Failed Step 1 TWO times

[FurFur2011]

Hello there,

I have a dilemma. I am an SGU student and left the island in December after finishing m basic sciences. I have a 2.5 GPA. I did not do so well in medical school because of MANY personal issues (divorce, moms death, medical problem). So I was already weak in my basic sciences.

I studied by myself for 4 months with Kaplan videos, DIT and FA. I took Step 1 in May 2011 and failed by 2 points. I then took the 7 week Live Kaplan course and took Step 1 late August, and once again failed. I will now be dismissed from SGU.

What can I do? Can I transfer to another Caribbean medical school? I am thinking about PA school as well. Also can I take Step 1 without being enrolled in a medical school?

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[sanityonleave]

Hello there,

I have a dilemma. I am an SGU student and left the island in December after finishing m basic sciences. I have a 2.5 GPA. I did not do so well in medical school because of MANY personal issues (divorce, moms death, medical problem). So I was already weak in my basic sciences.

I studied by myself for 4 months with Kaplan videos, DIT and FA. I took Step 1 in May 2011 and failed by 2 points. I then took the 7 week Live Kaplan course and took Step 1 late August, and once again failed. I will now be dismissed from SGU.

What can I do? Can I transfer to another Caribbean medical school?

Transferring -- Not any of the reputable ones. Honestly, I wouldn't go this route. You've (at least theoretically) already spent a lot of money, you're almost certainly not eligible to get into one of the "good" Carribean schools, and even if you got into a school and passed Step 1 (which isn't all that likely), you're unlikely to get a residency spot with two fails on your history.

I am thinking about PA school as well. Also can I take Step 1 without being enrolled in a medical school?

PA school -- certainly an option, but it's not as simple as "oh I guess I'll go be a PA" -- you'll need to shadow a PA, show some commitment to PA school, and have good background healthcare experience. I don't know how PA schools look at former med students, but my guess is they're going to want a good explanation for why you now want to be a PA that doesn't involve not being able to be a doc.

You must be certified by your school to take Step 1, so I'm almost certain you cannot take it as an independent.

As far as "what do I do?" -- that's something only you can decide. I will say at this point I do not think a career in medicine as a physician is going to be in your future (though I've been wrong before). There are other areas within medicine and other fields -- you have to figure out what interests you.

In any case, good luck to you. It's definitely not an easy road ahead.

 

[FurFur2011]

Transferring -- Not any of the reputable ones. Honestly, I wouldn't go this route. You've (at least theoretically) already spent a lot of money, you're almost certainly not eligible to get into one of the "good" Carribean schools, and even if you got into a school and passed Step 1 (which isn't all that likely), you're unlikely to get a residency spot with two fails on your history.

PA school -- certainly an option, but it's not as simple as "oh I guess I'll go be a PA" -- you'll need to shadow a PA, show some commitment to PA school, and have good background healthcare experience. I don't know how PA schools look at former med students, but my guess is they're going to want a good explanation for why you now want to be a PA that doesn't involve not being able to be a doc.

You must be certified by your school to take Step 1, so I'm almost certain you cannot take it as an independent.

As far as "what do I do?" -- that's something only you can decide. I will say at this point I do not think a career in medicine as a physician is going to be in your future (though I've been wrong before). There are other areas within medicine and other fields -- you have to figure out what interests you.

In any case, good luck to you. It's definitely not an easy road ahead.

Thank you for your reply.

The reason why I would go to PA school is because I was in PA school already and left it to go to medical school for various reasons. So I would just go back to that PA school, wouldn't be an issue.

Not sure if I would let the PA school know about all this medical school nonsense, just doesn't look good.

Also, yes I am aware that I wouldn't get a great residency or even ONE. But I think at this point I've come so far, its hard to just change to another career. I am okay with just graduating and doing something else with my degree i.e research etc.

I was consulting with my family since they are in the medical field but I figured I'd get another view on this since family will always say to keep on trying.

 

[Morsetlis]

I will tell you to keep on trying, but that's just me.

 

[FurFur2011]

I will tell you to keep on trying, but that's just me.

Yeah my dad and a few doctors said the same thing. My dad said keep taking it till you pass. He said to make it a goal, that I'm not going to stop till I pass. The issue is, when I get dismissed from SGU...I need to figure out how I can still take Step 1. So I need to transfer to another carib school and that is IF they even accept me

 

[Jeeps]

Yeah my dad and a few doctors said the same thing. My dad said keep taking it till you pass. He said to make it a goal, that I'm not going to stop till I pass. The issue is, when I get dismissed from SGU...I need to figure out how I can still take Step 1. So I need to transfer to another carib school and that is IF they even accept me

It ain't over till you stop breathing. If your healthy then continue pushing the boundaries, explore option from other medical schools. Who cares what "others" say, till they start paying for you school and helping you out, they can shove it =)


I know quite a few who made it out of med school just fine and 2 who got kicked out and transferred to carib and other carib.

 

[Rippey]

It ain't over till you stop breathing. If your healthy then continue pushing the boundaries, explore option from other medical schools. Who cares what "others" say, till they start paying for you school and helping you out, they can shove it =)


I know quite a few who made it out of med school just fine and 2 who got kicked out and transferred to carib and other carib.

Don't listen to this idiot... he can't even write properly. The last thing you want to do is get a false sense of hope and waste even more money/time.

sanityonleave gives the best advice; follow that.

 

[futIDdoc]

Be aware, in most states 3 failed attempts DQ's you from licensure. Also as an IMG with 3 attempts at Step I, it will be an uphill battle getting a residency spot.

 

[Arnett Hall]

Don't listen to this idiot... he can't even write properly.

Hey Rip: You're the same 3.92/30P Asian guy who hated being Asian, who applied to nineteen (19) low/middle tier schools and was rejected by every single one of them, correct? Now, when you talk to patients, do you always insult them every time you open your mouth? Or do you work only with cadavers?

 

[sanityonleave]

Thank you for your reply.

The reason why I would go to PA school is because I was in PA school already and left it to go to medical school for various reasons. So I would just go back to that PA school, wouldn't be an issue.

Not sure if I would let the PA school know about all this medical school nonsense, just doesn't look good.

Also, yes I am aware that I wouldn't get a great residency or even ONE. But I think at this point I've come so far, its hard to just change to another career. I am okay with just graduating and doing something else with my degree i.e research etc.

I was consulting with my family since they are in the medical field but I figured I'd get another view on this since family will always say to keep on trying.

OP -- I'm really not trying to be discouraging. I'm simply trying to be realistic. You state that you're aware of your residency chances, but your statement seems incongruous with a true knowledge about your likelihood of getting into residency. Even if everything goes perfectly from here on out, you would be a US-IMG coming from a not-very-reputable Caribbean school (none of the big 4 take people who have been dismissed from other Caribbean schools) with at least two step 1 failures on your record. With that background, it's not a matter of not getting a "great" residency -- my guess is you would have a significantly less than 50% chance of getting a residency spot at all.

There's a SDN member on here that is a program director (aProgDirector) -- if you're strongly considering trying to get into any Caribbean program that would take you, I would encourage you to PM him first re: your residency chances. I think (though I can't guarantee) that he would advise you to cut your losses and look into other avenues (such as PA school). You've got to understand that you've already taken on at least $100k of debt (unless someone else is forking over the money, but the principle is the same) and would have to take on at least $100k more for a slim chance at actually passing all of your exams and becoming a licensed physician in the US.

I think that the people telling you to "keep trying" are people in the premedical stage of their education -- and when you're a premed, to "keep trying" makes sense, as you can continue to work and applying each cycle sets you back at most $2-3k / cycle. That is not your (the OP's) reality. There are very real financial consequences for you if you keep trying, and you need to seriously consider the risk vs reward.

As a whole, it really sucks that you had a lot of personal issues that got in the way of medical school. I can relate with how difficult med school is in and of itself, so I can't imagine dealing with deaths in the family or a divorce at the same time. That said, unfortunately, those personal issues have put you in a tough spot with regard to your future, and you need to try and evaluate this rationally.

 

[ineed2stpsmurfn]

If you really want it... Never give up.

 

[peppy]

I definitely sympathize with the tragedies and setbacks you've experienced, but personally I would strongly recommend going back to PA school.

As things currently stand, it is getting harder for all foreign MDs to get American residency spots due to an increase in enrollment at American MD/DO schools.

Without a residency, an MD degree is very close to useless for employment. If you don't believe me about that, try asking on the General Residency forum what kind of job you could get if you can't get a residency and I think most people would agree.
The jobs you *could* get as an MD without a residency would be jobs you could get without the MD degree in the first place.
I know that logically it would make sense that having so much education would improve your job outlook, but the unfortunate reality is that an MD degree doesn't prepare you for any job other than residency. In your situation the odds of getting a residency are not very good unfortunately.

In contrast, finishing PA school would give you a well paying job and still allow you to be involved in medicine. Honestly, I've met many patients who think of their PA as their "doctor". It's not like being a PA is an awful job. It's really a lot like being a resident except without the sleep deprivation.

Every year you put off going back to PA school is another year you're accumulating student loan debt AND missing out on the income you could be making as a PA.
Additionally, from what I've heard, having an MD degree means that even if you do later become a PA, you will be held to the legal standard of an MD in terms of appropriate practice guidelines, which could actually hurt your ability to find work as a PA in the future. It's really not worth it to spend more money pursuing a degree that may actually end up harming you.