Ortho in San Diego

[Ohdarkthirty]

If i want to to orthopedics in the navy, will some one tell me what my residency will be like as far as intern year, GMO tours, what i need to apply for?

do i apply for ortho and then do that straight through or do i have to apply for surgery and then reapply for ortho after GMO tour?

can anyone give me some numbers as far as competitive board scores for ortho in san diego?

if anyone has any insight on the program that would be much appreciated as well.

thanks.

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[orbitsurgMD]

If i want to to orthopedics in the navy, will some one tell me what my residency will be like as far as intern year, GMO tours, what i need to apply for?

do i apply for ortho and then do that straight through or do i have to apply for surgery and then reapply for ortho after GMO tour?

can anyone give me some numbers as far as competitive board scores for ortho in san diego?

if anyone has any insight on the program that would be much appreciated as well.

thanks.

You should apply first for a deferment, unless you really don't want to be trained as an orthopedist right away (and you should want to be trained right away). If you are not allowed a deferment, usually you will have to do a year as a surgery intern, during which you can apply for an ortho spot the following year. Few are successful at this, but the declaration of your interest won't hurt you. You should count on then at least one tour as a GMO/FS/DMO. During your GMO tour, you should continue to apply for ortho every year until you are either accepted or you get sick of the Navy and decide to leave at the end of your EAOS. You should be mindful of the timing for application to civilian programs while you are on active duty.

Ortho is competitive even though the residencies in the Naval hospitals are not as busy as those in better civilian centers. Depending on the strength of your application, your chances may be better on the outside.

 

[Ohdarkthirty]

You should apply first for a deferment, unless you really don't want to be trained as an orthopedist right away (and you should want to be trained right away). If you are not allowed a deferment, usually you will have to do a year as a surgery intern, during which you can apply for an ortho spot the following year. Few are successful at this, but the declaration of your interest won't hurt you. You should count on then at least one tour as a GMO/FS/DMO. During your GMO tour, you should continue to apply for ortho every year until you are either accepted or you get sick of the Navy and decide to leave at the end of your EAOS. You should be mindful of the timing for application to civilian programs while you are on active duty.

Ortho is competitive even though the residencies in the Naval hospitals are not as busy as those in better civilian centers. Depending on the strength of your application, your chances may be better on the outside.

What do I have to do to get a deferment? it is starting to look better and better. From the GME website it sounds like I need a "valid personal reason" or "the needs of navy have to match with what i want" to get the deferral.

Also if I apply for a deferment as my first choice, will I still be able to get on the surgery track at the medical center that I want? or will I automatically get blacklisted for preferring a non-naval residency?

 

[backrow]

These responses have been pretty spot on so far. As of right now (this is if applying to a Navy Ortho residency as I have no clue on deferrments) you would apply to an Ortho track internship at NNMC, Portsmouth, or San Diego. After completing that internship you would then be sent to do at least one GMO tour (ranges from 1-3 yrs each tour). You would then reapply for your ortho PGY2 year.

Now with that being said, I have personally heard from a fairly reliable source (Navy Ortho attending) that the Navy Ortho program is slowly going to the straight through training model. It is my understanding that they will slowly be transitioning from everyone doing a GMO tour to nobody doing a GMO tour. He said that there would be about 2 slots for that track this year, and each subsequent year it would increase by one or two until all the slots were going straight through.

Hope this helps. BTW San Diego is the most competitive for ortho residency IMO.

 

[TommyJohn]

I rotated at NMCP and NMCSD in ortho this fall. Both rotations were excellent, but NMCP ended up being by my favorite of the 2 programs... didactics were more structured and the volume seemed higher. With that said, I ranked deferment as my first choice and was granted a full deferment. I agree with backrow's post about the Navy transitioning to straight through training...was told multiple times at both facilities that this was the trend (madated by the RRC) although it was going to take some time for that to fully occur. The Navy now only takes the number of interns in ortho they have gme 2+ slots for... ie 11.

As far as the deferment goes... I can only say what I did. (I would have been very happy training with the Navy, but deferment was the best option for me.) In mid summer, we were informed there were app. 40 people wanting to do ortho with 11 Navy slots and an anticipated 10 deferments (which increased to 12). I did 2 Navy aways and worked hard at both. My rotation at NMCP has been my best one of 4th year... great people... great experience. At all my Navy interviews I informed them that I was most likely going to be ranking full deferment first although I would be happy to train Navy. I also sat down with my attendings and talked about pros and cons of each route, got letters of rec from each and included them in my GME1 packet. A week before selection board, I also contacted the PD's and Specialty leader one last time to notify them of my final rank list. The last thing I did was email my list of civilian interview offers for inclusion in my packet.

I've read posts on here about doing aways... not doing aways... getting noticed... not getting noticed...etc. I think it's important to be known to the Navy programs since you need the support of the PD's in order to get a deferment. As with any away.. work hard and do a good job. If they had decided to pick me up for Navy GME and not grant the deferment, I would have been very happy, since it would have been an ortho slot (win-win situation in my book.) By working hard I ended up with good letters that I've used for my civilian application and those letters get mentioned at every interview. Another important thing is to be competitive in the civilian match. I'm guessing the more interview offers you have from quality programs by the time selection board rolls around... the better your odds are.

Hope this helps.

 

[hammena1]

I have heard the same thing that backrow and tommyjohn have heard about transitioning to straight through training. I know that Dec 04 selection comittee put a NMCSD intern into PGY-2 ortho training. I was told NMCSD would likely take 2 this year (Dec 05 comittee) and Bethesda was going to take 1. I am interested if anyone knows the real numbers.

I think that if your application and aptitude on Navy ortho rotations leaves the selection board reps (find out who they are while you are at Navy rotations!) inclined to believe that you can match in the civilian world, you will most likely get a deferment if you want one.

I matched in the Navy this past year and tips for matching in the Navy are the same as anywhere else; have an adequate application and work your butt off when you show up.

 

[SquidDoc]

I rotated at NMCP and NMCSD in ortho this fall. Both rotations were excellent, but NMCP ended up being by my favorite of the 2 programs... didactics were more structured and the volume seemed higher. With that said, I ranked deferment as my first choice and was granted a full deferment. I agree with backrow's post about the Navy transitioning to straight through training...was told multiple times at both facilities that this was the trend (madated by the RRC) although it was going to take some time for that to fully occur. The Navy now only takes the number of interns in ortho they have gme 2+ slots for... ie 11.

As far as the deferment goes... I can only say what I did. (I would have been very happy training with the Navy, but deferment was the best option for me.) In mid summer, we were informed there were app. 40 people wanting to do ortho with 11 Navy slots and an anticipated 10 deferments (which increased to 12). I did 2 Navy aways and worked hard at both. My rotation at NMCP has been my best one of 4th year... great people... great experience. At all my Navy interviews I informed them that I was most likely going to be ranking full deferment first although I would be happy to train Navy. I also sat down with my attendings and talked about pros and cons of each route, got letters of rec from each and included them in my GME1 packet. A week before selection board, I also contacted the PD's and Specialty leader one last time to notify them of my final rank list. The last thing I did was email my list of civilian interview offers for inclusion in my packet.

I've read posts on here about doing aways... not doing aways... getting noticed... not getting noticed...etc. I think it's important to be known to the Navy programs since you need the support of the PD's in order to get a deferment. As with any away.. work hard and do a good job. If they had decided to pick me up for Navy GME and not grant the deferment, I would have been very happy, since it would have been an ortho slot (win-win situation in my book.) By working hard I ended up with good letters that I've used for my civilian application and those letters get mentioned at every interview. Another important thing is to be competitive in the civilian match. I'm guessing the more interview offers you have from quality programs by the time selection board rolls around... the better your odds are.

Hope this helps.

How did you end up getting written civilian offers before the civilian match was up? I thought that military match came up before the civilian match? Anyways congrats on scoring ortho!

 

[TommyJohn]

How did you end up getting written civilian offers before the civilian match was up? I thought that military match came up before the civilian match? Anyways congrats on scoring ortho!

Interview offers... not position offers. Civilian interview offers usually start rolling out at some point in October.

 

[SquidDoc]

Interview offers... not position offers. Civilian interview offers usually start rolling out at some point in October.

Oh, I see. I was not aware that I could use those as an indicator...
So what happens if you are granted a full deferment by the Navy, yet end up not getting a spot at one of your perspective programs? Do you then have to take a 1 year deferment, followed by GMO?