pointed to as evidence of some sort of '-ism' that would otherwise disqualify him.

I mean, off-the-record, he may have done such things but are we just to assume that he did because we just want to assume that he did? It's either bad reporting or the story doesn't seem to make a whole lot of sense.

Edit: okay, combing over the article again we get: "concerns over Wasser’s “interpersonal leadership skills” and a “lack of empathy, relatability and responsiveness.”"

So, this was their opinion on a survey. Graduate education sure has changed a lot since I was in school...I didn't realize that faculty positions were elected positions based on 'votes' from the student body. Things like 'concerns over interpersonal leadership skills, lack of empathy, relatability, and responsiveness' strike me as pretty non-specific, subject to interpretation, and would need to be examined more closely to see if any 'offense' was actually committed or any breach of ethics.

If you have a 4% approval rating, you're doing something wrong.

 

[DOswag]

Wow there’s a lot to unpack here. But to simplify: those who are in favor of DEI focus almost exclusively on race (anti racist being actually racist) whereas others focus on merit (without considering race at all, which you would think would be more in line with “anti racist” but actually isn’t).

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

If you have a 4% approval rating, you're doing something wrong.

We have two data points with respect to how that particular student body rates people. A 4% rating and a 7% rating (if I recall correctly, I know it was less than 10 percent).

I'd need some more data than that to conclude that they weren't doing something wrong, i.e., being utterly dissatisfied with everyone.

 

[mistafab]

On topic of DEI / AA stuff. It bothers me when folks look at minority peers thinking they were some Affirmative Action candidate that did not have "merit." I can clearly say that 1) I was a strong resident candidate with top scores and top grades, 2) I had steller recommendations, research, activities, etc, 3) in my very strong residency program, I am again a very strong resident compared to peers in both qualitative (summative/formative), and quantitative ways (i.e. prite).

In addition, being at a top institution, I can clearly say some faculty members, many who are minorities, hold endowed professorships, run their labs, have tons of grants, etc etc are all well qualified for the position they have. What is hard for some non-minority people to fathom is that a lot of times minorities are simply better than you. Bigger, faster, stronger... People that are superior come in all shapes, sizes, and colors. Sometimes majority groups have a hard time accepting that they are in fact not chosen because they are the inferior candidate.

Sucks to suck. Winners arent complaining.

 

[Liquid8]

Unless Wasser did something truly terrible, there should be a huge lawsuit in the near future. Yale psych is looking like a train wreck.

Seems at odds with being awarded an Excellence in Teaching Award earlier this month...

Wasser Honored for Excellence in Teaching Forensic Psychiatry

Tobias Wasser, MD, associate professor of psychiatry, has been awarded the American Academy of Psychiatry and the Law’s (AAPL) “Howard V. Zonana Best Teacher in

medicine.yale.edu

Wasser was nominated for the award by multiple past forensic psychiatry fellows that he taught, including one who wrote, “Dr. Wasser is an extraordinary teacher and mentor. He stands out as a faculty member who is deeply dedicated to helping trainees excel at all levels of training. His teaching style is exciting and innovative and is consistent with his general approach of inspiring and pushing learners to grow and expand their skills. He is warm and welcoming and he has an ability to put fellows at ease, even when discussing difficult topics.”

 

[SmallBird]

This really is super disappointing. Whether or not it is believed that Yale is doing enough on DEI, they have lost an excellent candidate for program director and it's going to be insanely difficult to get another one. In their excitement to work on critical issues related to structural inequality the residents have ruined a career, massively damaged their program, compromised their own education, and done nothing at all to help any people of color.

 

[creoque]

This really is super disappointing. Whether or not it is believed that Yale is doing enough on DEI, they have lost an excellent candidate for program director and it's going to be insanely difficult to get another one. In their excitement to work on critical issues related to structural inequality the residents have ruined a career, massively damaged their program, compromised their own education, and done nothing at all to help any people of color.

Yeah this just made things infinitely worse. And Dr. Wasser's is not a career that deserves to be ruined.

 

[SmallBird]

Yeah this just made things infinitely worse. And Dr. Wasser's is not a career that deserves to be ruined.

Nope. He was always unfailingly kind to me, even as an IMG applicant in 2011 who needed help getting around New Haven and had several follow up emails about where the best place was to buy groceries. I hope the residents will at least reflect on their approach to this issue and consider how they may have been more effective rather than the littlefingeresque victory they are left with.

 

[smalltownpsych]

On topic of DEI / AA stuff. It bothers me when folks look at minority peers thinking they were some Affirmative Action candidate that did not have "merit." I can clearly say that 1) I was a strong resident candidate with top scores and top grades, 2) I had steller recommendations, research, activities, etc, 3) in my very strong residency program, I am again a very strong resident compared to peers in both qualitative (summative/formative), and quantitative ways (i.e. prite).

In addition, being at a top institution, I can clearly say some faculty members, many who are minorities, hold endowed professorships, run their labs, have tons of grants, etc etc are all well qualified for the position they have. What is hard for some non-minority people to fathom is that a lot of times minorities are simply better than you. Bigger, faster, stronger... People that are superior come in all shapes, sizes, and colors. Sometimes majority groups have a hard time accepting that they are in fact not chosen because they are the inferior candidate.

Sucks to suck. Winners arent complaining.

This has been what I have actually seen play out. The people that have had some additional challenges tend to have some additional skills when we’re looking at a field that is highly competitive such as being a doctor or what I have seen more firsthand is with psychologists. All of my dissertation committee were minorities and they were all pretty damn impressive each in their own right. One thing I completely agree with the DEI stuff is that diversity is a strength and when I am hiring, thats what I want on my team and I’m looking at a lot more than just skin color that’s for damn sure. Immigrants, children of immigrants, socioeconomics, ethnicity, gender, treatment perspectives, personality backgrounds, ages, etc. It would be stupid to have a bunch of people on my team that were too similar to me as I already do that part pretty well myself. 😊

 

[ArdorAyurveda]

Why would you be surprised? During my time in training, we had a transition of PD, and only women of color were allowed to be seriously considered by my co-residents. The way the PD selection process was done was that those highest up faculty in the administration presented a list of candidates to the residents, and the residents would ultimately vote for and elect from this list who the new PD would be after interviewing each individual candidate on this administration-approved list. Because the prevailing obsession in my program was to hire a woman of color, I had to resign myself to make the most of my vote by giving it to which woman of color had the most merit, as my vote for anyone else would have been pointless. They dismissed any males as serious contenders but humored those of color at least. White males were grilled more intensely during the group interview sessions with the residents and candidates for new PD. The males never had a chance, and white males were gatekept with any excuse about their character or performance before they were even seriously evaluated.

Academia does not like white men and actively tries to recruit any other demographic if it has the choice. The less male, the less white, the less heterosexual, the better. Have you spoken to the average psychiatry resident lately? They speak incessantly about white supremacy, racism, transphobia and all other flavors of the most mainstream social justice rhetoric. They complain about how there aren’t enough minorities in the residency programs, despite the fact that demand far outweighs supply of minorities. This heavily influences program directors and selection committees to rank candidates highly based on these superficial diversity characteristics. My residency program was sponsored by one of the elite institutions, and this preoccupation with diversity, mostly skin color, sexual orientation, and transgenderism, was built into the foundation of the institution and reinforced from the top down.

As a straight white male myself, my voice was so small and held little value in the community, and I walked on eggshells the entire time I was in training, never once daring to bring up opposing points of views or to even question anything remotely woke (e.g., I could suffer social and even professional damage for daring to speak about the incredible importance of intact families or the potential value of a male father figure in the home for the children—because this would be seen as misogynist towards single mothers and transphobic respectively). Those who rarely dared to were often ridiculed, documented thoroughly on, watched under a microscope, were less likely to be given mercy for natural learning mistakes, shamed, gossiped about, and treated as an outsider. I was surrounded by self-righteous activists, not humble physicians. It was 4 years of pretending that I was a true believer as much as I could without entirely betraying my true self and hating who I was, hoping the others couldn’t smell on me that I was different, trying to blend in and not be noticed. I considered any attention on me to be negative attention, even if I had done something good. I did not want eyes on me or minds thinking about me. I just focused on my work 1 day at a time, taking great satisfaction in being able to care for my patients and become a better physician daily, until it was finally over. I am now a very good clinician, but I still resent the environment I was forced to endure as a resident. Psychiatry, as a professional community, has lost its collective mind.

What sort of environment were you in? If you chose to attend residency in an urban, cosmopolitan location, perhaps you may have expected such a response from your colleagues. Not saying it's necessarily, fair, but you gotta know if your environment is hostile to your belief system. No institution is hiding the fact that DEI is name of the game these days...

And not that I would expect a white male to know this, but this sort of "othering" that you just recently have come to discern is what we minorities have had to deal with here in the US since its inception, and we continue to deal with it to this day through microaggressions, not only from our co-residents, program directors, and allied health nursing staff, but even from our patients. Yes, it is that pervasive. I know it's hard to fathom as someone who did not grow up experiencing it, but take a moment to listen to the experiences of your non-majority acquaintances.

I understand that has a hetero-cisgender white Male, it is hard for you to not be in the majority, to not be in power for once, even if it is only temporarily like when your homosexual, transgender colleagues are venting about their experiences in a safe environment (at work)...but demographics and culture are changing my friend...adapt and survive, or go and start your White Men in Psychiatry Support Group. I'm sure you will have plenty of members.

You said white males were never given a chance to be PD at your instutition...I can't tell you how many times my black male colleagues with "black" names such as DaQuan, Santavious, and Douane are never given a chance...at least the white males got an interview...to me, it's a good thing that women of color are being seriously considered for PD positions. On a larger scale, we need more of them. Especially American Indian/Native American women.

But hey, you even said that you gave up your vote for your fellow white male because it was pointless...so if you already knew the outcome, what made you choose this particular program? Why didn't you vote with your feet and transfer to a residency program in rural West Virginia? Plenty of white men in Appalachia that would agree with your stance.

Now having addressed the WHITE RAGE...I actually 100% agree with you that it's messed up that you were labeled as transphobic, misogynist, etc. for your stance on healthy father figures being important. As a cis-hetero black man, there is no one who is more invested more in having black fathers present in black homes. The black community has been torn asunder by the matriarchy. I stand by that 1000%

Let me reiterate before you write me off (which I would understand, given that I called out your White Rage earlier, but I would hazard that someone who writes aplenty probably reads aplenty as well). I agree with the notion having a healthy father figures is important for a child's development...but I fail to see what this has to do with you being white. It is a shame that your colleagues were so hyper-sensitive and irrational that they chose to lambast you for your benign belief. This is a problem among the radical and liberal left, and it is most certainly beginning to invade the consciousness of more moderate liberals, thanks in large part to the mainstream media. I agree that this ideological psyops issue, but I also want to keep my job, and I don't have a need to be right all the time at work, so I just keep my mouth shut and let my actions in my personal life do the talking.

Additionally, the majority of people are sheep and do not think for themselves -- the fact that most people fall into line with the predominant ideas that are spouted by the media, well to me that is a sign that they are of lesser intelligence, and thus I don't really need to worry about them. In other terms, I am not concerned with sheeple.

As for the elite institutions and their obsession with woke-ism...I attended one, and I truly believe that wokeness is a luxury belief...I personally know several of the psychiatry residents at a different Ivy League. Personally as in, I went to undergrad with them, attended the same parties, lived in the same dorms, went to the same entertainment venues, I have their phone numbers...it's all for show. They want power and attention and want to be seen as edgy by appearing woke. And some of them are actually just cultural Marxists and believe the Black Lives Matters is a legitimate coalition...lol, but that is delusion that I don't care to erase at the moment. I'll save that for another time...

At the end of the day, these elite institutions were built by white people for white people...and the minorities that end up going there, we for the most part end up clamoring for the same white collar jobs in the same urban metros as other rich (and mostly white) people. Once you get high up enough, you realize it's all just about $$$ and power...how many of these "elite" psychiatry residents from prestigious institutions end up practicing in inner-city Detroit, Oakland, Atlanta, or for the Indian Health Services? End up practicing in food deserts like in New Orleans and in Mississippi where the poorest and least privileged reside? Not many...myself included, I'm not tryna do all that.

Very few, usually only the ones that grew up in these kinds of places...so yes, currently some white candidates are getting overlooked, getting the short end of the stick. Y'all gone be alright, everyone knows about the Good 'Ole Boy Network anyway.

Which is why I actually am very disappointed in the residents...they're biting the hand that feeds them for the two seconds of fame...I have no doubts that Wasser would have made a fine PD. I don't need to "approve" of my boss, I just need him to not actively make my life more difficult, lol. There is 1000% entitlement at play here with these psychiatry residents who think that just because they have a prestigious name, they are somehow messianic representatives in the fight against white supremacy...but really they are just tools because who is on the Board of Directors at Yale School of Medicine? Not DaQuantavious, I'll tell you that much...

If this were happening at Morehouse, Howard, Meharry, and the like, I would see how this would be a national problem...but the fact that this little blip made the news at Yale? This is a joke, a non-issue. Sensationalism. I wonder if Yale is embarrassed by this. I am embarrassed for them.

Academia does not like white men? This is laughable bro...

Why Black doctors like me are leaving faculty positions in academic medical centers

It's ironic that Black faculty members are unfairly tasked with the complex and overwhelming chore of remedying the structural outcomes of centuries of institutionalized racism in medicine that they did not create.

www.statnews.com

Understanding the Experiences of Black Women Medical Students and Residents: A Narrative Review

Few research studies examine medical students and residents with intersectional identities. In the emerging literature, data on Black women's experiences may be misrepresented and misinterpreted as studies aggregate data for women, students of color, ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Academia IS white men, and the pendulum is just now swinging in the opposite direction......
(WHITE RAGE)

Lots of other good ideas in this thread, will respond to them individually. Great discussion, imo

 

[ArdorAyurveda]

Incorrect. In their post just prior to the one that I replied to, on the same thread page, they concluded this post with:



They weren’t just advocating for ethnic representation because “…it would make a quite effective and good option.” as you stated in your reply to me. Their statements were pretty clearly saying that it is an absolute necessity. I am glad they mentioned “culture” at the end of their post there, though they don’t value culture as much as color. Their focus and advocacy is on skin color, which is clearly viewed by them as the most valuable proxy for being able to provide quality patient care to ethnic minorities and for being least likely to abuse or provide poor quality care to ethnic minorities.



This question is absurd. Of course nobody gets promoted to the highest positions if they can’t even do the bare minimum of the role they have. This just does not exist. Is the bare minimum what you want in those with the most power to do good or do harm? Is that what you want in leaders, those who are most powerful and influential in society, those who rear the next generation, create policies, act as gatekeepers—for them to meet “some minimal level of competence”?

The MOST competent and MOST qualified need to be those who are at the top of the hierarchies of the major institutions of society. When I work in an administration with a clear hierarchy, those who are above me in the hierarchy better be more competent than I am, or at the very least equally as competent—and they better be of strong character. When people hold positions of power but are not more competent than, or at least equally as competent as, those they oversee, this breeds major instability for everyone involved and those who depend on these institutions—workers will be viewed as threats and competition by the higher-ups, the workers will have contempt for the higher-ups and won’t naturally respect or admire them, and the quality of work coming out of these toxic dynamics will be poorer as a result.

Color alone, disconnected from every other aspect of the person’s life, even when they meet the “minimal level of competence” has no value in a meritocracy and the natural world as far as I am concerned. And just to be clear, a meritocracy values and rewards those with the greatest competence and the highest integrity, and those individuals who embody both should be those who occupy the highest positions. If this is not held to, then corruption blossoms and bleeds throughout the institutions and ultimately into society and culture and the family units.

If true meritocracy is not protected and upheld, and things like nepotism and identity politics are allowed to flourish from within society’s major institutions, especially from the top down as it is nowadays, then these systems will become socially unstable, the overall competence and function of the institutions will decline, and the service to society that these institutions provide will be low quality and will also cause harm to the people, especially those in society who are the most vulnerable and underserved. When society and its major institutions becomes so influenced by artificially selective pressures such as those I mentioned above, ones that deviate far from common sense, rationality, and the natural order of things, then instability and chaos are guaranteed. Fortunately, nature always self-corrects. Though, these vile human beings who are currently running the major institutions into the ground are putting up one hell of a fight, and they are willing to destroy the whole system and everyone within it, including themselves, before they could ever be brought to justice to face punishment for the cruelty and injustice they have perpetrated and the insane ideology they have promoted and indoctrinated into their true-believing lackeys and the fools of society.

While I agree with the general pathos of your statements like "The MOST competent and MOST qualified need to be those who are at the top of hierarchies of the major institutions of society..." and similar musings...this simply isn't reality.

We can all agree that certain people in positions of power did not get there based solely off of "merit". I don't need to name names -- the important thing is is that we agree on that matter.

We should live in a meritocracy, but we don't. We never have. And I don't know if we ever truly will.

We can agree that the nepotocracy that we lived in, benefitted people who look a certain way -- up until very recently when things have started to change.

But to imply that a true meritocracy is "at stake" is obfuscation from the more nefarious truth -- that the majority of people in positions of power are white, and many people (of all races) would rather see that white institutionalism maintained, rather than have it addressed, dismantled, and restructured.

In this particular case, I would argue that Wasser was qualified for his position. He had merit, based on winning that forensic psychiatry teaching award. Right?

Forensic scientists are generally whiter, less diverse than US population they serve, study says
Ethnicity, race, and forensic psychiatry: are we color-blind?

Diversity and Inclusion Within AAPL​

Addressing Systemic Bias in Violence Risk Assessment

Hey, wait a second...

 

[ArdorAyurveda]

Thank you for actually pointing this out. These are residents that have worked under this guy for years. He was the aPD, and they absolutely had experiences with him that they are likely basing their decisions on. Was it written about in the article, no probably not because it would likely only be things that are recognizable by people in the program. Instead it was written vaguely as lack of empathy or support, but we all know what that means, this guy made their lives harder in some way, but literally no one outside of the program would understand/care about the specifics of that if it was written.

To be completely honest we had a situation similar to this unfold during our training. We had repeated problems with this one resident who was a darling of the chair. He constantly sucked up to staff and leadership alike, but was a complete tool to literally any residents he worked with. It didn't stop him from getting accolades from the department, and when he put himself up to be chief and was chosen despite numerous complaints by residents, they were pissed and started actually sharing the crap he was doing. Stuff like telling us we didn't need to call him when he was senior at home call for a situation that our residency policy requires us to call the senior for, or telling us we were lazy and doing a crap job because he is double dipping working far from the hospital on moonlighting while on call and didn't want to come in when we told him he needed to. He was then pressured to "step down for my family" from the position (later found out he was cheating on his pregnant wife with a therapist in the institution). Even those complaints didn't stop him from being offered an academic faculty track fellowship and becoming faculty (again loved by the chair).

Fortunately that same guy showed his colors by literally 3 mos into his faculty position, walking off the unit at 10am leaving a brand new intern alone to cover the unit, shutting off his phone, and telling no one that he quit to go get paid more at a for-profit hospital down the street.

Similar resident outrage happened in the same program when the aPD was appointed as PD after it was clear she was very dismissive of resident concerns often minimizing them or infantilizing residents (and this was also after the program had 3-4 different PDs in a 5 yr span). Then they planned to appoint an aPD that was similar to the aforementioned faculty member (albeit a less egregious one, despite them being best friends). The department kept the PD they appointed, but fortunately proceeded to appoint people the residents actually liked as co-aPDs to appease them, which seemed to work.

Even though we're currently in pumpkin spice latte season, I can't resist some good tea. How did people find out that the guy was having an affair with another therapist at the institution? That's even better than Jerry Springer.

 

[annoyedpsychiatrist]

.

If this were happening at Morehouse, Howard, Meharry, and the like, I would see how this would be a national problem...but the fact that this little blip made the news at Yale? This is a joke, a non-issue. Sensationalism. I wonder if Yale is embarrassed by this. I am embarrassed for them.

yes that is a fair point. This poorly written article has sparked a lot of debate when the reality is its essentially just young people whining about their boss, which tends to happen in most regular jobs out there. I mean at the end of the day they're studying psychiatry at yale university. I think theyll survive.

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

What sort of environment were you in? If you chose to attend residency in an urban, cosmopolitan location, perhaps you may have expected such a response from your colleagues. Not saying it's necessarily, fair, but you gotta know if your environment is hostile to your belief system. No institution is hiding the fact that DEI is name of the game these days...

And not that I would expect a white male to know this, but this sort of "othering" that you just recently have come to discern is what we minorities have had to deal with here in the US since its inception, and we continue to deal with it to this day through microaggressions, not only from our co-residents, program directors, and allied health nursing staff, but even from our patients. Yes, it is that pervasive. I know it's hard to fathom as someone who did not grow up experiencing it, but take a moment to listen to the experiences of your non-majority acquaintances.

I understand that has a hetero-cisgender white Male, it is hard for you to not be in the majority, to not be in power for once, even if it is only temporarily like when your homosexual, transgender colleagues are venting about their experiences in a safe environment (at work)...but demographics and culture are changing my friend...adapt and survive, or go and start your White Men in Psychiatry Support Group. I'm sure you will have plenty of members.

You said white males were never given a chance to be PD at your instutition...I can't tell you how many times my black male colleagues with "black" names such as DaQuan, Santavious, and Douane are never given a chance...at least the white males got an interview...to me, it's a good thing that women of color are being seriously considered for PD positions. On a larger scale, we need more of them. Especially American Indian/Native American women.

But hey, you even said that you gave up your vote for your fellow white male because it was pointless...so if you already knew the outcome, what made you choose this particular program? Why didn't you vote with your feet and transfer to a residency program in rural West Virginia? Plenty of white men in Appalachia that would agree with your stance.

Now having addressed the WHITE RAGE...I actually 100% agree with you that it's messed up that you were labeled as transphobic, misogynist, etc. for your stance on healthy father figures being important. As a cis-hetero black man, there is no one who is more invested more in having black fathers present in black homes. The black community has been torn asunder by the matriarchy. I stand by that 1000%

Let me reiterate before you write me off (which I would understand, given that I called out your White Rage earlier, but I would hazard that someone who writes aplenty probably reads aplenty as well). I agree with the notion having a healthy father figures is important for a child's development...but I fail to see what this has to do with you being white. It is a shame that your colleagues were so hyper-sensitive and irrational that they chose to lambast you for your benign belief. This is a problem among the radical and liberal left, and it is most certainly beginning to invade the consciousness of more moderate liberals, thanks in large part to the mainstream media. I agree that this ideological psyops issue, but I also want to keep my job, and I don't have a need to be right all the time at work, so I just keep my mouth shut and let my actions in my personal life do the talking.

Additionally, the majority of people are sheep and do not think for themselves -- the fact that most people fall into line with the predominant ideas that are spouted by the media, well to me that is a sign that they are of lesser intelligence, and thus I don't really need to worry about them. In other terms, I am not concerned with sheeple.

As for the elite institutions and their obsession with woke-ism...I attended one, and I truly believe that wokeness is a luxury belief...I personally know several of the psychiatry residents at a different Ivy League. Personally as in, I went to undergrad with them, attended the same parties, lived in the same dorms, went to the same entertainment venues, I have their phone numbers...it's all for show. They want power and attention and want to be seen as edgy by appearing woke. And some of them are actually just cultural Marxists and believe the Black Lives Matters is a legitimate coalition...lol, but that is delusion that I don't care to erase at the moment. I'll save that for another time...

At the end of the day, these elite institutions were built by white people for white people...and the minorities that end up going there, we for the most part end up clamoring for the same white collar jobs in the same urban metros as other rich (and mostly white) people. Once you get high up enough, you realize it's all just about $$$ and power...how many of these "elite" psychiatry residents from prestigious institutions end up practicing in inner-city Detroit, Oakland, Atlanta, or for the Indian Health Services? End up practicing in food deserts like in New Orleans and in Mississippi where the poorest and least privileged reside? Not many...myself included, I'm not tryna do all that.

Very few, usually only the ones that grew up in these kinds of places...so yes, currently some white candidates are getting overlooked, getting the short end of the stick. Y'all gone be alright, everyone knows about the Good 'Ole Boy Network anyway.

Which is why I actually am very disappointed in the residents...they're biting the hand that feeds them for the two seconds of fame...I have no doubts that Wasser would have made a fine PD. I don't need to "approve" of my boss, I just need him to not actively make my life more difficult, lol. There is 1000% entitlement at play here with these psychiatry residents who think that just because they have a prestigious name, they are somehow messianic representatives in the fight against white supremacy...but really they are just tools because who is on the Board of Directors at Yale School of Medicine? Not DaQuantavious, I'll tell you that much...

If this were happening at Morehouse, Howard, Meharry, and the like, I would see how this would be a national problem...but the fact that this little blip made the news at Yale? This is a joke, a non-issue. Sensationalism. I wonder if Yale is embarrassed by this. I am embarrassed for them.

Academia does not like white men? This is laughable bro...

Why Black doctors like me are leaving faculty positions in academic medical centers

It's ironic that Black faculty members are unfairly tasked with the complex and overwhelming chore of remedying the structural outcomes of centuries of institutionalized racism in medicine that they did not create.

www.statnews.com

Understanding the Experiences of Black Women Medical Students and Residents: A Narrative Review

Few research studies examine medical students and residents with intersectional identities. In the emerging literature, data on Black women's experiences may be misrepresented and misinterpreted as studies aggregate data for women, students of color, ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Academia IS white men, and the pendulum is just now swinging in the opposite direction......
(WHITE RAGE)

Lots of other good ideas in this thread, will respond to them individually. Great discussion, imo

Rage? I didn't hear any rage at all expressed in the original post. Oh well, I guess it's a subjective difference of opinion.

 

[FlowRate]

On topic of DEI / AA stuff. It bothers me when folks look at minority peers thinking they were some Affirmative Action candidate that did not have "merit." I can clearly say that 1) I was a strong resident candidate with top scores and top grades, 2) I had steller recommendations, research, activities, etc, 3) in my very strong residency program, I am again a very strong resident compared to peers in both qualitative (summative/formative), and quantitative ways (i.e. prite).

In addition, being at a top institution, I can clearly say some faculty members, many who are minorities, hold endowed professorships, run their labs, have tons of grants, etc etc are all well qualified for the position they have. What is hard for some non-minority people to fathom is that a lot of times minorities are simply better than you. Bigger, faster, stronger... People that are superior come in all shapes, sizes, and colors. Sometimes majority groups have a hard time accepting that they are in fact not chosen because they are the inferior candidate.

Sucks to suck. Winners arent complaining.

Somewhat interesting related opinion piece in NYT yesterday.

There are challenges with affirmative action relating to differences in expectations from others. Ultimately, everyone wants to feel that they earned their position and that others respect them for their qualifications and personal attributes.

 

[mistafab]

Somewhat interesting related opinion piece in NYT yesterday.

There are challenges with affirmative action relating to differences in expectations from others. Ultimately, everyone wants to feel that they earned their position and that others respect them for their qualifications and personal attributes.

I cant read it behind the paywall. Any further TLDR version?

 

[G Sheb]

People can criticize the residents, but the administration clearly messed up as well.
They decided to "stick it to them", ignore their perspective after they were initially included, refused to compromise or budge.
This is the correct decision. You will not have a good residency program if the residents are not on board, and the administration is not willing to hear their almost unanimous disapproval. Yale residents are Yale residents because they are not there to coast through residency.

Interesting to see the reaction here after the power play took a different turn. Many did not have a problem with abuse of authority, vilifying and throwing an intern under the bus for their political gratification.

 

[G Sheb]

Yeah this just made things infinitely worse. And Dr. Wasser's is not a career that deserves to be ruined.

Please. What a bunch of melodramatic bs. His career is not ruined. Not everyone needs to be a PD.
Most would run away from that position anyhow.

 

[creoque]

Please. What a bunch of melodramatic bs. His career is not ruined. Not everyone needs to be a PD.
Most would run away from that position anyhow.

Oh Please. Maybe others want to run away, but the man wanted to be PD. And it is an important next step if you want to rise up in Academia. To state that this doesn't affect his career is gaslighting.

 

[G Sheb]

Oh Please. Maybe others want to run away, but the man wanted to be PD. And it is an important next step if you want to rise up in Academia. To state that this doesn't affect his career is gaslighting.

You can have a great career in academia without being a PD (at Yale, at that).
Either he gets exactly what he wants or his career is ruined?
Talk about entitlement.

 

[creoque]

You can have a great career in academia without being a PD (at Yale, at that).
Either he gets exactly what he wants or his career is ruined?
Talk about entitlement.

It is not just about that. It is also about the news article with his name planted all over it.

 

[G Sheb]

It is not just about that. It is also about the news article with his name planted all over it.

Anyone who reads that article and decides to come to firm conclusions either on the residents or on Dr. Wasser should not be in a hiring position.

 

[hallowmann]

Even though we're currently in pumpkin spice latte season, I can't resist some good tea. How did people find out that the guy was having an affair with another therapist at the institution? That's even better than Jerry Springer.

People who were friends with him knew, and she ended up getting pregnant leading to the divorce...

 

[Stagg737]

People who were friends with him knew, and she ended up getting pregnant leading to the divorce...

Wait, he got the therapist pregnant when his wife was already pregnant? I think we've strayed from Jerry Springer and are entering Maury territory...

 

[Fan_of_Meehl]

Gender identity is not a social construct, it is a personal construct, gender roles and expectations based on that are social constructs. I identify as a male and that is my personal identity. In my case that is consistent with my biological sex and I have never been misgendered. For many of my patients that is not the case. Unfortunately, the virulent advocates that I have encountered are not typically among this group where there is a discrepancy between their identity or their biological sex or where there is a certain amount of ambiguity to their presentation such that they are misgendered. What I have actually seen is that they seem to be mostly heterosexuals that sometimes call themselves bi because they fooled around once or twice with the opposite gender and then puff themselves up as some kind of oppressed LGBTX person. A lot of it is a load of crap and it doesn’t help my patients that have legitimate concerns with gender identity and how to navigate the world in any way shape or form and often makes it worse when they stoke their already real fear of persecution for being different. I really wish these people would stop using my patients struggle to feel better about themselves.

By the way, I always try to validate peoples identity with name or pronouns. The part I think is stupid is when the majority who are not misgendered start giving our pronouns because it just seems kind of silly.

edit - apologize for the runon sentences. Friday night rant. lol

All I know is that if we had any other client who INSISTED that other people change their verbal behavior to suit their preferences, we'd engage that client in a therapeutic process to help them consider what changes (if any) they (the client) might wish to make in their thoughts/beliefs or their behaviors to address the problem in therapy. We wouldn't take the perspective of seeing it as our (or our client's) role in therapy to bemoan the state of the world or focus on changing the world vs. helping the client change. As psychotherapists, it's not our job to change the world. It's our job to develop professional working relationships with clients to help them explore if and how they may be able to make any changes in themselves in terms of their beliefs or behaviors to address their symptoms, to improve their functioning, to meet their goals, and/or help them maximize their adjustment to their life circumstances. Having it as your goal to insist or force other people to utter things the way you want them uttered is going be--generally speaking--a losing proposition. Of course, you may want to be assertive by clearly and respectfully articulating your needs, opinions, and boundaries (just like with any other conflict scenario) but--in the end--you cannot FORCE other people to change their minds or their tone of voice or their opinions. You can only invite them to the table to try to resolve the conflict amicably and in a way that maintains respect for all parties involved. In any conflict resolution scenario, you have to have a willing partner and trying to force or compel behavior by threatening punishment or insulting or attacking people will rarely yield positive long-term results.

 

[doctalaughs]

People can criticize the residents, but the administration clearly messed up as well.
They decided to "stick it to them", ignore their perspective after they were initially included, refused to compromise or budge.
This is the correct decision. You will not have a good residency program if the residents are not on board, and the administration is not willing to hear their almost unanimous disapproval. Yale residents are Yale residents because they are not there to coast through residency.

Interesting to see the reaction here after the power play took a different turn. Many did not have a problem with abuse of authority, vilifying and throwing an intern under the bus for their political gratification.

Lol, “abuse of authority” is the chair appointing a PD of his own choice after he tried to appoint the residents first choice but didn’t work out? Ooook. Sounds like he’s a brutal leader.

In any case, do you think there is even a 1% chance the next pick will be a white male? Might as well have it in the job description “white people need not apply” although I guess that would be technically illegal if the quiet part was written down. I’d say zero chance.

 

[G Sheb]

Lol, “abuse of authority” is the chair appointing a PD of his own choice after he tried to appoint the residents first choice but didn’t work out? Ooook. Sounds like he’s a brutal leader.

In any case, do you think there is even a 1% chance the next pick will be a white male? I’d say zero chance.

Umm, "abuse of authority" was not referring at all to the chair.

 

[doctalaughs]

Umm, "abuse of authority" was not referring at all to the chair.

So what was it referring to? Certainly not anonymous posts on a random Internet forum which have zero influence?

 

[G Sheb]

So what was it referring to? Certainly not anonymous posts on a random Internet forum which have zero influence?

Oh absolutely.
Luckily (hopefully) many here don't have the power to implement what they intend to do or how they are willing to use their power, which is all that matters.
Sometimes anonymity can be a lot more revealing.

 

[doctalaughs]

Oh absolutely.
Luckily (hopefully) many here don't have the power to implement what they intend to do or how they are willing to use their power, which is all that matters.
Sometimes anonymity can be a lot more revealing.

Ok - so I’m a founding/senior partner in a private practice with about 20 docs, 10 pas and 50 or so ancillary staff. If a new employee complained to the media about who I appointed to run one of the local clinics we have, they would be fired before the end of the business day, no questions asked. Doesn’t matter if others might agree with that employee. Unless they presented evidence the lead I appointed was a criminal or something.

In my opinion that is not an abuse of power in any way. It’s protecting the interests/brand of the business; I’d be a bad leader and failing all my other partners and employees if I did any different.

Only caveat, as stated prior - we don’t know any background here. Maybe the PD voluntarily resigned and the intern was disciplined appropriately- but otherwise I would call this reversal from the chair a sign of a weak leader (or more likely afraid of further bad press laced with DEI insinuations).

 

[erg923]

What sort of environment were you in? If you chose to attend residency in an urban, cosmopolitan location, perhaps you may have expected such a response from your colleagues. Not saying it's necessarily, fair, but you gotta know if your environment is hostile to your belief system. No institution is hiding the fact that DEI is name of the game these days...

And not that I would expect a white male to know this, but this sort of "othering" that you just recently have come to discern is what we minorities have had to deal with here in the US since its inception, and we continue to deal with it to this day through microaggressions, not only from our co-residents, program directors, and allied health nursing staff, but even from our patients. Yes, it is that pervasive. I know it's hard to fathom as someone who did not grow up experiencing it, but take a moment to listen to the experiences of your non-majority acquaintances.

I understand that has a hetero-cisgender white Male, it is hard for you to not be in the majority, to not be in power for once, even if it is only temporarily like when your homosexual, transgender colleagues are venting about their experiences in a safe environment (at work)...but demographics and culture are changing my friend...adapt and survive, or go and start your White Men in Psychiatry Support Group. I'm sure you will have plenty of members.

You said white males were never given a chance to be PD at your instutition...I can't tell you how many times my black male colleagues with "black" names such as DaQuan, Santavious, and Douane are never given a chance...at least the white males got an interview...to me, it's a good thing that women of color are being seriously considered for PD positions. On a larger scale, we need more of them. Especially American Indian/Native American women.

But hey, you even said that you gave up your vote for your fellow white male because it was pointless...so if you already knew the outcome, what made you choose this particular program? Why didn't you vote with your feet and transfer to a residency program in rural West Virginia? Plenty of white men in Appalachia that would agree with your stance.

Now having addressed the WHITE RAGE...I actually 100% agree with you that it's messed up that you were labeled as transphobic, misogynist, etc. for your stance on healthy father figures being important. As a cis-hetero black man, there is no one who is more invested more in having black fathers present in black homes. The black community has been torn asunder by the matriarchy. I stand by that 1000%

Let me reiterate before you write me off (which I would understand, given that I called out your White Rage earlier, but I would hazard that someone who writes aplenty probably reads aplenty as well). I agree with the notion having a healthy father figures is important for a child's development...but I fail to see what this has to do with you being white. It is a shame that your colleagues were so hyper-sensitive and irrational that they chose to lambast you for your benign belief. This is a problem among the radical and liberal left, and it is most certainly beginning to invade the consciousness of more moderate liberals, thanks in large part to the mainstream media. I agree that this ideological psyops issue, but I also want to keep my job, and I don't have a need to be right all the time at work, so I just keep my mouth shut and let my actions in my personal life do the talking.

Additionally, the majority of people are sheep and do not think for themselves -- the fact that most people fall into line with the predominant ideas that are spouted by the media, well to me that is a sign that they are of lesser intelligence, and thus I don't really need to worry about them. In other terms, I am not concerned with sheeple.

As for the elite institutions and their obsession with woke-ism...I attended one, and I truly believe that wokeness is a luxury belief...I personally know several of the psychiatry residents at a different Ivy League. Personally as in, I went to undergrad with them, attended the same parties, lived in the same dorms, went to the same entertainment venues, I have their phone numbers...it's all for show. They want power and attention and want to be seen as edgy by appearing woke. And some of them are actually just cultural Marxists and believe the Black Lives Matters is a legitimate coalition...lol, but that is delusion that I don't care to erase at the moment. I'll save that for another time...

At the end of the day, these elite institutions were built by white people for white people...and the minorities that end up going there, we for the most part end up clamoring for the same white collar jobs in the same urban metros as other rich (and mostly white) people. Once you get high up enough, you realize it's all just about $$$ and power...how many of these "elite" psychiatry residents from prestigious institutions end up practicing in inner-city Detroit, Oakland, Atlanta, or for the Indian Health Services? End up practicing in food deserts like in New Orleans and in Mississippi where the poorest and least privileged reside? Not many...myself included, I'm not tryna do all that.

Very few, usually only the ones that grew up in these kinds of places...so yes, currently some white candidates are getting overlooked, getting the short end of the stick. Y'all gone be alright, everyone knows about the Good 'Ole Boy Network anyway.

Which is why I actually am very disappointed in the residents...they're biting the hand that feeds them for the two seconds of fame...I have no doubts that Wasser would have made a fine PD. I don't need to "approve" of my boss, I just need him to not actively make my life more difficult, lol. There is 1000% entitlement at play here with these psychiatry residents who think that just because they have a prestigious name, they are somehow messianic representatives in the fight against white supremacy...but really they are just tools because who is on the Board of Directors at Yale School of Medicine? Not DaQuantavious, I'll tell you that much...

If this were happening at Morehouse, Howard, Meharry, and the like, I would see how this would be a national problem...but the fact that this little blip made the news at Yale? This is a joke, a non-issue. Sensationalism. I wonder if Yale is embarrassed by this. I am embarrassed for them.

Academia does not like white men? This is laughable bro...

Why Black doctors like me are leaving faculty positions in academic medical centers

It's ironic that Black faculty members are unfairly tasked with the complex and overwhelming chore of remedying the structural outcomes of centuries of institutionalized racism in medicine that they did not create.

www.statnews.com

Understanding the Experiences of Black Women Medical Students and Residents: A Narrative Review

Few research studies examine medical students and residents with intersectional identities. In the emerging literature, data on Black women's experiences may be misrepresented and misinterpreted as studies aggregate data for women, students of color, ...

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

Academia IS white men, and the pendulum is just now swinging in the opposite direction......
(WHITE RAGE)

Lots of other good ideas in this thread, will respond to them individually. Great discussion, imo

How is labeling the experience of this poster, especially based on what was actually written by this poster... "White Rage?" It's just disagreement. No? He/she can be upset by that. I think that's ok. I thought we were actually supposed to be "upset" by experiences we deem are based on race factors alone? I mean, isn't that the whole thing here? And, are we not in the business of affirming an individual's emotional experiences anymore? Even if we then help to guide a "corrective emotional experience" for them? Again, not saying there is not some exaggeration of fact/speculation in the poster's testimony here.... but come on.

And how in the hell is where a residency program located relevant? Its not like I can justify telling you: Well, you chose to go to a residency in Birmingham, Alabama (or pretty much anywhere south of the Mason-Dixon Line), thus "perhaps you may have expected such a response from your colleagues." Are you kidding me!? Get real!

And isn't part of the objection here that people can't disagree without being called or labeled something that is ridiculously over the top/strawman like? "White Rage? Does it help the conversation if I call you an "angry black?" No. Not helpful to this conversation. Not at all.

 

[docksan]

That post was amazing to read from start to finish and all sorts of disorienting at the same time.

 

[G Sheb]

Ok - so I’m a founding/senior partner in a private practice with about 20 docs, 10 pas and 50 or so ancillary staff. If a new employee complained to the media about who I appointed to run one of the local clinics we have, they would be fired before the end of the business day, no questions asked. Doesn’t matter if others might agree with that employee. Unless they presented evidence the lead I appointed was a criminal or something.

In my opinion that is not an abuse of power in any way. It’s protecting the interests/brand of the business; I’d be a bad leader and failing all my other partners and employees if I did any different.

Only caveat, as stated prior - we don’t know any background here. Maybe the PD voluntarily resigned and the intern was disciplined appropriately- but otherwise I would call this reversal from the chair a sign of a weak leader (or more likely afraid of further bad press laced with DEI insinuations).

So you're comparing your 20 physician private practice to a residency program?
I think this is off for so many reasons. But okay.

 

[untapped]

Part of white privilege is having your opinions be supported by a large share of the population, even in online forums. This also gaslights some minorities into devaluing their own lived experiences.

It's absurd to think that white men are not overrepresented in leadership and privileged positions whether in academia, business, politics, etc. It's like asking a fish if it's wet.

 

[tombreaz]

Part of white privilege is having your opinions be supported by a large share of the population, even in online forums. This also gaslights some minorities into devaluing their own lived experiences.

It's absurd to think that white men are not overrepresented in leadership and privileged positions whether in academia, business, politics, etc. It's like asking a fish if it's wet.

Wait, so if you're in the Congo is there black privilege?