"What's so great about Dermatology?"

[sideways]

I think you are ignoring the reason behind it being popular. It's popular exactly because of the money and the lifestyle.

If you cut their salaries in half and they had to work 50% harder to earn the same, derm would become pm&r.

I agree with you, at least in the initial phases of determining its popularity. But now it's a self-fulfilling prophecy. Med students, by character, on average, are narcissistic head-cases that need adulation. They went into med school to get adulation from society at large. In med school, some of the super head-cases now need adulation from their peers as well. So they pursue the most competitive specialties. For no other reason than they're competitive.

This further drives up the competition of said specialties.

Typically this was reserved to specialties that had street cred. Those that your gay uncle or *****ic grandmother would understand as being prestigious...read: brain surgeon. Somewhere along the line some rogue med students starting shifting the focus of what they wanted from medicine and said to hell with public prestige, I'm going to ride the cash vs. freedom curve.

But believe me, this seeking of prestige is the prime mover nowadays. You can get plenty of money in other specialties with just as good of a lifestyle. And the fact that many specialties with absolutely atrocious lifestyles are still very competitive? Well, they want the title.


If I may quote myself, I've described my theory elsewhere:

Here's the truth: the people who get into the most competitive specialties ARE NOT the most intelligent, in my observation. They are just the most pathologically driven to get into the most competitive specialties.

Getting straight A's in med school and knocking Step 1 out of the park is all about hard work, not brains. You can't be an idiot obviously, but I find being really smart can actually be a detriment in med school given that many highly intelligent people see through the mania of compulsively hard work, say "to hell with it," and thus get lower scores.

The guy gunning for neurosurgery isn't a genius. He's a narcissistic workaholic with a little teeny one that needs to prove to the world through his occupation how great he is, in spite of the fact that he doesn't believe it himself. This low self-image is ironically the very fuel needed to get through the excessively long hours required of someone who wants to pursue neurosurgery, so it's very self-selective in that respect. In the end, the process marries psychopathology with the demands of the given specialty very nicely.

These are generalizations, obviously, but they're pretty accurate. Once you get into med school, you'll see. Oh will you see.

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[patel2]

You make good points. There are other specialties that are very competitive and afford you a good lifestyle. However, nothing in medicine hits the combo of high pay for least amount of hours worked while not having to deal with other BS like derm, and that is what draws people to it. Once again, nothing wrong with going for derm, but those who pursue it should just be honest about it and try not to BS their colleagues and make it seem like they are providing an invaluable service to society.

I think the point is that people in derm are getting singled out for this, by far more than any other group of physicians. The "I'm okay with you having financial/lifestyle motivations, but let's call a spade a spade" attitude from other physicians seems to be always directed at dermatology, but far less in other fields where the motivations of people may center around lifestyle/money.

Why is the radiologist, the ophthamologist, the anesthesiologist or the GI doc thought to have selected his field because he genuinely has a passion for what he is doing (money/lifestyle must only be a peripheral concern to them)? It's the aspiring dermatologist who is always BS'ng his colleagues about saving poor people from deadly skin conditions when really he needs to own up to his real motivations.

Why are dermatolgoists expected to own up to and defend their motivations more than other groups? People don't go around telling primary care docs to own up to the fact that they are only in the field because of poor grades/test scores (I'm not referring to all, but surely this is true of some percentage).

 

[Narmerguy]

I have no problem with them doing so, but I would appreciate less BS being served up.

I think this is a big part of the reaction people have and I pretty much agree. There's nothing wrong with being primarily focused on the money and lifestyle but there is an issue when you encounter a bunch of people that claim that it's so many other things when it's obvious that it's the money and the lifestyle.

Obviously all derms are this way. Just enough that it becomes frustrating.

 

[AlexMorph]

I think the point is that people in derm are getting singled out for this, by far more than any other group of physicians. The "I'm okay with you having financial/lifestyle motivations, but let's call a spade a spade" attitude from other physicians seems to be always directed at dermatology, but far less in other fields where the motivations of people may center around lifestyle/money.

Why is the radiologist, the ophthamologist, the anesthesiologist or the GI doc thought to have selected his field because he genuinely has a passion for what he is doing (money/lifestyle must only be a peripheral concern to them)? It's the aspiring dermatologist who is always BS'ng his colleagues about saving poor people from deadly skin conditions when really he needs to own up to his real motivations.

Why are dermatolgoists expected to own up to and defend their motivations more than other groups? People don't go around telling primary care docs to own up to the fact that they are only in the field because of poor grades/test scores (I'm not referring to all, but surely this is true of some percentage).

All the ROAD specialties are guilty of this. Although, anesthesiology is becoming less and less so. But that's a whole another story...

My point is, the derm folk are the most guilty of prioritizing lifestyle above all else. No other specialty affords the money-to-work ratio that derm does.

 

[lrkoehle]

I think this is a big part of the reaction people have and I pretty much agree. There's nothing wrong with being primarily focused on the money and lifestyle but there is an issue when you encounter a bunch of people that claim that it's so many other things when it's obvious that it's the money and the lifestyle.

Part of the problem is that we're conditioned to act like those things don't matter. You'd never get into medical school if you answered the question "why medicine?" with "well, I want a steady career, that's intellectually stimulating, with good pay, and reasonable hours." Then once we're in school, we can't really say those things because our classmates will judge us negatively. Then come residency interviews, and I can't imagine that going over very well with PD's. So derm people just keep BSing...

For the record, I despise derm and I'd drop out of school if I had to do it for a living...seriously, I'd rather live in a box on the street.

 

[patel2]

All the ROAD specialties are guilty of this. Although, anesthesiology is becoming less and less so. But that's a whole another story...

My point is, the derm folk are the most guilty of prioritizing lifestyle above all else. No other specialty affords the money-to-work ratio that derm does.

But one could just as easily make the case that there are as many PCPs that are guilty of choosing the field only by virtue of mediocre test scores/evaluations, as there are people in ROAD specialties guilty of prioritizing lifestyle above all else.

These people don't ever get called out on their BS for why they chose the field, but the ROAD folks always get judged...seems like a double standard.

 

[farrago]

You make good points. There are other specialties that are very competitive and afford you a good lifestyle. However, nothing in medicine hits the combo of high pay for least amount of hours worked while not having to deal with other BS like derm, and that is what draws people to it. Once again, nothing wrong with going for derm, but those who pursue it should just be honest about it and try not to BS their colleagues and make it seem like they are providing an invaluable service to society.

Dude, WTF? Many people with severe skin disorders would beg to differ. And even acne, something that's made light off here all the time, can be incredibly psychologically traumatizing and physically disfiguring. I'm sure there are a lot of people out there who have suicidal thoughts because of their skin disorders.

 

[lrkoehle]

But one could just as easily make the case that there are as many PCPs that are guilty of choosing the field only by virtue of mediocre test scores/evaluations, as there are people in ROAD specialties guilty of prioritizing lifestyle above all else.

These people don't ever get called out on their BS for why they chose the field.

Plus, there are people in FM who choose it because they don't want the difficult residency of surgery or something else. Let's not act like that's not a lifestyle choice.

 

[muhali3]

also where kramer acts as dr. vanostram and inspects the mole on kruger's back...all because he has a long white coat from a butcher/meat shop thanks to his newfound love for the meat slicer. incredible episode. god i love that show.

I intend to use this format for all mty SOAPs:
"male mammal...approximately 30-60 years of age. Weight?...oh, indeterminant."

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5JGkMB2gFC0

haha Julliard-trained dermatologist.

 

[Slack3r]

Here's the truth: the people who get into the most competitive specialties ARE NOT the most intelligent, in my observation. They are just the most pathologically driven to get into the most competitive specialties.

Getting straight A's in med school and knocking Step 1 out of the park is all about hard work, not brains. You can't be an idiot obviously, but I find being really smart can actually be a detriment in med school given that many highly intelligent people see through the mania of compulsively hard work, say "to hell with it," and thus get lower scores.

The guy gunning for neurosurgery isn't a genius. He's a narcissistic workaholic with a little teeny one that needs to prove to the world through his occupation how great he is, in spite of the fact that he doesn't believe it himself. This low self-image is ironically the very fuel needed to get through the excessively long hours required of someone who wants to pursue neurosurgery, so it's very self-selective in that respect. In the end, the process marries psychopathology with the demands of the given specialty very nicely.

Well put.

 

[AlexMorph]

But one could just as easily make the case that there are as many PCPs that are guilty of choosing the field only by virtue of mediocre test scores/evaluations, as there are people in ROAD specialties guilty of prioritizing lifestyle above all else.

These people don't ever get called out on their BS for why they chose the field, but the ROAD folks always get judged...seems like a double standard.

By your own argument, they didn't choose that field. It's all they could get. And it seems bizarre to me that you would want to chastise those who did poorly on Step 1/rotations. What are we? Asian parents?

 

[WellWornLad]

Here's the truth:

Just an aside - any post starting with this should set your BS meter spinning.

The guy gunning for neurosurgery isn't a genius. He's a narcissistic workaholic with a little teeny one that needs to prove to the world through his occupation how great he is, in spite of the fact that he doesn't believe it himself.

And how old were you when neurosurgeons broke into your home, killed your father, raped your mother, burned down your house, poured sugar into the gas tank of the family car and left you for dead?

 

[patel2]

By your own argument, they didn't choose that field. It's all they could get. And it seems bizarre to me that you would want to chastise those who did poorly on Step 1/rotations. What are we? Asian parents?

I don't want to chastise any group of physicians- for whatever reason they are in the field...that's my point. I'm just pointing out that for the all the bad rep that derm/ROAD people get about not acknowledging what their real motives for choosing the specialty are, the same hypocrisy is likely prevalent in many other fields like FM.

 

[45408]

Just an aside - any post starting with this should set your BS meter spinning.



And how old were you when neurosurgeons broke into your home, killed your father, raped your mother, burned down your house, poured sugar into the gas tank of the family car and left you for dead?

Agreed. His stereotypes don't apply to the students in my class that went for neurosurgery, the residents in it, and definitely not the attendings I worked with.

 

[sideways]

Just an aside - any post starting with this should set your BS meter spinning.



And how old were you when neurosurgeons broke into your home, killed your father, raped your mother, burned down your house, poured sugar into the gas tank of the family car and left you for dead?

I was 5. What's your point?

 

[username456789]

I was 5. What's your point?

That perhaps you're letting childhood trauma influence your position on this matter.

C'mon, this isn't brain surgery.

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

ROAD specialty mentality:

You can talk and talk and chew at this topic all you want...

I'm gonna take my $$ to the bank in the meantime, see ya at the golf course... oh wait....

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

Just an aside - any post starting with this should set your BS meter spinning.



And how old were you when neurosurgeons broke into your home, killed your father, raped your mother, burned down your house, poured sugar into the gas tank of the family car and left you for dead?

It may not have been applied correctly, but the gist of the statement is true.

 

[sideways]

That perhaps you're letting childhood trauma influence your position on this matter.

C'mon, this isn't brain surgery.

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

That perhaps you're letting childhood trauma influence your position on this matter.

C'mon, this isn't brain surgery.

Stick to IM

You guys are seriously awesome at regurgitating over a worthless topic.

Reminds me of IM rounds...

In the SICU? Surgeons were a pro at that, too.

 

[badasshairday]

To answer the original question of this thread:

Bankers hours and lotsa $$$.

 

[username456789]

Stick to IM

Nah, I'm good.

 

[NickNaylor]

This thread needs a few of these:

 

[badasshairday]

Honestly, who cares about the reason why somebody does derm or any specialty for that matter. Different people want different things. Personally, I could never see myself as a dermatologist... or even most other specialties except for maybe 2 or 3. For all we know, compensation in the future may be completely different from what it is today. So the most important thing is to do what you like.

 

[adaptation1]

I'm not getting the logic here, or at least the animosity towards Derm.

Derms mainly see common skin diseases, often assumed to be merely cosmetic in nature. But ask anyone who has personally dealt with chronic skin diseases -- anyone who has suffered the agony of having to wear her pain in such a visible location. It's emotionally exhausting, often intractable to quick fixes, and isolating. A study showed, I remember, that psoriasis was equally debilitating and antagonist to one's quality of life as many other "more serious" disorders. So I assume you guys have the good sense not to trivialize common skin disorders.

That said, are we saying that these disorders should simply be delegated to primary care physicians, because the skills and experience necessary to treat them does not require specialization? I'd think that treating cystic acne is more than throwing accutane at patients like gummy bears. Or are we saying that, yes, derm is a necessary specialty, but they are simply get overpaid for such a cushy lifestyle and limited scope of practice? Or is all this hate, because it's simply hard to believe that people might actually enjoy the skin? That most people actually simply do it for the lifestyle and nothing else, while professing otherwise?

I just see a lot of hate, but I don't really get why.

 

[Marcus Brody]

They're sellouts. But thank God for them, and money and greed in general, because if all specialties worked and paid equally, the uncompetitive people would be stuck going into derm. Maybe it wouldn't exist as a specialty at all, maybe primary care would be stuck trying to deal with derm issues themselves.

I'm glad derm exists. Keeps the competitive people chasing the uninteresting un-fulfilling crappy jobs while we get to do the more fun stuff, albeit for less money- oh noes!

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

They're sellouts. But thank God for them, and money and greed in general, because if all specialties worked and paid equally, the uncompetitive people would be stuck going into derm. Maybe it wouldn't exist as a specialty at all, maybe primary care would be stuck trying to deal with derm issues themselves.

I'm glad derm exists. Keeps the competitive people chasing the uninteresting un-fulfilling crappy jobs while we get to do the more fun stuff, albeit for less money- oh noes!

I'm definitely happy with my specialty. It's a ROAD (not derm, though). It's fulfilling, I get to do fun stuff. I get to work with ALL types of patients. I also don't have to worry about less money either. Oh noes!

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

[YOUTUBE]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=goEA4DRkupA[/YOUTUBE]

This thread needs a few of these:

 

[2012mdc]

You make good points. There are other specialties that are very competitive and afford you a good lifestyle. However, nothing in medicine hits the combo of high pay for least amount of hours worked while not having to deal with other BS like derm, and that is what draws people to it. Once again, nothing wrong with going for derm, but those who pursue it should just be honest about it and try not to BS their colleagues and make it seem like they are providing an invaluable service to society.

What exactly do you mean by not having to deal with BS?


I really think a large portion of it is that people trivialize the skin. Rad Onc can offer a similar pay to hours ratio but because it deals with cancer and is relatively unknown it doesn't get nearly the same flak.

Maybe my school (or class) is just different but most people are very open about lifestyle concerns and most attendings outside of the surgeons mentioned the importance of life outside of medicine.

 

[muhali3]

^agree. allergy/immunology is another. I'm sure many would go into derm even if it wasn't a high pay/low hour specialty.

 

[Doctor4Life1769]

.

 

[kdburton]

To answer the original question of this thread:

Bankers hours and lotsa $$$.

You must mean bank-teller hours.

 

[lrkoehle]

They're sellouts. But thank God for them, and money and greed in general, because if all specialties worked and paid equally, the uncompetitive people would be stuck going into derm. Maybe it wouldn't exist as a specialty at all, maybe primary care would be stuck trying to deal with derm issues themselves.

I'm glad derm exists. Keeps the competitive people chasing the uninteresting un-fulfilling crappy jobs while we get to do the more fun stuff, albeit for less money- oh noes!

Implicit in your comment is the assumption that if all specialties paid equally everyone would want to go into a primary care field and money is the only thing that drives people to specialize. Guess what though, if I had to do FM or IM, I would not have gone to medical school, regardless of the pay.

 

[ButImLETired]

As said, there are two types. The ones whose focus is primarily cosmetic and the ones whose focus is primarily medical.

and I've also noticed the tendency of attractive people wanting to do derm/plastics. some type of psychopathology going on over there.

It's probably more related to a higher ego.

I don't know that this is true. I imagine it's the same thing as butch, gym-loving athletes going into ortho. You just understand some of the priorities of your patients.

Case in point: I could never do ortho. I have never been an athlete and don't understand the concept of actually LIKING exercise. So let's say you're an orthopod and you get a patient who's 40 years old, 2 kids, has been running marathons and triathlons his whole life and has had a bunch of knee surgeries already. However, he loves to run his marathons and there's one coming up and he needs the umpteenth knee surgery before he can go. My approach: convince him it's time to slow down. Surgery has its risks, he has kids, he should probably start caring more about being alive for them than running like he's still 20. I imagine most athletes would disagree because they'd see his point- obviously this running thing is a priority for him. On the other hand, I'm a singer and I met a 70-year-old laryngeal carcinoma patient who sings and who told his wife he'd rather die than lose the ability to sing so he refuses to have a radical surgery, preferring chemo instead. I do get that.

If you're beautiful and have always taken care of your appearance and know the value of your looks, you might be more inclined to understand the kind of person who'd want to spend a ton of money out of pocket in order to look beautiful. Simple as that.

But isn't that true for all the "lifestyle" specialties that are at least somewhat competitive?

Derm seems to get the most flak. Is it because it's hyper-competitive? has a cosmetic aspect? thought to be the most cush?

Are people that choose derm just the most honest with themselves? I don't care what most people say, there are a lot of people who don't see medicine as a higher calling but instead as an interesting career with very solid job security that pays well. If you actually enjoy skin, derm does have enough variety to be interesting, pays well, and has great job security.

I don't have a vested interest as I'm not doing derm but it seems to be a lot of the hate comes from jealousy and/or ignorance of the field.

I think in part it's because derm is seen as relatively "simple" (the "if it's dry, keep it wet, if it's wet keep it dry" concept). Anyone can see a rash, and putting cream isn't exactly rocket-science. It's obviously more complicated than it seems to a layman, but I think that perception is what drives the whole "if you're going into derm you just want to make a bunch of money" idea. Anesthesia gets some of that flak too, to a lesser extent- well-paid, shift-work, and anesthesiologists seem to just sit around and turn knobs all day while surgeons do the real work. No one knows all the thinking that goes behind turning those knobs, but it still "looks easy".

 

[2012mdc]

I don't know that this is true. I imagine it's the same thing as butch, gym-loving athletes going into ortho. You just understand some of the priorities of your patients.

Case in point: I could never do ortho. I have never been an athlete and don't understand the concept of actually LIKING exercise. So let's say you're an orthopod and you get a patient who's 40 years old, 2 kids, has been running marathons and triathlons his whole life and has had a bunch of knee surgeries already. However, he loves to run his marathons and there's one coming up and he needs the umpteenth knee surgery before he can go. My approach: convince him it's time to slow down. Surgery has its risks, he has kids, he should probably start caring more about being alive for them than running like he's still 20. I imagine most athletes would disagree because they'd see his point- obviously this running thing is a priority for him. On the other hand, I'm a singer and I met a 70-year-old laryngeal carcinoma patient who sings and who told his wife he'd rather die than lose the ability to sing so he refuses to have a radical surgery, preferring chemo instead. I do get that.

If you're beautiful and have always taken care of your appearance and know the value of your looks, you might be more inclined to understand the kind of person who'd want to spend a ton of money out of pocket in order to look beautiful. Simple as that.




I think in part it's because derm is seen as relatively "simple" (the "if it's dry, keep it wet, if it's wet keep it dry" concept). Anyone can see a rash, and putting cream isn't exactly rocket-science. It's obviously more complicated than it seems to a layman, but I think that perception is what drives the whole "if you're going into derm you just want to make a bunch of money" idea. Anesthesia gets some of that flak too, to a lesser extent- well-paid, shift-work, and anesthesiologists seem to just sit around and turn knobs all day while surgeons do the real work. No one knows all the thinking that goes behind turning those knobs, but it still "looks easy".

True but it seems most medical students have similar attitudes as the layman, maybe they're just preclinical ones who don't know any better

 

[OveractiveBrain]

This is somewhat of a slippery slope, as I imagine a sizable percentage of individuals who went to medical school in the first place did so out of less-than-virtuous/altruistic reasoning.

I actually hope you are wrong. I think most medical students join medicine because they are idealistic, because they have some higher calling, some passion for curing the sick, mending the wounded, and giving back to society.

I think it is the reverse. People go into medical school with mostly an idealistic mindset. When the workload gets too hard, their friends dwindle, relationships compromise, their hobbies and interests get consumed by school, those who do well enough to get out of the pit see certain specialties as the way. I paint a dismal picture of medical school, but to some extent its true. The people I've seen cling to their past end up scrambling or going into OB, while the people who suffer through medical school get their pick.

There was an interesting article two years ago about jading and idealism fallout. Berated by attendings, competing with classmates, shat on by residents for four years leaves the ideal medical student who wants to do good sour, angry, and jaded. They want their life back. Who is to wrong them for taking advantage of their academic success to reclaim the things they valued most before medical school?

 

[Brigade4Radiant]

What I want to know is why some people think that Anesthesiology is competitive when it is not very competitive at all.

 

[Slack3r]

What I want to know is why some people think that Anesthesiology is competitive when it is not very competitive at all.

It used to be more competitive that it is, but it's pretty much always been the easiest of the ROAD specialties. I think the ROAD specialties still carry the stigma of money and/or lifestyle and will always be seen as competitive. But I remember reading that gas has fallen to middle tier competitive (in the vein of EM or gsurg) and ophthalmetry has fallen a bit as well, although still competitive. I think when imaging reimbursements finally get axed, rads competitiveness will drop as well. I think derm will remain competitive off it's own merits, and I think the other three will still be viewed as competitive due to the reputation and the acronym.

 

[sideways]

It used to be more competitive that it is, but it's pretty much always been the easiest of the ROAD specialties. I think the ROAD specialties still carry the stigma of money and/or lifestyle and will always be seen as competitive. But I remember reading that gas has fallen to middle tier competitive (in the vein of EM or gsurg) and ophthalmetry has fallen a bit as well, although still competitive. I think when imaging reimbursements finally get axed, rads competitiveness will drop as well. I think derm will remain competitive off it's own merits, and I think the other three will still be viewed as competitive due to the reputation and the acronym.

 

[Slack3r]

W/e...opthalmology.

 

[ArcGurren]

Well, I'm taking my step 1 in a week and the chances of me getting a derm-worthy score are pretty low (though I do hope to do well) but I agree with the general sentiment that people who go into dermatology rarely do it because it's something they "enjoy" in terms of what they do, but instead enjoy the freedom/low stress/great money that it pays.

Also to the person who said people who go into neurosurgery are overcompensating and dicks etc.... no. Most of the neurosurgeons I have met have been nothing short of pleasant (if a little full of themselves) people who for the most part enjoy their job and what they do from a day to day basis, and have a very strong commitment to making headway in that field. Do they have much of a personal life or a married life? Not really, but if you enjoy what you're doing... etc.

I think one of my 4th year friends put it to me best... if you've got the big scores and you're a lazy SOB, you'll go into derm (note, this kid went into derm), but if you're not lazy, you'll go into neurosurgery.

As for why pretty people go into derm... I'm assuming for the same reason huge muscled jocks go into ortho. I would argue that the stereotype about jocks doing ortho is probably less on point than the pretty people doing derm stereotype.

 

[ArcGurren]

I'm not getting the logic here, or at least the animosity towards Derm.

Derms mainly see common skin diseases, often assumed to be merely cosmetic in nature. But ask anyone who has personally dealt with chronic skin diseases -- anyone who has suffered the agony of having to wear her pain in such a visible location. It's emotionally exhausting, often intractable to quick fixes, and isolating. A study showed, I remember, that psoriasis was equally debilitating and antagonist to one's quality of life as many other "more serious" disorders. So I assume you guys have the good sense not to trivialize common skin disorders.

That said, are we saying that these disorders should simply be delegated to primary care physicians, because the skills and experience necessary to treat them does not require specialization? I'd think that treating cystic acne is more than throwing accutane at patients like gummy bears. Or are we saying that, yes, derm is a necessary specialty, but they are simply get overpaid for such a cushy lifestyle and limited scope of practice? Or is all this hate, because it's simply hard to believe that people might actually enjoy the skin? That most people actually simply do it for the lifestyle and nothing else, while professing otherwise?

I just see a lot of hate, but I don't really get why.

I think there's a couple things.

1. The general BS that derm-bound kids sometimes try to pull by saying "oh yeah we're going for derm so we can fix skin cancers and help people fix their self-image" as their primary goal... although I'm sure this is the case for a minority of people, the majority almost definitely are in it for the money and cushy lifestyle. I don't think there's anything wrong with wanting it but being dishonest about why you want it is a little annoying.

2. A lot of people who apply for derm (including a few that I know) did so because they got really good scores and even though they weren't lazy, they decided to take the "lazy way out"... as opposed to another field like urology, orthopedics, neurosurgery, radiation oncology where real work is ACTUALLY being done (not that derm isn't getting stuff done but not to the extent of these fields). The perception is that derm is essentially taking the "cream of the crop" and turning them into people who sell accutane with cash up front. In essence a waste of talent which would otherwise be utilized to help other people. This isn't exclusive to derm obviously... a lot of people go into plastic surgery and then go mint millions on boob jobs and nip/tuck procedures instead of at least spending part of their time on fixing facial deformities, burn victims, etc (which IS a noble thing to do in my opinion).

I'm sure there are people who went into it because they legitimately enjoy the skin and the science of derm, but I think pretending that's the main reason MOST people go into it is ridiculous.

 

[username456789]

Medical school applicants all have to pretend to want to go to medical school solely for the purpose of "helping people" (and surely never for status or for the promise of a well respected job with good compensation). Then selective amnesia strikes, and the holier-than-thou attitudes surface, wagging the finger-of-shame at those medical students who apply for dermatology and may want to "help people" (and surely never for status or the promise of a well respected job with good compensation).

A hypocritical lot, we are.

 

[sideways]

W/e...opthalmology.

I think 'ophthalmetry" is something Navy Seals do to determine their coordinates.

 

[VoiceofReason]

derm is competitive because ther are like 100 seats total per year or some senseless h0rse$h1t like that

 

[AlexMorph]

Medical school applicants all have to pretend to want to go to medical school solely for the purpose of "helping people" (and surely never for status or for the promise of a well respected job with good compensation). Then selective amnesia strikes, and the holier-than-thou attitudes surface, wagging the finger-of-shame at those medical students who apply for dermatology and may want to "help people" (and surely never for status or the promise of a well respected job with good compensation).

A hypocritical lot, we are.

The system fosters hypocrisy. It's like politics. If you try to be a straight-shooter 100% of the time, you will go nowhere.

 

[AlexMorph]

derm is competitive because ther are like 100 seats total per year or some senseless h0rse$h1t like that

Ya, why don't NPs start cutting into this? Isn't there some program in Florida that is doing this? I say we need more of these programs.

 

[Slack3r]

Also to the person who said people who go into neurosurgery are overcompensating and dicks etc.... no. Most of the neurosurgeons I have met have been nothing short of pleasant (if a little full of themselves) people who for the most part enjoy their job and what they do from a day to day basis, and have a very strong commitment to making headway in that field. Do they have much of a personal life or a married life? Not really, but if you enjoy what you're doing... etc.

Yea, and I'm sure it's just a coincidence the average neurosurgeon salary is between $500k and $900k.

...although I'm sure this is the case for a minority of people, the majority almost definitely are in it for the money and cushy lifestyle.

2. A lot of people who apply for derm (including a few that I know) did so because they got really good scores and even though they weren't lazy, they decided to take the "lazy way out"... as opposed to another field like urology, orthopedics, neurosurgery, radiation oncology where real work is ACTUALLY being done (not that derm isn't getting stuff done but not to the extent of these fields). The perception is that derm is essentially taking the "cream of the crop" and turning them into people who sell accutane with cash up front. In essence a waste of talent which would otherwise be utilized to help other people. This isn't exclusive to derm obviously... a lot of people go into plastic surgery and then go mint millions on boob jobs and nip/tuck procedures instead of at least spending part of their time on fixing facial deformities, burn victims, etc (which IS a noble thing to do in my opinion).

Your use of blatant stereotypes and exaggerations aside, I think you're oversimplifying the subject.

 

[username456789]

Yea, and I'm sure it's just a coincidence the average neurosurgeon salary is between $500k and $900k.

Your use of blatant stereotypes and exaggerations aside, I think you're oversimplifying the subject.

Haha.

 

[Democritus]

Medical school applicants all have to pretend to want to go to medical school solely for the purpose of "helping people" (and surely never for status or for the promise of a well respected job with good compensation). Then selective amnesia strikes, and the holier-than-thou attitudes surface, wagging the finger-of-shame at those medical students who apply for dermatology and may want to "help people" (and surely never for status or the promise of a well respected job with good compensation).

A hypocritical lot, we are.