POUNDED on COMLEX II

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hooperg

hooperg

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Anyone else get totally and utterly slammed on COMLEX II? From those at my school with whom I've spoken that took form B09C specifically, their exam scores were terrible too.

Anyone else have problems with B09C? I was 150 points lower on Step 2 than Step 1 :thumbdown:
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DaveinDallas said:
Yet so many of the programs use 650 as a cutoff for those of us who took the COMLEX only. I can't tell you the number of times I've been told 'no joy' by programs, even for a 4th year clerkship with average COMLEX scores. I too walked out of Level 1 thinking,"Nothing could have prepared me for that one".....and I was hitting 72% on the Kaplan Q bank for Step 1. I really wish I had known about COMBANK then. Probably would have been a different story.....
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What hasn't been said is that many programs including Osteopathic programs are willing to forgive a bad COMLEX score if you have a high USMLE score. Usualy these programs with cutoffs will allow you to replace your COMLEX score with the USMLE if it's high enough (210>). For the people who failed COMLEX, I would study hard for the USMLE. Although the USMLE is more difficult, it's also more fair and correlates better with preparation than the COMLEX. I know many in my class that scored over 220 on the USMLE II and were scoring 400's on the COMLEX II.
 
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It'sElectric said:
Are you talking about osteopathic programs? I've never heard of such a cutoff, nor have I heard of anyone having trouble scheduling an away simply because their comlex didn't pass the sniff test.
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There are certain EM programs in Texas that wouldn't let me schedule a clerkship as they 'were just too competitive and most of the osteopathic applicants had Level I scores in the 650s'......wound up applying for a clerkship anyway and was rejected so fast that the department admin (who had been very encouraging BTW) didn't even know I had been reviewed.....

Another program in Texas has let it be known in no uncertain terms that I'll be going up against candidates with mid-600s and stand a very small chance of getting in with an average COMLEX score....in spite of the other things like hustle, ability to work with people, good patient care, etc......
 
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badgerred said:
What hasn't been said is that many programs including Osteopathic programs are willing to forgive a bad COMLEX score if you have a high USMLE score. Usualy these programs with cutoffs will allow you to replace your COMLEX score with the USMLE if it's high enough (210>). For the people who failed COMLEX, I would study hard for the USMLE. Although the USMLE is more difficult, it's also more fair and correlates better with preparation than the COMLEX. I know many in my class that scored over 220 on the USMLE II and were scoring 400's on the COMLEX II.
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Ok, I probably won't be able to go back and take Step 1 - too far away from the material anyway by now.....and Step 2 is too late to make it in for ERAS apps starting in September.....but is there a good score predictor out there for the USMLE? Like UWorld percentages or NBME practice tests?.....For step 2?
 
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DaveinDallas said:
Ok, I probably won't be able to go back and take Step 1 - too far away from the material anyway by now.....and Step 2 is too late to make it in for ERAS apps starting in September.....but is there a good score predictor out there for the USMLE? Like UWorld percentages or NBME practice tests?.....For step 2?
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Even if you don't include your score in ERAS, if you have the score in hand, you can still call the programs and fax your score to be included in your file particularly if it's a high score that better represents your abilities. I know allopathic programs are never shy about receiving USMLE scores since many are still skeptical of the COMLEX even if they are used to accepting DO sctudents; they still prefer their own test if possible. And based on what I've heard from friends at Osteopathic programs, DO programs also like the USMLE because many of their students and residents are aware of how poorly written the COMLEX is. Just because they are at a DO program, the people who are at those programs don't bleed NBOME; they care less about politics and more about quality care just like any other program whether they are ACGME or AOA!

Yes, there are several threads regarding NBME exams and UWorld scores correlation to USMLE scores. I think there is a large 30+ page thread on this forum about that. Check it out. Also, you are not required to take USMLE Step 1 before USMLE Step 2 if you are an osteopathic student. You can take them out of order.
 
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DaveinDallas said:
There are certain EM programs in Texas that wouldn't let me schedule a clerkship as they 'were just too competitive and most of the osteopathic applicants had Level I scores in the 650s'......wound up applying for a clerkship anyway and was rejected so fast that the department admin (who had been very encouraging BTW) didn't even know I had been reviewed.....

Another program in Texas has let it be known in no uncertain terms that I'll be going up against candidates with mid-600s and stand a very small chance of getting in with an average COMLEX score....in spite of the other things like hustle, ability to work with people, good patient care, etc......
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Unfortunately, this is likely a result of the fact that they wanted you to take the USMLE. More and more and more EM programs are pretty much (some even explicitly saying it) asking that osteopathic applicants take the USMLE. Them telling you that your less than 650 comlex score wouldn't be enough is code for...."shoulda taken the usmle".

That sucks even still, so I'm sorry to hear that.
 
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wingbowlchamp3 said:
i'm pretty fed up with the nbome. all of the comments about the ambiguity and worthlessness (what's with all the legal questions?) of the questions are spot on. i was lucky and did well on this b09 c exam (627) after doing the same on step I...

but i failed the humanistic part of the pe.

i don't even care what my grades or scores are to be honest. i work harder to keep myself "outside of the bubble" by following news, sports, and politics. i care about being professional. i especially care about treating my patients like they're my friends...not just names on a list that we're trying to get rid of.

now i have to spend $1,000 proving it in a completely dehumanized setting...with no idea of what exactly i did wrong the first time.
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I'm right there with you. I am also a very personable and professional individual who failed the humanistic portion of the PE, but I have the opportunity to be videotaped at my school completing an OSCE and to be critiqued by the Clinical Medicine professors. I'm also gonna work with one of the Family Medicine professors on site at the school for a week. Plus I'm planning to read a prep book or two that I didn't read prior to the first exam. I have no clue what they are looking for, but I hope I can come through with whatever it is on my retake. :xf:
 
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northtexdoc2010 said:
I'm right there with you. I am also a very personable and professional individual who failed the humanistic portion of the PE, but I have the opportunity to be videotaped at my school completing an OSCE and to be critiqued by the Clinical Medicine professors. I'm also gonna work with one of the Family Medicine professors on site at the school for a week. Plus I'm planning to read a prep book or two that I didn't read prior to the first exam. I have no clue what they are looking for, but I hope I can come through with whatever it is on my retake. :xf:
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I used First aid for the PE which is pretty good. I also looked at Kaplan but didn't like it as much as First aid.

Also I hear that the MDs are getting rid of the PE in the next few years. They are waiting to break even on the cost by running it for a few more years and then will terminate it. The DOs just started the PE In 2004 I think. We are always 8 steps behind but hopefully we'll catch up soon and end this crappy test as well.
 
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Just took the comlex today - no clue how I did, but that's par for the course with this exam. While there were plenty of random medicolegal questions (full of garbage I've either never learned, or pushed out of my memory bank), there definitely were no more than 1 or 2 per section.

Plenty of random questions, like I expected. Too much cranial. OMM questions were definitely tougher than I expected (overall, exam was much more random, and therefore tougher than COMSAE B). It's just a very confusing exam, full of questions where they tell you "A, B, C", then ask for "Z", if that makes sense. They definitely expect you to make assumptions in order to answer some of the questions.

So who knows, hopefully I don't fall into the trap of form B09C, which it sounds many people have.

I studied for both the USMLE and COMLEX using UWorld (past 2 weeks purely) and Secrets/B&W throughout the year.

Took COMSAE B yesterday - 650. But like I said (and many others apparently have as well), COMSAE was nothing like my COMLEX exam.

Any questions, let me know.
 
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It did seem to be pretty heavy in Ob/Gyn, so maybe look through that one last time. But like I said, the questions can be so random, it may not matter. I only studied OMM for a day, but maybe looking through cranial a little more thoroughly might have been beneficial (if you really want to torture yourself with that).
 
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ComicBookHero20 said:
honestly, if my score changes, i really will not care about the loss of money
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I passed the exam but want to send for a re-score as my score dropped by alot. Is it possible to get a change to a lower score or even a fail after getting a re-score? Because that would be devastating!
 
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WannaPassGas said:
I passed the exam but want to send for a re-score as my score dropped by alot. Is it possible to get a change to a lower score or even a fail after getting a re-score? Because that would be devastating!
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this question and the concern that follows it justifies, why i shouldnt pay another $50 for a rescore. If u passed, run with it. If u failed, then send for a rescore. NBOME will eat and swallow the extra few dollars u gt left.
 
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I have been hearing of this dreaded B09C quite a bit from students throughout my school. Many dropped 100 + points from their step 1 scores and studied the same or more. I'm actually frightened to take this thing on thursday if I lose 100 points I wont pass. Does anyone know if this exam is still in rotation at the end of August or how many different forms there are. Even if i don't get this form I'd like to be able to help. If anyone rescored and their grade changed a fair amount please let me know so I can pass the message around.
 
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Scorcher31 said:
I have been hearing of this dreaded B09C quite a bit from students throughout my school. Many dropped 100 + points from their step 1 scores and studied the same or more. I'm actually frightened to take this thing on thursday if I lose 100 points I wont pass. Does anyone know if this exam is still in rotation at the end of August or how many different forms there are. Even if i don't get this form I'd like to be able to help. If anyone rescored and their grade changed a fair amount please let me know so I can pass the message around.
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I sent in my rescore request last week. Haven't heard anything yet.

Also I went and had a chat with our GME and made her aware of the situation at hand. Applications haven't really started pouring in yet but she will keep an eye out and said that it will be interesting to see if a large number of applications will show such a great discrepancy in scores since so many of us got rocked. She also said that when something like this happens (i.e. wide scale problems with test scores/ exams etc), the program directors and usually aware of it and most take it into consideration.
Has anyone else spoken with their GMEs or academic counselors?
 
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wildsimmer said:
I sent in my rescore request last week. Haven't heard anything yet.

Also I went and had a chat with our GME and made her aware of the situation at hand. Applications haven't really started pouring in yet but she will keep an eye out and said that it will be interesting to see if a large number of applications will show such a great discrepancy in scores since so many of us got rocked. She also said that when something like this happens (i.e. wide scale problems with test scores/ exams etc), the program directors and usually aware of it and most take it into consideration.
Has anyone else spoken with their GMEs or academic counselors?
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no word on rescore yet over here either

our clinical education guys--they said that a lot of people bombed this one from our school. they said don't worry about applications--kinda mulled over it
 
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how long does it usually take to upload the exam status on the nbome website? i took the exam yesterday and was just curious if i had the infamous B09C.

i would describe my exam as good and bad. i thought the first 4 blocks i had were fair, well worded, and actually some good usmleworld type questions. 2 of my last 4 blocks were poor questions and very vague for the most part. LOTS of cranial, much more than i expected, some simple sacrum and somatic dysfunction, only 1 or 2 how do u treat this. also, neuro, obgyn, and peds made up a significant portion. i was kind of disappointed at the lack of medicine on the exam. i figured that would be the meat of the exam, but i was wrong. most of my medicine questions were worked into somatic dysfunction questions and not first step in management or diagnostic test. hopefully, i did well and achieved my goal of 600, we will see. good luck to all and usmle at the end of the week and im done.


PS- didnt do comsae bc i was told it didnt correlate and wasnt like the real test. i used usmle world, secrets, and read some step up to medicine for areas i can never seem to master.
 
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did anyone hear anything from the nbome on the re-scoring process and if we have a legitimate shot at our scores changing (for the better, presumably)?

I heard that the nbome says that they do not curve their exam, and that there is a fixed # correct that equates to passing, meaning that it does not matter who takes the test before or after, it has no reflection on the grade changing

does anyone know anything that can help elucidate this?
 
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I heard that the nbome says that they do not curve their exam, and that there is a fixed # correct that equates to passing, meaning that it does not matter who takes the test before or after, it has no reflection on the grade changing
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If this is in fact true, then that's just absolutely asinine. The USMLE standardizes you against ALL previous exam takers.

NBOME can't really be that foolish.....can it???
 
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How much biostatistics (sensitiviy, specificity, etc) was there on this B09C Comlex II version?
 
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It'sElectric said:
If this is in fact true, then that's just absolutely asinine. The USMLE standardizes you against ALL previous exam takers.

NBOME can't really be that foolish.....can it???
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i think the nbome is essentially keeping it's lips sealed on this whole process, and well that's fair on their part because it is a private organization

as far as i can surmise, this comlex 2 exam was a debacle on a huge level and i just hope the majority of us do not have to retake it, but it does not seem likely
 
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Someone in my class called the NBOME about the infamous B09c form. They said that everyone taking the exam within the time period of the current new release of scores (I assume meaning June/July) was given B09c. I pray my score changes after rescore.
 
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kltiger13 said:
Someone in my class called the NBOME about the infamous B09c form. They said that everyone taking the exam within the time period of the current new release of scores (I assume meaning June/July) was given B09c. I pray my score changes after rescore.
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did they say anything about the rescore? like it's going to change or they are seriously looking at the statistics for the exam and seeing what changes need to be done?
 
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tony montana said:
How much biostatistics (sensitiviy, specificity, etc) was there on this B09C Comlex II version?
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Very little.

wmc24 said:
how long does it usually take to upload the exam status on the nbome website? i took the exam yesterday and was just curious if i had the infamous B09C.
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The form you took shows up when your grade is posted - took over 5 and a half weeks for my grade to show up; yours might show up faster.
 
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thanks for the response. also, anyone ever not respond to the survey at the end? i clicked out of it by accident yesterday. i wonder if i will be deducted 100 points for not doing it :eek:
 
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Hi I was wandering if anybody else took the exam this week and what they suggest for the rest of us folks about to take it? Thanks!
 
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FWIW, I know someone that took it yesterday and she said it was very straightforward medicine - quite a change from form B09C.

SURVIVOR25 said:
Hi I was wandering if anybody else took the exam this week and what they suggest for the rest of us folks about to take it? Thanks!
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I just took the exam on 8/17. I have absolutely no idea what form exam I ended up taking but after reading the comments prior, I higly doubt it was the seemingly disastrous B09c. The exam I took seemed very straightforward. As previously stated there was more OMM than expected and future exam takers would be well advised to spend at least a day with the Savarese book or comparable. I had very little surgery. Most questions were very short (ie 2-3 lines) and most did not require lab values. Overall, I thought the exam was much easier than the first. I took USMLE step2 earlier this month and that exam was significantly more difficult and well written than the COMLEX2, but I've come to expect what I got from the NBOME at this point. I did have roughly 5 very random questions per block that included medical law and some OMM specifics I had never seen.

I really hope all of you who are battling with NBOME regarding the B09c exam continue to let your complaints be heard, as it sounds extremely unfair and irresponsible on their part to let an exam so poorly written influence the future of physicians carrying their degree. Best of luck.
 
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Can everyone keep us updated on the B09C.....How are you guys going about this? I took the exam but I do not know how/what I can do.
 
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Took the test today, thought it was fairly straightforward for the most part. I had a ton of OB/Gyn and mom's bringing their kids in for random ****. It was still a poorly written, crappy test that didn't really test my medical knowledge. I finished in 4 hours flat.

I got this overall feeling that the question writers give you some common problem then ask you to figure out what remedy their grandmother used on them when they were growing up.

-shrug-

We'll find out in many weeks. I'm sure my USMLE Step 2 scores (taking next week) will be back by the time COMLEX Step 2 scores are released. :rolleyes:
 
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USArmyDoc said:
Can everyone keep us updated on the B09C.....How are you guys going about this? I took the exam but I do not know how/what I can do.
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Did you fail too?



Took the test today, thought it was fairly straightforward for the most part. I had a ton of OB/Gyn and mom's bringing their kids in for random ****. It was still a poorly written, crappy test that didn't really test my medical knowledge. I finished in 4 hours flat.

I got this overall feeling that the question writers give you some common problem then ask you to figure out what remedy their grandmother used on them when they were growing up.

-shrug-

We'll find out in many weeks. I'm sure my USMLE Step 2 scores (taking next week) will be back by the time COMLEX Step 2 scores are released.
Click to expand...





Glad to hear more recent tests seem to be different than that B09c nightmare
 
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isotope1979 said:
I took the B09C exam and got the average for my results on the COMSAE A and B exams. I improved 100 points form my Level 1. The B09C exam is not evil.
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I've been told by a friend who contacted NBOME that B09C is not a particular form, rather it is just a code for Step 2.

This seems to make some sense, as the previous poster just took Step 1 and his "form" was A09C. I looked at mine from last year and saw that it was A08C. It seems that the "form" code goes something like this:

B09C
| | |
| | +--- arbitrary bull**** letter to make "form" code look more genuine
| +--- year in which test was taken
+-- A = step 1, B = step 2, C = step 3

So rather than B09C being a unique selection of questions, it is just an identifier for "step 2". In fact, the selection of stupid questions seems to vary widely. Yesterday, I had some of the stupid questions I was warned about but not nearly as many as others who have recently taken it. I think it was just luck of the draw. I'm sure when my score comes up it will also say "B09C".

Just thought I'd mention..
 
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