Ortho Match Day

[ItsGavinC]

But the AAO does not...

Very true. I was just using that example to make a point. It might also be said that the AAO has a vested interest in not increasing the number of ortho programs.

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[DDSSlave]

...It might also be said that the AAO has a vested interest in not increasing the number of ortho programs.

It might, if not for the enthusiastic accreditation and welcoming of legitimate new programs such as San Antonio.

 

[delicious]

Douche is at it again! How many times are we going to let this douche post until we take away his SDN privilege? God, what I would give to smack this douche just once.

Are you serious man?! That post prompted you to say I should have my SDN privileges taken away!!

Yah-E: are you still bitter about that "dental terminology thread". Hey man, I had a good laugh, but I've gotten over it. So should you! I pity the fool who doesn't get over that thread.

Oh yeah, semper ubi sub ubi is a philosophical statement, or theory if you will that I take to heart. I've been insulted on this thread so I'm not going to disclose its meaning.

 

[delicious]

Yah-E, I have changed my signature. This is not as a token of goodwill towards you. After thinking things through - negative statements like that really don't fit in with my philosophy of "semper ubi sub ubi." I know that if I tried making a nice gesture towards you, you would just spit in my face and call me a douche. Remember this: jesus died for you Yah-E.

 

[uicd2]

eh, no big deal... there are ways to get out of contracts... like if they, uh, are forced to fire you, heheh....

OEC are proprietary residencies that require the students to agree to 7 year contracts to work for OCA after they are out. if you break the contract you owe him $1 million.

 

[rocknightmare]

http://www.proz.com/?sp=h&id=311620

 

[delicious]

http://www.proz.com/?sp=h&id=311620

What can I say? I just feel very strongly about always wearing underwear. But this goes much deeper than always wearing underwear: I mean, its very existential - almost transcendent to worldly views.

 

[rocknightmare]

What can I say? I just feel very strongly about always wearing underwear. But this goes much deeper than always wearing underwear: I mean, its very existential - almost transcendent to worldly views.

i was only meaning to give a literal translation. i am sure it has meanings more important than we all ever know. As you say it is a way of life and if that is so then it is more complex than we can define on face value.

 

[delicious]

i was only meaning to give a literal translation. i am sure it has meanings more important than we all ever know. As you say it is a way of life and if that is so then it is more complex than we can define on face value.

Oh man, I'm just joking!!

Semper (always) ubi (where) sub (under) ubi (where)
Always wear underwear!!!

There's nothing complex or deep about this. It's just a stupid little thing latin students use to remember those words.

Now, I brace myself for extreme flaming from Yah-E and others for posting this useless information and wasting everyone's time. But hey, this wouldn't have started had nobody taken my initial joke about lazarra seriously. [I mean really: I want to kill lazarra, give me a break.] I make absolutely no apologies.

 

[delicious]

**flame Shields On!!!!!**

 

[texas_dds]

can we pleeeeeease talk about ortho?

 

[kato999]

for those who matched, are you going to pursue a Masters if it is an option in your program?

why or why not?

 

[BlueToothHunter]

I've just sent away my deposit today for Vanderbilt! My bank account is a wee bit lighter now!

 

[...]

can one apply for mutiple specialties?
esp. for ortho. seems the results come out earlier than others
if one does not get in, can he/she apply for others?
just curious

 

[texas_dds]

can one apply for mutiple specialties?
esp. for ortho. seems the results come out earlier than others
if one does not get in, can he/she apply for others?
just curious

its a bad idea, if not impossible. the exception is aegd/gpr - you can apply to those in addition to ortho, etc. there are 2 phases to match: dec 6th is ortho, jan 31st is pedo/oms/gpr/aegd - so expect a bunch more match threads around then.

 

[texas_dds]

3 reasons im doing a masters in ortho:
1-its required at the school im going to
2-i only applied to places where it was required because (honestly!) I love research and want my thesis to be taken seriously if not published
3-none of the OEC programs give a masters. just for this i think it is important to do one.

 

[tinker bell]

What is so attractive about being an orthodontist, that makes orthohopeful try extremely hard. And be wiiling to go through so many hoops to get in? All I can think of is less work (as your DA does them all, like an assembly line). Call me ignorant, but I don't think money is that great consider you have to do loads of work from dschool to ortho school, heartache of matching, headache of applying , etc..... Let's hear your reasoning.

 

[delicious]

What is so attractive about being an orthodontist, that makes orthohopeful try extremely hard. And be wiiling to go through so many hoops to get in? All I can think of is less work (as your DA does them all, like an assembly line). Call me ignorant, but I don't think money is that great consider you have to do loads of work from dschool to ortho school, heartache of matching, headache of applying , etc..... Let's hear your reasoning.

Yes, less work is an issue. Also, I like that it is not invasive (i.e. you're not doing any cutting or drilling). I think that also, people generally have a more positive experience at the orthodontist. Most people don't like visiting their dentist, but orthodontists help people look better and so it's not so negative.

With all specialty applications you're gonna have the headache of applying, and heartache of matching. Ortho's the best!!

 

[SuperSecretary]

I'm curious everyone: How many of you got into your first choice? Second? Third?

 

[texas_dds]

I'm curious everyone: How many of you got into your first choice? Second? Third?

i got my first

 

[Tarheel]

If you go to www.natmatch.com they posted some of the statistics for this years match. Of those who matched:
165 received their first choice,
42 received their second choice,
14 received their third choice,
12 received their fourth choice,
4 recieved their fifth choice,
6 people matched to a school they ranked sixth or higher.

Hope that helps.

 

[Jediwendell]

looks like if you don't get your first or second choice your chances go down substantially. but im no statistician.

 

[delicious]

If you go to www.natmatch.com they posted some of the statistics for this years match. Of those who matched:
165 received their first choice,
42 received their second choice,
14 received their third choice,
12 received their fourth choice,
4 recieved their fifth choice,
6 people matched to a school they ranked sixth or higher.

Hope that helps.

Whoa! Tarheel, thanks for the website. How did you find this company? Pretty obscure. Once again, thanks. Looks like half the people who apply to Match get a spot. Pretty comforting. If now I could only stop loafing on SDN and start studying.

 

[Qbankungfumasta]

If you go to www.natmatch.com they posted some of the statistics for this years match. Of those who matched:
165 received their first choice,
42 received their second choice,
14 received their third choice,
12 received their fourth choice,
4 recieved their fifth choice,
6 people matched to a school they ranked sixth or higher.

Hope that helps.

So... if you matched on your 4th or higher, does that mean that the school ranked you very high? That you were incredibly lucky?
You guys did a great job with the forum...I hope to meet you at the meetings next year.

 

[delicious]

You guys did a great job with the forum...

Thanks kungfumasta!

 

[Jediwendell]

Whoa! Tarheel, thanks for the website. How did you find this company? Pretty obscure. Once again, thanks. Looks like half the people who apply to Match get a spot. Pretty comforting. If now I could only stop loafing on SDN and start studying.

Remember, delicioso, that match only uses those people that rank at least one school in their statistics. Many more people apply to ortho spots each year than 504.

 

[kato999]

do you think there were close to a 1000 applicants this year? I have heard it is normally 800-900 but was wondering if anyone knew.

 

[uicd2]

i don't get it. why would you NOT rank a school on your list?

Remember, delicioso, that match only uses those people that rank at least one school in their statistics. Many more people apply to ortho spots each year than 504.

 

[delicious]

Remember, delicioso, that match only uses those people that rank at least one school in their statistics. Many more people apply to ortho spots each year than 504.

I don't understand what you mean here. Okay, some schools use match and some don't right? Those schools that use match don't have some other way for people to apply. 504 people applied via match; people that didn't use match aren't gonna get into these match schools. But some people that use match also apply via other school specific methods; and some may turn down matches to go to those schools. So, if anything - your chances are better than half because some people that match won't go to match schools. I don't want to overanalyze this though.

 

[ItsGavinC]

I don't understand what you mean here. Okay, some schools use match and some don't right? Those schools that use match don't have some other way for people to apply. 504 people applied via match; people that didn't use match aren't gonna get into these match schools. But some people that use match also apply via other school specific methods; and some may turn down matches to go to those schools. So, if anything - your chances are better than half because some people that match won't go to match schools. I don't want to overanalyze this though.

No, in order to rank a school you have to interview there. So, when Jedi says "Remember, delicioso, that match only uses those people that rank at least one school in their statistics...," she is saying that the MATCH stats are only based on those students that interview.

If there are 1,000 students who applied to Ortho programs but did not get a single interview, then they can't rank any programs, and are therefore not included in the MATCH stats.

 

[delicious]

No, in order to rank a school you have to interview there. So, when Jedi says "Remember, delicioso, that match only uses those people that rank at least one school in their statistics...," she is saying that the MATCH stats are only based on those students that interview.

If there are 1,000 students who applied to Ortho programs but did not get a single interview, then they can't rank any programs, and are therefore not included in the MATCH stats.

Oooohhh... I get it. thanks gavin. So, I guess your chances aren't as good as I had thought. Dammit!!!!

 

[tjb]

i don't get it. why would you NOT rank a school on your list?

If you do not like a program you do not rank it. For a 2-3 year ortho program it's not that bad, for a 6 year OMS residency it could be torture to be in a bad program.

tjb

 

[delicious]

If you do not like a program you do not rank it. For a 2-3 year ortho program it's not that bad, for a 6 year OMS residency it could be torture to be in a bad program.

tjb

Wait... there are 2 year ortho programs. Can anybody list those schools?



[I nominate this the most informative thread I have ever viewed.]

 

[texas_dds]

my personal favorite 2 year program is Iowa
another i know someone at is UDetroit-Mercy

but MANY are 26 and 27 months which is pretty close (baylor, oklahoma, houston to name a few)

 

[texas_dds]

so, it looks like if you get at least one interview and can participate in match, you have a 50/50 chance of being matched and of those, a 50/50 chance of getting your first choice.

 

[kato999]

i think minnesota and uop are two years or pretty close

 

[SuperSecretary]

so, it looks like if you get at least one interview and can participate in match, you have a 50/50 chance of being matched and of those, a 50/50 chance of getting your first choice.

Not quite: You are probably interviewing with 20 others for maybe 4 spots. Plus it depends on the interview. If you blow it, you don't have a 50/50 chance at anything. The school has to rank you too, don't forget.

 

[delicious]

my personal favorite 2 year program is Iowa
another i know someone at is UDetroit-Mercy

but MANY are 26 and 27 months which is pretty close (baylor, oklahoma, houston to name a few)

Does anyone know of a 2-year program in the northeast?!

 

[gryffindor]

Not quite: You are probably interviewing with 20 others for maybe 4 spots. Plus it depends on the interview. If you blow it, you don't have a 50/50 chance at anything. The school has to rank you too, don't forget.

I think it's hard to truly "blow" an interview. You really would have to say or do something really really bad. Otherwise I think they classify those 20 people as "these are the 4 we really want, these are the 3 we definitely don't want, and the other 13 we'll just put somewhere in the middle." Basically if you get an interview, it's still a 50% chance of matching because there are candidates with only 1 interview who get in and candidates with several interviews (I've seen those with 6, 7, 8, 9, 11 interviews) who don't.

The "trick" to matching successfully is to get at least one of your interview schools to rank you in their top x number of spots, where x = the number of residents in the first year class. Then, as long as you put that school somewhere on your rank list, you will get in, regardless of whether it was your first choice or you last choice. If two schools put you high up on their list of x spots, then you will get into the school you have higher up on your list.

 

[ItsGavinC]

so, it looks like if you get at least one interview and can participate in match, you have a 50/50 chance of being matched and of those, a 50/50 chance of getting your first choice.

In theory, and only if you apply to every school that particpates in the match.

 

[SuperSecretary]

In theory, and only if you apply to every school that particpates in the match.

And again, only if you don't blow your interview. And yes, you can totally blow an interview. What no one seems to understand is that a school might interview 30 people, but only rank 10. It's impossible to put odds on whether or not you'll match, even if only in theory. You could even rock your interview, but the other residents might not like you, or you could rub a staff person the wrong way and that knocks you out of the running. Just as you probably don't rank every school you interview with, the schools definitely do not rank everyone they interview.

 

[toofache32]

I think it's hard to truly "blow" an interview. You really would have to say or do something really really bad.

You would be surprised. Your numbers get you the interview, then you have to prove you can speak english and carry on a conversation. I remember the ortho director at my dental school talking about an applicant who said he wanted to do ortho because you don't have to work as hard as oral surgery. Not the right answer for any specialty.

 

[BlueToothHunter]

I know of at least two people who were the nicest, humblest and easy-going Type B students with top notch grades and boards failed to match. It's amazing how these guys could blow their interviews. They had from 4 to 8 interview offers. May be it was the interview stress that made them blurt things as silly as "ortho is easier than oral surgery"? Isn't this kinda like when guys go out on a first date? We think and we prepare notes 1 week in advance. And at the first date, we blow it totally by saying something so embarassing and doing something so silly... (as in "There's Something About Mary") all because of the stress of 'trying to be perfect'? Too bad if it happened too frequently... like during orthodontic interview...

 

[jpollei]

Congrats Texas_DDS, and any of the rest of you who got in. It is competetive...I'll find out first hand this next go round. Would those who got in be willing to list the schools they applied to and interview at (and where they did their DDS/DMD)? I'm sure a bunch of us would appreciate it.

Oh, and OEC IS that bad...

 

[JakeMUSC]

You would be surprised. Your numbers get you the interview, then you have to prove you can speak english and carry on a conversation. I remember the ortho director at my dental school talking about an applicant who said he wanted to do ortho because you don't have to work as hard as oral surgery. Not the right answer for any specialty.

Toofache32.....i just wanted to tell you your avatar is hilarious....

 

[shopaholic]

Congrats Texas_DDS, and any of the rest of you who got in. It is competetive...I'll find out first hand this next go round. Would those who got in be willing to list the schools they applied to and interview at (and where they did their DDS/DMD)? I'm sure a bunch of us would appreciate it.

Oh, and OEC IS that bad...

Hello, newcomer here. I've been reading SDN for a couple of months, but this is my first time writing. I've read posting after posting about how OEC is going to ruin the profession that I'm almost afraid to post. Why? Because next year I will be taking a scholarship from OEC. So my question is why do so many SDNers fear/hate me so much? I do not feel that I am compromising myself in anyway, and after visiting both Colorado and Jacksonville, I have no doubt that I'm going to get a top notch education from an accredited school. I applied to my own school's ortho program expecting at least a courtesy interview, but instead only got a courtesy letdown. They brought me in and told me that I was not going to get an interview and that OEC would be a better option for me if I wanted. The director even said that he thought the concept was good. Maybe he was just kidding, but I took him seriously...and next year I'll be starting my residency.

 

[dort-ort]

Hello, newcomer here. I've been reading SDN for a couple of months, but this is my first time writing. I've read posting after posting about how OEC is going to ruin the profession that I'm almost afraid to post. Why? Because next year I will be taking a scholarship from OEC. So my question is why do so many SDNers fear/hate me so much? I do not feel that I am compromising myself in anyway, and after visiting both Colorado and Jacksonville, I have no doubt that I'm going to get a top notch education from an accredited school. I applied to my own school's ortho program expecting at least a courtesy interview, but instead only got a courtesy letdown. They brought me in and told me that I was not going to get an interview and that OEC would be a better option for me if I wanted. The director even said that he thought the concept was good. Maybe he was just kidding, but I took him seriously...and next year I'll be starting my residency.

First of congrats on your OEC spot. Right off I will tell you that I am 100% against OEC. I have made numerous posts regarding my opinions so I won't rehash it here.

Its very tough to comment on your statements above in a way that you will understand why OEC will be detrimental to your career. Actually I can't. My comments will probably end up sounding philisophical or seemingly nonconstructive resulting in you waving it off. And thats ok. However, I will try to cut to the chase.

I can't tell you OEC is bad and make any impact on you (or anyone else in your position as there will always be people who want to do ortho and are not accepted into a traditional program and will take any action necessary to meet their ambition to learn ortho - resulting in agreeing to OEC) so I won't try. You are an adult and understand by now that decisions you make will only you be responsible for. I will submit to you however that after you finish your OEC residency -- and in your 2nd or 3rd yr. practicing for an OEC office (and remember you are indentured for 7 yrs.) - will you then and only then understand why it is detrimental to you. Mark my word on this.

The answer involves where you will see yourself at that point in your career in comparison to others: Points of frustrations are listed below (caveat: this is my opinion only (albeit an experienced one) so it is not set in stone and please feel free to wave it off -- however -- I can still say them and tell those who wish to read it to mark these words.

Frustrations that you may encounter will involve your freedom (be it clinical or not---example: you will not be able to spontaneously get up and tell staff that you will be off to Cancun for 3 days or be with the wife and kids - although this doesn't happen in private practice much also, however you still have the freedom to do it if you want -- this is what I mean by freedom -- its life freedom), loss of sense of self-fulfillment in achieving something you build and its very fulfilling (you will not be able to have this euphoric sense unless you have your own practice - this is hard to convey as you have never had your own practice and won't for 7 years), obvious financial frustrations (this of course is relative to your orthodontic colleague - and this one will grow on you and make the years go by very slow all 7 of them), frustration over sense of entitlement -- that is -- its your work and you should reap the rewards for it not someone else, and etc and etc, and etc. ALRIGHT- I will stop pontificating. And who's to say I am wrong? Many there are that will say I am wrong. I am ok with it. It is only my humble opinions I echoe and reverberate.

You know, the nice thing about life is that you are free to chart its course base on personal goals, ambition, and desires. And it would be nice if that were true throughout life. However, there are times in life where we are faced with limited choices and our decisions are made for us under the blinding view of innocence.


hope that helps. best of luck.

 

[BlueToothHunter]

... next year I will be taking a scholarship from OEC. So my question is why do so many SDNers fear/hate me so much? I do not feel that I am compromising myself in anyway, and after visiting both Colorado and Jacksonville, I have no doubt that I'm going to get a top notch education from an accredited school.

Congratulations! Feel free to post all your experiences with OEC programs. I wonder if you will be joining us during GORP sessions?

Happy Holidays everyone!

 

[adamlc18]

Hello, newcomer here. I've been reading SDN for a couple of months, but this is my first time writing. I've read posting after posting about how OEC is going to ruin the profession that I'm almost afraid to post. Why? Because next year I will be taking a scholarship from OEC. So my question is why do so many SDNers fear/hate me so much? I do not feel that I am compromising myself in anyway, and after visiting both Colorado and Jacksonville, I have no doubt that I'm going to get a top notch education from an accredited school. I applied to my own school's ortho program expecting at least a courtesy interview, but instead only got a courtesy letdown. They brought me in and told me that I was not going to get an interview and that OEC would be a better option for me if I wanted. The director even said that he thought the concept was good. Maybe he was just kidding, but I took him seriously...and next year I'll be starting my residency.

If you don't mind sharing, what are your stats? What school do you go to, what is your class rank/GPA, Board Part I scores. Also where did you apply for ortho and interview?

And How many faculty are there at the program you will be attending? You didn't mention which OEC program you will be at. And how does this number of faculty compare with the number of faculty per resident at a traditional program? Thanks.

 

[gryffindor]

Congrats shopaholic on starting an ortho program next year. Please keep us updated on your experiences since many of us don't really know what the OEC programs actually entail and only speculate on these boards.

At least your school was nice enough to give you a courtesy let down rather than wasting your time. I've been told by some practitioners that I should consider the OEC. Now being on the unsuccessful applicant end twice and seeing that the OEC is a 2 year program, it's starting to sound like a possibility.