Is a comfortable life as a PT with $250k in debt possible?

[Boodles130]

Hello,

I am currently applying for PT schools and at this moment have been accepted to a private PT school. It's a great feeling to be accepted, but unfortunately the school's tuition is very expensive. I have estimated that on top of my current undergrad loans, if I were to attend this school, that I would end up with around $250k in debt (with living expenses included). Is this even a realistic debt to be able to pay back with a PT's salary while living comfortably and eventually having a family? I want to be a PT more than anything, but seeing as how this school is my only current choice, I feel that fulfilling that dream in this way will make it become a financial nightmare. Any input would be greatly appreciated.

Thank you.

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[starrsgirl]

Ouch. I think you might be able to pull it off as a single guy/girl. But with a family? With real expenses? That is LITERALLY a house payment. In fact 2 mortgage payments in a lot of areas?

(I'm roughly figuring a $3000/month loan repayment!!! For 10 years!!!!!!!!!). IF you start working at 60K (which might even be a high estimate depending on your area), you will see about $4500 per month take home pay. So minus the debt load, now you are at $1500 per month (Which by the way, is 18K per year salary...only slightly above minimum wage level and considered poverty level if you add a family on top). You figure 50% (25% max on housing, 25% max on transportation are general accepted guidelines) of that will give you about $700 to spend on room AND board. So you'll need to live in something around $400/month and drive something less than $300 per month in car payment and gas. Both of those last figures seem completely implausible to me. You will only find something that cheap if you live with tons of roommates and walk everywhere....and remember, this will be for 10 years. I promise that is not enough money to support anyone on, spouse or kids. Sure, if you are fine being single, you can pull it off. But your scenario is my financial nightmare. (I'm an older student so I've been around once or twice, paid of school loans, worked a few jobs....if you haven't done any of that yet, please understand that those dollars will become very real to you when you are working and paying debt back). The most concerning part of this scenario too is that while you are paying off debt and living on minimum wage, you will not be able to start an emergency fund or start saving for retirement. It probably doesn't sound that important either right now, but no matter how much you love your job, most people do want to be able to retire at some point too.

Don't feel pressured to sign on the dotted debt line. There are many ways to a similar end goal.

 

[DesertPT]

 

[NewDPT31]

I borrowed 250k. Stupid stupid decision. I'm doing income based repayment for $150k of it, and had another 100k in private. It's absolutely suffocating. Even with my fed loans capped at 15%income, i still have to pay for the private loans too, so my minimum is around 2100/month.
The quote of 60k is 4500/month is false. Remember there are federal and state taxes. 60k is probably around 3500? I'm guessing.
Now, I supplement my salary($78k)(4x10) with 1 day a week(my day off) prn x10hrs, and then prolly 20 sundays a year, I work a lot of 60 hr weeks, and all in all make around 115k. but I can't sustain this for too terribly long.

DONT DO IT. Seriously. PT is fun. It's great. But it's still a job and it's not worth donating half of your salary to citibank. Go to the cheapest school possible. Seriously. Nobody cares where you go or what the name is. Get a degree from an accredited school, pass the boards, and you are fine.

 

[truthseeker]

seems like a lot to me. Must be cheaper options.

 

[DesertPT]

...had another 100k in private...

This is what suffocates people. Not nearly as much mercy as federal loans. As NewDPT31 is testifying to, private educational loans are what you must absolutely avoid like the plague.

 

[DesertPT]

The quote of 60k is 4500/month is false. Remember there are federal and state taxes. 60k is probably around 3500? I'm guessing.
Now, I supplement my salary($78k)(4x10) with 1 day a week(my day off) prn x10hrs, and then prolly 20 sundays a year, I work a lot of 60 hr weeks, and all in all make around 115k. but I can't sustain this for too terribly long.

60k turning into 3500 left per month would be 30% taxes...maybe if you were filing as single and had no exemptions or credits whatsoever you could get close to that, but there are very few people within the income range of PT who pay 30% in taxes. Married filing jointly with a couple of children and exemptions/credits is probably half that, and even as a single you could probably get it down to around 20%.

If you are making 115k gross/year and paying 2100/month towards loans, you would have $5k/month left you live on even assuming a generous 25% lost to taxes, no? And you only lose that much to taxes if you are single, and if you are single you have no family to support so seems like you could live reasonably comfortably on $3k/month cash-in-pocket. 115k/year should leave you with at least $6.5-7k/month post-taxes, doesn't seem like 2100/month loan payment would be that suffocating.

What am I missing here? I'm genuinely curious for my own future knowledge's sake. Unless of course you have a family to support, but I didn't think you did.

 

[Boodles130]

@knj27 You raised a good point to which, unless if I'm missing something here, would be a very doable situation for myself if I were in this situation. I've done some research and there are several different options to pay back loans specifically in deciding how long someone would want to finish paying their debt by. With a $250k loan it can range from $1.5k per month over 25 years to $2.5k per month over 10 years. It seems fairly tolerable but I don't know if I want to pay off my debt for 25 years just from school alone.

@NewDPT31 would you mind shedding some more light on what your situation is as to why you find it suffocating while having a $115k income? Unless if I'm really missing something, I feel that situation would not be so bad. I'm trying to make the best informed decision with the options available to me.

 

[DesertPT]

...I don't know if I want to pay off my debt for 25 years just from school alone.

This is where it gets scary...you're committing yourself essentially to a lifetime with much less expendable income

 

[NewDPT31]

60k turning into 3500 left per month would be 30% taxes...maybe if you were filing as single and had no exemptions or credits whatsoever you could get close to that, but there are very few people within the income range of PT who pay 30% in taxes. Married filing jointly with a couple of children and exemptions/credits is probably half that, and even as a single you could probably get it down to around 20%.

If you are making 115k gross/year and paying 2100/month towards loans, you would have $5k/month left you live on even assuming a generous 25% lost to taxes, no? And you only lose that much to taxes if you are single, and if you are single you have no family to support so seems like you could live reasonably comfortably on $3k/month cash-in-pocket. 115k/year should leave you with at least $6.5-7k/month post-taxes, doesn't seem like 2100/month loan payment would be that suffocating.

What am I missing here? I'm genuinely curious for my own future knowledge's sake. Unless of course you have a family to support, but I didn't think you did.

It sounds easier on paper. I am single, like probably 70% of what my class was at graduation. I live in Chicago, which has some of the highest states and local taxes in the nation. I pay for health insurance, dental insurance, vision insurance, contribute to my 401k(not more than what they match), have to pay for a car, have to pay for rent in a safe neighborhood in the city, renter's insurance, car insurance, gas, groceries, yatta yatta. I make too much to qualify for tax credits on student loan interest. I'm 28. There were 8 weddings this summer to go to.
Being single, with a good paying job but astronomical debt is a horrible tax burden. You look good on paper for the year, but you really aren't getting ahead.
$115 is not sustainable. It's the road to burnout.
I'm extremely lucky that my job allows me to do 4-10s so I can supplement with PRN on my days off. Just remember, PT is not a desk job where you put in 10 hours of sitting at a computer and doing work. It's non stop 1-on-1 or 2-3 patients at a time. You have to be ON at all times, with everybody. It's physical and with the paperwork is extremely tiring.
This isn't a pity party. I'm just being real. I'm in good health and like what I do. But to assume you will make 115k(I make easily 30k more than any of my friends), is unrealistic.

If you live in a smaller city, with lower taxes, have a few kids and a good tax situation because of household; and your cost of living is low. You will probably be fine because things are just different money wise. But, like most of my friends, 4-10s is not an option and your income will probably be around 65 pretax as entry level.

 

[jdaniels360]

But, like most of my friends, 4-10s is not an option and your income will probably be around 65 pretax as entry level.

Why does the $65k keep coming back here? This is the minimum if you actually WORK when you get out. It's also a more accurate number for outpatient ortho, no? If you work SNF + PRN/home health/overtime you can easily hit $75k. Please correct me if i'm wrong, that 10k makes a BIG difference.

 

[starrsgirl]

^^I'm in the midwest, and an informal survey of friends/PTs I know shows that they are not even earning 65K, no matter what their job setup. In my mind, it's more like $50K to start and maybe get to $65K if you work crazy hours. I also think the reality of working more than a 40 hour work week is much worse than the idea on paper. Agree with poster who mentioned the physical nature of the job versus a desk job. From my perspective, it doesn't seem like many people who planned to work all these extra jobs end up doing it (and understandably so). My point is, although it's an option, I'm not sure it should be anyone's go to plan to pay off too much debt. (Plus many people start thinking about starting a family after school....those second job hours are taken directly out of family time, so that might not be for everyone either).

 

[DesertPT]

Why does the $65k keep coming back here?

I don't know...$65k gross is only about the 20th percentile for PTs nationally. In some states like NV or CA it is only around the 10th percentile. In the lowest paying states (also some of the cheapest states to live in) $65k gets around the 30th percentile. Those percentiles include people who work part time.

As the poster above me said, there are definitely going to be areas where you will be offered less. But $65k seems to be the general assumption that is made on the forum.

 

[jblil]

$65k gross is only about the 20th percentile for PTs nationally.

It's probably true, for PTs with a few years' experience. For new grads, my salary survey as well as an informal poll of my classmates who just graduated (class of 2014) shows offers clustering around the $60K-$65K figure. One girl was offered $67K, but she's in a rather high COL area.

 

[jdaniels360]

And what setting do all these survey participants work in?

 

[NewTestament]

@knj27 With a $250k loan it can range from $1.5k per month over 25 years to $2.5k per month over 10 years. It seems fairly tolerable but I don't know if I want to pay off my debt for 25 years just from school alone..

Most of my classmates do not have $250k in loans. Most have about $150k from graduate and undergraduate school. Either way, you're much better off paying $2.5k/month for 10 years than taking 25 years. Pay off those loans ASAP.

 

[NewTestament]

I don't know...$65k gross is only about the 20th percentile for PTs nationally. In some states like NV or CA it is only around the 10th percentile. In the lowest paying states (also some of the cheapest states to live in) $65k gets around the 30th percentile. Those percentiles include people who work part time.

This is pessimistic, knj. The reality is cheerier. Look at the latest salary survey. Only 14% of PT's make less than $65k, and a quarter make between $65k-$75k. The average is more than $80k in every region of the country. If you work in a SNF, do home health, travel, work on weekends, or work in a rural area, you can make more than $70k as an entry-level PT.

http://physical-therapy.advanceweb....loads/2014/031014/PTSalarySurvey_National.pdf

 

[Bluecase]

That is total PTs. Not just new grads so people might make more money but they've been out of school much longer.

Also all of the posters who are not PTs yet talking about working in a setting you do not like or are not passionate about yet- there is a big factor here of being happy with your life and job satisfaction. If you have that much debt, work in a setting or multiple settings you hate to pay off loans even quicker you will be miserable. Better off taking a job you will enjoy making slightly less in the short term and actually doing the profession you went to school for. I'm not saying any site specifically bc some people prefer different settings. I am just saying working in any setting you are not passionate about also comes at a HUGE quality of life and job satisfaction price- which can't be measured in dollars and cents. So hold off on conjectures on what you'll do after graduation until you actually do it, can actually find all of these extra jobs in the market you're in, and see how happy or miserable you are.

For the op- just keep it real. If you have 250k in debt after pt school that is just a scary life choice. Reimbursements are going down, healthcare is changing for everyone. Having that much debt in a profession that is amazing but doesn't pay compared to other healthcare jobs (md, pa, etc...) is not a financially sound move no matter what your tax, family, or multiple income situation is. Just an honest perspective from someone who is working in the field as we speak who has to deal with all of these issues in real time

 

[jblil]

@ Bluecase: very well said, on both counts:
- Most salary surveys are not very useful to new grads, unless the data is stratified by years of experience;
- Not liking what you do makes for a very long day.

 

[DesertPT]

It sounds easier on paper. I am single, like probably 70% of what my class was at graduation. I live in Chicago, which has some of the highest states and local taxes in the nation. I pay for health insurance, dental insurance, vision insurance, contribute to my 401k(not more than what they match), have to pay for a car, have to pay for rent in a safe neighborhood in the city, renter's insurance, car insurance, gas, groceries, yatta yatta. I make too much to qualify for tax credits on student loan interest. I'm 28. There were 8 weddings this summer to go to.
Being single, with a good paying job but astronomical debt is a horrible tax burden. You look good on paper for the year, but you really aren't getting ahead.
$115 is not sustainable. It's the road to burnout.
I'm extremely lucky that my job allows me to do 4-10s so I can supplement with PRN on my days off. Just remember, PT is not a desk job where you put in 10 hours of sitting at a computer and doing work. It's non stop 1-on-1 or 2-3 patients at a time. You have to be ON at all times, with everybody. It's physical and with the paperwork is extremely tiring.
This isn't a pity party. I'm just being real. I'm in good health and like what I do. But to assume you will make 115k(I make easily 30k more than any of my friends), is unrealistic.

If you live in a smaller city, with lower taxes, have a few kids and a good tax situation because of household; and your cost of living is low. You will probably be fine because things are just different money wise. But, like most of my friends, 4-10s is not an option and your income will probably be around 65 pretax as entry level.

Nice one, thanks for the detailed reply.

 

[DesertPT]

That is total PTs. Not just new grads so people might make more money but they've been out of school much longer.

Yes but national surveys such as BLS/OES also include quite a few part time PTs, which balances things out to some extent.

 

[DesertPT]

This is pessimistic, knj. The reality is cheerier. Look at the latest salary survey. Only 14% of PT's make less than $65k, and a quarter make between $65k-$75k. The average is more than $80k in every region of the country. If you work in a SNF, do home health, travel, work on weekends, or work in a rural area, you can make more than $70k as an entry-level PT.

http://physical-therapy.advanceweb....loads/2014/031014/PTSalarySurvey_National.pdf

Well I guess I'm glad you think I'm being pessimistic...lol that doesn't happen to often

And thanks for the link, those numbers if anything seem a little more optimistic than BLS/OES numbers. Probably about the same though.

And yes while everyone will say that new grad numbers will be lower, you are probably going to be a PT for 30-40 years...if you look at lifetime earning potential, it's not that bad considering all the other pros and relatively few cons of the career that most PTs value.

Nevertheless, I don't think we would ever advise anyone to take on $250k in loan principle to become a PT.

 

[NewTestament]

Nevertheless, I don't think we would ever advise anyone to take on $250k in loan principle to become a PT.

Neither would I. It's not a smart financial move. But I don't know anyone in that kind of debt. Most of my classmates have about $150k in debt, which is still a lot but still much less than a quarter million. And all the PT's I've met seem to live comfortable lives. They aren't rich but they have money to do what they want.

 

[jdaniels360]

I just want to thank everyone on behalf of, well..... everyone, for contributing to boosting moral for those of us taking out 100k+. It's greatly appreciated and has absolutely allowed a lot of us to rest better at night. Thanks again for being there total strangers!

Thankful SPT

 

[DesertPT]

Neither would I. It's not a smart financial move. But I don't know anyone in that kind of debt. Most of my classmates have about $150k in debt, which is still a lot but still much less than a quarter million. And all the PT's I've met seem to live comfortable lives. They aren't rich but they have money to do what they want.

I know several with about the $150k range as well and I predict that's about where I'll be as well. On a 10 year repayment plan that's a little over $200k paid, about $1700/month which is definitely a lot but if you think of it as ~$20,000/year I think that is doable. I imagine my wife will make about that much each year doing part time work while being a mom so I guess that where the loan payment money comes from And with PAYE and IBR, it's not like you can't make small payments some months if things are tight and then larger ones other months to catch up with your yearly goals.

$250k principle on a ten year plan however would be $2900/month with ~350k total paid. You have to stretch that out to 25 years to get the same $1700 monthly payment as stated above and that results in ~$520k total paid

So going from $150k to $250k in principle ($100k difference), while keeping monthly payments the same results in a a difference of almost ~320k more in the total amount you will pay ($200k -> $520k). Seems obvious (contribute ~$20,000/year for 10 years or for 25 years) but I think a lot of people think more about monthly payments than the total amount they are going to cough up. This is of course without involvement in any loan forgiveness programs.

 

[hmmmatt]

This is of course without involvement in any loan forgiveness programs.

I'm surprised more people on here aren't talking about loan forgiveness programs. If you're looking at 250k after graduation, or even 150k, it would definitely be something to look into. PSLF + IBR/PAYE can take your monthly payments down to $400-600 a month (studentloans.gov is down right now, so I can't use the calculator to get some actual numbers), and then whatever is left (A LOT) is forgiven after 10 years, TAX FREE. Remember, if you do the minimum IBR/PAYE payment for 25 years, when your loans are forgiven, the forgiven amount is taxed. Of course you have to work in a non-profit, but there are tons of non-profit clinics/hospitals out there where you can do any setting you like and still be happy.

 

[Boodles130]

@hmmmatt Wow this is something that I have not really thought about because my financial knowledge is very limited. I will definitely look into this some more. Are the parameters for this only that I'd have to work for a non-profit clinic/hospital? Do you know if there would be a difference in salary as opposed to working in a for-profit clinic/hospital?

 

[Azimuthal]

Hmmm...it's because 9 years and 10 months of IBR would suck if the Feds decide to yank the program. Though, I'd still be grateful for anything, even the proposed cap on loan forgiveness. That proposed cap amount is still pretty generous.

 

[DesertPT]

Hmmm...it's because 9 years and 10 months of IBR would suck if the Feds decide to yank the program. Though, I'd still be grateful for anything, even the proposed cap on loan forgiveness. That proposed cap amount is still pretty generous.

What is the proposed cap? I haven't heard any indications that congress plans to pull PSLF but I suppose anything is possible in the next 15 years...

 

[Azimuthal]

What is the proposed cap? I haven't heard any indications that congress plans to pull PSLF but I suppose anything is possible in the next 15 years...

The proposed cap is $57,500. It's still pretty generous.

http://educatedrisk.org/analysis/of...ed-budget-pslf-caps-paye-benefits-limitations

 

[DesertPT]

Well if you are somebody with >$200k who makes minimum payments for 10 years under PSLF, and you have PT's salary, there is probably still going to be quite a bit more than $57500 left after those 120 payments...still a lot better than nothing though.

 

[Azimuthal]

I personally wouldn't mind full forgiveness either. But it's a big risk to put all my eggs in one basket. I will have to sit down and layout a plan if I go that route. I will most likely be making principle only payments in conjunction with regular planned payments.

 

[hmmmatt]

@hmmmatt Wow this is something that I have not really thought about because my financial knowledge is very limited. I will definitely look into this some more. Are the parameters for this only that I'd have to work for a non-profit clinic/hospital? Do you know if there would be a difference in salary as opposed to working in a for-profit clinic/hospital?

Yeah those are pretty much the only parameters. Work at a non-profit and make 120 on-time payments under whichever repayment plan you decided to go with/qualify for. As far as salary, I don't think there will be much of a difference. Obviously you most likely won't be able to open up your own private practice within those 10 years, but there are plenty of non-profit opportunities out there.

To all the other posters talking about the proposed cap and thinking that the government is going to one day just up and shut this program down, people say this stuff every time PSLF is brought up and I have no idea why. Yeah there was a proposed cap but nothing happened with it, and there are many organizations out there fighting to keep PSLF in place. The American Medical Association comes to mind. A cap on this program would completely negate the intentions of it. The people this was intended for, doctors, lawyers, etc. that are needed in public service, are not going to benefit from a cap. I just don't think it will happen, and that's why it was proposed and nothing ever happened with it.

Also, the number of PSLF participants is tiny compared to the amount of student loan borrowers out there. Government programs very rarely just disappear, sure changes can be made, but anyone that is currently enrolled will almost certainly be grandfathered in.

Is it good to have a back-up plan? Sure. But it's also not very helpful to just assume this is going to go away when there is no reason whatsoever to think so. No government programs related to student loans have just been taken away people enrolled in them.

All we can do is see how all of this goes and hope for the best.

 

[Azimuthal]

@hmmmatt, you don't know why something that may affect thousands of students keep coming up? This is an important subject that requires the expansion of thinking through different views. Things change. Political climates change. Obama's budget plan may have been defeated a while ago, but where is the budget now...in resolution until Dec 11. That in itself holds merit for discussion. Of course nothing has happened with the proposed cap (for 2015 -- if even included), it needs to pass the house and senate... How did you think fiscal budgets worked? To withhold such discussions would be a disservice to my peers.

 

[engmedpt]

Blunt response: 250k in student loans for pt is absolutely absurd. Please apply to the #200 ranked school since nobody cares as long as you pass boards. Happy thanksgiving.

 

[noyceguy]

$250,000 at 6.8% for 10 years is something like $2,877/mo. in repayment. So, no.

 

[starrsgirl]

^^ nearly 2 house mortgages in many places!!! ouch!!

 

[Rgvmed]

I'm figuring roughly 175k total debt give or take a few thousands after PT school. This is due to undergraduate/graduate debt already incurred. This number does not sit well with me but seem that someone is functioning at 250k makes me feel slightly better. I'll certainly be looking into loan forgiveness if the opportunity arises, either through IHS or perhaps some type of contractual work.

I do have one question. I have a wealthy family member who I'm going to approach about financing a "loan" for me at a much lower interest rate, or perhaps no interest. I don't want to ask them to loan money for tuition AND cost of living. Which would be the best to ask for a loan for? I'm looking at 55k max for my tuition through all three years and I'm going to try and survive on 45k for cost of living through the three years (I'll have some help from home that is 2.5 hours away). If I have my tuition financed through a family member am I still eligible for federal loans for cost of living? Or should I swap that idea and finance my cost of living through said family member. Any advice is welcomed.

 

[jblil]

DPTcoasral - if I understand you correctly, you project tuition to be ~55K and living expenses to be ~45K, over 3 years? If so, I don't think there is a big difference as to which portion should be financed by your family member, as the two are almost equal. You could run some tax simulations for 2015/2016/2017 to estimate your tax burden, since interest on student loans is deductible, within limits.
Check out http://www.irs.gov/taxtopics/tc456.html

 

[DesertPT]

If I have my tuition financed through a family member am I still eligible for federal loans for cost of living? Or should I swap that idea and finance my cost of living through said family member. Any advice is welcomed.

It doesn't matter. You're own cash on hand will not make you ineligible for federal loans. If you list that money as income on your FAFSA it may reduce the amount you are offered, but you won't have a problem getting enough money to get through school. If your Estimated Cost of Attendance (the magic number) is still higher than your Expected Family Contribution (the other magic number) then you will be offered enough loan money to make up the difference. And if you aren't listed as a dependent on anyone else's taxes, then I'm not sure how much the EFC comes into play anyway.

 

[NewTestament]

Blunt response: 250k in student loans for pt is absolutely absurd. Please apply to the #200 ranked school since nobody cares as long as you pass boards. Happy thanksgiving.

That amount of debt for any profession is really absurd unless you plan to be a surgeon.

 

[jdaniels360]

jblil, you seem like a number cruncher, so here's a problem for ya. I've looked online a little bit and didn't find a quick solution to this equation. I tried a few different sites and plugged and chugged and got nowhere. Lets say i graduate with 130k bc tuition was 27k/yr which is 81k total, plus living for 3 yrs on roughly16k/yr (interest has been accruing for 3 years), and i make 75k my first year out pre taxes (after working REALLY HARD) and i'm married with no kids. What would it be roughly after taxes? Maybe i'm WAY off but lets say i end up w/ 65k disposable income after taxes. If i were to pay back 30k a year w/ a 6.7% interest rate or whatever it is, and live on the remaining 35k/yr, which is more than double what i live on now (w/ a dual income household it could be doable), how long would that take roughly to pay off? Thanks!

 

[DesertPT]

jblil, you seem like a number cruncher, so here's a problem for ya. I've looked online a little bit and didn't find a quick solution to this equation. I tried a few different sites and plugged and chugged and got nowhere. Lets say i graduate with 130k bc tuition was 27k/yr which is 81k total, plus living for 3 yrs on roughly16k/yr (interest has been accruing for 3 years), and i make 75k my first year out pre taxes (after working REALLY HARD) and i'm married with no kids. What would it be roughly after taxes? Maybe i'm WAY off but lets say i end up w/ 65k disposable income after taxes. If i were to pay back 30k a year w/ a 6.7% interest rate or whatever it is, and live on the remaining 35k/yr, which is more than double what i live on now (w/ a dual income household it could be doable), how long would that take roughly to pay off? Thanks!

Sorry I'm not jblil...but if you had 130k in total principal at the time you began repayment, a 6.7% interest rate on all of it, and paid $2500/month ($30k/yr) it would take you around 5 years (maybe 5.5). Probably a little of $150k total paid.

 

[jdaniels360]

Well that's sure as sh** not terrible!! Thanks kj, appreciate the quick response! I'm just not someone who spends money very much so i don't see this being a problem. I'll sleep a little better tonight.... i think

One question though: how accurate is the 65k after taxes on a 75k earned income? Obviously there are a ton of variables, but lets just say in an average city like Indianapolis?

 

[DesertPT]

But I would think the only way $2500/month would be sustainable for 5 years would be if you and your spouse both worked and had no kids.

And during PT school how are you planning on living on $1300/month...just rent+utilities/bills+food+gas for me and my wife is a little more than that each month and we don't exactly live extravagantly.

 

[DesertPT]

One question though: how accurate is the 65k after taxes on a 75k earned income? Obviously there are a ton of variables, but lets just say in an average city like Indianapolis?

Probably a little optimistic...I think with federal and state income taxes (and any city taxes) you should probably plan more like $60k. Could be more and could be less...it just really depends what deductions, credits and exemptions you have, and what your final adjusted gross income is.

And you of course have to factor your spouses income in too (their income will be at least partially taxed at a higher rate than yours as it would be in the next tax bracket up).

 

[jdaniels360]

kj, i've been in PT school since May and have done just fine on under $1000 a month. My rent apartment is sub $700 with everything including bills and tv/cable/internet etc. $200/month groceries. Definitely don't use $100/month gas. The other expenses like health insurance (i'm on the schools policy), and car insurance are what bump that price per year up a little for living. But i'm not really close to $1300 a month; definitely under that. But remember, it's just me for right now.

In terms of taxes though, i pay less if i'm married? even if i have no kids? I'm pretty clueless at this point. What would be the most cost effective way to go about things in terms of taxes to get thing monkey off my back in the quickest time possible?

 

[starrsgirl]

Kids aren't super expensive, but daycare is killing us....just a thought as you think about the future. You might find it nearly eats one of your salaries (I know you said no kids, but things change! Food for thought!)

 

[starrsgirl]

$200 for groceries! and $100 for gas. My hat is off to you....that is straight up impressive.

Edited: Ok, I see you said this was just for you....I was thinking this was for 2 people. But still, I'm always impressed with a good budgeters! Well done

 

[DesertPT]

kj, i've been in PT school since May and have done just fine on under $1000 a month. My rent apartment is sub $700 with everything including bills and tv/cable/internet etc. $200/month groceries. Definitely don't use $100/month gas. The other expenses like health insurance (i'm on the schools policy), and car insurance are what bump that price per year up a little for living. But i'm not really close to $1300 a month; definitely under that. But remember, it's just me for right now.

In terms of taxes though, i pay less if i'm married? even if i have no kids? I'm pretty clueless at this point. What would be the most cost effective way to go about things in terms of taxes to get thing monkey off my back in the quickest time possible?

Man, you live in a pretty cheap area. And you must not drive as much as I do...or eat as much! ha jk

And yes, married filing jointly is almost always the better way to go, and having kids does reduce your tax liability. But it doesn't reduce it by as much as kids cost, that's for sure!

I would recommend using a product like TurboTax when you file your taxes next year and reading all the instructions/info/educational materials they have. It's like an idiot's guide to taxes