EM hourly pay/salary??

[GeneralVeers]

Your statement is incorrect or misleading.

https://www.tax-brackets.org/californiataxtable

OTOH, I agree with your general point: state taxes -- especially those in CA -- should not be ignored when considering salary.

HH

No it's not misleading. Using a tax calculator here: https://smartasset.com/taxes/california-tax-calculator#0eXax9o7HS

On 500K salary I'd pay $47K in state taxes. On 300K I'd pay 25K. That's pretty close to 10%.

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[GeneralVeers]

Areas with a higher cost of living have such because people actually want to live there. All the money in the world can't force most people to move to Sticksville, ND.

I personally would work there for all the money in the world. Then I would just have a private jet fly me home after shift to somewhere desirable to live.

 

[MEN2C]

what're the ranges for PED ED? I know it's significantly less, but can you get $150-200/hr for doing it?

 

[NRAI2001]

what're the ranges for PED ED? I know it's significantly less, but can you get $150-200/hr for doing it?

I know a guy that did peds and now is doing a PEDs EM fellowship... I dont understand the point/draw to it? Its 3 years long. Just as long as starting a full on EM residency. Arent most EM docs well suited and experienced to handle Peds emergencies? Whats the point of the 3 year fellowship? What would a pediatrician trained in a peds EM fellowship offer to an ED that an experienced EM physician couldn't already do?

I totally understand doing a combined deal like peds then doing a EM residency (I m seriously considering doing EM after I complete my FM residency)... but dont understand the PEDs EM fellowship???

From what I understand you dont get paid much more than a general pediatrician and there arent too many jobs for PEDs EM out there?

 

[dotcb]

For pediatricians, PEM is a step up in pay and specialization. For EM grads, it is a lateral move with similar pay but greater specialization.

Some people really like taking care of children and their families, and these fellowships allow you to work at tertiary peds centers. If you want to see a mix of adults and children in community hospitals, you definitely don't need a PEM fellowship after EM.

I see maybe 5% or at most 10% peds, which is fine w/ me.

 

[Welker]

unrelated topic but what percentage of your post-tax income do you guys use to pay off your student loan?

 

[bravotwozero]

I'm at 60% roughly, planning on paying it off in just over one year


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[emergentmd]

For pediatricians, PEM is a step up in pay and specialization. For EM grads, it is a lateral move with similar pay but greater specialization.

Some people really like taking care of children and their families, and these fellowships allow you to work at tertiary peds centers. If you want to see a mix of adults and children in community hospitals, you definitely don't need a PEM fellowship after EM.

I see maybe 5% or at most 10% peds, which is fine w/ me.

I may be out of the loop but don't Ped EM docs get paid less than EM docs? When I thought about doing PEM after an Em residency, I found out I could do 2 more years of residency to make less than I would being a reg EM doc.

I worked at a Pediatric EM hospital, got paid $50/hr more than the PEM fellows. I knew what they made, and I could moonlight making 3x what they made at the pedi hospital. The RVUs for Peds pt are ridiculously low. I could go a whole shift and not even draw blood.

 

[The White Coat Investor]

I don't know what he meant, but tax shelter to me is any deductible item you can put your money in. HSA account, retirement plan, health insurance premium if you're a 1099, mortgage interest deduction, childcare expenses all qualify as above the line deductions


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Mortgage interest is a below the line deduction whether you are an employee or self-employed. Childcare expenses are a tax credit. The others are above the line.

In general, a credit is better than a business expense is better than an above the line deduction is better than a below the line deduction.

 

[The White Coat Investor]

unrelated topic but what percentage of your post-tax income do you guys use to pay off your student loan?

0%. But if I had student loans as an attending, it would be >50%.

Get this through your thick skull now and it will serve you very well later:

You CAN live exactly like you're living now for a couple of years after residency. The difference between EM attending pay and resident lifestyle will pay off the average student loan in less than 2 years.

Think of it like this:

$300K income
$75K taxes
$50K lifestyle (heck, gives yourself a 50% raise, that would be huge in corporate America and call it $75K lifestyle)
That still leaves you $150K with which to build wealth. That may be paying off loans, maxing out retirement accounts, or saving up a downpayment.

How long do you think you would need to do that to have a serious jump start on your financial life? Yea, that's right, 2-5 years.

But you can't buy the fancy car on credit as you walk out of residency. You can have the fancy doctor house, but you can't have it now.

I just had an email the other day from a new attending EP. He has $450K in student loans but still walked out of residency and into a big house with a $2500 mortgage. Now he has to pay the principle, interest, taxes, insurance, maintenance, upgrades, utilities, landscaping, and furnishings for that big fancy house. Think you can do that on a $50K income? Of course not. But it's too hard and expensive to dump the house now. Hopefully he can avoid making the same mistake when he makes partner. Don't do that. It really does matter.

 

[Janders]

unrelated topic but what percentage of your post-tax income do you guys use to pay off your student loan?

Well I can't tell you that without knowing how much debt you have, at what interest rate, and what your salary is along with your fixed needs.
That said, this is basic hierarchy of needs stuff, as WCI explains. Or as Dave Ramsey explains.

#1 Get rid of any truly toxic debt (like high interest credit cards). Do this immediately, hopefully you don't have any of this debt. Eat ramen until it is gone. Also get your self at least a couple months of emergency fund socked away. Have rice and beans while you do this.

#2 Now, get rid of your "typical" student loan debt and other debt that is sitting at 7% or so. You should live like a resident with a raise while you do this. By which I mean, as a resident you made $50k/year roughly. Give yourself 85k/yr: go out to eat more, go on two nice vacations and buy a new TV and a new laptop and get cable and a new suit.
But take that ADDITIONAL new $100k++ and (A) fill up your 401k (B) throw the rest at your loans, instead of financing a luxury car, buying a house, and getting two jetskis and an expensive coke habit.

#3 If you have student loan or other debt sitting at <3% interest rate, consider letting it riiiiiii-iiiide. Or pay it off. But now you have flexibility.
Once you are out of debt, you can look at your income stream, calculate the proper savings rate (for retirement, perhaps house down payment), and truly considering upping your lifestyle.

My savings rate, counting paying off loans as "savings", was easily >60% of my post-tax income my first year out. Probably about the same second year out as well. Doing this gives you a massive head start and I strongly encourage it. I honestly think throwing 50% of your post-tax income @ debt is completely appropriate your first 1-2 years out...

 

[Welker]

0%. But if I had student loans as an attending, it would be >50%.

Get this through your thick skull now and it will serve you very well later:

You CAN live exactly like you're living now for a couple of years after residency. The difference between EM attending pay and resident lifestyle will pay off the average student loan in less than 2 years.

Think of it like this:

$300K income
$75K taxes
$50K lifestyle (heck, gives yourself a 50% raise, that would be huge in corporate America and call it $75K lifestyle)
That still leaves you $150K with which to build wealth. That may be paying off loans, maxing out retirement accounts, or saving up a downpayment.

How long do you think you would need to do that to have a serious jump start on your financial life? Yea, that's right, 2-5 years.

But you can't buy the fancy car on credit as you walk out of residency. You can have the fancy doctor house, but you can't have it now.

I just had an email the other day from a new attending EP. He has $450K in student loans but still walked out of residency and into a big house with a $2500 mortgage. Now he has to pay the principle, interest, taxes, insurance, maintenance, upgrades, utilities, landscaping, and furnishings for that big fancy house. Think you can do that on a $50K income? Of course not. But it's too hard and expensive to dump the house now. Hopefully he can avoid making the same mistake when he makes partner. Don't do that. It really does matter.

Thanks that breakdown was really helpful. I was debating buying a house but I think I'll settle on renting for now

 

[Psai]

Thanks that breakdown was really helpful. I was debating buying a house but I think I'll settle on renting for now

http://whitecoatinvestor.com/10-reasons-why-residents-shouldnt-buy-a-house/

Used this to convince my buddy not to throw away their hard earned money.

 

[shoal007]

300k salary for me is 98k in taxes (state, federal,Ss, Medicare). This is after deductions and tax credits. Family of 4. States is taking 25k.... Not including property tax or sales tax

Marginal tax rate of 42%. Yes 42 percent.... Thank you mr government.

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[bravotwozero]

300k salary for me is 98k in taxes (state, federal,Ss, Medicare). This is after deductions and tax credits. Family of 4. States is taking 25k.... Not including property tax or sales tax

Marginal tax rate of 42%. Yes 42 percent.... Thank you mr government.

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Time to move to either tx, nv, or fl....and keep 25k in your pocket !


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[Welker]

Yeah getting just 75k in taxes from 300k salary might not be realistic in most states I feel like.

 

[MEN2C]

I know a guy that did peds and now is doing a PEDs EM fellowship... I dont understand the point/draw to it? Its 3 years long. Just as long as starting a full on EM residency. Arent most EM docs well suited and experienced to handle Peds emergencies? Whats the point of the 3 year fellowship? What would a pediatrician trained in a peds EM fellowship offer to an ED that an experienced EM physician couldn't already do?

I totally understand doing a combined deal like peds then doing a EM residency (I m seriously considering doing EM after I complete my FM residency)... but dont understand the PEDs EM fellowship???

From what I understand you dont get paid much more than a general pediatrician and there arent too many jobs for PEDs EM out there?

There's a LOT of jobs for PEM. Much more than most peds specialties because many community hospitals will also hire you. Second, I'm a peds resident and I wouldn't do adult EM (or truthfully, most adult specialties...) for a million dollars a year. The one month of adult EM in med school was possibly the most dispiriting month of my life. It's such a necessary specialty and God bless if you can handle it, and I loved the EM docs, but I'd burn out within six months. It's just not for me .

 

[deleted109597]

There's a LOT of jobs for PEM. Much more than most peds specialties because many community hospitals will also hire you. Second, I'm a peds resident and I wouldn't do adult EM (or truthfully, most adult specialties...) for a million dollars a year. The one month of adult EM in med school was possibly the most dispiriting month of my life. It's such a necessary specialty and God bless if you can handle it, and I loved the EM docs, but I'd burn out within six months. It's just not for me .

There are jobs, but there are fewer PEM jobs than EM jobs. And a lot of those community peds shops hire straight pediatricians, because usually there aren't enough PEMs to go around. Peds to PEM guys can't work in general EDs because they don't train on adults. EM to PEM guys can, but the dirty secret is that 20% of EM training is peds, and as such any EM doc can work in Peds ERs as well. Also, there's been a few papers coming out showing the peds to PEM tract can be woefully underprepared for procedures and critical care, as they don't get enough of it in fellowship.

But PEM pays more than pediatrics usually. There are unusually high paying primary peds practices, and there are some terribly paying PEM jobs, but in general this holds true. It pays less than EM, but that's because the RVUs are lower. You make more repairing a Mercedes than you do a Honda.

 

[MEN2C]

So many community hospitals hire PEM trained people for the afternoon shift (3p-12a) usually - I know some graduating people work there. I don't expect to make general EM money .

As for PEM and procedures - if you go into PEM for procedures, you're doing it wrong . I'm not aware of any poor outcomes - papers coming out showing that dedicated Peds ED have better adherence to pedi guidelines on many things - but anyway, that's here nor there - I don't want to do a general EM residency . Generally, EM guys don't work in the PED Eds unless they've also done the fellowship (at least, in the three children's hospitals ive worked at, I haven't seen any that weren't PEM certified (through either tract).

Also, I am not saying anything negative about EM. I know that general EM guys can take care of kids just fine - not doubting that for a second . I rotate with EM residents in the pedi ED and they're great!!

It's just not an option for me because I'd rather gouge my eyes out than take care of adults - in fact the other specialty I'm interested is
neonatology - so even teenagers aren't my favorites haha!!!

 

[BoardingDoc]

Generally, EM guys don't work in the PED Eds unless they've also done the fellowship (at least, in the three children's hospitals ive worked at, I haven't seen any that weren't PEM certified (through either tract).

In Children's hospitals, yeah you're right. In every other hospital I've ever worked in that had a pedi-ed section, I've seen it staffed by both PEM and regular EM docs.

 

[MEN2C]

In Children's hospitals, yeah you're right. In every other hospital I've ever worked in that had a pedi-ed section, I've seen it staffed by both PEM and regular EM docs.

Oh yeah, absolutely. It wouldn't make sense financially otherwise - outside of the post school shift, there probably isn't enough pedi volume at most places to justify having a person who can't see adults.

 

[deleted109597]

So many community hospitals hire PEM trained people for the afternoon shift (3p-12a) usually - I know some graduating people work there. I don't expect to make general EM money .

Not sure where that is happening, but I've never seen that. And I've worked at lots of shops. High and low volume. I'm sure it exists, but it isn't common by any stretch of the imagination.

Generally, EM guys don't work in the PED Eds unless they've also done the fellowship (at least, in the three children's hospitals ive worked at, I haven't seen any that weren't PEM certified (through either tract).

I didn't do a fellowship. I work nearly full time at a dedicated peds ED in a children's hospital. It does happen. Now, if you're at an academic place, they want fellowship trained so they can teach other fellows.

 

[MEN2C]

Thank you for your perspective . My experience is limited to a very small sample - at my program, a lot of fellows moonlight at a couple local community hospitals and all of them have offers at community hospitals around the area. However, not ideal for a lot of people because it's usually the post school shift - 3 or 4pm to midnight or whatever, and so you're away from home for those hours three-four days per week. So if you have school age children, you'd be missing them 3-4 days of the week.

This setup may not be common at other places, so I'll definitely defer to your experience on that point! I've wished many times that I didn't hate treating adults - cause otherwise general EM sounds great .

 

[EDParallax]

Thanks that breakdown was really helpful. I was debating buying a house but I think I'll settle on renting for now

It's not necessarily settling to rent. The myth of American Home Ownership is very real. The markets don't always go up, and if you rent under what you can afford you can invest the rest how you see fit. Furthermore, you won't have to be a homeowner with all of the responsibilities and expenses it requires.

I am pro home ownership for people who know what they are getting into and have thought it out, not for everyone across the board.

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[HooliganSnail]

I'm just gonna say that in my job searches, the numbers being thrown around are very inflated.

Locum Jobs can make more than 220/hr, but that is the exception, not the norm, and they are by definition, jobs that no one else wants to do, that's why they hire a locum doc.

All the income survey's agree with my findings more accurately. EM docs make between 275-330 annually. This has been trending up. That is 140-185/hr. If you want to work by where you live, you will NOT pull down the numbers that are being thrown around here.

300/hr is 518,000/yr if you work 144hrs/month. I am sure some people do this, but it really is the exception.

 

[bravotwozero]

If you're working locums, particularly in places like Michigan and Texas, you can very easily expect to make more than 220 per hour. It's all about geography, but I don't think that's exceptional. I work locums gigs that pay substantially more, and I didn't even have to work to find them - the recruiters found me


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[deleted109597]

I'm just gonna say that in my job searches, the numbers being thrown around are very inflated.

Locum Jobs can make more than 220/hr, but that is the exception, not the norm, and they are by definition, jobs that no one else wants to do, that's why they hire a locum doc.

All the income survey's agree with my findings more accurately. EM docs make between 275-330 annually. This has been trending up. That is 140-185/hr. If you want to work by where you live, you will NOT pull down the numbers that are being thrown around here.

300/hr is 518,000/yr if you work 144hrs/month. I am sure some people do this, but it really is the exception.

Heh. There's not a job in this part of the state that starts less than $230/hr, and that's an all ped's shop. The regular EDs are $250-$275/hr base rate, and if you're doing locums, it just goes up from there. There's a reason my facebook feed just popped up with this locums ad.

 

[HooliganSnail]

If you're working locums, particularly in places like Michigan and Texas, you can very easily expect to make more than 220 per hour. It's all about geography, but I don't think that's exceptional. I work locums gigs that pay substantially more, and I didn't even have to work to find them - the recruiters found me


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Right. IF you are working locums. Everyone knows you can make tons and tons of money doing locums.

What about NOT locums......

 

[bravotwozero]

Right. IF you are working locums. Everyone knows you can make tons and tons of money doing locums.

What about NOT locums......

Your statement said 220 for locums is the exception and not the rule. I was simply disputing that point because in my experience it's not as 'exceptional' as you are making it out to be. Even for a permanent gig, 220 as an IC is pretty lowball unless you work in a freestanding ED - see McNinja's post.


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[Psai]

I'm just gonna say that in my job searches, the numbers being thrown around are very inflated.

Locum Jobs can make more than 220/hr, but that is the exception, not the norm, and they are by definition, jobs that no one else wants to do, that's why they hire a locum doc.

All the income survey's agree with my findings more accurately. EM docs make between 275-330 annually. This has been trending up. That is 140-185/hr. If you want to work by where you live, you will NOT pull down the numbers that are being thrown around here.

300/hr is 518,000/yr if you work 144hrs/month. I am sure some people do this, but it really is the exception.

Someone is going to get very rich off of you.

 

[HooliganSnail]

Your statement said 220 for locums is the exception and not the rule. I was simply disputing that point because in my experience it's not as 'exceptional' as you are making it out to be. Even for a permanent gig, 220 as an IC is pretty lowball unless you work in a freestanding ED - see McNinja's post.


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Again, according to the medscape EM compensation report, the average is 322,000. This is significantly less than what would be expected if the wages earned were what is being reported on this forum.

$220 ( you're "low ball" estimate) x 144hrs/month = $380,000/year.

380,000 is more than 322,000....

There are a few possibilities to explain this

1. ED physicians are NOT working 144 hours a month ( although 87% of respondents in above survey reported working greater than 30 hrs a week...)

2. Their are a disproportional amount of posters on this forum who represent the top 25% of income earners for EM.....

3. The posters on this forum are not responding to the medscape survey, making that survey inaccurate by hundreds of thousands of dollars.

4. The numbers on this forum are grossly inflatated, and people are posting hourly wages that are truly exceptional as standard

I am inclined to think it is number 4......one plus one does NOT equal four.

 

[HooliganSnail]

Someone is going to get very rich off of you.

Well they are all getting very rich off all of us, but that doesn't mean that I'm not waste deep in bullsh*t here......

EM docs just do NOT make the amounts being reported here, these numbers are inaccurate. Some may, but the vast majority seem not to.

 

[deleted109597]

There's no way in hell I would work 144hr/month. Maybe there are places it wouldn't be that bad, but I like not being at work too.
There's a reason people keep commuting to Texas to work, and it's not the permian basin.
I'm sure there's a bias, just like everyone here has a Step 1 of 250+, but it's not imaginary. It's just that the people with numbers below that are silent. One of my friends just left Philadelphia because they were paying $117/hr. Another one was earning $140/hr outside of DC. Both moved to Texas because of it. I've had residents go to Tennessee, South Carolina, and Mississippi and make over $220. I had one go to Ohio and get paid terribly.
I'm happy for people not to believe it exists, because it keeps allowing me to rake CMGs over the coals when their shifts aren't filled a week out.

 

[MackandBlues]

There's no way in hell I would work 144hr/month. Maybe there are places it wouldn't be that bad, but I like not being at work too.
There's a reason people keep commuting to Texas to work, and it's not the permian basin.
I'm sure there's a bias, just like everyone here has a Step 1 of 250+, but it's not imaginary. It's just that the people with numbers below that are silent. One of my friends just left Philadelphia because they were paying $117/hr. Another one was earning $140/hr outside of DC. Both moved to Texas because of it. I've had residents go to Tennessee, South Carolina, and Mississippi and make over $220. I had one go to Ohio and get paid terribly.
I'm happy for people not to believe it exists, because it keeps allowing me to rake CMGs over the coals when their shifts aren't filled a week out.

Is it all of Texas or away from the major metro areas like Dallas and Houston? Thank you


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[deleted109597]

Is it all of Texas or away from the major metro areas like Dallas and Houston? Thank you


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I only work in a small part of Texas, but I know that the payscale is pretty high in most semi rural areas. The Valley, El Paso, Midland/Odessa, Lubbock, even San Antonio and Houston have decent gigs. UTMB at Galveston (an EmCare shop) starts out at $275/hr. So yeah, it's most of the state that I'm aware of.
Now, pending law changes towards FSEDs, this may swing back the other way eventually. But it certainly holds true today.

 

[WilcoWorld]

Also, there's been a few papers coming out showing the peds to PEM tract can be woefully underprepared for procedures and critical care, as they don't get enough of it in fellowship.

Interesting - please post citations.

 

[deleted109597]

Interesting - please post citations.

http://journals.lww.com/pec-online/...ubation_Practice_and_Maintaining_Skill.4.aspx
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22841174
https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22424653
(both of those are from Cincinnati Children's, not well known for being terrible)
https://www.cambridge.org/core/jour...hip-trainees/049E9976AF76A7C08CC06C028A612E35
This one is the worst, but it's Canadian. If you look at the self reported number of procedures it looks terrible.

 

[WilcoWorld]

double post

 

[WilcoWorld]

(both of those are from Cincinnati Children's, not well known for being terrible)
This one is the worst, but it's Canadian. If you look at the self reported number of procedures it looks terrible.

Thanks. Those numbers are quite low.

 

[goodoldalky]

I'm just gonna say that in my job searches, the numbers being thrown around are very inflated.

Locum Jobs can make more than 220/hr, but that is the exception, not the norm, and they are by definition, jobs that no one else wants to do, that's why they hire a locum doc.

All the income survey's agree with my findings more accurately. EM docs make between 275-330 annually. This has been trending up. That is 140-185/hr. If you want to work by where you live, you will NOT pull down the numbers that are being thrown around here.

300/hr is 518,000/yr if you work 144hrs/month. I am sure some people do this, but it really is the exception.

Certainly you will have reporting bias on a forum like this, where people who make a heftier paycheck talk about it more freely than the converse.

Realize that most em docs in large busy facilities probably work less than 144 hr per month (that's 18 8s) and those surveys include part timers, freestandings etc. I do have colleagues that make in the 140-180 range. I have no idea how they do it. Again I am fortunate to have the job I have.

There was a post on another website a few days ago. EM Doc goes into the ED where he works for problem X, sees himself (lol) gets an XRay and discharges himself. I didn't know you could see yourself but get this, he got a bill, for his own services for himself (X-ray and facility fee not included), $1,000! Couldn't get his group to waive it either, hahaha. Food for thought

 

[shoal007]

Certainly you will have reporting bias on a forum like this, where people who make a heftier paycheck talk about it more freely than the converse.

Realize that most em docs in large busy facilities probably work less than 144 hr per month (that's 18 8s) and those surveys include part timers, freestandings etc. I do have colleagues that make in the 140-180 range. I have no idea how they do it. Again I am fortunate to have the job I have.

There was a post on another website a few days ago. EM Doc goes into the ED where he works for problem X, sees himself (lol) gets an XRay and discharges himself. I didn't know you could see yourself but get this, he got a bill, for his own services for himself (X-ray and facility fee not included), $1,000! Couldn't get his group to waive it either, hahaha. Food for thought

hilarious. should have figured how a c arm or portable xr machine worked.

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[deleted547339]

Certainly you will have reporting bias on a forum like this, where people who make a heftier paycheck talk about it more freely than the converse.

Realize that most em docs in large busy facilities probably work less than 144 hr per month (that's 18 8s) and those surveys include part timers, freestandings etc. I do have colleagues that make in the 140-180 range. I have no idea how they do it. Again I am fortunate to have the job I have.

There was a post on another website a few days ago. EM Doc goes into the ED where he works for problem X, sees himself (lol) gets an XRay and discharges himself. I didn't know you could see yourself but get this, he got a bill, for his own services for himself (X-ray and facility fee not included), $1,000! Couldn't get his group to waive it either, hahaha. Food for thought

He wrote a note on himself!???

 

[WilcoWorld]

Certainly you will have reporting bias on a forum like this, where people who make a heftier paycheck talk about it more freely than the converse.

Realize that most em docs in large busy facilities probably work less than 144 hr per month (that's 18 8s) and those surveys include part timers, freestandings etc. I do have colleagues that make in the 140-180 range. I have no idea how they do it. Again I am fortunate to have the job I have.

There was a post on another website a few days ago. EM Doc goes into the ED where he works for problem X, sees himself (lol) gets an XRay and discharges himself. I didn't know you could see yourself but get this, he got a bill, for his own services for himself (X-ray and facility fee not included), $1,000! Couldn't get his group to waive it either, hahaha. Food for thought

I wonder how much of that $1000 he got paid?

I'd bet General Veers would've gotten more of it.

 

[goodoldalky]

I wonder how much of that $1000 he got paid?

I'd bet General Veers would've gotten more of it.

He didn't say but if he makes 200 an hour and sees about 2.5 pph ballpark would be around $80-85

 

[WilcoWorld]

He didn't say but if he makes 200 an hour and sees about 2.5 pph ballpark would be around $80-85

I like your post, but not the facts conveyed therein.

 

[CCmetal94]

I scribe in a small rural ER in the midwest. ER docs told me they make about 500k/yr. One locum told me he was getting paid $500/hr. Shifts are 12 hours but low acuity. Only an hour out from a major city.

 

[fahimaz7]

I scribe in a small rural ER in the midwest. ER docs told me they make about 500k/yr. One locum told me he was getting paid $500/hr. Shifts are 12 hours but low acuity. Only an hour out from a major city.

I'm on the low end of this scale for sure. With that said, I live in a paradise, have a great job, have a great group, and get great benefits (free health care, premiums, 36k towards 401k, etc). It's not all about the money.

 

[JAFERD]

EM docs just do NOT make the amounts being reported here, these numbers are inaccurate. Some may, but the vast majority seem not to.

EM docs DO make the amounts reported here! Not all EM docs are making >200/hr, but jobs that pay that are not hard to find, and many of them are great jobs. It's not difficult to make $300k/yr in EM without working that hard. You also can't just multiply the hourly rates reported by 40 hrs/week, see the huge resulting yearly salary, and then use that number to justify why people are lying about how much they're getting paid. ED docs don't work 40 hours a week (or at least very few of them do). Full time for ED seems to be closer to low 3o's per week.

One thing I haven't heard mentioned much here is the difference between IC and employee positions. Most of the jobs paying more than $220/hr are likely IC positions without benefits. Benefits packages and bonuses can get very valuable. You can always get a job with benefits and a slightly lower hourly pay and then do some locums work for the bigger money (and tax benefits).

 

[emergentmd]

I'm just gonna say that in my job searches, the numbers being thrown around are very inflated.

Locum Jobs can make more than 220/hr, but that is the exception, not the norm, and they are by definition, jobs that no one else wants to do, that's why they hire a locum doc.

All the income survey's agree with my findings more accurately. EM docs make between 275-330 annually. This has been trending up. That is 140-185/hr. If you want to work by where you live, you will NOT pull down the numbers that are being thrown around here.

300/hr is 518,000/yr if you work 144hrs/month. I am sure some people do this, but it really is the exception.

Yeah, you are right. These high paying jobs are rare and hard to find. There must be a bias here and most make 150-175/hr.

Hold on..... I have to tell the scheduling lady that I can't drive an hr from my home this weekend at $500/hr......

Did I tell you I have this conversation on a weekly basis? Did I tell you I live in a city that is one of the most sought after to live and a top 15 populated city?

People who want to make this much has nothing to do with if it exists. It has to do with knowing how to play the game and having someone who has figured it out show you. No one will come and offer you 350+/hr.

Anyhow, I am only working 6 shifts in Feb, so I just picked up 2 weekday 10am shifts at $425/hr. I feel almost cheated but willing to take the haircut to fill out my schedule alittle. I plan on working 2-4 more shifts but not taking anything less than $475/hr.

 

[da8s0859q]

@emergentmd, remind me, what's the catch again? Are these places the sort of places you'd ever want to work if not for the money?