Should I try to apply stateside a third time? or should I apply to the big4

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

Applied to about 15 DO schools, and was lucky to get on the waitlist of 1 school, but I don't know if getting a waitlist was due to interviewing with them pretty late (Febuary, secondary submitted in January)
for reference, I'm pushing 30, and don't want to waste a whole other year of my life for a third cycle if no one state-side accepts me

quick rundown of my stats:

501 mcat (2nd attempt)

2.9 uGPA but with a 3.6 graduate GPA,

1300 hours of research with 1 research pub

100-150 hours of community service (soup kitchen)

500 unpaid non-profit volunteer

700 hours of science-based work (nutrition)

100 hours of paid scribe position during undergrad

Ive been working at a non-STEM job for 2 years

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[Mr. Nevergiveup]

MY ugpa is kinda low, and my mcat was a 501
I DID a lot of repairs, (1 year smp, 2 year Masters) although mostly not medically related my ECs are fair, last cycle I was able to interview with them, I didn't really click with the 2 interviewers, but my second time, I spent a lot of time preparing, clicked with the interviewer and that eventually got me a WL,
tbh I was kinda surprised I even received an II for this school, I did everything super late both times I applied to that school,
I didn't submit my 2ndaries til November and didn't have my interview until late march.
would reapplying but submitting everything early give me greater chances of getting Accepted, or am I just as likely to be waitlisted again and possibly not accepted due to my grades/scores?

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

@gonnif is carrib my only choice of getting an acceptance?

 

[LunaOri]

You need a lot more clinical and volunteer hours to be able to build an application. Why are you working a non-clinical job for 2 years?

 

[wysdoc]

You need a lot more clinical and volunteer hours to be able to build an application. Why are you working a non-clinical job for 2 years?

I agree. Put in some hours volunteering starting now and submit your DO application earlier this year (July or August) and I think you will get more interviews. In reference to your question about submitting "Day 1" (the first day the app is open) submit after you have 100-150 charitable non-clinical volunteer hours achieved.
The WL from this year might still come through as well.

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

I agree. Put in some hours volunteering starting now and submit your DO application earlier this year (July or August) and I think you will get more interviews. In reference to your question about submitting "Day 1" (the first day the app is open) submit after you have 100-150 charitable non-clinical volunteer hours achieved.
The WL from this year might still come through as well.

Thanks for the advice! I really appreciate it, I’m just trying to figure out what my next plan should be incase things don’t work out with the waitlist,
I was considering applying caribb as a fall back plan like my friend had done last year (same gpa, but he had more clinical hours but no volunteer stuff and was like 493mcat )
but based off my late interview waitlist, my gut is telling I might still have a chance if I wait 1 more year, (in that case I’ll be packing sunscreen)

So would I be fine completing without an mcat retake and get my volunteer hours up to 300?
I also forgot to mention, aside from my non-stem job (which had a story of me applying basic first aid to a child for a semi-minor injury) I also did about an extra 80hours of unpaid volunteer coaching positions from my former high school coach, plus ~60 hours of (paid) assisting with the evening youth k-5 and middle school,

So overall, I just need more extra curriculars to get an A as a non-trad student,
I can maybe do an extra unpaid scribe job or something at my local hospital for 6-10 hours a week since I have an 2 close family members working in a nearby hospital as a nurses)

I also think I wasn’t applying as broadly as I should have, I my application this cycle consisted of schools in the mostly schools in northeastern, that screened out my gpa like both PCOM,lecom, and touro,

And tbh although my W was from a southern was just pure luck (reapplicant, interviewed then R first cycle) even with my out of state WL (which was a Hail Mary but I do have ties to the state) I didn’t apply to some of the schools that I maybe should have such as

mu-com

Bcom

Rvu com

az-com

Nova com/nsu Florida (currently living near one of there OOS rotation sites)

Noorda (maybe,)

Orlando-com (maybe because no federal loans)

Meharry

Kansas university com (got an R from kc-com)


Maybe VCOM-auburn or probably not vcom-Virginia

…but then again I was given an R at schools I thought I might have a chance at like such wv-com and arcom,

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

You need a lot more clinical and volunteer hours to be able to build an application. Why are you working a non-clinical job for 2 years?

Initially Started this job because it gave me time to study while I’m working, but even though I haven’t taken the mcat in over a year, I just been having trouble finding a job that’s both clinical related and pays me somewhat ok thst I can manage my bills

 

[Emmet2301]

Are you looking for IM/FM or a speciality? If you're ok with IM and a residency in a random area then Carib might be ok.

 

[Mr.Smile12]

Your graduate GPA includes both an SMP and a 2-year Masters (research or also SMP?). What feedback have you gotten from your SMP faculty about your lack of success? There's much more to your profile than just your metrics and stats, and I don't have a sense of chronology to know what you have been doing recently.

A January submission is rather late in the AACOMAS process, so you luckily did get an interview. Did you do any outreach to the schools you applied to?

 

[AJS59]

Please don't go to the Caribbean unless you want to run the risk of crippling debt with no marketable degree (or no residency) on the other side. It's not to say you couldn't come out of it on the other side, but the match rate for DOs is 92% vs. something in the 50-60% for IMGs (which include Caribbean schools). And even if you do match, odds are it would be in a less desirable field and a less desirable program/location on the other side

If you get your hours up I think DO schools are in your future, especially given how late/narrowly you applied. Fill out a WAMC and you may get more specific advice

 

[PuzzlesMD]

I would absolutely get clinical hours ASAP and continue to get them over the next 12 months. Also apply to a lot more DO schools across the country. If you are willing to move to the Caribbean you should be willing to move to bumble**** USA

DO and spending another year applying >>>>> Caribbean

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

I would absolutely get clinical hours ASAP and continue to get them over the next 12 months. Also apply to a lot more DO schools across the country. If you are willing to move to the Caribbean you should be willing to move to bumble**** USA

DO and spending another year applying >>>>> Caribbean

Thank you,
I’m working on trying to find a DO to shadow in my area, I also was planning to retake the mcat in late August and aiming for atleast a 505,
In a sense I’ve been feeling immense pressure to go to the Caribbean route since I’m already pretty old (turning 29 soon)
I had a sense of getting pressured into it my friend who I’ve done most of undergrad with and postbacc/grad school is sort of pressuring me to apply and join him anytime in the Carib everytime we talk (misery loves company I guess) I was also at this wedding last week where a couple both graduated from a big 4 caribb school so now my parents are starting to get the idea I should stop wasting my time and to go off shore,

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

Your graduate GPA includes both an SMP and a 2-year Masters (research or also SMP?). What feedback have you gotten from your SMP faculty about your lack of success? There's much more to your profile than just your metrics and stats, and I don't have a sense of chronology to know what you have been doing recently.

A January submission is rather late in the AACOMAS process, so you luckily did get an interview. Did you do any outreach to the schools you applied to?

Secondaries was sent in January if that matters, but yes i still feel immensely lucky to have an interview invite with them twice,

My SMP wasn’t really an SMP, its was really me going full time while working full time for 2 semesters after getting my bachelors degree,
My masters was more research oriented, no linkage to any med schools

 

[AJS59]

Thank you,
I’m working on trying to find a DO to shadow in my area, I also was planning to retake the mcat in late August and aiming for atleast a 505,
In a sense I’ve been feeling immense pressure to go to the Caribbean route since I’m already pretty old (turning 29 soon)
I had a sense of getting pressured into it my friend who I’ve done most of undergrad with and postbacc/grad school is sort of pressuring me to apply and join him anytime in the Carib everytime we talk (misery loves company I guess) I was also at this wedding last week where a couple both graduated from a big 4 caribb school so now my parents are starting to get the idea I should stop wasting my time and to go off shore,

I really think its worth your benefit to continue prepping for the DO schools; the Caribbean looks like an easy way out but in reality it is often a dead end for most students.

 

[Faha]

Where is your state of residence ? I agree that your lack of clinical exposure hours is a major weakness in your application.

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

Where is your state of residence ? I agree that your lack of clinical exposure hours is a major weakness in your application.

should I try to get shadowing hours by the time I reapply in june? (I live in NY)
I am planning to retake the MCAT sometime in early september, would that be necessary if I just get my shadowing hours up for schools like WCU-COM, NSU-KPCOM, ICOM, NOORDA-COM, maybe even OCOM?

 

[chilly_md]

should I try to get shadowing hours by the time I reapply in june? (I live in NY)
I am planning to retake the MCAT sometime in early september, would that be necessary if I just get my shadowing hours up for schools like WCU-COM, NSU-KPCOM, ICOM, NOORDA-COM, maybe even OCOM?

Scribe or get some hands-on clinical experience. That is what your app has been missing. You can portion out some scribe hours as shadowing or network and shadow on days you are not working.

I do not know if you’ll get substantial hours by this summer though. Applying in August for DO would be fine if that lets you accumulate an additional 200 hours (working around 15-20 hours a week should get you there).

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

Scribe or get some hands-on clinical experience. That is what your app has been missing. You can portion out some scribe hours as shadowing or network and shadow on days you are not working.

I do not know if you’ll get substantial hours by this summer though. Applying in August for DO would be fine if that lets you accumulate an additional 200 hours (working around 15-20 hours a week should get you there)

So what your sayings Its better for me to maximize my time free time by getting clinical hours, or maybe even trying to secure a Medical Assistant job and get as many hours as I can by August. Then it is for me to try and attempt an MCAT retake in early September and minimize my time shadowing.

 

[chilly_md]

So what your sayings Its better for me to maximize my time free time by getting clinical hours, or maybe even trying to secure a Medical Assistant job and get as many hours as I can by August. Then it is for me to try and attempt an MCAT retake in early September and minimize my time shadowing.

You should get non-clinical volunteer hours too at a homeless shelter or food bank as wysdoc pointed out. Adding on to the soup kitchen is fine if that is something you did relatively recently. If your second MCAT score was 501, I do not think you will be able to increase it substantially enough.

A DO letter would be beneficial as well. As would having someone look over your written materials to make sure they are easy to read and have a clear meaning. It has been difficult to piece together your different posts and it seems you’re misunderstanding the message others have mentioned about clinical hours. Those are scribing, working as an MA, EMT, hospital volunteer that interacts with patients. Shadowing is completely different and is not going to fix your app on its own.

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

You should get non-clinical volunteer hours too at a homeless shelter or food bank as wysdoc pointed out. Adding on to the soup kitchen is fine if that is something you did relatively recently. If your second MCAT score was 501, I do not think you will be able to increase it substantially enough.

A DO letter would be beneficial as well. As would having someone look over your written materials to make sure they are easy to read and have a clear meaning. It has been difficult to piece together your different posts and it seems you’re misunderstanding the message others have mentioned about clinical hours. Those are scribing, working as an MA, EMT, hospital volunteer that interacts with patients. Shadowing is completely different and is not going to fix your app on its own.

I think i can get a Hospital volunteer job, I have 2 nurses in my family and Ill try to apply to any MA jobs around me,
Although I would love to do EMT, I don't think I'll have enough time to get hours in since I'm applying in august,
is there any other jobs or unpaid ways to get more clinical hours that I can look into, in the mean time?

Also my food bank volunteers is pretty recent, started it about 1 year ago, its for homeless veterans, I can maybe see if I can squeeze out some more time there as well by then

 

[chilly_md]

I think i can get a Hospital volunteer job, I have 2 nurses in my family and Ill try to apply to any MA jobs around me,
Although I would love to do EMT, I don't think I'll have enough time to get hours in since I'm applying in august,
is there any other jobs or unpaid ways to get more clinical hours that I can look into, in the mean time?

Also my food bank volunteers is pretty recent, started it about 1 year ago, its for homeless veterans, I can maybe see if I can squeeze out some more time there as well by then

You could try hospice volunteering. If you are going to attempt to do multiple activities for clinical hours, they should each have at least 50 hours, with one being ideally 100 or more hours. Doing hospital volunteering or hospice here and there for 20 hours each is not worth putting down on an application.

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

You could try hospice volunteering. If you are going to attempt to do multiple activities for clinical hours, they should each have at least 50 hours, with one being ideally 100 or more hours. Doing hospital volunteering or hospice here and there for 20 hours each is not worth putting down on an application.

Great, Thank you very much for your advice!

 

[Faha]

should I try to get shadowing hours by the time I reapply in june? (I live in NY)
I am planning to retake the MCAT sometime in early september, would that be necessary if I just get my shadowing hours up for schools like WCU-COM, NSU-KPCOM, ICOM, NOORDA-COM, maybe even OCOM?

If you accumulate enough shadowing and clinical volunteering hours you could receive interviews at some of the newer schools with your MCAT of 501. I suggest all these schools with your stats:
UNECOM
NYIT-AR
LECOM (Elmira)
DUQCOM
UP-KYCOM
WVSOM
PCOM Georgia and South Georgia
LMU-DCOM (all schools)
BCOM (all schools)
VCOM (all schools)
OCOM
ACOM
WCU-COM
ARCOM
BUCOM
UIWSOM
KHSC-COM
Noorda-COM
ICOM
RVU-Montana
Touro-Montana
Any new schools that open (D'Youville, Meritus)
Most of these schools have MCAT medians in the 498 to 502 range so you could receive interviews.

 

[Mr. Nevergiveup]

If you accumulate enough shadowing and clinical volunteering hours you could receive interviews at some of the newer schools with your MCAT of 501. I suggest all these schools with your stats:
UNECOM
NYIT-AR
LECOM (Elmira)
DUQCOM
UP-KYCOM
WVSOM
PCOM Georgia and South Georgia
LMU-DCOM (all schools)
BCOM (all schools)
VCOM (all schools)
OCOM
ACOM
WCU-COM
ARCOM
BUCOM
UIWSOM
KHSC-COM
Noorda-COM
ICOM
RVU-Montana
Touro-Montana
Any new schools that open (D'Youville, Meritus)
Most of these schools have MCAT medians in the 498 to 502 range so you could receive interviews.

Is D'Youville accepting students this upcoming cycle?
do you know if I have a chance at NSU-KPCOM?

 

[Faha]

Is D'Youville accepting students this upcoming cycle?
do you know if I have a chance at NSU-KPCOM?

D'Youville was under review this month for accreditation. Final decision not released. You could try NSU-KPCOM but their stats are higher than yours.