How long it takes to get X

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bluebubbles

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I'm curious how many days it takes to get things done in your health system or medical community.

Placing FDG PET/CT order to getting it completed
Placing diagnostic MRI order to getting it completed, like a pelvis MRI for rectal cancer staging
Placing volumetric MRI order to getting it completed, like a brain MRI for SRS planning
Placing IR biopsy order (or referral to IR) to getting tissue
Sending out surgical path to getting second opinion, like IHC or FISH for sarcoma, and visual diagnosis (not NGS)

I am in a smaller city. Several dozen radiologists are around. It seems like workup is taking longer than usual. Or our diagnostician colleagues are just busier than we are.

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Same… weeks out for everything especially MRI’s. It’s possible to get a biopsy done sooner but that can still take 1-2 weeks on average if I don’t push for it. Planning MRI’s can take 2-3 weeks and PET’s vary but at least 2 weeks.

Path I’ve seen take almost a month to come back if sent out.
 
Used to be within a week for everything. Then the very large radiology group in town was bought by PE. 2-3 weeks now. Yaaaaaaaay.
 
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I'm curious how many days it takes to get things done in your health system or medical community.

Placing FDG PET/CT order to getting it completed
Placing diagnostic MRI order to getting it completed, like a pelvis MRI for rectal cancer staging
Placing volumetric MRI order to getting it completed, like a brain MRI for SRS planning
Placing IR biopsy order (or referral to IR) to getting tissue
Sending out surgical path to getting second opinion, like IHC or FISH for sarcoma, and visual diagnosis (not NGS)

I am in a smaller city. Several dozen radiologists are around. It seems like workup is taking longer than usual. Or our diagnostician colleagues are just busier than we are.
In regards to your last sentence
Probably not your radiology colleagues are too busy. Much more likely that there is not enough staff. Ct and mri techs, even schedulers are in short supply
 
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The concept of "rural" and "isolated" means very different things depending on where in the country you are, so I'll preface my answer saying that I staff a rural hospital but in the population-dense region of the Census-designated northeast.

I just want to be clear that my version of "rural" can't compete with Nebraska's version of "rural".

But I mention this because I've integrated myself "into" the hospital more than is normally possible, and there are significantly fewer variables to consider, because of the small/rural size. Basically, I control a lot more and have access to a lot more information than I would otherwise.

Yes, we have absolutely been struggling for the past few months. We would estimate starting in December 2022 is when we really noticed the uptick.

It's not the Radiologists, as others have said, though their workloads are higher than years past.

1) Equipment. This is more specific to my hospital but I know I'm not alone. For a certain type of diagnostic scan, there wasn't an investment made in the machines, so the equipment availability is a constraint.

2) The Boomers, aka "Silver Tsunami". The next decade is the final, huge push of the increase in the 65+ crowd. Unfortunately, it's a "one two punch". I've noticed a huge amount of Boomer staff retiring (which has been a trend for years, of course). So you have senior staff, with a ton of institutional knowledge (even if they're "bad" at their job) leaving, not being replaced, and then becoming patients themselves. In terms of cancer incidence alone, I've seen projected increases of 9-12% over the next 5 years.

3) Along the "retiring" line - staffing. The pandemic drove people out of their existing jobs in healthcare. Some people left entirely. But - and this is what we saw a lot in RadOnc - people realized the abuse they were taking. LOOKING AT YOU, CERTAIN WELL-KNOWN ACADEMIC INSTITUTIONS. On the doctor side, we've seen a lot of job hopping. But on the allied health/support staff side, you saw not only job hopping but also the rise of travel agencies. There's just so much human psychology to unpack here, but basically, there are huge staffing issues and workflow disruptions.

4) Pent-up pandemic demand. As the masking mandates end, the PHE declared over, people who were putting things off are finally coming in. It's not the disaster influx we worried about, but it's putting more stress on the system.

5) Economics. We've had to spend a ton on travel agencies. We've "lost" a lot of money on investments. We've also lost a lot on the operational side. You could get a PhD in healthcare economics of course, and what's going on, but the take home is the vast majority of hospitals posted losses. This is making them fearful and/or unable to invest in solutions to help what we're seeing.

For months now, this has consumed my personal and professional life. Given the size, scope, and nature of the "causes" of these observed "effects" - it's going to get worse before it gets better. At my hospital, we have energetic admin/leadership that actually understand the issues and have more strategic vision than most. Even here, even trying to actively address these issues with unusually smart people - it will likely take us another 2 or 3 years to "fix" this.

In summary: you're not alone. Buckle up.
 
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Placing FDG PET/CT order to getting it completed
Within a week, sometimes within a couple of days
Placing diagnostic MRI order to getting it completed, like a pelvis MRI for rectal cancer staging
Depends on region of the body. Pelvis slots are more available than abdomen slots. Don't ask me why. May take up to two weeks. If it takes too long, I refer to outside of our hospital system and generally get an appointment within a week.
Placing volumetric MRI order to getting it completed, like a brain MRI for SRS planning
Within a week, usually.
Placing IR biopsy order (or referral to IR) to getting tissue
Depends on location (again) and imaging (US vs. CT guided). Can take up to two weeks.
Sending out surgical path to getting second opinion, like IHC or FISH for sarcoma, and visual diagnosis (not NGS)
Never done that, our pathology department is excellent.
 
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I'm curious how many days it takes to get things done in your health system or medical community.

Placing FDG PET/CT order to getting it completed
Placing diagnostic MRI order to getting it completed, like a pelvis MRI for rectal cancer staging
Placing volumetric MRI order to getting it completed, like a brain MRI for SRS planning
Placing IR biopsy order (or referral to IR) to getting tissue
Sending out surgical path to getting second opinion, like IHC or FISH for sarcoma, and visual diagnosis (not NGS)

I am in a smaller city. Several dozen radiologists are around. It seems like workup is taking longer than usual. Or our diagnostician colleagues are just busier than we are.

PET/CT is reasonable, usually 1 - 2 weeks. Often we can get them squeezed in if really needed.
MRs around 2-3 weeks for brain/rectal. Can also usually get someone in quick if in a pinch for SRS. MR head and neck takes me like 6 weeks to get. Inpatient is usually same day but last year we were waiting days for an MRI in the hospital.
IR biopsy is usually 1 - 2 weeks.
We have very good path; but send out the unusual stuff to CC and that takes 3-4 weeks.

I am in a 250K city. Biggest bottleneck for us is pulmonary or GI interventionists (EUS, bronch, fiducials). We don't have enough. I think maybe 1-2; so its taking 4-6 weeks. I'm thinking about going to the local academic center to see if I can fire up some millennials about starting their own center.
 
Used to be within a week for everything. Then the very large radiology group in town was bought by PE. 2-3 weeks now. Yaaaaaaaay.
When did they get bought? Just curious because the best part of high interest rates is going to be watching these PE firms go down in flames.

All that free money debt should need re-financing around...... now?
 
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I'm curious how many days it takes to get things done in your health system or medical community.

Placing FDG PET/CT order to getting it completed
Placing diagnostic MRI order to getting it completed, like a pelvis MRI for rectal cancer staging
Placing volumetric MRI order to getting it completed, like a brain MRI for SRS planning
Placing IR biopsy order (or referral to IR) to getting tissue
Sending out surgical path to getting second opinion, like IHC or FISH for sarcoma, and visual diagnosis (not NGS)

I am in a smaller city. Several dozen radiologists are around. It seems like workup is taking longer than usual. Or our diagnostician colleagues are just busier than we are.
I'm at a large academic center and the wait times are definitely an issue.

PET: 3-4 weeks
MRI: 4-6 weeks
Biopsy (IR or IP): <2 weeks
Path: Rarely send out, not sure

For urgent PET/MRI, I've been sending them to other institutions.
 
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I can get imaging within a week at freestanding center. Biopsy at hospital takes 1 month. PEG tube 2 weeks.
 
I'm at a large academic center and the wait times are definitely an issue.

PET: 3-4 weeks
MRI: 4-6 weeks
Biopsy (IR or IP): <2 weeks
Path: Rarely send out, not sure

For urgent PET/MRI, I've been sending them to other institutions.
This is similar to my experience. Routinely referring to local centers around me for urgent cases/new diagnoses.
 
When did they get bought? Just curious because the best part of high interest rates is going to be watching these PE firms go down in flames.

All that free money debt should need re-financing around...... now?
Last year
 
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