Things to do as an EMT-B?

[GregoryMD]

I realize this is an odd question. I got nationally registered as an EMT around February. I took a program at a local CC that allowed high school seniors to take the course.

Now that I've graduated high school and got my EMT, I was looking for a part time job, or even volunteer experience as an EMT. I'm going to university in the fall to pursue pre-med, but EMS has always been a sort of related hobby of mine.

Trouble is, I haven't been able to find a job as an ER tech in any hospitals near me. There is a "freeze" on techs in Phoenix, AZ apparently. I decided to look more into ambulance companies, and they require you to be 21 before they employ you, which doesn't work well for me as I am only 18.

This age requirement is also in Tucson, where the university I'm going to is located (U of A) this fall.

So where can I get some volunteer experience or part time work as an EMT fresh out of high school, and something manageable while in university. Firefighting is also kind of a hobby/interest of mine (If I didn't become a doctor, it would be my backup career...), would an engine company take me along as a volunteer on ride-a-longs maybe?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[Dwindlin]

I ran into a similar situation when I first got certified. I had to take a job with a local private service that did not do 911 until I was 21. The 21 years old rule you will likely run into everywhere, and it has to do with the companies insurance covering you to drive. So, the service I ended up working for all I did was tech on a BLS truck, I didn't drive at all.

As far as tech jobs go, getting a spot in the ER is tough for EMTB's, most ERs look for medics as they can start IVs, push meds, etc. Some hospitals may hire you as a tech on a floor though.

Best of luck! I've never understood why they let you get certified at 18, yet nearly no one can use you until you're 21.

 

[pseudoknot]

As far as tech jobs go, getting a spot in the ER is tough for EMTB's, most ERs look for medics as they can start IVs, push meds, etc. Some hospitals may hire you as a tech on a floor though.

That will vary widely state by state. In California there are no paramedics working anywhere in hospitals, because the nurse's union (or perhaps state regulations) will not allow them to do any ALS type stuff.

Here in Virginia you do find both, although EMT-Bs (or pretty much any tech) can start IVs with on the job training. I don't think medics are supposed to administer medications other than ACLS drugs in a code, but I'm not sure about that.

Of course this is all a bit of a tangent. I guess the bottom line is that in some areas there are ER tech jobs for basics, but even in those places you need experience or connections to get them.

 

[Dwindlin]

That will vary widely state by state. In California there are no paramedics working anywhere in hospitals, because the nurse's union (or perhaps state regulations) will not allow them to do any ALS type stuff.

Here in Virginia you do find both, although EMT-Bs (or pretty much any tech) can start IVs with on the job training. I don't think medics are supposed to administer medications other than ACLS drugs in a code, but I'm not sure about that.

Of course this is all a bit of a tangent. I guess the bottom line is that in some areas there are ER tech jobs for basics, but even in those places you need experience or connections to get them.

Here in Ohio even working in the hospital we are held to our scope of practice, and in Ohio EMT-B's (even with training) cannot start IVs (legally), so you won't find EMT-Bs in the ERs. On the flip side medics can do anything in the ER as they do pre-hospital, when I worked in the ER I routinely handled airway management in codes instead of having Resp. paged (assuming the doc didn't want to do it themselves).

I'm honestly surprised that EMS hasn't moved for a more nationalized standards. I mean NREMT is a standard for most things, but essentially states can do whatever they want. I live on the Ohio/Indiana border and work in both sates and it amazes me the differences in practice. Example, in Indiana I can do surg. crics, NGs and central lines pre-hospital. We can do none of that in Ohio. Just boggles my mind at times.

 

[jbar]

I'm honestly surprised that EMS hasn't moved for a more nationalized standards. I mean NREMT is a standard for most things, but essentially states can do whatever they want.

You are talking about a country where we can't agree on standards for driver's licenses because it would impinge too much on states rights. Different states have different laws which govern EMS. I don't mind the variances in practice nearly as much as I do how hard it is to get reciprocity. Give me a sheet and make me take an online test to show I know how your state differs from national, but asking me to take another EMT class is crazy.

 

[GregoryMD]

As far as tech jobs go, getting a spot in the ER is tough for EMTB's, most ERs look for medics as they can start IVs, push meds, etc. Some hospitals may hire you as a tech on a floor though.

In seems in the Phoenix or Tucson area, EMT-Bs are actually in demand to fill ER Tech jobs. I suppose the hospitals here figure it's cheaper to pay an EMT-B and just give them on the job training for IVs and such, than hiring a full fledged paramedic. That and the scope of practice really depends on the hospital. I knew of one hospital that let techs do whatever they were trained to do at the hospital. Some even assisted the ER docs with suturing.

My problem is the "freeze". Since my certification, there was one opening which I tried following up on, but the position got filled before I got an interview. I've religiously followed every hospital around me for openings, but it's been dry the past few months.

Which is why I'm considering being a volunteer EMT, whether it be for a private rig or the fire department. Thing is, I'm itching for some action. I don't want to volunteer and just be stuck watching. I finished top in my class. I feel like my potential is not being used, ahaha.

I may just have to wait until I'm 21 and work then.

 

[docB]

That will vary widely state by state. In California there are no paramedics working anywhere in hospitals, because the nurse's union (or perhaps state regulations) will not allow them to do any ALS type stuff.

In CA the CNA (nurse's union) is so politically powerful that there's little difference between their position and state regs.

I'm honestly surprised that EMS hasn't moved for a more nationalized standards. I mean NREMT is a standard for most things, but essentially states can do whatever they want. I live on the Ohio/Indiana border and work in both sates and it amazes me the differences in practice. Example, in Indiana I can do surg. crics, NGs and central lines pre-hospital. We can do none of that in Ohio. Just boggles my mind at times.

There have been episodic movements to create national standardization but they always get mired in regional politics and turf battles. Some area doesn't want medics to do skill X and they derail the process by convincing local and state level authorities that they'll lose their power to some national entity. While that is true it would be worth it to have the standardization and portabiltiy it would afford.

 

[Dwindlin]

Do nurses have this trouble with high variability between states?

 

[docB]

Do nurses have this trouble with high variability between states?

They have to be sererately licensed in each state where they practice. I know that docs definitely have these problems. You have to get licensed in each state where you want to practice and the requirements vary greatly and the licensing process is insanely long and costly.

 

[traumasurg]

OP,

I was in your situation about a month ago. All ambulances companies where I live require you to be 21 for insurance purposes to drive. I went to a private company and asked asked about volunteering. They partnered me with an older gentleman who was a driver who enjoyed volunteering. They trained me to get a twelve lead and how to send it to the hospital. The only difference is on that truck is we have a limited drug box. It's been very rewarding so far. I pretty much take care of the patient by myself which is pretty cool. I would recommend volunteering if you could. It gets you clinical experience plus volunteering.

 

[jbar]

As an EMT-B i'd say how big the drug box is doesn't really matter all that much.

 

[Siggy]

Drug box for basics: Oxygen, and a variety of other things that you might use once in a blue moon, if at all. I always laugh when my coworkers ask having X or how great it is having Y (like epipens). "When was the last time you had a patient where you could/did use it?" "Err, umm, ahh." "Exactly. It's just something else to make unit checkout longer and cost money."

 

[traumasurg]

Drug box for basics: Oxygen, and a variety of other things that you might use once in a blue moon, if at all. I always laugh when my coworkers ask having X or how great it is having Y (like epipens). "When was the last time you had a patient where you could/did use it?" "Err, umm, ahh." "Exactly. It's just something else to make unit checkout longer and cost money."

The only thing I have used is oxygen and aspirin as basics in Alabama are allowed to give aspirin. I was just trying to give some idea of the differences between volunteering and working.

 

[jbar]

Other options as an EMT who isn't old enough to drive the rig:

Event coverage (concerts, NASCAR, etc)
Search and rescue
Ski patrol
Amusement parks (sounds grim, but I hear places like six flags actually have a fair number of people who get sick, have MIs etc in the parks)

Hope that helps

 

[meliora27]

I work as a tech in the ED. I worked on an ambulance (private) for ~6 months and then started applying for tech jobs. Tech jobs can be hard find and they usually like to see some actual experience as an EMT-B before they'll interview/hire you. If you can get a tech job however I recommend it. It can be hard and it's often hectic but it's quite fun and I've learned a lot this way. At my hospital, EMT's are also hired to work on the floors at patient techs as well, doing primarily CNA tasks but it's still an option for some.

 

[Blahblahologist]

Move to western PA. We're so short on EMT's and medics out here that my company regularly hires under-21's, exorbitant insurance premiums be damned.

Otherwise, you could try volunteer fire departments in your area. Some do quick response for medical emergencies and are looking for an extra EMT or two to jump on the engine.

 

[GregoryMD]

Move to western PA. We're so short on EMT's and medics out here that my company regularly hires under-21's, exorbitant insurance premiums be damned.

Otherwise, you could try volunteer fire departments in your area. Some do quick response for medical emergencies and are looking for an extra EMT or two to jump on the engine.

Actually doing some more soul searching, I decided when I move down to Tucson for college in a few months, I'm going to look into going through firefighter training and becoming a volunteer firefighter. Since I'm already an EMT, it'll cut down the length of time for training I'd assume (I just go through firefighting 1&2 I think, and of course physicals and exam). It would provide a great extra curricular for pre-med. I've had an interest in firefighting ever since I went through EMT, our instructor was a firefighter, so I got some exposure to the field, and it's like 80% medically related on emergency calls or so; so it's in a way clinical experience as well.

 

[traumasurg]

Actually doing some more soul searching, I decided when I move down to Tucson for college in a few months, I'm going to look into going through firefighter training and becoming a volunteer firefighter. Since I'm already an EMT, it'll cut down the length of time for training I'd assume (I just go through firefighting 1&2 I think, and of course physicals and exam). It would provide a great extra curricular for pre-med. I've had an interest in firefighting ever since I went through EMT, our instructor was a firefighter, so I got some exposure to the field, and it's like 80% medically related on emergency calls or so; so it's in a way clinical experience as well.

I also volunteer as a firefighter and I have to tell you it has been a very rewarding experience. The majority of our calls are medical but having been exposed to extrication and water rescues it has been really fun.

The fires are pretty cool too.

 

[GregoryMD]

I also volunteer as a firefighter and I have to tell you it has been a very rewarding experience. The majority of our calls are medical but having been exposed to extrication and water rescues it has been really fun.

The fires are pretty cool too.

How much training did it require? Did you find you could handle it with a college workload, or did you do it over the summer?

 

[Dwindlin]

How much training did it require? Did you find you could handle it with a college workload, or did you do it over the summer?

I believe most states recognize 3 levels of Fire training. A 36 hour volunteer course. 120 hour Firefighter 1 and a 240 hour Firefighter 2. For small volunteer departments Firefighter 1 I think is sufficient (I don't recommend the 36 hour course to anyone) if you'll be working in a busy department that actually sees a large number of structure fires you'll definitely want the 240. In Ohio, where I work, the 240 is simply a continuation on the 120 course, and doesn't add anything to basic firefighting tactics. It did however provide a lot more survival, and unique firefighting tactics (dealing with large fuel fires like tankers or airliners, confined space fires, etc..).

If you're interested in the specialties (the poster above mentioned water rescue) those are often taught in separate courses. Example, I am a Extrication Tech, Rescue/Recovery Diver, and High Angle Rescue certified but all 3 of those were separate courses I had to take after I was a certified firefighter.

As for course load I did my Fire Academy while taking a very heavy course load for my pre-med courses, at the time I was taking Cell Bio, Orgo I, Phys I and Calc. However, the fire academy I went to had almost zero bookwork, we met Tue/Thurs evenings 4 hours and Saturdays 8 hours. And better than 95% of it was physical. We did ~1.5 hour of PT each day we met, and then the rest of the day spent on senario based training. The last month or so was entirely live burn training. So at least for me, it added nothing to my acedemic course load, just a heavy time commitment and I would generallly leave those days with my ass thouroughly kicked.

And my advice, if you have the option take academy mid/late fall or even early winter. Nothing worse than having 8 hours in 40 pounds of gear, do very physically chanllenging tasks in a structure around 500 degrees, then walking out only to get no relief since it was 95 and humid.

Again a lot of this is personal experience and may vary some from state to state, so take it for what its worth.

 

[GregoryMD]

I believe most states recognize 3 levels of Fire training. A 36 hour volunteer course. 120 hour Firefighter 1 and a 240 hour Firefighter 2. For small volunteer departments Firefighter 1 I think is sufficient (I don't recommend the 36 hour course to anyone) if you'll be working in a busy department that actually sees a large number of structure fires you'll definitely want the 240. In Ohio, where I work, the 240 is simply a continuation on the 120 course, and doesn't add anything to basic firefighting tactics. It did however provide a lot more survival, and unique firefighting tactics (dealing with large fuel fires like tankers or airliners, confined space fires, etc..).

If you're interested in the specialties (the poster above mentioned water rescue) those are often taught in separate courses. Example, I am a Extrication Tech, Rescue/Recovery Diver, and High Angle Rescue certified but all 3 of those were separate courses I had to take after I was a certified firefighter.

As for course load I did my Fire Academy while taking a very heavy course load for my pre-med courses, at the time I was taking Cell Bio, Orgo I, Phys I and Calc. However, the fire academy I went to had almost zero bookwork, we met Tue/Thurs evenings 4 hours and Saturdays 8 hours. And better than 95% of it was physical. We did ~1.5 hour of PT each day we met, and then the rest of the day spent on senario based training. The last month or so was entirely live burn training. So at least for me, it added nothing to my acedemic course load, just a heavy time commitment and I would generallly leave those days with my ass thouroughly kicked.

And my advice, if you have the option take academy mid/late fall or even early winter. Nothing worse than having 8 hours in 40 pounds of gear, do very physically chanllenging tasks in a structure around 500 degrees, then walking out only to get no relief since it was 95 and humid.

Again a lot of this is personal experience and may vary some from state to state, so take it for what its worth.

Ah, a very helpful post. One more question, are there a lot of opportunities to get into an academy for the training (like you said if I entered late fall or winter), or is it like a select few dates among the year? I was always under the impression exams and physicals for fire fighting come like once a year or something, or does this not really apply to volunteers wishing to get trained?

Is my best option just contacting the local FD and telling them I'm an EMT and interested in becoming a volunteer firefighter?

 

[traumasurg]

How much training did it require? Did you find you could handle it with a college workload, or did you do it over the summer?

I took FF 1 during the semester last fall. It wasn't too bad because I was just taking gen bio and gen chem with some other bs classes. I took it with our "city" fire dept. and it was pretty rigorous. It is possible to do during a semester I think. My vol. dept. actually doesn't require any training except on the job training but I really didn't want to die in a fire so I decided I would minimize my chances by getting real training. As for extra certs I would only recommend extrication if you are near a medium-large city. If we ever have any chemical spills or high angle rescue we call for the city dept.

 

[Dwindlin]

Ah, a very helpful post. One more question, are there a lot of opportunities to get into an academy for the training (like you said if I entered late fall or winter), or is it like a select few dates among the year? I was always under the impression exams and physicals for fire fighting come like once a year or something, or does this not really apply to volunteers wishing to get trained?

Is my best option just contacting the local FD and telling them I'm an EMT and interested in becoming a volunteer firefighter?

Yeah I would say you're best bet is to contact a department you're interested in joining. They may even pay for your training if you sign a contract to work there for so long (this is what I did, and I got FF2, EMT-B and P all for free).

And I actually completely agree with this:

As for extra certs I would only recommend extrication if you are near a medium-large city

Of the 3 areas of specialty training I received I've only ever used the extrication in a real situation. Honestly I took the other 2 because they sounded really fun and the department was paying.

 

[xBODOMx]

Dang, that is slightly disappointing to hear a freeze for Phoenix, AZ on techs. I'm about to finish my EMT class. I guess I will be in your situation as well, I'm only 18.

 

[GregoryMD]

Dang, that is slightly disappointing to hear a freeze for Phoenix, AZ on techs. I'm about to finish my EMT class. I guess I will be in your situation as well, I'm only 18.

Ah where did you take your class? PVCC or GCC?

 

[xBODOMx]

Ah where did you take your class? PVCC or GCC?

MCC, just passed my Final and practicals. Taking the NREMT in a week or two whenever my account is ready.

Do you know how long the tech freeze is going to last?

 

[GregoryMD]

MCC, just passed my Final and practicals. Taking the NREMT in a week or two whenever my account is ready.

Do you know how long the tech freeze is going to last?

Well the past few months I saw maybe like 3-4 positions in various hospitals open up. Honestly, I haven't been looking much since I'm moving to Tucson for college soon anyway.

Good luck on the national registry. I remember our instructors kept saying to study hard for it, but it was either they prepared us really well, or I just retained all that info that well. I was expecting a difficult 3 hour test. I finished in like 40 minutes and passed

Just pay attention to the wording.

 

[xBODOMx]

Well the past few months I saw maybe like 3-4 positions in various hospitals open up. Honestly, I haven't been looking much since I'm moving to Tucson for college soon anyway.

Good luck on the national registry. I remember our instructors kept saying to study hard for it, but it was either they prepared us really well, or I just retained all that info that well. I was expecting a difficult 3 hour test. I finished in like 40 minutes and passed

Just pay attention to the wording.

Thanks, and yeah that's what I heard. Watching out for the wording. I'm really not too worried about it. You going to UA? I'm looking for an undergrad school to go to, AZ gets poor choices lol. I'm thinking I might move up to Tucson too, even though I hate Tucson. But its better than ASU.

 

[daithi]

I am working in one of the nly area hospitals to hire basics as techs. I work on the endocrine/epilepsy floor of Children's Med Center in Dallas. I do vitals, change beds, room stocking, etc. same as a CNA but I have also been trained to draw labs, start IVs, insert NG tubes and foleys,spike IV bags and change chest tube dressings. They also let me suction.I have also picked up rudimentary EEG electrode application and EEG pattern recognition and order supplies for the floor.It's been a long road to get this much responsibility, but I love the job.

 

[chman]

This is interesting. I am also thinking about getting my EMT-B. I want to either go to med or PA school, but for PA school I need some health care experience. I am concerned that I would get the degree and not be able to use it. I would go the CNA route to be a tech, but I don't want to end up changing adult diapers.

The other option for me would be to just get my degree in nursing, but that would make med school harder. Any thoughts? I live in the Seattle area, if that helps.

 

[Dwindlin]

This is interesting. I am also thinking about getting my EMT-B. I want to either go to med or PA school, but for PA school I need some health care experience. I am concerned that I would get the degree and not be able to use it. I would go the CNA route to be a tech, but I don't want to end up changing adult diapers.

The other option for me would be to just get my degree in nursing, but that would make med school harder. Any thoughts? I live in the Seattle area, if that helps.

Granted I have no personal experience with PA school but I've heard from many that EMS is a great method to gain your clinical experience. If you are truly on the fence about med school I would say err on the side of preparing for that. So I would say focus mainly on doing well in your classes and prep for MCAT. The one thing that most of us this board tell you though is to not pursue EMS simply for an extra curricular on a med school app.

 

[chman]

Granted I have no personal experience with PA school but I've heard from many that EMS is a great method to gain your clinical experience. If you are truly on the fence about med school I would say err on the side of preparing for that. So I would say focus mainly on doing well in your classes and prep for MCAT. The one thing that most of us this board tell you though is to not pursue EMS simply for an extra curricular on a med school app.

I am really not concerned with being the perfect applicant, although maybe I should be. I am leaning heavily towards PA. I want to do emergency medicine, so this would be a good experience.

One thing about EMS services in Seattle is that the fire department handles a lot of it from what I understand. It is called "medic one" and they are top notch. They train at Harborview hospital which is part of UW medicine, and they go more in depth than many medic programs. What I am getting at is that I don't know what the demand is for EMT-B's. I guess I could go to one of the other cities around here or do a private service.

 

[docB]

This is interesting. I am also thinking about getting my EMT-B. I want to either go to med or PA school, but for PA school I need some health care experience. I am concerned that I would get the degree and not be able to use it. I would go the CNA route to be a tech, but I don't want to end up changing adult diapers.

The other option for me would be to just get my degree in nursing, but that would make med school harder. Any thoughts? I live in the Seattle area, if that helps.

If your goal is med school or PA school I would suggest not spending time doing EMS but devoting yourself to doing well on the grades and tests you will have to excell at to get into either of those. Any EMS experience you gain will not be as helpful in getting into professional school as would better grades and scores.

 

[jbar]

But many PA programs want clinical time. So they need to do something beyond tests and grades.

The real reason to do EMT is because you think i'd be fun. The two years I spent doing EMS may not have done much to get me in med school, but I wouldn't trade those two years on the rig for anything. Good times.