Opps!! Michael Moore did it again

[sejin8642]

Here comes another documentary called "Sicko" by Michael Moore. The movie is about criticism of our healthcare systems and problems. I still don't know details about the movie but it's going to be interesting I guess. Does anyone know what the movie is about specifically?

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[TomWestmanRules]

I won't be able to catch Michael Moore's new pile of crap. I have more important things to do like clip my toenails, stare at blank wall for a few days, and scrub my car with a toothbrush.

 

[viciouz]

I heard its about insurance, and how they avoid treating people and its inefficient. And he touches a little on universal care.

 

[ssquared]

I believe it is about HMOs.

He also tried to go to Cuba to prove a point about how they have the same life expectancy as us, but about a fourth of the spending on healthcare.

The movie will be released June 29th. I like Michael Moore, but I think I might have to go see Ratatouille first.

 

[maestro1625]

I believe it is about HMOs.

He also tried to go to Cuba to prove a point about how they have the same life expectancy as us, but about a fourth of the spending on healthcare.

The movie will be released June 29th. I like Michael Moore, but I think I might have to go see Ratatouille first.

I plan on watching it up at Showcase West in Flint, Michigan, where it will once again receive a standing ovation...

... I thought he lacked focus with Fahrenheit 911, but Bowling for Columbine was done really well, and it showed a good amount of my morning commute to HS in the first grade shooting scene

 

[da8s0859q]

I won't be able to catch Michael Moore's new pile of crap. I have more important things to do like clip my toenails, stare at blank wall for a few days, and scrub my car with a toothbrush.

What he said (minus the toothbrush bit - I'm anal enough about my car without having to buff out toothbrush-induced scratches. )

 

[kdburton]

Here comes another documentary called "Sicko" by Michael Moore. The movie is about criticism of our healthcare systems and problems. I still don't know details about the movie but it's going to be interesting I guess. Does anyone know what the movie is about specifically?

spin spin spin spin. Michael Moore is an idiot

 

[rpm]

Wow and to think some of you people are going to be future docs in charge of the healthcare system. You haven't even seen the movie yet and are complaining about it. I didn't like F9-11 as it was full of some spin but this one actually looks interesting. The movie isn't about being on the right or left but about healthcare for everyone and how insurance companies are screwing us over. A number of people all across the political spectrum stated that and despite Moore's political affiliations, praised the movie. So do yourselves a favor and watch it before criticizing it.

 

[Decicco]

socialism=bad
competition=good
michael moore=3 years from a heart attack

 

[maestro1625]

socialism=bad
competition=good
michael moore=3 years from a heart attack

oversimplify much?

but of course you are aware that the current drug setup in medicare lacks competition... oh you knew that. ok.

I love pseudolibertarians.

 

[Kikaku21]

I'm not a big M. Moore fan. But he does get people talking, and therefore, a discourse on the subject. Americans are so polarized that they don't talk about issues anymore. Its nice to have someone promoting conversation, even if they are a little over the top.

 

[msundi83]

oversimplify much?

but of course you are aware that the current drug setup in medicare lacks competition... oh you knew that. ok.

I love pseudolibertarians.

A true libertarian would scrap medicare outright. Maybe he feels that way, he didn't say.

 

[Dookter]

You know what I like about Moore? He shows some of the things that we don't see all the time. Sure he is totally biased in his opinions.... but you can still see some things brought into the spotlight that we maybe should be talking about more.

 

[scgroat]

This thread is probably going to get shut down pretty soon, but I'll go ahead and second the fact that he is an idiot and a bigot. I am thus entirely intolerant of any piece of crap that he puts out. All he does is feed lies to people who don't know anything about politics yet for some reason still feel inclined to have a strong opinion.

 

[maestro1625]

he is...a bigot. I am thus entirely intolerant.

 

[scgroat]

the irony was sort of what I was getting at

 

[Decicco]

A true libertarian would scrap medicare outright. Maybe he feels that way, he didn't say.

Ha, funny you say so because I am a libertarian and I would. Thats why I'm voting for Congressman Ron Paul for President (who is an MD, mind you and running on the GOP ticket). You can read his position on health care at: http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul339.html

You know what I like about Moore? He shows some of the things that we don't see all the time. Sure he is totally biased in his opinions.... but you can still see some things brought into the spotlight that we maybe should be talking about more.

Youre right, you never hear anyone talking about health care nowadays.

 

[maestro1625]

Ha, funny you say so because I am a libertarian and I would. Thats why I'm voting for Congressman Ron Paul for President (who is an MD, mind you and running on the GOP ticket). You can read his position on health care at: http://www.lewrockwell.com/paul/paul339.html

of course he has next to no chance of winning the primary much less the general election... though I guess I can't call you crazy because I still hold out some hope for Richardson.

 

[maestro1625]

michael moore=3 years from a heart attack

though now that I remember it, my dad saw him up in Traverse City 2 weeks ago and said the guy looked like he could barely walk. And he saw him watching the finish of a triathlon, for added irony.

 

[Decicco]

Youre probably right.
But, his "vegas" odds were slashed from 200 to 1, to 15 to 1: http://www.gambling911.com/Ron-Paul-Odds-053107.html

And there is some speculation as to whether he can win NH: http://www.freemarketnews.com/WorldNews.asp?nid=42148&fb=1

When it comes down to it, electibility doesnt really factor into my equation of who I support anyway.

 

[SketchLazy]

I thought 'Fahrenheit 9/11' was a movie chalk full of logical inconsistencies but it did bring attention to the matter of Iraq and the situation that was going on there. After the movie came out, there were discussions about not only what was said in the movie but people began addressing the problems in Iraq which had largely been ignored. The best part about his movies is that whatever he decides to document becomes a huge topic of debate and political discourse.

I heard his new one will cover individual stories of people who think they are covered through HMOs for a certain procedure, but are denied coverage. At some point prior to the procedure, their HMOs have reduced their coverage without letting them know. It's gotten praise even from people who were on the other side of the fence concerning his last movie. No doubt it will probably be a polarizing movie but that's his style.

 

[Medikit]

He played with my heart? Got lost in the game

 

[pguin]

He's a huge idiot and everyone should walk out of a movie theater feeling dumber than when they entered. When you spoon feed irrelevant 100% biased information to the crowd in a way that makes it seem important its sad that so many people feel he has something important to say. However he does get people to pay attention to certain important issues...I just hope they look into the issues themselves rather than just accepting what he has to say.

However - I really want to see this movie for the sole purpose of seeing if he mentions that one of the largest drains on our healthcare system and the reason for a diminished lifespan in this country is OBESITY. I'd love to see the Vegas odds on that getting mentioned while he narrates with a bucket of fried chicken in front of him

 

[Felzor]

I would say the opposite. People like Jon Stewart promote discourse. Michael Moore is a combination of polarizing and illogical that encourages people who don't agree with him to dismiss him and the points that he's making.

Discourse is whatever you make of it. Movies like Moore's are pointless if only his fans watch it while his opponents bitch about what a fat ***** he is.

I hear that this movie is less about raging against the government and more about the need for people to accept personal responsibility. In one scene I guess he sails off to Guantanamo with a bunch of 9/11 firefighters to demonstrate that the Al-Qaeda detainees actually receive better health care than the heroes (when they're not being tortured?). Where there's a will, there's a way.

I respect Ron Paul, but excuse me if I don't think a few tax credits are going to lower the cost of premiums, improve HMO coverage, lower pharmaceutical costs, and tear apart legal red tape for malpractice. In all seriousness, good luck to him.

 

[ssquared]

I'd be curious to see what who people voted for in the 2004 election as correlated to whether or not they dislike Michael Moore.

Just a thought. Holding my tongue here....

 

[Gut Shot]

He also tried to go to Cuba to prove a point about how they have the same life expectancy as us, but about a fourth of the spending on healthcare.

Try 1/25th the spending.

 

[ssquared]

Try 1/25th the spending.

Yeah, whatever the statistic is. I don't really remember what it is off the top of my head. It's pretty dramatic though. And they have free medical education to go along with the free healthcare.

 

[63768]

i tned to disregard everything michael moore says. i gave him a chance when i went to watch fahrenheit 9/11, and i immediately realized that he uses choice editing to make his points.

 

[notdeadyet]

He's a huge idiot and everyone should walk out of a movie theater feeling dumber than when they entered.

I'm always puzzled by folks who approach Michael Moore as a standard documentarian. He's not. He mixes his documentary-style film-making with entertainment. He always has. He makes no bones about it. I haven't seen Sicko, but I doubt he doesn't use irony, absurdity and humor to make most of his points.

There are lots of humorists on the left, whether in comedy, film, documentaries, literature, etc. You could name dozens and dozens. But why is it the domain of the left wing?

The right has the Moral Outrage thing nailed, but I'm always amazed that it can't seem to get its arms around the idea that humor is a great source for discourse. I'm sure there are plenty of funny Republicans out there.

I'm politically non-denominational when it comes to humor, but the only ones I can think of that are any good on the right are Dennis Miller (who is hilarious) and P.J. O'Rourke (who I don't think is as prolific as he used to be).

So if folks are upset by the fact that Moore is a left-winger mixing entertainment with his facts, they should foster some creativity in their ranks to approach the same. No need to take ourselves so seriously.

 

[Dookter]

Youre right, you never hear anyone talking about health care nowadays.

Did I say I was only talking about healthcare? I just mean in general.

 

[deleted103644]

I'm politically non-denominational when it comes to humor, but the only ones I can think of that are any good on the right are Dennis Miller (who is hilarious) and P.J. O'Rourke (who I don't think is as prolific as he used to be).

So if folks are upset by the fact that Moore is a left-winger mixing entertainment with his facts, they should foster some creativity in their ranks to approach the same. No need to take ourselves so seriously.

Lisa: C:, C:\Dos, C:\Dos\Run. Ha! Only one person in a million would find that funny.
Frink: Yes, we call that the Dennis Miller Ratio.

 

[sirus_virus]

Try 1/25th the spending.

-Who the hell keeps the books in CUBA?

-what kind of accurate data can you get from CUBA?

-Have you ever been to CUBA or any other third world country?

-Do you know how likely it is that a government official that has not been paid his/her salary for 3 months is going to keep good records?

-Do you know what could happen when one man controls all the information you can get from a whole country?

-Why would Cuba give you information that suggests socialism is failing?

-Was the soviet medical system not supposedly the best in the world according to the UN at some point?

-Why don't you guys move to Cuba?

 

[pguin]

I'm always puzzled by folks who approach Michael Moore as a standard documentarian. He's not. He mixes his documentary-style film-making with entertainment. He always has. He makes no bones about it. I haven't seen Sicko, but I doubt he doesn't use irony, absurdity and humor to make most of his points.

There are lots of humorists on the left, whether in comedy, film, documentaries, literature, etc. You could name dozens and dozens. But why is it the domain of the left wing?

The right has the Moral Outrage thing nailed, but I'm always amazed that it can't seem to get its arms around the idea that humor is a great source for discourse. I'm sure there are plenty of funny Republicans out there.

I'm politically non-denominational when it comes to humor, but the only ones I can think of that are any good on the right are Dennis Miller (who is hilarious) and P.J. O'Rourke (who I don't think is as prolific as he used to be).

So if folks are upset by the fact that Moore is a left-winger mixing entertainment with his facts, they should foster some creativity in their ranks to approach the same. No need to take ourselves so seriously.

I dont think you can possibly compare Michael Moore's political agenda to that of the political comedians like Jon Stewart and Dennis Miller. Moore clearly present his material as being a documentary of factual information and desperately tries to present as much one-sided information as he can to convince the viewers that his view is correct. He may spice it up with some things of entertainment value but in the end it never seems like entertainment was his goal.
This is the exact opposite of the comedians who always seem like entertainment is their goal with their politics just serving as their fodder. I'm actually left wing but I'm insulted when someone trys to sway me on any decision by manipulating the truth, even if I agree with it.

 

[Gut Shot]

-Who the hell keeps the books in CUBA?

I don't know. CUBAN accountants?

-what kind of accurate data can you get from CUBA?

Ask the CIA.

-Have you ever been to CUBA or any other third world country?

CUBA, no. Other third world countries, yes.

-Do you know how likely it is that a government official that has not been paid his/her salary for 3 months is going to keep good records?

-Do you know what could happen when one man controls all the information you can get from a whole country?

-Why would Cuba give you information that suggests socialism is failing?

When I was in grad school studying tropical medicine some colleagues visited Cuba from time to time. Their healthcare system works because it is essentially a monument to preventive care. Read more about it here.

-Was the soviet medical system not supposedly the best in the world according to the UN at some point?

Haven't heard that one. Please look into it and get back to me.

-Why don't you guys move to Cuba?

Because you'd miss us.

 

[sirus_virus]

Their healthcare system works because it is essentially a monument to preventive care. Read more about it here.

I read your nice little article. Now go help me tell my fellow Americans that they should pay for all my 8 years of college medical education, including living expenses and medical care, then tell me how many variations of the words "F%Ck YOU" you get.

 

[Gut Shot]

I read your nice little article. Now go help me tell my fellow Americans that they should pay for all my 8 years of college medical education, including living expenses and medical care, then tell me how many variations of the words "F%Ck YOU" you get.

Fifty five. Oddly, the same number of times Dennis Hopper says some variation of the word "f%ck" in Blue Velvet.

 

[sirus_virus]

Fifty five. Oddly, the same number of times Dennis Hopper says some variation of the word "f%ck" in Blue Velvet.

 

[sirus_virus]

Just for the record. I am in full support of every single American having insurance. If you are in the healthcare business, you will be a fool not to support an increase in potential paying customers i.e., increase in demand for your services. I just don't think allowing the very idiots on capitol hill that pretty much screwed up every other social program to handle health insurance for all is a good idea.

 

[kdburton]

Try 1/25th the spending.

Thats because the US is so much more advanced. The main reason why healthcare is so expensive here is because people want the best healthcare, and that means coming up with new ways to do things, better ways to do things, etc. That makes the prices of healthcare skyrocket. Cuba is so far behind us in all that kind of stuff that it makes sense that they only spend 1/25th on healthcare. If all the fatasses in the US would just go on a diet and start exercising then there would be much less need for treating chronic disorders like obesity, diabetes, and heart disease. Heart disease is the biggest killer and it is also leads to the single largest expenditure of healthcare dollars in the US. People in Cuba don't need to make "lifestyle interventions" to stop eating too much because they are poor as hell and can't afford to become fat like everyone here.

 

[Gut Shot]

Just for the record. I am in full support of every single American having insurance. If you are in the healthcare business, you will be a fool not to support an increase in potential paying customers i.e., increase in demand for your services.

Exactly. Thank you.

 

[Gut Shot]

Thats because the US is so much more advanced. The main reason why healthcare is so expensive here is because people want the best healthcare, and that means coming up with new ways to do things, better ways to do things, etc. That makes the prices of healthcare skyrocket.

That's part of it. For a more comprehensive evaluation read Dr. Bodenheimer's pieces here, here and here.

Cuba is so far behind us in all that kind of stuff that it makes sense that they only spend 1/25th on healthcare.

True, although Cuba's experience truly underscores the importance of preventive care. There are other poor third world nations in that region, but Cuba has a higher life expectancy, lower infant mortality and better vaccination rates. Even minimal resources can go a long way when properly applied.

If all the fatasses in the US would just go on a diet and start exercising then there would be much less need for treating chronic disorders like obesity, diabetes, and heart disease.

I can't argue with you here.

 

[LifetimeDoc]

I read your nice little article. Now go help me tell my fellow Americans that they should pay for all my 8 years of college medical education, including living expenses and medical care, then tell me how many variations of the words "F%Ck YOU" you get.

Well, being that the money you pay for your medical education is a far cry from the actual cost (meaning that the bulk of your medical education is paid by federal, state, local, and non-profit educational funds) maybe they should tell your fellow Americans the truth? You'll probably pay $0-20k for your undergraduate education, $80k-100k for your medical school education, and $0k for your post-graduate medical education for a grand total of 100k-120k (not including living expenses). Another $500k of that is paid by somebody else. Suprise!

 

[ssquared]

Thats because the US is so much more advanced. The main reason why healthcare is so expensive here is because people want the best healthcare, and that means coming up with new ways to do things, better ways to do things, etc. That makes the prices of healthcare skyrocket. Cuba is so far behind us in all that kind of stuff that it makes sense that they only spend 1/25th on healthcare. If all the fatasses in the US would just go on a diet and start exercising then there would be much less need for treating chronic disorders like obesity, diabetes, and heart disease. Heart disease is the biggest killer and it is also leads to the single largest expenditure of healthcare dollars in the US. People in Cuba don't need to make "lifestyle interventions" to stop eating too much because they are poor as hell and can't afford to become fat like everyone here.

Do you really believe that, or are you just repeating what your mommy told you?

Give me a break. If you ever looked a chart describing money spent on healthcare and life expectancy, you'd realize that the US doesn't spend so much because we're "so advanced." We're not the only 1st world country out there. And we're not the only country with obesity problems (and if you knew anything about obesity, you would know that poorer people are far more likely to be overweight and sick in general).

 

[siinew]

I won't be able to catch Michael Moore's new pile of crap. I have more important things to do like clip my toenails, stare at blank wall for a few days, and scrub my car with a toothbrush.

And don't forget, you probably have hours of right-wing propaganda to catch up on... from right of center, Fox "News" all the way to Fukkus on the Family. To counter your likely flame, your political opinions get mine, don't start it if you don't like the reactions.

 

[siinew]

Wow and to think some of you people are going to be future docs in charge of the healthcare system. You haven't even seen the movie yet and are complaining about it. I didn't like F9-11 as it was full of some spin but this one actually looks interesting. The movie isn't about being on the right or left but about healthcare for everyone and how insurance companies are screwing us over. A number of people all across the political spectrum stated that and despite Moore's political affiliations, praised the movie. So do yourselves a favor and watch it before criticizing it.

Exactly. Well Said.

 

[siinew]

Fifty five. Oddly, the same number of times Dennis Hopper says some variation of the word "f%ck" in Blue Velvet.

You're hilarious, Gut Shot. Great postings by you all the way through.

 

[maestro1625]

-Why don't you guys move to Cuba?

you could have made good points if you didn't follow it up with this last bit of stupidity.

 

[JacobSilge]

Give me a break. If you ever looked a chart describing money spent on healthcare and life expectancy, you'd realize that the US doesn't spend so much because we're "so advanced." We're not the only 1st world country out there. And we're not the only country with obesity problems (and if you knew anything about obesity, you would know that poorer people are far more likely to be overweight and sick in general).

That just depends on what he means by "so advanced." We spend so much money because of expensive end of life interventions. These interventions are far more technologically advanced than the means used in Cuba in similar situations (pain management and palliative care at best). America doesn't rank #1 in terms of access to health care technology for nothing. The question is whether this leads to better public health.

As for poorer people tending to be more overweight, that's not necessarily the case. The poor in Africa and South America are not overweight. It is from the problem of fresh healthy food and a gym membership costing more than things like fast food and a TV. So in theory one could say that the obesity epidemic of the lower socioeconomic strata of the US is not from not having enough money, but rather from having just the wrong amount.

 

[Gut Shot]

You're hilarious, Gut Shot. Great postings by you all the way through.

Nank nu.

 

[maestro1625]

ok, so I just realized that the title of this thread is a Brittney Spears reference


BOOOOO, OP... shame on you.