NYC programs

[mountebank]

Just wondering what are some final thoughts about the NY programs. I know its a big 4 year city. But I really enjoyed St. Lukes/Rooselvelt. I think its a great 3 yr program with lots of opportunities as well as great housing. The residents are happy and get to enjoy the city, unlike residents at Jacobi and Bellevue.

By the way, BI (NYC) sent out an email...and they are back!! Not sure if this is going to change how I'm going to rank them. The BI program has a bunch of "off-site" rotations at Jacobi, St.Lukes, Elmherst. Not too attractive when these sites have their own EM residency programs.

other thoughts?

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[Hornet871]

What's the scoop on BI, big guy? I'm kinda interested myself, but I'm still not sure of their accreditation status.

Their e-mail said that they are now on provisional accreditation. How long does this last? Could they move from provisional status to no status next year or in two years? Or does provisional status mean that they won't even be up for review for another three years, meaning that the earliest they could get the death penalty is 2006?

Also, have you heard the slave-driving hours rumor about BI? I'm told that they get worked to death, but such rumors are hard to verify.

I'm kinda in between about BI vs. North Shore. At North Shore, they don't see much, but their accreditation is never in question. Then again, their location - 90 mins outside the city - sucks.

Any thoughts?

(Probably not, since the NY threads NEVER generate any responses. I don't know if it's because NY people never read this board, or if we're all just jealously guarding our info b/c we [mistakenly] think it'll improve our odds in the match. Watch, there will be another 50 views of this thread, but no responses.)

 

[Apollyon]

Originally posted by Hornet871
(Probably not, since the NY threads NEVER generate any responses. I don't know if it's because NY people never read this board, or if we're all just jealously guarding our info b/c we [mistakenly] think it'll improve our odds in the match. Watch, there will be another 50 views of this thread, but no responses.)

My one thread about NY rejections got a few responses, until someone hijacked it into "What is North Shore like?", instead of starting their own.

One reason why I don't respond to many threads, is because I don't have anything to say. If you want empty blather, or "me too!", Hornet, I'll do that.

90 minutes into the city from North Shore - only if you're commuting in the morning. Even on the train, it's WELL under an hour.

 

[sweetfynesse]

Hornet871, I agree. Most people don't seem to talk much about NYC programs. Although I did a month away-rotation at King's County Hospital in Brooklyn, I can't say I know much about other area programs other than what you learn on interview day. As for KCHC, I truly enjoyed the experience as a medical student unfamiliar with the area. But, I can't imagine completing a residency there. The residents are extremely over-worked. Only the residents that "knew what it was liked before I applied" seemed to like it a little. Some graduating seniors said they would never do it again. Yet still others admit they absolutely loved the experience. It seems they have to start seeing the light at the end of the tunnel (ie PGY3/4) before they have any positive thoughts about the program.

I, too, wish more NY students would relay their experiences with their area hospitals because most of them rotate at several hospitals and would have a better idea of the programs. But, my experience with some NY students (at least during my rotation) is that they are very secretive about the pros and cons of area programs. I guess they think you may take their spot or something silly.

Anyway, mountebank, I was also impressed with SLR. What it lacks in trauma, it makes up in medical/surgical emergencies. I know you will come out well prepared for practice. Plus, the residents are happy, and they do get to enjoy what the city has to offer. And, its a three year deal affiliated with Columbia Univ.

Bellevue- During my rotation at KCHC, I heard several students with good things to say about Bellevue. I honestly don't remember what they were though. I think its really laid back in that they don't have lots of trauma. Actually, some students that rotated there didn't even see one trauma case during their entire rotation. There were a few attendings at KCHC that graduated from the Bellevue residency program, one of whom revealed to me that s/he was so unprepared with level 1 trauma patients before coming to KCHC that s/he almost lost it when she had to crack her first chest. Not to worry, s/he's doing much better now.
Apparently, they don't get much hands on with trauma, but I think the didactics are center focus...

Jacobi- Lots of trauma...Lots of med/surg...Long hours, but residents seem to be happy. At least they were at the interview Great resident training, definitely prepared for anything when you graduate. But, like my attending told me- "is it really necessary to see 100 episodes of appendicitis to learn how to treat it." Same goes with trauma...But, the program has a great name and they do get mad respect outside of NY.

Lincoln- Oh my God...would never put myself through the madness. Long hours 20-22 shifts throughout the four years. Lots of trauma...One of the busiest ERs in NYC and its burroughs-including Jacobi and KCHC. Could probably work anywhere after graduation, but can get great training at many more laxed environments...They won't be on my list...

Mt. Sinai- Great training between Elmherst and Mt. Sinai. Great for those interested in research, as well. Geat name. Attendings from all over the country make for a very diverse faculty. Residents are happy for the most part, and they have great housing, too. Downside: PGY2-4. Sorry, can't think of anything else.

Methodist- Low trauma, but residents rotate through KCHC for trauma. Great commraderie, residents couldn't be more happy. They probably have the best housing options in the area- nice Brooklyn brownstones. Bad idea if you're thinking about academics, being that it is a community program...But if you know you don't want to do academics later, then go for it...its the only other three year deal in the area...

Metropolitan & Maimonides- declined interivews

Northshore- didn't apply, but rotating students love the laxed environment, coupled with great teaching...

Just my thoughts mountebank, hope they help...

 

[codebrown]

What did you guys think about the amout of ancillary support at Bellevue? They are short nurses and staff and I know that the residents do a lot of patient moving, IVs, etc. I think this is somewhat of a drawback, but on the other hand, I guess that you do get good at lines, etc. I thought that the people there are great however. Seems to be a pretty cerebral place. They have a big focus on underserved patients- homeless, sunstance abuse, etc. A real county hospital feel- although less trauma than many county hospitals. Any other thought appreciated.

 

[Future EM?]

North Shore - 1 hr from NYC? Huh? I took the LIR and it took me like 20-30 minutes tops. Also really like the program, but feel uneasy about going to a program without a more "national" reputation. I know everyone says jobs are relatively easy to come by. But what about 10 years later? Wouldn't you better off going to a University program where the name would be more recognized? Trying to sort all this out.

St. Luke's Roosevelt - also liked the program. But the PD was kind of strange? Any one get that feeling? Does it have a strong reputation in NYC or nationally? Will the fact that Columbia is starting their own program affect them at all?

 

[Hornet871]

Guys, I guess my North Shore commute time is a bit off. Here's how I estimated:

From hotel (in Times Sq) to Penn Station: 10 mins
LIRR to Manhasset: 35 mins
Taxi from Manhasset station to NS Hospital: 15 mins

That's an hour right there, and that's making good time. When you throw in incidentals, the commute can easily become longer.

Maybe my LIRR time is off, though. If someone has a schedule handy, look it up for me. Thanks.


Unrelated topic: North Shore vs. Jeff? Is it more desirable, I wonder, to live right in the heart of Philly or to live a 40-minute commute from NYC? Depends on what kind of person you are, I know, but what do you guys think? Which situation would afford a single guy more fun?


Thanks for the input.

 

[orthoguy]

Any thoughts on Stony Brook?

 

[sweetfynesse]

Originally posted by Future EM?
...St. Luke's Roosevelt - also liked the program. But the PD was kind of strange? Any one get that feeling? Does it have a strong reputation in NYC or nationally? Will the fact that Columbia is starting their own program affect them at all?

LOL Future EM!!! Indeed the PD was a bit strange, but he's doing a great job and the residents have nothing but good things to say about him...It seems like a lot of residents in the NY area think the residents at SLR are arrogant. Maybe that could have something to do with the 3 vs 4 year deal, who knows... On a national scale, I have no idea how they are viewed. They have quite a few people doing fellowships out of their program, and I guess that says something...Then again, some EM attending don't even know it exists.

 

[Apollyon]

Originally posted by orthoguy
Any thoughts on Stony Brook?

The ONLY thing I know about SB is that, once you are employed, you have to account for EVERY SINGLE MONTH of your life, from High School on - because of that guy who became a nurse at SB (or worked there) and killed a bunch of elderly patients. His name will come to me soon.

 

[shaft]

After my interview at North Shore (which ended at 1:00 pm ish) I was through the Queens-Midtown Tunnel about 12 minutes later and I did not drive faster than 80. Outbound at 8:00 in the am with construction it took 20-25 minutes from said tunnel.

 

[mountebank]

thanks for the input, keep it coming.

SLR- there's a current thread on the "weirdness" of Dr. Lanoix. He's a cool guy, residents like him. He's not a rapist. He has children, whom he loves. Lots of experience. But go with your gut, if his personality is too shakey for you, do go there. Because I've heard "that's how he is."

BI- not sure when they will be reviewed again. Probably less than 3 years (I think). So keep your bags packed if you match there.

 

[mountebank]

above i meant. ...if his personality is too shakey for you DON'T go there. which makes tons of sense.

What's all the hoopla about the distance from North Shore to Manhattan? Why would anyone want to live in Manhattan if they weren't working there? Its so expensive. Live near the hospital, or relatively close and travel to the city on your days off (or when you have time). This is residency, and we are paid worst than the cafeteria cashier, living in Manhattan is not on my list if I match outside the city.

BTY - Personally, I think the strongest program in 5 years will be the new NYP (Cornell/Columbia). There's no doubt about it. This program has the personal and money to put New York EM back on the map. However there are many bugs that will have to be "worked out".

 

[Apollyon]

Originally posted by mountebank
This is residency, and we are paid worst than the cafeteria cashier, living in Manhattan is not on my list if I match outside the city.

Actually, in NYC, resident pay is pretty good; I was able to go to Tahiti on it, and pay cash. The other residents in my program have gone to France, London, Pakistan, Hawaii, and there's another one I know that went to Belize.

The key is to find a cheap place to live (ergo, not Manhattan - unless you can find 4 other people that want to share an apartment - which actually isn't a bad deal, for $5000/month for a 5 bedroom).

 

[mountebank]

There are some fairly cheaper neighborhoods in Queens and Brookyln (safe too!!). I'm willing to do that. Take the Subway in, learn/work, and leave. On days off, party in the city or go to Tahiti!

 

[Apollyon]

Roger that. I paid $720/month to live in Dyker Heights (Brooklyn), and now $675/month to live in Forest Hills (Queens). If I end up at NY-Presbyterian, I'll complete the snotty, snobby trifecta.

 

[mountebank]

there's always DA BRONX

 

[Hornet871]

Any final thoughts on Methodist hospital in Brooklyn? I get a feeling that the residents are overworked, though they seemed happy.

(Residents at Emory are also happy, but boy, are they overworked!)

Making this ROL is much harder than I anticipated. My top five seemed set in stone for the longest time, but this weekend has seen a radical shakeup in the Top 5. Figuring Methodist's place in the Top 5 is making me batty.

Help me, Obi-Wan Kenobi, you're my only hope.

 

[sweetfynesse]

Originally posted by Hornet871
Any final thoughts on Methodist hospital in Brooklyn? I get a feeling that the residents are overworked, though they seemed happy.

(Residents at Emory are also happy, but boy, are they overworked!)...

I didn't rotate at Methodist, nor did I interview at Methodist- but only because of scheduling conflicts. However, during an away rotation at King's County in Brooklyn, I was able to work with a few residents (interns, and chief resident) from the Methodist program who were completing their trauma rotations. They absolutely loved their program, and highly recommended it for people that weren't considering academics in the future. If you aren't sure, then they said Methodist probably isn't the place for you...that's not to say that you can't get an academic position coming out of their program, you just have to look and work harder...maybe you should check to find out whether any of their grads have gone on to fellowships...that could make a difference if you were considering academics...other comments: really laid-back residents lending to great camaraderie, PGY1-3 program, off-service rotations were cool, bread and butter of EM, not a level 1 trauma center which is why they complete trauma at King's County (will definitely see enough trauma there)...i don't think they have serious conflicts with the residents at King's Cty. It appeared that King's Cty residents may not respect them as much, but who cares when those residents work their butt of for four unhappy years....hope this helps

 

[Hornet871]

Hey, man, that was an awesome reply you gave. I posted, you replied with solid info. How rarely that happens so smoothly! You rock, dude. Good luck in the match.


the HORNET

 

[ERMudPhud]

I went to med school in NY and did an internship at Mt. Sinai before going to Denver Health for my EM residency. My information is a little out of date since I left NYC in 1998. I was most impressed with Bellvue and Jacobi. At that time Sinai was still new and BI and SLR were going through a lot of turmoil. My impression now from talking to friends in NYC still hasn't changed much. Bellvue has excellent academics and you will see everything at least once. Some of the best people I have worked with in Denver came from Bellvue. Don't worry about the decreased amount of trauma. Trauma becomes remarkably similar/repetitive after a while and you only need to see so much. The lack of ancillary services resulting in resident doing IV'S and patient transport was a universal problem at every hospital I worked in in NYC (Presbyterian, Harlem, SLR, Sinai, Elmhurst, Bronx VA). Keep in mind that EM traditionally has difficulties with turf battles at places where med/surg are strong(Cornell,Columbia,Sinai) but this doesn't seem to be as big an issue at Bellvue and Jacobi. My wife went to Stony Brook and got a great education as well as a good quality of life so that is another thought. Don't know much about North Shore and the outer borough programs.

 

[Future EM?]

any more specific in regards to SLR or Stanford?