X vs. Y, where to interview?

[Cobalt-60]

ok, if you had to choose between two places to interview at (and give up your interview slot at the other place), where would you choose to interview?

U Chicago vs. UPenn?

and why?

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[Gfunk6]

Really it depends on too many factors, many of them personal. Personally, I believe Penn has a stronger department overall but if you are diehard into bench work then U Chicago may be a better choice.

IMO Chicago >> Philadelphia in terms of livability.

I guess it depends what kind of career you envision for yourself and what part of the country you would eventually like to settle in. Ultimately, you can't really go wrong as both are fine programs.

 

[napoleondynamite]

Hey Cobalt..can I solve your dilemma and take one of those off your hands?

 

[deleted4401]

Both are top programs. I'd say you go for whatever city you like better. I rotated through UChicago. It's a high-powered place, brilliant attendings and residents. Not super busy, but there is a different focus. Not only do you have a year of basic science research, but you get a day a week, as well.

-S

 

[stephew]

Both are top programs. I'd say you go for whatever city you like better. I rotated through UChicago. It's a high-powered place, brilliant attendings and residents. Not super busy, but there is a different focus. Not only do you have a year of basic science research, but you get a day a week, as well.

-S

oooo well, erm, be careful about that. I wouldnt choose merely based on the city you like better; the first responder had it best- they are both good programs and there are way too many personal variables; yes city is one of them (and some btw like philly better)- but also issues like teaching style, clinical responsibilites, relationship with the attendings etc.

 

[Cobalt-60]

so which would you choose, Steph?

also, i've heard rumors, is UChicago in the 'not nice part' of town?

 

[stephew]

again- i can't direct someone to that. the bad part of town is neither here nor there in the equasion or pretty low odwn.

 

[radonc]

u chicago is in hyde park, which isnt the nicest part of chitown...but upenn is in west phili, which isnt the greatest area too. you may not live around where you work, there are much better areas to live in both cities, or alternatively, you could live in the 'burbs.

 

[deleted4401]

I don't know, Steph. As far as teaching style, relationship with attendings, and clinical responsbilities ... I'm not sure how you can attempt to figure this out without interviewing there (or by rotating through), so I'm not sure how that can help you figure out which program to interview at, b/c ... you haven't interviewed yet. I might be missing something ... As far as decision-making prior to interviewing between top programs, it's nearly impossible to figure out those above factors, except from hearsay (i.e. Wash U is malignant, Chicago is too academic, Sloan-Kettering is a sweatshop).

Pick your X-factor (mine is location; yours might be the % of graduates that choose academic positions or it may be that some place has hotter therapists or something else), and then let that aid you in figuring out which interviews to go to and which ones to cancel.

Finally, for the average candidate, it has to be undertood that the difference between UChicago and Penn is somewhat inconsequential compared to the difference between either of those and my program (Pitt) or another mid/lower tier program. (i.e. if I was ranking between MDA and Rush, even though I hate Houston and love Chicago, I'd choose MDA). But, I cannot, for the life of me, figure out how I would choose between UChicago and Penn without interviewing/rotating at either. And, so to answer the OP's question about, I'd ask Steph and a few other people, I'd ignore their advice, and interview in Chicago because I think it's a better city

Later, skater
-S

 

[bobloblaw]

I don't know if this factors into the equation, but U Penn announced at ASTRO that they have signed a contract with IBA to build a new proton facility. So , if particle therapy is of interest to you, U Penn may be the way to go. Odds are it wouldn't be ready by the time this year's applicants start residency, but it would probably be up and running sometime during their residency. It's kind of ironic, because U Penn has been criticized in the past (by some, at least) for being slower to adopt newer technologies.

It seems like more and more departments are interested in protons these days. Realistically, though, the majority of practicing radiation oncologists do not have access to particle therapy and therefore it is unlikely to be a central component of your long-term career.

Reputation-wise, both institutions are excellent.

All that being said, I agree with SimulD. Chicago (the city) rocks.

 

[Cobalt-60]

how about:

U Virginia vs. U Wisconsin?

(and again, reasons why)

 

[XRTmonster]

Well, who has more positions available in the match?

I believe wisconsin only has one spot open for US seniors. The other spot starts in 2007. While I'd love to interview at wisconsin I couldn't due to scheduling conflicts. The fact they only have one spot open cushioned the blow of having to turn down an interview. I don't know what UVA has. Look into it.

 

[radiodog]

Wisconsin has two spots, one 5 year, one 4 year.

 

[CNphair]

how about:

U Virginia vs. U Wisconsin?

(and again, reasons why)

I have to vote Wisconsin on this one. Having interviewed there, I can tell you it really is a top notch program. And the residents seemed very happy. Only downside in my book was location - winter sucks. But the city of Madison itself seemed quite charming.

 

[deleted4401]

From what everyone says, UWisc is one of the top programs in the country.

As far as technology, now that I'm at a high-tech place, I'm realizing that it doesn't matter a whole lot. It's great to have nice toys, but we all have to learn the basics, and as long as you have some exposure to 3D planning, you should be able to manage. And, with the new toys, to repeat an oft-used phrase: "When you have a hammer, everything looks like a nail".

-S

 

[ronmexico]

i talked to a 3rd year resident whose not at penn a couple of weeks ago. he said that they were talking about the proton facility back when he interviewed. personally, it would not factor into my decision. I honestly cannot see it having any affect on your training. if it takes 4 years to announce a deal, how long does it take to make it operational?

 

[stephew]

one should NOT base their decision based on if the facility has protons or really any one given technology; not having the basics is bad (IMRT comes into the basics nowadays) but boutique stuff is ncie and fun; but it doesnt not a residency choice make. it is the shiny penny equlivient of radonc.

remember, learn basic radonc. when you practice it will take you 20 mins (ok just a wee bit longer) to learn how to use the boutique stuff.

 

[Dave Evans]

I had to turn down U Chicago because both interview dates conflict with UCSF and Stanford. . . It's insane how few choices for interview dates these places have. . . but I freed up a spot!

 

[Doctor&Geek]

I had to turn down U Chicago because both interview dates conflict with UCSF and Stanford. . . It's insane how few choices for interview dates these places have. . . but I freed up a spot!

Chicago on the same dates as UCSF and Stanford - that's real bad.

 

[Dave Evans]

Chicago on the same dates as UCSF and Stanford - that's real bad.

Yeah, it's totally unfair. It's absolutely insane that these programs can give such short notice on top of a total lack of choices (I've been invited to 5 programs now that haven't given any choice of date).

 

[Doctor&Geek]

I'm just lamenting the fact that those programs are some of the few radonc programs that would support resident research (and I'm not talking about 4 month projects here, for the uninformed).

 

[Dave Evans]

I'm just lamenting the fact that those programs are some of the few radonc programs that would support resident research (and I'm not talking about 4 month projects here, for the uninformed).

Agreed. It's brutal. I WISH I could've interviewed there - i'm still upset about it. . . and totally annoyed at the insane scheduling process that gives many applicants 1 choice of date.

 

[RLMD]

Ok, why is it that all of these programs have interviews on friday? What is so special about friday? Ive been lucky so far, but I have a feeling that soon I will have to turn down an interview because everyone wants to interview on the same 2 or 3 fridays.