Official 2012-2013 IM Residency WAMC (What Are My Chances) Thread

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Stats:
- Top 10 School
- Step 1: 251
- Core clerkships: Honors: Medicine, Surgery, Psych. Remainder High Pass
- Medicine electives: Honors: MICU rotation #1, outpatient medicine. High Pass: Subi-I, MICU rotation #2
Was told by medicine adviser very emphatically to "not worry" about high pass in sub-i and one of my MICU electives since the evaluations were good but "just didn't quite reach the level of honors."
And, indeed, the narratives are excellent to outstanding. Nonetheless I still worry.
- Rank: Likely around the middle?
- LORs: From MICU rotation #2 ("extremely strong letter" as per attending, apparently he liked me more than the other attending did :) ), outpatient medicine, Medicine Clerkship.
(Worked with too many attendings on subi to get to know any one of them particularly well, unfortunately.)

- Others: Fairly interesting large retrospective study which will hopefully get published in a good journal this fall/winter. A published case report, a poster.

- Programs
Bayview
Beth Israel Deaconess
Brigham
Brown
Chicago
Cornell
Duke
Mayo
Michigan
NW
Penn
Sinai
Stanford
Tufts
OHSU
Wash U
U Colorado
UVa
U Wash
UPMC
UCSF
Yale

- Advice is much appreciated.
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Does having only 3 LORs look bad? By 3 I mean... Two attending letters plus one chair/department letter. I know the minimum for most places is 3, but everyone left and right of me seems to have 4 total.
 
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NinerDO said:
School: Western U Osteopathic
Step 1: 188 :scared:
Step 1 COMLEX: 427
Step 2: 219
Step 2 COMLEX: 433

Pre-clinical -All pass
Clinical - High pass/Honors.
Class Rank - Bottom 1/3

AOA - Yes
LORs - 2 strong LoR, 1 from my program director

Programs:

Alameda County
Santa Clara Valley
Kaiser Oakland/SF/Santa Clara
White Memorial
Scripps
USC/LA County
Santa Barbara Cottage

AOA:
Valley Las Vegas
Arrowhead

I need some serious help. I would love to stay in California but know that might be hard considering my scores. I am also open to spots in Philadelphia, Chicago, and New York city.
Click to expand...

I would really appreciate any help in this. I am obviously not looking for any competitive programs and would be satisfied with any community programs. Are there any places in big cities that would be a sure bet for an interview for me?
 
NinerDO said:
School: Western U Osteopathic
Step 1: 188 :scared:
Step 1 COMLEX: 427
Step 2: 219
Step 2 COMLEX: 433

Pre-clinical -All pass
Clinical - High pass/Honors.
Class Rank - Bottom 1/3

AOA - Yes
LORs - 2 strong LoR, 1 from my program director

Programs:

Alameda County
Santa Clara Valley
Kaiser Oakland/SF/Santa Clara
White Memorial
Scripps
USC/LA County
Santa Barbara Cottage

AOA:
Valley Las Vegas
Arrowhead

I need some serious help. I would love to stay in California but know that might be hard considering my scores. I am also open to spots in Philadelphia, Chicago, and New York city.
Click to expand...

NinerDO said:
I would really appreciate any help in this. I am obviously not looking for any competitive programs and would be satisfied with any community programs. Are there any places in big cities that would be a sure bet for an interview for me?
Click to expand...

Just because it seems that you really want to know (I'm not trying to be mean):

Here is your situation: You barely passed COMLEX x2, barely passed USMLE step 1, and your step 2 is below average; Your USMLE score (<200) will filter you out of most ACGME IM programs and your COMLEX score (<450) will filter you out of most AOA IM programs. 200 and 450 are pretty much the bare minimums for even marginally-competetive/desirable IM programs these days. Your class rank is also low!

If I was you, I would apply to ALL AOA programs and ALL community ACGME programs in the cities that you mentioned. Your best shot is AIs at your favorite AOA programs and kicking a** as they are more likely to value AIs over scores. To be honest, given your stats you can't really be picky these days regarding geography and I would drop all Kaisers and USC from your list (waste of money, although whats another $60-100 in the grand scheme of things, but don't expect much).

Apply as broadly as you can and hope for the best :luck:
 
General rule for this thread, if you have 3 of the following 5 you should not ask what your chances are (assuming US citizenship):

Honors in Medicine
From top 20 med school
AOA
Greater or equal to 240 Step 1
Took year off in a named program (Doris Duke, Howard Hughes, etc) and/or published 1st author in research

Because its just unnecessary and you are making everyone else feel bad. Go apply to your MGH/Brigham/BI. You guys will be ok.
 
chudog15 said:
General rule for this thread, if you have 3 of the following 5 you should not ask what your chances are (assuming US citizenship):

Honors in Medicine
From top 20 med school
AOA
Greater or equal to 240 Step 1
Took year off in a named program (Doris Duke, Howard Hughes, etc) and/or published 1st author in research

Because its just unnecessary and you are making everyone else feel bad. Go apply to your MGH/Brigham/BI. You guys will be ok.
Click to expand...

Agreed. I simply don't understand the numbers of people who come here and do that. There is no one thing which will get an interview at any one program. However having those stats will get interviews at a majority of top programs in all likelihood. Personally, I would wager the people who have posts like that are fairly pretentious... maybe that's why they're worried... or should be at least.

Good luck to everyone!
 
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Wonder if you guys can give me your thoughts about my application and how competitive I am for IM residency
I am 2nd in my class and AOA, honors in all classes and rotations, 5 publications. I go to an awesome MD school but not ivy league
Just didn't study right for Step 1 and got smack average...step 2 is pending

It's unclear to me if I am qualified for the more competitive programs, especially in the northeast. Thanks!
 
take the shot said:
Wonder if you guys can give me your thoughts about my application and how competitive I am for IM residency
I am 2nd in my class and AOA, honors in all classes and rotations, 5 publications. I go to an awesome MD school but not ivy league
Just didn't study right for Step 1 and got smack average...step 2 is pending

It's unclear to me if I am qualified for the more competitive programs, especially in the northeast. Thanks!
Click to expand...

Community programs in Alaska are about your top prospect.
 
take the shot said:
Wonder if you guys can give me your thoughts about my application and how competitive I am for IM residency
I am 2nd in my class and AOA, honors in all classes and rotations, 5 publications. I go to an awesome MD school but not ivy league
Just didn't study right for Step 1 and got smack average...step 2 is pending

It's unclear to me if I am qualified for the more competitive programs, especially in the northeast. Thanks!
Click to expand...

check the peurto rico programs.
 
Bill Swa said:
Community programs in Alaska are about your top prospect.
Click to expand...
Guys, I appreciate your attempts at joking but I am sincere: the dilemma for me has been that all I have heard about is how important Step 1 is. Me and my classmates have all gotten the impression that even if you had other great statistics, if you didn't rage on step 1, no one would care about your other stuff (grades, class rank, AOA, etc...) Almost like you would be rejected right away.

So despite how I've worked my a** off for over 3 years, it seemed like I would not make the cutoff for more competitive schools because of my average score

If I am wrong, nothing would make me happier but this has been my fear
Thanks
 
take the shot said:
Wonder if you guys can give me your thoughts about my application and how competitive I am for IM residency
I am 2nd in my class and AOA, honors in all classes and rotations, 5 publications. I go to an awesome MD school but not ivy league
Just didn't study right for Step 1 and got smack average...step 2 is pending

It's unclear to me if I am qualified for the more competitive programs, especially in the northeast. Thanks!
Click to expand...

and cards/gi or bust, right?
 
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take the shot said:
Wonder if you guys can give me your thoughts about my application and how competitive I am for IM residency
I am 2nd in my class and AOA, honors in all classes and rotations, 5 publications. I go to an awesome MD school but not ivy league
Just didn't study right for Step 1 and got smack average...step 2 is pending

It's unclear to me if I am qualified for the more competitive programs, especially in the northeast. Thanks!
Click to expand...
I suppose the real question is.... what exactly do you consider an "average" step 1?
 
take the shot said:
224
Click to expand...
If you think you've been pre-screened out of a program you want to go to, send a polite email letting the program know you're enthusiastic about going there and asking if they'd give your application a second look. With a resume like that you should be able to talk your way into an interview just about anywhere.


As for me:

Top 40 school
Middle of the class, not AOA
Preclinicals: mostly P with some HP/H; Clinicals mostly HP and H. Medicine clerkship grade was HP; later honored the medicine sub-internship and a medicine elective.
Step 1: 236; Step 2 scheduled
No volunteering or extracurriculars save a few small teaching experiences.
Significant time doing research in med school with a couple of co-authored publications in two top-tier journals, but no first author papers.
3 LORs from research mentor and medicine attendings, plus chair letter.

I'm interested in going into academics in a not terribly competitive specialty; I'm applying to strong university programs all over and would be delighted to go to any of them. This is how I imagine my competitiveness, though perhaps I am totally delusional:

Very Reach:
MGH
Johns Hopkins
Mayo Clinic
UCSD
UCSF
Stanford

Reach:
University of Washington
Wash U
Yale
U Penn
U Michigan

Attainable:
OHSU
UTSW
Emory
Vandy
Baylor
Duke
U Pitt
U Colorado
U Chicago
Tulane

Thoughts? Other places I should look at?
 
Retro Virus said:
As for me:

Top 40 school
Middle of the class, not AOA
Preclinicals: mostly P with some HP/H; Clinicals mostly HP and H. Medicine clerkship grade was HP; later honored the medicine sub-internship and a medicine elective.
Step 1: 236; Step 2 scheduled
No volunteering or extracurriculars save a few small teaching experiences.
Significant time doing research in med school with a couple of co-authored publications in two top-tier journals, but no first author papers.
3 LORs from research mentor and medicine attendings, plus chair letter.

I'm interested in going into academics in a not terribly competitive specialty; I'm applying to strong university programs all over and would be delighted to go to any of them. This is how I imagine my competitiveness, though perhaps I am totally delusional:

Very Reach:
MGH
Johns Hopkins
Mayo Clinic
UCSD
UCSF
Stanford

Reach:
University of Washington
Wash U
Yale
U Penn
U Michigan

Attainable:
OHSU
UTSW
Emory
Vandy
Baylor
Duke
U Pitt
U Colorado
U Chicago
Tulane

Thoughts? Other places I should look at?
Click to expand...

Good God. Your tiers are way off.
 
NinerDO said:
I would really appreciate any help in this. I am obviously not looking for any competitive programs and would be satisfied with any community programs. Are there any places in big cities that would be a sure bet for an interview for me?
Click to expand...

You need to look at the less competitive programs in places like New Jersey, Philly, and possibly NYC (but all NYC progs are going to be more competitive just because everyone wants to go there). IMHO, at this point your biggest priority is just to try to match a non-malignant IM program *somewhere*.. The DO side might be your best bet at this point, although I think some less competitive allo community programs are probably still willing to give you the time of day. Look at Arrowhead and the other DO progs in Cali. I know someone with worse COMLEX scores than you that matched at Mercy in Philly. Poke around and find those DO IM progs that don't fill every year (there's plenty to choose from) and throw all of em an app. Vineland in Jersey might be a decent bet also.

Go on ERAS and check out all the less competitive allo community progs in your desired locales...apply to as many as possible (there should be dozens to choose from). Be careful, though...a lot of these places could be malignant. Go on as many interviews as humanly possible and be alert for signs that the program mistreats residents.
 
majahops said:
Really? With the exception of UPENN, I thought his tiers were pretty reasonably ordered.
Click to expand...

I also agree for the most part. Duke also needs to move up, UCSD and Mayo down. Most of the order is about right for the programs listed.
 
DEdm said:
I also agree for the most part. Duke also needs to move up, UCSD and Mayo down. Most of the order is about right for the programs listed.
Click to expand...

Oh please oh please oh PLEASE can Christmas come early and this turn into another "Best IM Programs" thread
 
.
 
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School: Osteopathic
USMLE
Step 1:224
Step 2: 241
COMLEX
L1: 596
L2: 552
PE: Pass

Pre-clinical: GPA 3.6
Clinical: Mostly Honors or High Pass
Class rank: Top 50% of the class
Research: 2 Poster Presentations and working on a journal publication.

Top Choice:
Scripps Clinic/Scripps Green Hosp - Sub I in Dec
Scripps Mercy Hosp

Kaiser Foundation Hosp, Fontana
UC Irvine Med
Huntington Memorial Hosp
UCSD - Rotation in January
Harbor-UCLA Med Ctr
St Mary Med Ctr, Long Beach
Loma Linda
USC
Kaiser Foundation Hosp LA
UCLA Medical Center
Cedars-Sinai
White memorial
UCLA Olive View

Any idea what my chances are would be very helpful. Thank you!
 
Med school: East coast; USNWR top 25 of research and primary care.
Step 1: 240
Step 2: 264
MS1-2: P/F
MS3: All honors except family med (first rotation of third year)
Obtained MPH at a top 5 program between MS3-MS4
Some research but minimal - no publications. Up for AOA, no word yet.
Above average extra-curriculars and LORs.

Would like to shoot for some of the upper tier programs including UCSF, Stanford, UCLA (plus extension programs), Vandy, UAB, UColorado, UCSD, MGH, UTSW
(please don't transition this into a discussion about which of those are "top" tier -- I don't really care which ones are better than others)

Want to do outpatient general internal medicine when I get done.
 
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wunderland said:
Med school: East coast; USNWR top 25 of research and primary care.
Step 1: 240
Step 2: 264
MS1-2: P/F
MS3: All honors except family med (first rotation of third year)
Obtained MPH at a top 5 program between MS3-MS4
Some research but minimal - no publications. Up for AOA, no word yet.
Above average extra-curriculars and LORs.

Would like to shoot for some of the upper tier programs including UCSF, Stanford, UCLA (plus extension programs), Vandy, UAB, UColorado, UCSD, MGH, UTSW
(please don't transition this into a discussion about which of those are "top" tier -- I don't really care which ones are better than others)

Want to do outpatient general internal medicine when I get done.
Click to expand...

seriously. peruse the thread.

you're fine.
 
[deleted]
 
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gutonc said:
I'm thinking about locking down this thread just to stop the madness here.
Click to expand...

lol y? all im asking is if i missed any programs i should be applying to, is that so wrong?
 
Hi, I really want to know what are my chances of getting interviews and in what places in the US. I have already received interview rejections from UT Southwestern Austin and Orlando Health.

I'm an IMG from Venezuela (top university of Venezuela - I know that might not mean much in the US).

- Graduated first in class (145 students), Magna cum laude.
- Step 1: 265.
- Step 2 CK: 274.
- Step 2 CS: Pass.
- Step 3: Not yet taken but in pretty good shape.
- Meaningless research and publications.
- Need visa (J1 or H1B).

I have 3 months of observerships, one in a private practice of Cardiology, one in private practice of Endocrinology, and one in a University Affiliated Hospital in Florida. I have several LORs from american physicians (Internal Medicine, Cardiology, Endocrinology and Surgery), but since I waived the right to see them I have no idea of what they say.

What do you think are my chances of obtaining interviews in good programs?

I'm looking to be interviewed and matched in UT Houston or Baylor (also Houston) since that is my preferred location. Possible?

Thanks.
 
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Also an IMG here wondering if the crunch is coming on IMGs or what. From a Carib school, need a J1 visa.
Step 1: 263
Step 2 CK: 277
Step 2 CS: Pass
2 LORs from IM program directors and a few more from other IM staff. I waived my right to view them but I was told they were strong from one program that invited me. Not much for extracurricular activities or awards though.

Applying to all the programs that usually take IMGs in Michigan, as well as NY. Also applied to a few other random schools across the US that are IMG friendly and a few dream schools just to see what happens. I've got 2 interviews so far and also 1 rejection. The program that sent the rejection is a low-tier program that has a resident roster full of only IMGs and a few DOs. Not sure if things are just getting harder this year or if it's normal to get a few rejections even from low tier programs?

I've applied to 54 programs in total. Should I start applying to more programs or should I just relax and wait until the MSPEs are out and the ball starts rolling? Seeing all the interview invites on here from other people is getting me nervous.
 
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gutonc said:
I'm thinking about locking down this thread just to stop the madness here.
Click to expand...

Maybe just charge for their advice and coddling?

Who the @$#% needs to ask, however its put...WAMC with scores and crap that make the average med student look like high school drop out.


FYI gutonc - your posts are freakin hilarious, keep up the good work
 
NOT Top 50 school, midwest
Step 1: high 220s
AOA: no
Preclinical grades: Pass, a few H | (H/P/F)
Clinical grades: High Passes in everything sans Honor Psych (I know, but whatevs)
Overall ranked in middle percentiles
Pubs: 1 second author, a couple of posters
Extracurriculars: some leadership, usual volunteer stuff, Goldman Humanism, AIDS clinic
LORs: chair, IM attendings, and research mentor
Legal: NO DUI's! (a definite plus in my book)

Looking to stay in the midwest and west coast, preferably Northwest. Interested in A/I
**Need help with my tiers!**

Reach
OHSU
real Baylor
UTSW
UW
Vandy
Mayo MN
Michigan

Competitive?
Loma Linda
Scripps'
UC-Davis
UC-Riverside
Mayo-AZ
University of Utah
Arizona
Emory
Brown
Dartmouth

Safety Net
Legacy Emmanuel (Oregon, community)
Providence's (Oregon, community)
Virginia Mason
fake Baylor
 
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hey ppl, i know this is an IM thread but i just want yall opinion on my chances for any prelim IM interview based on my scores.
I'm a U.S. citizen IMG (caribbean). step 1 201, step 2 224 on second attempt, cs passed on first attempt. geography is not an issue for me.
 
Jetolso said:
Hi, I really want to know what are my chances of getting interviews and in what places in the US. I have already received interview rejections from UT Southwestern Austin and Orlando Health.

I'm an IMG from Venezuela (top university of Venezuela - I know that might not mean much in the US).

- Graduated first in class (145 students), Magna cum laude.
- Step 1: 265.
- Step 2 CK: 274.
- Step 2 CS: Pass.
- Step 3: Not yet taken but in pretty good shape.
- Meaningless research and publications.
- Need visa (J1 or H1B).

I have 3 months of observerships, one in a private practice of Cardiology, one in private practice of Endocrinology, and one in a University Affiliated Hospital in Florida. I have several LORs from american physicians (Internal Medicine, Cardiology, Endocrinology and Surgery), but since I waived the right to see them I have no idea of what they say.

What do you think are my chances of obtaining interviews in good programs?

I'm looking to be interviewed and matched in UT Houston or Baylor (also Houston) since that is my preferred location. Possible?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I'd really appreciate a little feedback from the "informed" applicants here, since I think I still have a chance to add some more programs to my application (100 but a lot of them are really competitive).
 
DMO said:
NOT Top 50 school, midwest
Step 1: high 220s
Step 2 CK: high 230s
AOA: no
Preclinical grades: Pass, a few H | (H/P/F)
Clinical grades: High Passes in everything sans Honor Psych (I know, but whatevs)
Overall ranked in middle percentiles
Pubs: 1 second author, 1 oral presentation, a couple of posters
Extracurriculars: some leadership, usual volunteer stuff, Goldman Humanism, AIDS clinic
LORs: chair, IM attendings, and research mentor
Legal: NO DUI's! (a definite plus in my book)

Looking to stay in the midwest and west coast, preferably Northwest. Interested in A/I
**Need help with my tiers!**

Reach
OHSU
real Baylor
UTSW
UW
Vandy
Mayo MN
Michigan

Competitive?
Loma Linda
Scripps'
UC-Davis
UC-Riverside
Mayo-AZ
University of Utah
Arizona
Emory
Brown
Dartmouth

Safety Net
Legacy Emmanuel (Oregon, community)
Providence's (Oregon, community)
Virginia Mason
fake Baylor
Click to expand...

I think that's a completely legit list. I don't think OHSU belongs in that top tier, but whatever. I do think you're missing a ton of good midwest programs (which is one of the places you want to stay). If I were you, I'd tack on:
Loyola
Rush
UIC
UW-Madison
UMinn
UC-Irvine
CPMC
SCVMC

I think you're going to get at least 10 interviews out of that group (yours + mine).
 
Hey everyone, my scores are:

Step 1: 218
Step 2 ck: 231
Step 2 cs: still waiting

I go to a decent school in the midwest (maybe ranked 40-60?). No honor in medicine, No AOA. Decent amount of ECs, and some clinical research. Was around top 50% of my class. I have no illusions about where I stand. I know I'm a pretty average (to below average) applicant. I have a few reaches, but I applied mostly to middle tier university programs and some community programs with fellowships, as I'm thinking about heme/onc.

I was pretty bummed about my step 1 score, and actually pretty satisfied with my step 2....but as I thought about, compared to the averages, I really did about the same on both. Will this modest increase make much of a difference for me in your opinion? I can give more details about the specific programs I applied to if necessary. Thanks in advance for your help.
 
For what it's worth, if we look at the 2011 match outcomes data (http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf) and the range of Step 1 and Step 2 CK scores for US seniors who matched into Internal Medicine, we see your Step 1 score of 218 and your Step 2 ck score of 231 are at the same place on the distribution. So I doubt it's going to make a difference.
 
Retro Virus said:
For what it's worth, if we look at the 2011 match outcomes data (http://www.nrmp.org/data/chartingoutcomes2011.pdf) and the range of Step 1 and Step 2 CK scores for US seniors who matched into Internal Medicine, we see your Step 1 score of 218 and your Step 2 ck score of 231 are at the same place on the distribution. So I doubt it's going to make a difference.
Click to expand...

Thanks, I guess this got moved so i'll post my list of programs soon as well. Thanks for your input though.
 
US medical student, not an Ivy League med school
Step 1: 203
Step 2: 249

Honors all 3rd year clerkships
Honors SubI

Well published, Sarnoff Fellowship after 2nd year of med school, returning after 4th year to finish project so will apply to residency during that (next) year

I'm distraught over my Step 1. I took it at the end of my research year after I had forgotten most of the material and in the midst of my parents' divorce. Its not reflective of my abilities but who is going to believe that? I had always planned on going to an academic program in IM but now I'm not sure if that is even a possibility. Can anyone give me advice on how to apply? Given my serious research background, would community programs even want me? And won't research programs screen me out?
 
Reading this thread has officially made me depressed and insecure. Haha.

Sent from my Nexus 7 using SDN Mobile
 
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