Obama vs. McCain Round II

[calisoca]

Sorry, next time I'll write a disclaimer at the top of my post..."I AM BEING SARCASTIC WITH THIS POST."

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[SHC1984]

The cost of education will always go up every year since most politicans think that young people (college students) will never vote...so pissing us off will not matter...They only care about making the old people happy...

 

[PrepharmKID]

I think part of that is schools seem to believe that if they are in the top 1 percent of most expensive schools, then that will improve their standing as a school. I know ASU said that when Michael Crowe became president. He said something like he wanted to increase tuition, which would put it in a higher standing of schools. I can almost believe that, but realistically we all know that is not going to make a school better.

I am interested to see what Obama is going to do about the cost of education. I mean its not like he's gonna go to schools and say ok you gotta cut your tuition by 30 percent. So we'll see.

What is your opinion on this pharmD321? LOL. Do you think tution is gonna drop? More financial aid? More scholarships?

 

[calisoca]

I think part of that is schools seem to believe that if they are in the top 1 percent of most expensive schools, then that will improve their standing as a school. I know ASU said that when Michael Crowe became president. He said something like he wanted to increase tuition, which would put it in a higher standing of schools. I can almost believe that, but realistically we all know that is not going to make a school better.

I am interested to see what Obama is going to do about the cost of education. I mean its not like he's gonna go to schools and say ok you gotta cut your tuition by 30 percent. So we'll see.

What is your opinion on this pharmD321? LOL. Do you think tution is gonna drop? More financial aid? More scholarships?

Exactly what my sarcasm was directed at previously. Watching him speak of "lowering the costs of education for our children" struck no chord with me but the crowd always erupted with acceptance. Afterall, this would be an excellent concept if it were to actually become reality. Regardless, I am warming up my magical plastic card and am fully prepared to pay every cent of pharmacy school because in my opinion, it's well worth it. And since when do great things in life come for free?

This would be fine if it were always the case but getting my FAFSA rejected for the past 5 years in a row has been pretty aggravating when other students get countless dollars thrown at them in financial aid; yet, never cease to take extravagant vacations right in the face of all those helping to support their education. So you can't afford to expand your horizon in a classroom but you can afford to go to Cancun for 3 weeks during the summer? Niiiccceee. Way to live the life of a fraudulent individual. The idea and motivation behind financial aid is a beautiful thing but I have witnessed so many accounts of it being abused that it leaves me feeling a bit bitter (if you couldn't tell, lol).

 

[PrepharmKID]

Exactly what my sarcasm was directed at previously. Watching him speak of "lowering the costs of education for our children" struck no chord with me but the crowd always erupted with acceptance. Afterall, this would be an excellent concept if it were to actually become reality. Regardless, I am warming up my magical plastic card and am fully prepared to pay every cent of pharmacy school because in my opinion, it's well worth it. And since when do great things in life come for free?

This would be fine if it were always the case but getting my FAFSA rejected for the past 5 years in a row has been pretty aggravating when other students get countless dollars thrown at them in financial aid; yet, never cease to take extravagant vacations right in the face of all those helping to support their education. So you can't afford to expand your horizon in a classroom but you can afford to go to Cancun for 3 weeks during the summer? Niiiccceee. Way to live the life of a fraudulent individual. The idea and motivation behind financial aid is a beautiful thing but I have witnessed so many accounts of it being abused that it leaves me feeling a bit bitter (if you couldn't tell, lol).

I feel like you just spoke everything I have been feeling the last 6 years of being declinded aid. I had a friend whose parents owned their own business and so when they did FAFSA, they put that their income was like $30k. So she ended up getting a free ride to school, housing, etc. Gotta love it.

 

[PrePharmD]

I feel like you just spoke everything I have been feeling the last 6 years of being declinded aid. I had a friend whose parents owned their own business and so when they did FAFSA, they put that their income was like $30k. So she ended up getting a free ride to school, housing, etc. Gotta love it.

Exactly. Someone said they could never see someone making 100k a year being taxed to the point where there income is equal to someone making 50k a year. Maybe not in actual income but people in the lower income bracket will receive federal aid in many other forms such as financial aid, etc. My husband and I are pretty darn poor since he lost his job this year and didn't receive any help from the government but I did receive a lot more grants. Why try to pick up those extra hours at work when the government gives out free money? The system is pretty screwed up.

 

[PharmD321]

My Aunt just sent me a very interesting email. I don't know if you guys know, but my uncle ran for Lt. governor office for the libertarian party back in the 80's so he and my aunt knows some politics.

So, my adventure with Obama actually ended. I am sorry to other people that support Obama but he is actually the worst person!

I read both books, Audacity of Hope and Dreams of my father, and he acts like he devotes himself to help the poor people everywhere. But I am sorry to tell you this, it is not true.

Obama is a corrupted person just like McCain (read Keating 5 scandal)

My Aunt opened my mind a little and told me about Obama's scandal with the Annenburg project with Bill Ayers. Not good at all.

Another scandal was when Obama is friends with Tony Rezko. Not good to be friends with the slum landlord.

I really don't want to get into the details because the new president already disappointed me.

I guess I am going to vote for Ron Paul in 2012 and hopefully he will win next time.

 

[SHC1984]

Exactly. Someone said they could never see someone making 100k a year being taxed to the point where there income is equal to someone making 50k a year. Maybe not in actual income but people in the lower income bracket will receive federal aid in many other forms such as financial aid, etc. My husband and I are pretty darn poor since he lost his job this year and didn't receive any help from the government but I did receive a lot more grants. Why try to pick up those extra hours at work when the government gives out free money? The system is pretty screwed up.

GRANTS??? Are you talking about undergrad? I was lucky to have recieved a merit scholarship for undergrad, but for dental school I applied for fin aid and all they give me was LOANS!
And those loans are with interest DURING school...so that didn't help at all so I turn it down.
So are you telling me that really poor people get fin aid that are NOT loans??? I have never heard of that before...I thought fin aid = Loans!

 

[cdhoward]

 

[PrepharmKID]

My Aunt just sent me a very interesting email. I don't know if you guys know, but my uncle ran for Lt. governor office for the libertarian party back in the 80's so he and my aunt knows some politics.

So, my adventure with Obama actually ended. I am sorry to other people that support Obama but he is actually the worst person!

I read both books, Audacity of Hope and Dreams of my father, and he acts like he devotes himself to help the poor people everywhere. But I am sorry to tell you this, it is not true.

Obama is a corrupted person just like McCain (read Keating 5 scandal)

My Aunt opened my mind a little and told me about Obama's scandal with the Annenburg project with Bill Ayers. Not good at all.

Another scandal was when Obama is friends with Tony Rezko. Not good to be friends with the slum landlord.

I really don't want to get into the details because the new president already disappointed me.

I guess I am going to vote for Ron Paul in 2012 and hopefully he will win next time.

I love saying I told you so. "I TOLD YOU SO". Even people that interview that guy say he is straight up "CREEPY". You should watch The O'reilly Factor. He gives it straight up. He has a book out you should read, so does Laura Ingrams. The Dem's think Conservatives just make stuff up, but they are great at fact finding.

PharmD321, you really need to research the info about Obama and his brother. The guy wont send any money to his own brother to help him survive, but he DOES want to take money out of MY pocket and give it to those unwilling to find jobs. Very hypocritical. He mentions "help your brother" but I have yet to hear him help his own BLOOD brother. HYPOCRITE

 

[SHC1984]

I love saying I told you so. "I TOLD YOU SO". Even people that interview that guy say he is straight up "CREEPY". You should watch The O'reilly Factor. He gives it straight up. He has a book out you should read, so does Laura Ingrams. The Dem's think Conservatives just make stuff up, but they are great at fact finding.

PharmD321, you really need to research the info about Obama and his brother. The guy wont send any money to his own brother to help him survive, but he DOES want to take money out of MY pocket and give it to those unwilling to find jobs. Very hypocritical. He mentions "help your brother" but I have yet to hear him help his own BLOOD brother. HYPOCRITE

I never really liked mccain or obama...but voted for obama b/c 1) he say he was going to end the war in Iraq (I was against that war all along...) 2) he wanted to bring universal healthcare to the United States...(I know all the MD/DDS are going to hate me, but I don't care I support universal healthcare 100% )

 

[PrepharmKID]

I never really liked mccain or obama...but voted for obama b/c 1) he say he was going to end the war in Iraq (I was against that war all along...) 2) he wanted to bring universal healthcare to the United States...(I know all the MD/DDS are going to hate me, but I don't care I support universal healthcare 100% )

Easy to say, hard to do. I have a dozen friends fighting in the war, and 4 friends that have already served and are now home for good. Only 1 says he doesn't believe in what they are doing over there. They all say it really upsets them when people with signs say to bring them home. It makes them feel like friends they have lost was all in vain. They want to see it through, "freedom" in the middle east. We aren't fighting terrorism IMO anymore, now its to help another country that wants our help.

As for the universal healthcare....you do know that in countries where they have that, they can be on waiting lists for years to get surgeries. I would rather pay my 85 dollar hospital visit or 15 dollar GP or specialist copay. Just my opinion!

 

[chibipinkbunny]

My Aunt just sent me a very interesting email. I don't know if you guys know, but my uncle ran for Lt. governor office for the libertarian party back in the 80's so he and my aunt knows some politics.

So, my adventure with Obama actually ended. I am sorry to other people that support Obama but he is actually the worst person!

I read both books, Audacity of Hope and Dreams of my father, and he acts like he devotes himself to help the poor people everywhere. But I am sorry to tell you this, it is not true.

I really don't want to get into the details because the new president already disappointed me.

I guess I am going to vote for Ron Paul in 2012 and hopefully he will win next time.

Lol, well you had a quick turn around . Just goes to show what an effect the liberal media, and public education has on young people. I guess if you start hearing it enough you consider it truth. Don't worry though, if Ron Paul picks up the GOP nomination the media will dig up dirt, or make up dirt on him. Nobody is perfect, but it seems as though the media blows things out of proportion on conservative candidates.

 

[phar2013]

The cost of education will always go up every year since most politicans think that young people (college students) will never vote...so pissing us off will not matter...They only care about making the old people happy...

So true

 

[phar2013]

Exactly what my sarcasm was directed at previously. Watching him speak of "lowering the costs of education for our children" struck no chord with me but the crowd always erupted with acceptance. Afterall, this would be an excellent concept if it were to actually become reality. Regardless, I am warming up my magical plastic card and am fully prepared to pay every cent of pharmacy school because in my opinion, it's well worth it. And since when do great things in life come for free?

This would be fine if it were always the case but getting my FAFSA rejected for the past 5 years in a row has been pretty aggravating when other students get countless dollars thrown at them in financial aid; yet, never cease to take extravagant vacations right in the face of all those helping to support their education. So you can't afford to expand your horizon in a classroom but you can afford to go to Cancun for 3 weeks during the summer? Niiiccceee. Way to live the life of a fraudulent individual. The idea and motivation behind financial aid is a beautiful thing but I have witnessed so many accounts of it being abused that it leaves me feeling a bit bitter (if you couldn't tell, lol).

Just curious how did you pay for school then...private loans, working, and/or parents?

 

[SHC1984]

Easy to say, hard to do. I have a dozen friends fighting in the war, and 4 friends that have already served and are now home for good. Only 1 says he doesn't believe in what they are doing over there. They all say it really upsets them when people with signs say to bring them home. It makes them feel like friends they have lost was all in vain. They want to see it through, "freedom" in the middle east. We aren't fighting terrorism IMO anymore, now its to help another country that wants our help.

As for the universal healthcare....you do know that in countries where they have that, they can be on waiting lists for years to get surgeries. I would rather pay my 85 dollar hospital visit or 15 dollar GP or specialist copay. Just my opinion!

Agree with you 100%!!! 99.99% of the things that come out of a politican's mouth NEVER happen...but that can be GOOD news since that means the taxes won't go up!!!! If what everyone here says is true then Obama does NOT really care about the poor and therefore will be too lazy to change the tax systems....afterall, I am sure he is rich (most politicans are rich) so why will he want to tax himself higher??

 

[SHC1984]

Exactly what my sarcasm was directed at previously. Watching him speak of "lowering the costs of education for our children" struck no chord with me but the crowd always erupted with acceptance. Afterall, this would be an excellent concept if it were to actually become reality. Regardless, I am warming up my magical plastic card and am fully prepared to pay every cent of pharmacy school because in my opinion, it's well worth it. And since when do great things in life come for free?

This would be fine if it were always the case but getting my FAFSA rejected for the past 5 years in a row has been pretty aggravating when other students get countless dollars thrown at them in financial aid; yet, never cease to take extravagant vacations right in the face of all those helping to support their education. So you can't afford to expand your horizon in a classroom but you can afford to go to Cancun for 3 weeks during the summer? Niiiccceee. Way to live the life of a fraudulent individual. The idea and motivation behind financial aid is a beautiful thing but I have witnessed so many accounts of it being abused that it leaves me feeling a bit bitter (if you couldn't tell, lol).

I always thought FAFSA = LOANS!!! I did not know that FAFSA = FREE money that you don't have to pay back!!! I guess I learn something new everyday!

 

[naseuy]

Easy to say, hard to do. I have a dozen friends fighting in the war, and 4 friends that have already served and are now home for good. Only 1 says he doesn't believe in what they are doing over there. They all say it really upsets them when people with signs say to bring them home. It makes them feel like friends they have lost was all in vain. They want to see it through, "freedom" in the middle east. We aren't fighting terrorism IMO anymore, now its to help another country that wants our help.

As for the universal healthcare....you do know that in countries where they have that, they can be on waiting lists for years to get surgeries. I would rather pay my 85 dollar hospital visit or 15 dollar GP or specialist copay. Just my opinion!

Not to disrespect the soldiers, but it isn't just their war. It's america's war. We really need to evaluate if we really have a just purpose and the means for continuing this war.

As for universal healthcare, it being crappy health care is a very legitimate argument, but at least it's better than no healthcare at all?

 

[PrepharmKID]

Not to disrespect the soldiers, but it isn't just their war. It's america's war. We really need to evaluate if we really have a just purpose and the means for continuing this war.

As for universal healthcare, it being crappy health care is a very legitimate argument, but at least it's better than no healthcare at all?

I think my point was that since they are there firsthand, they can see that it's making a difference. But we can agree to disagree on that.

About the universal healthcare, I like my 15 dollar copay. I would rather pay that instead of being on a waiting list for two years to remove cancerous skin or whatever the issue is. I have a friend from canada that lives in CA and when he needs to see specialists, he gets on a waiting list 6 months to a year long. He flies back up there just for that reason. I like being able to get scheduled in tomorrow or the day after when I call the doctor. But that's just my personal preference.

 

[SHC1984]

I think my point was that since they are there firsthand, they can see that it's making a difference. But we can agree to disagree on that.

About the universal healthcare, I like my 15 dollar copay. I would rather pay that instead of being on a waiting list for two years to remove cancerous skin or whatever the issue is. I have a friend from canada that lives in CA and when he needs to see specialists, he gets on a waiting list 6 months to a year long. He flies back up there just for that reason. I like being able to get scheduled in tomorrow or the day after when I call the doctor. But that's just my personal preference.

The war shouldn't have started in the first place...Bush was an idiot for starting it. However, since it has already started AND lasted for many years...I can see your point in cleaning it up...

There are pros and cons of universal healthcare system.
Pros-everyone will get healthcare, doctors actually care about the patients and want whats the best for the patients (won't cheat patients to put more money in their pockets), no one will get turn down b/c they have no money to see the doctor (bad reason to turn someone down IMO)
Cons- long wait periods (you have mentioned)

 

[PrepharmKID]

The war shouldn't have started in the first place...Bush was an idiot for starting it. However, since it has already started AND lasted for many years...I can see your point in cleaning it up...

There are pros and cons of universal healthcare system.
Pros-everyone will get healthcare, doctors actually care about the patients and want whats the best for the patients (won't cheat patients to put more money in their pockets), no one will get turn down b/c they have no money to see the doctor (bad reason to turn someone down IMO)
Cons- long wait periods (you have mentioned)

Well I think we had good reason to go over. But it should have been planned first. It was just a really big mess and still is.

Yeah, i can see how you are saying it would be good for everyone to have insurance. But I guess I just see it as a privelege, not a right.

I am curious what percentage of people see a doctor for yearly check up's, etc? If maybe only 20 percent of the population goes to the doctor when they need it, imagine how busy it would be if everyone knew they could go. WOW. I just made up those numbers, but i can imagine it being that close....

 

[BMBiology]

About the universal healthcare, I like my 15 dollar copay. I would rather pay that instead of being on a waiting list for two years to remove cancerous skin or whatever the issue is...I like being able to get scheduled in tomorrow or the day after when I call the doctor. But that's just my personal preference.

Let's make it clear.

First, universal healthcare does not mean elimination of private insurances. Like in other nations, you can go with the private insurance or universal healthcare. You have an option.

Second, under universal healthcare, you will be seen immediately for emergency situations including skin cancer. But if you feel you need to be seen immediately for an allergy, then you can keep your private insurance.

There are millions of people including children who do not have healthcare in this country. Let's also give them the option of receiving universal healthcare.

 

[naseuy]

I think my point was that since they are there firsthand, they can see that it's making a difference. But we can agree to disagree on that.

About the universal healthcare, I like my 15 dollar copay. I would rather pay that instead of being on a waiting list for two years to remove cancerous skin or whatever the issue is. I have a friend from canada that lives in CA and when he needs to see specialists, he gets on a waiting list 6 months to a year long. He flies back up there just for that reason. I like being able to get scheduled in tomorrow or the day after when I call the doctor. But that's just my personal preference.

Must be great to have coverage.

Sucks for those who don't though.

 

[PrepharmKID]

Let's make it clear.

First, universal healthcare does not mean elimination of private insurances. Like in other nations, you can go with the private insurance or universal healthcare. You have an option.

Second, under universal healthcare, you will be seen immediately for emergency situations including skin cancer. But if you feel you need to be seen immediately for an allergy, then you can keep your private insurance.

There are millions of people including children who do not have healthcare in this country. Let's also give them the option of receiving universal healthcare.

I never said private insurance would cease to exist. I just dont agree with having to pay taxes that are going to go to other peoples insurance.

There will always be some sort of wait for universal healthcare. Here is some info for you:

Studies by the Commonwealth Fun found that 57% of Canadians reported waiting 4 weeks or more to see a specialist.

A March 2, 2004 article in the Canadian Medical Association Journal stated, "Saskatchewan is under fire for having the longest waiting time in the country for a diagnostic MRI — a whopping 22 months.

A February 28, 2006 article in The New York Times quoted Dr. Brian Day as saying, "This is a country in which dogs can get a hip replacement in under a week and in which humans can wait two to three years."

In a 2007 episode of ABC News 20/20, host John Stossel cited numerous examples of Canadians who had difficulty accessing health care.

According to the Fraser Institute, treatment time from initial referral by a GP through consultation with a specialist to final treatment, across all specialties and all procedures (emergency, non-urgent, and elective), averaged 17.7 weeks in 2005.

And in regards to you saying you have a choice between private and government health care:

The Canada Health Act, which sets the conditions with which provincial/territorial health insurance plans must comply if they wish to receive their full transfer payments from the federal government, does not allow charges to insured persons for insured services (defined as medically necessary care provided in hospitals or by physicians). Canada remains the only industrialized country that outlaws privately financed purchases of core medical services.

Is this really what you want out of our insurance in the US? I sure as heck dont. Too many problems.

As for children with no insurance... We have that addressed already. There is a county hospital down the street from my house and there is assistance for those that cant afford insurance.

And yes, it's nice having insurance. Pretty sure every school offers it when you sign up for classes. Works out great.

 

[BMBiology]

As for children with no insurance... We have that addressed already. There is a county hospital down the street from my house and there is assistance for those that cant afford insurance.

So it is now about taxes? Fine. Do you think sending a child with a bacteria infection to a county hospital rather than a family practice actually save tax payers money?

 

[PrepharmKID]

So it is now about taxes? Fine. Do you think sending a child with a bacteria infection to a county hospital rather than a family practice actually save tax payers money?

Are you saying a child with a bacteria infection is not allowed to go to a GP? I just stated "other assistance". My dad was out of a job when I was about 5 years old and I am pretty sure we had some sort of assistance when I had to go to the doctor for my asthma. That would the the "other assistance".

And how do you think this universal health insurance is gonna get paid for if not partly from taxpayers? Maybe the money will rain from the heavens. That would be cool.

 

[PrepharmKID]

Maybe you're just saying some random homeless child? I dont really know what you mean by a child. The county hospital is around for a reason. If people didn't go, there would be no reason for it to be open, so I guess you could say it is fulfilling it's requirements by allowing anyone to go visit.

And hey, at least if you go to the ER at a hospital, county or not, you'll know you can get in faster than visiting a doctor in canada! So i'd say what we have to offer currently is tons better than what universal healthcare might!

 

[PharmD321]

Nicholas --

Our friends at the Democratic National Committee laid it all on the line to bring change this year.

We've been reviewing the books, and the DNC went into considerable debt to secure victory for Barack and Joe. It took unprecedented resources to staff up all 50 states, train field organizers, and build the technology to reach as many swing voters as possible.

It worked.

But it also left the DNC in debt. So before we do anything else, we need to help pay for this winning strategy.

Will you make a donation of $30 or more now? You'll get a limited edition 2008 Victory T-shirt:

https://donate.barackobama.com/victoryshirt12

The DNC's 50-state field strategy was crucial to our campaign's success, as well as victories for Democrats up and down the ballot. Their organizing infrastructure allowed us to compete -- and win -- in states that seemed insurmountable just four years ago.

They took out substantial loans to make it happen. The DNC didn't hold back, and now, neither can we.

You were there for this campaign when we needed to reach out to more voters and compete in more states. Now we're relying on grassroots supporters like you to come through for this movement once again.

We'll get to work transforming this country. But first, we need to take care of the DNC.

Please make a donation of $30 or more today and receive your Obama Victory T-shirt:

https://donate.barackobama.com/victoryshirt12

Thank you for everything,

David

David Plouffe
Campaign Manager
Obama for America


Please donate: https://donate.barackobama.com/victoryshirt12



Why did they send this to me? I don't want to donate to someone that is in debt if I am already in debt. I would rather donate this site to have better resources to help young people learn about their career paths to medical field and also help feed the poor people in the civic center.

And, I thought that obama said that he didn't accept loan money from his donors?

EDIT: Yes prepharmkid, you might have told me so but I had 2 different views (I liked ron paul and used to like obama) and then I figure out from everyone's clues (including you) that this new president isn't very good at all.

 

[PrepharmKID]

Nicholas --

Our friends at the Democratic National Committee laid it all on the line to bring change this year.

We've been reviewing the books, and the DNC went into considerable debt to secure victory for Barack and Joe. It took unprecedented resources to staff up all 50 states, train field organizers, and build the technology to reach as many swing voters as possible.

It worked.

But it also left the DNC in debt. So before we do anything else, we need to help pay for this winning strategy.

Will you make a donation of $30 or more now? You'll get a limited edition 2008 Victory T-shirt:

https://donate.barackobama.com/victoryshirt12

The DNC's 50-state field strategy was crucial to our campaign's success, as well as victories for Democrats up and down the ballot. Their organizing infrastructure allowed us to compete -- and win -- in states that seemed insurmountable just four years ago.

They took out substantial loans to make it happen. The DNC didn't hold back, and now, neither can we.

You were there for this campaign when we needed to reach out to more voters and compete in more states. Now we're relying on grassroots supporters like you to come through for this movement once again.

We'll get to work transforming this country. But first, we need to take care of the DNC.

Please make a donation of $30 or more today and receive your Obama Victory T-shirt:

https://donate.barackobama.com/victoryshirt12

Thank you for everything,

David

David Plouffe
Campaign Manager
Obama for America


Please donate: https://donate.barackobama.com/victoryshirt12



Why did they send this to me? I don't want to donate to someone that is in debt if I am already in debt...

And, I thought that obama said that he didn't accept loan money from his candidates?

LMAO!

 

[AngelaCL]

Why did they send this to me? I don't want to donate to someone that is in debt if I am already in debt. I would rather donate this site to have better resources to help young people learn about their career paths to medical field and also help feed the poor people in the civic center.

Okay.... If you don't want to donate, don't donate! Donate to whatever cause you believe in. BOTH campaigns had to fundraise and ask people to volunteer in order to run. Why would you expect them to not ask?

 

[naseuy]

Maybe you're just saying some random homeless child? I dont really know what you mean by a child. The county hospital is around for a reason. If people didn't go, there would be no reason for it to be open, so I guess you could say it is fulfilling it's requirements by allowing anyone to go visit.

And hey, at least if you go to the ER at a hospital, county or not, you'll know you can get in faster than visiting a doctor in canada! So i'd say what we have to offer currently is tons better than what universal healthcare might!

If people were to only visit emergency care units when they have a health problem, that's costly to both the individual and to the government that funds the hospital.

Many diseases are asymptomatic during the first stages, but if people were to visit their doctors only when they start feeling ill, then the chance of recovery would decrease significantly.

 

[PrePharmD]

The war shouldn't have started in the first place...Bush was an idiot for starting it. However, since it has already started AND lasted for many years...I can see your point in cleaning it up...

There are pros and cons of universal healthcare system.
Pros-everyone will get healthcare, doctors actually care about the patients and want whats the best for the patients (won't cheat patients to put more money in their pockets), no one will get turn down b/c they have no money to see the doctor (bad reason to turn someone down IMO)
Cons- long wait periods (you have mentioned)

By no means do I like Bush, but one man cannot be blamed for everything. There were a lot of people who agreed with him at the time and when public opinion changed, they changed, pointing the finger at Bush (i.e. Joe Biden). Clinton's legacy is spotless yet terrorists were learning to fly planes in our country during his term. Presidents for years have known about the threat of terrorism but have done nothing. When somebody finally does something, everyone jumps on them. I think doing the wrong thing and doing nothing are both equally worthy of criticism. BTW, Clinton also thought there were weapons of mass destruction, yet chose to do nothing. Good thing September 11th will go down in history as having occurred during Bush's term even though it happened months into his presidency, because all of the mistakes that led to it had nothing to do with Bush at all.

 

[PrepharmKID]

If people were to only visit emergency care units when they have a health problem, that's costly to both the individual and to the government that funds the hospital.

Many diseases are asymptomatic during the first stages, but if people were to visit their doctors only when they start feeling ill, then the chance of recovery would decrease significantly.

Umm ok. You really aren't disputing a single thing with me in that post cause I NEVER once said sait that people with no health insurance should go to the hospital. THe last paragraph was merely a joke at the universal healthcare plan canada has in place. What I said was true, you can get in faster to our hospitals than a doctor in Canada.

NO ONE is preventing someone from visiting a doctor or specialist here. Not sure why you are implying such a thing.

 

[PharmD321]

By no means do I like Bush, but one man cannot be blamed for everything. There were a lot of people who agreed with him at the time and when public opinion changed, they changed, pointing the finger at Bush (i.e. Joe Biden). Clinton's legacy is spotless yet terrorists were learning to fly planes in our country during his term. Presidents for years have known about the threat of terrorism but have done nothing. When somebody finally does something, everyone jumps on them. I think doing the wrong thing and doing nothing are both equally worthy of criticism. BTW, Clinton also thought there were weapons of mass destruction, yet chose to do nothing. Good thing September 11th will go down in history as having occurred during Bush's term even though it happened months into his presidency, because all of the mistakes that led to it had nothing to do with Bush at all.

You forgot to mention that Bill's wife, Hillary Clinton, voted for the war in Iraq. Obama wasn't even in the senate during that time so he had no choice if he could vote or not vote for the war in Iraq. It was congress that decided if we should go to war or not and then congress approved, then bush decided that we should go to war.

EDIT: also, I bought that book on ebay, losing osama, and I can't wait until I read!!!

 

[BMBiology]

You really aren't disputing a single thing with me in that post cause I NEVER once said sait that people with no health insurance should go to the hospital.

You don't seem to understand that many private offices will not take you unless you can pay for it. They will tell you to go to a county hospital, which end up costing the tax payers more money.

 

[cdhoward]

You forgot to mention that Bill's wife, Hillary Clinton, voted for the war in Iraq. Obama wasn't even in the senate during that time so he had no choice if he could vote or not vote for the war in Iraq. It was congress that decided if we should go to war or not and then congress approved, then bush decided that we should go to war.

EDIT: also, I bought that book on ebay, losing osama, and I can't wait until I read!!!

Did you get a good deal? Anyway, break the book down for us after you read it.

 

[PrepharmKID]

You don't seem to understand that many private offices will not take you unless you can pay for it. They will tell you to go to a county hospital, which end up costing the tax payers more money.

Once again you would be misquoting me if you are saying I said "anyone can go to any doctor and get accepted as a patient any time". Private practices CAN turn anyone away they want technically, especially if they are cash only. Unless someone finds actual proof, I think I would like to believe that someone going to a county hospital and paying out of pocket, OR proving they need financial assistance is CHEAPER than universal healthcare. I am leaving this open to anyone that can find proof that is incorrect. Since your post ONLY refers to the cost side, I would think that charging someone at a county hospital is cheaper than allowing every person in this country universal healthcare. But like I said, if there is research that proves me wrong, post it please!

 

[BMBiology]

No one is trying to convince you otherwise. Cost is a valid issue but the argument you are making lacks the basic understanding of the issue. Hospital visits by people without insurance for non emergency illness is one of the main arguments for universal healthcare since it will save tax payers money but ironically, you are using the same argument to argue against universal healthcare.

 

[PrepharmKID]

No one is trying to convince you otherwise. Cost is a valid issue but the argument you are making lacks the basic understanding of the issue. I will leave it at that.

I am not trying to convince anyone, as a matter of fact, I left it open for anyone to show me numbers that prove it either way if they want. Apparently I have a better understanding as I am able to find and post at least some evidence to support my stance. But I think I said it earlier, lets agree to disagree.

 

[naseuy]

NO ONE is preventing someone from visiting a doctor or specialist here. Not sure why you are implying such a thing.

The cost of healthcare is preventing most uninsured people from getting healthcare. You may argue that they could go to free health clinics, but there are significant barriers to those as well. The lack of funding and voluntary staff, limited sites prevents it from being accessible.

I am not trying to convince anyone, as a matter of fact, I left it open for anyone to show me numbers that prove it either way if they want. Apparently I have a better understanding as I am able to find and post at least some evidence to support my stance. But I think I said it earlier, lets agree to disagree.

When you present an argument, the burden of proof lies on you. It's a little ridiculous say, "I present point A, unless you can prove me wrong, I am right".

 

[PrepharmKID]

The cost of healthcare is preventing most uninsured people from getting healthcare. You may argue that they could go to free health clinics, but there are significant barriers to those as well. The lack of funding and voluntary staff, limited sites prevents it from being accessible.

This argument can be presented to both sides, for and against universal healthcare. It seems that in the US as well as countries with healthcare for everyone, they all have this problem.

When you present an argument, the burden of proof lies on you. It's a little ridiculous say, "I present point A, unless you can prove me wrong, I am right".

Ummm, I did present information about the universal healthcare system and how it does not make it better, unless you dont mind waiting i think it said "17.7 months" for a simple MRI. Read a few posts up. Lots of info!

 

[BMBiology]

You really aren't disputing a single thing with me in that post cause I NEVER once said sait that people with no health insurance should go to the hospital.

I hate to point out the obvious but you did:

As for children with no insurance... We have that addressed already. There is a county hospital down the street from my house and there is assistance for those that cant afford insurance.

 

[naseuy]

This argument can be presented to both sides, for and against universal healthcare. It seems that in the US as well as countries with healthcare for everyone, they all have this problem.



Ummm, I did present information about the universal healthcare system and how it does not make it better, unless you dont mind waiting i think it said "17.7 months" for a simple MRI. Read a few posts up. Lots of info!

"Unless someone finds actual proof, I think I would like to believe that someone going to a county hospital and paying out of pocket, OR proving they need financial assistance is CHEAPER than universal healthcare. I am leaving this open to anyone that can find proof that is incorrect."

I was referring that statement, but okay.

 

[PrepharmKID]

I hate to point out the obvious but you did:

Uh yeah, i said it write here:

there is assistance for those that cant afford insurance

Do you not know how to read?

 

[BMBiology]

Uh yeah, i said it write here:

Do you not know how to read?

Isn't it ironic that someone who is asking me if i can read, misspelled the word "right"?

 

[PrepharmKID]

Lets put it this way, I have successfuly presented information to back what I have been saying, you have not. We should just drop it at this point because neither will be persuaded by the other.

 

[PharmD321]

Did you get a good deal? Anyway, break the book down for us after you read it.

I bought it on ebay for 17 bucks with free shipping so its not that bad of a deal. I will update to you guys what I find.

 

[naseuy]

Okay, Play nice.

 

[PrepharmKID]

You don't seem to understand that many private offices will not take you unless you can pay for it. They will tell you to go to a county hospital, which end up costing the tax payers more money.

I am almost positve you spelled "ends" wrong in this sentence. That would make the sentence grammatically correct. Easy to point out minor spelling issues in someones posts isn't it? I am willing to bet I could find errors in most peoples posts. So isn't it ironic that someone accusing someone of spelling a word incorrectly also happens to type a word incorrectly as well?

 

[PrepharmKID]

I work during the afternoon/evening doing data entry. I am required to have speed in what I do, I was thinking faster than I was typing and made a simple mistake. Obviously I know which correct word to use. I think you just need to chill out