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You are special to me.
Official "I applied on the first day" thread
- Thread starter joe6102
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You are special to me.
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Bwhahaha... you're too funny. Are you this sarcastic during interviews?
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At what point should you worry if you haven't heard from any programs? 3-4weeks?
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Some programs may wait until MSPE's are released in Nov. Some will tell you this week. There is no way to know. If you've applied to a range of programs, it's likely you'll hear from some of them in the next 2-3 weeks.
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Thanks for your help, I applied broadly for peds and am excited for what the next few months will bring.
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Merging similar/duplicate threads...
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applied to 9 IM programs.....thinking I'll add another.....hopefully I don't screw myself with so few programs!
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are you being cheap?
or are you super confident, with a bubbly personaility and 266/99 on both step 1 and II?
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not "super" confident, but I am going into internal medicine and I've picked programs that are in my league, some dream schools (2), and some that I know I'll get into (like my home prog) so I have backups. Yes I do have a very bubbly personality, no I am not being cheap
Step 1 240+ not 260s!
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General Surgery folks, anyone got any news??
I got an invite to a wedding but that's about it so far
I would go anyway.
That would be hilarious!
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After the $800 raping i got from SFMatch, $230 seems like nothing. And it appears all but 2 schools have downloaded my app...let the waiting game begin
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General Surgery folks, anyone got any news??
I applied on 9/2 for general surgery and got my first interview today. I also got an email saying thanks for applying to a separate program.
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yes, i submitted my scores. if i don't and they see that i had already taken it, they will know.
i wasn't intoxicated. i was depressed. someone told me that its good to apply as soon as eras opens. thats why i took step 2 while not quite ready for it. and i am still doing clinical rotations so i don't want to take it in the middle of the rotation.
please advise.
i wasn't intoxicated. i was depressed. someone told me that its good to apply as soon as eras opens. thats why i took step 2 while not quite ready for it. and i am still doing clinical rotations so i don't want to take it in the middle of the rotation.
please advise.
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1. Without some other connection / major research / etc, you're not going to get a rads spot. It doesn't hurt to apply (except for the ERAS cost), but I'd expect that you'll get no interviews. If you really, really love rads, them you're going to have to apply very broadly and hope someone nibbles.
If it turns out that you invented MRI, or have some other amazing research, or are "connected" to someone known in the radiology world, then that might pull you through.
According to Charting outcomes in the Match, the average Step 2 for US grads getting into Rads was 237 and the 25th percentile was 224. Unfortunately, a 197 would be the 2nd percentile.
2. Anesthesia is more likely, but still an uphill battle. The average there was 223 with the 25th percentile being 210. A 197 is the 9th percentile.
What do you do now? Well, there is nothing to be done about your USMLE score. You need to do as well as possible in your clinicals. You should probably choose one of radiology and anesthesia and focus your efforts -- research, connections, letters, and rotations. Once you apply to programs, the number of interviews you get will give you some sense of what is likely to happen. If you get 10+ interviews, you're likely to get a spot. If you get <10 interviews, then you'll want to work on a Plan B.
Most importantly, if you have a problem with depression, you need to address it now. Being an intern with uncontrolled depression is not a good plan.
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thank you for your reply. I am going to try to do well in my clinical rotations. any suggestions on what electives to choose for radiology and anesthesiology? i don't have connections. i am doing a research right now. i applied to nuclear medicine also but so far no interviews.
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I already did a radio and anesthesia elective. i am going to do an ICU and neuro elective. so shall i send eras my grades, new transcript after i am done with those. i alreday sent 1 transcript to eras. the prograns are going to see that ? thanks again.
for the backup, i've applied for categorical internal medicine programs. any suggestions on that?
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dear prog director,
I got an interview for internal medicine. Please give me tips for the interview. We are not suppose to ask for prematch or how i will be placed on the list, right?
thanks.
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You are certainly allowed to ask for a prematch -- there is no rule about this. The trick is to do so nicely. Asking if the program offers prematches in general, for example.
Programs are not allowed to "guarantee" or imply a match commitment. Hence, I'm not supposed to tell you that you're "sure to match here" or that I've "ranked you #1". I can say that I'm very interesting in having you match with us (which doesn't really mean anything), or I could tell you that I won't be ranking you.
Applicants commonly tell me that they're ranking me #1. And, they not uncommonly are lying (as they match somewhere else). So, I've learned to mostly ignore this.
Yes, assuming you can get a license. Some states have specific lists of medical schools that are "acceptable" -- California is an example. If you went to a non-approved cali school, no matter where you do your residency, you'll not get a license in California. Only a few states are draconian about this, so for the most part you'll be able to work wherever you want.
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Yeah, but that doesn't mean that someone with a 197 would have only a 2 percent chance of matching in rads. Most people with a 197 won't be applying for rads as they view themselves as probably uncompetitive for rads, however, there will be lots of folks with 235+ applying for rads as they stand a better chance. For example, say 20 people with a step 2 score of 197 apply for rads, and say half make it, i.e. 10 people, maybe that is approximately 2 percentile considering the hundreds of others who apply and get in to rads.
Anyway, I think a high Step 2 score is important for more cognitive specialties like internal medicine, pediatrics, family practice even . . . radiology takes a different set of skills, but obviously having a good foundation of clinical knowledge is important i.e. clinical-radiologic correlation.
Point Being-Not many applicants with 197 will apply for rads and this could artificially decrease the number with 197 who get rads. Your chances at a rads residency may have dropped from 75% chance pre-Step 2 to maybe a 30% chance now. Not great, but not hopeless, if you apply more places than the average applicant maybe you would have a 40% chances of rads. Many students with sub-par board scores select out or were settled on a specialty that doesn't need high board score to match somewhere.
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A good point. It got me to thinking, and realizing that with the data provided from the NRMP, we can actually calculate the "average" chances of someone with a 197 step 2 who gets an interview getting a rads spot.
For US allo MD applicants:
There were 831 applicants who matched rads in 2007. 2% of them had a Step 2 score of 197 or less. 2% of 831 = 17 people matched with a 197 or less.
There were 84 applicants who did not match rads in 2007. 25% of them had a 197 or less. 25% of 84 is 21.
17/(17+21) = 44%, so actually not too bad.
For Independent applicants:
There were 179 applicants who matched, of which 4% had a Step 2 of 197 or less. 179 x 4% = 7 applicants matched with 197 or less.
There were 237 applicants who didn;t match, of which 29% had a Step 2 of 197 or less. 237 x 29% = 68
7/(7+68) = 9%, not great but not impossible either.
These numbers assume you get an interview, as they are derived from people who ranked Rads and I would assume that most people who do not get any interviews, wouldn't bother ranking rad programs. This also ignores everything else in the application, and assumes that I actually calculated this all correctly.
So, if the OP gets some Rads interviews, then his/her chance of matching appears to be somewhere between 10 and 40 percent, depending on whether he/she is an allo US MD or not. This ignores the chances of him/her getting an interview in the first place, which there is no way to know. I know that our rads program gets 100's of applications and only interviews about 30 or 40 people. If the chance of the OP getting a rads interview in the first place is about 25%, then his/her ultimate chance of rads is somewhere between 2.5% and 10%. Since the OP hasn't told us anything else about their app, it's hard to know.
Anyway, my advice still stands. If the OP is interested in rads, then they should of course apply. The worst thing that can happen is that they don't get any interviews. He/She needs a backup plan. Anesthesia is not a reliable backup plan, since it's reasonably competitive also. The OP could certainly apply to both rads and gas, but should have a backup on top of that also.
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I applied to 194 programs programs on the first day.
30 med-peds,30 pediatrics,134 internal medicine.
Got four rejections,
One program said cannot call this time but will be under their consideration should the situations change.
30 med-peds,30 pediatrics,134 internal medicine.
Got four rejections,
One program said cannot call this time but will be under their consideration should the situations change.
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You seem to have very detailed information APD, however, I looked up the "Charting Outcomes in the Match" from 2007, and the statistics provided there are different (they only show 609 who matched in Diagnostic Radiology in 2007, I assume this doesn't count the scramble). Maybe being a Program Director they give you more accurate info??:
In terms of Step 2 scores equal to or less than 180 (which I admit is close but not exactly our applicants score) I found:
For U.S. Seniors with a Step 2 of less than or equal to 180 applying for Diagnostic Radiology 7 did not match and 1 did match (perhaps over confident as Independent applicants in this bracket did better):
However, ironically, for Independent applicants i.e. IMGs, with Step 2 equal to or less than 180, 3 match and 3 didn't match!
Taking a quick look at the graph for Step 1 performance, of US grads with a Step 1 between 221 and 230 (Like the OP's Step 1), actually 150 matched and 10 did not match.
For Independent Applicants, between 221 and 230, 27 matched and 28 did not match.
Now, for Independent applicants with Step 2 between 180 and 210 by eyeballing the graph the chances maybe be between 10 to 50 percent, so yes a low Step 2 score hurts some.
HOWEVER, our applicant did good on Step 1 for radiology and anesthesiology, i.e. 230, which would guarantee almost that such an applicant were he/she a US student would get radiology and if an IMG then would have a 50% chance of getting radiology. So, roughly speaking our applicant could have between a 10 and 50% chance of getting radiology, depending on a worst case scenario of only looking at Step 2, or a best case scenario of only looking at Step 1 . . . What would a radiology PD do?
I would guess, that a PD might figure that someone who got 230 on Step 1 would be expected to get roughly 240 on Step 2, i.e. approximately a ten point increase, so the good showing on Step 1 might explain away the poor showing on Step 2 as a "bad day." I.e. the talent is there but didn't show up that day. So, I would weight the probability closer to the best case scenario, i.e. 35 percent chance, which isn't great, but something to work with, i.e. the applicant could apply everywhere like crazy, albeit with "back-up" plans for residency, which could include applying for IM, Family (or also anesthesiology as he/she probably has about a 35% chance there as well being similarily competitive as Diagnostic Radiology).
Also, some people who failed the steps i.e. US grads? maybe went for radiology anyway and got it, so this may give the OP a leg up.
The big question is whether Step 2 is a very large determinant of success in radiology, or not important at all. It is possible that Step 2 performance is a surrogate marker for something else, like perhaps acing a radiology elective, to some degree. I.e. people with lighters in their pockets are more likely to get lung cancer due to having a lighter in your pocket being associated with smoking . . . Obviously Step scores do measure something, but how PDs react to disparate step scores is an interesting question, especially when many PDs don't have Step 2 scores for applicants, although this is changing as more and more are wanting to see them before rank time apparently. . .
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First, thanks for the great post.
Nope. We're looking at the same data, which is here.
I think you're forgetting that there are both PGY-1 and PGY-2 matches into radiology. The numbers I was quoting includes both. They are listed at the top of the columns in Table DR-1, and also in Table 1 at the beginning of the document.
Man do I feel like a fool. I saw that first table (DR-1) and calculated from there -- assuming the USMLE scores are normally distributed, they give you the means and the 25th/75th percentiles, so you can calculate the SD and then map out percentiles. In my post above, everything was calculated from what would be predicted by that distribution.
You're pointing out that, had I remembered about the graphs just below, all of this real data is actually displayed for all to see. Silly me. All that work is meaningless.
As you point out, in 2007 20% of IMG's with a Step 2 of 190-200 matched in Rads, and 50% of US grads did. So, the OP's chances are much better than I mentioned above -- assuming that he/she gets interviews.
Now we're both guessing with numbers. In any case, we agree. The OP still has some chance in both Rads and Gas. There is more to applications than USMLE score. Hopefully the OP has something in their application that will keep a PD's attention off their Step 2 score.
Thanks for keeping me honest!
Nope. We're looking at the same data, which is here.
I think you're forgetting that there are both PGY-1 and PGY-2 matches into radiology. The numbers I was quoting includes both. They are listed at the top of the columns in Table DR-1, and also in Table 1 at the beginning of the document.
Man do I feel like a fool. I saw that first table (DR-1) and calculated from there -- assuming the USMLE scores are normally distributed, they give you the means and the 25th/75th percentiles, so you can calculate the SD and then map out percentiles. In my post above, everything was calculated from what would be predicted by that distribution.
You're pointing out that, had I remembered about the graphs just below, all of this real data is actually displayed for all to see. Silly me. All that work is meaningless.
As you point out, in 2007 20% of IMG's with a Step 2 of 190-200 matched in Rads, and 50% of US grads did. So, the OP's chances are much better than I mentioned above -- assuming that he/she gets interviews.
Now we're both guessing with numbers. In any case, we agree. The OP still has some chance in both Rads and Gas. There is more to applications than USMLE score. Hopefully the OP has something in their application that will keep a PD's attention off their Step 2 score.
Thanks for keeping me honest!
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