Spouses role in a practice

[thefootfixer]

To all the owners out there…how important or instrumental is it, to have your spouse play a role in establishing and growing your practice? I know tons of docs that have a spouse as an OM..and a ton that don’t …pros and cons of either?

The immediate pro I think of is that there’s someone built in that cares about the office…curious to see people’s thoughts

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[DYK343]

Pros: you dont have to pay income to a manager/keep that money in the family.

Cons: For the life of you, for some unknown reason, you cant keep any employees longer than 6 months. (this is a subltle intertwined long running joke on this board).

- - -

I love my wife. But I couldnt spend all day every day (work and home) with her. Plus you would be much more likely to bring work home with you if you both worked together and made business decisions together.. It would dominate the dinner table discussion every night. No thanks.

 

[thefootfixer]

Pros: you dont have to pay income to a manager/keep that money in the family.

Cons: For the life of you, for some unknown reason, you cant keep any employees longer than 6 months. (this is a subltle intertwined long running joke on this board).

- - -

I love my wife. But I couldnt spend all day every day (work and home) with her. Plus you would be much more likely to bring work home with you if you both worked together and made business decisions together.. It would dominate the dinner table discussion every night. No thanks.

How would one manage a task like this solo? It would take sometime to find true help from people who care, and then obviously they can leave as well.

How does a solo doc combat this

 

[DYK343]

How would one manage a task like this solo? It would take sometime to find true help from people who care, and then obviously they can leave as well.

How does a solo doc combat this

Im not in private practice so ill let others comment further

 

[heybrother]

Benefits
(a) They care / theoretically have your interests at heart / aren't going to embezzle / aren't to leave
(b) "Tax" Benefits ie. 401k, health insurance
(c) If you married someone on your level ie. you are an intelligent person, you married an intelligent person then you may have someone who is capable of seeing the big pictures, handling more complicated issues like billing / remittance / potentially more teachable. Teaching an employee to resolve complicated issues can be difficult, expensive etc. I think we have 1 employee who went to college ie. our OM.

Cons
(a) Its entirely possible that they are bad at it and have no business being involved in your business
(b) Its possible they have something they are good at that they should be off doing that could pay more, be more satisfying, be more worthwhile
(c) The overall experience of people on this forum is that nothing is worse than dealing with an office manager who is also a podiatrist's wife. ie. they run associates off, often treat staff poorly.

I think there's some truth to this regardless of the business. Family members who "work" at an office often speak with the full authority of the owner without actually working, contributing, etc. My wife worked for a business where the owner's spouse would simply show up, yell at people, complain / point out tiny problems, and then leave.

One of my complaints about someone I used to work with was that they never had a complaint that would actually make the office a dollar.

 

[NatCh]

Your spouse will terrorize all your employees, and you won't be able to fire him or her for creating a toxic work environment.

 

[heybrother]

Your spouse will terrorize all your employees, and you won't be able to fire him or her for creating a toxic work environment.

Natch's wife offered him a job but he stood his ground and said "no, I won't do that to your staff. If you need me I'll be off on some mountain biking and occasionally practicing podiatry."

 

[NatCh]

It would take sometime to find true help from people who care, and then obviously they can leave as well.

Pay them well, treat them well.

You can't demand that someone care about your business but you can set the stage for them to arrive there on their own. Even then, be ready for them to leave at some point. To an employee it's just a job, not a lifetime commitment.

 

[NatCh]

Natch's wife offered him a job but he stood his ground and said "no, I won't do that to your staff. If you need me I'll be off on some mountain biking and occasionally practicing podiatry."

Ha! I like my style.

 

[619]

You can't demand that someone care about your business but you can set the stage for them to arrive there on their own. Even then, be ready for them to leave at some point. To an employee it's just a job, not a lifetime commitment.

Even a spouse is no longer a guaranteed lifetime commitment.

 

[619]

Just to add my 2 cents; Don't hire someone you can't fire. If you are ok with firing your spouse then I see no problem hiring him/her.

 

[Boba Foot]

Cons: you’ll have to split 50% of the practice and its assets after the divorce.

 

[icebreaker32]

Do it if you must......on a shoe string budget and your spouse can not make a good salary elsewhere. When it is no longer necessary, do not have your spouse work at the office.

 

[619]

Do it if you must......on a shoe string budget and your spouse can not make a good salary elsewhere. When it is no longer necessary, do not have your spouse work at the office.

What if she decides not to leave? You can't use your spouse during the early struggling phase of a practice and have he/she walk away when the practice begins to thrive and blossom. Never been in such situation but just thinking out loud. Hard to let go after getting a taste of power.

 

[NatCh]

Even a spouse is no longer a guaranteed lifetime commitment.

Yeah man. Imagine having marital problems while going to work together every damned day. Then you could lose a spouse AND your office manager all at once, followed by half of everything. Blahhhh.

 

[Feli]

Cons: you’ll have to split 50% of the practice and its assets after the divorce.

That's why you never get (legally) married in the first place.

Aside from obvious pitfalls mentioned, if my partner were to work at any job on my office, she'd be taking a 75-95% pay cut. That is not including bennies, stock shares, 401 match I wouldn't privide. Me thinks she would hard pass on that pkg.

 

[NatCh]

My brother-in-law is an orthopedic surgeon. I'm told that one of their employees threatened to sue over something and his wife's response was to tell that employee, "Go ahead. The rich always win." 🤢🤮

They're divorced now.

 

[icebreaker32]

What if she decides not to leave? You can't use your spouse during the early struggling phase of a practice and have he/she walk away when the practice begins to thrive and blossom. Never been in such situation but just thinking out loud. Hard to let go after getting a taste of power.

You are correct.....real hard to do. Only start in first place if you must because as you said hard to get them to leave and what is a good thing in the beginning is not longterm for marriage and staff. Very few doctor's wives are liked by staff.

I know a family doctor that would make more money, have more vacation and better benefits if employed by hospital.....I think one of the main reasons they have not joined is that the wife would be without job/power.

 

[air bud]

You guys are all sexist. What about the men that could be office managers?

 

[heybrother]

My brother-in-law is an orthopedic surgeon. I'm told that one of their employees threatened to sue over something and his wife's response was to tell that employee, "Go ahead. The rich always win." 🤢🤮

They're divorced now.

I want that on a t-shirt

 

[thefootfixer]

Early on when I was in school I thought it was almost necessary to have a power couple sail the ship. But now that I’ve been out for a while looking, I’m seeing it can go both ways.

Idk if having a spouse there to carry some of the load takes any real pressure off of the doctor. In this case the entire family’s success /failure depends on the practice. We all hope to succeed but there will downturns etc that are unavoidable.

That being said, if the spouse has another career that they make a good living with, it almost seems worth keeping that investment and finding someone else to help out with the practice. Again it’s about separating eggs into different baskets.

I tend to go back on forth on this topic.

Pro: 2 people, seems easier to manage , burden shared.

Con: all income tied into growing a practice, spousal career halted (unless he or she had no other option to begin with),

 

[NatCh]

That being said, if the spouse has another career that they make a good living with, it almost seems worth keeping that investment and finding someone else to help out with the practice. Again it’s about separating eggs into different baskets.

When my kids were little we would sometimes pay them for doing additional work beyond their normal duties. We called that "inside money."

When they would do jobs for others (e.g., babysitting someone else's kids) we called that "outside money."

They felt more satisfaction making outside money.

 

[NatCh]

You guys are all sexist. What about the men that could be office managers?

I made sure to say "spouse" rather than "wife."

 

[deleted1149159]

If you are a resident reading this and are looking at a practice where there is any family involvement in the business in any shape or form...RUN. Blood is thicker than water, and you will never get where you need to be in that practice. Ever.

 

[NatCh]

If you are a resident reading this and are looking at a practice where there is any family involvement in the business in any shape or form...RUN. Blood is thicker than water, and you will never get where you need to be in that practice. Ever.

Facts

 

[air bud]

If you are a resident reading this and are looking at a practice where there is any family involvement in the business in any shape or form...RUN. Blood is thicker than water, and you will never get where you need to be in that practice. Ever.

This is not exclusive to Podiatry by the way....I saw it with Ortho.

 

[dtrack22]

This is not exclusive to Podiatry by the way....I saw it with Ortho.

I think it’s exclusive to solo or small group private practice. Which now a days seems largely limited to podiatry. We have an interventional radiologist where I live that does extremity work who is solo and his wife works at the practice.

 

[NatCh]

I think it’s exclusive to solo or small group private practice. Which now a days seems largely limited to podiatry. We have an interventional radiologist where I live that does extremity work who is solo and his wife works at the practice.

A solo Radiologist? That's the first I've ever heard of that. Who knew???

 

[dtrack22]

A solo Radiologist? That's the first I've ever heard of that. Who knew???

Interventional. Yeah he was hospital employed, broke off built his own clinic and angio suite. Does endovascular work, kyphoplasty, some other interventional radiology things. Does everything in house from a non invasive work-up standpoint (which is nice because I don’t have to get any studies done prior to referral) and is 30 min from where I work, so most of our vascular folks go to him at first and then only go to vascular surgery if they need bypassed.

 

[NatCh]

Interventional. Yeah he was hospital employed, broke off built his own clinic and angio suite. Does endovascular work, kyphoplasty, some other interventional radiology things. Does everything in house from a non invasive work-up standpoint (which is nice because I don’t have to get any studies done prior to referral) and is 30 min from where I work, so most of our vascular folks go to him at first and then only go to vascular surgery if they need bypassed.

Wow

 

[dtrack22]

Wow

Yeah. He said he got a good deal on the angio suite equipment since he was the lead on securing new equipment for the hospital prior to leaving. But how much you think outfitting an angio suite cost? On top of the building which has office space, waiting area, patient rooms, diagnostic testing rooms, and then pre-op holding and post-op recovery? All for a single doc practice. We all should have been interventional radiologists…

 

[dtrack22]

We all should have been interventional radiologists…

Or take over the family’s dental device company like my neighbor who just bought a second home near @NatCh

On the bright side I’ve got access to it a week or so in the winter and then again in the summer for free, so I can go break my collarbone on a bike with him. Or tear an ACL again skiing.

 

[NatCh]

Yeah. He said he got a good deal on the angio suite equipment since he was the lead on securing new equipment for the hospital prior to leaving. But how much you think outfitting an angio suite cost? On top of the building which has office space, waiting area, patient rooms, diagnostic testing rooms, and then pre-op holding and post-op recovery? All for a single doc practice. We all should have been interventional radiologists…

That’s definitely a full send.

 

[thefootfixer]

Any docs out there WITH no spouse involvement care to chime in? How y’all run your practices ?

 

[deleted1149159]

This is not exclusive to Podiatry by the way....I saw it with Ortho.

Absolutely correct. Many small practices have this. Makes sense for the owner. Terrible for the other physician employees.

And I'll also add, any practice where the mistress works there, too...especially when there is no effort to hide the fact...

I knew of a practice where the wife worked there. Then the mistress worked within the office with the wife. Then the wife become the ex-wife and was fired. Mistress, now new wife, took over. RUN if this is what you hear/see. RUN fast. Not podiatry. Dentistry.

 

[NatCh]

Any docs out there WITH no spouse involvement care to chime in? How y’all run your practices ?

I have employees

 

[NatCh]

Or just took over our family’s dental device company like my neighbor who just bought a second home near @NatCh

On the bright side I’ve got access to it a week or so in the winter and then again in the summer for free, so I can go break my collarbone on a bike with him. Or tear an ACL again skiing.

Get those planks waxed up. It won’t be much longer! Photo from right now:

 

[ExperiencedDPM]

If you are a resident reading this and are looking at a practice where there is any family involvement in the business in any shape or form...RUN. Blood is thicker than water, and you will never get where you need to be in that practice. Ever.

Make that RUN a full SPRINT. The only way have a spouse “run” the practice is if you decide to keep it a small mom and pop operation.

Otherwise it’s completely inappropriate and toxic. The thought of working in an office as an employee in a practice run by my employers spouse actually causes shrinkage and terror.