Masters in Neuroscience, potential pathway to PhD?

[Mikayla May]

I am currently debating attending a master's of neuroscience in Europe and was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.

I am interested in clinical neuropsychology but realized during a PhD interview/prospective student weekend that clinical neuropsychology programs appear to neglect the neuroscience/biology and focus more on psychology, mental illness... psychotherapy. I was disappointed to see that less than 1/5th of the courses involved content focused on a biological basis of behavior. Also, the program was nearly $200,000 and I was hoping to get into a program somewhat funded. I want to be totally thrilled to attend a PhD program especially when it is that expensive. I know I could get more of the "neuro" experience through professor research and practicums, but I still feel like I would not have a good grasp on the neuroscience even then.

Recently, I have been considering neuroscience. I feel as though I am more partial to the science than the psychology. My only fear with straight neuroscience is that I will not have enough interaction with people.. part of the reason why I wanted to do neuropsychology was for the hospital aspect and being able to see patients. I am worried I will be unhappy in research/academia alone. (I have also considered neurology but it would require going back to my undergrad and taking pre-med classes and then the MCAT).

My thinking as of now is to attend either a neuroscience or a neuropsychology 1-2 year masters program in Europe. I have looked into Europe for many reasons including later deadlines, GRE not considered, traveling, cost, and neuro specialties. I am hoping that through a master's I can figure out if neuroscience seems more fitting than neuropsychology before applying to full PhD programs again and gain more research experience.

All of the responses I have gotten have been to NOT get a master's because it would be a "waste of time" and that what I really need is more research experience. This is confusing to me because all paid research positions in my state (Colorado) are given to those with master's degrees (I know this because I've applied to more than I'd like to admit). My question is how a master's degree in neuroscience would be valuable, what job opportunities have been found with the degree, and personal reasons for applying to a master's of neuroscience. I would appreciate any feedback and advice you have on the matter. Thanks so much!


Edit:My question is directed towards those who have neuroscience experience vs. neuropsychology because I am trying to understand if a master's in neuroscience would be of value to a PhD program. I have received answers about neuropsychology and understand a master's would not do much good for me. Thanks!

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[wtfook]

Have you applied to research jobs outside of Colorado? It seems like if you're willing to move out of the country for a master's program, you could probably also move across the country for a paid job. There are definitely research jobs for people with a BS. Many psychology jobs have 2 year research manager positions usually for recent bachelor level graduate, and I'm sure there are ones for those interested in neuroscience research.

Are you looking to start a program this fall? Or are you worried about your GRE scores? I'm confused as to why you'd want to go to a program with a later application and no GRE score requirements.

General advice I've seen is that if you have a solid undergrad GPA and were a psychology major, it's not necessary to do a master's degree. The master's is usually recommended if you need to prove you can do well in psych classes and/or you need to compensate for a poor GPA. Otherwise, most PhD programs care a lot about your research experience. Getting publications and presenting are huge and you can do that with an RA job if you're able to find the right labs.

Edit: From reading your previous posts, I noticed that you've already asked this question in another thread and got responses basically exactly the same as what I just said. I feel like you've already gotten feedback on the exact questions you asked in your last paragraph... is there something new you wanted to know?

 

[deleted343839]

Neuroscience and neuropsychology are very different fields. It's important to know that neuropsychology is a subspecialty of clinical psychology. Clinical psychology programs don't "neglect" biology, but it is not the primary emphasis. Any good clinical program will provide solid generalist training in clinical psychology first as a foundation to pursue specialty training in the later stages of your education.

There are less expensive ways of figuring out what you want to do for a career than what you've described. Getting a master's degree abroad sounds like a big hassle for an uncertain outcome.

 

[psych.meout]

As wtfook noted, we've already hashed this out in another thread you previously created.

I am currently debating attending a master's of neuroscience in Europe and was wondering if anyone could give me some advice.

I am interested in clinical neuropsychology but realized during a PhD interview/prospective student weekend that clinical neuropsychology programs appear to neglect the neuroscience/biology and focus more on psychology, mental illness... psychotherapy. I was disappointed to see that less than 1/5th of the courses involved content focused on a biological basis of behavior. Also, the program was nearly $200,000 and I was hoping to get into a program somewhat funded. I want to be totally thrilled to attend a PhD program especially when it is that expensive. I know I could get more of the "neuro" experience through professor research and practicums, but I still feel like I would not have a good grasp on the neuroscience even then.

Recently, I have been considering neuroscience. I feel as though I am more partial to the science than the psychology. My only fear with straight neuroscience is that I will not have enough interaction with people.. part of the reason why I wanted to do neuropsychology was for the hospital aspect and being able to see patients. I am worried I will be unhappy in research/academia alone. (I have also considered neurology but it would require going back to my undergrad and taking pre-med classes and then the MCAT).

My thinking as of now is to attend either a neuroscience or a neuropsychology 1-2 year masters program in Europe. I have looked into Europe for many reasons including later deadlines, GRE not considered, traveling, cost, and neuro specialties. I am hoping that through a master's I can figure out if neuroscience seems more fitting than neuropsychology before applying to full PhD programs again and gain more research experience.

All of the responses I have gotten have been to NOT get a master's because it would be a "waste of time" and that what I really need is more research experience. This is confusing to me because all paid research positions in my state (Colorado) are given to those with master's degrees (I know this because I've applied to more than I'd like to admit). My question is how a master's degree in neuroscience would be valuable, what job opportunities have been found with the degree, and personal reasons for applying to a master's of neuroscience. I would appreciate any feedback and advice you have on the matter. Thanks so much!

1. Psychology is a science.
2. You won't be licensable with a neuroscience degree, even with a PhD, which means you will not be a provider for patients in a hospital setting.
3. The reason why neuroscience and biological bases of behavior are not the primary emphases of clinical psychology programs is that they are focused on training you as a clinical psychologist first, before providing any specialty training.
4. Clinical psychology degrees from Europe are not licensable in the US. There are different standards and requirements.
5. If you're willing to go to Europe for a master's degree that is of marginal value in attending a doctoral program in the US, you should be willing to apply to research positions across the US, not just Colorado.

 

[smalltownpsych]

It might not help you figure out what you want to do, as far as a career in neuroscience, but then again spending a few years in Europe will still be a great experience. Just don't expect it to help you much with a career in the US.

The real question is what is it that you want to do? Being interested in a broad topic like neuroscience is a good start, but there are many aspects of that. Psychologists tend to be more interested in the more observable, reportable, and measurable aspects of neurological function as opposed to the underlying mechanisms of how that comes about. Meanwhile other scientists are looking at how the CNS itself functions either on an anatomical level, a cellular level, a genetic level, or a biochemical level. For them, the behavior, thoughts, and emotions that the organism might have are secondary.

By the way, researchers and academics interact with people everyday. In fact, there is much more social interaction in an academic job than there is in a pure clinical job. I am going to be teaching a couple of classes at a local college starting in the fall primarily to increase my social interactions with a somewhat normal population - students.

 

[deleted343839]

to increase my social interactions with a somewhat normal population - students

Come back and tell us what you think of these "normal" folk.

 

[smalltownpsych]

Come back and tell us what you think of these "normal" folk.

I guess since I haven't taught in a few years I am all caught up in rosy retrospection and forgetting about some of the very clear clinical issues that I had to deal with as an instructor as well. Thanks for reminding me. Geez, with friends like this...

 

[Mikayla May]

Have you applied to research jobs outside of Colorado? It seems like if you're willing to move out of the country for a master's program, you could probably also move across the country for a paid job. There are definitely research jobs for people with a BS. Many psychology jobs have 2 year research manager positions usually for recent bachelor level graduate, and I'm sure there are ones for those interested in neuroscience research.

Are you looking to start a program this fall? Or are you worried about your GRE scores? I'm confused as to why you'd want to go to a program with a later application and no GRE score requirements.

General advice I've seen is that if you have a solid undergrad GPA and were a psychology major, it's not necessary to do a master's degree. The master's is usually recommended if you need to prove you can do well in psych classes and/or you need to compensate for a poor GPA. Otherwise, most PhD programs care a lot about your research experience. Getting publications and presenting are huge and you can do that with an RA job if you're able to find the right labs.

Edit: From reading your previous posts, I noticed that you've already asked this question in another thread and got responses basically exactly the same as what I just said. I feel like you've already gotten feedback on the exact questions you asked in your last paragraph... is there something new you wanted to know?

I am looking to start a program this Fall, yes. I am not worried per se about my GRE scores, but they are definitely a weaker part of my application. The deadlines in Europe are much more extended as opposed to the U.S. and I am definitely ready for more schooling and traveling. Also, I did post in another thread, but since I have been considering neuroscience more than neuropsychology, I thought I would re-phrase my question and ask about a neuroscience pathway. I spoke to an individual that got a master's in cognitive neuroscience and it helped her in the process of gaining admission into a PhD neuroscience program so I was curious as to other responses.

 

[PSYDNEUROGUY]

I am looking to start a program this Fall, yes. I am not worried per se about my GRE scores, but they are definitely a weaker part of my application. The deadlines in Europe are much more extended as opposed to the U.S. and I am definitely ready for more schooling and traveling. Also, I did post in another thread, but since I have been considering neuroscience more than neuropsychology, I thought I would re-phrase my question and ask about a neuroscience pathway. I spoke to an individual that got a master's in cognitive neuroscience and it helped her in the process of gaining admission into a PhD neuroscience program so I was curious as to other responses.

I think if neuroscience is really your passion, I would dedicate your efforts to that. I think you might find it difficult trying to do both, when in reality, focusing on doing well on one thing for the time being might be in your best interest. Later of course, by all means expand and integrate other disciplines with your neuroscience training. As far as APA is concerned and ethically speaking, the knowledge you would use in clinical practice would come from the degree that grants you your license. In other words, while I might have advanced training in cognitive neuroscience compared to other neuropsychologists, the scope of my practice is defined by the state board (i.e., testing, therapy, etc.). This isn't to say that my knowledge can't be used, but it would be so in an indirect way. For example, I am able to collaborate with other medical professionals and talk about complex topics in neurology, neuropsychiatry with a very firm knowledge base in the biochemistry and biophysics of the CNS, but again, that is more-so to help me conceptualize what I need to do within the scope of my clinical practice.

 

[Prototype123]

Neuroscience and neuropsychology are very different fields. It's important to know that neuropsychology is a subspecialty of clinical psychology. Clinical psychology programs don't "neglect" biology, but it is not the primary emphasis. Any good clinical program will provide solid generalist training in clinical psychology first as a foundation to pursue specialty training in the later stages of your education.

There are less expensive ways of figuring out what you want to do for a career than what you've described. Getting a master's degree abroad sounds like a big hassle for an uncertain outcome.

No, neuropsychology is a subset of psychology, be it clinical or research based.

 

[deleted343839]

No, neuropsychology is a subset of psychology, be it clinical or research based.

I'm aware of the textbook definition, but the OP referred to neuropsychology in terms of the clinical discipline, and so do most of the posts on this forum.