If you could do it over would you

[snoopy69]

i think some of the people saying that want to go into medicine because it is "intellectually stimulating" are watching too many episodes of house m.d. or er. I am not a med student (trying to decide if I want to be), but it seems like the profession is not at all like the situations presented in these tv shows where the doctor is almost like a detective. What do you guys think?

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[Ross434]

I've heard that medicine is not intellectually stimulating. In fact, this is why i have decided against it. It seems that day to day routines take over and there is not as much problem solving and learning as there is at first. ie: the next person comes in with a busted appendix, you do the same thing you've always done, and follow through the list of steps. Also, i hear medical school really sucks, intellectually, in terms of consisting purely of memorization with little or no intense puzzles and problems. That said, i'm hardcore addicted to problem solving and math, so i'm doing engineering instead.

 

[cryptic]

I've heard that medicine is not intellectually stimulating. In fact, this is why i have decided against it. It seems that day to day routines take over and there is not as much problem solving and learning as there is at first. ie: the next person comes in with a busted appendix, you do the same thing you've always done, and follow through the list of steps. Also, i hear medical school really sucks, intellectually, in terms of consisting purely of memorization with little or no intense puzzles and problems. That said, i'm hardcore addicted to problem solving and math, so i'm doing engineering instead.

You have to jump in the water first,to find out what it is to be a fish.

Consider pathology specifically surgical pathology;you get a piece of tissue ,you analyze it,better than the best detectives in fiction viz holmes,poirot etc.from subtle clues you formulate a whole picture of the disease from start to finish.From two dimensional (slide)you go into the three dimensional(tissue)and then into the fourth dimensional(time).
Again ,as not every detective can be holmes,not every pathologist is capable of such subtlety and astuteness.
But you find such a guy at work you may perhaps be plesantly surprised by what you find.
This person will simply blow you away.
I know of a person who from a mere liver biopsy could furnish such details about a persons medical history that would astound clinicians treating the patient for years.And this after just a cursory glance at the slide.Now that is intellect.
Just today one of our hematopathologists from a routine peripheral blood smear examination asked the clinicians(who were completely baffled by the patient's inexplicable abdominal pain after hundreds of costly tests) whether the guy had ever been shot.The clinicians thought the hempath was cracking a joke(the patient being from a somewhat violent neighbour hood).Nevertheless they found the guy had been shot in the neck a couple of years ago.Its an easy case and since so many people here are of so high an intellect as to discard medcine for it's lack of intellectual stimulation,I presume you have already connected the dots(blood smear...abdominal pain...history of shooting).Nevertheless,the point I am trying to make is maybe the flaw is not what the field but with the practitioner.
Remember,even conan doyle thought holmes was unusual,a rare bird.
Someday in medicine if you are lucky you will meet the rare bird and be thankful that even if you are if not in the same league,at leastyou have the honour to be in the same profession which has produced the brightest and the best of people and will continue to do so.

 

[roja]

Medicine is incredibly intellectually challenging. Is there routing stuff? absolutely. Find me a job that doesn't.

Pick any field and an MD can tell you about a case stumper.

Aspects of medical school does suck. Any field that deals with complex material requires memorization. What is hard about med school is the VOLUME. but alot of it is very interesting stuff. But its definately not for everyone. You have to not only like the science, you have to like dealing with people. Lots and Lots and Lots of people.

There is *so* much in medicine that can't be explained yet. Its fascinating.

Not to mention you are taking care of an incredibly valuable aspect of someones life: thier health.

If you like to see a *direct* effect of what you do for someone, then medicine is a great field.

 

[gujuDoc]

I was talking to a 3rd year med student at USF med school, who wanted to go into ophthamology.......

Anyhow, he said that he wouldn't have done it again if he had to go back into time. He said he would buy a business and make money that way because though he loved the philosophy of medicine, there was just tooo much politics in current healthcare that made it a jading experience. I told him that I had a friend that was an investment banker in his late 30's going back to med school, and his response was that he would trade places to have the investment banker's old job if he could. I've heard similar stories from other people too. But then I've shadowed residents like the Chief resident in neuro at USF, and they've said that they would do it again in a heartbeat and love every minute of it depsite the downs.

So I guess it depends on who you talk to. I'm not a med student or resident yet, but as a premed, we have to realize that when we get to residency we will be in massive debt and working 80 hours a week, barely getting paid 30-40 grand a year during that time. That's barely enough to survive on plus pay off debt. Then on top of that, not all attendings and higher ups are nice. Some will take great advantage of you and some places still violate the new residency work hour rules, etc. So its going to be real tough. I hate when I talk to Indian parents trying to push their kids into rushing into medicine, without understand the full reality of medicine. Medicine is a lot harder then people make it out to be and there's a reason they try to be sooooo selective these days in choosing who they accept into med school. However, like anything else, after awhile something loses the glamour when you've seen it sooo routinely. So it really comes to deciding whether you can handle the politics, whether you really really want to be here, or whether you are doing it for prestige and money only. if it is the latter, you are better off getting an MBA or JD and making money that way.

Just some food for thought.

 

[Clin_Epi]

Everyone works for the man.

CambieMD

My question: How do I become the man?

 

[MD'05]

My question: How do I become the man?

Invest wisely, young grasshoppa

 

[mackie]

Today was my first day of internship. After being thoroughly overwhelmed during the first few hours, I spent the rest of rounds fighting to hold back tears and fighting to keep myself from getting the heck out of there. I was even considering other career paths. I convince myself that many people must feel similarly, and that I should give myself at least a week before going to the program director and saying "I don't think this is for me."

It almost felt like third year of medical school and my first clinical rotation where the interns didn't understand my role (and I hardly did), and I got treated like an Acting Intern for two whole weeks before a new attending figured out that I had waaayyyyyy more responsibility than a new third year should be made to handle.

I'll be sure to come back and let everyone know how it turns out.

 

[CambieMD]

Today was my first day of internship. After being thoroughly overwhelmed during the first few hours, I spent the rest of rounds fighting to hold back tears and fighting to keep myself from getting the heck out of there. I was even considering other career paths. I convince myself that many people must feel similarly, and that I should give myself at least a week before going to the program director and saying "I don't think this is for me."

It almost felt like third year of medical school and my first clinical rotation where the interns didn't understand my role (and I hardly did), and I got treated like an Acting Intern for two whole weeks before a new attending figured out that I had waaayyyyyy more responsibility than a new third year should be made to handle.

I'll be sure to come back and let everyone know how it turns out.

Hang in there, this will be old hat in a few months. Everyone feels overwhelmed when they are starting out.

CambieMD

 

[lexrageorge]

.......

Anyhow, he said that he wouldn't have done it again if he had to go back into time. He said he would buy a business and make money that way because though he loved the philosophy of medicine, there was just tooo much politics in current healthcare that made it a jading experience. I told him that I had a friend that was an investment banker in his late 30's going back to med school, and his response was that he would trade places to have the investment banker's old job if he could. I've heard similar stories from other people too. ....

Just a couple of pointers I would like to make:

1.) Investment banking is no picnic. You will work 90-100 hours with a completely unpredictable schedule (sound familiar?). You will put up with some of the biggest turdballs in the planet on a daily basis. You can make lots of $$$. However, you are in constant competition with newly minted MBA's. Miss your quota once (even after years and years of success) and you're history, replaced by cheaper talent. Also, if the stock market tanks, I-Banking biz dries up fast, and with it, your job. And, once you're out, there is no way back in. The work itself tends to be monotonous and tedious for the most part.

2.) Getting an MBA or JD is no sure path to riches. There are lots of unemployed JD's out there; many of the ones that are employed are miserable. YOu would be too if you're responsibility was to shift through boxes and boxes of poorly written documents during litigation discovery.

Bottom line: there are no shortcuts to money and prestige, unless you're last name is Hilton or Simpson. The reality of any of these fields (medicine, law, business) is very different from what you see on MTV.

Is all lost? Of course not. Some people are very happy in these fields, and have done quite well.

 

[Ross434]

Just a couple of pointers I would like to make:

1.) Investment banking is no picnic. You will work 90-100 hours with a completely unpredictable schedule (sound familiar?). You will put up with some of the biggest turdballs in the planet on a daily basis. You can make lots of $$$. However, you are in constant competition with newly minted MBA's. Miss your quota once (even after years and years of success) and you're history, replaced by cheaper talent. Also, if the stock market tanks, I-Banking biz dries up fast, and with it, your job. And, once you're out, there is no way back in. The work itself tends to be monotonous and tedious for the most part.

2.) Getting an MBA or JD is no sure path to riches. There are lots of unemployed JD's out there; many of the ones that are employed are miserable. YOu would be too if you're responsibility was to shift through boxes and boxes of poorly written documents during litigation discovery.

Bottom line: there are no shortcuts to money and prestige, unless you're last name is Hilton or Simpson. The reality of any of these fields (medicine, law, business) is very different from what you see on MTV.

Is all lost? Of course not. Some people are very happy in these fields, and have done quite well.

I think the fact that most people on here only see medicine, law, and i banking as the only careers you can make money in is pretty sad. You can make a lot of money *anywhere*. Why are people here only looking for the easy guaranteed wealth.

 

[Amxcvbcv]

Why are people here only looking for the easy guaranteed wealth.

Because deep down in our selfish core, that's what everyone wants. Some people just have a bigger shield of altruism than others.

Mmm... nothing like a big steaming bowl of cynicism to start the day.

 

[gujuDoc]

Just a couple of pointers I would like to make:

1.) Investment banking is no picnic. You will work 90-100 hours with a completely unpredictable schedule (sound familiar?). You will put up with some of the biggest turdballs in the planet on a daily basis. You can make lots of $$$. However, you are in constant competition with newly minted MBA's. Miss your quota once (even after years and years of success) and you're history, replaced by cheaper talent. Also, if the stock market tanks, I-Banking biz dries up fast, and with it, your job. And, once you're out, there is no way back in. The work itself tends to be monotonous and tedious for the most part.

2.) Getting an MBA or JD is no sure path to riches. There are lots of unemployed JD's out there; many of the ones that are employed are miserable. YOu would be too if you're responsibility was to shift through boxes and boxes of poorly written documents during litigation discovery.

Bottom line: there are no shortcuts to money and prestige, unless you're last name is Hilton or Simpson. The reality of any of these fields (medicine, law, business) is very different from what you see on MTV.

Is all lost? Of course not. Some people are very happy in these fields, and have done quite well.

You make some really good points. I think that is another thing that draws people into medicine.........the job security. At least, I've observed that a lot.

Actually, a few of the older applicants I've known were attorneys and told me the same thing. I've heard for lawschool, its only those that come out of the major top law schools that get the high paying jobs. Many other JDs tend to be struggling to make ends meet. Some have even worked two jobs, from what I've heard. That said, very true that everything is different from television. Even with medicine, it will take quite a while to get out of debt and then to build a practice, before wealth starts occurring.

And even then, the one's who become wealthiest are either in a super stressful competitive subspecialty or surgical field, and/or have other side investments. I.E. the richest doctors I know include a cardiologist that also owns and sells HMO businesses which he owns in partnership with other relatives that are doctors, a CEO of a cardiology office with 8+ partners, and people in things of that nature.

I think at heart, it is important to realize that one always sees greener pastures at everywhere but where they are at. But once they get to that other side, they see that it isn't as green as they once thought it was. But who ever said life was unfair was right. We just do our best to survive and think of the positives in our field, like the rewards of seeing patients and working in a challenging field that will always bring about something interesting. At least that's the way I try to look at it. Also, I think we should try to look at all that we learn from the journey when the going gets tough. Because that is the best way to gain a positive outlook and keep ourselves going each day.

 

[humuhumu]

Mmm... nothing like a big steaming bowl of cynicism to start the day.

 

[gujuDoc]

Because deep down in our selfish core, that's what everyone wants. Some people just have a bigger shield of altruism than others.

Mmm... nothing like a big steaming bowl of cynicism to start the day.

So true.

 

[jujukat]

If you have any doubts about it what-so-ever, then listen to me: "DO NOT DO IT!" do it only once you've resolved your doubts about it. the last thing you want to do is go through medical school and residency wondering if this is the right profession for you! once you're in you can't get out. it's almost like a life-sentence.
sorry if i sound bitter, but medicine is one of those fields that you have to want more than anything else. otherwise it's just not worth it.

 

[supercut]

Yes, absolutely, I would do it again.

I started med school at age 38 because I always regretted not doing it. I've now just finished my second year of surgery residency. For the most part, I've enjoyed it. I didn't find med school to be all that painful. The schedule during the first two years wasn't bad, and our exams were concentrated in blocks of two weeks (no classes just time to study for and take the exams). Clincial years were harder in terms of schedule, but usually a hard month was followed by a lighter month.

Everything that all the previous posters have said about dealing with pts is true. Many of them are people who make no contribution to society and yet still have an entitlement attitude. There is also a subset of upper middle class america who also have a bit of an entitlement attitude (For example, they will make a big fuss and complain about things such as a nurse didn't answer the call bell immediately to get them a soda when there was another pt coding on the floor!). The subset of patient who are grateful and not overly demanidng are a joy to care for.

There are few professions where the government thinks it can interfere as much as it does in medicine, or where candidates start rules just to get elected. (Witness Hillary Clinton and her sudden new interest in trying to make electronic medical records mandatory)

How do you think your plumber would react if he repaired your pipes and then you decided that you would only pay 50% of the bill? Yet that is what happens in medicine with the insurance companies. You can try to get the pt to pay the balance out of their pocket, but good luck getting any money from them because most people don't think that one red cent should come out of their own pocket to pay for medical care (they gladly pay rapidly increasing prices for their supersize fast food, tobacco and ETOH products, though)

And people are increasingly looking as suing their doctors as a "get rich quick" method.

Despite all these drawbacks, I generally enjoy surgery. I totally enjoy performing surgery. It is absolutely the coolest job in the world. I like it not so much for the "helping people" aspect, but just becuase I like poking around in someone's abdomen and figuring out what is causing a problem, and then fixing it.

And it's not true that I don't have a life. Since I started surgery residency, I have decided to become a more active person and have taken up several sports, including skiing and biking. I'm not great at any, and it can be hard to find time sometimes, but usually a couple times a month I manage to get some time in. I could go to the gym almost daily (and I really have no valid excuse for not doing so) You have to be more creative to have a life than the 9-5 crowd.

Realize that you will have to be much more savvy about business than ever before, and that you will have to figure that out on your own (its not taught in med school/residency). Your malpractice will cost more than the average joe's salary.

Every profession has its advantages and disadvantages. You need to look at both and assess if the cost/benefit ratio makes sense to you.

I think if you are considering medicne primarily as a way to make good money, you should spend some time investigating the benefits/drawbacks of other fields. If you are considering medicine primarily as a career that provides personal satisfaction, then it might be for you.

 

[CambieMD]

Yes, absolutely, I would do it again.

I started med school at age 38 because I always regretted not doing it. I've now just finished my second year of surgery residency. For the most part, I've enjoyed it. I didn't find med school to be all that painful. The schedule during the first two years wasn't bad, and our exams were concentrated in blocks of two weeks (no classes just time to study for and take the exams). Clincial years were harder in terms of schedule, but usually a hard month was followed by a lighter month.

Everything that all the previous posters have said about dealing with pts is true. Many of them are people who make no contribution to society and yet still have an entitlement attitude. There is also a subset of upper middle class america who also have a bit of an entitlement attitude (For example, they will make a big fuss and complain about things such as a nurse didn't answer the call bell immediately to get them a soda when there was another pt coding on the floor!). The subset of patient who are grateful and not overly demanidng are a joy to care for.

There are few professions where the government thinks it can interfere as much as it does in medicine, or where candidates start rules just to get elected. (Witness Hillary Clinton and her sudden new interest in trying to make electronic medical records mandatory)

How do you think your plumber would react if he repaired your pipes and then you decided that you would only pay 50% of the bill? Yet that is what happens in medicine with the insurance companies. You can try to get the pt to pay the balance out of their pocket, but good luck getting any money from them because most people don't think that one red cent should come out of their own pocket to pay for medical care (they gladly pay rapidly increasing prices for their supersize fast food, tobacco and ETOH products, though)

And people are increasingly looking as suing their doctors as a "get rich quick" method.

Despite all these drawbacks, I generally enjoy surgery. I totally enjoy performing surgery. It is absolutely the coolest job in the world. I like it not so much for the "helping people" aspect, but just becuase I like poking around in someone's abdomen and figuring out what is causing a problem, and then fixing it.

And it's not true that I don't have a life. Since I started surgery residency, I have decided to become a more active person and have taken up several sports, including skiing and biking. I'm not great at any, and it can be hard to find time sometimes, but usually a couple times a month I manage to get some time in. I could go to the gym almost daily (and I really have no valid excuse for not doing so) You have to be more creative to have a life than the 9-5 crowd.

Realize that you will have to be much more savvy about business than ever before, and that you will have to figure that out on your own (its not taught in med school/residency). Your malpractice will cost more than the average joe's salary.

Every profession has its advantages and disadvantages. You need to look at both and assess if the cost/benefit ratio makes sense to you.

I think if you are considering medicne primarily as a way to make good money, you should spend some time investigating the benefits/drawbacks of other fields. If you are considering medicine primarily as a career that provides personal satisfaction, then it might be for you.

That was a great post. The pros and the cons of medicine were outlined in a balanced fashion. Everyone should accept that medicine is a difficult profession to go into. Medicine is what it is. I enjoy being a physician.
Anyone with doubts about going into medicine, probably should not.

CambieMD

 

[Gut Shot]

I'd totally do it over again, only without spending six friggin' years in graduate school beforehand. You think medicine sucks? Just imagine you're a PhD trying to stay afloat writing NIH grants. It's a bit like being one of 18 piglets competing for 6 nipples.

Some guys get all the milk, while others wither and end up teaching five sections of undergrad microbiology. It's ugly.

 

[Dire Straits]

Because deep down in our selfish core, that's what everyone wants. Some people just have a bigger shield of altruism than others.

Mmm... nothing like a big steaming bowl of cynicism to start the day.

well not everybody, maybe most people do, but definetly not everybody. personally i've never all that much been into money. as long as i make enough to support myself then i'm content. never really been one to want more and more. i will dedicate most of my career to working for international medical outreach organizations, and there is very little money in that line of work. so i plan to spend my remaining time as a locum physician in the States so i can have money to live off and fund my volunteer trips. i realize i could make loads of cash by being a surgical subspecialist working at some private practice, but i really see no fulfillment or excitement in that. and of course i'm not the only one, there are lots of doctors who spend most of their time doing relief work in developing countries for little pay. so not ALL of us are in it for the money, the big house, fancy cars, etc.

 

[Amxcvbcv]

well not everybody, maybe most people do, but definetly not everybody. personally i've never all that much been into money. as long as i make enough to support myself then i'm content. never really been one to want more and more. i will dedicate most of my career to working for international medical outreach organizations, and there is very little money in that line of work. so i plan to spend my remaining time as a locum physician in the States so i can have money to live off and fund my volunteer trips. i realize i could make loads of cash by being a surgical subspecialist working at some private practice, but i really see no fulfillment or excitement in that. and of course i'm not the only one, there are lots of doctors who spend most of their time doing relief work in developing countries for little pay. so not ALL of us are in it for the money, the big house, fancy cars, etc.

I'm not saying everyone wants five luxury cars and a yacht, but I challenge you to find anyone that doesn't want their profession to comfortably support their existance on a reliable basis (implicit in this is everyone's varying definition of what constitutes comfortable). Obviously, you're a lucky individual that's willing to put other people's interests high on your priority list.

 

[Toofscum]

You're right about the unemployed JDs. I am one. I have been job searching for months and I cannot find anything. Most lawyers will make no more than any regular Joe with a BA.

 

[Dire Straits]

I'm not saying everyone wants five luxury cars and a yacht, but I challenge you to find anyone that doesn't want their profession to comfortably support their existance on a reliable basis (implicit in this is everyone's varying definition of what constitutes comfortable). Obviously, you're a lucky individual that's willing to put other people's interests high on your priority list.

from your original post it sounded like you were implying that all doctors are selfish and are primarily in it for the money. you are correct that a lot of them are indeed in it for the prestige, sense of power, money, and other motives that could be called self-serving. i have seen it already at the med school level, so i presume it only gets more this way as people advance through their training and feel a greater sense of entitlement due to all the hard work they've put in. afterall this is one main reason why the low-paying specialties are unpopular compared to the high-paying ones. but if all doctors felt this way then no people from disadvantaged parts of the world with no access to healthcare would get the medical care they receive from the minority of doctors who dedicate their lives to helping them. just as i have never understood why people are so caught up in making more money than they really need, some people don't understand why i would want to give up the opportunity to make lots of money to go to places where i would make very little money.

 

[Amxcvbcv]

from your original post it sounded like you were implying that all doctors are selfish and are primarily in it for the money. you are correct that a lot of them are indeed in it for the prestige, sense of power, money, and other motives that could be called self-serving. i have seen it already at the med school level, so i presume it only gets more this way as people advance through their training and feel a greater sense of entitlement due to all the hard work they've put in. afterall this is one main reason why the low-paying specialties are unpopular compared to the high-paying ones. but if all doctors felt this way then no people from disadvantaged parts of the world with no access to healthcare would get the medical care they receive from the minority of doctors who dedicate their lives to helping them. just as i have never understood why people are so caught up in making more money than they really need, some people don't understand why i would want to give up the opportunity to make lots of money to go to places where i would make very little money.

I think we agree with each other.

Would I still want to be a doctor if the salaries weren't what they are? Yes.

Would I still want to be a doctor if the salary was minimum wage? That's a loaded question because I don't think that condition would ever exist in our society, so it doesn't really matter.

I see the medical profession as the perfect intersection in an immense Venn diagram. It provides intellectual stimulation, reliable employment, monetary rewards, varied opportunities, etc. Perhaps I don't have a very good imagination, but for me, medicine is the ultimate career and all of my experiences thus far reinforce my choice.

 

[doc05]

Perhaps I don't have a very good imagination, but for me, medicine is the ultimate career and all of my experiences thus far reinforce my choice.

too bad you haven't actually had any experiences yet. when do you start your ms1 year??

 

[DOCTORSAIB]

Just a couple of pointers I would like to make:

1.) Investment banking is no picnic. You will work 90-100 hours with a completely unpredictable schedule (sound familiar?). You will put up with some of the biggest turdballs in the planet on a daily basis. You can make lots of $$$. However, you are in constant competition with newly minted MBA's. Miss your quota once (even after years and years of success) and you're history, replaced by cheaper talent. Also, if the stock market tanks, I-Banking biz dries up fast, and with it, your job. And, once you're out, there is no way back in. The work itself tends to be monotonous and tedious for the most part.

2.) Getting an MBA or JD is no sure path to riches. There are lots of unemployed JD's out there; many of the ones that are employed are miserable. YOu would be too if you're responsibility was to shift through boxes and boxes of poorly written documents during litigation discovery.

Bottom line: there are no shortcuts to money and prestige, unless you're last name is Hilton or Simpson. The reality of any of these fields (medicine, law, business) is very different from what you see on MTV.

Is all lost? Of course not. Some people are very happy in these fields, and have done quite well.

You took the words right out of my mouth. I worked in retail banking for 5 years and then as a financial advisor for American Express before quiting and persuing medicine. Investment banking is no joke, especially if you're working for a firm with high quotas. Job hours can seriously blow (80+ hours easily) and the stress of managing someone else's money is not easy. I always hear it from other people "If I could go back, I would drop medicine and do an MBA." Do an MBA for what? To join the countless other MBA's with data entry jobs or crappy analyst positions for companies that go "belly up" after you're hired.

The grass is ALWAYS greener on the other side. It took me 4 hard years to get into medical school and I'm damn happy that I finally made it. You should consider yourself privelaged for being a med student/resident. Speaking of resident, why the hell do people complain about pay in residency. You're getting an opportunity to learn what you've always wanted. Pay during residency is similar across the country and it's a well known fact how much you will be making. In some countries, residents DON'T even get paid. You will make enough money (depending on your lifestyle) once you're done. Shut it up, stop complaining, and be happy your going to be a doctor soon.

p.s..please don't respond with lame comments like "wait until you are in ___year, etc etc." Trust me, I've heard it all.

 

[Amxcvbcv]

too bad you haven't actually had any experiences yet. when do you start your ms1 year??

I knew someone would say that.

My classes start August 15th.

My current job does offer me ample opportunities to see the medical culture, though, and I keep coming back despite only making $9 an hour and working graveyard weekend shifts. Also, notice I did say "thus far". I'm well aware of the apparent shift from naive neophyte to cynic that tends to occur during medical school/residency.

 

[DrKnowItAll]

I think the fact that most people on here only see medicine, law, and i banking as the only careers you can make money in is pretty sad. You can make a lot of money *anywhere*. Why are people here only looking for the easy guaranteed wealth.

Because these people are as creative as dried potatoes.

 

[Zong117]

Do you guys have any opinions on pursuing dentistry instead? Sounds like the lifestyle is better, at least, and would working with the mouth/maxillofacial area be much different or less rewarding than any other area of the human body?

 

[roja]

I knew someone would say that.

My classes start August 15th.

My current job does offer me ample opportunities to see the medical culture, though, and I keep coming back despite only making $9 an hour and working graveyard weekend shifts. Also, notice I did say "thus far". I'm well aware of the apparent shift from naive neophyte to cynic that tends to occur during medical school/residency.

Don't worry. that shift doesn't happen to all of us. I'm still happy as a camper with my career choice.

 

[Rudy Guliani]

If I knew then what I know now, I would never have done it. Med school has destroyed my marriage. I don't think that any job is worth that. And in the end, when it comes down to it, medicine is just a job, same as a garbageman, same as an airplane pilot. Somehow we have gotten it into our heads that medicine is some kind of higher calling, more noble than a simple occupation. That kind of idealistic bull**** is for naive pre-meds. There are lots of occupations out there that touch on people's lives in different ways, medicine does not have the monopoly on that. But it does seem to make people sacrifice a disproportionate amount of their social lives, family lives, time with spouses and children, and the important things in life. If I could have foreseen that med school would drive my wife away from me I would have quit immediately and started flipping burgers instead. Those of you in marriages or serious relationships should beware lest med school destroy what is important to you too.

 

[GenSurg]

Medicine definitely isn't what it used to be. I can empathize with those that wouldn't go through the process again. It can be very difficult to deal with patients that don't respect you, abuse the system, and expect too much from you. We can't fix everyone's ailments with a single pill, and people expect doctor's to work miracles. I've also seen that patients don't respect physicians time commitments. Many people don't respect what doctors do anymore. About the only respect that I have gotten since starting in medicine has to do with the time commitment.

That being said, I still think medicine is a wonderful field. I believe there is something for just about everyone that wants to pursue it. There are many different fields of medicine, and there are many directions someone can choose. If I take care of 1 patient that really appreciates what I do for them, it can make up for the 10-15 people that don't.

http://www.freeiPods.com/?r=20049323

 

[gujuDoc]

If I knew then what I know now, I would never have done it. Med school has destroyed my marriage. I don't think that any job is worth that. And in the end, when it comes down to it, medicine is just a job, same as a garbageman, same as an airplane pilot. Somehow we have gotten it into our heads that medicine is some kind of higher calling, more noble than a simple occupation. That kind of idealistic bull**** is for naive pre-meds. There are lots of occupations out there that touch on people's lives in different ways, medicine does not have the monopoly on that. But it does seem to make people sacrifice a disproportionate amount of their social lives, family lives, time with spouses and children, and the important things in life. If I could have foreseen that med school would drive my wife away from me I would have quit immediately and started flipping burgers instead. Those of you in marriages or serious relationships should beware lest med school destroy what is important to you too.

I'm not naive and idealistic. I know that medicine has its ups and downs and that it probably will be the hardest 8 years of my life when I get to med school.

But what I also know is that for every one person that blames being an MD for ruinning their marriage, there is at least one person who's had a good solid, strong, supportive marriage that has gotten through the rough times and made it through. maybe it is different for me, because I come from Indian culture where education and fidelity in marriage are too important to us, and where divorce is rarely if ever seen. However, regardless of that.....

There are many many many family friends who have or are going through medical school and/or residency right now, who are quite happy in their marriages and have very supportive spouses.

I've also seen many older married students go back, and they seem to be doing fine in med school and with their spouse.

So I don't think your situation characterizes all people. Honestly, while I don't know your situation, I have to wonder about people who divorce their spouses over something like this. Again, maybe because I'm from another country, I can't understand things. But in my culture, when they take the oath of for better or for worse, til death do us apart or the Hindu equivalent of it, it literally means just that in 98% of the cases.

 

[deleted4401]

One thing that's true is that for every person that complains about this field, there's another who tells you how enriched and lucky they were to get to do it. I'm an intern, and yeah, s--t hasn't hit the fan yet, but it's been interesting and fun and stressful and horrible and great all at once. Every day or two, I get a warm smile and hear "Thank you, doctor," and you know what? For a few hours or maybe more, everything is alright. And, I'm saying this not even matching in the field I wanted to!

And, what professionals don't have trouble balancing work and personal lives? At graduation, we had a marriage counselor come in talk to us about balance in our lives; but he did let us know that the statistics bear out that physicians DO NOT have a higher divorce rate than the general U.S. population. Not that it isn't high, it is, but it's no different than Joe Schmow the computer programmer. So, I don't think it's fair to blame the specific field on one's marital woes. It's hard, but so is any high-powered profession - ask corporate lawyers, or i-bankers, or a senator, or whomever if they don't have trouble with their personal lives.

Dissatisfaction is high in many fields. Sure, some fields have better quality of life (i.e. dentistry or pharmacy), but those fields aren't for everyone. I guess I just think that I'd be happy doing just about anything, but I'm happiest doing this. Some people are miserable in medicine, but they'd probably be miserable doing anything.

Yes, I'd do it again. It's good stuff. It'll get worse before it gets better, but I'm looking forward to being an attending one day.

Simul

 

[Rudy Guliani]

You'd best watch your step there son, you're on shaky ground. Keep your self-righteous thoughts to yourself.

I'm not naive and idealistic. I know that medicine has its ups and downs and that it probably will be the hardest 8 years of my life when I get to med school.

But what I also know is that for every one person that blames being an MD for ruinning their marriage, there is at least one person who's had a good solid, strong, supportive marriage that has gotten through the rough times and made it through. maybe it is different for me, because I come from Indian culture where education and fidelity in marriage are too important to us, and where divorce is rarely if ever seen. However, regardless of that.....

There are many many many family friends who have or are going through medical school and/or residency right now, who are quite happy in their marriages and have very supportive spouses.

I've also seen many older married students go back, and they seem to be doing fine in med school and with their spouse.

So I don't think your situation characterizes all people. Honestly, while I don't know your situation, I have to wonder about people who divorce their spouses over something like this. Again, maybe because I'm from another country, I can't understand things. But in my culture, when they take the oath of for better or for worse, til death do us apart or the Hindu equivalent of it, it literally means just that in 98% of the cases.

 

[gujuDoc]

You'd best watch your step there son, you're on shaky ground. Keep your self-righteous thoughts to yourself.

First off, I'm not a guy. I'm a woman. Second off, I didn't mean to come off as selfrighteous.

If I did come off as self righteous, and stuck up, I sincerely sincerely sincerely do apologize. I don't mean to sound stuck up in anyway, and that is why I prefaced it by saying that it may be due to a difference in cultural beliefs.

Again, I'm not trying to diss you, so I apologize.

But what I meant and was trying to get at is that..........

I don't know your situation in particular, but I don't think it is fair for you to tell people that being a doctor is going to be the end of the world for other people's marriages either. Many many many med students and residents that I have met, are married and doing quite well. I just think that sometimes people aren't strong enough to stick it through. This has been happening with a female friend of mine. She wants to do medicine and her hubby keeps getting insecure that she's going to leave him once she gets to med school. I think many people give up on their loved one's to easily sometimes. But if it were a choice of being married and miserable in every other aspect of my life, or being in a good field and divorced from someone who is not able to be supportive of me and my dreams, then I'd choose the former. I'm not saying that you don't have a point. But could you honestly picture yourself happy flipping hamburgers and being told to do things only the way your wife would've wanted it?? Don't you think that if you were forced to live working in an atmosphere that you didn't like just to be with your wife, that that wouldn't make you equally as miserable as being without her is making you????
I'm just curious about this.

Again, I don't mean to offend you and I'm sincerely sorry for coming off in a not so good tone, I just think its like the poster above me said when he said that its not fair to blame medicine as a major cause of divorce rates.

As pointed out above, being in any major career can have a major effect on one's life.

On a related note, I noticed that where I live, the doctor's are the happiest people and the engineers and people working in stores like publix or SAMS are the one's who constantly wish for more.

That's just what I've seen in my life.

 

[lexrageorge]

You'd best watch your step there son, you're on shaky ground. Keep your self-righteous thoughts to yourself.

That is the most idiotic response to a well worded post I've seen in while.

 

[radswannabe]

That is the most idiotic response to a well worded post I've seen in while.

I don't know what's more ******ed, this entire thread or your useless interjection, lexra.

 

[medlaw06]

hey all...i just wanted to put in my 2 cents (i am SO broke, I don't even know if I can afford that much)..anyways, i have quite a few friends that i went to law school (go easy with the jokes) with and this is their first year out...majority of them are NOT the kind you are thinking of, but rather are in corporate settings...they just graduated in May and now are enegetically out there in the "real" world thinking that all that they have strived for for so long is gonna pay off at the end, right?....not so fast....they HATE what they do...sometimes its the morality aspect, or lack thereof...sometimes its the so-called "long hours" (which we, in medicine, laugh at---try workin' 80"+" hours at half the salary while someone is puking/sh**ing on you)....in any case, true...they are making 6 figures already....but they still despise it....

true...have i thought if I am wasting my time in medicine....it's not the way it was...we have lawyers on 1 side looking at almost every move that we make and asking us why we didn't order every test under the sun for their client in hopes that we screw up and they hit the lottery...on the other hand, we have HMOs who sit there are look over our shoulders for every test that we DID order...and then we have "wonderful" patients, of which 1/3 will NEVER be compliant, and 1/3 will be SOMEWHAT compliant....painted a bleak picture, right?...compensation is reduced (hey...let's be honest)...hours are longer....

but then look around...is anyone happy with what they are doing....there's a dime a dozen MBAs...lawyers are....well...they're lawyers, enough said....PhD is stuck working his/her ass off for the first 6-8 years TRYING to get a full time position to only have the department head say to them after the 6th year "sorry....we can't make you assistant or associate since you didn't publish enough" and then have to start the process again making $35g....pilots rarely see their husband/wife and have 1 of the most stressful jobs....hard laborers work their bones off at $10.00/hour....nurses get crapped on by arrogant docs/residents....i could go on and on, but i think you get the point....

looking at the whole picture, medicine isn't that bad anymore, is it?....we are already in the top 3% of salaries (true, we have MASSIVE debts, but it can be paid off in time)....it's respected for its intelligence....the only field I can think of in which you can work 1 day a week and still earn 80k (I know of quite a few ER Docs--especially younger women who have small children at home and want to stay at home with them--who do this on the side)...not too shabby, right?

bottom line: all professions have plus and minus....

on an aside...anchor for SportsCenter would be the COLLEST JOB IN THE WORLD!!!!!!!

 

[gujuDoc]

I don't know what's more ******ed, this entire thread or your useless interjection, lexra.

I think this thread is actually worthwhile for a few reasons. Even though, we will probably not understand the feelings these people are going through until we have sat in their seat, and even though we have no room as premeds to comment on what they have been through, it is still good for us to see what differing opinions about those who have been through it are.

Why??? So many times as premeds, we lose ourselves in this naive little world about saving the world, that when someone posts about the reality that medicine is a job at the end of the day and not some sort of calling, we don't listen. To hear the experiences of residents and med students is refreshing because it gives us the hard facts and lets us understand med school for what it really is, ups, downs, and all.

So I suppose in a sense, it is a helpful thread that has given some other perspective besides the usual. I'm glad this thread is around because even though not every post was sunny bright skies and pretty pink flowers on pretty green pastures, it has given me a good idea of how different people have felt coming out at the other end of the tunnel.

So thank you to all of you that responded.

Rudy,

I just wanted to say again that I didn't mean to be coming off as rude, arrogant, a bitch, or anything of that nature. So I apologize if I did. I hope things work out for you in the future and that you find either some way to make things work out with your ex, or find someone else who can bring that kind of joy she brought to your life in the future.

But that said................

Although its going to be a road through literal hell at times, I don't see myself doing much else. Medicine just seems to be the only thing that really really really interests me. I think I'd get bored in business or law. I'm not big on the nursing route either. Outside of being a doctor, the closest thing to anything I could see myself doing is being a PA, if I didn't get in med school. Some have tried to tell me to think Pharmacy, and again it seems soooooooo boring. I don't know, there is something that just appeals about medicine. And it has nothing to do with the saving the world concept of idealistic naive premeds. I think its just a fascination with clinical medicine, getting to know people of different backgrounds, fascination with the human body especially the brain (I love neurology), etc that draw me to medicine. Oh and the fact that I get to do all that and still know the job security, a decent living etc, will be there in the end.

But that's just my personal belief.

 

[Blade28]

A medical ethicist that lectured us last year (in med school) stated the following:

The three most respected professions in this country are physician, teacher, and clergyman. Only the physician makes a decent salary.

 

[bluebirdie]

Hey there,
Just wanted to give you a positive post amongst all the negativity. I don't think med school was as bad as I thought it was going to be. There were moments no doubt, but it was very manageable. I've wanted to be a doctor for most of my life and now I get to live my dream, something that very few people like to do. I agree that you can't really know what med school is like until you really experience it. this can be frustrating when I have to listen to my friends who are in nursing school or still in college complain to me about how hard their classes are, and how it's just like med school.... People get burned out, sleep deprived, and can't see their families as much, during 3rd year or their internship year, so it can make for some very unhappy campers. Please remember that no matter how telling someone's argument about how bad or good medicine is as a career choice, it is only one person's opinion. I'm sure you are already aware that the hours suck during residency, physicians' compensation is lower than it used to be, and people seem to be suing left and right for everything. Plus tuition isn't getting any cheaper. If I were you, I would go to different doctors that you know and ask, you won't find that everyone hates their job...and wishes they could be getting wasted instead.

 

[gujuDoc]

Hey there,
Just wanted to give you a positive post amongst all the negativity. I don't think med school was as bad as I thought it was going to be. There were moments no doubt, but it was very manageable. I've wanted to be a doctor for most of my life and now I get to live my dream, something that very few people like to do. I agree that you can't really know what med school is like until you really experience it. this can be frustrating when I have to listen to my friends who are in nursing school or still in college complain to me about how hard their classes are, and how it's just like med school.... People get burned out, sleep deprived, and can't see their families as much, during 3rd year or their internship year, so it can make for some very unhappy campers. Please remember that no matter how telling someone's argument about how bad or good medicine is as a career choice, it is only one person's opinion. I'm sure you are already aware that the hours suck during residency, physicians' compensation is lower than it used to be, and people seem to be suing left and right for everything. Plus tuition isn't getting any cheaper. If I were you, I would go to different doctors that you know and ask, you won't find that everyone hates their job...and wishes they could be getting wasted instead.

thanks for posting. I've talked to different physicians and residents I've shadowed, and many of them said they wouldn't do it over again, while others said they absolutely loved their job.

I think this is just another source of seeing what people's opinions are, which is why the original post was probably posted here.

 

[football56]

I'm not naive and idealistic. I know that medicine has its ups and downs and that it probably will be the hardest 8 years of my life when I get to med school.

But what I also know is that for every one person that blames being an MD for ruinning their marriage, there is at least one person who's had a good solid, strong, supportive marriage that has gotten through the rough times and made it through. maybe it is different for me, because I come from Indian culture where education and fidelity in marriage are too important to us, and where divorce is rarely if ever seen. However, regardless of that.....

There are many many many family friends who have or are going through medical school and/or residency right now, who are quite happy in their marriages and have very supportive spouses.

I've also seen many older married students go back, and they seem to be doing fine in med school and with their spouse.

So I don't think your situation characterizes all people. Honestly, while I don't know your situation, I have to wonder about people who divorce their spouses over something like this. Again, maybe because I'm from another country, I can't understand things. But in my culture, when they take the oath of for better or for worse, til death do us apart or the Hindu equivalent of it, it literally means just that in 98% of the cases.

Do you realize that the highest suicide rate among professions in America is doctors (physicians)? Don’t categorize or group the older people in regards to how they got through medical school and residency that are already married. Every relationship is different. Yes, a couple can be happy and have no problems at all while wile in medical school. However, then residency comes around and the significant other (or if they both are residents) may not like how the other partner is working 80 hours a week (even more for some weeks) and working 30 hour shifts. Working these many hours takes time away from loved ones and hobbies. It also screws with your sleep cycle (one of the major reasons why I am going to go into research instead of medicine is that I don’t want to screw up my circadian rhythm by forcing my body to go through sleep deprivation so often).

I find it funny that researchers stress the importance of sleep, but yet at the same time residents are forced to work 80-100 hours a week and even more some weeks. This goes against what research tells us.

Yes, I can sense some naiveness coming from your postings. I am also an undergraduate student and I work in a hospital. And yes being a doctor is just another job like a custodian, sales rep, mangers, etc. You don’t have as much freedom as you once had in practicing medicine. I hope you do realize that in time (depending on your specialty) what you do will become mostly routine. Are you ready to order CT scans, US, PV, PFT, Echo, EKG, EEG, stress tests, x-rays all day long? You wont save the world by being a doctor. How man MD’s do you know that have made a huge difference in this world? How many politicians and scientists do you know that have made a significant difference in the world? Are you ready to tell a person they have an ulcer in the upper GI tract because they were drinking heavy for the last few years and you know it is there own fault and you can’t do anything about changing their habits? You can offer counseling but that is as far as you can go. Are you ready to tell a person they should stop smoking because it will kill him/her and you know the patient does not give a crap what you say but you have to say it anyways even when you know this person is just going to continue to smoke?

I respect the doctors who have to deal with traumatic situations. This is where you can do the most for helping people out. You don’t help people out by saying to the patient that they can go home but you know they are in no better condition then when they first came. Why do you think the same patients always keep coming back for medical help?

Are you ready to have the HMO’s looking over your shoulders looking at every test that you have ordered and having the HMO’s deny coverage for certain exams, tests, and surgeries? Are you ready for 30-hour shifts? Are you ready to get paged while trying to take a nap? Are you read to not get any time to eat a good meal for a whole working day from time to time? Are you ready to go into 280,000 dollars in-depth and spend the next 30 years trying to pay it off? Are you ready for the fear of getting sued because you made a mistake while being sleep deprived from having to work all night? Are you ready to take care of a patient that has been beaten up but your patient either killed the other person or beat the other person up even worse? Are you read to spend a lot of your time doing patient dictations? Are you ready to not have much free time? Are you ready to have to wear pager everywhere you go? Are you ready to be called in to work during holidays? Are you ready to do a lot of grunge work as a first year resident? Are you ready to get paged all day long constantly? Are you ready to see 15 patients in one day with only being able to spend 10 or 15 minutes with each patient? Are you ready for the dreaded question at the end of the exam when you are already late to see another patient when you ask “is there anymore questions” and then the patient starts to ask question after question and then you fall 30 minutes behind schedule and then you have to hurry through the rest of your patients so you can get back on schedule? Are you ready for the nurse to page you because he/she can’t read your hand writing? Are you read to spend a lot of days where you get not chance to sit down and relax for a few minutes?

Being a doctor is no longer as glamour’s as it once was.

 

[gujuDoc]

Football56,

First off, you are no attending, much less med student or resident to be telling me $hit.

Second off, I already repeatedly apologized and tried to explain myself to Rudy. I'm sorry you failed to read the rest of my posts that came after the one you chose to quote. If you had read them, you'd see that I tried to clear up what I meant. I'm sorry you failed to do so.

Third off, I'm no naive idiot. i'm aware that suicide rates are high among physicians, but they are also high among other professions as well. You say you choose research because you think it will be less stress. I've got news for you, you should go read the thread that was in preallo sometime ago and listen to what people like Havarti and Learfan have had to say about research statistics. Researchers are also up there with the suicide rates. Do you really think going into research is going to be any better or that it will necessarily mean less working hours??? You are quite naive if you think that. The researchers I work with make their grad students work a lot more then you realize, for a lot less compensation.

I'm damn well aware of the ever increasing problems with HMOs, Malpractice, working hours, etc. I'm damn well ready to deal with it. I'm damn well ready to deal with what comes my way, and I know I probably will become more cynical over the years. I've seen what good family friends have gone through in getting through medical school and residency, I've had many family friends that are physicians and talked to them a lot about how the conditions are, and I've talked to many physicians that I've worked with about the conditions.

I've also read through this entire thread and talked to med students in the area where I live.

I know I am not going to fully understand what these physicians and residents and med students feel until I get there. I know that not everyone would do it over again and that it is a lot of hell at times. I know that not everyone will give a sunny picture of medicine that they like to pretend and give at the medical school forums. Its the sole reason why I've been reading this thread, to get the real picture and not sunny bright skies picture.

I, too, have spent a lot of time working and volunteering in a hospital setting, as well as shadowing. I'm damn well aware that after awhile everything becomes routine and don't see medicine as some glamour show that many other naive premeds do see it as.

However, all that is beyond the point of my post to Rudy.

I was only stating that for every doctor that commits suicide or has a failed relationship, there is also a doctor who has had a successful marriage and so it is unfair to base one person's experience as the premise of what will happen to all future married couples in medical school.

And regardless of whether much of what I've seen is routine, it is still a far cry better then working in business with a 9-5 job. For all the routine ways of medicine, once trained, at least I think I'll be happy to get up and go to work rather then miserable.

Every job has their ups and downs. and frankly I'd rather take being a clinician any day over research because at least you know there will be some tangible results in medicine, whereas you could be working the same 80 hour week in a research lab and get barely paid half of what doctors get paid, get barely any tangible results because the experiment keeps failing, etc.

As per the work hours of residents, although there are many programs that have not taken the new laws seriously (cough*Hopkins*cough---See AMSA article from a former ER resident there), many of the programs are now implementing the new 80 hour work rules and doing their best to make conditions better for residents. I'm not saying that all programs are doing this, cuz I'm well aware there are many that will still overwork you and go against the laws, but many are trying to do this.

So at least there is some progress, albeit it not that big of progress, in way of the work hour issues.

To answer your other questions, will I be willing to make those sacrifices, the answer is yes.

 

[Radpimp]

Most of the smart people in medical school who graduated at the top of their class, applied to the specialites that had good pay and lifestyle. There are still rewarding fields where patients still appreciate your work and time.

Stay away from the those miserable specialties like General Surgery.

 

[football56]

Football56,

First off, you are no attending, much less med student or resident to be telling me $hit.

Second off, I already repeatedly apologized and tried to explain myself to Rudy. I'm sorry you failed to read the rest of my posts that came after the one you chose to quote. If you had read them, you'd see that I tried to clear up what I meant. I'm sorry you failed to do so.

Third off, I'm no naive idiot. i'm aware that suicide rates are high among physicians, but they are also high among other professions as well. You say you choose research because you think it will be less stress. I've got news for you, you should go read the thread that was in preallo sometime ago and listen to what people like Havarti and Learfan have had to say about research statistics. Researchers are also up there with the suicide rates. Do you really think going into research is going to be any better or that it will necessarily mean less working hours??? You are quite naive if you think that. The researchers I work with make their grad students work a lot more then you realize, for a lot less compensation.

I'm damn well aware of the ever increasing problems with HMOs, Malpractice, working hours, etc. I'm damn well ready to deal with it. I'm damn well ready to deal with what comes my way, and I know I probably will become more cynical over the years. I've seen what good family friends have gone through in getting through medical school and residency, I've had many family friends that are physicians and talked to them a lot about how the conditions are, and I've talked to many physicians that I've worked with about the conditions.

I've also read through this entire thread and talked to med students in the area where I live.

I know I am not going to fully understand what these physicians and residents and med students feel until I get there. I know that not everyone would do it over again and that it is a lot of hell at times. I know that not everyone will give a sunny picture of medicine that they like to pretend and give at the medical school forums. Its the sole reason why I've been reading this thread, to get the real picture and not sunny bright skies picture.

I, too, have spent a lot of time working and volunteering in a hospital setting, as well as shadowing. I'm damn well aware that after awhile everything becomes routine and don't see medicine as some glamour show that many other naive premeds do see it as.

However, all that is beyond the point of my post to Rudy.

I was only stating that for every doctor that commits suicide or has a failed relationship, there is also a doctor who has had a successful marriage and so it is unfair to base one person's experience as the premise of what will happen to all future married couples in medical school.

And regardless of whether much of what I've seen is routine, it is still a far cry better then working in business with a 9-5 job. For all the routine ways of medicine, once trained, at least I think I'll be happy to get up and go to work rather then miserable.

Every job has their ups and downs. and frankly I'd rather take being a clinician any day over research because at least you know there will be some tangible results in medicine, whereas you could be working the same 80 hour week in a research lab and get barely paid half of what doctors get paid, get barely any tangible results because the experiment keeps failing, etc.

As per the work hours of residents, although there are many programs that have not taken the new laws seriously (cough*Hopkins*cough---See AMSA article from a former ER resident there), many of the programs are now implementing the new 80 hour work rules and doing their best to make conditions better for residents. I'm not saying that all programs are doing this, cuz I'm well aware there are many that will still overwork you and go against the laws, but many are trying to do this.

So at least there is some progress, albeit it not that big of progress, in way of the work hour issues.

To answer your other questions, will I be willing to make those sacrifices, the answer is yes.

It looks like you are a bit angry man. Chill out! I never said research was easy. Let me quote what I said again: “one of the major reasons why I am going to go into research instead of medicine is that I don’t want to screw up my circadian rhythm by forcing my body to go through sleep deprivation so often.” Let me describe to you what this means. I don’t care to have to work for 24 hours with no sleep and have to work 80 to 100 hours a week and never get more then four hours of sleep in one night. By doing research I am able to still get a decent amount of sleep and I don’t have to worry about being forced to work 24 hours straight. This says nothing about me not knowing how hard research is. I do know about having to spend so much time writing grants, manuscripts, reading the literature and having to do deal with projects that don’t work. I’m an undergraduate student with a major in Biology and a minor in Genetics. I will be doing one of the hardest types of research out there. I will be going into biomedical research to do research with genetic syndromes (Ph.D. will be in Molecular Genetics). I know about the pressures of having to publish to keep a job. Even when you do have a great reputation and tract record and outstanding funding your chances of getting tenured is still very slim. I am looking to work at a large university hospital to do research. Doing research is much more stressful at times then practicing medicine.

 

[gujuDoc]

Most of the smart people in medical school who graduated at the top of their class, applied to the specialites that had good pay and lifestyle. There are still rewarding fields where patients still appreciate your work and time.

Stay away from the those miserable specialties like General Surgery.

I don't think I'd ever want to do any surgical field, be it general surg or a subspecialty of surgery.

I'm sorta interested in neurology, infectious disease, and internal medicine.

I've heard general internal medicine can be crappy at times too, because they are always needed on call.

People often tell me that derm and radiology are the two fields with the nicest lifestyles.

But who knows what happens, I can't really determine what will be my interest until I get to med school first.



In regards to football56, I should also mention one more thing about my post to Rudy.......

I mentioned that I might not understand where he came from because of the fact that the D word (Divorce) is an unheard phenomenon in Indian culture, so I've never really dealt with that issue or understood that phenomena. So I already prefaced my whole post with the fact that I may be lacking in understanding relationship woes. But again, I tried to clear the air already and you would've seen that yourself had you bothered to read my other posts rather then choosing which one you were going to read and failing to read the others.

But what ever floats your boat. I'd give more stalk to what you say if you were a med student, resident, or attending, because the point of this thread was to answer the original question "would you do it over again?".

 

[gujuDoc]

It looks like you are a bit angry man. Chill out! I never said research was easy. Let me quote what I said again: “one of the major reasons why I am going to go into research instead of medicine is that I don’t want to screw up my circadian rhythm by forcing my body to go through sleep deprivation so often.” Let me describe to you what this means. I don’t care to have to work for 24 hours with no sleep and have to work 80 to 100 hours a week and never get more then four hours of sleep in one night. By doing research I am able to still get a decent amount of sleep and I don’t have to worry about being forced to work 24 hours straight. This says nothing about me not knowing how hard research is. I do know about having to spend so much time writing grants, manuscripts, reading the literature and having to do deal with projects that don’t work. I’m an undergraduate student with a major in Biology and a minor in Genetics. I will be doing one of the hardest types of research out there. I will be going into biomedical research to do research with genetic syndromes (Ph.D. will be in Molecular Genetics). I know about the pressures of having to publish to keep a job. Even when you do have a great reputation and tract record and outstanding funding your chances of getting tenured is still very slim. I am looking to work at a large university hospital to do research. Doing research is much more stressful at times then practicing medicine.

Again, if you'd read my other posts, you'd also realize I'm not a MAN but a WOMAN!!! That said, I'm glad you realize what you are getting into. My only point is that you went off on me without reading the rest of my posts or realizing that I already apologized for making any generalizations.

If you'd even bothered to read further below, you'd see that I tried my best to clear the air and rephrase what I was saying. You also would have seen that I never claimed to be an expert just that I didn't think it is fair to say that ALL, key word here ALL marriages will fail as a result of being in medicine, when I'd seen many successful marriages get through the rough times.

But again, that's my two cents. I didn't say anyone had to agree with it.

On a side note, isn't it funny how people always tend to look at the green pastures. The engineers look at the doctors and think "Doctors have it easy cuz they have money coming out of everywhere" (ala some Indian people I know). The doctors think the business men have it easy because they don't have to work as many hours. The business men think doctors have it easy because they have job security, etc. etc. etc.

It goes on and on. But fact of the matter, is no one in the world has it easy. They may have more sleep then a doctor, but they don't have it easy.

Even the waiters who get paid 2 dollars an hour and a few tips, don't have it easy when it comes down to it.

The only thing that sets doctors apart, is that they have constant threat of malpractice and lawsuits, and have to work sometimes 2-3 days straight if not more.

 

[deschutes]

This is a long thread, so I am going to jump in without having read every post -

I entered medicine a little before my 19th birthday (jumping education systems) - so compared to what I know now (which is not a lot but enough), I did not know very much about a career in medicine at all at that time.

It wasn't so much a question of "why medicine", I simply thought - why not?
Not everyone has a chance at med school.

A little dose of pragmatism:
Universities focus on graduating their students - the real question is, what sort of degree is going to get you a job?

Some issues can be analyzed to death.

Had I been older or "more mature", perhaps I would have mulled over things a great deal longer - thing is, I don't think the decision would change.