PGY-III Ortho Resident considering Financial Assistance Program (FAP)

[Strategy]

Hello everyone,

I am a current PGY-III at an Orthopedic Surgery program interested in pursuing military medicine. As a medical student, I had considered HPSP (and was accepted), but did not sign because I wanted to keep my options open and wanted to be able to pursue the specialty training of my choice. 6 years later, I am almost halfway through residency in orthopedics and am glad I made the decision I did. However, my interest in the military still stands and so I am considering the FAP opportunity to do so.

My interests lie in Ortho Trauma and Arthroplasty. I am single. I am interested in the military to be able to serve my country, travel, practice in austere environments, and gain a unique experience that I could obtain on the civilian side. I am NOT interested in a life long career in the military. I understand I will likely fall behind my classmates from a monetary standpoint if I joint and I am okay with this.

A couple questions:

1. I have considered taking FAP now and then deferring fellowship until after my payback is complete (2-3 years max). As I said above I would most likely do trauma. Thoughts on this vs. the traditional route of FAP throughout residency and fellowship and then payback?
2. My first interest is the Navy, can anyone speak to Ortho as it differs between the three branches?
3. I am concerned about skill atrophy. What could I potentially do to prevent this and how real is this problem?
4. Is there anything else I should know?

Thank you for your time.

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[DrMetal]

Hello everyone,

I am a current PGY-III at an Orthopedic Surgery program interested in pursuing military medicine. As a medical student, I had considered HPSP (and was accepted), but did not sign because I wanted to keep my options open and wanted to be able to pursue the specialty training of my choice.

Smart choice. Are you interested in doing a fellowship? Does FAP allow you to do a fellowship, or will you be forced to serve as a general orthopedist first? If you want to a fellowship, might be a good idea to just continue going at it on your own. Join when you're done, consider the reserves.

 

[Atlas Shrugged]

3. Not join the military.

How much money are you getting via FAP? This is an absolutely terrible financial decision when comparing the average orthopedic surgery salary on the civilian side. Professionally, basically no surgeons in the department of defense are operating with frequency anywhere near their peers, to the point that the surgeons themselves don't even feel competent. Although arthroplasties appear to be an exception: https://www.usnews.com/news/nationa...military-surgeons-skills-preparedness-for-war

 

[MCCareer.org]

I would recommend that you complete any fellowship you want before you join the Navy. Once you are in, it can be hard to get fellowships.

 

[DMBandFan86]

Consider waiting until fellowship is complete and joining the reserves. Can keep a great civilian salary and still deploy often. Avoid all the active duty crap and skills atrophy. There are civilian employers that offer annual military leave and would recommend you find a military friendly place to work as you will deploy fairly often. Best of both worlds.

 

[Strategy]

FAP allows fellowship. It would basically be viewed as another year of residency from the military standpoint.

 

[Strategy]

Smart choice. Are you interested in doing a fellowship? Does FAP allow you to do a fellowship, or will you be forced to serve as a general orthopedist first? If you want to a fellowship, might be a good idea to just continue going at it on your own. Join when you're done, consider the reserves.

FAP allows fellowship. It would basically be viewed as another year of residency by the military.

 

[Strategy]

3. Not join the military.

How much money are you getting via FAP? This is an absolutely terrible financial decision when comparing the average orthopedic surgery salary on the civilian side. Professionally, basically no surgeons in the department of defense are operating with frequency anywhere near their peers, to the point that the surgeons themselves don't even feel competent. Although arthroplasties appear to be an exception: https://www.usnews.com/news/nationa...military-surgeons-skills-preparedness-for-war

$45k / year and $2k / month stipend while being sponsored. Like I said I would only do this for 1-2 years meaning my payback would only be 2-3 years (payback = # of years sponsored +1). It would be a short stint in the military and I know I could make much more civilian side.

 

[Strategy]

Consider waiting until fellowship is complete and joining the reserves. Can keep a great civilian salary and still deploy often. Avoid all the active duty crap and skills atrophy. There are civilian employers that offer annual military leave and would recommend you find a military friendly place to work as you will deploy fairly often. Best of both worlds.

Hmm this does seem an appealing option. Do you know where I can find out more information about this. How long are typical contracts and what capacities are you deployed in?

Thank you all.

 

[SirGecko]

$45k / year and $2k / month stipend while being sponsored. Like I said I would only do this for 1-2 years meaning my payback would only be 2-3 years (payback = # of years sponsored +1). It would be a short stint in the military and I know I could make much more civilian side.

I think (don’t have reference to quote though) that you would need to do three years minimum no matter what your education obligation is. (Just a thing to consider)

Also just be aware when calculating your salary you would not be eligible for a multi year retention bonus. You would just get the ortho incentive pay. I’ve seen people mislead by recruiters that don’t understand how special pays work before.

 

[Radishguy]

I would recommend that you complete any fellowship you want before you join the Navy. Once you are in, it can be hard to get fellowships.

Hard to get fellowships because of the military or the program? Just trying to see what kind of an impact joining reserves or guard during medical school would have on my ability to match or get the fellowship I want after.

 

[SirGecko]

Hard to get fellowships because of the military or the program? Just trying to see what kind of an impact joining reserves or guard during medical school would have on my ability to match or get the fellowship I want after.

Hard because the military doesn’t allow as many fellowships as the civilian sector. If you are reserves I think you have more control over your training (though the military may still use you as a generalist) but I’d defer to someone with reserve experience.

 

[armytrainingsir]

Join the reserves when you finished your training. All of it. At that point you will get your fill of military medicine rather quickly as an orthopedist.
In my experience, seeing how the army reserve works, I don’t think you’ll ever be put in a position where your fellowship training would be fully utilized with the exception of trauma. Deployed orthopedic surgery, again from my perspective and minimal experience, is splinting, washouts, ex-fixes, evac out of theater.

 

[AvrgPreMedKid]

Just wait until you're done training then pick up a CRITICALLY SHORT WARTIME ACCESSION BONUS (CSWSAB).
It's 400k for a 4-year service obligation for ortho.

Defense Finance and Accounting Service > MilitaryMembers > payentitlements > Pay Tables > HPO2

 

[Strategy]

Just wait until you're done training then pick up a CRITICALLY SHORT WARTIME ACCESSION BONUS (CSWSAB).
It's 400k for a 4-year service obligation for ortho.

Defense Finance and Accounting Service > MilitaryMembers > payentitlements > Pay Tables > HPO2

Does this routinely become available? Is it only for the Navy? Thanks