Should I look into it?

[Osteopathinthemaking]

I have been posting a lot on SDN lately purely because it has taught me a tremendous amount which I am grateful for. As my poster name signifies I am extremely interested in D.O. but my scores are sub par I have already taken the MCAT twice without much improvement and although I have done informal post bacc at my undergrad and have stellar EC I know its not enough...but it may be enough for SGU or Ross which are the two schools in the Caribbean I am interested in due to experience with them (knowing physicians who attended, advisors etc)

so I am now considering it but I don't know if I even stand a chance there TO consider it my stats are: MCAT 1st try: 21 2nd try: 24 (balanced 7,8,9) and 3.35S 3.4C with a 3.95 undergrad all science 18 credits post bac factored in. Do I stand a chance there?

---

Members don't see this ad.

 

[gyngyn]

Getting in won't be a problem.
I've seen folks with way worse stats get into Ross, even recently.
Getting out (with a match) is a completely different question.

 

[deleted480308]

I'm coming by to drop my standard advice. If you can't get in a US school, don't be a doctor. Look at podiatry or something else. The risk of not getting a residency out of the carribean is too high for me to recommend it to you in good faith

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

Getting in won't be a problem.
I've seen folks with way worse stats get into Ross, even recently.
Getting out (with a match) is a completely different question.

I'm coming by to drop my standard advice. If you can't get in a US school, don't be a doctor. Look at podiatry or something else. The risk of not getting a residency out of the carribean is too high for me to recommend it to you in good faith

Thanks for your advice!

 

[the argus]

You will likely get into Ross, SGU possibly.

As for the residency match, this topic has been covered extensively on this forum. I think it's much more helpful to look at the actual stats than rely on ominous postings on an Internet forum. Here it is briefly for Ross and SGU,

1. 15-25% attrition rate (i.e. fail out of school)
2. Of those entering the match, 80-90% match. This is mostly in FM, IM, and psych. Those that don't match almost always have a major red flag (step failure, semester failure, etc) or tried for a more competitive specialty with no backup.

Ross and SGU both matched >800 people last year, so thats ~1700 people last year alone that will be licensed physicians that wouldn't be if they listened to the "standard advice" on this forum.

I'm not trying to sell you on Ross/SGU, I just think it's important to use data when making decisions. For those that don't make it through, the loan situation can no doubt be horrible. That said, Ross/SGU is definitely a viable option for many people every year.

 

[deleted480308]

OP, if you want to bet $300k on a 60% chance of getting matched (and that number is matching to anything, not even full residency...some of them are prelims that don't actually solve your problem) then you can make that bet. Just remember some people cared enough to warn you

 

[Medstart108]

I'm coming by to drop my standard advice. If you can't get in a US school, don't be a doctor. Look at podiatry or something else. The risk of not getting a residency out of the carribean is too high for me to recommend it to you in good faith

With the recent expansion in DO schools I tend to agree with this, however podiatry =/= medicine and I certainly would rather try again than become a podiatrist for the rest of my life, no offense podiatrists its not you its me.

 

[Wolf02]

I'm coming by to drop my standard advice. If you can't get in a US school, don't be a doctor. Look at podiatry or something else. The risk of not getting a residency out of the carribean is too high for me to recommend it to you in good faith

Absolutely correct. I went the Caribbean route. (Not even a big 3) and was very lucky to get matched. After my second try that is... If I could do it all over again..... Definitely wouldn't!

 

[WonderBoy]

I have been posting a lot on SDN lately purely because it has taught me a tremendous amount which I am grateful for. As my poster name signifies I am extremely interested in D.O. but my scores are sub par I have already taken the MCAT twice without much improvement and although I have done informal post bacc at my undergrad and have stellar EC I know its not enough...but it may be enough for SGU or Ross which are the two schools in the Caribbean I am interested in due to experience with them (knowing physicians who attended, advisors etc)

so I am now considering it but I don't know if I even stand a chance there TO consider it my stats are: MCAT 1st try: 21 2nd try: 24 (balanced 7,8,9) and 3.35S 3.4C with a 3.95 undergrad all science 18 credits post bac factored in. Do I stand a chance there?

OP, apply to DO school which have match rate of 99% if not 100% at most places. Apply to early DO schools forget about off shore schools, the risk of not matching and sweating during match time is not worth it. Touro NY has a masters programs you can look into if you get no traction during application cycle. I have seen what it does to people that have gone to the process. Yes people match from those off shore schools but you don't want to the person that doesn't match with 300k in loans. Good luck!

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

OP, apply to DO school which have match rate of 99% if not 100% at most places. Apply to early DO schools forget about off shore schools, the risk of not matching and sweating during match time is not worth it. Touro NY has a masters programs you can look into if you get no traction during application cycle. I have seen what it does to people that have gone to the process. Yes people match from those off shore schools but you don't want to the person that doesn't match with 300k in loans. Good luck!

With the recent expansion in DO schools I tend to agree with this, however podiatry =/= medicine and I certainly would rather try again than become a podiatrist for the rest of my life, no offense podiatrists its not you its me.

yeah podiatry is not for me and I dont believe that I am not cut out to be a doctor simply due to the MCAT i recognize that its going to take a tremendous amount of effort but I am 110% committed =)

I have applied early for DO to 13 schools but I am extremely STRESSED and pessimistic because even with the update of a 3.9 GPA in the last 18 credits I didnt get called off the WL for VCOM which I know is unlikely in itself but just panicked is all ~thank you so much for your input

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

just in closing I guess I am going to see how this cycle goes, if it goes negatively I am going to apply to a couple of post baccs/masters and caribbean school and see where it goes =)

 

[tartesos]

just in closing I guess I am going to see how this cycle goes, if it goes negatively I am going to apply to a couple of post baccs/masters and caribbean school and see where it goes =)

If you can't get into a us school this year, keep committed and apply again next year, not abroad, study again, take a prep course make your app stronger but please don't go the Caribbean route( this is coming from an img).

 

[22031 Alum]

I dont believe that I am not cut out to be a doctor simply due to the MCAT

Just remember that even though it seems like it now, the MCAT is not the end of standardized testing. It is just the beginning and it only gets harder. Struggling with it predicts struggling on Steps 1-3. Adding that red flag to IMG status makes your chances even worse than the stats quoted above- which, incidentally, ignore that Caribbean grads matching into their "specialty of choice" are forced to "choose" less desirable specialties, often in less desirable locations. "Choosing" FP when you'd actually rather be an orthopedic surgeon isn't the path to a happy life.

Long story short:
1) poor MCAT predicts poor performance on later tests which will affect your eventual chances of matching

2) Going Caribbean will close more doors for you than any other route.

 

[Skip Intro]

<snip>

Ross and SGU both matched >800 people last year, so thats ~1700 people last year alone that will be licensed physicians that wouldn't be if they listened to the "standard advice" on this forum.

Good overall post that I agree with, except for the bolded part.

There are a lot of people that get fired out of residency. And, it can be very hard to get back into residency depending on what you were dismissed for. In my residency class alone, we had one. She was an osteopathic grad. Anesthesia was not the right "fit" for her. She went into psych. She was lucky. If you don't finish residency and become ABMS certified as well as independently licensed, your chances of living and practicing where you want go down significantly.

That said, the stats about the Caribbean delivering this year were amazing, at least at the reputable schools. Ross and SGU both had record placements. That was for students who started in 2011.

I think the caveats all apply. But, to simply say "don't" in the promulgation of some nebulous fear is not honest or fair to the thousands - literally thousands - of doctors the Caribbean has produced over even just the past few years.

Is it hard work? Is it risky? Yes. But, if your trajectory is sound and you work hard, it is still do-able.

-Skip

 

[22031 Alum]

I think the caveats all apply. But, to simply say "don't" in the promulgation of some nebulous fear is not honest or fair to the thousands - literally thousands - of doctors the Caribbean has produced ov

By that logic, it's wrong of me to tell patients they shouldn't smoke while pregnant, because of the thousands of women who do so with no apparent harm to their babies.

Something doesn't stop being a bad idea because it happens to work out for some...

 

[Skip Intro]

By that logic, it's wrong of me to tell patients they shouldn't smoke while pregnant, because of the thousands of women who do so with no apparent harm to their babies.

Huh? What? No! Man, this is a horrible analogy and has nothing to do with this. Smoking is all risk, no reward. The reward here is that you get to become a doctor!

Something doesn't stop being a bad idea because it happens to work out for some...

If you look at the percentages of people who matriculate, eventually graduate. and place into residency, they are far greater than those who fail out (at least at the well-established schools). It doesn't just work out for "some". It works out for the majority.

To torture a different (and better) analogy, driving a car is risky; that's why you wear a seatbelt (or should, if you don't).

-Skip

 

[22031 Alum]

Huh? What? No! Man, this is a horrible analogy and has nothing to do with this.



If you look at the percentages of people who matriculate, eventually graduate. and place into residency, they are far greater than those who fail out (at least at the well-established schools). It doesn't just work out for "some". It works out for the majority.

To torture a different (and better) analogy, driving a car is risky; that's why you wear a seatbelt (or should, if you don't).

-Skip

Why is it a bad analogy? I could pull data from my hospital alone on thousands of women who smoked while pregnant and had perfectly healthy babies. We still know it's a bad idea to do so, as it increases the risk of a bad outcome. You can tell me about thousands of Caribbean grads who end up matching (let's pretend any match is the desired goal, not even first choice specialty), but the risk of a bad outcome is higher for Caribbean grads.

You edited to address my question. To a patient, the reward is a healthy baby without having to go through the annoyance of quitting. And lots of them - the majority even, since you want to focus on that- get exactly that. We with medical knowledge can say that's not a real reward, but I have plenty of patients who think that way.

If a pathway that worked out for me was constantly under criticism, I'd be inclined to defend it too. But let's not pretend that the existence of good outcomes makes it unfair to discuss the likelihood of bad outcomes. Especially for a candidate like OP who already has a track record of struggling on tests. Caribbean + poor Step scores would be lethal, or close to it.

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

Thank you all for your input. I can't say that I wasn't excepting lots of opinions here and I am appreciative of them. SDN is great because of this very reason, lots of info from both experiences and data.

 

[mcat_taker]

Why is it a bad analogy? I could pull data from my hospital alone on thousands of women who smoked while pregnant and had perfectly healthy babies. We still know it's a bad idea to do so, as it increases the risk of a bad outcome. You can tell me about thousands of Caribbean grads who end up matching (let's pretend any match is the desired goal, not even first choice specialty), but the risk of a bad outcome is higher for Caribbean grads.

You edited to address my question. To a patient, the reward is a healthy baby without having to go through the annoyance of quitting. And lots of them - the majority even, since you want to focus on that- get exactly that. We with medical knowledge can say that's not a real reward, but I have plenty of patients who think that way.

If a pathway that worked out for me was constantly under criticism, I'd be inclined to defend it too. But let's not pretend that the existence of good outcomes makes it unfair to discuss the likelihood of bad outcomes. Especially for a candidate like OP who already has a track record of struggling on tests. Caribbean + poor Step scores would be lethal, or close to it.

People generally go to the caribbean because they have a track record of struggling on tests (i.e. lower MCAT or GPA is why they are there in the first place, so whether OP has a "track record" of struggling or not on tests is not really unique to the candidate's profile). A majority match from the reputable schools regardless.

Throwing away all the data, I can anecdotally say that everyone I personally know who has gone to the caribbean matched, liked their decision, and recommended it (sample of around 8 people to the reputable programs). So to just blatantly tell OP not to do it, especially if you yourself didn't go through it is just wrong. the highest step 1 score ever I'm pretty sure recently came from a kid at SGU.

 

[22031 Alum]

People generally go to the caribbean because they have a track record of struggling on tests (i.e. lower MCAT or GPA is why they are there in the first place, so whether OP has a "track record" of struggling or not on tests is not really unique to the candidate's profile). A majority match from the reputable schools regardless.

Throwing away all the data, I can anecdotally say that everyone I personally know who has gone to the caribbean matched, liked their decision, and recommended it (sample of around 8 people to the reputable programs). So to just blatantly tell OP not to do it, especially if you yourself didn't go through it is just wrong. the highest step 1 score ever I'm pretty sure recently came from a kid at SGU.

Okay. I give up. You guys are right. Bad ideas become good ideas because 70% of people have things turn out fine. I'll remember that the next time I hear about a family member who did [insert bad idea] here, but "the baby was fine!" Bad outcomes being statistically more likely doesn't matter, as long as they still happen a minority of the time.

 

[mcat_taker]

Okay. I give up. You guys are right. Bad ideas become good ideas because 70% of people have things turn out fine. I'll remember that the next time I hear about a family member who did [insert bad idea] here, but "the baby was fine!" Bad outcomes being statistically more likely doesn't matter, as long as they still happen a minority of the time.

There is NO inherent benefit to smoking while pregnant. Like Skip said, the benefit of going to the caribbean is getting a chance to become a doctor that you otherwise would not have been able to become. That reflects a real, tangible benefit in that scenario.

 

[the argus]

ignore that Caribbean grads matching into their "specialty of choice" are forced to "choose" less desirable specialties, often in less desirable locations. "Choosing" FP when you'd actually rather be an orthopedic surgeon isn't the path to a happy life.

If this is the metric you are going to use, then you should also be posting in the osteopathic forum telling people not to go to DO schools as well. DOs and US-IMGs have extremely similar match profiles in the NRMP. They match into the same specialties and the same program tier within specialty.

The number of AOA residency positions in the more competitive fields (111 ortho, 20 neuro surg, 20 ENT, 20 urology, 18 ophtho, 49 derm) is exceedingly small compared to the total number of DO matriculants (5,788 first year enrollment in 2011, went through match this year). DO students also must "choose" less desirable specialties.

Again, I'm not trying to sell the OP on going to the caribbean. I've stated many times on this forum that people should exhaust all options (DO included) before going the caribbean route. I also think it's important to use facts and be realistic when discussing this topic.

If a pathway that worked out for me was constantly under criticism, I'd be inclined to defend it too. But let's not pretend that the existence of good outcomes makes it unfair to discuss the likelihood of bad outcomes.

No one is trying to hide the pitfalls of caribbean medical school, they are well documented on this site. The issue is that many of the people commenting on this issue are uninformed and make statements that just really have no basis in reality. Going to the caribbean is a much more realistic option than it is made out to be on this forum. It's ridiculous to me that people say things like this,

If you can't get in a US school, don't be a doctor.

when ~70% of people that go to Ross/SGU get residency positions. Just like the good outcomes don't cancel out the bad, the bad outcomes don't cancel out the good. And the majority of outcomes are good. Just blanketly saying "never go to the caribbean" is unthoughtful and lazy.

 

[deleted480308]

If this is the metric you are going to use, then you should also be posting in the osteopathic forum telling people not to go to DO schools as well. DOs and US-IMGs have extremely similar match profiles in the NRMP. They match into the same specialties and the same program tier within specialty.

The number of AOA residency positions in the more competitive fields (111 ortho, 20 neuro surg, 20 ENT, 20 urology, 18 ophtho, 49 derm) is exceedingly small compared to the total number of DO matriculants (5,788 first year enrollment in 2011, went through match this year). DO students also must "choose" less desirable specialties.

Again, I'm not trying to sell the OP on going to the caribbean. I've stated many times on this forum that people should exhaust all options (DO included) before going the caribbean route. I also think it's important to use facts and be realistic when discussing this topic.

No one is trying to hide the pitfalls of caribbean medical school, they are well documented on this site. The issue is that many of the people commenting on this issue are uninformed and make statements that just really have no basis in reality. Going to the caribbean is a much more realistic option than it is made out to be on this forum. It's ridiculous to me that people say things like this,when ~70% of people that go to Ross/SGU get residency positions. Just like the good outcomes don't cancel out the bad, the bad outcomes don't cancel out the good. And the majority of outcomes are good. Just blanketly saying "never go to the caribbean" is unthoughtful and lazy.

The last time i looked, the 70% was their match rate.....not remotely the same as the percentage of matriculants that make it to reaidency since their washout rates are so higj. Do you have other info?

 

[the argus]

The last time i looked, the 70% was their match rate.....not remotely the same as the percentage of matriculants that make it to reaidency since their washout rates are so higj. Do you have other info?

Yes. Ross/SGU have had first time match rates (i.e. recent grads in the match for the first time) of 80-90% in recent years. Attrition rates are 15-25%. I've posted previously where that 70% overall comes from, I'll repost it below

Exact numbers are hard to know because, as gyngyn pointed out, the schools do not make that info publicly available. I can only give you examples from my experience at Ross.

Ross starts 3 classes per year, each with 350-450 people (I believe SGU is similar in that they have 2 classes per year, each with 500-600 students). Ross is on a semester schedule, but they don't give summer vacation so you do the 4 basic science semesters in 16 months. This comes out to somewhere between 1100-1300 starting per year.

The attrition rate for my class was ~25%, so this will come out to ~900 people per year (i.e. 3 classes) applying to the match each year. Then you must add the additional people who are reapplicants from previous years (many of these are bad applicants from multiple previous years with little chance of matching, but some are strong applicants from the previous year that didn't match in more competitive fields and are reapplying in less competitive fields and will match)

Then you have an 80-90% first-time match rate (Ross' last year was 86%, which is from the mouth of Joseph Flaherty, Dean of Ross, who was previously the Dean of the University of Illinois COM before Ross poached him a few years ago).

Put this all together and you get ~800 grads in residency each year.

 

[deleted480308]

Yes. Ross/SGU have had first time match rates (i.e. recent grads in the match for the first time) of 80-90% in recent years. Attrition rates are 15-25%. I've posted previously where that 70% overall comes from, I'll repost it below

Soooooo, we are agreeing that getting in only gives someone a 70% chance of matching to a residency?

I call those crap odds for a $200k bet, but everyone's an adult and can roll those dice if they want. I will stick to advising against it

 

[W19]

so I am now considering it but I don't know if I even stand a chance there TO consider it my stats are: MCAT 1st try: 21 2nd try: 24 (balanced 7,8,9) and 3.35S 3.4C with a 3.95 undergrad all science 18 credits post bac factored in. Do I stand a chance there?

You might get ino DO with these stats if you apply to LUCOM, DCOM, WVSOM, VCOM (all campuses), BCOM, PCOM-GA, SOMA, ACOM etc...

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

You might get ino DO with these stats if you apply to LUCOM, DCOM, WVSOM, VCOM (all campuses), BCOM, PCOM-GA, SOMA, ACOM etc...

I applied to all of those schools except SOMA and I applied super early this cycle so we will see! I hope I can make the cut somewhere....I wonder if LUCOM has any regional bias...

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

Soooooo, we are agreeing that getting in only gives someone a 70% chance of matching to a residency?

I call those crap odds for a $200k bet, but everyone's an adult and can roll those dice if they want. I will stick to advising against it

I am not a gambler and those odds scare the hell out of me too. I am looking into a post-bac at LECOM but those can make or brake you even tho I have something to prove and will be working my ass off... I am also considering retaking the MCAT but a third score that could be average is even more scary...esp because I am now woking full time...

 

[W19]

I applied to all of those schools except SOMA and I applied super early this cycle so we will see! I hope I can make the cut somewhere....I wonder if LUCOM has any regional bias...

You most likely will get in. Forget about Caribbean! Your stats are good enough for low tier DO.

 

[tartesos]

And not to even think about the growing us grads in the coming future with no or little growth in residency spots. Those sgu + Ross numbers are sure to take a beating.
They will even be pressed to find clinical rotations in us in the future, not too distant.

 

[FumblyBumbly]

This site makes the Caribbean seems like the death knell for everyone who enters and for many, it is. But for just as many more, it is a pathway to becoming a doctor for those too impatient to pursue alternative means of boosting their application.

A number of my undergrad classmates (n =9) have just graduated from Carribean med schools (SGU and Ross) and they've all matched into residencies (FM and psychiatry). I know 70% chance of matching into a residency is a crazy gamble to put 300K+ on but my classmates never had any doubt that they would match and I didn't either. They were all capable but (hopefully previously) lazy students that had low GPAs but high MCAT scores. I think if they were not totally opposed to spending gap year or two to strengthen their application in some way, they could have just as easily made it into a US MD/DO school. So I suppose for these types of students, the match rate was about 90% because they were very unlikely to fail out in the first place.

Obviously you'll have to be brutally honest with yourself about why you don't have a US MD/DO ready application. If you're not that type of student, take heed because you'll be going up against such students that have not had any trouble at all with the SAT or the MCAT or the USMLE.

Also, I work closely with a residency program and I know an SGU grad that just matched into a top 5 residency field (one of the crazy competitive ones). The thing is, their father is a program director in one such program and called into a bazillion favors to get this done. Even then, the grad had to spend a few years toiling in a few research positions before it happened. According to the grad, they know a lot of the other SGU grads that made it into such competitive programs and surprise, it was always the influential parent calling in a few favors.

I thought I would mention this here because every so often, someone mentions the handful of Caribbean grads that manage to match into one of the top 5 residency fields and no one ever seems to tell them that it's all a crock of ****.

 

[ThoracicGuy]

This site makes the Caribbean seems like the death knell for everyone who enters and for many, it is. But for just as many more, it is a pathway to becoming a doctor for those too impatient to pursue alternative means of boosting their application.

A number of my undergrad classmates (n =9) have just graduated from Carribean med schools (SGU and Ross) and they've all matched into residencies (FM and psychiatry). I know 70% chance of matching into a residency is a crazy gamble to put 300K+ on but my classmates never had any doubt that they would match and I didn't either. They were all capable but (hopefully previously) lazy students that had low GPAs but high MCAT scores. I think if they were not totally opposed to spending gap year or two to strengthen their application in some way, they could have just as easily made it into a US MD/DO school. So I suppose for these types of students, the match rate was about 90% because they were very unlikely to fail out in the first place.

Obviously you'll have to be brutally honest with yourself about why you don't have a US MD/DO ready application. If you're not that type of student, take heed because you'll be going up against such students that have not had any trouble at all with the SAT or the MCAT or the USMLE.

Also, I work closely with a residency program and I know an SGU grad that just matched into a top 5 residency field (one of the crazy competitive ones). The thing is, their father is a program director in one such program and called into a bazillion favors to get this done. Even then, the grad had to spend a few years toiling in a few research positions before it happened. According to the grad, they know a lot of the other SGU grads that made it into such competitive programs and surprise, it was always the influential parent calling in a few favors.

I thought I would mention this here because every so often, someone mentions the handful of Caribbean grads that manage to match into one of the top 5 residency fields and no one ever seems to tell them that it's all a crock of ****.

The bolded portion is the most concerning. People going to the Caribbean think they are saving time instead of improving their app for a year or two. It's not uncommon for Carib students to end up taking an extra year in school or an extra year or two trying to match. Perhaps they end up starting residency at the same time they would coming out of a US program, but now they have the stigma of the Carib program to deal with.

 

[crotchrocketer]

I have said this before and I'll say it again. The least important stat when considering Caribbean med school (at the top 3/4 schools) is pass rate. The pass rate SHOULD be everyone else, not you. Look into other factors; rotation sites, island, person desire, willingness to accept the stigma, other options available to you... People will fail because they were never qualified to be doctors to begin with. Are you qualified to be in medical school?? Only you can answer this question. I may ask if you actually understand the deeper concepts, able to string information together and problem solve without too much directing? Is critical thinking one of your strengths?? (Rhetorical questions FYI). I for one and I know many that agree, believe that failing a student may be tragic for that individual but honestly better for the quality of the product overall. Sounds a bit harsh, but we are talking about reality here.

 

[nazpawz]

I have been posting a lot on SDN lately purely because it has taught me a tremendous amount which I am grateful for. As my poster name signifies I am extremely interested in D.O. but my scores are sub par I have already taken the MCAT twice without much improvement and although I have done informal post bacc at my undergrad and have stellar EC I know its not enough...but it may be enough for SGU or Ross which are the two schools in the Caribbean I am interested in due to experience with them (knowing physicians who attended, advisors etc)

so I am now considering it but I don't know if I even stand a chance there TO consider it my stats are: MCAT 1st try: 21 2nd try: 24 (balanced 7,8,9) and 3.35S 3.4C with a 3.95 undergrad all science 18 credits post bac factored in. Do I stand a chance there?

Take the MCAT again! if you have your heart set on osteopathic medicine you won't be happy in allopathic! don't dismiss yourself before actually getting rejected by an admission committee! try again!apply again!

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

Take the MCAT again! if you have your heart set on osteopathic medicine you won't be happy in allopathic! don't dismiss yourself before actually getting rejected by an admission committee! try again!apply again!

I have my heart set on becoming a physician, while i love the philosophy of DO I believe I can embody those principles (sans omt) in my work as a doctor. Are you pro Caribbean?

 

[tartesos]

I have my heart set on becoming a physician, while i love the philosophy of DO I believe I can embody those principles (sans omt) in my work as a doctor. Are you pro Caribbean?

The only people pro Caribbean are the ones that have gone there and not even all of us!
Do your 1000% to go in USA.
Good luck!

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

The only people pro Caribbean are the ones that have gone there and not even all of us!
Do your 1000% to go in the USA.
Good luck!

I take it you went? lol by pro-Caribbean I mean they don't advocate for it just that they have something more positive to say than beware of the black hole of debt and disappointment

 

[tartesos]

I take it you went? lol by pro-Caribbean I mean they don't advocate for it just that they have something more positive to say than beware of the black hole of debt and disappointment

I went in my home country that happens to be in the Caribbean( D R) abut it's not referred to when they say Caribbean here( usually that refers to English speaking islands).

As an img no matter where you go( training), it's an upside hill to move forward, although not impossible( yet) why would you not try and avoid this?

 

[Mad Jack]

yeah podiatry is not for me and I dont believe that I am not cut out to be a doctor simply due to the MCAT i recognize that its going to take a tremendous amount of effort but I am 110% committed =)

I have applied early for DO to 13 schools but I am extremely STRESSED and pessimistic because even with the update of a 3.9 GPA in the last 18 credits I didnt get called off the WL for VCOM which I know is unlikely in itself but just panicked is all ~thank you so much for your input

You should have applied much more broadly. With your stats I'd say 20 schools and you'd probably get a bite.

If you end up not doing so well this cycke, I'd recommend PA school or another career in medicine over going South- match rates for IMGs are going to plummet in the coming years, and you don't want to have Carib debt with no match, it will literally ruin you forever.

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

You should have applied much more broadly. With your stats I'd say 20 schools and you'd probably get a bite.

If you end up not doing so well this cycke, I'd recommend PA school or another career in medicine over going South- match rates for IMGs are going to plummet in the coming years, and you don't want to have Carib debt with no match, it will literally ruin you forever.

Thanks, I am planning on doing a post bacc /retaking mcat if this cycle doesnt work out, i did apply to 13 schools this time I appreciate the advice!

 

[Mad Jack]

Thanks, I am planning on doing a post bacc /retaking mcat if this cycle doesnt work out, i did apply to 13 schools this time I appreciate the advice!

Like I said, 13 isn't enough. Broad is 20+.

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

yeah I totally get that, however I applied to 13 schools including all lower tier and a few mid tier ones. Im sure you know how expensive it is and I dont see the point of applying to higher tier schools that will DEFF not accept a 24 mcat.. if I am missing something tho please let me know

 

[Mad Jack]

yeah I totally get that, however I applied to 13 schools including all lower tier and a few mid tier ones. Im sure you know how expensive it is and I dont see the point of applying to higher tier schools that will DEFF not accept a 24 mcat.. if I am missing something tho please let me know

Well, you never know what a school will see in you. Some of the newer schools may have averages near 26-27, but they take their fair share of 23s along the way. Even at my school, where our average is somewhere around 28, I know a few 23s that were traditional students our adcoms saw potential in. I know it's expensive, but losing a year is more expensive still, so hedge your bets and hope for the best.

Also, I would strongly recommend either LECOM or Touro-NY's postbaccs to you. Touro's is shorter, and would be my preference were I you, but LECOM's is almost guaranteed to take you and fairly inexpensive.

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

Well, you never know what a school will see in you. Some of the newer schools may have averages near 26-27, but they take their fair share of 23s along the way. Even at my school, where our average is somewhere around 28, I know a few 23s that were traditional students our adcoms saw potential in. I know it's expensive, but losing a year is more expensive still, so hedge your bets and hope for the best.

Also, I would strongly recommend either LECOM or Touro-NY's postbaccs to you. Touro's is shorter, and would be my preference were I you, but LECOM's is almost guaranteed to take you and fairly inexpensive.

Thanks so much! I ws looking into LECOM's and I have heard mixed reviews so we shall see lol I dont know much about touro though

 

[Mad Jack]

Thanks so much! I ws looking into LECOM's and I have heard mixed reviews so we shall see lol I dont know much about touro though

Trouble with LECOM's is the whole two year thing. Other than that, you're pretty much guaranteed to get in.

 

[Osteopathinthemaking]

Trouble with LECOM's is the whole two year thing. Other than that, you're pretty much guaranteed to get in.

Maybe I havent done my research thoroughly enough but LECOM's post bacc is two years??

 

[ConfusedChemist]

ok here's my 2 cents
given that you've struggled with the MCAT, more than once, how confident are you that you can jump from the bottom percentiles (of the same group of med students/pre meds) to at least the middle of the pack on USMLE1?
I don't mean to be rude, etc.
But if it were me, that'd be my biggest fear. you NEED a good Step1 score if you go carib. Realistically, a great score.
I'd need to prove to myself first I could do it

 

[chloesilverado]

ok here's my 2 cents
given that you've struggled with the MCAT, more than once, how confident are you that you can jump from the bottom percentiles (of the same group of med students/pre meds) to at least the middle of the pack on USMLE1?
I don't mean to be rude, etc.
But if it were me, that'd be my biggest fear. you NEED a good Step1 score if you go carib. Realistically, a great score.
I'd need to prove to myself first I could do it

Yes and no. Look at the numbers. You don't need a great score to match as an American IMG. The mean Step 1 score for American IMGs matching in FM was __.

It's completely doable. So long as you pass Step 1, apply broadly, and if you REALLY want to practice medicine in America, it can happen.

 

[ConfusedChemist]

Yes and no. Look at the numbers. You don't need a great score to match as an American IMG. The mean Step 1 score for American IMGs matching in FM was __.

It's completely doable. So long as you pass Step 1, apply broadly, and if you REALLY want to practice medicine in America, it can happen.

yeah...I guess I'm in the Canadian mindset
IMG is literally a death sentence for practicing in Canada, so they end up trying to get a visa to the US as an IMG which isn't so easy

 

[NewHorizons]

yeah...I guess I'm in the Canadian mindset
IMG is literally a death sentence for practicing in Canada, so they end up trying to get a visa to the US as an IMG which isn't so easy

I wouldn't go so far as to say a death sentence.... but it's pretty dismal.

Looking through the CaRMS matching this year approximately 25% students from all international schools got matched back in Canada (this includes both those who graduate that year and those who didn't match the first time). I didn't read it much more to dissect the numbers.