Timeline for MSTP Grant?

[sweetpotater]

Hi all! Quick rundown on my situation, though this could easily apply to others (I’ve also read the recent thread on MSTP grant process and am currently looking through the F32 FOA that was posted there; if my question is answered, I’ll edit this post later):

I caught a couple early acceptances to non-MSTP MD-PhD programs (1 fully funded, 1 not), and am waiting to hear back from a few MSTP’s post-interview. In the scenario that none of the MSTPs pan out for me, I recognize that fully funded > non fully funded MD-PhD programs is the general consensus, barring rare circumstances.

That in mind, my acceptance to a non fully-funded program is at a school that has stated they are in the process of applying for the MSTP (no idea if it’s true, but I’ve taken it as such since they said they were already in the process).

I’m curious if there is a consistent point in the year where schools find out whether they have been granted the MSTP designation — I could obviously email this school as well to ask, but could also see that as being nosy. At the moment, I am hoping that one of the MSTPs I’m waiting on comes around with news and makes this an easy decision, but figured it wouldn’t hurt to post this here in case others are in the the same situation.

Cheers!!

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[FalconSlice]

Hi all! Quick rundown on my situation, though this could easily apply to others (I’ve also read the recent thread on MSTP grant process and am currently looking through the F32 FOA that was posted there; if my question is answered, I’ll edit this post later):

I caught a couple early acceptances to non-MSTP MD-PhD programs (1 fully funded, 1 not), and am waiting to hear back from a few MSTP’s post-interview. In the scenario that none of the MSTPs pan out for me, I recognize that fully funded > non fully funded MD-PhD programs is the general consensus, barring rare circumstances.

That in mind, my acceptance to a non fully-funded program is at a school that has stated they are in the process of applying for the MSTP (no idea if it’s true, but I’ve taken it as such since they said they were already in the process).

I’m curious if there is a consistent point in the year where schools find out whether they have been granted the MSTP designation — I could obviously email this school as well to ask, but could also see that as being nosy. At the moment, I am hoping that one of the MSTPs I’m waiting on comes around with news and makes this an easy decision, but figured it wouldn’t hurt to post this here in case others are in the the same situation.

Cheers!!

There are several things I think you may be conflating. Don't worry as most people do too.

First things are first:
Fully funded: this can apply to students/trainees or the program. There are NO MD-PhD (MSTP or non-MSTP) that are "fully funded" by the NIH or any other governmental entity.

MSTP: Definition of MSTP is that they are funded to some extent by the NIH's mechanism. Again, NO--I'll repeat--NO MSTP is "fully funded." In fact, they are only fractionally funded by the NIH. The rest is made up by the school.

Students' funding can vary. At our institution, each student is fully funded during the whole process and are supported during the grad school years by the PI. If he/she happens to get external funding (which many of us do) via a fellowship/grant/etc. they are rewarded with a monetary award (a little bone thrown to us for saving folks money and for making the program look good). Some institutions will pick a few students and fully fund them and the rest are left to fend for themselves. Long-story short, MSTP or non-MSTP is completely unrelated to whether students are fully funded. There are many other nuances, but this was generally the different cases back when I was applying almost a decade ago. @Fencer can weigh in (and correct me if I am wrong). There are many non-MSTP MD-PhD programs which fully support and fund their students.

TL;DR: don't focus on whether program is MSTP or non-MSTP. Focus on the actual funding and support you will (or won't get) as this is a different issue than whether a program has fractional NIH support (i.e., MSTP) or not.

 

[sweetpotater]

There are several things I think you may be conflating. Don't worry as most people do too.

First things are first:
Fully funded: this can apply to students/trainees or the program. There are NO MD-PhD (MSTP or non-MSTP) that are "fully funded" by the NIH or any other governmental entity.

MSTP: Definition of MSTP is that they are funded to some extent by the NIH's mechanism. Again, NO--I'll repeat--NO MSTP is "fully funded." In fact, they are only fractionally funded by the NIH. The rest is made up by the school.

Students' funding can vary. At our institution, each student is fully funded during the whole process and are supported during the grad school years by the PI. If he/she happens to get external funding (which many of us do) via a fellowship/grant/etc. they are rewarded with a monetary award (a little bone thrown to us for saving folks money and for making the program look good). Some institutions will pick a few students and fully fund them and the rest are left to fend for themselves. Long-story short, MSTP or non-MSTP is completely unrelated to whether students are fully funded. There are many other nuances, but this was generally the different cases back when I was applying almost a decade ago. @Fencer can weigh in (and correct me if I am wrong). There are many non-MSTP MD-PhD programs which fully support and fund their students.

TL;DR: don't focus on whether program is MSTP or non-MSTP. Focus on the actual funding and support you will (or won't get) as this is a different issue than whether a program has fractional NIH support (i.e., MSTP) or not.

Thank you for the detailed response! Your advice motivated me to go do better research on the NIH's support for the MSTPs, and now I realize the funding sources/terminology aren't as black and white as I initially thought.

For the school I was specifically posting about, it appears that they may have offered up an overly optimistic estimate on their progress toward the MSTP, so my initial concern about this is an afterthought at this point. They do not currently offer a stipend during medical school years, and my initial thought was that receiving the MSTP designation would allow them to do so -- now I realize that this was a false assumption, since I've been told that a school showing that they're able to autonomously support their MD-PhD students during all 8 years (tuition + stipend) generally has to precede receiving the fractional NIH support through the MSTP, just so the NIH knows that the school isn't relying on the grant to keep the students in the "fully funded" state that I was mentioning.

To your last point, I do have an acceptance to a program that offers full tuition payment + stipend for all 8 years (better deal than the above).

 

[Fencer]

I have been in a MSTP study section. If I determine that the a program is not fully funding their current student, that goes down big time against that program. I am only aware of a highly prestigious institution who has a relatively small class (to the size of the program) and takes another group out from their MS-1/2 class. In my book, that is a "moderate weakness" in their institutional commitment... they have been able to get away with it because of their other strengths. In fairness, they might provide institutional funding for their MS 1/2 class. I do not know...

Every other MSTP or soon to be MSTP that I am aware fully funds their students ---> Tuition and fees, and stipend and benefits.

 

[sweetpotater]

I have been in a MSTP study section. If I determine that the a program is not fully funding their current student, that goes down big time against that program. I am only aware of a highly prestigious institution who has a relatively small class (to the size of the program) and takes another group out from their MS-1/2 class. In my book, that is a "moderate weakness" in their institutional commitment... they have been able to get away with it because of their other strengths. In fairness, they might provide institutional funding for their MS 1/2 class. I do not know...

Every other MSTP or soon to be MSTP that I am aware fully funds their students ---> Tuition and fees, and stipend and benefits.

Thank you for the response @Fencer !! This clarifies a lot of what I've heard about non-MSTP MD-PhD programs and their funding. Your last point is exactly what I was curious about... one fewer thing to be worried about!