All Branch Topic (ABT) From AD to VA/GS

[Neogenesis]

My ADSO is up summer 2020 and I am currently debating all options. Has anyone here transitioned from AD to a GS or VA position? I’m trying to find info on buying back my active time to apply toward a VA or GS retirement. Even more specifically I’m trying to find out if I can buy back my USU time as well. I’m finding very conflicting info. Any and all experience is welcome.

NEO


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[turkish]

I’m in the hiring process now. Check out usajobs dot gov and search for openings in your field. Retirement buyback is around $1500 per year, and you can pay it over time. You have to work in the system for five years before you’re fully vested, but st that point it’s five years plus whatever you’ve bought back at 1% x # years of your highest income. Money starts rolling in around 57 years old I believe (there are some different ways to get it early or late). Plus if you do guard or reserves until 20 years total, you don’t have to give up your military retirement, you can “double dip”.

 

[Neogenesis]

Turkish. Thanks for the reply. Can you tell me a little more about the reserve thing? Are you saying you can have your years count for both VA retirement AND military retirement?


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[notdeadyet]

Something I’ve never understood:

For everyone who serves full time military looking at doing 20: Wouldn’t it make much more sense financially to do 15 years active, switch to reserve/arng while working VA for your final 5? You’d have over 75% of a full military pension plus a full VA retirement.

I realize you couldn’t draw your pension until 60, but I still don’t see how it would t make much more sense financially.

 

[Ridge_Runner]

Something I’ve never understood:

For everyone who serves full time military looking at doing 20: Wouldn’t it make much more sense financially to do 15 years active, switch to reserve/arng while working VA for your final 5? You’d have over 75% of a full military pension plus a full VA retirement.

I realize you couldn’t draw your pension until 60, but I still don’t see how it would t make much more sense financially.

Has anyone on here done something like this? At first glance it seems like it was be relatively lucrative depending on how the VA calculated your actual 5 years of salary.

 

[colbgw02]

Something I’ve never understood:

For everyone who serves full time military looking at doing 20: Wouldn’t it make much more sense financially to do 15 years active, switch to reserve/arng while working VA for your final 5? You’d have over 75% of a full military pension plus a full VA retirement.

I realize you couldn’t draw your pension until 60, but I still don’t see how it would t make much more sense financially.

When you say 75% of a full pension, you're saying 75% of half of base pay, right?

Once vested, I think VA pays 1% of average of top 3 multiplied by number of years. Five years doesn't get you very much, but of course you could still keep working.

I once ran the numbers on separating at 19 years, going to work for the VA, and buying back all 19 years. After 11 years, I think one could retire with the much higher VA pension and start collecting immediately.

 

[turkish]

Yes, this is one way you can collect two federal retirements. The other would be to do twenty in the military then do a GS career, starting from fresh and not buying in to the FERS. If you buy in using your active duty time, and you are past twenty years, you have to give up the pay but not the benefits (tricare, commissary, etc).

The downside is that neither the reserve retirement or FERS retirement checks start coming until you’re close to sixty, whereas after a full twenty years in the military you start collecting immediately. The other downside is that in the reserves/guard, you can get your twenty year letter after doing twenty “good years” (met drill requirements or were on active duty long enough), but they literally count the days and divide by 360 to reach how many “years” you have. So for me, I’m getting out around 15 years. If I do five years in the reserve, only drilling, no more active duty time or deployments, I’ll do around 40 days a year. That’s 200ish days, not even a full year. So if I stay O5, I’ll retire as an O5 with 15-16 years, so 40% of monthly pay (16x2.5%) and won’t get that money until I’m 60. You can add days (“points”) by doing other things like online training, PHAs annually, etc.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Whether this is more lucrative or less depends on your age at military retirement (how far from 60). You also can do this before 15 years but it means that you need reserve years to 20 and 5 FERS years so you could be looking for a job as a reservist (or say get out at 11 and do 9 of both). The longer you are AD, the better the reserve retirement. You need to make your own spreadsheet and look at money now vs later, etc.

For me, it would have been a break even proposition (probably)

 

[haujun]

Something I’ve never understood:

For everyone who serves full time military looking at doing 20: Wouldn’t it make much more sense financially to do 15 years active, switch to reserve/arng while working VA for your final 5? You’d have over 75% of a full military pension plus a full VA retirement.

I realize you couldn’t draw your pension until 60, but I still don’t see how it would t make much more sense financially.

Yes. Most HPSP typically do 21 years to get out as 06. Military retirement probably going to raise tax burden when you bring in civilian physician pay too. So net pay from military retirement is small. If you are going to work until 60 as a civilian doctor getting military retirement at that age may not be a bad idea. You will pay less tax when you get it then.

 

[TheGoose]

Yes, this is one way you can collect two federal retirements. The other would be toyear) twenty in the military then do a GS career, starting from fresh and not buying in to the FERS. If you buy in using your active duty time, and you are past twenty years, you have to give up the pay but not the benefits (tricare, commissary, etc).

The downside is that neither the reserve retirement or FERS retirement checks start coming until you’re close to sixty, whereas after a full twenty years in the military you start collecting immediately. The other downside is that in the reserves/guard, you can get your twenty year letter after doing twenty “good years” (met drill requirements or were on active duty long enough), but they literally count the days and divide by 360 to reach how many “years” you have. So for me, I’m getting out around 15 years. If I do five years in the reserve, only drilling, no more active duty time or deployments, I’ll do around 40 days a year. That’s 200ish days, not even a full year. So if I stay O5, I’ll retire as an O5 with 15-16 years, so 40% of monthly pay (16x2.5%) and won’t get that money until I’m 60. You can add days (“points”) by doing other things like online training, PHAs annually, etc.

To follow on the GS+Reserve/NG combo, i believe that you also get authorized up to 15 days of paid federal days off to go and drill for reserves/NG which is a seperate entity from your regular VA leave balance . Adds to the potential 'double dip' since you're not losing money taking your drill time

Military Leave

So that's 26 days of paid vacation/typical leave, 13 days sick leave, 5 days CME, 10 national holidays, and 15 days Drill (56 days/yr +13 sick if needed).

Downside is banging your head against the wall dealing with the VA b.s. the rest of the year...

Definitely something im considering when looking at getting out in that 10-15yr range.

For the usuhs side of things I think the 4 yrs would kick in after 20 for reserve time as well. For example in turkish's example doing bare minimum drill after 15yrs AD, would bump it up to O5 w 15yrs (but 19yr multiplier) when factoring in usuhs time

Additional financial thought on this: if you go GS you can continue pumping up your TSP

 

[Chetamine]

I made a spreadsheet for myself (O4,10yrs) and a friend (O5, 15yrs) and it doesn't make sense to stay on active duty if you can get a GS job and buy into FERS, as long as you can tolerate the reserves. Once you are vested in FERS and your reserve time is complete, either continue with the GS job and increase your retirement or get a civilian gig until age 60. Or, cut back to part time, knowing you don't have to save nearly as much for retirement. the risk is you pass away and there isn't nearly as much going to your spouse/family. this all may be dependent on your specialty/compensation.

 

[didja]

I was planning to seperate at 17, join the reserves and work at a local VA affiliated with the medical school our MTF works with (i.e., the VA situation would have been tolerable). The retirement of course would have been very generous at 60 but the time value of an active duty retirement in your mid-40s isn't trivial, especially considering tricare. My wife actually developed some serious medical issues so I'm staying in until 20 after all. It saves me 2 years of working at the VA and the pension and healthcare starting in my mid-40s will let me do some locums work interspersed with some slow travel and international travel.

 

[Gastrapathy]

Sorry to hear that. At 17, staying was probably the right choice anyway.

 

[Neogenesis]

Ok, so to clarify the "double dipping" of retirements. If you get out at 15 years of AD and continue in reserves, you would have 15 years + whatever reserve time you do after. If you went into the VA/GS system after getting out of AD, you can get a retirement from that as well, but you would be starting at 0 years when you begin working for them, correct?

VS taking the 15 years of AD time and buying into the GS/VA retirement and essentially being at 15 years in when you start with them after getting of AD

You cannot make your 15 years of AD time count towards reserves AND GS/VA retirement at the same time, correct?

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[Gastrapathy]

No, your AD time counts for both after a small “buy back” for GS. You have to do 5 years GS and then you’d get 20. The AD years also count for benefits (vacation, etc) so you start maxed out.